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Jake Diesel
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Posted - 2013.10.17 14:57:00 -
[1] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:With vehicles we just have the basic hulls but now with prototype modules and we keep the prototype turrets
The turrets themselves have also gone back to basics and do no have any variations, so fragmented/cycled missile launchers are gone and same with blaster/railgun variations
So we have a basic hull with possible proto turrets/mods provided we can fit them
So AV needs to go through the same gutting and lose all varients (breach/assault) and also lose the adv/proto AV weapons so it is basic AV vs basic hull
Now before you complain about basic hulls having access to proto modules, you still have access to proto damage modules
Also with proto turrets, AV players can still use proto suits
So overall the fight could look like this
Basic hull + adv/proto modules + adv/proto turrets vs adv/proto dropsuit + adv/proto damage mods + basic AV weapon
Then give it a good month or 2 of testing to get feedback and stats from PC then add in adv hulls and AV weapons and repeat and then add in proto hulls and AV weapons
I've already tested this for you. Here are the results:
Ishukone Assault Forge Gun + Basic Dropsuit = 2079 HP damage
VS
Basic Armor HAV (fully specced)
Result: 5-6 volleys to destroy a Basic Armor HAV with proto assault forge.
Is there something wrong with this picture? A proto weapon vs a "basic" hull of an HAV and yet it cannot be destroyed by one volley (4 rounds) of a proto Ishukone forge. Your balance suggestions leans to the favor of tanks. Not a balance. If it takes two or more protos to take down a basic, then proto HAV's will dominate. |
Jake Diesel
BIG BAD W0LVES
45
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 15:02:00 -
[2] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Atiim wrote:The Attorney General wrote:Atiim wrote:
Question, when your in a Tank vs Tank fight would it Mae you angry if you died because your shots would either dive staight towards a wall or glitch up so bad that they fly backwards or just run around in circle?
Doesn't happen. Stop making up excuses for you not being able to use a tracking weapon properly. If 90% of the playerbase can roll around like rambo popping tanks with swarms, but you can't, that means there is something wrong with you. Have you ever used swarms? I have No skill required and broken as ****
Agreed. A powerful "fire and forget" weapon in the hands of a medium dropsuit that can outrun a heavy is just baffling. |
Jake Diesel
BIG BAD W0LVES
45
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 15:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Jake Diesel wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:With vehicles we just have the basic hulls but now with prototype modules and we keep the prototype turrets
The turrets themselves have also gone back to basics and do no have any variations, so fragmented/cycled missile launchers are gone and same with blaster/railgun variations
So we have a basic hull with possible proto turrets/mods provided we can fit them
So AV needs to go through the same gutting and lose all varients (breach/assault) and also lose the adv/proto AV weapons so it is basic AV vs basic hull
Now before you complain about basic hulls having access to proto modules, you still have access to proto damage modules
Also with proto turrets, AV players can still use proto suits
So overall the fight could look like this
Basic hull + adv/proto modules + adv/proto turrets vs adv/proto dropsuit + adv/proto damage mods + basic AV weapon
Then give it a good month or 2 of testing to get feedback and stats from PC then add in adv hulls and AV weapons and repeat and then add in proto hulls and AV weapons I've already tested this for you. Here are the results: Ishukone Assault Forge Gun + Basic Dropsuit = 2079 HP damage VS Basic Armor HAV (fully specced) Result: 5-6 volleys to destroy a Basic Armor HAV with proto assault forge. Is there something wrong with this picture? A proto weapon vs a "basic" hull of an HAV and yet it cannot be destroyed by one volley (4 rounds) of a proto Ishukone forge. Your balance suggestions leans to the favor of tanks. Not a balance. If it takes two or more protos to take down a basic, then proto HAV's will dominate. Why would you use a basic dropsuit? you have adv/proto suits so that means more proto dmg mods Also you dont know what the new AV numbers are so is this current AV vs current HAVs or current AV vs new vehicles? Im on about with the vehicle respec we take it back to basics for both sides, currently a proto AV weapon will decimate the new vehicles, also we dont have passive resisatances so the AV will do a full lot of damage, 135% current swarms do unless we have our hardners on but they only last so long Also or stats are wrong if its against shield, generally it will 3/4 shot it
This is current. And this is an example of a proto assault forge gun (fitted on a basic dropsuit) vs a "basic" armor tank. Two complex damage mods would deal 2238 HP damage to a "basic" HAV. What I'm trying to get at is why does it take a full proto forge such as this to take a full volley of 4 hits to drop a basic? And you want basic vs basic? Lol.
I sometimes run my Ishukone on a basic Dren heavy because it's a free suit and costs me only 59,000 isk to lose per fit. But more often I run the DAU assault forge cause its cheaper. 27,000 per fit. And in the world of AR's, running a fat expensive suit is very costly. |
Jake Diesel
BIG BAD W0LVES
45
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 16:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Jake Diesel wrote:Tainsanely Kashuken wrote:Jake Diesel wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:With vehicles we just have the basic hulls but now with prototype modules and we keep the prototype turrets
The turrets themselves have also gone back to basics and do no have any variations, so fragmented/cycled missile launchers are gone and same with blaster/railgun variations
So we have a basic hull with possible proto turrets/mods provided we can fit them
So AV needs to go through the same gutting and lose all varients (breach/assault) and also lose the adv/proto AV weapons so it is basic AV vs basic hull
Now before you complain about basic hulls having access to proto modules, you still have access to proto damage modules
Also with proto turrets, AV players can still use proto suits
So overall the fight could look like this
Basic hull + adv/proto modules + adv/proto turrets vs adv/proto dropsuit + adv/proto damage mods + basic AV weapon
Then give it a good month or 2 of testing to get feedback and stats from PC then add in adv hulls and AV weapons and repeat and then add in proto hulls and AV weapons I've already tested this for you. Here are the results: Ishukone Assault Forge Gun + Basic Dropsuit = 2079 HP damage VS Basic Armor HAV (fully specced) Result: 5-6 volleys to destroy a Basic Armor HAV with proto assault forge. Is there something wrong with this picture? A proto weapon vs a "basic" hull of an HAV and yet it cannot be destroyed by one volley (4 rounds) of a proto Ishukone forge. Your balance suggestions leans to the favor of tanks. Not a balance. If it takes two or more protos to take down a basic, then proto HAV's will dominate. Why would you use a basic dropsuit? you have adv/proto suits so that means more proto dmg mods Also you dont know what the new AV numbers are so is this current AV vs current HAVs or current AV vs new vehicles? Im on about with the vehicle respec we take it back to basics for both sides, currently a proto AV weapon will decimate the new vehicles, also we dont have passive resisatances so the AV will do a full lot of damage, 135% current swarms do unless we have our hardners on but they only last so long Also or stats are wrong if its against shield, generally it will 3/4 shot it This is current. And this is an example of a proto assault forge gun (fitted on a basic dropsuit) vs a "basic" armor tank. Two complex damage mods would deal 2238 HP damage to a "basic" HAV. What I'm trying to get at is why does it take a full proto forge such as this to take a full volley of 4 hits to drop a basic? And you want basic vs basic? Lol. I sometimes run my Ishukone on a basic Dren heavy because it's a free suit and costs me only 59,000 isk to lose per fit. But more often I run the DAU assault forge cause its cheaper. 27,000 per fit. And in the world of AR's, running a fat expensive suit is very costly. I run a basic tank and mods with a proto turret, it costs 1.7mil per fit Also your FG has a 300m range and i cant see you because lolrendering Also where are you positioned? whats the skill of the pilot? whats the tank fit? are hardners on or off? was the repper used? its very situational at best Also the FG does do more damage to armor by an extra 10% but generally you want to use swarms since FG is alot better vs shield but shield has to passive tank and has **** active hardners, the armor tank is the best tank in the game mainly due to good long active hardners and the broken repper which keeps us in the fight Frankly in PC it takes 2 proto FG to kill me but i have eveything active at the time while the FG themselves are up high and i cant defend myself and need a sniper to get rid of you or an OB Isnt 4 shots just a clip of a FG? and its assault which means usper fast firing
I'm not aguing any of your valid points at all.
The insanely high cost per tank loss is just plane stupid. How is it supposed to be fun when it takes an average of 7 games to replace one tank? And that's if you average a payout of $250;000 per match. Yes, I do feel for tankers. And the rendering issue? Another persistent problem that ccp can't seem to straighten out. So yes, I do feel for you tankers out there. And DS pilots. I'm just trying to bring the point that if it's difficult already for one fully kitted up assault forge to drop a basic tank, then an advanced and proto tank would probably too powerful if it was done in tiers like dropsuits. One of the devs or cpms gave an example of this tier system using current stats, and it really made tanks op. That's why they're redoing the whole vehicle system.
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