CoD and Battlefield arnt competitive on consoles, if you think they are, go to a gaming tourney with big prizes, guess what, they dont have the games and if the remote chance they allow it, its the PC version without AA on.

Every match I played today was a total blowout. I'm sure all of the elite players are thrilled...

God forbid you actually have to aim yourself in a FPS.

Every match I played today was a total blowout. I'm sure all of the elite players are thrilled...

Well the matches suck now, what can I say? I've played over a dozen and we either stomp the other team, or they stomp us. When 1.4 hit I was seeing some of the most balanced, heated matches since I can remember. I think this demonstrates why my suggestion is a good compromise: FW/PC get limited AA, pub matches get the standard 1.4 AA. Elite players can be elite in FW/PC, and the other 70% of us can enjoy more intense, closer matches in "high sec."

Well AA has effected balance, radically. And I've yet to hear why my suggestion is bad. Pub matches may not be the pinnacle of gameplay, but I suspect that 80%+ of the population is playing them exclusively.

How will people practice and perfect their gun game if the AA changes depending on the type of match?

Aim your damned self, all day, every day, and this problem goes away.

Because they can use the weak setting in pub matches too (and get a small SP bonus).

You're violating the KISS principle, and you'll violate it further every time someone asks a question about your proposed system to solve a non problem.

Simplest fix is to remove auto aim and make DS3 and mouse fully configurable. People will learn how to aim.

I would say we keeping aim assist and making an e-war counter instate,
like in eve the tracking disrupter
for dust i thing it could be a passive module or a skill that reduce AA,

something like a shape shift, hologram module or a Decoy module

what do you think?

Tomorrow I will host my 5th BCD (Booze, Controller, Dust) event in my flat. We will be around 6 people. There will be two completely dust noobs, who have never ever heard of Dust and 4 people who are always at BCD. From the four who will come NO ONE is playing Dust in his free time excluded the event. I canGÇÖt wait to see the reactions to 1.4. This is going to be very interesting. CanGÇÖt wait for the feedback!

I have other friends who come back to Dust since 1.4 and I hope that this event will infect the others as well :).

You're violating the KISS principle, and you'll violate it further every time someone asks a question about your proposed system to solve a non problem.

Simplest fix is to remove auto aim and make DS3 and mouse fully configurable. People will learn how to aim.

Do you realize how ironic it is to say that my suggestion is too complex (standard AA & weak AA) when your suggestion includes tons of sliders for all kinds of controller variables. Look I'd love to have a hip fire and ads setting for each weapon. I'd love to be able get a setting where from 0-25% the stick is very low sensitivity, and when it's 100% it's very fast.

Having those options won't fix the AA problem. The AA problem is that new players will load up dust, not be able to hit anything and uninstall. 90% of them won't even realize they can configure the controls, and of the ones that do, they probably won't bother because it'll look overwhelming and they haven't even decided if they like the game yet. I've spent a lot of time studying user interaction design, and I can assure you that the solution needs to be simple. Making the AA feel like it does on other console shooters is critical for people's first impressions. If you want to keep competition pure at the highest levels, then fine restrict the controls to weak AA for FW & PC. That isn't complicated, it follows the design principle of progressive disclosure, and it sucks in new players and incentivses them to improve.

To be clear, my view is that the AA problem is that AA is even in this game. It is a crutch, and many players in this game and others do not need it, and do not want it, and after it's gone, won't even miss it. There are people in PC games that can't aim to save their lives, and there is nothing to save them except their investment in themselves. Yet PC FPS servers are still crowded with people of varying skill level and seriousness, and there is no rage quitting because people who can't aim don't have an Aim Assist (unless they are CHEATING, to put it in perspective...).

Your proposal provides for an inconsistent game experience, and as newbies make their way into planetary conquest they will hit a hard wall, and the only way to get a shot at that wall again is to somehow be invited back into a PC. They will get tired of getting stomped and getting kicked from pc due to bad performance, and now you introduce the danger of having an even bigger segregated community of pubbers vs PC participants.

As for the wall of sliders, that can be hidden behind an "advanced" tab. The immediately available preset profiles will be:

Profile B (Battlefield)
Profile C (Cod)
Profile X (Chromosome)
Profile U (Uprising)

This is much more simple from a programming and game design perspective, as all they are doing is exposing the variables they currently have hard-coded into the game, and will prevent people from having to relearn the controls every patch. This, along with tiered battles, is a much better application of Progressive Disclosure, without changing the entire game to placate people who can't aim.

Players who want to get into PC/FW can practice for it by playing in pub matches with the weak aim assist setting (and even receive a small SP boost for doing so). If they've played to the point where they're interested in the higher levels of competition then they're already over the "hump," so to speak. They've probably managed to acquire at least a couple million SP and are seeing their character take shape. At this point they're much less likely to walk away if they find out that FW & PC have weaker AA. I'm pretty confident my proposal would drastically improve new player retention over yours.

This thread is a good place to drop this...

Did you know, that...as a new player, I am being held back by the RPG mechanics.

IE, as a new Sniper, I have more weapon sway than "That Guy"






Point being. With **** like that infesting this game, I don't see where you get off in singling out a mechanic like Aim Assist.


Your entire game is built around the idea of giving Aim Assist to people who have more time invested anyway.


So I guess, what you're all trying to say is, So long as I've played the game long enough, it's ok to have the game make things easier for me. But if I'm new, then I should have to work harder? How does that make any sense?

If anything, someone who has mastered the game.... needs to be challenged more... not less. Yet everything you people complain about is all in the name of making things easy for you, the vet. And harder for the noob.

Please for the love of God, fix your ******* logic.



Let me use CoD as a clearer example for you idiots to get you to realize what it is that you cry about.

CoD has killstreaks.
Do you really think that a guy who just went 11-0.... needs any extra help?
Do you really think the people he's playing against, are going to be able to use their "Newbieness" to handle that killstreak, as well as the guy who just went 11-0 against them?

Most everything you "Vets" try to do, is right in line with CoD killstreaks. You want the developer to make a game that holds YOUR HANDS. And makes things easier for you. Don't lie. You know it's true.

Dust, if it continues down it's current path, will be the new "Poster Child" of this logic. Where the game holds the hands of the players least likely to need that help.


"But I'm so awesome at the game, I deserve to have it hold my hand for me!"
"IF there's no reward for my awesomeness, then the game sucks!"
"Going 11-0 is not enough of a reward, I need the game to kill stuff for me, while I hide in a corner"

Just a few quotes from the idiots that defended Killstreaks to the point that it has become what it has. Rediculous.

Don't make Dust another "Killstreak" FPS.




In other words. Yes AA, is the great equalizer that makes sucky players, worthy opponents. Makes matches worth playing, instead of seeing who can go AFK the quickest.

Matchmaking, has and always will be a failed experiment at trying to replace a server browser. It has NEVER WORKED for any game. The only reason it worked for Halo in the past was because it was new, once the new smell wore off. People started quitting matches more. Why did people quit matches? Because matchmaking was never any good at matching based on skill or what people were actually "interested" in playing.

Quickly and Quality don't mix. That's why matchmaking has never worked.
Matchmaking was always meant to be the "Big Red Easy Button" that does everything at the press of 1 button to get you into a match quickly. Key word, Quickly. Meaning the matchup were never about quality.

IE. Matchmaking cared more about how quickly in can throw you in a "good connection" room. Not the gametype or map or skill levels to consider it a quality matchup.

If matchmaking did care about quality.

You'd quickly realize that you'd all be better off with a server browser.
Because it would take "Matchmaking" 20 minutes to find you a "quality" match.

...
Yes matchmaking is not very good in this game but seriously AA can't be the answer for that problem as AA causes other problems....

Nice statement, but I would avoid using totals, unless you have a proof?

Some off topic question: Is CCP even reading this? We are discussing here out asses off and CCP is screwing with the AA around like crazy. Only hearing the opinions of the one who cries the loudest.

There have been no changes to Aim Assist since Uprising 1.4 was deployed.

Locked for rumor mongering.

Players who want to get into PC/FW can practice for it by playing in pub matches with the weak aim assist setting (and even receive a small SP boost for doing so). If they've played to the point where they're interested in the higher levels of competition then they're already over the "hump," so to speak. They've probably managed to acquire at least a couple million SP and are seeing their character take shape. At this point they're much less likely to walk away if they find out that FW & PC have weaker AA. I'm pretty confident my proposal would drastically improve new player retention over yours.

I agree with the need for full controller customization, but I think keeping the AA as it was at 1.4's launch in "high sec" pub matches would make the experience for new players (and review sites) in-line with the rest of the console FPS industry. There's already a lot to get your head around when you start playing DUST for the first time, and not having the AA that they've grown accustomed to will make the game feel awkward and not worth messing with. I can guarantee you most people will just uninstall instead of trying to figure out how to mess with the controls (or even know they can mess with the controls).

Your focus is still on retaining players at the cost of fundamentally changing gun-play in this game, and reducing the point of being skilled.

Is that a smart trade?

What happens to that middle-of-the-road player who has a slightly higher level of marksmanship to his competition? His skill advantage will be all but erased by AA. Where should his rewards for practice be eroded to placate some lazy entitled whiner?

So what if some skilless noob rage quits after being stomped? Screw that guy, nothing will ever make him happy. Tons of games on PC have no aim assist and those games are healthily populated by people of all skill levels.

This kind of crutch isn't something that belongs in any competitive game, let alone something in the Eve universe. Eve is hard game by video game standards, and I think it's ok if Dust is "hard" by "console" standards.

Is CCP even reading this? We are discussing here out asses off and CCP is screwing with the AA around like crazy. Only hearing the opinions of the one who cries the loudest.

I think it's a necessary trade. DUST needs to increase its playerbase by something like a factor of 100. Having "high sec" pub matches accessible to newcomers, and vets who dislike hyper-twitchy chop-strafing gameplay is a reasonable compromise. The elite players can play in the more exclusive parts of the game where the stakes are higher and the rewards are better, with minimal or no AA, and the other 70% of us can enjoy more balanced matches. There is motivation to improve your gun game, but being a crack-shot isn't a requirement to enjoy the game.

He can play with the weak AA setting and get a small SP boost, or he can even play with no AA and get a significant SP boost. There's something for everyone.

We need skillless noobs to become skilled vets for this game to go anywhere long term. It makes sense to draw them in, and make them want to invest time, effort and money in DUST. The nature of DUST is addictive with it's passive SP system, it makes people want to keep coming back even if they've played another shooter for a while. Also, some may take a break but still run passive boosters, which will help fund game development. This is much more valuable than a system that encourages noobs to rage quit.

EVE is hard, but it's hard because it requires thinking and strategy, not because it's twitchy. No AA's would be like not having an overview in EVE and being forced to click moving ships in space to target them. That's "skill" right? Try proposing that to the "hardcore" EVE players and see how well that idea goes over...