Yep, math, facts, debunking, totally trolling.

Just try to show some kind of proof that tanks aren't insanely OP.

Some dude was offering 50 mil isk for video evidence earlier for proof of people who say soloing tanks is easy. You can convince me with just math, no need to set up any equipment.

Oh you can't do it? That's a shmae....

To really get a good grasp of the situation you really need to put some time into playing both roles. Both roles being Tanks and AV. I'm a Tanker(Proto Missile Gunnolgi, complex mods) and I'm also an AV Heavy(Proto Forge Guns, Prof Lv4). I'll explain my positions on the Tank V. Infantry(rather than focus on Tank V. Tank)

Here are my views and such:

Now I have used Blasters, Rails and Missiles. However I only run Missiles now(unless there's some jack-wagon Redline Rail Gun). The way I see it, Blasters absolutely wreck infantry and are the biggest problem that infantry face. I think a simple increase in dispersion, lower fire rate, and higher damage per shot would decrease it's effectiveness against infantry(especially at range) while keeping it's current effectiveness against Vehicles. Currently, Rail Guns are not very effective against infantry, and unless you have [brag]sweet Missile skillz like me and can hit infantry reliably[/brag] Missiles aren't very effective either(especially with their broken feeling splash mechanics.)

While I do use Tanks, I am truly a Heavy at heart. Maybe it's because I've been a Heavy since I started playing Dust over a year ago and I've gotten particularly good, but I can easily solo Tanks with an Assault Forge Gun and an AV nade or two(maybe even finish 'em off with a flaylock just to get them real salty). The trick is to get behind them and aim at their weak spot. A shocking and revolutionary tactic, I know. But I am serious, the amount of Forge Gunners I've seen who just shoot at the side of Tank from 200m away that can easily just hide behind a near by building or hill is staggering.

Swarms. Sorry, I've never used Swarms seriously. I'd love to offer some balancing or buff suggestions, but I've never used them so I don't feel like I'm in a position to really talk about them.

Here's some tips for you fellow Forge Gunners out there:

Don't use the Sentinel. Only use Basic Frames. Damage mods effect Forge Guns more than any other infantry weapon due to the Forge Guns high base damage, so being able to stick two of them on a suit is vital.

Be mobile. Use an LAV, but don't drive right up to the Tank because it'll probably hear you. And if you are really close to a Tank, drive slower and thus quieter. I swear, people only ever go full throttle or nothing. Get out a distance away and walk closer if you need too. I also recommend putting a Cardiac Regulator and a KinCat in your low slots so you can move a bit faster for longer. Also be prepared to lose your LAV, either to an enemy blowing it up, the LAV blowing itself up if you're away from it for too long, or some ******* blueberry taking off while you're resupplying.

The Assault Forge Gun is King. Unless you want to risk losing any of your Gastun's, use the AFG. ADV tier is fine, but if you can afford it, go with the Ishukone. If you're not good with the AFG, learn to get good. Make an cheap fit, get in an Ambush match and try to hit infantry and get used to the charge-up time. If you can hit a sprinting scout at 100m you can hit a Tank's fuel cells.

EDIT: After reading through most of this thread, the rage is hilarious. I recommend calming down and trying to actually come up with constructive ideas.

Well, the problem here is that you completely ignored one of my posts and you also completely ignored what I was trying to say.

Sorry it is hard to get to the entire tank-brigade at all times, can you repeat your B.S., take a number and sit in the corner with grog. I will BBL to address your B.S.

So you are trolling... when someone is trying to take the middle ground here you just bash em too?

Forge gunners doing it is fine, but tankers doing it is OP.

Double standards all the way.

Please, find me some AVers who stuck up for pilots at ANY point in the last eight months.

Then come talk to me about fucking 'hypocrisy'.

I'm done.

Enjoy your circle jerk.

ARGGHHHHH the irony is killing me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You do understand that currently tanks can camp towers while infantry cannot, due to tanks having a longer range on their rail weaponry than infantry? All you have to do is fly on top of a tower, recall dropship, deploy MLT railgun tank with double damage mods. Where in my statement did i say that forge gun camping on a tower or tanks camping on a tower is OP? Please find it, as i would greatly appreciate viewing my invisible statement. Currently, tankers (yourself included, if you can consider yourself a tanker) complain that tower camping with a forge gun is OP, should not be done, etc. However, you have had a way to fight back against this, albeit rather difficultly, with a railgun which can one shot the infantry. Whereas now, if a tanker is sitting on a tower, infantry AV is powerless to intervene, as their weapons are ineffective at that range.

You could be more hypocritical and nonsensical than Tankahiro, and thats really saying something

Im a Proto Hvy,Fg with 20+ million sp and all your cold hard math sh!T doesn't prove crap. I solo HAV's with an Ishikone/gaston/wy and im here to tell ya it is not that hard. Usually anywere from 3 to 5 shots (3 for militia gear only noobs in a sica or soma) sometimes more but its easy. Usually never more than one clip. You have to understand that when there hardners are off they are vulnerable. Wasting your ammo on a maddy with its hardners on aint gona get you that kill dude. Plus he may try to escape if you press him to much.

I dont have a recorder or id shove the dvd up your anime@ss.

Maybe instead of complaining still about HAV's being Op (they are a bit but CCP is trying to start over on balancing issues with AV vs HAV's.) you should get to or 3 of your corpmates or buds together and go gank some tanks. If three of you cant get the job done....well im afraid you need more help than we can give you.

And you do understand that the turret elevation prevents a tank completely from doing what you describe, right?

A tank can't aim very well at all below its hull.

Im a Proto Hvy,Fg with 20+ million sp and all your cold hard math sh!T doesn't prove crap. I solo HAV's with an Ishikone/gaston/wy and im here to tell ya it is not that hard. Usually anywere from 3 to 5 shots (3 for militia gear only noobs in a sica or soma) sometimes more but its easy. Usually never more than one clip. You have to understand that when there hardners are off they are vulnerable. Wasting your ammo on a maddy with its hardners on aint gona get you that kill dude. Plus he may try to escape if you press him to much.

I dont have a recorder or id shove the dvd up your anime@ss.

Maybe instead of complaining still about HAV's being Op (they are a bit but CCP is trying to start over on balancing issues with AV vs HAV's.) you should get to or 3 of your corpmates or buds together and go gank some tanks. If three of you cant get the job done....well im afraid you need more help than we can give you.

And you do understand that the turret elevation prevents a tank completely from doing what you describe, right?

A tank can't aim very well at all below its hull.

I assume I don't count in this?

What's the point of stating that?

More than likely if they're tower sniping, they're not focused on what's going down right below them. They can still aim at far off objectives with the perfect shot and area denial. And if you try to get up on there with them, you're shot down.

believe it or not, you can aim downwards, idk if its a glitch, but you can do it

Only in the Madrugar and Soma though. Can't aim down in a Sica or a Gunnlogi.

Only in the Madrugar and Soma though. Can't aim down in a Sica or a Gunnlogi.

Before:
AV is invulnerable to Tanks (rendering glitch)

Now:
Tanks are invulnerable to infantry and most AV

Before:
Blah Blah ISK

Now:
200k tank >>>>>>>>>>>> 200k suits

Before:
1 AV'er killing 3 tanks is OP

Now:
1 tank killing squads not OP

Before:
Tanks need teamwork to survive!!

Now:
Tanks should be able to SOLO!! Make AV require teamwork.

Then:
400M range locks down entire field

Now:
lol railguns and killing infantry at 200 Ms with blasters....


Yeah, you guys never get to talk about underpowered again... ever. You have no credibility left.

When infantry complained about contact grenades, they were nerfed into the ground. When tankers complained about AV grenades, infantry said "LOL HTFU."

Do not speak of hypocrisy.

Um, look at AV grenade damage. Hypocrisy?
I haven't seen a single AV grenade kill this build not to mention the fact I haven't seen one thrown.

I only see one person crying. YOU.

I got 2 questions for you

1: Whats your Anti Tank loadout for tanking out a Maddy.?


2: Whats your Anti Tank loadout for tanking out a Gunny.?


1:A: I bet the answer is the antiarmor fit that you got with your caracter. OMG

2:A: Milita hvy with militia FG. Hope you at least threw on a militia damage mod.

FYI: CCP is trying to rebalance Av vs Hav. thats why everything was nerfed and started over.

no1 is even trying to av at the current point in time.

the few ppl i do see using av are pretty successful. ive been aving for quite a while as well with my unspecced av. basically its a mlt free suit with adv swarms and std av nades.

if ppl would pull their head out of their own ass and use some actual tactics with av. the situation would get better.

TRANSLATION: Please dont nerf my no gungame tank crutches

advanced swarms?
Hell no!

standard av nades......STANDARD!!! av nades
HELL NO!!

Do us a favor and just stop posting.

I killed Bad Furry with an AV grenade Wednesday.

no.

I know Bad Furry and an AV grenade is "usefull" for three things in build 1.7

1 wasting isk
2 wasting CPU PG
3makeing Bad Furry and other tankers say LOOK! an IDIOT! with av grenades...

I got a tank with Lai dais (packed) yesterday.