Redline tanks are not automatically unstoppable. I've been on both sides of the redline game, and I've killed and been killed by rail tanks. Some guys will just run with a failing strategy and blow through 20 ADS in a match, and others find their inner killer instinct with a suicidal RE-packed LAV. Also, a no SP Sica can spawn camp the redline, but that's not nearly as fun.

Dropships have always annoyed me. They facilitate rooftop snipers (forge and rifles) - tactics I despise, and it's little different from redline camping/hiding. Same attitude. Pilots asked for a chance, they didn't like being threatened by infantry, so now we have to call in tanks to counter their cowardly tactics. I do it because I have to, and if I can discourage future harassment, that's a win-win. If these pilots had their way, I'd need to build a DS covered in REs to have a chance at killing another dropship. That would be silly, but nobody should feel safe anywhere on the battlefield.

Brah, do you even Dropship?

did you or did you not cause the pilot to flee asap?
also swarms need a damage buff by 20

I try not to damn certain game tactics or weapons as broken unless it is desperate. But rail gun tanks are just so completely broken it has me wondering if they were properly tested.

They have Huge alpha, Huge Hp, Huge Range, Huge elevation and they can be immune in the redline. Not just in the redline but they can shoot an objective from 300m in the redline.

This is monstrously stupid. I cannot move in any map, or any game mode without a rail tank or three that are up to 300 meters into the redline 1 or 2 shotting my dropship. It is absolutely broken. I have even been killed at the maximum flight ceiling. Exactly what is a flying vehicles advantage if a tank can kill it anywhere in the entire sky?

I think you might need to see the Issue from my perspective Quill. Hence (delayed by that christian holiday)my upcoming video.

The video will make my points clearer.

As regards fitting and movement. Map design is such that the rail tank can cover huge parts of the map including often every objective (airspace we are talking about here) from great distance. The issue this causes is that they can hit a dropship almost anywhere. This negates the design decision of active modules giving us a strong attack window. Dropships have no attack window. We can be hit so easily from so far that we have few retreat options.

Afterburners are not the solution. A variety of fits should be available and viable, scanners, CRUs etc. Forcing me to use a certain tactic because of a broken game element is a poor fix. not a proper solution.

Well.. you're entitled to your opinion. However, i respectfully disagree, having a different opinion.

Afterburners *are* *a* solution. They're not the solution you want... but that doesnt suddenly make them "not a solution".

Also, your wording isnt helping. If you replace it with more neutral language, ie:

"Forcing me to use a certain tactic, because of one specific game element", it becomes clearer, that this is not neccessarily a game breaking issue.

Even if you dont believe that, it is still a fact that a reasonably equipped dropship, should be able to survive at least one hit, and then be able to take some sort of appropriate action.
Unless of course, it is just gently floating in the air like a blimp saying "hit me hit me hit me!"

Now, there is an edge case, for triple stacked damage mods, making a single hit overly extreme.
I would suggest that this is not an issue of "rail tanks are broken", but rather, "damage mods are broken".
Perhaps you should lobby for damage mods not being stackable.

I for one, would be all behind that, since it would make infantry lives much better as well.


Edit: I personally have hit a dropship, with a non-damage-modded rail tank, with around 6(maybe 5) shots in the same clip... and it still survived.
So that's the biggest reason why I disagree that rail tanks are broken, even with respect to dropshits.
(admittedly, MOST dropships, go down in flames after 3 shots. But we already know that most dropship fits out there are laughable)

Quill you keep repeating without stateing a definitive. So lets cut the waffle. Do you think that redline rail tanks with 600m rage and 1:1.2 elevation are balanced weapons?

Well.. you're entitled to your opinion. However, i respectfully disagree, having a different opinion.

Afterburners *are* *a* solution. They're not the solution you want... but that doesnt suddenly make them "not a solution".

Also, your wording isnt helping. If you replace it with more neutral language, ie:

"Forcing me to use a certain tactic, because of one specific game element", it becomes clearer, that this is not neccessarily a game breaking issue.

Even if you dont believe that, it is still a fact that a reasonably equipped dropship, should be able to survive at least one hit, and then be able to take some sort of appropriate action.
Unless of course, it is just gently floating in the air like a blimp saying "hit me hit me hit me!"

Now, there is an edge case, for triple stacked damage mods, making a single hit overly extreme.
I would suggest that this is not an issue of "rail tanks are broken", but rather, "damage mods are broken".
Perhaps you should lobby for damage mods not being stackable.

I for one, would be all behind that, since it would make infantry lives much better as well.


Edit: I personally have hit a dropship, with a non-damage-modded rail tank, with around 6(maybe 5) shots in the same clip... and it still survived.
So that's the biggest reason why I disagree that rail tanks are broken, even with respect to dropships.
(admittedly, MOST dropships, go down in flames after 3 shots. But we already know that most dropship fits out there are laughable)

(Gah.. edit #2: fixed a rude typo I didnt realize I made :-/ )

TL;DR remove the redlines, bring in more alternative starting spawnpoints and spread them out far apart on the edges of each map.

Cool. So where we disagree mainly is the elevation. What about map design having airspace that is too open?

Too many strawmen there Quill. I can't really respond to that.

Sounds like you have a rather locked mentality about this.

Do you believe, "Dropships should always have a way to win"?

or to put it another way,
"Dropships should be able to beat anything else"?


if no, then tell us what the balancing weakness for dropships is?

I try not to damn certain game tactics or weapons as broken unless it is desperate. But rail gun tanks are just so completely broken it has me wondering if they were properly tested.

They have Huge alpha, Huge Hp, Huge Range, Huge elevation and they can be immune in the redline. Not just in the redline but they can shoot an objective from 300m in the redline. This is monstrously stupid. I cannot move in any map, or any game mode without a rail tank or three that are up to 300 meters into the redline 1 or 2 shotting my dropship. It is absolutely broken. I have even been killed at the maximum flight ceiling. Exactly what is a flying vehicles advantage if a tank can kill it anywhere in the entire sky?

They are not in need of slight balance or tweaking but plain broken to the point that they should not be in the game with the maps that we have.

I am making a video to make my point but at this stage CCP. They need to go. Now. Until they can be made to work with current map size and until you fix the broken and unbalanced redline they have to go. SImply remove the rail turret until we can make a weapon that powerful work within the limits of fair balance,

I only make threads like this if something is game breakingly bad. And I don't like to. But this is a special case. Did you know that at 250m from an objective, from a flat surface a rail tank can shoot a dropship 238 meters up?! Tanks rule the ground and the sky. At 238 meters my dropship is useless. I have to sit, in complete exposure evey single game to these distant, redline tanks. I can't use skill or tactics to avoid them. They see me all the time from complete safety. The tank can cover any area a dropship can operate in from a single spot up to 540m away (proven tested distance)

So here it is CCP. Take out that turret. Now. Until we can balance it. Its unfair and it breaks air/ground balance. CCP, you need to speak to us pilots about this. Not part-timers; but us full on dropship guys. Please engage us. In private, behind NDAs or whatever you feel is best but we really need to talk with you. This stuff needs fixing. ASAP.

No blue tag yet....

Are you surprised?

Why not just decrease tracking speed? Rails have BAD tracking speeds in EVE it'd make them unable to move their turret around up close and force them to snipe...

I try not to damn certain game tactics or weapons as broken unless it is desperate. But rail gun tanks are just so completely broken it has me wondering if they were properly tested.

They have Huge alpha, Huge Hp, Huge Range, Huge elevation and they can be immune in the redline. Not just in the redline but they can shoot an objective from 300m in the redline. This is monstrously stupid. I cannot move in any map, or any game mode without a rail tank or three that are up to 300 meters into the redline 1 or 2 shotting my dropship. It is absolutely broken. I have even been killed at the maximum flight ceiling. Exactly what is a flying vehicles advantage if a tank can kill it anywhere in the entire sky?

They are not in need of slight balance or tweaking but plain broken to the point that they should not be in the game with the maps that we have.

I am making a video to make my point but at this stage CCP. They need to go. Now. Until they can be made to work with current map size and until you fix the broken and unbalanced redline they have to go. SImply remove the rail turret until we can make a weapon that powerful work within the limits of fair balance,

I only make threads like this if something is game breakingly bad. And I don't like to. But this is a special case. Did you know that at 250m from an objective, from a flat surface a rail tank can shoot a dropship 238 meters up?! Tanks rule the ground and the sky. At 238 meters my dropship is useless. I have to sit, in complete exposure evey single game to these distant, redline tanks. I can't use skill or tactics to avoid them. They see me all the time from complete safety. The tank can cover any area a dropship can operate in from a single spot up to 540m away (proven tested distance)

So here it is CCP. Take out that turret. Now. Until we can balance it. Its unfair and it breaks air/ground balance. CCP, you need to speak to us pilots about this. Not part-timers; but us full on dropship guys. Please engage us. In private, behind NDAs or whatever you feel is best but we really need to talk with you. This stuff needs fixing. ASAP.