Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Zero Harpuia
Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance
1068
|
Posted - 2013.10.05 23:09:00 -
[91] - Quote
There is a problem most of you are willfully ignoring on the subject of Logis. They are not designed to be equipment mules, they just happen to be thrust into that role via bad foresight. If anything, Scouts are better suited to use Equipment. Logistics just make a good equipment mule due to their high number of slots and high fitting, similar to what makes them as good at killing as Assaults. These bonuses are meant to cinch up each suit's roles and to give each class of suits the roles they were envisioned to have.
Imagine that the game is TF2 for a moment. Logi is Medic, but can also equip Engineer's wrench and build stuff. Due to Medic's greater speed, HP, and regen, people will always choose Medic over Engie. There is also the fact that in this little universe, Engie does not exist, so they feel that choosing Medic to Engineer is normal.
That is the state of DUST. there is no Engineer role suit, so the Logistics suit is filling in for it. When they get around to fixing the role bonus problems, they will make the Logistics suits actually focus on Logistics, which is EVE slang for Healing. They will then make a new suit for the other Equipment, like the some of the Type-2 suits used to be.
Therefore, I feel that we should make a new class of suits in the OP. The Engineer class.
Minmatar will get bonuses to Remote Explosives due to their speed and lower, but not lowest, scan profile. This may cover all the explosives, like proximity. Amarr will get bonuses to the Drop Uplink, as they are the slower and tankier ones they will be the ones most familiar with advantageous terrain. Gallente would hopefully get drones. Sentry drones for point defense, small drones for personal mobile support, etc. Or, they can get the Active Scanner and Point Defense Drones while GalLogi gets bonuses to repair drones. Caldari, I'm honestly not too sure on. I'm not a major Caldari in any verse, but maybe... Webbifiers? interdiction bubbles? EWAR? Should another suit entirely be EWAR? Help me out here.
EDIT: Make shield repper. Give CalLogi bonus to Shield Repper. Give CalEngie bonus to Nanohives. Boom. |
Cosgar
ParagonX
5653
|
Posted - 2013.10.05 23:41:00 -
[92] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Cosgar wrote:Zero Harpuia wrote:That about right? Sounds like these bonuses would fix that somewhat, giving the assault suits the power to be the weapons guys, and the Logis the repair aptitude to be allowed to drop their gun once in a while. Actually, what it does is kills versatility in a role designed for diversity. I did some thinking on the logistics bonuses and like I mentioned earlier in the topic, the need to be more generalized while being equipment oriented instead of tied down to a single piece of equipment that you're not always going to carry given the circumstances you need to adapt to in a single battle. Also, we're going to get more equipment at some point and for a class meant to use equipment, shouldn't their bonuses affect as much of it as possible? Gallente: +5% to equipment range per level. Instead of being tied to one thing, you get a bonus that can affect the effective range of nanohives, reppers, the active scanner, the blast radius for REs/Mines and can fit with other equipment we might get later like target painters, bubble shields, webifiers... etc. Amarr: +5% to armor repair module efficacy per level. Honestly, there's really nothing wrong with the Amarr bonus. It fits with the suit as an assault/logi hybrid and since it affects armor repair on a suit that only gets 4 low slots at prototype it's not overpowering. The only change I would make is to extend that bonus to reactive plates as well to add more flexability to the suit's armor tanking options. Caldari: -5% to equipment cooldown per level. Similar to the Gallete, this would affect a broader range of equipment instead of one thing, but just like the Gallente, focus on reusable equipment. This would apply to the active scanner, but later down the road any and all equipment that would have a cooldown like anything EWAR related. Before I go into the Minmatar bonus, I still don't see what the issue is for a suit bonus that only works in 2/3 of the game's available modes. I'd rather keep the hacking bonus since it's what everyone wants logistics to be- non combat oriented. But if the bonus has to go, I'd suggest something like this. Minmatar: +5% to deployed equipment carried per level. At max level this would affect how many nanohives, uplinks, and later on bubble shields, proximity scanners, decoys, or any other deployed equipment that would come into the game. I'm open to ideas as long as they fit with the logi's focus on equipment. I do like where you're going with this, but there are some issues with what you propose. The cooldown reduction bonus would be only useful for active scanner until other equipment with cooldown comes, and we don't even know if EWAR stuff will be deployable or cooldown based. I don't want a bonus based on the assumption of how a future piece of equipment might work. 5% (25% max) units carried bonus would be useless to many deployable equipment, since 25% of the maximum carried for many is still less than one. Though I suppose anything 0.5 or higher can be rounded up to to 1. EDIT: Nevermind, I see you said elsewhere that it should round up. The Amarr logi bonus I'm fine with your idea or my idea. EDIT: Regarding the current Minmatar logi bonus, its not so much that its an issue, its just that it doesn't really fit with the logi's emphasis on equipment, and it would work MUCH better on the Minmatar scout. The current scout's melee damage even with maxed out melee bonus is still weak compared to a medium frame's melee, and a bonus to another race's knives doesn't make sense; even if its changed to a bonus for the Minmatar knives when they come out, it will still be weird that only one race's suit gets a bonus to their knives. The fastest scout having the hacking speed bonus would make the most sense to me. If these changes come, there would have to be an SP refund, so you could rethink your role and specializations if you need to. Those ideas weren't etched in stone, just something to show you the kind of flexibility the bonuses need. Bonuses to specific pieces of equipment is the ultimate dud a lot of logistics players are dreading. For example, I'm a Minmatar logi and I rarely use my repper and focus more on triage hives. A repair tool bonus would be as useful for me as a screen door on a submarine. Also, I was thinking ahead on the different types of equipment we may eventually be getting in hopes that when the bonuses do change we'll have more gear to show for it as well.
The hacking bonus actually is pretty in line with the logi suit when you think about it. All the Minmatar suits are built for guerrilla hit and run tactics. Assaults make great flankers, scouts (used to) make great alpha damage assassins, and the logi is an excellent infiltrator and trapper. The heavy will most likely wind up having the lowest EHP, but the highest shield recharge rate, lowest delay and most mobility. |
Cosgar
ParagonX
5653
|
Posted - 2013.10.06 00:02:00 -
[93] - Quote
Zero Harpuia wrote:There is a problem most of you are willfully ignoring on the subject of Logis. They are not designed to be equipment mules, they just happen to be thrust into that role via bad foresight. If anything, Scouts are better suited to use Equipment. Logistics just make a good equipment mule due to their high number of slots and high fitting, similar to what makes them as good at killing as Assaults. These bonuses are meant to cinch up each suit's roles and to give each class of suits the roles they were envisioned to have.
Imagine that the game is TF2 for a moment. Logi is Medic, but can also equip Engineer's wrench and build stuff. Due to Medic's greater speed, HP, and regen, people will always choose Medic over Engie. There is also the fact that in this little universe, Engie does not exist, so they feel that choosing Medic to Engineer is normal.
That is the state of DUST. there is no Engineer role suit, so the Logistics suit is filling in for it. When they get around to fixing the role bonus problems, they will make the Logistics suits actually focus on Logistics, which is EVE slang for Healing. They will then make a new suit for the other Equipment, like the some of the Type-2 suits used to be.
Therefore, I feel that we should make a new class of suits in the OP. The Engineer class.
Minmatar will get bonuses to Remote Explosives due to their speed and lower, but not lowest, scan profile. This may cover all the explosives, like proximity. Amarr will get bonuses to the Drop Uplink, as they are the slower and tankier ones they will be the ones most familiar with advantageous terrain. Gallente would hopefully get drones. Sentry drones for point defense, small drones for personal mobile support, etc. Or, they can get the Active Scanner and Point Defense Drones while GalLogi gets bonuses to repair drones. Caldari, I'm honestly not too sure on. I'm not a major Caldari in any verse, but maybe... Webbifiers? interdiction bubbles? EWAR? Should another suit entirely be EWAR? Help me out here.
EDIT: Make shield repper. Give CalLogi bonus to Shield Repper. Give CalEngie bonus to Nanohives. Boom. From a TF perspective: Scout = Scout and Spy Heavy = Pyro, Heavy, and Soldier Logi = Engineer, Demoman, and Medic Assault = Soldier |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6427
|
Posted - 2013.10.06 03:15:00 -
[94] - Quote
Someone suggested scan precision as a Caldari scout bonus, I kind of like that. |
Zero Harpuia
Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance
1070
|
Posted - 2013.10.06 20:23:00 -
[95] - Quote
Cosgar wrote:Zero Harpuia wrote:There is a problem most of you are willfully ignoring on the subject of Logis. They are not designed to be equipment mules, they just happen to be thrust into that role via bad foresight. If anything, Scouts are better suited to use Equipment. Logistics just make a good equipment mule due to their high number of slots and high fitting, similar to what makes them as good at killing as Assaults. These bonuses are meant to cinch up each suit's roles and to give each class of suits the roles they were envisioned to have.
Imagine that the game is TF2 for a moment. Logi is Medic, but can also equip Engineer's wrench and build stuff. Due to Medic's greater speed, HP, and regen, people will always choose Medic over Engie. There is also the fact that in this little universe, Engie does not exist, so they feel that choosing Medic to Engineer is normal.
That is the state of DUST. there is no Engineer role suit, so the Logistics suit is filling in for it. When they get around to fixing the role bonus problems, they will make the Logistics suits actually focus on Logistics, which is EVE slang for Healing. They will then make a new suit for the other Equipment, like the some of the Type-2 suits used to be.
Therefore, I feel that we should make a new class of suits in the OP. The Engineer class.
Minmatar will get bonuses to Remote Explosives due to their speed and lower, but not lowest, scan profile. This may cover all the explosives, like proximity. Amarr will get bonuses to the Drop Uplink, as they are the slower and tankier ones they will be the ones most familiar with advantageous terrain. Gallente would hopefully get drones. Sentry drones for point defense, small drones for personal mobile support, etc. Or, they can get the Active Scanner and Point Defense Drones while GalLogi gets bonuses to repair drones. Caldari, I'm honestly not too sure on. I'm not a major Caldari in any verse, but maybe... Webbifiers? interdiction bubbles? EWAR? Should another suit entirely be EWAR? Help me out here.
EDIT: Make shield repper. Give CalLogi bonus to Shield Repper. Give CalEngie bonus to Nanohives. Boom. From a TF perspective: Scout = Scout and Spy Heavy = Pyro, Heavy, and Soldier Logi = Engineer, Demoman, and Medic Assault = Soldier
Actually, Assault is Demoman and Soldier, maybe Pyro too. Depends on what exactly you;d want Commando for once they make the suit abit more viable.
Also, I stand by the idea that Logi aren't Equipment mules, and that general bonuses are bad for Logis. Should we make the Assaukt bonuses just '5% bonus to damage' because some CalAss wants to use Laser Rifles? Or because a AmarrAss wants to use SMGs as a primary? You CAN make anything, as they state repeatedly, but everyone agrees that some things are better off never being created.
Also, anyone else find it funny that the best shortening for Assault is Ass? I didn't meant to insult Assaults, but it just made me chuckle so I kept it. |
I-Shayz-I
Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic
1020
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 02:57:00 -
[96] - Quote
Weekly bump because this is important. ____________________
My list of most important threads: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=102975&find=unread
If you know of any topics you'd like to add please post them here |
True Adamance
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
2724
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 03:20:00 -
[97] - Quote
Did you consider a bonus to Assault Damage with light weapons?
I know it sounds pretty silly but I always thought of the assault suit like the wasp while the logi was the bee.
Wasps by common stero type and thin and lithe, they dart about with a painful sting, which they can use again and again and again.
Bee's/ Bumble Bees are the slower, more clumsy, by more formidable in stature, sting once, but fulfil a supporting role in the hive.
I just imagined the Assault would have high DPS, but low EHP and require logi support to stay alive, coupling that with their relative speed over the other suits, while Logis would be higher EHP, but low a DPS, harder to kill but more resilient in a fight |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6493
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 03:26:00 -
[98] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Did you consider a bonus to Assault Damage with light weapons?
I know it sounds pretty silly but I always thought of the assault suit like the wasp while the logi was the bee.
Wasps by common stero type and thin and lithe, they dart about with a painful sting, which they can use again and again and again.
Bee's/ Bumble Bees are the slower, more clumsy, by more formidable in stature, sting once, but fulfil a supporting role in the hive.
I just imagined the Assault would have high DPS, but low EHP and require logi support to stay alive, coupling that with their relative speed over the other suits, while Logis would be higher EHP, but low a DPS, harder to kill but more resilient in a fight I originally had assault bonus be a a 2% damage bonus per level, but eventually changed it and gave damage bonus to Gallente instead since their weapons are about DPS, and made it 5% total since many thought 10% was too much. I suppose the damage bonus could be the general bonus, and Gallente could keep the current PG/CPU bonus but make it specifically for plasma weapons. I had a skype conversation with some other posters, and they preferred something more... interesting then the PG/CPU thing for Gallente assault.
I might change it again. |
True Adamance
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
2726
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 04:01:00 -
[99] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:True Adamance wrote:Did you consider a bonus to Assault Damage with light weapons?
I know it sounds pretty silly but I always thought of the assault suit like the wasp while the logi was the bee.
Wasps by common stero type and thin and lithe, they dart about with a painful sting, which they can use again and again and again.
Bee's/ Bumble Bees are the slower, more clumsy, by more formidable in stature, sting once, but fulfil a supporting role in the hive.
I just imagined the Assault would have high DPS, but low EHP and require logi support to stay alive, coupling that with their relative speed over the other suits, while Logis would be higher EHP, but low a DPS, harder to kill but more resilient in a fight I originally had assault bonus be a a 2% damage bonus per level, but eventually changed it and gave damage bonus to Gallente instead since their weapons are about DPS, and made it 5% total since many thought 10% was too much. I suppose the damage bonus could be the general bonus, and Gallente could keep the current PG/CPU bonus but make it specifically for plasma weapons. I had a skype conversation with some other posters, and they preferred something more... interesting then the PG/CPU thing for Gallente assault. I might change it again. I do not feel that is right given the state of the AR which ignores the rules of Blaster tech |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6493
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 04:27:00 -
[100] - Quote
Cosgar wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Cosgar wrote:Zero Harpuia wrote:That about right? Sounds like these bonuses would fix that somewhat, giving the assault suits the power to be the weapons guys, and the Logis the repair aptitude to be allowed to drop their gun once in a while. Actually, what it does is kills versatility in a role designed for diversity. I did some thinking on the logistics bonuses and like I mentioned earlier in the topic, the need to be more generalized while being equipment oriented instead of tied down to a single piece of equipment that you're not always going to carry given the circumstances you need to adapt to in a single battle. Also, we're going to get more equipment at some point and for a class meant to use equipment, shouldn't their bonuses affect as much of it as possible? Gallente: +5% to equipment range per level. Instead of being tied to one thing, you get a bonus that can affect the effective range of nanohives, reppers, the active scanner, the blast radius for REs/Mines and can fit with other equipment we might get later like target painters, bubble shields, webifiers... etc. Amarr: +5% to armor repair module efficacy per level. Honestly, there's really nothing wrong with the Amarr bonus. It fits with the suit as an assault/logi hybrid and since it affects armor repair on a suit that only gets 4 low slots at prototype it's not overpowering. The only change I would make is to extend that bonus to reactive plates as well to add more flexability to the suit's armor tanking options. Caldari: -5% to equipment cooldown per level. Similar to the Gallete, this would affect a broader range of equipment instead of one thing, but just like the Gallente, focus on reusable equipment. This would apply to the active scanner, but later down the road any and all equipment that would have a cooldown like anything EWAR related. Before I go into the Minmatar bonus, I still don't see what the issue is for a suit bonus that only works in 2/3 of the game's available modes. I'd rather keep the hacking bonus since it's what everyone wants logistics to be- non combat oriented. But if the bonus has to go, I'd suggest something like this. Minmatar: +5% to deployed equipment carried per level. At max level this would affect how many nanohives, uplinks, and later on bubble shields, proximity scanners, decoys, or any other deployed equipment that would come into the game. I'm open to ideas as long as they fit with the logi's focus on equipment. I do like where you're going with this, but there are some issues with what you propose. The cooldown reduction bonus would be only useful for active scanner until other equipment with cooldown comes, and we don't even know if EWAR stuff will be deployable or cooldown based. I don't want a bonus based on the assumption of how a future piece of equipment might work. 5% (25% max) units carried bonus would be useless to many deployable equipment, since 25% of the maximum carried for many is still less than one. Though I suppose anything 0.5 or higher can be rounded up to to 1. EDIT: Nevermind, I see you said elsewhere that it should round up. The Amarr logi bonus I'm fine with your idea or my idea. EDIT: Regarding the current Minmatar logi bonus, its not so much that its an issue, its just that it doesn't really fit with the logi's emphasis on equipment, and it would work MUCH better on the Minmatar scout. The current scout's melee damage even with maxed out melee bonus is still weak compared to a medium frame's melee, and a bonus to another race's knives doesn't make sense; even if its changed to a bonus for the Minmatar knives when they come out, it will still be weird that only one race's suit gets a bonus to their knives. The fastest scout having the hacking speed bonus would make the most sense to me. If these changes come, there would have to be an SP refund, so you could rethink your role and specializations if you need to. Those ideas weren't etched in stone, just something to show you the kind of flexibility the bonuses need. Bonuses to specific pieces of equipment is the ultimate dud a lot of logistics players are dreading. For example, I'm a Minmatar logi and I rarely use my repper and focus more on triage hives. A repair tool bonus would be as useful for me as a screen door on a submarine. Also, I was thinking ahead on the different types of equipment we may eventually be getting in hopes that when the bonuses do change we'll have more gear to show for it as well. The hacking bonus actually is pretty in line with the logi suit when you think about it. All the Minmatar suits are built for guerrilla hit and run tactics. Assaults make great flankers, scouts (used to) make great alpha damage assassins, and the logi is an excellent infiltrator and trapper. The heavy will most likely wind up having the lowest EHP, but the highest shield recharge rate, lowest delay and most mobility.
I'm about to change the proposal, I need ideas. I can't use the max units carried for deployables thing since even if I round up, It will still be useless at early levels. The range Idea is great (Repair tool range, active scanner range, active scanner range, nanohive supply radius). I'm also thinking of an efficacy bonus (effects repair rate of repair tool, nanohive resupply rate, active scanner precision, RE/PM, RE max spawns) I need a third idea.
OPENED TO SUGGESTIONS |
|
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6500
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 04:30:00 -
[101] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:True Adamance wrote:Did you consider a bonus to Assault Damage with light weapons?
I know it sounds pretty silly but I always thought of the assault suit like the wasp while the logi was the bee.
Wasps by common stero type and thin and lithe, they dart about with a painful sting, which they can use again and again and again.
Bee's/ Bumble Bees are the slower, more clumsy, by more formidable in stature, sting once, but fulfil a supporting role in the hive.
I just imagined the Assault would have high DPS, but low EHP and require logi support to stay alive, coupling that with their relative speed over the other suits, while Logis would be higher EHP, but low a DPS, harder to kill but more resilient in a fight I originally had assault bonus be a a 2% damage bonus per level, but eventually changed it and gave damage bonus to Gallente instead since their weapons are about DPS, and made it 5% total since many thought 10% was too much. I suppose the damage bonus could be the general bonus, and Gallente could keep the current PG/CPU bonus but make it specifically for plasma weapons. I had a skype conversation with some other posters, and they preferred something more... interesting then the PG/CPU thing for Gallente assault. I might change it again. I do not feel that is right given the state of the AR which ignores the rules of Blaster tech
Changed it again |
Stile451
Red Star. EoN.
264
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 07:30:00 -
[102] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:I'm about to change the proposal, I need ideas. I can't use the max units carried for deployables thing since even if I round up, It will still be useless at early levels. The range Idea is great (Repair tool range, active scanner range, active scanner range, nanohive supply radius). I'm also thinking of an efficacy bonus (effects repair rate of repair tool, nanohive resupply rate, active scanner precision, RE/PM, RE max spawns) I need a third idea.
OPENED TO SUGGESTIONS I like these suggestions as they are useful without being specific while being focused on equipment.
For a third idea what about an equipment cool down reduction. It would be very useful for active scanners(maybe too useful) but would also affect uplinks(I have no idea why they have a cool down) and explosives(there will likely be future equipment with cool downs as well). |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6502
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 07:45:00 -
[103] - Quote
Stile451 wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:I'm about to change the proposal, I need ideas. I can't use the max units carried for deployables thing since even if I round up, It will still be useless at early levels. The range Idea is great (Repair tool range, active scanner range, active scanner range, nanohive supply radius). I'm also thinking of an efficacy bonus (effects repair rate of repair tool, nanohive resupply rate, active scanner precision, RE/PM, RE max spawns) I need a third idea.
OPENED TO SUGGESTIONS I like these suggestions as they are useful without being specific while being focused on equipment. For a third idea what about an equipment cool down reduction. It would be very useful for active scanners(maybe too useful) but would also affect uplinks(I have no idea why they have a cool down) and explosives(there will likely be future equipment with cool downs as well). Cosgar suggested a cooldown thing as well, but the scanner is the only thing that has cooldown, and I don't want to suggest a bonus like that if I don't know for sure if and when other equipment will cooldown will come. |
Stile451
Red Star. EoN.
265
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 08:30:00 -
[104] - Quote
Maybe change the skill to speed increase for equipment. Hives would pulse faster(same amount of clusters with the same amount of ammo replenished but simply faster), uplinks would spawn quicker, scan rate would be quicker but time showing would remain the same. There is an overlap with the repair tool and the efficacy option(efficacy repairs more, but this one repairs more often - should equal out to be the same amount repaired over the same time period). Perhaps this could be used in conjunction with cool downs but it may not be necessary.
It's basically overclocking your equipment. |
Zat Earthshatter
Ghosts Of Ourselves
376
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 08:45:00 -
[105] - Quote
This is a very good suggestion in my opinion The skill bonuses I've seen while I was playing seem to be very haphazard, with the same specialization promoting completely random playstyles depending on race.
I also noticed, however, that a large portion of your ideas were based on as-yet-unannounced gear items, specifically melee weapons. I have an idea, but I wish to remain on-topic, so I'll probably post a new thread with the suggestion. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6505
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 08:59:00 -
[106] - Quote
Zat Earthshatter wrote:This is a very good suggestion in my opinion The skill bonuses I've seen while I was playing seem to be very haphazard, with the same specialization promoting completely random playstyles depending on race.
I also noticed, however, that a large portion of your ideas were based on as-yet-unannounced gear items, specifically melee weapons. I have an idea, but I wish to remain on-topic, so I'll probably post a new thread with the suggestion. All racial melee weapons have been announced and shown in Fanfest 2013, they're all a bunch of knives (ooh, how creative ). Here: http://i.imgur.com/uoQpwnJ.jpg
None of my suggestions are based on anything unannounced. |
Broonfondle Majikthies
Bannana Boat Corp
306
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 09:59:00 -
[107] - Quote
I believe I heard somewhere that they were going to add perks/skills to using race weapons with characters (nothing drastic like a damage boost for instance, just reflecting their combined origin / familiarity - less kick?) And I think the Min scouts + logi's would be upset with the skill changes - doesn't reflect the lore. Scouts are close combat experts
Incidental the lore is also why Commando's can punch like a a runaway freight train and break a light frame in one swing |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6510
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 14:17:00 -
[108] - Quote
Broonfondle Majikthies wrote:I believe I heard somewhere that they were going to add perks/skills to using race weapons with characters (nothing drastic like a damage boost for instance, just reflecting their combined origin / familiarity - less kick?) And I think the Min scouts + logi's would be upset with the skill changes - doesn't reflect the lore. Scouts are close combat experts Incidental the lore is also why Commando's can punch like a a runaway freight train and break a light frame in one swing
Like I already said, even with the maxed out skill bonus, the the Minmatar scout's bonus still sucks compared to a medium frame. It is a dumb bonus. Scouts are not just CQC experts, and they're also experts at spotting, sneaking and sneaking to avoid combat. Their speed, scanning, and stealth makes them perfect for avoiding combat and getting to the objectives, therefore nothing about the lore contradicts that.
Nothing about the lore justifies a hacking bonus for the Minmatar logi either. |
Hagintora
Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation
156
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 14:36:00 -
[109] - Quote
I think I'd be more comfortable with Assaults getting a 5% reduction to CPU/PG of all Light Weapons and Sidearms. It would allow them to fit higher tier weapons while still giving room for better Slot fittings.
The idea of Duvolle Assault Rifle with 15% proficiency bonus, and a 10% Suit bonus, combined with Damage Mods really doesn't appeal to me.
Unless my math is completely wrong, (a possibility I fully admit to) with 2 Complex Damage Mods it would be doing 56.57 damage wit ha 707.12 DPS. 37.4 base for the Duvolle, plus 15% for Prof Skill (43.01), plus 10% for the Suit bonus (47.31) plus 10% for the first Damage Mod (52.04) plus 8.7%(?) for the second Damage Mod equals 56.57 damage per shot, times 12.5 rounds per second ROF makes it 707.12 DPS.
I think this bonus could push the damage output of one Class above what any other class can take, or dish out in return. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6510
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 14:56:00 -
[110] - Quote
Hagintora wrote:I think I'd be more comfortable with Assaults getting a 5% reduction to CPU/PG of all Light Weapons and Sidearms. It would allow them to fit higher tier weapons while still giving room for better Slot fittings.
The idea of Duvolle Assault Rifle with 15% proficiency bonus, and a 10% Suit bonus, combined with Damage Mods really doesn't appeal to me.
Unless my math is completely wrong, (a possibility I fully admit to) with 2 Complex Damage Mods it would be doing 56.57 damage wit ha 707.12 DPS. 37.4 base for the Duvolle, plus 15% for Prof Skill (43.01), plus 10% for the Suit bonus (47.31) plus 10% for the first Damage Mod (52.04) plus 8.7%(?) for the second Damage Mod equals 56.57 damage per shot, times 12.5 rounds per second ROF makes it 707.12 DPS.
I think this bonus could push the damage output of one Class above what any other class can take, or dish out in return. Damage mods have stacking penalties; each successive one reduces in effectiveness. I would like the 10% damage buffs to all weapons that Uprising brought reduced. If the assault bonus is only 5%, then it would be 5% less powerful then guns currently are right now. |
|
Hagintora
Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation
156
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 15:10:00 -
[111] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Damage mods have stacking penalties; each successive one reduces in effectiveness. I would like the 10% damage buffs to all weapons that Uprising brought reduced. If the assault bonus is only 5%, then it would be 5% less powerful then guns currently are right now.
Also assaultts are about offense, so in my opinion they are supposed to dish out more damage. I proposed sentinels get a damage resistance bonus, so they would be able to take it.
Sorry, for some reason I had the Suit bonus at 10% instead of 5%. With that alteration it puts the DPS at 675. I apologize for my bad math.
While I agree with you about the mass 10% nerf to all weapons, you can't guarantee that's what CCP will do, so the 5% bonus still makes me a little uneasy. I understand what you're saying about Assaults, but the same effect could be had by reducing their CPU/PG reqs as well. Allowing them to fit better Mods could achieve the same effect without having to buff their damage.
But I will admit that just because I don't like it, doesn't mean that I'm right. Just offering my opinion on the matter. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6515
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 23:27:00 -
[112] - Quote
Stile451 wrote:Maybe change the skill to speed increase for equipment. Hives would pulse faster(same amount of clusters with the same amount of ammo replenished but simply faster), uplinks would spawn quicker, scan rate would be quicker but time showing would remain the same. There is an overlap with the repair tool and the efficacy option(efficacy repairs more, but this one repairs more often - should equal out to be the same amount repaired over the same time period). Perhaps this could be used in conjunction with cool downs but it may not be necessary.
It's basically overclocking your equipment.
Alright, NEW logi bonus proposal
Cal bonus: 5% range of equipment per level; repair tool range, active scanner range, RE/PM blast radius, nanohive supply radius.
Gal bonus: 5% efficacy of equipment; repair rate of repair tool, nanohive resupply rate, active scanner precision, RE/PM damage, drop uplink max spawns, and injector armor revived.
Min bonus: 5% equipment speed; faster active scanner cooldown, faster nanohive pulses, faster drop uplink spawns, and increase in repair rate, faster injector animation.
pew pew |
Garth Mandra
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
152
|
Posted - 2013.10.09 23:40:00 -
[113] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Stile451 wrote:Maybe change the skill to speed increase for equipment. Hives would pulse faster(same amount of clusters with the same amount of ammo replenished but simply faster), uplinks would spawn quicker, scan rate would be quicker but time showing would remain the same. There is an overlap with the repair tool and the efficacy option(efficacy repairs more, but this one repairs more often - should equal out to be the same amount repaired over the same time period). Perhaps this could be used in conjunction with cool downs but it may not be necessary.
It's basically overclocking your equipment. Alright, NEW logi bonus proposal Cal bonus: 5% range of equipment per level; repair tool range, active scanner range, RE/PM blast radius, nanohive supply radius.
Gal bonus: 5% efficacy of equipment; repair rate of repair tool, nanohive resupply rate, active scanner precision, RE/PM damage, drop uplink max spawns, and injector armor revived.
Min bonus: 5% equipment speed; faster active scanner cooldown, faster nanohive pulses, faster drop uplink spawns, and increase in repair rate, faster injector animation.
pew pew EDIT: Also changed the Gallente bonus again.
I like these much better. Less specific than some of the previous iterations but still going with a theme. Nice work. |
Stile451
Red Star. EoN.
267
|
Posted - 2013.10.10 01:53:00 -
[114] - Quote
Agreed. Good work. Logis are in great condition.
I do have a few suggestions though:
Gallente Assault may become too powerful with the extra damage percentage. Considering that many of the weapons are slow to reload and have high DPS or alpha damage maybe a reduction to reload time would be an option.
Conversely the commando reload speed isn't as useful as I presume the player will switch to their other weapon when one is depleted. The damage increase for racial light weapons may fit better for commandos as they are light weapon specialists. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6517
|
Posted - 2013.10.10 02:13:00 -
[115] - Quote
Stile451 wrote:Agreed. Good work. Logis are in great condition.
I do have a few suggestions though:
Gallente Assault may become too powerful with the extra damage percentage. Considering that many of the weapons are slow to reload and have high DPS or alpha damage maybe a reduction to reload time would be an option.
Conversely the commando reload speed isn't as useful as I presume the player will switch to their other weapon when one is depleted. The damage increase for racial light weapons may fit better for commandos as they are light weapon specialists.
Gallente assault would only have 5% more damage than other assaults. Other assaults get things like bigger magazines, less heat buildup (higher damage potential for laser rifle), and more range (remember how big an advantage sharpshooter was in Chromosome?).
I don't like damage for commandos, seems to assault-y |
The-Errorist
Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation
274
|
Posted - 2013.10.10 03:26:00 -
[116] - Quote
I like the new proposed assault and logi changes. Especially for the logis since it doesn't make you feel restricted to use one kind equipment. |
Sam Toucan
The Vanguardians
2
|
Posted - 2013.10.10 03:48:00 -
[117] - Quote
I have a different viewpoint on the commando suits. Perhaps they could add a percent movement speed on commando suits to compensate for there considerably low health. Not to make them as fast as medium suits, but at least make them faster than the lugging tanks that other heavies are, because commando suits cannot be health tanked enough to compensate for there excruciatingly slow speed. |
Stile451
Red Star. EoN.
267
|
Posted - 2013.10.10 03:52:00 -
[118] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Gallente assault would only have 5% more damage than other assaults. Other assaults get things like bigger magazines, less heat buildup (higher damage potential for laser rifle), and more range (remember how big an advantage sharpshooter was in Chromosome?).
I don't like damage for commandos, seems to assault-y I'm actually thinking about how powerful the AR is now that hit detection has been improved. We are going to end up with a predominant amount of players going Gallente assault simply because the AR gets a bonus to damage(it will be like the Caldari logi suit all over again).
Reload speed doesn't seem to fit with the commando. I'm not sure what would be a useful skill for it though. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6523
|
Posted - 2013.10.10 04:16:00 -
[119] - Quote
Stile451 wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Gallente assault would only have 5% more damage than other assaults. Other assaults get things like bigger magazines, less heat buildup (higher damage potential for laser rifle), and more range (remember how big an advantage sharpshooter was in Chromosome?).
I don't like damage for commandos, seems to assault-y I'm actually thinking about how powerful the AR is now that hit detection has been improved. We are going to end up with a predominant amount of players going Gallente assault simply because the AR gets a bonus to damage(it will be like the Caldari logi suit all over again). Reload speed doesn't seem to fit with the commando. I'm not sure what would be a useful skill for it though. Even if everyone did prefer the assault that has 5% more damage than the others, wouldn't mean it would actually be the better bonus. I personally would just go Amarr assault to make the scrambler rifle even more beastly. The Gallente suits don't have many high slots, so I believe its already balanced by the inability to use many damage mods. The Gallente suits are also crap for fitting high tier stuff (even when using hybrid weapons to take advantage of their fitting bonus) compared to Caldari suits (ask Cat merc). |
Garth Mandra
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
152
|
Posted - 2013.10.10 04:17:00 -
[120] - Quote
Sam Toucan wrote:I have a different viewpoint on the commando suits. Perhaps they could add a percent movement speed on commando suits to compensate for there considerably low health. Not to make them as fast as medium suits, but at least make them faster than the lugging tanks that other heavies are, because commando suits cannot be health tanked enough to compensate for there excruciatingly slow speed.
In my opinion bonuses on specialised suits shouldn't mitigate the weaknesses of that specialisation. They should enhance the strengths of the specialisation.
So the strength of the commando suit is supposed to be its versatility with two light weapons so the bonus should in some way make having those two light weapons better. I have no idea what though. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |