If this is an attempt to make armor tanking more viable it sadly misses the point by a long shot. You're still far better off with basic plates than wasting PG/CPU on this.

To fix armor tanking just do what you've already promised (but evidently forgotten); reduce movement penalty.

This won't fix it.
This will help it, but not by much.

Reducing the penalty would just make it easier for all suits to stack plates, the best way to fix it is to penalize Armor tanks less by giving them specific racial bonuses to the usage of armor modules.

Almost every weapon except for a few were made to decimate armor, specially with many armor killer boasting bonuses from 130%- 150%, only thing Shields have to worry about is a scrambler rifle and a laser rifle, and getting fluxed, but at least none of those weapons will OHKO them.

Really never understood why sensor/biotic/code breaker modules were put in the low slots rather than high.

It's like, I can have some tank and more mobility with a lot of utilities....

Or I can be super slow and deal a lot of damage.

I'm curious as why Armor Tanking automatically defaults playstyle to something akin to being a heavy. Gallente are Active Armor tankers, they rely on fast repair rates and being able to move about so that they can lay down their high damage (plasma weapons being the highest damage/shortest range in Eve Online). Giving them the most armor and then expecting them to throw Armor Plates at the problem is counter-intuitive.

All the damage in the world doesn't do you any good if you can't hit **** to begin with and armor plates don't just hit you in the sprint zone - they hit EVERYWHERE. Movement speed, strafe speed, turn speed - everything.

didn't even care to balance vs shields because that's a different issue with all the modules of one type vs another type and that's about weighing pros and cons. besides armor has the repair tools. shields have one LLAV that's difficult to use. IMO shields vs armor is balanced due to pros and cons and equipment to deal/help with them, its not the games fault that people don't use the right tactics and equipment to deal with different issues.

didn't even care to balance vs shields because that's a different issue with all the modules of one type vs another type and that's about weighing pros and cons. besides armor has the repair tools. shields have one LLAV that's difficult to use. IMO shields vs armor is balanced due to pros and cons and equipment to deal/help with them, its not the games fault that people don't use the right tactics and equipment to deal with different issues.

Reducing the penalty would just make it easier for all suits to stack plates, the best way to fix it is to penalize Armor tanks less by giving them specific racial bonuses to the usage of armor modules.

Elaborate please. What are you asking for when you say "by penalizing armor tanks less through racial bonuses"? Are you suggesting [1] a reduction to the penalty imposed when using armor plates or are you suggesting, [2] a direct increase in some or all of the factors influenced by the penalty (movement, sprint, turn) so that armor tankers in essence feel less of an effect when utilizing armor?

The reason I ask is because, although I use Gallente suits, I do not run plates as I don't feel a sacrifice in speed is worth the increase in health. I instead try for a weak attempt towards regen tanking with reppers. (Hopefully the stats on the new armor modules will be better upon release and I'd be more willing to run them, the non-penalty ferros at least.)

Therefore, if it's the first option, it wouldn't affect me at all, and thus, I'd be be in a way losing out, since this method of balancing would not make me better off although plate users overall would benefit.

The second option however would improve my capabilities, and of the two is of course more beneficial in my case.

You have literally posted "If it's so bad why buff it?"

This demonstrates a basic and complete lack of understanding of the concept of balance. Please stop posting.

I asked the question so the people asking for significant armor buffs have to admit why they use armor over shield if it is so inadequate. This is the most important aspect of the entire balance argument. Saying you just like a particular race for storyline or eve ties doesnt cut it either. There must have been some redeeming factor in armor suits that has led people to play them.

If armor tanking is given too much of a repping buff then heavy suits are going to become a serious balance issue. If the true intent here is just to balance armor and shield, it should be done through suit bonuses and not mods. I feel people are campaigning for another flavor of the month OP fit, rather than long term balance.

I do have a drawback to shields that could work. Now just increasing scan signature is not enough of a drawback but I suggest increasing the time one is spotted & remains on the radar after being seen. Maybe like 10% per complex extender (I'm open to ideas here as I don't know what the base is.)

This, I feel, is enough of a drawback without over nerfing the shields. It does not hurt their ability to tank and it is somewhat in line with Eve Lore.

Now I do agree armor needs more ehp to make it able to tank better with the speed penalty.

These forums are starting to look more and more like the Eve forums. Sort of brings a tear to my eye.

And we wonder why CCP "doesn't communicate".

Indeed. Like I said, it's not the best way to disseminate information and I promise you we're trying really really hard to keep things like this from happening and get you information on changes and additions the game out in a timely and appropriate manner (definitely for real this time, honest!)

Being easily seen isn't that big of a nerf, specially since if your skilled enough whoever is brave enough to come out and shoot you will just be more points for you, also scanning is broken so it wouldn't make a difference.

Perhaps, but remaining on the radar will make it very difficult to flank or sneak up on the enemy. If you are skilled enough then a speed penalty wont affect you much either.

I don't mean being scanned, but that is something that could be added. When you are seen by an enemy (they put Sights on you) then you are put on everyones radar for a few seconds, I suggest increasing that time if you are running shields.

Maybe I am crazy but I know how spotting worked in BF, it was a huge game changer. You could not hide nor flank.

A speed penalty affects more than just moving, if all it did was penalize your moving speed then it would be something to shrug off, but it also affects how fast you can track a target, and your turning speed in and out of ADS; on top of the already slow movement speed of the controller, I play COD on 12 sensitivity Dust 514 is like 5.

Difference between spotting and scanning. Spotting puts a permanent target on the person so you can locate them through walls and if they are above or below you, scanning comes no were close to giving these advantages. All scanning does is tell you the X coordinate of the enemy.

I agree, speed penalty does affect more than just sprint speed but knowing the location of the enemy and the direction they are facing as they move isn't something one should just shrug off.

Yes just scanning and knowing X is where the enemy was would not be enough. However, when you are spotted you are tracked as you move for a few seconds, just on the radar. Increasing this, I feel, is a large tactical drawback.

Yes your right but your forgetting one thing, we do not have spotting.

Yes your right but your forgetting one thing, we do not have spotting.

Well I believe that in order for us to run competitively with the shield tanking suits we have to sacrifice upwards of 16%-25% speed, and also our armor regeneration, in EVE speed is taken into account numerically, in Dust 514 speed is only a number in the hands of our intelligence and our skill. Because of that penalizing speed for armor tanks does a lot more bad than it does in EVE, if it didn't we wouldn't have this problem right now. So, what I meant with my post was a reduction in the penalty for armor tank suits that would give us the ability to stack higher plates than a Shield tank can, and bring us up to their total EHP with the same or lower speed penalty. The reduction in penalty would have to be 10% per level on speed, and 5% per level on CPU/PG, now it wouldn't affect you because you do not wish to impose a speed penalty on your self but if you had a 5% reduction CPU/PG using ferroscale plates, which have no penalty, you will notice that when it comes to stacking plates you would have an edge.

If a 50% speed penalty for Gallente and Amarr was to be imposed, a Gallente would be able to use a complex armor plate the same way a Caldari would be able to use a Enhanced armor plate, meaning we would get about 28 more HP for the same penalty. This is equally true for other plates that have a speed penalty. If we compared a Assault gk.0 with 3 shield extenders and 1 complex armor plate, his EHP would be 643 and speed 4.75, a Assault ck.0 with 4 shield extenders and 1 enhanced armor plate has 681 EHP and speed of 4.75. Even though the Caldari suit is still at an advantage in repping and overall EHP, and also the ability to forgo the speed penalty and still have decent HP, this can be one of the few needed fixes really help bridge the cap and give armor tanks a chance to really compete on equal footing.

No, I am not asking for all suits to be the same. I have other posts explaining why.

Yes, the reduction to cpu/pg usage would certainly benefit. I didn't see you mention that before so I thought you were only supporting the reduction of the penalty itself for the racial aspect, my apologies. Would this fitting requirement reduction only affect plates or also reppers?

I have indeed read most if not all your other posts on this topic, as well as each page in the current threads discussing armor. So yes, I understand your point on the use of plates given no racial bonuses and did not assume that you were asking for all suits to be the same.

Thank you for the clarification.

One thing to keep in mind is that even if armor could get the same total HP on armor as a shield tank can get in shields, which is a bit less than 700, we can be OHKO by a basic locus grenade

Or rep'd by a logi. And we both know that a basic locus doesn't OHKO most suits.

Either way, why does it always have to be one or the other. It's not like picking up armor plates automatically DQ's you from having shields as well.

a complex shield is a high slot and gives you 72 more HP.

Then again, I believe that each slot should have a different module... with a few exceptions. Like Forgegunners etc...

Specialized (proto) modules are all pretty useful. Being able to do everything well is usually better than being able to do one thing (slightly) better. Especially given the rock/paper/scissors style of Dust.

Self important cry baby. Go away. This game will be better without you entitled ass telling everyone what you deserve. Until you invest enough of your money into the company to become a business partner, your a customer like the rest of us. Don't like what's being done? Your rights as a customer are to stop giving the company your money.