Heavy + HMG :
Pros
- HMG okay Damage output (around 650)
- High HP, around 1500 if equipped with 2 complex shield extender and 3 complex plates).
Cons
-slow suit(easy target)
-big hitbox(easy target)
- HMG dispersion
- Low range
- Bigger scanning profile
- Slow turning speed
- Need a logi repairer, or repair module instead of plates
- Definately can't strafe
- rarely achieve headshot with most bullets
- Can't carry anything
- Can't jump

Assault/Logi + AR :

Pros
- AR and TAR good DPS, 360 DPS and let say around 700 DPS for guy that can click fast enough.
- Medium-High HP, around 800-900 if equipped with 4-5 complex shield extender
- fast
- can Strafe with ease.
- Can carry equipment, which mean nanites, scanners, nanohives, droplink
-medium hit box
-higher headshot bonus
- Can aim (with a sight)
- Long range
- Jump well enough to go over barriers

Cons...
-Less speed than scout
-Less HP than heavy


Help me here,because I have no kitten clue what else. I know i run heavy so my analysis might be a bit wrong, but I don,t mind people adding to this.

lol

*sigh*... people and their judging of weapons in pub games against noobs. This community will NEVER learn. Thanks to CCP's data collecting in pubs, they saw how easy it was too mow down noobs using militia suits running straight at heavies, so they thought a nerf was needed.

People need to think OUTSIDE THE BOX. People don't pub 24/7 against noobs who don't know their arse from their elbow, and it's only when you play against good people you'll see how WEAK the class is.

I personally have always wanted the Heavy class to be a CQC nightmare. I think the Heavy should be a class that has one dominating strength and multiple weaknesses. It should be a juggernaut that excels at close range and destroys everything, but it should be a class that is completely worthless at mid to long range. That would be the trade-off for having such lethal ability at close range. I would also give HMGGÇÖs insane power and burn up. I have always been annoyed that CCP has allowed this pitiful burn up mechanic to exist and it allows any scrub heavy to hold the trigger down to get kills. Heavy should be a skillful class that is a high risk and high reward weapon. Maxing out HMG operation should not mean that you never burn up and in fact the burn up should be incredible to the point that you have to grab level 5 in order to somewhat control it. I also would significantly increase the turning speed of the Heavy because itGÇÖs a joke right now. I have seen rail guns turn faster. Heavy should be a class that you have to strategically place in order for it to be effective and it should require patience from those that use it.

To those that want heavy to be used from a defensive position. Be careful what you wish for because if CCP goes ahead and gives suppression mechanics to heavies then youGÇÖre in for a rude awakening. I come from BF3 and while suppression is great in concept itGÇÖs terrible in practice. Think of the suppression a Mass driver inflicts and multiply it by 10 because that is what a HMG will do if given suppression mechanics. If you think spray and pray was annoying now wait until a HMG kills you because a Heavy is literally holding down the button with 425 bullets of suppression fury.

Heavies aren't complaining that they die open field. They're complaining that they cannot compete in areas where they are supposed to excel because the suit and weapons have been over-nerfed to the point of making them uncompetitive VS assault in those areas where you claim they are supposed to be superior.

I can do everything a heavy is supposed to do better with an assault or a scout and have more SP to spend elswhere, so why even have them at all?


If the devs aren't willing to let them excel in anything other than being big slow targets that take 6-8 extra bullets to kill, I actually have to recommend that CCP look into dropping the heavy suits and heavy weapons all together.

A little extra damage drop-off range on the HMG ain't gonna do ish.

CQC with that turning speed, thats what shotguns are for. really? if you guys had your way heavy suits would just be turrets. and with most maps being 80%-90% open field, your just asking for another target. realistically the hmg should have equal to or more range than an AR. the heat up time is good as it is.

due to its initial dispersion its allegedly good at CQC, but once the spooling is complete it should accurate enough to hit the AR camper on the roof. (by that time ive already spent about 100 bullets spooling). remember the suit is inherently balanced it doesn't need trade offs it has them now. the limited mobility, reload time, initial inaccuracy, few suit slots, low damage to shields, bad turning speed, susceptibility to shotguns, nova knives and grenades.

the way it is now i cant hit someone from literally across the street, in real life, someone two blocks down would still get shredded. remember this isn't an LMG this is an HMG with a suit especial designed to carry it.

Even CCP said that Heavy's were meant to be point defense guys.

Please - accept the guy's helpful advice

Can one of the people yelping about "its a defensive weapon" explain what the fundamental difference between attacking and defending is. If i can't put people down while attacking how do i suddenly gain the ability to kill them if the objective near me is blue. If an enemy can strafe step around me while im attacking what changes when im defending. Is the hit deyection different around base you have captured? Is there a damage bonus? We have the largest radar sig so if we are defending we will show up earlier then any other suit so its not like we can suprise the enemy.
Also i have only seen the devs talk about how the sentinel suit was designed for a defensive role can some one provide a link to where the devs say the hmg is a defensive weapon.
Lastly if the weapon isn't leathal how can it be used as a supressive weapon, as some people say it is supposed to be. If tue enemy isnt n danger of dying they will just ignore and or kill you.

You misread. I put the "intended" in there intentionally. They were always meant for a defensive role.

@Billy

In a defensive situation, you get to control exactly where you fight. The enemy don't. They come to you instead of you going to them. If you're a heavy, you dictate exactly where you meet the assaults. If you're smart, that would be in CQC. Also, when playing defensively, you don't run across 20m of open ground.

defensive

You misread. I put the "intended" in there intentionally. They were always meant for a defensive role.

@Billy

In a defensive situation, you get to control exactly where you fight. The enemy don't. They come to you instead of you going to them. If you're a heavy, you dictate exactly where you meet the assaults. If you're smart, that would be in CQC. Also, when playing defensively, you don't run across 20m of open ground.

And you're wrong again. The removal of sharpshooter forced the HMG into a defensive role. Before it was a versatile suit / class. Able to attack and defend, which EVERY class should be able to do, as that is a very basic aspect of a FPS.

But people with your mentality are happy to force a class into 1 role and call that a day. The range nerf to all weapons hurt the HMG the most cuz without it, heavies are stuck camping. That's fun for people? Camping a room?

Plus this defensive role you speak of, it's also followed by another one I laugh at... the "support role". Support and defend what exactly? A 10-15m radius? lol

Forcing roles into a class is a sure way to see people move away from it... like many have done already.

bullshit . how am i in control of where i encounter the enemy if i show up on radar first, objectives have multiple ways in, and i can be easily out flanked. go thru the maps in your head, most objectives have a wide open side to them. not to mention that if the enemy does come to me i also have to make sure they aren't too close as they can strafe around me quite easily, and i cant run from a grenade well. and as the assault suits have a shorter wait for sheild recharge they can play peekaboo with me till i have to reload.

Kay, let's see. High HP, check. Low speed, check. What does that equal? A low mobility heavy weapons platform. That's its description, no? Its anti-personnel main weapon of choice is short range. No one can argue with that. Coupled with the low mobility, this means that it needs the enemy to come to it. Is there any fault with that logic? This automatically means defensive role. I can't see how you can't think that through. I'm not forcing the heavy suit into a role, that IS its role. Give it an AR and it still won't be able to keep up with an assault suit, simply because the assault suit is more mobile, and can trick the heavy user when running around cover (e.g. a shipping container-type thing) to pop round behind him.

Sure, you can play your heavy like that, but that's not his best role. Just like a scout's best role is not to take out tanks. Or an assault's best role is not to support the team.

It's really quite simple - the heavy's best role, the role it exceeds at, is defensive play. You CAN play it offensively, but you're much better off playing assault for that. You CAN use it to snipe, but it's a waste of the suit. You CAN use it with a shotgun, but it's effectively useless like that.

Again, I'm not forcing the suit into a role, I'm simply stating THAT'S WHAT'S IT'S BEST AT.

I see a flaw and experienced players stop me if it's incorrect. If a heavy's sole purpose is to defend, do they wait for their team to take an objective until they can actually perform their jobs? If so, that means that all heavy specialized players should just wait in the MCC until they have an objective to defend. The problem becomes noticed if the team is unable to take an objective and must attack the for the duration of match. I suppose that it's accepted that since the heavy cannot help you attack, they can freely sit in the MCC until the team does grab that objective or gets redlined, in which case, the heavy we never need to leave the MCC. CCP claims the heavy is only for defending as well so that implies CCP expects the heavy soldier to remain in the spawn point if there is no objective to defend. That seems logical to me.

If you are a heavy, you do this; sit in the MCC until you are able to defend something. If someone complains, you tell them you're job is not to attack, it is to defend.


CCP caters to all classes but not the heavy. They gave the assault and logistics drop suits that can mass up to or more than1k total armor and shield to match the heavy. I have a corp mate that has 600 shield, 400 armor and a GLU TAC because the minmatar assault has 5 high slots and 4 low slots. He can do the defensive job of a heavy much better as he has only 100 less hp than I do and he can actually kill other players while still keeping much better mobility than my heavy. The assault really can do the job of a heavy better.


They gave snipers plenty of open spaces and a redline close to the action so they cannot be flanked nearly as easily and a buff to sniper rifles dmg.

They only took from the heavy. I don't know anything they actually gave the heavy suit. Thanks CCP!

Heavies are not defensive tools - that is the counter every idiot who fears OP infantry tanks spouts.

We are walls that move the battlefield or get picked off for being idiots standing out in the open. Any points to say heavies are only meant to be one thing is worthy of being called ignorant. CCP calls heavies JUGGERNAUGTS that stand toe to toe with tanks - so if we were to take CCP to there word they're already lying about what our class can do.

Heavies don't move fast - you're right - they need to move smart instead. For when they do reach the front lines safe they can move it forward. Or used to be able too - now a heavy trying anything but point defense is folly and proof CCP has no idea wtf they're doing.

And I'll remind you we are suppose to be able to create our own perfect solider. My ideal one would be a slow moving tank , ops, not going to happen, why even with all of CCP's brag of customization? It's ridiculous and posts like yours supports CCP's ignorance of there own creation.

Realistically. the HMG should have the stats it had in Replication.

Do I know you?

perhaps.

1. heavies should have thier run speed increased by about 15% to actually be able to participate in the game and support their team.

2. heavies should have 500shield and 500 armor

3. heavies armor and shields should by passively resistant by 30% (basic. it should be given) to small arms and grenades. with the ability that it can be increased by 2% to a max of 10% (or total 40%) resistance per skill lvl. (head shots do not receive this bonus)

the regular exile assault rifle does 31hp at 750 rpm for a 387.5dps, and a total 1860 per clip. with the base -30% to small arms and grenade damage received, that dps becomes 271.25pds and a total of 1302 per clip to a heavy. so in one clip a heavy can still be killed. however, this is assuming that the AR wielder is not missing any shots. if you as a heavy effectively take cover -OR- are shooting at the same time and not missing you will kill them in a one v one situation.

heavies are designed to win 1v1 encounters and to defend squads from being over run with suppressive fire.


these buffs are meant to balance the slow run speed, slow turning speed (this shouldn't change), the high skill point cost (you cnt just be a heavy and something else, you have to invest tons of sp into it), the lack of additional high power and low power slots, ease of heads-hots (slow target easier head shots), the long reload time, susceptibility to snipers and vehicles (vehicles should do the same damage to heavies as they dont fire small arms)

this will lead to a more dynamic gameplay as heavies will be able to both defend their squads from being over run, and push forward toward an objective.

please remind me, what was that like?

I understand you wanted to make the Heavy play the role of point defender. To me this means being able to take on at least a full squad of 6 by myself as is often the case. In order for this to happen HMG needs either:

category a.) Longer range, tighter bullet spread, less kick/heat build up, smaller targeting reticule, wind up upon ADS, suppression effect: stopping power (-__% movement speed per landed round), more damage

or

category b.)Faster turning speed, more damage, faster wind up when AFH, suppression effect: blur (-__% visibility per landed round), longer range, tighter spread, wind up upon ADS, less kick/heat build up

I wouldn't mind seeing a category a.) HMG(point man assaulter) and a category b.) HMG(point defender) in each tier for the HMG in order to add more diversification for the Heavy's role. Either one of these categories would work for point defender, however.

These are my suggestions please note under each category suggestions are listed in order of importance for intended purpose.

These suggestions are based off of my own experience, other players' suggestions, and the DEVs'/players' communications.

1. heavies should have thier run speed increased by about 15% to actually be able to participate in the game and support their team.

2. heavies should have 500shield and 500 armor

3. heavies armor and shields should by passively resistant by 30% (basic. it should be given) to small arms and grenades. with the ability that it can be increased by 2% to a max of 10% (or total 40%) resistance per skill lvl. (head shots do not receive this bonus)

the regular exile assault rifle does 31hp at 750 rpm for a 387.5dps, and a total 1860 per clip. with the base -30% to small arms and grenade damage received, that dps becomes 271.25pds and a total of 1302 per clip to a heavy. so in one clip a heavy can still be killed. however, this is assuming that the AR wielder is not missing any shots. if you as a heavy effectively take cover -OR- are shooting at the same time and not missing you will kill them in a one v one situation.

heavies are designed to win 1v1 encounters and to defend squads from being over run with suppressive fire.


these buffs are meant to balance the slow run speed, slow turning speed (this shouldn't change), the high skill point cost (you cnt just be a heavy and something else, you have to invest tons of sp into it), the lack of additional high power and low power slots, ease of heads-hots (slow target easier head shots), the long reload time, susceptibility to snipers and vehicles (vehicles should do the same damage to heavies as they dont fire small arms)

this will lead to a more dynamic gameplay as heavies will be able to both defend their squads from being over run, and push forward toward an objective.

i personally dont care about the sprint speed as much as i do the turn speed. i dont see why slow overall movement has to effect how quickly we can change the direction we are facing, tbh.

sick to death of every weapon doing more dmg than the hmg. boundless does 19.8 (thats the proto HMG for those of u that didnt know) while submachine guns do what, 22? but with no dispersion.

honestly, with the duvolle doing 77dmg (not QQ about AR dmg as much as im QQing about HMG dmg here) why in the hell is the hmg dmg so low?
balance? thats not balance. thats crippling a gun (and user) from doing his intended role. minimum range and crazy bullet spread, so that 2000rps really doesnt mean too much, does it?

the range from the last build (i dont remember wut the dmg was, so i wont comment on that) was ideal for our role, even with the slow turn speed.

some of u ppl are worried about the heavy being a game dominator or some ish. well, lemme tell ya...if u cant figure out how to kill a walking heavy, then u need to get killed by its HMG.
point defender, area denial, CQC, frontal assault support......those are the roles of heavies. thats wut we are supposed to b good at.
not even barely adequate, tbh. and its not the suit (although i would love having a equipment slot so i can carry uplinks. yaknow, being a point defender and all. jus sayin) its the effin gun. our options are limited as is, so make the HMG what it should be.

/rant