Just my opinion but you are saying that you can't tank with a scout suit? Scout suits are the least out of all the suits for tank. Scout suits are eventually gonna have stealth with them too and I feel that will be the majority of your defenses. I would hardly start calling for a nerf on a gun because it easily kills a suit that isn't designed to run and gun. I don't know if you play Eve but the scout suit in my opinion would be the same as a Buzzard or maybe a Manticore. I would do tests with an assault suit and see what you get done with that and make a call. Trying the lowest tank with one of the higest damage guns and then saying it's too strong seems a bit pre-mature to me.

Just my thoughts.

sorry rolyat but I have to agree with takron. I do believe ccp is looking at the breach ar's as a whole ( not saying nerf, just looking into). All the weapons have their downfalls. The standard ar's actually win in terms of dps and clip size so the breach ar isn't everything. The main issue has still been hit detection and the server having an easier time keeping up with the slower RoF weapons.

I keep preaching giving ccp some slack considering this is their first shooter and have a lot to learn when it comes to hit detection and game balance. By the way, they are off to a great start and have made tremendous progress and I believe by q4 will have an awesome product that blows every other fps out of the water. Hopefully...

Seriously should consider making all Prototype weapons and gear high valued.

For a slower rate of fire as its described, its not working like it should be.

In the description, it is said that the slow rof is a penalty for high damage, but as of now, its near impossible to run away from a guy with a Creodron without getting killed.

Omg stop posting stuff like this, i mean think about what this game actually is. Im sorry, i dont mean to be an a**hole but DUST is supposed to be a game that requires a grand amount of time to be able to compete well in. If you think the breach weapons are too strong then put more armor modules on and call it a day. The longer you play=the stronger you can make your character, which=equiping better armor or repair gear=greater chance to survive a gunfight against a Breach weapon.

The range is a little crazy. I was taken out in my Heavy suit from full health and shields while standing on the supports of a building near C's closest Supply Depot. The guy who did it used one of these to down me from right near C itself in two seconds. Heavy suit or no, I barely lived long enough to see who did it. Lag is a possibility, I suppose. Could have been getting shot and all the bullets effectively hit at once. Still, that's quite a bit of range for a non tactical AR.

dude you can put armor modules on a type II or adv. suit all day long, the breach is gonna rip through it like paper. it just Kills Too Fast, even if bullets too slow.

really all we ask is that they take a look at the breach weapons. tweaking? if needed.

problem is the breach rifle accuracy. it is a headshot machine even with hipfire.

if you use the regular rifle for a round then switch to breach then you will see a world of a difference. the regular AR theoretically wins in DPS but in a real fight you will miss most of your shots because of the spread. alot of engagements also happen at mid range where the breach will also easily dominate.

And that's why you spend your skills in the weapon book, Ar proficiency (and even sharpshooter).

Sp is cheap now with the 4x multiplier. Sp spending at launch will mean choices


hipfire accuracy is due to hit detection being off - i presume

Problem with AR isn't the damage IMHO it's their accuracy and range, mainly in that you're better off shooting people with an AR on mid ranges then with a sniper rifle and you'd be surprised on how many times I've died from aimed AR shots from what most would call a "sniping distance".

So AR needs either their range or accuracy reduced, personally I would go for the range unless hit detection gets some more tweaks.

the prototype standard rifle is far better, the duvolle i think its called

Creodron breach assault rifle approximate stats from my memory.
Damage 57
RoF 400
Magazine capacity is 42

Just base damage is enough to kill a 400 ehp dropsuit in 8 hits. If you account for some amount of damage resist that goes up to 8-10 hits.

The weapon is powerful however it does have a lower RoF and a smaller magazine. Its more stable when firing from the hip but has a horrible zoom.

They could maybe use some tweaking but plenty of people manage to escape me when I run around with one.

Edit
I hate autocorrect on my phone
Replaced frozen with Creodron

Don't nerf the gun, buff all the other weapons.

Don't nerf the gun, buff all the other weapons.

Problem with AR isn't the damage IMHO it's their accuracy and range, mainly in that you're better off shooting people with an AR on mid ranges then with a sniper rifle and you'd be surprised on how many times I've died from aimed AR shots from what most would call a "sniping distance".

So AR needs either their range or accuracy reduced, personally I would go for the range unless hit detection gets some more tweaks.

Again, sniper rifle isn't meant for mid range combat. One of the big advantages of a sniper rifle is its single-shot power and long distance accuracy. That's what assault weapons are for.

Granted, they could put a way for the mid-long distance rifles to be much more accurate only when crouching, making them less accurate if moving around or strafing. Still, trying to compare a prototype assault weapon to a basic sniper rifle is really not advisable. It's like comparing horsemen to pikemen - one is meant to defeat the other.

I am certainly skilling up for CreoDron now myself. I spent all my time and SP getting the prototype heavy suit in hopes that it would cut down on the 6-8 shot kills from behind. Didn't have much of a bump still get taken down by this rifle. So guess what I'm adapting now I will have one and a proto heavy suit. See you all this weekend. Can't beat them join them.

This will probably get hot cause of how common a weapon it is.

But I think the CreoDron really needs to be looked at. I have close to 400 EHP in most my scout fits and get 3 or 4 shooted by it. They might be fitted with damage mods sure, but if i don't get the drop on someone with it, they take me down without a chance of fighting.

I will get someone that is on TeamSpeak with me that's in the beta that uses the CreoDron to test it out more in detail (with and without damage mods) and will post it up on this thread most likely next weekend.

Maybe a nerf (?), or a large kick to make it harder to keep the DPS on the same target without high level skills.

Suggestion to the Dev's, look at the heat maps and search for all the CreoDron kills and if possible the situations that they kill and are killed.

NOTE: I'm not really for nerfing alot of stuff in a game that will be connected to serious business spaceships (lol) but something needs to be looked at with this weapon.

Just posting now cause I've yet to see something on it here yet.

See you too I'll be in my bright red proto logistics with my creodron

I have to agree with the buff statement to the other guns you want to get them to a point everyone wants to use any of them its just a matter of fitting play style. Typically I would love a burst type but with 5 rounds each pull gone and possibly missing a grouping hurts performance alot and repulling isnt fast enough on the burst.

Just right now the other types just dont seem to have stopping power to stop a variety of other classes.

See you too I'll be in my bright red proto logistics with my creodron

I luvs me Creodron Breach AR. The stupid proto-armor guys who rush me in the open while I am firing at them from a distance while behind cover just deserve to die, period. Maybe they should invest in the Creodron instead of overly expensive armor and learn how to take cover as well. Because my crap tier I armor dies real fast even from militia SMGs if I get caught in the open.

I also put most of my points into the AR and marksman skills and use a damage mod so I can even drop heavies who are in the open very easily with just the tier II AR breach if I wanted.

But as much as I love the Creodron, I have two problems with it. First, it should require at least some tier II skill training to use. And, second, the auto-aim has got to go - for ALL assault rifles. Auto-aim is what makes this game easy mode. I tested it extensively over the weekend and this is how I get it to work: pick a target, zoom in to your target and aim near where you want to hit them (usually center mass or head), begin firing, release the aim while still firing so you are now shooting from the hip, and BINGO, I am getting miracle kills at long range while running and gunning. Pretty lame. It would make more sense to have to stop and aim to get those hits.

It's the auto-aim which is 'broken', not the gun. Because the dudes with the shield buffed scout suits are ALWAYS a pain in the ass to kill even with the Creodron. At close range they usually drop my crap armor pretty quickly no matter how many rounds I fire off.

^^^
I agree with this guy we really shouldn't be in a hurry to nerf things, just look at what happened to HMG. It seems many people now find it pretty much worthless.

Actually, this is the perfect time to nerf things. Plus, I seriously doubt the HMG will remain in its current form.

I think it's better to readjust weapons/fittings right now while we're still in BETA than later on after release when people have real SP invested.

and what if they entire problem dissappears when they finaly fix hit detection. i did a little bit of math from memory on the stats of the AR.

Creodron breach assault rifle approximate stats from my memory.
Damage 57
RoF 400
Magazine capacity is 42
DPS 380

Basic rifle stats
Damage 30
RoF 750
Magazine 60
DPS 375

This is all from memory so it is very likely to be off a bit feel free to post corrections on exact numbers although I am fairly certain I am close.

The above is theoretical max dps at base stats for the weapons no skills have been accounted for.

this is just my opinin but that puts these two at similar damage output.

the biggest defference honestly is the increased hipfire accuracy on the breach variants.

Also i did say in an earlir post that perhaps they could use tweaked but that is different than just swinging the nerf bat around.

nerfing any particular weapon or anything for that matter should be a last resort.

^^^
the concept goes both ways we can wait for them to fix hit detction and then see if the rifle still needs to be nerfed.

This will probably get hot cause of how common a weapon it is.

But I think the CreoDron really needs to be looked at. I have close to 400 EHP in most my scout fits and get 3 or 4 shooted by it. They might be fitted with damage mods sure, but if i don't get the drop on someone with it, they take me down without a chance of fighting.

I will get someone that is on TeamSpeak with me that's in the beta that uses the CreoDron to test it out more in detail (with and without damage mods) and will post it up on this thread most likely next weekend.

Maybe a nerf (?), or a large kick to make it harder to keep the DPS on the same target without high level skills.

Suggestion to the Dev's, look at the heat maps and search for all the CreoDron kills and if possible the situations that they kill and are killed.

NOTE: I'm not really for nerfing alot of stuff in a game that will be connected to serious business spaceships (lol) but something needs to be looked at with this weapon.

Just posting now cause I've yet to see something on it here yet.