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Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 15:42:00 - [241] - Quote Varoth Drac wrote: I know we are getting off topic here but I don't understand, from a design perspective, how shorter depleted delays than non-depleted can be a good thing. Why would you want to encourage shield tankers to go into armour? The current method makes for much better gameplay. And just a correction on precision mods. You are more likely to find them on a logi than a scout, where they are very effective. I also have an assault fitted with them, though I doubt that's common. It's not encouragement to go into armor. It's a higher likelihood of survival if you escape. Waitting 6-8 seconds if yo manage to survive being put into armor (unlikely) is an eternity. And i forgot about the precision logi. I stand corrected. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 15:45:00 - [242] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: faster regen on lower HP suits? why? when we rebalanced the armor regen rates, the gal scout had the best. then we all found out how that actually turned out in the field, and nerfed it. Because right now scouts have the highest regen at 50 in the case of caldari. Things are being normalized between scout 50 and sent 30 for now. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 15:54:00 - [243] - Quote Devadander wrote: Will the base shield amounts be altered? Specifically, the sentinel? With only one low available, how can it be last and be competitive? Again I only ask because this is my all day every day. I've already lost my two oldest friends to caldari being easy bait... Calsent isn't being changed. It's shield regen stats are staying as they are now. Currently a calsent with a low slslot regulator can get about a half secondd depleted delay and under 2 sec recharge delay. That's not changing. So "worst regen stats" are actually taking the current best and using them as a baseline. Calsents will retain the best depleted delay. The only reason IMHO that the calsent is even playable right now is because it recovers so fast after eating damage. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Devadander Woodgrain Atari 703	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:29:00 - [244] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Devadander wrote: Will the base shield amounts be altered? Specifically, the sentinel? With only one low available, how can it be last and be competitive? Again I only ask because this is my all day every day. I've already lost my two oldest friends to caldari being easy bait... Calsent isn't being changed. It's shield regen stats are staying as they are now. Currently a calsent with a low slslot regulator can get about a half secondd depleted delay and under 2 sec recharge delay. That's not changing. So "worst regen stats" are actually taking the current best and using them as a baseline. Calsents will retain the best depleted delay. The only reason IMHO that the calsent is even playable right now is because it recovers so fast after eating damage. Sounds good, but we should look at 50-100 extra shield for sent for base stats. Edit: basically want to break 1000 shield with maxed maxes. Idc if its 1001.3. Gêå You want a toe? I can get you a toe dude. Gêå Joined - 06-28-12 ~Deal with it~
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:32:00 - [245] - Quote I'm also working on extender additions If we consider the current extender equivalent to ferroscale, I'm building a proposal for a plate and reactive analog. The reactive analog would be the "no penalty" extender. Basic design philosophy is the closer you push towards armor hp the worse your base recovery rates should be. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Devadander Woodgrain Atari 703	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:33:00 - [246] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: I'm also working on extender additions If we consider the current extender equivalent to ferroscale, I'm building a proposal for a plate and reactive analog. The reactive analog would be the "no penalty" extender. Very nice. Gêå You want a toe? I can get you a toe dude. Gêå Joined - 06-28-12 ~Deal with it~
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 15	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:33:00 - [247] - Quote Devadander wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Devadander wrote: Will the base shield amounts be altered? Specifically, the sentinel? With only one low available, how can it be last and be competitive? Again I only ask because this is my all day every day. I've already lost my two oldest friends to caldari being easy bait... Calsent isn't being changed. It's shield regen stats are staying as they are now. Currently a calsent with a low slslot regulator can get about a half secondd depleted delay and under 2 sec recharge delay. That's not changing. So "worst regen stats" are actually taking the current best and using them as a baseline. Calsents will retain the best depleted delay. The only reason IMHO that the calsent is even playable right now is because it recovers so fast after eating damage. Sounds good. Probably not. Shield Stat strength is relative. If you hold one unit constant and buff everything else, the relative strength of the unit held constant is lessened. Nothing inherently wrong with a standardized framework, but buffing shield stat performance of armor tankers won't work out to anyone's advantage except for armor tankers. I understand that "Step 2" will involve improving shield modules, which will help shield tankers, but make no mistake. Aeon's angling for a buff for armor tankers (unless he has since changed his mind). What I expect we'll end up is more HP Module utilization, less loadout variety, a widening of the Assault performance/usage gap and best-in-class (potentially OP/FoTM) Dual Tankers.
Asad Thahab-Jabal Incorruptibles 90	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:35:00 - [248] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: I'm also working on extender additions If we consider the current extender equivalent to ferroscale, I'm building a proposal for a plate and reactive analog. The reactive analog would be the "no penalty" extender. Like so?
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:38:00 - [249] - Quote This is a multi-angle process. Once shields are unscrewed, the next tricks are AV and utility mods. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:39:00 - [250] - Quote Asad Thahab-Jabal wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: I'm also working on extender additions If we consider the current extender equivalent to ferroscale, I'm building a proposal for a plate and reactive analog. The reactive analog would be the "no penalty" extender. Like so? Pretty much WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.

Varoth Drac Dead Man's Game 1	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:41:00 - [251] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Varoth Drac wrote: I know we are getting off topic here but I don't understand, from a design perspective, how shorter depleted delays than non-depleted can be a good thing. Why would you want to encourage shield tankers to go into armour? The current method makes for much better gameplay. It's not encouragement to go into armor. It's a higher likelihood of survival if you escape. Waitting 6-8 seconds if yo manage to survive being put into armor (unlikely) is an eternity. I can see it being ok, but I think it takes away from the gameplay of shield tanking. It takes skill to take cover before depleting you shield. You should be rewarded for this with faster recovery, as is the case now. Yes you will survive more with lower depleted delay, but I think if shield tankers are dying too much there are better ways to buff them than dumbing down the gameplay. Most well fitted shield tankers don't have to wait 6-8 seconds when depleted. It's more like 3 - 4 seconds. Reducing depleted delays even further than normal delays just reduces the value of regulators even more. I think people should be rewarded more for doing shield tanking well, not punished less for doing it badly. By this I mean, if you fit a load of regen mods on your Caldari assault and successfully take cover at the right times you should be rewarded. Whereas if you don't bother with regen and run around like an armour tanker you should be punished. Again, it could well work, it's just not the direction I would go in. P.S. It doesn't make sense from a lore / common sense perspective. I think the mechanics of Dust are already too opaque. Making things less intuitive is bad. P.P.S. Just, why?
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:47:00 - [252] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: . I understand that "Step 2" will involve improving shield modules, which will help shield tankers, but make no mistake. Aeon's angling for a buff for armor tankers, unless he has since changed his mind. . This is where you are entertainingly wrong. Tell ya what. If you excise this rediculous premise from your head I'll lay off the "scout master race" taunting. you're letting your distaste for aeon cloud your perception of intent. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
zzZaXxx XxAMBUSH FTWxX 769	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:49:00 - [253] - Quote Yo CPM! What are your thoughts on allowing damage mods to be placed in low slots as well? Armor tankers get to have the best of both worlds while shield tankers have to choose, and in their low slots they have no choice: regulator and reactives.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:52:00 - [254] - Quote zzZaXxx wrote: Yo CPM! What are your thoughts on allowing damage mods to be placed in low slots as well? Armor tankers get to have the best of both worlds while shield tankers have to choose, and in their low slots they have no choice: regulator and reactives. This is a shield regen thread. Make another thread for that please. Don't knock this one off-topic WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
zzZaXxx XxAMBUSH FTWxX 769	Posted - 2015.09.21 16:59:00 - [255] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: zzZaXxx wrote: Yo CPM! What are your thoughts on allowing damage mods to be placed in low slots as well? Armor tankers get to have the best of both worlds while shield tankers have to choose, and in their low slots they have no choice: regulator and reactives. This is a shield regen thread. Make another thread for that please. Don't knock this one off-topic Oh ok...but it is relevant to being able to use the mods you need to fully focus on shields without sacrficing damage.
zzZaXxx XxAMBUSH FTWxX 769	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:04:00 - [256] - Quote Has Rattati given y'all any feedback on the proposed changes? They seem drastic but drastic change is needed. Better to just implement them and then if shields are OP rein them in.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 15	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:05:00 - [257] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: . I understand that "Step 2" will involve improving shield modules, which will help shield tankers, but make no mistake. Aeon's angling for a buff for armor tankers, unless he has since changed his mind. . This is where you are entertainingly wrong. Tell ya what. If you excise this rediculous premise from your head I'll lay off the "scout master race" taunting. you're letting your distaste for aeon cloud your perception of intent. http://i.imgur.com/eshWaQK.jpg ^ That's from Aeon. Page 1, Post 1. Note how the CalScout and CalSent are held constant. Now note the following shield buffs to armor tankers: GA Sent - Buff to recharge. GA Scout - Buff to recharge. GA Logi - Buff to recharge and delay. GA Commando - Buff to recharge and delay. GA Assault - Buff to recharge and delay (This one receives the biggest buffs of all. Anyone surprised?). AM Logi - Buff to recharge and delay. AM Commando - Buff to recharge and delay. AM Assault - Buff to recharge and delay. I'm just looking at the numbers, and it looks to me like Aeon's angling for a buff for Armor Tankers. Unless, as I said above, he has since changed his mind. What am I missing here, Breakin?
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:12:00 - [258] - Quote Now go rearrange all of the dropsuits in the following order with in order of lowest HP to highest. Calscout, calassault, calogi, calmando, calsent Then do the same for minmatar, then gallente, lastly amarr. Notice a pattern, or does it need to be spelled out in crayon? Accusing aeon of angling for an armor buff is disingenuous and deceptive or it's being blind and willfully ignorant. Either way it's an attack on aeon's motives and thus his character. In any case as long as you cling to that absurdity I have no further use for your input adipem. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 15	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:17:00 - [259] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Now go rearrange all of the dropsuits in the following order with in order of lowest HP to highest. Calscout, calassault, calogi, calmando, calsent Then do the same for minmatar, then gallente, lastly amarr. Notice a pattern, or does it need to be spelled out in crayon? Accusing aeon of angling for an armor buff is disingenuous and deceptive or it's being blind and willfully ignorant. Either way it's an attack on aeon's motives and thus his character. In any case as long as you cling to that absurdity I have no further use for your input adipem. I'm not being willfully ignorant or disingenuous. I'm looking at his numbers. Explain to me how buffing shield recovery and recharge delay of armor tankers, while holding those values constant for shield tankers, isn't a direct buff to armor tankers? Use the crayon if you need. I'm not following. Hypothetical: If shield tankers were outperforming all else, would it be wise to increase their base armor and armor regen values, while holding those values for armor tankers constant? PS: Your double standards are showing again. I'm speaking to the numbers. I'm not calling anyone's character into question. Why are you calling my character (and intelligence, of all things) into question?
Devadander Woodgrain Atari 703	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:28:00 - [260] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Now go rearrange all of the dropsuits in the following order with in order of lowest HP to highest. Calscout, calassault, calogi, calmando, calsent Then do the same for minmatar, then gallente, lastly amarr. Notice a pattern, or does it need to be spelled out in crayon? Accusing aeon of angling for an armor buff is disingenuous and deceptive or it's being blind and willfully ignorant. Either way it's an attack on aeon's motives and thus his character. In any case as long as you cling to that absurdity I have no further use for your input adipem. I'm not being willfully ignorant or disingenuous. I'm looking at his numbers. Explain to me how buffing shield recovery and recharge delay of armor tankers, while holding those values constant for shield tankers, isn't a direct buff to armor tankers? Use the crayon if you need. I'm not following. Hypothetical: If shield tankers were outperforming all else, would it be wise to increase their base armor and armor regen values, while holding those values for armor tankers constant? That original sheet is what got me heated. If we implement aeons numbers, then improve modules, gal can potentially become a dual tanked beast. I didn't want to harp on it given our past... But its fairly plain in the numbers that gal gets an un-needed shield boost. Gêå You want a toe? I can get you a toe dude. Gêå Joined - 06-28-12 ~Deal with it~

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:29:00 - [261] - Quote The calscout and calsent are held constant because they are arguably the best performing in the race. They are the baseline. The assault, logi and commando each receive significant buffs to put them in line with the two actual performing suits. The fact that the calsent is one of the poorest performing sentinels due to raw Hp isn't part of the equation. Then we take the caldari regen valuse and apply a lesser to minmatar. Also scaling from scout to sentinel. But then we get to the gallente and amarr. The shields are paper thin and only last a heartbeat under any fire. The idea that it should take more than 4-5 seconds out of combat to BEGIN recovering as some kind of balance metric is amusing. The only two armor suits with significant shielding are the sentinels. The commando base shields are ok. In neither the case of the sentinel or the commando do they have the slot layout to put forward a shield buffer and regen to be anything but a poor cousin to rhe minmatar but doing so would open low slots for things like damps, range mods (if they didn't suck) and other sundries that might work on an armor suit if they didn't have to completely and utterly sacrifice durability. The 198 HP of a max core galassault isn't going to be the thing that makes or breaks the suit in a fight. It's ability to rock reps and kincats to get in close faster than you can stop him will. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
zzZaXxx XxAMBUSH FTWxX 769	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:31:00 - [262] - Quote You bickering trolls have derailed this discussion with your petty personal grievances. Cease and desist.
Varoth Drac Dead Man's Game 1	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:40:00 - [263] - Quote Come on Apidem. Gallente buffs in the OP are very similar to Caldari buffs. Shield buffs hold more value for Caldari suits, and besides, balancing armour and shields wasn't the intention of the thread. I'm much more worried about significant buffs to assaults and logis, whilst leaving sentinels and scouts where they are. Without doing anything to try to maintain balance. I think if this goes through how it is, balancing will need to be done. Either by nerfing the suits getting buffed, or buffing the suits being held relatively constant. I guess it's simple logic.
zzZaXxx XxAMBUSH FTWxX 769	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:49:00 - [264] - Quote Keeping scouts' regen the same while raising the floor with other suits is an indirect nerf to scouts, which are already a bit UP right now. Shields are underperforming across the board, so Cal scout and other scouts' regen/delays should be buffed along with the rest.
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 12	Posted - 2015.09.21 17:55:00 - [265] - Quote zzZaXxx wrote: You bickering trolls have derailed this discussion with your petty personal grievances. Cease and desist. Best post in this thread. Sgt Kirk's Propaganda Youtube Channel
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 18:07:00 - [266] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: zzZaXxx wrote: You bickering trolls have derailed this discussion with your petty personal grievances. Cease and desist. Best post in this thread. Agreed. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 15	Posted - 2015.09.21 18:24:00 - [267] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: The calscout and calsent are held constant because they are arguably the best performing in the race. They are the baseline. The assault, logi and commando each receive significant buffs to put them in line with the two actual performing suits. The fact that the calsent is one of the poorest performing sentinels due to raw Hp isn't part of the equation. Then we take the caldari regen valuse and apply a lesser to minmatar. Also scaling from scout to sentinel. But then we get to the gallente and amarr. The shields are paper thin and only last a heartbeat under any fire. The idea that it should take more than 4-5 seconds out of combat to BEGIN recovering as some kind of balance metric is amusing. The only two armor suits with significant shielding are the sentinels. The commando base shields are ok. In neither the case of the sentinel or the commando do they have the slot layout to put forward a shield buffer and regen to be anything but a poor cousin to rhe minmatar but doing so would open low slots for things like damps, range mods (if they didn't suck) and other sundries that might work on an armor suit if they didn't have to completely and utterly sacrifice durability. The 198 HP of a max core galassault isn't going to be the thing that makes or breaks the suit in a fight. It's ability to rock reps and kincats to get in close faster than you can stop him will. Put one shield extender on that GalAssault and he has more hitpoints in his "paperthin" shield reserves than the total base HP of 3 of 4 Scouts. 198HP may mean nothing to a Heavy, but compared to any Scout's base shields or armor, 198HP is a significant sum. Standardizing shield stats for easier tuning, I get and support. But further entrenching "King HP" by making shield modules more attractive and beneficial for all units raises concerns. I'm concerned about a widening of the MedFrame performance gap over other frames on account of their higher slot count. I'm concerned about dual tanking becoming a serious problem. I'm concerned about the weakening of what few relative strengths shield users possess over armor users. I'm concerned about impact on performance gap between veterans with significant HP tank and newbros without. I'm concerned about further marginalization of those who dare try to keep up with low or no HP modules. I (for one) would like to see someday a Dust where glass-cannon loadouts might compete again and where newbros might once again stand a chance if/when they outplay the protos. I don't believe these to be unreasonable or unfair, and it seems to me that we're moving in the opposite direction. CCP Rattati wrote: ... I want to balance the game so all roles and dropsuits can flourish. Even those who don't stack HP modules? I'd like to think so, but I'm beginning to wonder if and how we'll ever get there.
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 2	Posted - 2015.09.21 18:24:00 - [268] - Quote Ok... The old values kick Armour tamkers shield regen in the nuts (as intended?) Yet this proposal, may reduce delays on almost all AM/GA to equal the current MN Scout ?? In battle.. While I am waiting 80 seconds for my Armour to regen (Min Scout) ... an Armour suit only has to wait 4-5.5 secs to start shield regen??? whut So imo the proposed delays will not work, and the proposed recharge ... Does that really say 35 on GA Assault ??? as in equal to current Min Assault... On first look I grabbed the popcorn and thought "this Adipem guy is a loon, I like him" but then I went back over things and while I understand you are using CA as the baseline to tweak others.. I think CA should be the baseline to tweak MN.. Using CA as any base in changing Armour suit stats ?? That sounds as logical as triple plate stacking my MN Scout CA > MN >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GA > AM See you're missing the part in your curve where the Armour suit Shield stats can.. "jump off a cliff" SOONtm
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 11	Posted - 2015.09.21 20:44:00 - [269] - Quote Addressing most of the arguments based on "gallente will dual tank" Unfortunately enterprising individiuals playing all races already do that. I'm all in favor of lowering the function synergy between armor and shield mods. But before then shields have to be brought to some semblance of parity. Then the non-HP/regen mods need to be looked at for utility value. If the utility modules in both high and low slots cannot be made more desirable then I think we should look at actively discouraging brickfits via penalties. I think a better solution would be giving value incentive to engage in racial tank doctrines. Amarr and caldari are traditionally armor and shield buffer respectively. Gallente and minmatar rely more on recovery and speed. Incentivizing each race's traditional doctrines should pull some of the "HP mods over all" mindset. HP mods are appropriate to a point. But none of the fits i use, nor any of the people I speak to find all HP mods to be viable as a fitting style. Except amarr sentinels but I personally think that's insane. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Aeon Amadi 12	Posted - 2015.09.21 21:11:00 - [270] - Quote Doc DDD wrote: Repping an extra 10 shields per second under cover is not going to matter much when the player is getting blasted before his shields rep more than one cycle. We had considered the plausibility of just doing away with shield delay altogether unless it was at zero, meaning you'd only have depleted delay. We decided to go against this because it'd just homogenize it with armor and make it incredibly difficult to find distinction between the two and would be hard to balance extreme fits like Cal Sentinels with stacked Energizers (having upward of 100+hp/s). We haven't gotten rid of the option yet, just severely unlikely it will be implemented as anything other than a last ditch effort. Too many problems with it. Vesta Opalus wrote: "not even close to an armor stacked player with a rep tool" Then shields still fail in the overall meta. Thats why I was asking about support equipment. If shield suits cant compete as a team against armor based suits, its still not balanced. Echoing Cross' sentiment, I'm pretty sure that logic was applied in the AV vs Vehicles bit and look how well that worked out, lol. It's sort of flawed logic to balance one player versus two (because you will have to have two in order for the repair tool to be considered) and if that one guy is over-powering or even balanced with the two, than imagine how powerful he'd be against one. Devadander wrote: To clarify: We have indeed seen wonders suggested in the past that went stale within weeks. I can see where this leads, and its glorious. But, the steam can't stop once this starts rolling. This isn't something that can be drug out over a year and expect to have any shield players left. The initial change will leave us balanced... but out-supported. Things have to move quickly. On that note, the more we buck and argue, the longer it will take. See the big picture and you will be on board. Nobody runs more shield fits than me, sorry for all the heat. o7 As Cross mentioned, we have a multi-step plan to completely re-evaluate all of this. We're receiving feedback and making minor changes to what is proposed with Step One (this thread) and have already begun work on Step Two and -some- work on Step Three. Once the ball is rolling, our intent is to continuously work on it until balance has been achieved and the remaining steps rendered moot, being as they are relatively independent of one another. Who knows, maybe Step One will knock balance where it needs to be. Maybe it'll be Step Two. We might have to go all the way to Step Four or further to achieve balance but know that the CPM -is- working on it and that this was a project given (implied) approval by CCP, so the only barrier is their time. Breakin Stuff wrote: dual tanking will always be a thing unless doing so is directly penalized. I've suggested doing so, but I'm outvoted. Not so much outvoted as a general air of improving utility to encourage diversity over penalizing dual-tanking. Inherently there's nothing wrong with dual-tanking, but it should generally be assumed that you'll be making too many sacrifices in other areas by doing so. So much so that it becomes less advantageous. DeathwindRising wrote: you dont outright penalize dual tanking. you make it impossible to make a viable fit. meaning the pg and cpu cost of a dual tank would leave you running sidearms with no equipment. that would solve everything naturally. the easiest way would be a fitting bonus to the modules. either increase fitting cost of the modules or reduce fitting capacity. im also wondering about the overall design here. regarding caldari suits mostly, their slower suits need more regen than the more mobile suits S'one way to do it but optimally you want to make other things better than what dual-tanking could offer. Encouraging a player to think, "I could dual-tank but I could also use profile dampeners to enhance my hit-and-run shield tanking", as an example, is the better method, I feel. Cross elaborates on that a bit better than I do but I'm sick atm so. Negative Introspection - Aeon's CPM Blog



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