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Really starting to hate the WP minimum...

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8532	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:05:00 - [1] - Quote Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Viktor Hadah Jr Negative-Impact Back and Forth 7144	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:17:00 - [2] - Quote git gud CBM EVE, Dust & Corp Services Buying Dead & Inactive Corps
TooMany Names AlreadyTaken Going for the gold 688	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:19:00 - [3] - Quote The obvious solution to this is stop playing ambush alone. The best way to earn ISK and SP is shooting at enemy vehicles. I bagged 580k ISK once camping a tower with an Ishukone assault forge gun trololol. Found my favorite DJ - ATB
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8534	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:20:00 - [4] - Quote Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: git gud Don't troll, Viktor, you're really bad at it. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8534	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:23:00 - [5] - Quote TooMany Names AlreadyTaken wrote: The obvious solution to this is stop playing ambush alone. The best way to earn ISK and SP is shooting at enemy vehicles. I bagged 580k ISK once camping a tower with an Ishukone assault forge gun trololol. The obvious solution is that if a player invests effort into a full game, even at extreme odds, he should be rewarded... The solution to being rewarded progression for playing the game should not come from being forced to play with a squad or using gameplay gimmicks to guarantee that you meet the minimum to receive rewards that you would not have received under normal play. This is not good game design and it punishes players without reason for circumstances beyond their control. EDIT: And if it is a "solution", then my next proposition would be to have players automatically be placed in squads upon joining a match like they did in Chromosome. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 712	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:30:00 - [6] - Quote Should get more wp for downing a proto suit with a lesser suit. Should get less wp for downing a militia suit with a proto suit. This would soon get the better players using noobier gear... Or just whining on the forums!
Atiim Titans of Phoenix 15517	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:31:00 - [7] - Quote lolwat? My brother AFKs in bush while playing CoD on the other PS3 and he still makes enough WP to get the ISK/SP. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8534	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:32:00 - [8] - Quote Atiim wrote: lolwat? My brother AFKs in bush while playing CoD on the other PS3 and he still makes enough WP to get the ISK/SP. Video or it didn't happen. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command 969	Posted - 2015.02.08 19:54:00 - [9] - Quote Today during a skirmish I got 148 WP as a NDS pilot. I was busy all match, got a couple transport assists and even 3 kill assists from blueberry gunners (these are seldom!). 0 SP payout.
deezy dabest 2142	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:00:00 - [10] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: git gud Don't troll, Viktor, you're really bad at it. I dont think that was a troll that was just a statement that you need to improve your abilities.

Varoth Drac State of Purgatory General Tso's Alliance 582	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:01:00 - [11] - Quote I seem to remember an interesting system in world of Warcraft for dealing with pvp rewards where some have s clear advantage over others. I think it was some kind of ranking system other than level, and you only got rewarded for killing higher ranked people, the more difference in rank the more reward, or something like that. I wonder if we could have a similar system. So stompers wouldn't get sp for killing noobs, but if anyone kills a stomper they get a large reward. All based upon a ranking system similar to mu. Maybe the mu itself?
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8534	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:03:00 - [12] - Quote Varoth Drac wrote: I seem to remember an interesting system in world of Warcraft for dealing with pvp rewards where some have s clear advantage over others. I think it was some kind of ranking system other than level, and you only got rewarded for killing higher ranked people, or something like that. I wonder if we could have a similar system. So stompers wouldn't get sp for killing noobs, but if anyone kills a stomper they get a large reward. All based upon a ranking system similar to mu. Maybe the mu itself? Would work if there were any way to dictate who you fought against but there's no way to do that, so it'd just be frustrating to be pitted up a team of newer players because the battle finder decided you should be. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 714	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:03:00 - [13] - Quote I gotta ask... Are these full matches that people are failing to get over 150 wp? Even vs protato squads you should be getting more than that. Think about it, your team is dying (probably a lot) just put some useful spawn points down, or sneak about and hack stuff.
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8534	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:04:00 - [14] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: git gud Don't troll, Viktor, you're really bad at it. I dont think that was a troll that was just a statement that you need to improve your abilities. No, it's trolling because Viktor of all people, by now, should understand that this game doesn't always work out in your favor. Battle finder or otherwise. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8534	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:05:00 - [15] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: I gotta ask... Are these full matches that people are failing to get over 150 wp? Even vs protato squads you should be getting more than that. Think about it, your team is dying (probably a lot) just put some useful spawn points down, or sneak about and hack stuff. I'm pretty sure if a guy has time to die five or more times in a match, he's been there for a healthy duration. Just saying. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
deezy dabest 2142	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:05:00 - [16] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: I gotta ask... Are these full matches that people are failing to get over 150 wp? Even vs protato squads you should be getting more than that. Think about it, your team is dying (probably a lot) just put some useful spawn points down, or sneak about and hack stuff. I have had matches where solo i only barely hit 150. In a 50 man ambush when the smart deploy is being instanly stomped it is hard to even get a shot out little less drop an uplink that stays alive long enough for a spawn.
DDx77 The Exemplars RISE of LEGION 125	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:14:00 - [17] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. I generally have three frontline suits with different roles and I usually can get a minimum 500wp a match I have one with uplinks, and two others with a rep tool ( long and short range weapon) You can do this with all militia gear (uplinks,nanohives,rep tool) If you experiment with the medic or anti- armor frontline fit you can make yourself a very effective fit that will help make a ton of isk- it's like a poor mans apex suit Even when your team is getting blown out, you should check the map and deploy uplinks and/or nanohives where you think they will best help your team and not get discovered by the enemy Use the rep tool when your shields/armor are recovering. So attack, fallback, rep tool/recover, attack when back to decent health The other benefit of using frontlines this way is that you can experiment with other weaponry and playstyles with very low risk Boosting : Allowing the server to protect people from other countries from taking damage
Obliv Shining Flame Amarr Empire 26	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:15:00 - [18] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png Uplinks. These forum guys recommended them and I tried and got top 3 in a few matches.
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8534	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:17:00 - [19] - Quote DDx77 wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. I generally have three frontline suits with different roles and I usually can get a minimum 500wp a match I have one with uplinks, and two others with a rep tool ( long and short range weapon) You can do this with all militia gear (uplinks,nanohives,rep tool) If you experiment with the medic or anti- armor frontline fit you can make yourself a very effective fit that will help make a ton of isk- it's like a poor mans apex suit Even when your team is getting blown out, you should check the map and deploy uplinks and/or nanohives where you think they will best help your team and not get discovered by the enemy Use the rep tool when your shields/armor are recovering. So attack, fallback, rep tool/recover, attack when back to decent health The other benefit of using frontlines this way is that you can experiment with other weaponry and playstyles with very low risk Why in god's name would I use Frontline suits when I have several suits at Proto x3 Sarcasm aside, I also don't think a player should be shoe-horned into fulfilling a Logi role in order to feel they need to hit their minimum to receive SP. The fact of the matter is that if you can't hit the minimum without having to change your gameplay in Ambush, then the minimum is too high or should be done away with all together. The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
deezy dabest 2142	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:17:00 - [20] - Quote Obliv wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png Uplinks. These forum guys recommended them and I tried and got top 3 in a few matches. Uplinks are great and all until you go up against a true proto stomp where they are scanning them down and slapping everyone up. A 50 man ambush gives an average of 3 clones per person. When the enemy is on top of your smart deploy that is almost literally gone in the blink of an eye.

SagaB Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 137	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:24:00 - [21] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: Obliv wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png Uplinks. These forum guys recommended them and I tried and got top 3 in a few matches. Uplinks are great and all until you go up against a true proto stomp where they are scanning them down and slapping everyone up. A 50 man ambush gives an average of 3 clones per person. When the enemy is on top of your smart deploy that is almost literally gone in the blink of an eye. In the beginning of an ambush you sprint the hell away from your team and hopefully the opposite direction from the stomping team. With enough distance from active scanners, drop uplinks far away but flanking the steamroll. Collect WP.
Sleepy Shadow Qualified Scrub 257	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:30:00 - [22] - Quote You think that's bad? Check this out : / WP requirement should be removed for Ambush. ItGÇÖs fine for Skirmish and Domination which are favoured by the AFK community anyway. =ƒÿ¦
deezy dabest 2143	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:32:00 - [23] - Quote Sleepy Shadow wrote: You think that's bad? Check this out : / WP requirement should be removed for Ambush. ItGÇÖs fine for Skirmish and Domination which are favoured by the AFK community anyway. Thats exactly what everyone is talking about. It also happens to be the people that most people are likely referring too.
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8537	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:32:00 - [24] - Quote Sleepy Shadow wrote: You think that's bad? Check this out : / WP requirement should be removed for Ambush. ItGÇÖs fine for Skirmish and Domination which are favoured by the AFK community anyway. LMFAO!!! Well, maybe your entire team should "git gud scrub". Because lord knows you totally could have turned that around if you had just an ounce more "skillz" Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Sleepy Shadow Qualified Scrub 257	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:38:00 - [25] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Sleepy Shadow wrote: You think that's bad? Check this out : / WP requirement should be removed for Ambush. ItGÇÖs fine for Skirmish and Domination which are favoured by the AFK community anyway. LMFAO!!! Well, maybe your entire team should "git gud scrub". Because lord knows you totally could have turned that around if you had just an ounce more "skillz" I know, so ashamed for not being better (._. ) =ƒÿ¦
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 626	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:42:00 - [26] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The main purpose of the minimum WP limit is to target AFK:ers. However, there were concerns raised about the minimum WP limit affecting different game modes differently, with Ambush as a clear example. I recommended to initially wait to implement the minimum limit, until we know how the system behaves for newbs and vets....but here we are I guess. However with that said, unless you know the lifetime SP of the people you listed, and the secret "VET threshold" CCP implemented, there is no way you can state those people didn't get any SP, since the minimum WP requirement only applies to VETs. Although you got 0 SP, you still got ISK and salvage, right? So you can't say you got nothing (At least I did when I didn't met the requirements) And ask yourself, how much SP would you really have gotten from 125WP? Compare that to your lifetime SP, and you will see that it really doesn't matter. On the bright side, when you DO get a lot of WP as a VET, you see the SP roll in as never before. (Overall I think it's evens out)
Raiden246 State of Purgatory General Tso's Alliance 26	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:59:00 - [27] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Atiim wrote: lolwat? My brother AFKs in bush while playing CoD on the other PS3 and he still makes enough WP to get the ISK/SP. Video or it didn't happen. Come on man... running the APEX Nomad (Loyalty version) I can get more than 150 warpoints against Nyain San in Ambush. My actual proto fits, 450 or more. Get Good.
The Eristic Dust 90210 787	Posted - 2015.02.08 20:59:00 - [28] - Quote It's a painfully myopic system regardless of game mode, honestly. There are plenty of noobs that do just as poorly in Skirm/Dom (especially in meat grinder maps), and given the time investment, to receive nothing there is even worse. Hell, I even had an Ashland Dom recently where I received nothing because I spent the match chasing a proto sniper and a tank around the map to keep them from focusing on the letter. Only 125 points, but effectively shut down two potentially powerful enemy assets for the entire game. It's the kind of job somebody has to do, but people definitely won't if they get no reward for it. Hitting my WP threshold should never be a concern, only what needs to be done to help my team try to win. Reality is the original Rorschach. Verily! So much for all that.
TIGER SHARK1501 Savage Bullet 143	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:02:00 - [29] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS I was kinda surprised myself. I played a few ambush and got stomped so badly I got isk but no SP.
Raiden246 State of Purgatory General Tso's Alliance 26	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:03:00 - [30] - Quote I do agree this system should be removed, for the sake of the new player (whom apparently Rattati cares about :D )

Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8539	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:05:00 - [31] - Quote Regis Blackbird wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The main purpose of the minimum WP limit is to target AFK:ers. However, there were concerns raised about the minimum WP limit affecting different game modes differently, with Ambush as a clear example. I recommended to initially wait to implement the minimum limit, until we know how the system behaves for newbs and vets....but here we are I guess. However with that said, unless you know the lifetime SP of the people you listed, and the secret "VET threshold" CCP implemented, there is no way you can state those people didn't get any SP, since the minimum WP requirement only applies to VETs. Although you got 0 SP, you still got ISK and salvage, right? So you can't say you got nothing (At least I did when I didn't met the requirements) And ask yourself, how much SP would you really have gotten from 125WP? Compare that to your lifetime SP, and you will see that it really doesn't matter. On the bright side, when you DO get a lot of WP as a VET, you see the SP roll in as never before. (Overall I think it's evens out) I got like 70k ISK and no salvage. Also you can generally tell a veteran from a new player by using Eve-Gate and looking at their employment history. Looking at Bradric Banewolf (from the third picture I linked) you can see that he's been around since March 2013. He's not new by any sense of the word but because he didn't reach the minimum WP: No SP. I'm not going to do this with every person I play with but if it's happening to at least one player, then we can assume it's happening to a hundred others. And that right there is what drives me bonkers. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8539	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:07:00 - [32] - Quote Raiden246 wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Atiim wrote: lolwat? My brother AFKs in bush while playing CoD on the other PS3 and he still makes enough WP to get the ISK/SP. Video or it didn't happen. Come on man... running the APEX Nomad (Loyalty version) I can get more than 150 warpoints against Nyain San in Ambush. My actual proto fits, 450 or more. Get Good. Read OP and answer the questions asked or shut up, seriously. You clearly have nothing useful to say. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Middas Betancore Mantodea MC 442	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:07:00 - [33] - Quote While there is a lot of way of making WP and the warlords patch puts u in matches that have time to make LP I still listen to players who play a lot of dust, but have a bad match and get nothing at all not a small amount..but nothing...with boosters active this becomes very infuriating It may curtail AFK farming in the short term, but soon enough they will get their requisite number of WP and then AFK Is the 200wp action of an AFK'er justified? they did their part, now they can AFK? Pretty much whatever arbitrary amount we set will prove awkward...so just remove it...find another way to deal with AFK just my thoughts "Deploy the gas, we'll burn what's left"- Redacted
Obliv Shining Flame Amarr Empire 27	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:15:00 - [34] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: Obliv wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png Uplinks. These forum guys recommended them and I tried and got top 3 in a few matches. Uplinks are great and all until you go up against a true proto stomp where they are scanning them down and slapping everyone up. A 50 man ambush gives an average of 3 clones per person. When the enemy is on top of your smart deploy that is almost literally gone in the blink of an eye. You can lead a horse to water..... I am just passing on what I learned yesterday. With one militia uplink I get 500+ wp. That would solve the guys problem, correct?
deezy dabest 2143	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:19:00 - [35] - Quote Obliv wrote: You can lead a horse to water..... I am just passing on what I learned yesterday. With one militia uplink I get 500+ wp. That would solve the guys problem, correct? Unfortunately it does not always solve the problem. Some stomps will prevent links from being any real help to you as they get popped before you get your first spawn on them. If you manage to escape and get a link far away then you are golden and the limit will not be an issue. Aside from being insta popped by smart deploy being camped there is the issue of other people putting out links negating your ability to get points. Ambush OMS the 150 WP requirement is fine but the 50 man ambush really should not have any requirement at all. It just ends far too fast in many cases.
Sleepy Shadow Qualified Scrub 257	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:20:00 - [36] - Quote Regis Blackbird wrote: However with that said, unless you know the lifetime SP of the people you listed, and the secret "VET threshold" CCP implemented, there is no way you can state those people didn't get any SP, since the minimum WP requirement only applies to VETs. Although you got 0 SP, you still got ISK and salvage, right? So you can't say you got nothing (At least I did when I didn't met the requirements) And ask yourself, how much SP would you really have gotten from 125WP? Compare that to your lifetime SP, and you will see that it really doesn't matter. Dusted off one of my alts this weekend and had little over 10 MIL SP on it. Anything above 10 MIL is considered a vet but I donGÇÖt know where the line is drawn; I donGÇÖt have any alts with less than 10 MIL. Regardless, even if it was very little SP I still want it. I have more than enough ISK and I suppose SP too, but I still want my SP reward after a battle. Every bit help towards whatever goal I have going. =ƒÿ¦
Obliv Shining Flame Amarr Empire 27	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:25:00 - [37] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: Obliv wrote: You can lead a horse to water..... I am just passing on what I learned yesterday. With one militia uplink I get 500+ wp. That would solve the guys problem, correct? Unfortunately it does not always solve the problem. Some stomps will prevent links from being any real help to you as they get popped before you get your first spawn on them. If you manage to escape and get a link far away then you are golden and the limit will not be an issue. Aside from being insta popped by smart deploy being camped there is the issue of other people putting out links negating your ability to get points. Ambush OMS the 150 WP requirement is fine but the 50 man ambush really should not have any requirement at all. It just ends far too fast in many cases. I wasn't trying to provoke an arguement. I'm sorry. I haven't been sleeping much. There's actually two uplinks in the militia pack but you can only put one down at a time. I just spawn and start looking for a good place to put them. I try to get around behind the red guys. You have to shoot people too. All those +25 add up. I watch the hurt guys rotate to the back and kill them first.
Sleepy Shadow Qualified Scrub 257	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:35:00 - [38] - Quote Obliv wrote: You can lead a horse to water..... I am just passing on what I learned yesterday. With one militia uplink I get 500+ wp. That would solve the guys problem, correct? If everyone on your team drops one or even two uplinks, so 16 or 32 links on the field, how many WP do you think that will be per person? Would you be able to make 500 WP from links alone? GÇ£Git gudGÇ¥ and GÇ£I alwaysGÇ¥ are not solutions to anything. You may be able to scrape enough WP to get your SP but the same tactics wonGÇÖt work for everyone on your team. Also, MLT Uplink only has 10 spawns. So the absolute max you can get from it is 250 WP. Enough to get your SP though : ) =ƒÿ¦
dust514 loves bunghole Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:36:00 - [39] - Quote if you cant get 150 just delete dust. your to worthless to play
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 716	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:40:00 - [40] - Quote The Eristic wrote: I spent the match chasing a tank around the map to keep them from focusing on the letter. Only 125 Were you just chasing it in a dropsuit and not getting shot? Because if you pulled a forge/swarm or even some AV grenades, you'd have easily gotten 2 lots of 75 wp. Tanks are quite literally wp pinatas.

Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8539	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:42:00 - [41] - Quote dust514 loves bunghole wrote: if you cant get 150 just delete dust. your to worthless to play Will do, just as long you delete Dust 514 off your PS3 the -INSTANT- you don't land 150 WP in Ambush (which -will- happen) so that you're not a hypocrite. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
The Eristic Dust 90210 787	Posted - 2015.02.08 21:44:00 - [42] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: Were you just chasing it in a dropsuit and not getting shot? Because if you pulled a forge/swarm or even some AV grenades, you'd have easily gotten 2 lots of 75 wp. Tanks are quite literally wp pinatas. Plasma Cannon Scout. First shot or nade, he hardens and runs, repeat. No points. Reality is the original Rorschach. Verily! So much for all that.
SgtMajSquish MLBJ Consolidated Dust 338	Posted - 2015.02.08 22:11:00 - [43] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: I gotta ask... Are these full matches that people are failing to get over 150 wp? Even vs protato squads you should be getting more than that. Think about it, your team is dying (probably a lot) just put some useful spawn points down, or sneak about and hack stuff. But that would require spending ISKies on equipment and actually trying to help. CoD CoD CoD herp derp derp Rise and shine CCP. It's time to implement ping based match making.
Slave of MORTE Eyniletti Rangers Minmatar Republic 274	Posted - 2015.02.08 22:34:00 - [44] - Quote Lol they should a just increased reward system ..to give proper rewards for risk terrible pub payouts started afking and now there is a function that doesn't fix the problem and harms new unskilled players like Aeon tsk. Tsk ccp Yet another slave of Mortedeamor
Nirwanda Vaughns 1400	Posted - 2015.02.08 22:42:00 - [45] - Quote i feel yours, just as anyone elses opinion on this matter will just get the regular 'get good' idiots posting. its a poor mechanic and a lazy fix for the AFK issue. hell its not stopped AFk so all its doing is harming peopel who get stomped. i was in a game other evening and was 5th and only just got 150wp. every one else below me got 125 or less points. thats 2/3s the f*kin team not geting sp due to stomping tryhards. if CCP really feel the need to keep the minimum WP then at least remove it from Ambush because half the time the game is over so quick when you come up against a stomp team you don't get chance to earn points. Never argue with an idiot. they bring you down to their level and beat you through experience proud C-II bpo owner*
LUGMOS Corrosive Synergy 1970	Posted - 2015.02.08 22:44:00 - [46] - Quote This system only affects "vets" Newbies are not up for this system, and get paid regardless. Again, where the line is drawn is unknown ATM. However, this is only a big problem in spambush. Simple solution: get rid of it for ambush. Is it really so simple? probably not, as it is not as easy as it seems. Since it is an addition to EOM payouts IN GENERAL, it is difficult to limit it to only Dom and Skirm. Is it impossible? Probably not. So get on it devs Official QuafeGäó Advocate Anti-FoTM Prof. V Forum Scavenger Prof. V
Piercing Serenity PFB Pink Fluffy Bunnies 847	Posted - 2015.02.08 23:21:00 - [47] - Quote I don't think that there is any system that will be without some terrible flaw. Yes, it sure does suck to be the one or three people in a match who tried really hard and still did not get anything. That's not a sarcastic statement, either. It sucks. However, I think it sucks more, for a larger number of people, to feel like all of your hard work is equal to someone who didn't do anything all match. This system has two large improvements to me, compared to the current system: Your work in battle is more valuable. If you do well, you will get rewarded much more than someone who does poorly It is theoretically possible for everyone to do well enough to get rewarded appropriately Closed Beta Vet (E3 Build), Former PFBHz Best Corps Battled (Personally): Imperfects, TeamPlayers, Hellstorm
Nirwanda Vaughns 1401	Posted - 2015.02.08 23:47:00 - [48] - Quote i admit on my main when i logi and pull in 21k sp without boosters its pretty f*kin beutiful hahaha the extra sp for wp vets get is great. its just that teh times i run into stompers and don't get sp outweighs that extra sp over time so is not really a bonus i'm happy for th eminimum wp to be in for skirm and doms but for ambush the matches don't last long enough and puts pressure of players to get 150 wp than actually assist the team properly Never argue with an idiot. they bring you down to their level and beat you through experience proud C-II bpo owner*
S-PANZA Expert Intervention Caldari State 118	Posted - 2015.02.09 00:17:00 - [49] - Quote I also dont like the minimum... Id like it more if you got to keep the WP earned up to the 150 even without the bonus. It just seems like a waste of time if you dont receive what youve earned.
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 661	Posted - 2015.02.09 00:40:00 - [50] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. This is a pretty good point. I really don't think it is effective in any event. I can drop some long lasting uplinks and go afk and still make good SP/Isk in a dom or skirm. But even if it is more effective than I think -- yeah -- in Ambush you aren't AFKing really so -- I don't see the point in having it there.

Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 1219	Posted - 2015.02.09 00:43:00 - [51] - Quote I haven't played since warlords deployed but..3 revives is 150 wp right? Mark a$$ tricks, and bags of dicks....
TritusX PH4NT0M5 248	Posted - 2015.02.09 00:47:00 - [52] - Quote So this is why you left the match right away after Kalante killed you Forced Death
DootDoot Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 409	Posted - 2015.02.09 01:07:00 - [53] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: I gotta ask... Are these full matches that people are failing to get over 150 wp? Even vs protato squads you should be getting more than that. Think about it, your team is dying (probably a lot) just put some useful spawn points down, or sneak about and hack stuff. WTF magical bubble world do you live in. Put yourself in the game. Your in a squad of friends who casually play DUST. You que up for ambush. Get put in a 50 clone match. The enemy group spawns 150m Away. Their group consists of two squads of 6 and 4 of veteran PC players running proto. Your team will get stomped off their spawn in less then 2 minutes. Scouts will be removing spawn pads as fast as you lay them. You can't even respawn and move without being shot. There is nothing to hack. You can't call in a vehicle. Your only hope at this point is trying to spawn with a scout and sneak away without being scanned to try and put an uplink down to get any kind of points praying enough want to spawn back in even so you can get 150 WP. 50 clone ambushes make no sense to have this limit. Ambushes make EVEN LESS sense to have an AFK mechanic to punish AFK'ers not contributing IN AN AMBUSH...... Where are they hiding? If they hide and not die? Are they really creating a negative situation in an ambush? Why are there even WP limits in the entire Ambush game mode? This should be the entry level game mode that every player goes to first.... Its a simple deathmatch... Why are we penalizing players who actually play the game? Because they aren't good enough? Like WTF is wrong with people on these forums.
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 1219	Posted - 2015.02.09 01:11:00 - [54] - Quote DootDoot wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: I gotta ask... Are these full matches that people are failing to get over 150 wp? Even vs protato squads you should be getting more than that. Think about it, your team is dying (probably a lot) just put some useful spawn points down, or sneak about and hack stuff. WTF magical bubble world do you live in. Put yourself in the game. Your in a squad of friends who casually play DUST. You que up for ambush. Get put in a 50 clone match. The enemy group spawns 150m Away. Their group consists of two squads of 6 and 4 of veteran PC players running proto. Your team will get stomped off their spawn in less then 2 minutes. Scouts will be removing spawn pads as fast as you lay them. You can't even respawn and move without being shot. There is nothing to hack. You can't call in a vehicle. Your only hope at this point is trying to spawn with a scout and sneak away without being scanned to try and put an uplink down to get any kind of points praying enough want to spawn back in even so you can get 150 WP. 50 clone ambushes make no sense to have this limit. Ambushes make EVEN LESS sense to have an AFK mechanic to punish AFK'ers not contributing IN AN AMBUSH...... Where are they hiding? If they hide and not die? Are they really creating a negative situation in an ambush? Why are there even WP limits in the entire Ambush game mode? This should be the entry level game mode that every player goes to first.... Its a simple deathmatch... Why are we penalizing players who actually play the game? Because they aren't good enough? Like WTF is wrong with people on these forums. Mlt fit with needle? Mark a$$ tricks, and bags of dicks....
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2483	Posted - 2015.02.09 01:15:00 - [55] - Quote i had my first match yesterday where i earned 0 sp, was kinda cool Spawned in late, our warbarge was down to ~50% armour enemy at ~50% shields(thought that was fixed), ran around the outside, dropped two uplinks, killed two mercs, died once, match ended in a loss ofc. Not complaining at all because in a standard skirmish i'm making 12 to 18 thousand sp now, considerably more than before. How are new peeps finding the time-based sp payouts? Are they good enough to help the struggling newbros get a leg up? PSN: RationalSpark
Pseudogenesis nos nothi 1647	Posted - 2015.02.09 01:44:00 - [56] - Quote Eh, too much QQ for my taste. 150 WP is nothing. Drop a single uplink and have 6 people spawn on it. Rep a person for 6 armor. Get 3 kills. Drop some nanohives. Do any of the above, in any combination, and you're set. If you can't pull that off then no offense, but you didn't deserve the SP. They are called Skill Points for a reason. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
xavier zor nos nothi 623	Posted - 2015.02.09 02:27:00 - [57] - Quote Stefan Stahl wrote: Today during a skirmish I got 148 WP as a NDS pilot. I was busy all match, got a couple transport assists and even 3 kill assists from blueberry gunners (these are seldom!). 0 SP payout. i honestly wouldn't care now, i get 1k SP as it is with thiss ***** sp glitch ***** useless devs new home <3

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 16925	Posted - 2015.02.09 02:42:00 - [58] - Quote I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Alex-ZX Valor Coalition Red Whines. 235	Posted - 2015.02.09 02:46:00 - [59] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? A system that I saw that worked pretty good was like in MAG, suppression had something like big boxes where ppl spawn and of course enemies can't get close because of the red line. Or like in killzone after a certain amount of kills it just throws u to the opposite side of the map. Alex's modified ZX-030 HMG Luis' modified VC-107 CR Alex's modified VC-107 SMG *Owner of this beasts*
Nirwanda Vaughns 1401	Posted - 2015.02.09 02:48:00 - [60] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? howabout the grid method someone mentioned months ago? basically the map is divided into 5x5 grids. you pick a square and it drops you somewhere in that grid. if you choose one with reddots its your own fault for team/squad not having scanners. it also helps flanking too. Never argue with an idiot. they bring you down to their level and beat you through experience proud C-II bpo owner

deezy dabest 2145	Posted - 2015.02.09 02:52:00 - [61] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? For 50 man ambush redlines much smaller and divide the map into 4 quadrants for spawn purposes. These would basically consist of a large socket and a small outer perimeter. Quadrant selection for spawn would then be totally random. This would make flanks happen and cause stompers to be on their toes while stomped blueberrys would essentially be flanking automatically. For Ambush OMS I just dont know.
One Eyed King nos nothi 7718	Posted - 2015.02.09 02:54:00 - [62] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Is it possible to have some mixture of the two? Perhaps a spawn that shifts on occasion, like once every 30 seconds, but not so often that everyone is sort of on their lonesome? This way if a group IS being slaughtered, players could wait 30 seconds and ensure they have a different spawn point. This would also force both teams to use uplinks in order to have teammates consciously spawn closer to the action. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
Juno Tristan Obscure Reference 348	Posted - 2015.02.09 03:02:00 - [63] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Part of the problem is you don't know where smart deploy will spawn you, it should appear as part of the countdown so you can abort if the area's being overrun ADS Ramming Revenge! Should Have Stayed Inside (the Tank)
Banjo Robertson Random Gunz RISE of LEGION 446	Posted - 2015.02.09 03:14:00 - [64] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Let players choose where exactly to spawn on the map in ambush using a little circle similar to how you select where to drop an orbitasl.
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 2080	Posted - 2015.02.09 03:20:00 - [65] - Quote Banjo Robertson wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Let players choose where exactly to spawn on the map in ambush using a little circle similar to how you select where to drop an orbitasl. Brilliant idea. Take your stinking paws off me, you damned dirty hipster! [RYJC]
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 722	Posted - 2015.02.09 03:26:00 - [66] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Any super smart ideas? No, I only have stupid ones... But it might work. How about dropping plenty of CRU's at the start of Ambush matches, since anyone can hack them and they aren't easily destroyed, there's a good chance of someone on both teams running off at the start of the match and hacking them. &/OR When a team is down by 10 clones, drop in some pre-hacked CRU's for them. One of them is bound to be of some use. Although it still relies on the team being mildly competent and knowing when to switch spawns, the enemy team will struggle to camp multiple spawns.
Booby Tuesdays Ahrendee Mercenaries 1300	Posted - 2015.02.09 03:27:00 - [67] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Why can't Ambush just have a set of spawn points per map? Each team can pick from 2-3 dedicated spawn points or use smart deploy. Being forced to spawn on a blueberries crappy uplink in the middle of a firefight is the reason I quit playing Ambush over a year ago. Half-Assed Forum Warrior / Half-Decent Commando / Damn Good Logi / Matari Loyalty 7
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 829	Posted - 2015.02.09 03:30:00 - [68] - Quote Juno Tristan wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Part of the problem is you don't know where smart deploy will spawn you, it should appear as part of the countdown so you can abort if the area's being overrun Spot on. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
SgtMajSquish MLBJ Consolidated Dust 341	Posted - 2015.02.09 03:34:00 - [69] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Is it possible to have some mixture of the two? Perhaps a spawn that shifts on occasion, like once every 30 seconds, but not so often that everyone is sort of on their lonesome? This way if a group IS being slaughtered, players could wait 30 seconds and ensure they have a different spawn point. This would also force both teams to use uplinks in order to have teammates consciously spawn closer to the action. The issue is the complexity of said algorithms to determine the kills in an area. I see it as a constantly changing list of kills with their location on them. The algorithm would test the first kill and then compare the next 10ish for their location. If the kills are not one sided(heated battle scenario) all logic would be on standby untill it becomes one sided. I can picture the logic for it but cannot see it as being very resource efficient in anyway. It might work on another system but with the limitations of the PS3 im not so sure Rise and shine CCP. It's time to implement ping based match making.
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 723	Posted - 2015.02.09 03:39:00 - [70] - Quote The Eristic wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: Were you just chasing it in a dropsuit and not getting shot? Because if you pulled a forge/swarm or even some AV grenades, you'd have easily gotten 2 lots of 75 wp. Tanks are quite literally wp pinatas. Plasma Cannon Scout. First shot or nade, he hardens and runs, repeat. No points. Throw flux > fire cannon > both hit at the same time, gets at least 75 points. Also watch the turret, he can't see a scout that's behind the turret. DootDoot wrote: WTF magical bubble world do you live in. The one where I'm a Commmaaannnndddoooooo and anything is possible!

DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 862	Posted - 2015.02.09 04:04:00 - [71] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Remove spawn system? And let us spawn where we want. The grid spawn is a good idea
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10985	Posted - 2015.02.09 04:24:00 - [72] - Quote Perhaps we could try out what Project Legion is suppose to try out. Let us spawn high up in the air -- and I mean real high -- so that we can adjust the direction of our decent as we fall, have an idea of what's going on before we reach the ground, and be able to avoid the disorientation that results from spawning blindly on the ground. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10985	Posted - 2015.02.09 04:32:00 - [73] - Quote SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: The issue is the complexity of said algorithms to determine the kills in an area. I see it as a constantly changing list of kills with their location on them. The algorithm would test the first kill and then compare the next 10ish for their location. If the kills are not one sided(heated battle scenario) all logic would be on standby untill it becomes one sided. I can picture the logic for it but cannot see it as being very resource efficient in anyway. It might work on another system but with the limitations of the PS3 im not so sure You're assuming that only the PS3 will handle the computations. As of right now, the PS3 is not handling much, if any, of the computations behind how much damage your weapon deals, how bonuses are applied, etc. As far as I know in the years I have known CCP, all computations are made and verified server side on Tranquility which has been handling vastly more complex algorithms for Eve Online for almost 12 years straight without so much as breaking a sweat except during epic fleet battles and the biggest rush hour at Jita. If anything, the algorithms for the spawning in ambush would be handled best by the server. Don't worry about the stress on the server. I'm sure it can handle it given what it goes through every day for Eve Online. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Ld Collins State of Purgatory General Tso's Alliance 189	Posted - 2015.02.09 04:58:00 - [74] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Spawn on squad leader ambush only.
Billi Gene 526	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:05:00 - [75] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Atiim wrote: lolwat? My brother AFKs in bush while playing CoD on the other PS3 and he still makes enough WP to get the ISK/SP. Video or it didn't happen. presumably his brother is one of those annoying derps that drops uplinks in ambush, the fact that he could then afk assured of people being forced to use his uplinks sure makes me want to scream "exploit" :P Pedant, Ape, Troll. My Beard makes Alpha's sook :P
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8550	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:14:00 - [76] - Quote TritusX wrote: So this is why you left the match right away after Kalante killed you I left that match because I looked at the competition (mostly veterans with proto) and my team (bumbling guys in militia who were scattered all over the map with no sense of spatial awareness despite the sounds of gunfire) and left the match because I knew that it was going to be a lost cause. There is such a thing as a tactical retreat. I weighed my options and it became apparent that it would be more ISK efficient to just leave. It also lessened the possibility of wasting my time for a zero SP outcome. So, before you troll, let me ask you this: Did you win that match? CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? No, I genuinely enjoy Ambush. The spawn system is frustrating at times but it's overall a fun game-mode that I can play a few rounds in short durations and have been finding a lot of good video material to post. Point in case. What I don't like is that every so often the game just throws a curveball my way that I have no control over. I don't have a problem losing. I have a problem losing and not getting jack for it despite actually trying my hardest. Why stay in a match that I know I'm going to lose if losing doesn't even benefit me in any way? But nice try trying to de-rail the thread to Ambush Spawn mechanics Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
The Noob Destroyer 1266	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:20:00 - [77] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Remove spawn system? And let us spawn where we want. The grid spawn is a good idea this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_LxyhCJpsM
Billi Gene 526	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:20:00 - [78] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Varoth Drac wrote: I seem to remember an interesting system in world of Warcraft for dealing with pvp rewards where some have s clear advantage over others. I think it was some kind of ranking system other than level, and you only got rewarded for killing higher ranked people, or something like that. I wonder if we could have a similar system. So stompers wouldn't get sp for killing noobs, but if anyone kills a stomper they get a large reward. All based upon a ranking system similar to mu. Maybe the mu itself? Would work if there were any way to dictate who you fought against but there's no way to do that, so it'd just be frustrating to be pitted up a team of newer players because the battle finder decided you should be. a fitting meta level (suit meta AND modules/equipment/weapons) now exists in game, this could be used on a per spawn basis to feed a rewards equation of some sort. The notion of higher meta fittings getting less reward for killing low meta and its opposite, isnt so far fetched. +2% for each meta level your victim is above your own, -2%SP for each meta level you are higher than your victim? (2% of 50 points= 1 point). if vehicle fitting meta level is equitable to drop suit' re: militia/standard/advanced/proto, then vehicle damage and suit kills for vehicle rewards could also be adjusted. risk vs reward? heck maybe 2% isnt enough, or maybe higher risk should should pay more? 6% per meta above your own? ((to any pubstompers.... "welcome to New Eden" ...lolz)) Pedant, Ape, Troll. My Beard makes Alpha's sook :P
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 626	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:32:00 - [79] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Perhaps we could try out what Project Legion is suppose to try out. Let us spawn high up in the air -- and I mean real high -- so that we can adjust the direction of our decent as we fall, have an idea of what's going on before we reach the ground, and be able to avoid the disorientation that results from spawning blindly on the ground. I concur with this ^ Place an fixed "spawn point" close to ceiling height (that is always available) in conjunction with "smart deploy". There is already a card on the Trello board for this.
THUNDERGROOVE Fatal Absolution 1459	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:39:00 - [80] - Quote The Eristic wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: Were you just chasing it in a dropsuit and not getting shot? Because if you pulled a forge/swarm or even some AV grenades, you'd have easily gotten 2 lots of 75 wp. Tanks are quite literally wp pinatas. Plasma Cannon Scout. First shot or nade, he hardens and runs, repeat. No points. lol Allotek Flux grenades repeatedly give me 150 WP for landing one on a tank. I'm the Rayman of uplinks. AIV member. 21 day EVE trial.

Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8553	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:42:00 - [81] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: The Eristic wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: Were you just chasing it in a dropsuit and not getting shot? Because if you pulled a forge/swarm or even some AV grenades, you'd have easily gotten 2 lots of 75 wp. Tanks are quite literally wp pinatas. Plasma Cannon Scout. First shot or nade, he hardens and runs, repeat. No points. lol Allotek Flux grenades repeatedly give me 150 WP for landing one on a tank. Unfortunately, anecdotal evidence doesn't address the overall problem. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 7409	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:47:00 - [82] - Quote 125WP? I usually get that much when there's less than ten clones left and I get spawned in a game that's about to end. You need to read up on strategy and reinvent your tactics. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 7409	Posted - 2015.02.09 05:50:00 - [83] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? How about we stick with the spawning close to teammates mechanic, but add in.code that says "If X team deaths in Y time then change spawn." Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 830	Posted - 2015.02.09 06:09:00 - [84] - Quote @Aeon If said "AFKer" doesn't care about KD then Ambush is the best game mode to AFK in. Get more salavage and isk in a shorter time span than skirm and dom. That being said the situation you're describing seems to be the exception rather than rule. Alot of NPC corps are highlighted who are not affected by WP minimum. Also in each image you provide there are plenty of players who have a more deaths than the ones you highlight who still manage to break the WP barrier. In terms of most deaths per image Image 1 Death bringer goes 2/9 and gets 250 WP Image 2 Pedro Juan goes freaking 2/11 and manage to get 225 warpoints Image 3 Two players die 8 times, Quatera 1/8 210 wp and Isiah654 0/8 25 WP. These stats are sad indictcators of matchmacking, mostly documents noobs having a rough time, but in terms of sympathy for Vets with low WP hauls, i could care less. If a player going 2/11 (getting uber stomped) can break 150 WP then there no reason why somebody rocking proto in ambush can't do the same thing. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
I-Shayz-I I----------I 5280	Posted - 2015.02.09 06:13:00 - [85] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? 1. If there was a way to detect people dying within x seconds from being spawned in that would prevent a lot of the ambush spawn camping. If you are on the stomping side of ambush, generally all you have to do is find the place that players are spawning in at, which means a lot of easy kills from spawn traps. The game doesn't register that people are being spawn trapped until there's already a group of players that have died. 2. Spawning into the middle of a battle is never fun. Even in most popular FPS games, the game usually spawns players away from the battle and not just where the cluster of allies are currently located. You usually never spawn alongside multiple friendly players, and rarely in the exact same place. Scattering the spawns in a section of the map is more effective than having the game spawn players in the same location of other spawns. 7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
Talos Vagheitan Ancient Exiles. 907	Posted - 2015.02.09 06:44:00 - [86] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Spawn so your friendly blob is directly between you and the enemy blob. 'In theory' you should spawn a short distance behind your "front line". Teams getting massacred is a separate issue and no spawning system will fix it. Who cares what some sniper has to say
Big Burns Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 559	Posted - 2015.02.09 07:03:00 - [87] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? I rarely see a team, who gets slaughtered early on in the match, make a come back. Why drag the match out and make us run around looking for a guy trying to hide? Why are the maps for ambush soooo large? Kind of a contradiction dontcha think? When you think of ambush you think of CQC and fast paced battles....not running 300 meters from spawn to spawn just so Mr. newbie or Mr. Alt character can have a chance to hide. This ain't hide and seek. Stick us in a metal cage 50x50 meters and let's get that SP. Some of your players don't have all day to play. So they definitely don't want to run around for 10 minutes, just to get two kills and not reach the 200WP limit for vets. You need to listen to me Rattati and stop avoiding me. I'm a try-hard, because half my team sits in the MCC.
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8555	Posted - 2015.02.09 07:05:00 - [88] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: 125WP? I usually get that much when there's less than ten clones left and I get spawned in a game that's about to end. You need to read up on strategy and reinvent your tactics. See questions asked in OP, answer them. Tesfa Alem wrote: @Aeon If said "AFKer" doesn't care about KD then Ambush is the best game mode to AFK in. Get more salavage and isk in a shorter time span than skirm and dom. That being said the situation you're describing seems to be the exception rather than rule. Alot of NPC corps are highlighted who are not affected by WP minimum. Also in each image you provide there are plenty of players who have a more deaths than the ones you highlight who still manage to break the WP barrier. In terms of most deaths per image Image 1 Death bringer goes 2/9 and gets 250 WP Image 2 Pedro Juan goes freaking 2/11 and manage to get 225 warpoints Image 3 Two players die 8 times, Quatera 1/8 210 wp and Isiah654 0/8 25 WP. These stats are sad indictcators of matchmacking, mostly documents noobs having a rough time, but in terms of sympathy for Vets with low WP hauls, i could care less. If a player going 2/11 (getting uber stomped) can break 150 WP then there no reason why somebody rocking proto in ambush can't do the same thing. See questions asked in OP, answer them. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Mary Sedillo Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 347	Posted - 2015.02.09 08:29:00 - [89] - Quote Ambush really really sucks and is there for people trying to power grind SP with little effort. Lemon in the eye of you folks. ;)
Big Burns Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 559	Posted - 2015.02.09 08:42:00 - [90] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS It's all about the money Aeon. You see...the more players CCP acquires, the more money they make. New players won't be attracted to the game if they are always losing and dying. So how does CCP fix this problem you may ask. Well, they have two options, they could fix match-making which would place vets against vets, or they could hold the vets back. Guess which one they chose? lol. It started with the whole racial bonus thing. This allowed new players to spend a certain amount of SP and be productive on the battlefield in one particular role. Before this the vets were extremely OP as the could change between roles and be the best at every role they had. With this new racial bonus option, new players could stand a better chance of being just as productive on the battlefield as someone with multiple roles. The next big jump was the introduction of bandwidth, which made it nearly impossible to run multiple roles. Vets used to start a match in their uplink suits, then switch to any other suit accordingly. Now with bandwidth, you have to run logi the whole match or another role, one or the other. In doing this, it limits the vets options or versatility and therefore helps the new players. The lastest installment of "let's screw our vets out of what they grinded for", is Apex suits. Finally, the day has come where Dust goes complete noob. This is the mother load for CCP. New players are drooling over proto BPO's. They can compete with the vets a little better and make lots of isk, no worries. No skills required. And CCP gets money from those who decide to purchase these with aurum. OH YEA! Just awesome. The last thing and most recent thing they have come out with is what your topic is about. Now, it will help with afk'ing, however...why ambush? Then after reading everything I've written above...it all starts to make sense. Just another way CCP tries to level the playing field without making it look to obvious, that they are intentionally restricting veteran players, like a boa constrictor they just keep squeezing. Do you know how to boil a frog? You don't boil the water then throw a frog in it...it'll just jump out. Instead, you put it on simmer and place the frog in the warm water, it enjoys it and doesn't realize it's being cooked until it's too late. They are doing the same thing to the vets. Little by little. I'm a try-hard, because half my team sits in the MCC.

Mary Sedillo Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 347	Posted - 2015.02.09 08:45:00 - [91] - Quote Big Burns wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS It's all about the money Aeon. You see...the more players CCP acquires, the more money they make. New players won't be attracted to the game if they are always losing and dying. So how does CCP fix this problem you may ask. Well, they have two options, they could fix match-making which would place vets against vets, or they could hold the vets back. Guess which one they chose? lol. It started with the whole racial bonus thing. This allowed new players to spend a certain amount of SP and be productive on the battlefield in one particular role. Before this the vets were extremely OP as the could change between roles and be the best at every role they had. With this new racial bonus option, new players could stand a better chance of being just as productive on the battlefield as someone with multiple roles. The next big jump was the introduction of bandwidth, which made it nearly impossible to run multiple roles. Vets used to start a match in their uplink suits, then switch to any other suit accordingly. Now with bandwidth, you have to run logi the whole match or another role, one or the other. In doing this, it limits the vets options or versatility and therefore helps the new players. The lastest installment of "let's screw our vets out of what they grinded for", is Apex suits. Finally, the day has come where Dust goes complete noob. This is the mother load for CCP. New players are drooling over proto BPO's. They can compete with the vets a little better and make lots of isk, no worries. No skills required. And CCP gets money from those who decide to purchase these with aurum. OH YEA! Just awesome. The last thing and most recent thing they have come out with is what your topic is about. Now, it will help with afk'ing, however...why ambush? Then after reading everything I've written above...it all starts to make sense. Just another way CCP tries to level the playing field without making it look to obvious, that they are intentionally restricting veteran players, like a boa constrictor they just keep squeezing. Do you know how to boil a frog? You don't boil the water then throw a frog in it...it'll just jump out. Instead, you put it on simmer and place the frog in the warm water, it enjoys it and doesn't realize it's being cooked until it's too late. They are doing the same thing to the vets. Little by little. They tried the pitting vets against vets thing before in matchmaking. It led to horridly under-populated matches, and ******* LONG ASS wait-times. You want to go back to that?
Mary Sedillo Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 347	Posted - 2015.02.09 08:47:00 - [92] - Quote You could also worry less about others and just do what you do that brings you enjoyment.
shaman oga Dead Man's Game 3995	Posted - 2015.02.09 09:10:00 - [93] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? In normal ambush, i would block more of the map, keep the fight in rather small area. Block access to most of the high ground positions, it's very annoying see an entire team camping high ground. Add 2 little redline area for enemies, smaller than skirm/dom. If X deaths in area, then spawn to redline farther from that area. In OMS, add normal redline mechanic. Some have luck, some have money, trading is not a crime. Minmatar omni-merc
Justicar Karnellia Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 936	Posted - 2015.02.09 09:19:00 - [94] - Quote At its core, the 150 WP was to counter afk-ing which in ambush, is extremely difficult. Would it be so difficult to just remove this minimum in ambush? The WP totals don't really even reach the dizzying heights you can get in a domination of skirmish anyway.
Big Burns Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 560	Posted - 2015.02.09 09:25:00 - [95] - Quote Mary Sedillo wrote: You could also worry less about others and just do what you do that brings you enjoyment. I don't mean to be rude, please forgive me for asking. Are you handicapped in any way, shape or form? I'm a try-hard, because half my team sits in the MCC.
Pseudogenesis nos nothi 1647	Posted - 2015.02.09 09:29:00 - [96] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: EDIT: To better establish my point here: Why is the minimum WP for SP a thing in Ambush? If it was meant to combat AFKers, and there isn't any safe location to AFK in Ambush, then who's it stopping? Not true, I AFK'd once or twice in ambush, you just pop down a bunch of droplinks and then wander around in the hills. Besides, you don't really need to be safe to AFK Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
Big Burns Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 560	Posted - 2015.02.09 09:32:00 - [97] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: EDIT: To better establish my point here: Why is the minimum WP for SP a thing in Ambush? If it was meant to combat AFKers, and there isn't any safe location to AFK in Ambush, then who's it stopping? Not true, I AFK'd once or twice in ambush, you just pop down a bunch of droplinks and then wander around in the hills. Besides, you don't really need to be safe to AFK lol. YES!!!! Someone with common sense. Are their others or are we the only ones that survived? I'm a try-hard, because half my team sits in the MCC.
Pseudogenesis nos nothi 1648	Posted - 2015.02.09 09:36:00 - [98] - Quote Big Burns wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: EDIT: To better establish my point here: Why is the minimum WP for SP a thing in Ambush? If it was meant to combat AFKers, and there isn't any safe location to AFK in Ambush, then who's it stopping? Not true, I AFK'd once or twice in ambush, you just pop down a bunch of droplinks and then wander around in the hills. Besides, you don't really need to be safe to AFK lol. YES!!!! Someone with common sense. Are their others or are we the only ones that survived? Unfortunately no, I ate them to absorb their powers Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
Big Burns Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 560	Posted - 2015.02.09 09:41:00 - [99] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Big Burns wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: EDIT: To better establish my point here: Why is the minimum WP for SP a thing in Ambush? If it was meant to combat AFKers, and there isn't any safe location to AFK in Ambush, then who's it stopping? Not true, I AFK'd once or twice in ambush, you just pop down a bunch of droplinks and then wander around in the hills. Besides, you don't really need to be safe to AFK lol. YES!!!! Someone with common sense. Are their others or are we the only ones that survived? Unfortunately no, I ate them to absorb their powers Wish I could've ate some brains. The only thing I got is popcorn. Dust514- 90% L3 / 10% R1
Darken-Soul BIG BAD W0LVES 1934	Posted - 2015.02.09 09:59:00 - [100] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? You could have smart deploy spawn you away from the fighting. If people want to defend a position or form up they can bring equipment like any other game mode. How about placing people on teams balanced by weekly k/d? That way everyone can fight people of their own skill level. Team deploy. I like how one side always gets ambushed. I don't know if it's intended or it just works out that way. keep this but make the match start AFTER everyone loads in. Collect all the singles and throw them in a match against eachother. Who wants some?

Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8562	Posted - 2015.02.09 10:01:00 - [101] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: EDIT: To better establish my point here: Why is the minimum WP for SP a thing in Ambush? If it was meant to combat AFKers, and there isn't any safe location to AFK in Ambush, then who's it stopping? Not true, I AFK'd once or twice in ambush, you just pop down a bunch of droplinks and then wander around in the hills. Besides, you don't really need to be safe to AFK I can still find you and kill you, given enough effort. The same can't be said about guys who rubber-band their analog stick and chill in the MCC for the duration of a match. Two completely separate issues; can you guess which one the WP minimum was put in place for? Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Pagl1u M Dead Man's Game RUST415 1461	Posted - 2015.02.09 10:05:00 - [102] - Quote If a vet cant Reach 150 WP, he totally deserves to be rewarded with 0 SP, ambush or not. Because it means that that vet wasnt even trying at all. Period. One of the few assaults you'll find in a PC match!
Sequal's Back Intara Direct Action Caldari State 262	Posted - 2015.02.09 10:17:00 - [103] - Quote Pagl1u M wrote: If a vet cant Reach 150 WP, he totally deserves to be rewarded with 0 SP, ambush or not. Because it means that that vet wasnt even trying at all. Period. I totally agree with you. Rise? That's what they used to call me. Sequal Rise. That was my name. Now I come Back to you, at the turn of the tide.
Nirwanda Vaughns 1405	Posted - 2015.02.09 11:25:00 - [104] - Quote oh and as a few have said. in ambs th emap sizes could do with coming in a little. in a 50 man battle on a map with a large city map, that'd be plenty of room for a short close quarters game. in 80 man ambush on open maps its simply a pain in th ebackside running around trying to find reddots. if scanners were better, either all or gallente log was changed it'd help but sometimes for 32 people the maps are far too big Never argue with an idiot. they bring you down to their level and beat you through experience proud C-II bpo owner
SoTa PoP Heaven's Lost Property 6048	Posted - 2015.02.09 11:28:00 - [105] - Quote If you can't keep up you don't get paid... However, it's dumb. Why would they put this system in when academy is such a short process? Soon as they're done they're thrown into pubs - get there ass handed to them - and now they're punished for it. CCP hates new players. n+ÅS¦¦Gùò GÇ+GÇ+ GùòS¦¦n++ I watch anime for the plot
Darken-Soul BIG BAD W0LVES 1938	Posted - 2015.02.09 11:32:00 - [106] - Quote SoTa PoP wrote: If you can't keep up you don't get paid... However, it's dumb. Why would they put this system in when academy is such a short process? Soon as they're done they're thrown into pubs - get there ass handed to them - and now they're punished for it. CCP hates new players. Humans usually hate what they don't understand. Who wants some?
Bayeth Mal nos nothi 2334	Posted - 2015.02.09 11:56:00 - [107] - Quote I agree. It's rare but sometimes you just have those matches. Sometimes I've been on the winning side of such an extreme stomp that I've walked out with a grand total of 10wp because I refused to camp the redline. Other times you might be trying a weird alt fit (like say, testing nova knives) and you realise by the end of the match you really got FA in terms of points. I wonder how long before people just start leaving matches because they get nothing if they don't reach some arbitrary limit. Just bring back oceanic. AFK problem solved. We'll bang, OK?
Adipem Nothi nos nothi 6524	Posted - 2015.02.09 12:28:00 - [108] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Any super smart ideas? Super Smart Spawn will not spawn a unit within (X) meters of enemy. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Adipem Nothi nos nothi 6524	Posted - 2015.02.09 12:35:00 - [109] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: TritusX wrote: So this is why you left the match right away after Kalante killed you I left that match because I looked at the competition (mostly veterans with proto) and my team (bumbling guys in militia ...) and left the match because I knew that it was going to be a lost cause. Would've done exactly the same thing. Insufficient incentive to play an unplayable match. Suggestion: Scotty the Mathmaking AI anticipates that your odds of winning the upcoming battle are 36,000 to 1. Stompees who remain until match end will be paid 1M Isk and 100 Barge Components. Do you wish to deploy? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 7025	Posted - 2015.02.09 12:42:00 - [110] - Quote Ambush phase line: Place 9 "objective markers" that don't actually have hack points. Yellow = no one in close proximity. Blue = only allies in close proximity. Red = Enemies (possibly blues) in close proximity. Allow players to spawn on any of these markers at will. AV

Darken-Soul BIG BAD W0LVES 1943	Posted - 2015.02.09 13:18:00 - [111] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Any super smart ideas? Super Smart Spawn will not spawn a unit within (X) meters of enemy. What if they exploit this? We could in Resistance. All you have to do is spread out 195% of the distance (x) over the whole map. Picture overlapping circles. All you need to do is pick a spot and remove that guy. That spot would be the only one they can spawn in. Who wants some?
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 7648	Posted - 2015.02.09 13:20:00 - [112] - Quote Stop being bad at ambush? 150 WP is very attainable through kill assists alone. "You don't want McSyphilis. Don't nobody want McSyphilis." - One Eyed King
Adipem Nothi nos nothi 6524	Posted - 2015.02.09 13:26:00 - [113] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Stop being bad at ambush? 150 WP is very attainable through kill assists alone. Depends upon how badly matchmaking/mu performed. It is not uncommon for the stomp side to lose fewer than 10 clones by match end. Not many assists to go around. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Adipem Nothi nos nothi 6524	Posted - 2015.02.09 13:35:00 - [114] - Quote Darken-Soul wrote: [quote=Adipem Nothi] Super Smart Spawn will not spawn a unit within (X) meters of enemy.[/quote What if they exploit this? We could in Resistance. All you have to do is spread out 195% of the distance (x) over the whole map. Picture overlapping circles. All you need to do is pick a spot and remove that guy. That spot would be the only one they can spawn in. Good point. Were Resistance's MP maps similar in size to Dust's? Most of the Ambush stomps I've played involved one blob of units farming a spawn point until it flips, then finding/farming the next. Unit proximity is what makes the blob invincible. If the units dispersed to farm multiple spawn points, the blob would become less of a blob and more vulnerable to counterattack. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Brush Master Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1438	Posted - 2015.02.09 13:36:00 - [115] - Quote Juno Tristan wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Part of the problem is you don't know where smart deploy will spawn you, it should appear as part of the countdown so you can abort if the area's being overrun Sounds like a good step. Dust Veteran. June 2012 - ? True Logi. Flying DS from the start. @dustreports
LHughes State of Purgatory General Tso's Alliance 327	Posted - 2015.02.09 13:39:00 - [116] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Let us choose where to spawn for a certain amount of WP? maybe designated areas on the map (not CRUs) That moment when you walk in on Rattati in the shower but he hasn't undressed yet He's such a tease xx
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 7648	Posted - 2015.02.09 13:42:00 - [117] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Depends upon how badly matchmaking/mu performed. It is not uncommon for the stomp side to lose fewer than 10 clones by match end. Not many assists to go around. Alternatively: don't queue for ambush because it is poop "You don't want McSyphilis. Don't nobody want McSyphilis." - One Eyed King
Michael Epic Bragian Order Amarr Empire 448	Posted - 2015.02.09 16:25:00 - [118] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Yes. I have a super smart idea.... So you have CRU's, right? You already have the coding that allows those to work from their static locations however in Ambush or Domination or Skirmish, those locations may vary. This is what you should do...you should pick pieces of the map, say rock formations or pieces of the actual sockets themselves and insert a tiny invisible CRU that spawns randomly. Pick 6 places on every Ambush map and say when 3 people spawn there, the point changes...so every 3rd spawn it changes to a different place. That would solve being able to camp a spot, that would solve everyone spawning in the blob or spawning under fire. It would solve a lot of your spawning problems in Ambush. It would work a lot like drop uplinks too but be invisible and ever changing and server generated. You would have to write the code for it to be random enough to work but you see what I am saying I'm sure.
The-Errorist 1033	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:26:00 - [119] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? If X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friendlies, just in outer rims adjacent to the person who has the least amount of deaths. Suits, Tanks, a mode
Vesta Opalus T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 399	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:36:00 - [120] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The WP minimum functions to influence vets to get off their ass and get more than 125 god damned WP. If you honestly cant get more than that you should just stop playing. Not even kidding, go find something else to have fun with that wont make you feel like you are a bumbling idiot. I cant even remember the last time I got <150WP unless I was afk eating a sandwich the whole game.

Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8592	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:39:00 - [121] - Quote Pagl1u M wrote: If a vet cant Reach 150 WP, he totally deserves to be rewarded with 0 SP, ambush or not. Because it means that that vet wasnt even trying at all. Period. Explain to me why. Sequal's Back wrote: Pagl1u M wrote: If a vet cant Reach 150 WP, he totally deserves to be rewarded with 0 SP, ambush or not. Because it means that that vet wasnt even trying at all. Period. I totally agree with you. Again, explain to me why. Adipem Nothi wrote: Would've done exactly the same thing. Insufficient incentive to play an unplayable match. Suggestion: Oops! Something went wrong with Scotty the Matchmaking AI. Your odds of successfully navigating the upcoming stomp are approximately 3,720:1. Stompees will be paid end-of-match compensation of 3000 SP, 100 Barge Components. and 300k Isk (plus face value of all gear destroyed). Do you wish to deploy? That'd make too much sense, Adipem. You know what would make even more sense then that? Tieracide, maybe meta-level limited match setups, an actual match-maker... or just removing the stupid WP minimum altogether. The hilarious part here is that I just see people saying, "Herp derp if you can't hit 150 WP you deserve 0" but no-one seems to be explaining -WHY-. I keep asking why, I keep asking the functionality, but no-one has a good answer - hell they don't have any answers, just the same trolling non-sense of, "git gud", like they've -never- had a bad match where they just got annihilated. And I -refuse- to stop arguing against it BECAUSE it doesn't have a justifiable explanation. I won't stop until someone can come in here and say, "This is why: -insert justifiable, reasonable argument as to why a player should not just stop playing because they'd be wasting their time otherwise-". What freaggin incentive do I have to even stay in the match if by 25 clones I haven't hit the minimum -already-? Why should I stay at all, if looking at the team-setups I see a whole squad of 'x' corporation that I know will be running high-end gear? Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8592	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:41:00 - [122] - Quote Vesta Opalus wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The WP minimum functions to influence vets to get off their ass and get more than 125 god damned WP. If you honestly cant get more than that you should just stop playing. Not even kidding, go find something else to have fun with that wont make you feel like you are a bumbling idiot. I cant even remember the last time I got <150WP unless I was afk eating a sandwich the whole game. And it -will- happen to you at some point. One of these days you're going to get <150WP and not get anything because the stars aligned and you got screwed over, simple as that. Try running Ambush with all militia/standard gear and come back and say that it doesn't happen. I dare you to -live stream it- if you're THAT confident that you will never -EVER- have <150WP in an Ambush match. You're going to slap yourself silly when you realize just how broken and dumb this mechanic is. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8592	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:47:00 - [123] - Quote Let me come at this from a different angle. Why stop at 150 WP? Clearly if it's to get a Veteran to get off his kitten and put forth the effort, why stop there? Why not raise it up to say... 300 WP? How about 500 WP? A veteran can easily attain 1000 WP right? Or is that too high for you guys? You can't hit 1000 WP consistently every single match you play? Maybe you shoullllllddd git gud scrub. I mean, yanno, because I can -totally- hit 1000 WP running squad leader as a Logistics suit with a gimmick fit. Even easier if I run my Madrugar and have it filled to the brim cranking out that MCRU while I've got nanohives/dropuplinks scattered all about the map. Why can't you? You guys starting to wrap your head around why this is dumb yet? Because I can go on all day with this. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Vesta Opalus T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 399	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:47:00 - [124] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Pagl1u M wrote: If a vet cant Reach 150 WP, he totally deserves to be rewarded with 0 SP, ambush or not. Because it means that that vet wasnt even trying at all. Period. Explain to me why. Sequal's Back wrote: Pagl1u M wrote: If a vet cant Reach 150 WP, he totally deserves to be rewarded with 0 SP, ambush or not. Because it means that that vet wasnt even trying at all. Period. I totally agree with you. Again, explain to me why. Adipem Nothi wrote: Would've done exactly the same thing. Insufficient incentive to play an unplayable match. Suggestion: Oops! Something went wrong with Scotty the Matchmaking AI. Your odds of successfully navigating the upcoming stomp are approximately 3,720:1. Stompees will be paid end-of-match compensation of 3000 SP, 100 Barge Components. and 300k Isk (plus face value of all gear destroyed). Do you wish to deploy? That'd make too much sense, Adipem. You know what would make even more sense then that? Tieracide, maybe meta-level limited match setups, an actual match-maker... or just removing the stupid WP minimum altogether. The hilarious part here is that I just see people saying, "Herp derp if you can't hit 150 WP you deserve 0" but no-one seems to be explaining -WHY-. I keep asking why, I keep asking the functionality, but no-one has a good answer - hell they don't have any answers, just the same trolling non-sense of, "git gud", like they've -never- had a bad match where they just got annihilated. And I -refuse- to stop arguing against it BECAUSE it doesn't have a justifiable explanation. I won't stop until someone can come in here and say, "This is why: -insert justifiable, reasonable argument as to why a player should not just stop playing because they'd be wasting their time otherwise-". What freaggin incentive do I have to even stay in the match if by 25 clones I haven't hit the minimum -already-? Why should I stay at all, if looking at the team-setups I see a whole squad of 'x' corporation that I know will be running high-end gear? In-game justification: if you dont perform your job (you're a mercenary after all), you dont get paid. Out-game justification: Learn to play and help your team. One uplink can get you like 300-400 WP if you dont place it in a moronic place, 3 kills will get you enough WP, rep tools, nanohives, hacking OMS installations, damaging vehicles, and so on and so forth. How about you justify people getting any kind of reward when they perform so badly that they can't even hit 150 WP? I might support a better system if you can think one up, but I have zero problem with a system like this being in place.
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 737	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:47:00 - [125] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: I won't stop until someone can come in here and say, "This is why: -insert justifiable, reasonable argument as to why a player should not just stop playing because they'd be wasting their time otherwise-". What freaggin incentive do I have to even stay in the match if by 25 clones I haven't hit the minimum -already-? Why should I stay at all, if looking at the team-setups I see a whole squad of 'x' corporation that I know will be running high-end gear? Because you're not the only one on the team. It's because everyone 'stops trying' that a stomp occurs, some check the player list at the start of battle and you see them do nothing. If you aren't going to try, why stay in the match, just leave it'll be better for the rest of the team. The people you don't care about putting at a disadvantage because you've taken up a player slot on the team without doing anything and yet you expect to get a reward, for doing nothing useful... Even in primary school they tell you 'it's the taking part that counts.' Sure back there it means you get a gold star just for being, but the meaning you're meant to take from it, is that you should actually take part and try to help! Why should I care if someone gets no points, for giving up and not trying, just because it's too difficult? If someone else was in that slot, sure we would likely still lose, but at least we'd be able to put up a fight. When you don't try, anything everyone else does becomes worthlessly outnumbered.
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 2082	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:48:00 - [126] - Quote Mary Sedillo wrote: They tried the pitting vets against vets thing before in matchmaking. It led to horridly under-populated matches, and ******* LONG ASS wait-times. You want to go back to that? I can't speak for closed beta but they've done no such thing since I've been here from the start of open beta. Take your stinking paws off me, you damned dirty hipster! [RYJC]
Michael Epic Bragian Order Amarr Empire 449	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:49:00 - [127] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: That'd make too much sense, Adipem. You know what would make even more sense then that? Tieracide, maybe meta-level limited match setups, an actual match-maker... or just removing the stupid WP minimum altogether. The hilarious part here is that I just see people saying, "Herp derp if you can't hit 150 WP you deserve 0" but no-one seems to be explaining -WHY-. I keep asking why, I keep asking the functionality, but no-one has a good answer - hell they don't have any answers, just the same trolling non-sense of, "git gud", like they've -never- had a bad match where they just got annihilated. And I -refuse- to stop arguing against it BECAUSE it doesn't have a justifiable explanation. I won't stop until someone can come in here and say, "This is why: -insert justifiable, reasonable argument as to why a player should not just stop playing because they'd be wasting their time otherwise-". What freaggin incentive do I have to even stay in the match if by 25 clones I haven't hit the minimum -already-? Why should I stay at all, if looking at the team-setups I see a whole squad of 'x' corporation that I know will be running high-end gear? This is why; The WP minimum is a good idea that was put in place to encourage player participation. If you are in the match and you are sitting on the side of the road in an LAV so you don't get kicked or sitting in the MCC with a rubber band on your controller so you can gain isk, you don't deserve SP or isk period. People do this...they are called AFK'ers and I am sure you know that. They not only take places of people who might actually be playing the game, but they also stress out veterans like me because when I am on the ground putting boots to asses, I have no support. I'm decent at this game and sometimes I'm a beast at this game but I am never God at this game. I cannot be every role and defend every objective and every point myself. It cannot be done. I am not a one man army. So I rely on all of you to assist me against the other 16 players on the other side. Just the same as you rely on me and if you're not going to try, I don't believe you should advance in this game because you are lazy and cowardly and no one deserves a reward for being cowardly and lazy. If you're not even going to try, why play the game? This AFK pandemic also ruins the new player experience. You have just graduated the battle academy and put into your first match with veterans and you see 9 players up in the MCC not doing anything and you are being humiliated and juggernauted and stomped to the ninth degree.....so you decide you know what? Eff this game...this game sucks, I'm going to play ___________. So the WP minimum is there for all of those reasons...and the reason why is because its what is best for Dust 514, its what is best for business and its a step in the right direction to encourage player participation and not allow a bunch of cowardly, lazy people to collect paychecks and skill points for spelunking about with their thumbs in their rectal cavities. Savvy?
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8592	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:54:00 - [128] - Quote Vesta Opalus wrote: In-game justification: if you dont perform your job (you're a mercenary after all), you dont get paid. Out-game justification: Learn to play and help your team. One uplink can get you like 300-400 WP if you dont place it in a moronic place, 3 kills will get you enough WP, rep tools, nanohives, hacking OMS installations, damaging vehicles, and so on and so forth. How about you justify people getting any kind of reward when they perform so badly that they can't even hit 150 WP? I might support a better system if you can think one up, but I have zero problem with a system like this being in place. So now we need to justify being rewarded for playing the game in the first place, in a game-mode that is -really hard- to exploit mechanics for AFK purposes..? See my last post. Why stop at 150 WP? If I were a mercenary contractor, (by the way, I'm not a mercenary just because the game says I am), I'd want the best of the best of the best. I'd set a hard limit of 1000 WP. If you can't manage that, no pay. But it isn't ISK... It's SP. You still get the ISK. You don't get the SP. It's like saying that you don't learn from the experience, that the Active Boosters are worthless because you're "not gud nuff" or because the game just decides that you deserve to be spawn camped in from the start of the match. I digress. It's a shoddy game mechanic. It's built out of vengeance and ego. There's no -real- functionality behind it other than "Well, I don't think that guy is putting forth the effort despite going 1/7 in that last match." Derpty Derp wrote: Because you're not the only one on the team. It's because everyone 'stops trying' that a stomp occurs, some check the player list at the start of battle and you see them do nothing. If you aren't going to try, why stay in the match, just leave it'll be better for the rest of the team. The people you don't care about putting at a disadvantage because you've taken up a player slot on the team without doing anything and yet you expect to get a reward, for doing nothing useful... Even in primary school they tell you 'it's the taking part that counts.' Sure back there it means you get a gold star just for being, but the meaning you're meant to take from it, is that you should actually take part and try to help! Why should I care if someone gets no points, for giving up and not trying, just because it's too difficult? If someone else was in that slot, sure we would likely still lose, but at least we'd be able to put up a fight. When you don't try, anything everyone else does becomes worthlessly outnumbered. Except you seem to miss the point here: The guy who isn't getting any SP rewards -is the guy who stayed in the match and tried ot make it work- NOT the guy who left because the competition was (reasonably speaking) too steep. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8592	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:56:00 - [129] - Quote Michael Epic wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: That'd make too much sense, Adipem. You know what would make even more sense then that? Tieracide, maybe meta-level limited match setups, an actual match-maker... or just removing the stupid WP minimum altogether. The hilarious part here is that I just see people saying, "Herp derp if you can't hit 150 WP you deserve 0" but no-one seems to be explaining -WHY-. I keep asking why, I keep asking the functionality, but no-one has a good answer - hell they don't have any answers, just the same trolling non-sense of, "git gud", like they've -never- had a bad match where they just got annihilated. And I -refuse- to stop arguing against it BECAUSE it doesn't have a justifiable explanation. I won't stop until someone can come in here and say, "This is why: -insert justifiable, reasonable argument as to why a player should not just stop playing because they'd be wasting their time otherwise-". What freaggin incentive do I have to even stay in the match if by 25 clones I haven't hit the minimum -already-? Why should I stay at all, if looking at the team-setups I see a whole squad of 'x' corporation that I know will be running high-end gear? This is why; The WP minimum is a good idea that was put in place to encourage player participation. If you are in the match and you are sitting on the side of the road in an LAV so you don't get kicked or sitting in the MCC with a rubber band on your controller so you can gain isk, you don't deserve SP or isk period. People do this...they are called AFK'ers and I am sure you know that. They not only take places of people who might actually be playing the game, but they also stress out veterans like me because when I am on the ground putting boots to asses, I have no support. I'm decent at this game and sometimes I'm a beast at this game but I am never God at this game. I cannot be every role and defend every objective and every point myself. It cannot be done. I am not a one man army. So I rely on all of you to assist me against the other 16 players on the other side. Just the same as you rely on me and if you're not going to try, I don't believe you should advance in this game because you are lazy and cowardly and no one deserves a reward for being cowardly and lazy. If you're not even going to try, why play the game? This AFK pandemic also ruins the new player experience. You have just graduated the battle academy and put into your first match with veterans and you see 9 players up in the MCC not doing anything and you are being humiliated and juggernauted and stomped to the ninth degree.....so you decide you know what? Eff this game...this game sucks, I'm going to play ___________. So the WP minimum is there for all of those reasons...and the reason why is because its what is best for Dust 514, its what is best for business and its a step in the right direction to encourage player participation and not allow a bunch of cowardly, lazy people to collect paychecks and skill points for spelunking about with their thumbs in their rectal cavities. Savvy? Dude, what part of -AMBUSH- don't you understand? Again with this "it's to stop AFK pandemic" non-sense, no-one is going to AFK in Ambush and if they did they'd just -DIE- because we would find them and -murder- them for the easy kills. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
RayRay James State of Purgatory General Tso's Alliance 987	Posted - 2015.02.09 18:57:00 - [130] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Pagl1u M wrote: If a vet cant Reach 150 WP, he totally deserves to be rewarded with 0 SP, ambush or not. Because it means that that vet wasnt even trying at all. Period. Explain to me why. Sequal's Back wrote: Pagl1u M wrote: If a vet cant Reach 150 WP, he totally deserves to be rewarded with 0 SP, ambush or not. Because it means that that vet wasnt even trying at all. Period. I totally agree with you. Again, explain to me why. Adipem Nothi wrote: Would've done exactly the same thing. Insufficient incentive to play an unplayable match. Suggestion: Oops! Something went wrong with Scotty the Matchmaking AI. Your odds of successfully navigating the upcoming stomp are approximately 3,720:1. Stompees will be paid end-of-match compensation of 3000 SP, 100 Barge Components. and 300k Isk (plus face value of all gear destroyed). Do you wish to deploy? That'd make too much sense, Adipem. You know what would make even more sense then that? Tieracide, maybe meta-level limited match setups, an actual match-maker... or just removing the stupid WP minimum altogether. The hilarious part here is that I just see people saying, "Herp derp if you can't hit 150 WP you deserve 0" but no-one seems to be explaining -WHY-. I keep asking why, I keep asking the functionality, but no-one has a good answer - hell they don't have any answers, just the same trolling non-sense of, "git gud", like they've -never- had a bad match where they just got annihilated. And I -refuse- to stop arguing against it BECAUSE it doesn't have a justifiable explanation. I won't stop until someone can come in here and say, "This is why: -insert justifiable, reasonable argument as to why a player should not just stop playing because they'd be wasting their time otherwise-". What freaggin incentive do I have to even stay in the match if by 25 clones I haven't hit the minimum -already-? Why should I stay at all, if looking at the team-setups I see a whole squad of 'x' corporation that I know will be running high-end gear? You keep asking for why? Here's my opinion The 150 WP minimum is for Vets only. I'm unaware of what the level is the constituted a vet, but I've heard it range anywhere from 10 mil SP to 30 Mil SP. For the sake of argument, let's split that number and call it 20 Mil SP With 20 mil sp, you have been playing for a while. You understand the game mechanics, how weapons affect suits (and vice versa) you understand the roles of suits, the differences in races and have played more than enough matches to take that knowledge and apply it appropriately. With the combination of that knowledge and experience, and as a vet, you have to TRY and not get 150 WP if you're actively playing. Kills, Assists, Links, reps, hives, needles, scans, hacking (no ambush obviously), etc all give you the ability to get anywhere from +5 SP (killing enemy equipment) to +100 SP (Hacking) even +150 if you manage to kill a tank. With all of the options afforded to you to get SP, 150 is not a tough barrier to crack. Since this was implemented, I have in ONE MATCH not hit the 150 WP and that was because the match was nearly over before I joined the fight. I did still manage to get 125 WP. I got isk, I got not skill points, so i pulled up my big boy pants and deployed into another match. That is the answer to "Why?"

Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8595	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:02:00 - [131] - Quote RayRay James wrote: You keep asking for why? Here's my opinion The 150 WP minimum is for Vets only. I'm unaware of what the level is the constituted a vet, but I've heard it range anywhere from 10 mil SP to 30 Mil SP. For the sake of argument, let's split that number and call it 20 Mil SP With 20 mil sp, you have been playing for a while. You understand the game mechanics, how weapons affect suits (and vice versa) you understand the roles of suits, the differences in races and have played more than enough matches to take that knowledge and apply it appropriately. With the combination of that knowledge and experience, and as a vet, you have to TRY and not get 150 WP if you're actively playing. Kills, Assists, Links, reps, hives, needles, scans, hacking (no ambush obviously), etc all give you the ability to get anywhere from +5 SP (killing enemy equipment) to +100 SP (Hacking) even +150 if you manage to kill a tank. With all of the options afforded to you to get SP, 150 is not a tough barrier to crack. Since this was implemented, I have in ONE MATCH not hit the 150 WP and that was because the match was nearly over before I joined the fight. I did still manage to get 125 WP. I got isk, I got not skill points, so i pulled up my big boy pants and deployed into another match. That is the answer to "Why?" Copy and paste that entire text, attach it in an e-mail, and send it to the 13 players on the enemy team who got screwed over in this video that I posted. You telling me 13 people didn't put forth the effort? You telling me that their entire team only killing -EIGHT PEOPLE- they'd manage to get the assists and necessary warpoints, in five minutes, it should be fair that the veterans on their team basically just wasted their time? Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Vesta Opalus T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 399	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:15:00 - [132] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Vesta Opalus wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The WP minimum functions to influence vets to get off their ass and get more than 125 god damned WP. If you honestly cant get more than that you should just stop playing. Not even kidding, go find something else to have fun with that wont make you feel like you are a bumbling idiot. I cant even remember the last time I got <150WP unless I was afk eating a sandwich the whole game. And it -will- happen to you at some point. One of these days you're going to get <150WP and not get anything because the stars aligned and you got screwed over, simple as that. Try running Ambush with all militia/standard gear and come back and say that it doesn't happen. I dare you to -live stream it- if you're THAT confident that you will never -EVER- have <150WP in an Ambush match. You're going to slap yourself silly when you realize just how broken and dumb this mechanic is. My alt is 100% invested in vehicles and has to run normal ambushes in starter gear/militia suits. I may have gotten <150 WP in a match but I dont remember it. Even in starter suits, it is not difficult for a vet player who knows what they are doing to get 150. I dont know about you but I have no problem not getting SP when I do nothing for the team, even if it is an outlier in terms of performance. Aeon Amadi wrote: So now we need to justify being rewarded for playing the game in the first place, in a game-mode that is -really hard- to exploit mechanics for AFK purposes..? See my last post. Why stop at 150 WP? If I were a mercenary contractor, (by the way, I'm not a mercenary just because the game says I am), I'd want the best of the best of the best. I'd set a hard limit of 1000 WP. If you can't manage that, no pay. But it isn't ISK... It's SP. You still get the ISK. You don't get the SP. It's like saying that you don't learn from the experience, that the Active Boosters are worthless because you're "not gud nuff" or because the game just decides that you deserve to be spawn camped in from the start of the match. I digress. It's a shoddy game mechanic. It's built out of vengeance and ego. There's no -real- functionality behind it other than "Well, I don't think that guy is putting forth the effort despite going 1/7 in that last match." The reward for playing a game is having fun, the mechanics of the game or in game rewards can take away or add to that, so its up to you to decide if playing the game is fun or not. If it isnt fun I would suggest not playing it. I dont see how its hard to afk in ambush game mode, all you have to do is keep spawning in. I've seen more jumping afk starter AV fits in ambush than any other game mode. Why stop at 150 WP? I dunno, you can make an argument for whatever you want, the specific number might seem to high or too low, I think 150 WP is fair enough and I rarely see anyone who isnt running around aimlessly or sitting around afk get less than that. It penalizes SP over ISK because: ISK is the fuel that keeps a clone running, penalizing ISK would make it harder to run dropsuits in the future, thus creating a negative performance feedback resulting in worse and worse chances to make the WP minimum, SP penalty just leaves you where you were before the match. ISK is not relevant to many players, and most people dont afk in matches to win ISK. SP is the number that means something to the players behind the clone, so you have to penalize that number to make anything stick. As for being spawn ****** by ambush, or the WP minimum being a shoddy mechanic in generally: I agree. This is CCP we're talking about here, and Im not sure why anyone ever queues up for ambush without expecting to be screwed over every once and a while. And again, if you can suggest something better I'd be all for it (but I dont think having no minimum at all is better).
Shadowswipe Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 255	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:15:00 - [133] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? If deaths are too high in one area, stop spawning one guy in at a time. Instead, make it a rising threshold to spawn all teammates at the same time. This way, if a team is getting slaughtered by one at at time spawning on teammates, then instead it will be a big force all at once and hopefully be able to break the spawn/death cycle due to numbers. Or allow people to pick general spawn areas. Or air drop people if there are too many deaths on the ground. Or Orbital the area to clear the rapid spawn/death area. A "screw it, our guys are losing anyways, at least we know there are lots of enemies in the area.
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8595	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:20:00 - [134] - Quote Vesta Opalus wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Vesta Opalus wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Nothing like running ADV/Proto gear against a proto-stomp team in Ambush only to come out with 125 WP and not get any SP for the match. Just shelling out ISK for nothing at this point. Under current mechanics, none of these people would have received SP: http://i.imgur.com/x5zqCs0.png http://i.imgur.com/r1OsMSi.png http://i.imgur.com/XIbZFiZ.png YOU -WILL- READ THE BELOW BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The question you have to ask is: What meaningful function does the WP Minimum implement? What is it supposed to do, who is it supposed to affect, and who gets caught the crossfire unnecessarily? If the WP Minimum was implemented to keep people from AFKing, then Ambush shouldn't be in the equation because it's nigh impossible to AFK through an Ambush. YOU -WILL- READ THE ABOVE BEFORE MAKING COMMENTS The WP minimum functions to influence vets to get off their ass and get more than 125 god damned WP. If you honestly cant get more than that you should just stop playing. Not even kidding, go find something else to have fun with that wont make you feel like you are a bumbling idiot. I cant even remember the last time I got <150WP unless I was afk eating a sandwich the whole game. And it -will- happen to you at some point. One of these days you're going to get <150WP and not get anything because the stars aligned and you got screwed over, simple as that. Try running Ambush with all militia/standard gear and come back and say that it doesn't happen. I dare you to -live stream it- if you're THAT confident that you will never -EVER- have <150WP in an Ambush match. You're going to slap yourself silly when you realize just how broken and dumb this mechanic is. My alt is 100% invested in vehicles and has to run normal ambushes in starter gear/militia suits. I may have gotten <150 WP in a match but I dont remember it. Even in starter suits, it is not difficult for a vet player who knows what they are doing to get 150. I dont know about you but I have no problem not getting SP when I do nothing for the team, even if it is an outlier in terms of performance. Aeon Amadi wrote: So now we need to justify being rewarded for playing the game in the first place, in a game-mode that is -really hard- to exploit mechanics for AFK purposes..? See my last post. Why stop at 150 WP? If I were a mercenary contractor, (by the way, I'm not a mercenary just because the game says I am), I'd want the best of the best of the best. I'd set a hard limit of 1000 WP. If you can't manage that, no pay. But it isn't ISK... It's SP. You still get the ISK. You don't get the SP. It's like saying that you don't learn from the experience, that the Active Boosters are worthless because you're "not gud nuff" or because the game just decides that you deserve to be spawn camped in from the start of the match. I digress. It's a shoddy game mechanic. It's built out of vengeance and ego. There's no -real- functionality behind it other than "Well, I don't think that guy is putting forth the effort despite going 1/7 in that last match." The reward for playing a game is having fun, the mechanics of the game or in game rewards can take away or add to that, so its up to you to decide if playing the game is fun or not. If it isnt fun I would suggest not playing it. I dont see how its hard to afk in ambush game mode, all you have to do is keep spawning in. I've seen more jumping afk starter AV fits in ambush than any other game mode. Why stop at 150 WP? I dunno, you can make an argument for whatever you want, the specific number might seem to high or too low, I think 150 WP is fair enough and I rarely see anyone who isnt running around aimlessly or sitting around afk get less than that. It penalizes SP over ISK because: ISK is the fuel that keeps a clone running, penalizing ISK would make it harder to run dropsuits in the future, thus creating a negative performance feedback resulting in worse and worse chances to make the WP minimum, SP penalty just leaves you where you were before the match. ISK is not relevant to many players, and most people dont afk in matches to win ISK. SP is the number that means something to the players behind the clone, so you have to penalize that number to make anything stick. As for being spawn **** by ambush, or the WP minimum being a shoddy mechanic in generally: I agree. This is CCP we're talking about here, and Im not sure why anyone ever queues up for ambush without expecting to be screwed over every once and a while. And again, if you can suggest something better I'd be all for it (but I dont think having no minimum at all is better). So you believe that players should deal with being screwed over by a spawn system you admit is shoddy... and a gameplay mechanic you admit is shoddy... because we have no other viable option besides -not- screwing them over. I think we're done here. Be sure to watch the video I posted above, maybe weigh in on your (somewhat elitest) perspective a bit. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? Founder of AIV**
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8595	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:24:00 - [135] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Dude, if the solution to fixing the Minimum WP gimmick is to invest time and effort into fixing the spawn system; just make it like any other game and have the teams spawn on opposite sides of one another, switching sides as they gain more ground. Throw up some turrets for each side to defend with. S'the way every other FPS does it, other than lower player counts and random spawns. But every other FPS doesn't have to worry about -not- getting SP at the end of the match or losing ISK to constantly being massacred. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Vesta Opalus T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 400	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:25:00 - [136] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: RayRay James wrote: You keep asking for why? Here's my opinion The 150 WP minimum is for Vets only. I'm unaware of what the level is the constituted a vet, but I've heard it range anywhere from 10 mil SP to 30 Mil SP. For the sake of argument, let's split that number and call it 20 Mil SP With 20 mil sp, you have been playing for a while. You understand the game mechanics, how weapons affect suits (and vice versa) you understand the roles of suits, the differences in races and have played more than enough matches to take that knowledge and apply it appropriately. With the combination of that knowledge and experience, and as a vet, you have to TRY and not get 150 WP if you're actively playing. Kills, Assists, Links, reps, hives, needles, scans, hacking (no ambush obviously), etc all give you the ability to get anywhere from +5 SP (killing enemy equipment) to +100 SP (Hacking) even +150 if you manage to kill a tank. With all of the options afforded to you to get SP, 150 is not a tough barrier to crack. Since this was implemented, I have in ONE MATCH not hit the 150 WP and that was because the match was nearly over before I joined the fight. I did still manage to get 125 WP. I got isk, I got not skill points, so i pulled up my big boy pants and deployed into another match. That is the answer to "Why?" Copy and paste that entire text, attach it in an e-mail, and send it to the 13 players on the enemy team who got screwed over in this video that I posted. You telling me 13 people didn't put forth the effort? You telling me that their entire team only killing -EIGHT PEOPLE- they'd manage to get the assists and necessary warpoints, in five minutes, it should be fair that the veterans on their team basically just wasted their time? Looks horrible, but I'd blame matchmaking here, not the WP minimum. That said, I've been saying if you have a better system, speak up. Maybe we could add in a rule to the WP minimum that goes something like this: If more than half the team fails to meet the minimum, dont penalize anyone. But again removing the minimum is not a solution just because theres one game out of 100 that is such a brutal stomp that the other team genuinely did not have the chance to make the minimum WP.
Roy Ventus Axis of Chaos 1866	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:27:00 - [137] - Quote I can't completely believe that someone wearing ADV/PRO gear would get less than 300 WP in a match. That means no kills, no support, no nothing. Unless the game has changed drastically, it was pretty easy to get past 150 WP on your own. I mean, I understand that newbs end up getting smacked around because of this, but then if they were well taught enough, they would end up getting enough points right? "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." http://royventus.tumblr.com
Vesta Opalus T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 400	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:38:00 - [138] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: So you believe that players should deal with being screwed over by a spawn system you admit is shoddy... and a gameplay mechanic you admit is shoddy... because we have no other viable option besides -not- screwing them over. I think we're done here. Be sure to watch the video I posted above, maybe weigh in on your (somewhat elitest) perspective a bit. No I dont believe players should deal with being screwed over by the ambush spawn system. Thats why I rarely play it. I dont understand why other people do play it to be honest, but this is apparently the spawn system we are stuck with, and people playing ambush should expect to be ****** over by it in the long run. And again, the WP mechanic is pretty flat and unforgiving, but again, if you have suggestions Im 100% open to improving it. RE: Elitist. I don't think theres anything at all elitist about wanting everyone on the team to put forth some effort to achieve a common goal. If anything thats a populist position. But hey opinions may vary.
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 7661	Posted - 2015.02.09 20:17:00 - [139] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Let me come at this from a different angle. Why stop at 150 WP? Clearly if it's to get a Veteran to get off his kitten and put forth the effort, why stop there? Why not raise it up to say... 300 WP? How about 500 WP? A veteran can easily attain 1000 WP right? Or is that too high for you guys? You can't hit 1000 WP consistently every single match you play? Maybe you shoullllllddd git gud scrub. I mean, yanno, because I can -totally- hit 1000 WP running squad leader as a Logistics suit with a gimmick fit. Even easier if I run my Madrugar and have it filled to the brim cranking out that MCRU while I've got nanohives/dropuplinks scattered all about the map. Why can't you? You guys starting to wrap your head around why this is dumb yet? Because I can go on all day with this. Attainable with little effort vs. Difficult to attain. Stop comparing apples to clydesdales. "You don't want McSyphilis. Don't nobody want McSyphilis." - One Eyed King
RayRay James State of Purgatory General Tso's Alliance 987	Posted - 2015.02.09 21:29:00 - [140] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: RayRay James wrote: You keep asking for why? Here's my opinion The 150 WP minimum is for Vets only. I'm unaware of what the level is the constituted a vet, but I've heard it range anywhere from 10 mil SP to 30 Mil SP. For the sake of argument, let's split that number and call it 20 Mil SP With 20 mil sp, you have been playing for a while. You understand the game mechanics, how weapons affect suits (and vice versa) you understand the roles of suits, the differences in races and have played more than enough matches to take that knowledge and apply it appropriately. With the combination of that knowledge and experience, and as a vet, you have to TRY and not get 150 WP if you're actively playing. Kills, Assists, Links, reps, hives, needles, scans, hacking (no ambush obviously), etc all give you the ability to get anywhere from +5 SP (killing enemy equipment) to +100 SP (Hacking) even +150 if you manage to kill a tank. With all of the options afforded to you to get SP, 150 is not a tough barrier to crack. Since this was implemented, I have in ONE MATCH not hit the 150 WP and that was because the match was nearly over before I joined the fight. I did still manage to get 125 WP. I got isk, I got not skill points, so i pulled up my big boy pants and deployed into another match. That is the answer to "Why?" Copy and paste that entire text, attach it in an e-mail, and send it to the 13 players on the enemy team who got screwed over in this video that I posted. You telling me 13 people didn't put forth the effort? You telling me that their entire team only killing -EIGHT PEOPLE- they'd manage to get the assists and necessary warpoints, in five minutes, it should be fair that the veterans on their team basically just wasted their time? My assumption would be that those people probably aren't above the 'veteran' cutoff and it therefore didn't matter. If they ARE above the 'veteran' cutoff, then yes, I concur they didn't do enough or got steamrolled by game mechanics. EDIT: Also, stop saying they wasted their time. While not ideal, they did at least get some isk to compensate for their time.

Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8607	Posted - 2015.02.09 23:33:00 - [141] - Quote Vesta Opalus wrote: Looks horrible, but I'd blame matchmaking here, not the WP minimum. That said, I've been saying if you have a better system, speak up. Maybe we could add in a rule to the WP minimum that goes something like this: If more than half the team fails to meet the minimum, dont penalize anyone. But again removing the minimum is not a solution just because theres one game out of 100 that is such a brutal stomp that the other team genuinely did not have the chance to make the minimum WP. Why is it not a solution, exactly..? Because you say it is? What was wrong with Ambush -before- the WP Minimum that it warranted the change..? RayRay James wrote: My assumption would be that those people probably aren't above the 'veteran' cutoff and it therefore didn't matter. If they ARE above the 'veteran' cutoff, then yes, I concur they didn't do enough or got steamrolled by game mechanics. EDIT: Also, stop saying they wasted their time. While not ideal, they did at least get some isk to compensate for their time. We'll see, whenever Eve Gate comes back up and we can search each character by their employment history and see when they were created. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
TIGER SHARK1501 Savage Bullet 147	Posted - 2015.02.10 03:18:00 - [142] - Quote Raiden246 wrote: I do agree this system should be removed, for the sake of the new player (whom apparently Rattati cares about :D ) Heck new players would be like what am I doing? I've been playing almost 2 years and its steering me away from ambush because Proto stompers will keep me from earning SP. And no comments about get gud because that doesn't solve the problem this creates
Timtron Victory Horizons' Edge 328	Posted - 2015.02.10 03:34:00 - [143] - Quote I urge the community to not buy boosters in protest ISK Weekly Lottery Proud Christian Jesus Loves You

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 16993	Posted - 2015.02.10 03:46:00 - [144] - Quote on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8612	Posted - 2015.02.10 03:49:00 - [145] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. For real..? Take one for the team..? I can't just play the game how I want to play it, now; I have to run a suit I could care less for so that I can make my minimum to actually go on to enjoying the game? Bah, don't even know why I'm fighting it, Evolve comes out in two hours anyway, not like I'm honestly going to be playing anyway. But I will be making a mental note not to play Ambush anymore. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 16994	Posted - 2015.02.10 04:00:00 - [146] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. For real..? Take one for the team..? I can't just play the game how I want to play it, now; I have to run a suit I could care less for so that I can make my minimum to actually go on to enjoying the game? Bah, don't even know why I'm fighting it, Evolve comes out in two hours anyway, not like I'm honestly going to be playing anyway. But I will be making a mental note not to play Ambush anymore. No, to help the team win... "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Kaze Eyrou DUST University Ivy League 1926	Posted - 2015.02.10 04:01:00 - [147] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Remove Ambush altogether. At least that's my knee-jerk reaction. CB Vet // Logi Bro // @KazeEyrou Kaze's Helpful Links
Timtron Victory Horizons' Edge 328	Posted - 2015.02.10 04:02:00 - [148] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. For real..? Take one for the team..? I can't just play the game how I want to play it, now; I have to run a suit I could care less for so that I can make my minimum to actually go on to enjoying the game? Bah, don't even know why I'm fighting it, Evolve comes out in two hours anyway, not like I'm honestly going to be playing anyway. But I will be making a mental note not to play Ambush anymore. No, to help the team win... You know sometimes I dont hack the objective but instead stand guard to take one for the team, but I guess I cant do that anymore since its every man for his WP haha ISK Weekly Lottery Proud Christian Jesus Loves You
Vicious Minotaur 1999	Posted - 2015.02.10 04:03:00 - [149] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: No, to help the team win... It's ambush. Every man for himself. I am a minotaur. a+üa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa+üa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça+üa+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+üa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa+üa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ë
Raptor Princess ALLOTEC INC 139	Posted - 2015.02.10 04:05:00 - [150] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. I played an ambush this week where the majority of my team did not get 150WP. The map was the production facility. We spawned around D11(in a corner). The enemy team spawned around H11. They ran to us and stopped us escaping the corner. Cloakers couldn't get out either to drop uplinks. (Also, not all vets are skilled into cloaked scouts)

Kaze Eyrou DUST University Ivy League 1926	Posted - 2015.02.10 04:05:00 - [151] - Quote RayRay James wrote: The 150 WP minimum is for Vets only. I'm unaware of what the level is the constituted a vet, but I've heard it range anywhere from 10 mil SP to 30 Mil SP. Actually, I've been told it's character age. eccentric echidna told me that his 5 million SP character got 0 SP because he is considered a "vet" even though he has a small amount of SP. CB Vet // Logi Bro // @KazeEyrou Kaze's Helpful Links
Timtron Victory Horizons' Edge 328	Posted - 2015.02.10 04:16:00 - [152] - Quote Players are spending money on boosters to get extra SP, its like biting the hand that feeds you CCP. Like others have said, AFK was to farm ISK not SP ISK Weekly Lottery Proud Christian Jesus Loves You
Adipem Nothi nos nothi 6561	Posted - 2015.02.10 04:25:00 - [153] - Quote Timtron Victory wrote: Players are spending money on boosters to get extra SP, its like biting the hand that feeds you CCP. Like others have said, AFK was to farm ISK not SP What does this even mean? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Raptor Princess ALLOTEC INC 140	Posted - 2015.02.10 05:17:00 - [154] - Quote Timtron Victory wrote: Players are spending money on boosters to get extra SP, its like biting the hand that feeds you CCP. Like others have said, AFK was to farm ISK not SP If this is the case, why not award sp but not isk for <150WP?
Phuc Yoo Charlie Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.02.10 06:13:00 - [155] - Quote Alex-ZX wrote: A system that I saw that worked pretty good was like in MAG, suppression had something like big boxes where ppl spawn and of course enemies can't get close because of the red line. make the box bigger as death rate increases
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K 1223	Posted - 2015.02.10 07:07:00 - [156] - Quote Phuc Yoo Charlie wrote: Alex-ZX wrote: A system that I saw that worked pretty good was like in MAG, suppression had something like big boxes where ppl spawn and of course enemies can't get close because of the red line. make the box bigger as death rate increases Let's all camp that big box with big guns and see what happens. Just spawn A and B team on th3 exact opposite side of the map. Mark a$$ tricks, and bags of dicks....
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8616	Posted - 2015.02.10 07:59:00 - [157] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. For real..? Take one for the team..? I can't just play the game how I want to play it, now; I have to run a suit I could care less for so that I can make my minimum to actually go on to enjoying the game? Bah, don't even know why I'm fighting it, Evolve comes out in two hours anyway, not like I'm honestly going to be playing anyway. But I will be making a mental note not to play Ambush anymore. No, to help the team win... What, slaying isn't considered an integral team mechanic in a game-mode expressly about killing the enemy team as efficiently as possible? I have to run Logi or something support-based instead of just going right for the throat and killing other players in order to attain this silly minimum WP to get my just rewards? I mean, seriously, what is the argument for function here..? It's either "git gud scrub" or "run something else". This is silly. What was broken about Ambush that required the WP Minimum? Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K 1223	Posted - 2015.02.10 08:04:00 - [158] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. For real..? Take one for the team..? I can't just play the game how I want to play it, now; I have to run a suit I could care less for so that I can make my minimum to actually go on to enjoying the game? Bah, don't even know why I'm fighting it, Evolve comes out in two hours anyway, not like I'm honestly going to be playing anyway. But I will be making a mental note not to play Ambush anymore. No, to help the team win... What, slaying isn't considered an integral team mechanic in a game-mode expressly about killing the enemy team as efficiently as possible? I have to run Logi or something support-based instead of just going right for the throat and killing other players in order to attain this silly minimum WP to get my just rewards? I mean, seriously, what is the argument for function here..? It's either "git gud scrub" or "run something else". This is silly. What was broken about Ambush that required the WP Minimum? In Ratitties defense. (Always wanted to say that.) In Ambush or other game modes the Veteran players should lead the pack, picking smarter routes and running less favorable suits To enable less able players to utilize their abilities. And efore you start barking it's because.... fk pubs. Mark a$$ tricks, and bags of dicks....
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8616	Posted - 2015.02.10 08:15:00 - [159] - Quote So, earlier I linked a video that showed 13 out of 16 players on the enemy team having gone beneath the minimum. Responses were "that's a lot of NPC corps, they're probably new players". So allow me to illustrate a point of fact. Kaze Eyrou wrote: RayRay James wrote: The 150 WP minimum is for Vets only. I'm unaware of what the level is the constituted a vet, but I've heard it range anywhere from 10 mil SP to 30 Mil SP. Actually, I've been told it's character age. eccentric echidna told me that his 5 million SP character got 0 SP because he is considered a "vet" even though he has a small amount of SP. Assuming that the above is true, the requirements to become a 'Vet' are pretty lax. Using Eve Gate we can see when a character was first created, and thereby, get a rough estimate as to whether or not they're a "vet". Let's assume for a moment that 5,000,000 SP is the minimum to achieve 'vet' status... For the record, not using boosters, that's about 5-6 weeks worth of SP cap even without boosters. So, for arguments sake, we'll say that 'vet' status is achieved after Three Months. The end of match screen of this video shows a list of players. While I can't pull up histories for all characters (because their name extends beyond the applicable limit in the EOM screen) we can look at the ones who do. Characters highlighted in bold and underlined are the ones who we can safely assume are 'vets' who did not get SP rewards. TENSHI verde - 2014.10.01 Nyrei Myrithor - 2015.02.06 juger knot - 2014.12.24 2000watts - 2014.05.11 sandy cheeks - 2015.02.04 unreal killer - 2015.02.05 Snipe T Armstong - MARCUS PEREZ - Robea Robles - 2014.04.16 Dub EZKIEL - 2014.07.12 super 514 - 2014.05.18 EmoFreerunner - ZAPBRANAGINZ - 2014.06.07 Given our criteria listed above, we can now assume that at least -SIX- people on the -SIXTEEN- man team were applicable veterans who did not receive SP from that match. AND EVEN IF THEY WEREN'T VETERANS.... Why the kitten would a bunch of newbros be placed on the same freaggin team against hardcore veterans like those listed on mine, such as the guys from Outer Heaven? Some questions, if I may: - If the six veterans above did not achieve WP minimum to receive SP rewards, why have the minimum in the first place? - If they aren't veterans, why are newbros being put on the same team against overwhelming odds? - Assuming that they would have normally been good enough to fight my team, why the bloody hell didn't they? - If the spawn system is at fault, then which would be an easier fix? The WP Minimum, or the spawn system they've been struggling with for (now) years? Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Luther Mandrix WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 433	Posted - 2015.02.10 08:46:00 - [160] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? on the map let us pick where we spawn with the cursor and hit x .Like doing a old order from the map mode. The new smart deploy will be smart because a human is doing it.

Sleepy Shadow Qualified Scrub 261	Posted - 2015.02.10 10:33:00 - [161] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. So you have to skill into scouts to play Ambush as a vet? What theGÇª? I do have a scout but I donGÇÖt see why itGÇÖs now mandatory for me to use it to get SP in a match. And even if I did, I can guarantee I get the required WPs but how about the other people? I can leach some points from people dying but screw them right? The only thing wrong with Ambush before this WP requirement was matchmaking and spawns. WP requirement didnGÇÖt fix either. So now the problems with Ambush are matchmaking, spawns and WP requirement. Good job. Yeah, not playing Ambush altogether is the best solution for me. =ƒÿ¦
Jason Pearson Legio DXIV 4376	Posted - 2015.02.10 10:36:00 - [162] - Quote I'm a vet and you do other things than just dying if you want to be good. o7

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 17032	Posted - 2015.02.10 11:12:00 - [163] - Quote Sleepy Shadow wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. So you have to skill into scouts to play Ambush as a vet? What theGÇª? I do have a scout but I donGÇÖt see why itGÇÖs now mandatory for me to use it to get SP in a match. And even if I did, I can guarantee I get the required WPs but how about the other people? I can leach some points from people dying but screw them right? The only thing wrong with Ambush before this WP requirement was matchmaking and spawns. WP requirement didnGÇÖt fix either. So now the problems with Ambush are matchmaking, spawns and WP requirement. Good job. Yeah, not playing Ambush altogether is the best solution for me. Well, if you are a slayer and can't kill anyone...the advice was because it was hard to spawn. I think a decent cloak fit is maybe 100k SP. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

duster 35000 Algintal Core Gallente Federation 228	Posted - 2015.02.10 11:14:00 - [164] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Sleepy Shadow wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. So you have to skill into scouts to play Ambush as a vet? What theGÇª? I do have a scout but I donGÇÖt see why itGÇÖs now mandatory for me to use it to get SP in a match. And even if I did, I can guarantee I get the required WPs but how about the other people? I can leach some points from people dying but screw them right? The only thing wrong with Ambush before this WP requirement was matchmaking and spawns. WP requirement didnGÇÖt fix either. So now the problems with Ambush are matchmaking, spawns and WP requirement. Good job. Yeah, not playing Ambush altogether is the best solution for me. Well, if you are a slayer and can't kill anyone...the advice was because it was hard to spawn. I think a decent cloak fit is maybe 100k SP. Most of the time, the cloak glowing is very obvious, I think it's map lighting. Choo Choo
Sleepy Shadow Qualified Scrub 262	Posted - 2015.02.10 11:36:00 - [165] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Sleepy Shadow wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. So you have to skill into scouts to play Ambush as a vet? What theGÇª? I do have a scout but I donGÇÖt see why itGÇÖs now mandatory for me to use it to get SP in a match. And even if I did, I can guarantee I get the required WPs but how about the other people? I can leach some points from people dying but screw them right? The only thing wrong with Ambush before this WP requirement was matchmaking and spawns. WP requirement didnGÇÖt fix either. So now the problems with Ambush are matchmaking, spawns and WP requirement. Good job. Yeah, not playing Ambush altogether is the best solution for me. Well, if you are a slayer and can't kill anyone...the advice was because it was hard to spawn. I think a decent cloak fit is maybe 100k SP. This match Happened on this map Our first spawn was on C 9-10, we moved up and first met the opposing team on E-F 9-10 region. We were promptly dispatched by the opposing team and we kept spawning on D 9. As we were pushed back our second mass spawn was back at our original spawn on C 9-10 but since the enemy team was at our last location (D 9) this was not a good spawn. We spawned below them and thereGÇÖs nowhere to go. They had height advantage and there is absolutely nowhere to hide in our spawn; behind us was the red line and nothing but two open roads to take, both of which were easy for the enemy team to see. Not surprisingly we were killed. Our last spawn was near the building at D 8. By this time we had lost most of our clones and yet again we had the height disadvantage. We were easy prey to the enemy team who were still standing above us. Only my first spawn was safe; all others were camped and I lived mere seconds after spawning. No amount of skill can help me when the enemy is standing above my spawn and raining bullets and grenades on me. Even if I had managed to escape with a scout it probably would have been too late to lay an Uplink as we were bleeding out clones and fast. That match did not last long. And I donGÇÖt care about ISK, I still have 290 MIL of it, I care about fair matches and an SP payout after it. Do explain what was wrong with Ambush before the WP requirement? Aeon has tried asking the same question. The WP requirement is fine for Skirmish and Domination, itGÇÖs welcome there, but for Ambush itGÇÖs a problem. =ƒÿ¦
Pagl1u M Dead Man's Game RUST415 1479	Posted - 2015.02.10 11:42:00 - [166] - Quote Read plz One of the few assaults you'll find in a PC match!
Sole Fenychs Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 607	Posted - 2015.02.10 11:52:00 - [167] - Quote Did Rattati just move over to the evil side? The issue isn't one player not getting WP. It's that the approach for secure WP is to destroy team coherency. Imagine if everyone was running uplinks out of fear of getting zero SP. If the players wisen up (...or they don't, because they don't read the secret discussions on the forums and just think that the game is broken and stop playing), they'll all use this same strategy. What will you do then? 50 clones, 16 players. How the **** do you expect everyone to earn their WP with uplinks and maybe three to ten kills in total, if it's a stomp? Do you want them to start boosting, everyone running repair Logi and using hit and run to take damage and earn WP from healing? This game mode is about killing. Not about gaming the system in the most ridiculous fashion to avoid an arbitrary restriction. I feel reminded of that one event where we had no progress indicator and we had to do stuff like hack fifty installations. It made the game completely unplayable for a few days because everyone just aimed for the event instead of playing the object. And after these few days, CCP decided to finally update the "what's new" screen, which caused a whole new wave of players discovering the same thing. Right now it almost sounds like you want to make Ambush into a permanent instance of that event.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 6574	Posted - 2015.02.10 13:19:00 - [168] - Quote Observation WP Limit / Smart Spawn problems are only problems when the Ambush match is a stomp. Optimal Solution Cure Ambush Stomps and WP Limit / Smart Spawn problems will resolve on their own. This could be accomplished by holding Super Mu squads in queue until suitable opponent becomes available. This could also be accomplished by reducing squad size to 4. There are many who think reduced squad size will not help matchmaking; we could prove that it does (or doesn't) through a "trial run" in Ambush. Interim Solution Check the roster for Bad Scotties before deploying. If Bad Scottied, leave battle. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Mortishai Belmont G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance 498	Posted - 2015.02.10 14:11:00 - [169] - Quote The fact of the matter, is it's only implemented against newer players, people who have been around long enough should know how to toss down an uplink, nano hive, grab a rep tool, hack an objective, hack any installation, get an assist, or find a way to get 150 WP, all of those do not involve a direct kill. It's supposed to get people to try to help out in the game rather then going AFK, though it still seems people just get the 150 and do AFK anyway :c G.L.O.R.Y Soldier, I'm that Amarr heavy you warn your team about <3 -Heavy/Logi/Assault/Scout-
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 6575	Posted - 2015.02.10 14:25:00 - [170] - Quote Mortishai Belmont wrote: The fact of the matter, is it's only implemented against newer players ... Thought newer players were immune to Min(WP). (?) Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley

Mortishai Belmont G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance 499	Posted - 2015.02.10 15:39:00 - [171] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Mortishai Belmont wrote: The fact of the matter, is it's only implemented against newer players ... Thought newer players were immune to Min(WP). (?) Oops, wrote that wrong, it was early and my coffee hadn't hit my brain yet :c G.L.O.R.Y Soldier, I'm that Amarr heavy you warn your team about <3 -Heavy/Logi/Assault/Scout-
Mortishai Belmont G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance 500	Posted - 2015.02.10 15:49:00 - [172] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? I would say made smaller area maps, have each team spawn behind cover in their redline, so even if they are getting camped they can have a chance to run out to the flanks or shoot from behind cover. It would seem simple compared to how it is now, even if they are being camped, the enemy team can't fully control all three ways out of the redline, right, middle, and left. Smaller area maps would help with TTK, being spawned behind redline and cover would prevent instant kills and pure spawning bad luck, and reduce the amount of work and calculation for random spawning. It would be even better for city maps, so basically the main battle field would be in the city, the redline starting at the entrances (half and half to each team gets t least 3 entry points.), even if you are camped, the enemy will be in a door way and would discourage camping due to high casualties in an enclosed area. G.L.O.R.Y Soldier, I'm that Amarr heavy you warn your team about <3 -Heavy/Logi/Assault/Scout-
Avallo Kantor 441	Posted - 2015.02.10 16:54:00 - [173] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? Is it possible to tell how many hostiles are in an area when determining spawn? (As you can with friendlies) One idea is to run two checks: 1) Is this a good spawn for player's team? [Using your current spawn mechanic] 2) Is this a good spawn for other team [Using current spawn mechanic, assuming assuming player is on other team] If you get a good result for both, it is bad. (If 1 is bad, don't bother checking for 2) If that doesn't work, (No good spots that meet 1 but not 2) then spawn on a socket that has a min range of X from any spawn spots that meet 2. [Aka don't spawn them in a socket that is within enemy team] The basic thrust of the idea is that you should make the spawning system take into account the current equation for both teams. As to the don't spawn on deaths do it as a comparative ratio between the teams in the last X second interval.
Orion Sanjeet Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 272	Posted - 2015.02.10 17:59:00 - [174] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? The problem with smart spawn is that there are too many variables to take into account to provide a safe spawn. A simple fix would be to split the map into quadrants, or even into 8 or 10 pieces, after you die you can just select one of those sectors of map and you will spawn randomly in that sector, to prevent spawns of an enemy team is an area where your team is just add if x (higher than 2 to prevent automatically knowing where snipers are)or more in sector, cannot spawn within one sector of that location. Now that would give a really good idea on where the enemy would be but this is ambush, Also give sector spawn an increased time to spawn to incentivise use of player equipment. So instead of you tying to come up with clever programming Ebola makes me feel all warm and squishy inside.
Ku Shala UNITED MERCINARY AND PILOTS ALLIANCE 1228	Posted - 2015.02.10 18:07:00 - [175] - Quote solution to ambush smart deploy, npc uplinks spawn (in strategic places decided by the intelligent devs) with the scan radius you can decide if it is safe or not and the enemy has some extra wp laying around to shoot *-¦a+ó a+ú-Æa+äla+ä (CK-0 Specialist)* Caldari Loyalist Superior technology will privale.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10993	Posted - 2015.02.10 18:25:00 - [176] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. For real..? Take one for the team..? I can't just play the game how I want to play it, now; I have to run a suit I could care less for so that I can make my minimum to actually go on to enjoying the game? Bah, don't even know why I'm fighting it, Evolve comes out in two hours anyway, not like I'm honestly going to be playing anyway. But I will be making a mental note not to play Ambush anymore. Actually, even a Federation 'Serpent' Scout or any other light suit with a militia spawn uplink can ensure you have enough WPs early on. Do the math. It doesn't really take that much to prepare even for a player who has no SP invested in scouts. Assuming a single militia uplink has about 10 spawns available multiplied by 25 WPs per spawn will yield at least 250 WPs. You need only about 150-200 WPs to get the minimum needed. And yes, I often do take one for the team in this situation and sometimes even run a proto scout with R-9 uplinks for greater effect. Then I spawn in a Federation 'Serpent' Scout and deploy one more uplink due to the suit's 12MB/s bandwidth and still reap the benefits from the R-9 uplinks. Profit. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 743	Posted - 2015.02.10 18:32:00 - [177] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Any super smart ideas? Another stupid idea... Can your guys create a simple AI to control an mCRU fitted dropship/tank? The dropship's could hover at the flight ceiling moving around the map, now anyone can drop out anywhere the dropship goes. Make sure the pilot seat is 'filled' so trolls can't spawn > switch to pilot > dump in the redzone. You could extend this idea to allow small turrets on the dropships, so while people fight it out on the ground, up in the air people can sit on the turret and try to pop the enemy dropship (or enemies jumping out of it.) When the dropship is downed you're stuck with the 'stupid deploy' until a fresh dropship is 'spawned.' As much of a hassle as this may be to create, you have mentioned wanting new players able to experience vehicle play. With these AI controlled vehicles they can literally spawn in and get on a turret to see what all the fuss is about, without ruining someones day. Don't ask about the tank, it's an afterthought for the new player base, I imagine anything within AV range is going to get used as a wp pinata (which in a bad way would overcompensates for the problem.) Sleepy Shadow wrote: So you have to skill into scouts to play Ambush as a vet? What theGÇª? You take Rattiti's advice too literally. Yes spec into a scout if you want to run faster than the enemy scouts (which shouldn't pose much of a threat on their own anyway.) But You don't really have to outrun the enemy, just your team-mates... Or should we say cannon fodder. These 'brave' clones will take several for your team, getting 0 wp in a match and whining about it on a forum, just so they can distract the enemy team from the guys who knew it was best to perform a 'strategic retreat.' Sleepy Shadow wrote: I do have a scout but I donGÇÖt see why itGÇÖs now mandatory for me to use it to get SP in a match. And even if I did, I can guarantee I get the required WPs but how about the other people? I can leach some points from people dying but screw them right? Technically, you're not screwing them over, you're helping them avoid getting stomped on the spawn, by giving them somewhere safe to spawn after they stand still and get shot the first time. Timtron Victory wrote: You know sometimes I dont hack the objective but instead stand guard to take one for the team, but I guess I cant do that anymore since its every man for his WP haha If you're finding an objective in Ambush, then there really is a problem with Ambush!
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 8644	Posted - 2015.02.10 21:38:00 - [178] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Sleepy Shadow wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: on Ambush. If you are a vet, it is fairly easy take a cloak scout with a drop uplink, cloak, run to a safe space, drop the link and regroup. Take one for the team. I have done that quite a few times. Not only does it encourage people to do the same, but gives you a fighting chance. the 6 spawns should give the 150 you need. Even if we need to fix ambush, it's still sound advice. So you have to skill into scouts to play Ambush as a vet? What theGÇª? I do have a scout but I donGÇÖt see why itGÇÖs now mandatory for me to use it to get SP in a match. And even if I did, I can guarantee I get the required WPs but how about the other people? I can leach some points from people dying but screw them right? The only thing wrong with Ambush before this WP requirement was matchmaking and spawns. WP requirement didnGÇÖt fix either. So now the problems with Ambush are matchmaking, spawns and WP requirement. Good job. Yeah, not playing Ambush altogether is the best solution for me. Well, if you are a slayer and can't kill anyone...the advice was because it was hard to spawn. I think a decent cloak fit is maybe 100k SP. Not going to misquote a dev but that really comes off as saying that if I want my SP reward I should roll something MORE VIABLE THAN WHAT I CURRENTLY ROLL EVEN THOUGH THAT ROLE IS SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED FOR SLAYING and you should seriously consider the balancing mechanics of that if you are serious in that suggestion =P Adipem Nothi wrote: Observation WP Limit & Smart Spawn problems are only problems when the Ambush match is a stomp. They are more symptoms secondary to a larger problem with Scotty. Optimal Solution Cure Ambush Stomps and WP Limit & Smart Spawn problems will resolve on their own. This could be accomplished by holding Super Mu squads in queue until suitable opponent becomes available. This could also be accomplished by reducing squad size to 4. There are many who think reduced squad size will not help matchmaking; we could prove that it does (or doesn't) through a "trial run" in Ambush. Interim Solution Check the roster for Bad Scotties before deploying. If Bad Scottied, leave battle and try again. So, naturally, as far as solutions to a problem go... We can roll back the WP Minimum (probably with a hotfix) or we wait a few months to tackle the major issues that have persisted since Dust 514 was playable by anyone other than Devs. .... and you choose the longer, harder route? Why? Aeon Amadi wrote: This super awesome evidence that I gave that everyone ignored I love how everyone just grazed over this. What, because now that I've actually proven that this does apply to -multiple veterans at a time- we're just going to change the topic? No, I refuse >=\ Seriously, dudes, I really don't understand the premise here. I've given evidence that this WP minimum affects "veterans" who actually play the game instead of AFKing and the only response is to start up troll threads (git gud/uninstall), wait months for CCP to finally get Ambush spawning down, or proposals that the players in question completely change their playstyle to ensure they hit the minimum. There is a very simple solution -RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF YOU- that can be done quickly and efficiently: Kill the WP Minimum. AFKers are going to AFK, you will -never- stop that. The only people that this is going to harm are the people that actually play this kittening game, why is it so hard for you to understand that? We don't need all the bureaucracy to fix something -that wasn't broken-. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
Mahal Daj Mahal Tactical Enterprises 128	Posted - 2015.02.10 22:03:00 - [179] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I think you just hate ambush? We tried to fix ambush spawn mechanics, which were random, more like BF/COD, just spawn away in the distance, but then the blob was invincible. The current mechanic tries to put you close to the hub of your teammates, but if they are being massacred, it's not good either. Then we get into "if X deaths in area, then not spawn close to friends, just in outer rims", and that isn't easy either. Any super smart ideas? 1) Add a distance travelled system to the anti-AFK farmer system? You often score low when you try to break the spear of the blob. 1000 meters covered gives you access to the match rewards even if you were under 150 WP? 2) Make Squad Leader Marks visible to everyone on the team (in ambush) so that you can at least get oriented. 3) Start ambush with a few uplinks and nanohives on the ground, so that there if one team is steamrolled, they fall back to their start point and have a minor advantage over the team that left the assets behind. 4) Allow the option to autodeploy to the Smart-Deploy location instead of the uplinks that are dropped in horrible places (if you ever wonder why you lost... it was that one guy with a needle and terrible uplinks) 5) Use a 30 second Smart Deploy when the whole team is dead to another location to allow a fresh start together. 6) knowing is half the battle in Dust, so maybe when the last merc gets killed, drop a radial scan in that area A&B) There's some ideas! Ewar Orbital Support for 1000 WP, you can suppress an area for 10 db, or scan an area at the advanced level. $) or you can just take your lickin', dust off your boots and win the next one... because the last thing that benefits this game is the golden-spoon for all players. See my Post on Crashes: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2413361#post2413361
CLONE117 True Pros Forever 885	Posted - 2015.02.10 22:22:00 - [180] - Quote redesign the whole game mode instead?. lets make it interesting say 2 bases on opposite ends of the map. with vehicles and everything else. and y not makes these bases safe havens as well. and make sure it is difficult to take over to keep from redlining lets add some extremely powerful turrets in good strategic locations at said base so it would be difficult to attack. and make the middle area of the map that no mans land where all the primary fighting occurs. idk. but that wp minimum should go. lets go find the reason why they afk this game in the first place. and then solve that problem instead of coming up with ways that will create more reasons to afk. if only we could pilot the mcc. id end the matches real quick.



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