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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 11 post(s)

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15294	Posted - 2015.01.21 03:38:00 - [1351] - Quote Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2710	Posted - 2015.01.21 03:47:00 - [1352] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Just for clarification, what do you mean by undebateable? click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15294	Posted - 2015.01.21 03:53:00 - [1353] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Just for clarification, what do you mean by undebateable? The true meta, not some opinionated ideas that result in arguing. FOTM, PC fit, whatever you call it. The fit noone calls stupid. That fit. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Golden Day Y.A.M.A.H 883	Posted - 2015.01.21 03:54:00 - [1354] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Just for clarification, what do you mean by undebateable? The true meta, not some opinionated ideas that result in arguing. FOTM, PC fit, whatever you call it. The fit noone calls stupid. That fit. The fits that were used commonly in 1.8??? HAHAHAHA Im not crazy......
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2710	Posted - 2015.01.21 03:56:00 - [1355] - Quote True Adamance wrote: There is a reason historically tanks have not been fitted with short range rapid firing turrets. This is because they cannot penetrate the armours of the vehicles they are targeting unless they have significant force, power, etc behind them. Even accounting that the projectile being fired is a small amount of plasma we are talking super dense materials, specialised armour designs,technologies which harden the armour and shielding, graphine based technologies in incredibly advanced manners etc. There is quite literally no justification in using a smaller calibre rapid firing turret when a larger calibre comparatively slower firing weapons achieves a better result. Now I'm not saying that all turrets are going to be exactly the same, that would be pointless, however the core functionality of a tank turret is power, accuracy, and rate of fire. You can achieve all three of these via the conventional tank turret with an Auto Loader producing a cannon with 15-17 RPM. There is a specific reason these are mounted on top of heavily armoured main battle tanks and not in their place 25mm Auto-cannons. I'm just going to start here, the rest I already covered You say penetrate, when the balls of plasma can in fact penetrate. hell, a ***** Plasma Rifle could (if the shields kept down) pen a armor of a HAV. This is a known fact. You say "We have advanced armor!" That is bullshit, as I said, Plasma Rifles. Then you say "But historically" I can stop you right there. Real life, a story made up tens of thousands of years in the future, and where defensive systems work VASTLY different than our own, yet you try to actually say that that is a valid reason why a sub par turret that seeing as you're an Amarr RPer I assume would hardly even use, it seems to me that either you don't know what the ** you're even talking about, or that you're doing this to make Gallente purposefully worse. Also, nowhere have I said that keeping machine gun type blasters is good. Stop misrepresenting me. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 16722	Posted - 2015.01.21 04:02:00 - [1356] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Just for clarification, what do you mean by undebateable? The true meta, not some opinionated ideas that result in arguing. FOTM, PC fit, whatever you call it. The fit noone calls stupid. That fit. Fit 1 Gunnlogi 2x Hardeners 1x Complex Extender 1x PG Extender 1x 120mm Advance Plates Prototype Turret Fit 2 Gunnlogi 2x Complex Extenders 1x Hardeners 1x PG Extender 1x 120mm Advanced Plates Prototype Turret *"He spoke, and we made it so all worlds were one, all peoples were one, all faiths, creeds, and nationalities were one.
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2710	Posted - 2015.01.21 04:08:00 - [1357] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Just for clarification, what do you mean by undebateable? The true meta, not some opinionated ideas that result in arguing. FOTM, PC fit, whatever you call it. The fit noone calls stupid. That fit. You mean for current? If so, what True said. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Thaddeus Reynolds Facepunch Security 164	Posted - 2015.01.21 04:19:00 - [1358] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Just for clarification, what do you mean by undebateable? The true meta, not some opinionated ideas that result in arguing. FOTM, PC fit, whatever you call it. The fit noone calls stupid. That fit. The ones that True linked are the Meta Fits (minor alterations exist depending on the specific user and weather or not they want small guns)...I'd hardly call them unbeatable, but they are the current meta all other slots are pilot preference (although armor plate and pg upgrade are the preference for solo users) Either: Gunnlogi Proto Large Gun 2x Extenders 1x Hardener or Gunnlogi Proto Large Gun 2x Hardener 1x Extender Khanid Logi and Tanker, sometimes AV Heavy or Sniper. I believe all these roles are support for front line soldiers.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15299	Posted - 2015.01.21 04:19:00 - [1359] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Just for clarification, what do you mean by undebateable? The true meta, not some opinionated ideas that result in arguing. FOTM, PC fit, whatever you call it. The fit noone calls stupid. That fit. You mean for current? If so, what True said. all right and Maddies? and there is no single best Turret ? "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 727	Posted - 2015.01.21 05:07:00 - [1360] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Just for clarification, what do you mean by undebateable? The true meta, not some opinionated ideas that result in arguing. FOTM, PC fit, whatever you call it. The fit noone calls stupid. That fit. You mean for current? If so, what True said. all right and Maddies? and there is no single best Turret ? Large turrets VS Armor tanks, missiles is the best turret, then rails and blasters last VS shield tanks, Rails, blasters, then missiles VS Dropships Rail, missiles, blaster VS infantry, blasters, rails a close second (ohk) ad missiles third So it depends on your test, but most competent tankers will have fis with all three turret variants and will bring the right one for the right job. "OP "Madurgar: Ion turret Fuel injector (leave second slot open to acount for low fitting space Plate Repper (add in module of choice here, probably either a second plate or a hardener) Maddies, well, the only thing going for them is the Ion Turret. Other than that meta wise they are far too flexible (if they dare get on the field) to come up with one OP fit. My own madrugar fit isn't popular. Also, i'll leave the "op" python fits to the python pilots. As an incubus pilot, this is the fit i run the most, and have fought the most. 1 complex Afterbuner Proto turret: (Rail or missile, this depends on situation though it doesn't change survivability. hunting tanks means i'm flying just as low as i need to to hunt infantry, and are thus succeptable to infantry AV as well ) 1 complex PG 1 complex 120 mm plate 1 complex light repper Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.


CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15300	Posted - 2015.01.21 05:15:00 - [1361] - Quote I am not asking you to play your hand so we can nerf the OP. I am trying to find the best fit, so we can figure out at least 1 or two alternative equal fits to those. When playing around in protofits, I immediately get annoyed by the need for pg/cpu mods. Using infantry fitting logic, it goes ADV hull + proto weapon and fill in relative mods with adv to std. This is not so easy with HAV's and reduces options. Another thing, not new, is that the problems usually come with stacking modules. How adverse are pilots to more "good mod" but only one per fitting? "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Bright Cloud Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 785	Posted - 2015.01.21 05:27:00 - [1362] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I am not asking you to play your hand so we can nerf the OP. I am trying to find the best fit, so we can figure out at least 1 or two alternative equal fits to those. When playing around in protofits, I immediately get annoyed by the need for pg/cpu mods. Using infantry fitting logic, it goes ADV hull + proto weapon and fill in relative mods with adv to std. This is not so easy with HAV's and reduces options. Another thing, not new, is that the problems usually come with stacking modules. How adverse are pilots to more "good mod" but only one per fitting? To be honest good fits should not require any CPU/PG mods regardless if its armor or shield. Sadly its impossible to make good fits without them with the current skills and stats. Bright is the opposite of dark! Who would have thought of that?!
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 727	Posted - 2015.01.21 05:39:00 - [1363] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I am not asking you to play your hand so we can nerf the OP. I am trying to find the best fit, so we can figure out at least 1 or two alternative equal fits to those. When playing around in protofits, I immediately get annoyed by the need for pg/cpu mods. Using infantry fitting logic, it goes ADV hull + proto weapon and fill in relative mods with adv to std. This is not so easy with HAV's and reduces options. Another thing, not new, is that the problems usually come with stacking modules. How adverse are pilots to more "good mod" but only one per fitting? ? In regads to the redline gunnys, not asking for a nerf, just pointing out a very dangerous fit most don't consider. 4.4 K armor and 3.6 K shield + rail turret + damage mods, very leathal tank. just some side commentary, For vehicles the fitting philosphy is all about balancing survivability and costs, and whats the most powerfull turret you can fit with your prefered level of security. Cant really glass cannon it the way you would say an assault Ak/1 with two damage mods and a viziam, becuase the pro large turrets alone cost more than 250,000 isk. Thats why the meta has switched to shield tanks, they have the most survivability. In terms of having one good module, it is a bit restrictive. Maybe having multiple good modules but you can only keeping one active at a time. Two damage mods, sure, but instead of getting +40% damage output, your stuck at +20 consistently. Personaly, i would cap hardeners at two, and restrict damage mods to only having one active at a time. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 810	Posted - 2015.01.21 05:42:00 - [1364] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I am not asking you to play your hand so we can nerf the OP. I am trying to find the best fit, so we can figure out at least 1 or two alternative equal fits to those. When playing around in protofits, I immediately get annoyed by the need for pg/cpu mods. Using infantry fitting logic, it goes ADV hull + proto weapon and fill in relative mods with adv to std. This is not so easy with HAV's and reduces options. Another thing, not new, is that the problems usually come with stacking modules. How adverse are pilots to more "good mod" but only one per fitting? It just changes things around. A month or two and we will have new fits. The big issue for me is that maddys always come out to stomp infantry. But the guy that comes to kill the maddy doesn't use a maddy. He uses a gunnlogi with missiles and dual hardeners. When the maddy dies he comes back with a gunnlogi rail fit. The first gunnlogi goes back to the redline and swaps out for a gunnlogi rail fit. Any other tank that gets called in at this point will be the same thing because the rail lets you engage other tanks without having to get into range of av infantry, and also because blasters and missiles suck at long range against shield tanks. There is no other option for large multi tank battles. Both tanks have crap fitting space and should be addressed

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15302	Posted - 2015.01.21 06:05:00 - [1365] - Quote The idea is then to bring out dropships and or enforcers (well in my dreams) that are high speed, low hp blaster tanks (against shields) that have the maneuverability to engage and circle the gunnlogi, or high speed, rapid redeployment missile enforcers that get behind or on the side and alpha strike. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 727	Posted - 2015.01.21 06:26:00 - [1366] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: The idea is then to bring out dropships and or enforcers (well in my dreams) that are high speed, low hp blaster tanks (against shields) that have the maneuverability to engage and circle the gunnlogi, or high speed, rapid redeployment missile enforcers that get behind or on the side and alpha strike. Reagarding tanks fights, dont worry, most of this already is current meta. Gunlogis are very bad a turret tracking close range, and even missile tanks need to get that first shot in before the armor tanks can react. Nitrous booster will make a blaster tank dance around a rail gunlogi. Its armor tanks exended survivabliity vs missiles and infantry AV thats led to the current meta. regarding enforcers, I think in some proposals, they compensate the enforcer for a little less HP but a small bonus to damage outpput and speed. get in fast hit hard and then attempt to drive away, but if the enemy tank sees you first your a goner. Regarding dropships vs tanks: high speed and manuverable enough, just need a tweak to damage output. Tank small turrets should be angle high enough to counter ADS to compensate. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1943	Posted - 2015.01.21 06:43:00 - [1367] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I am not asking you to play your hand so we can nerf the OP. I am trying to find the best fit, so we can figure out at least 1 or two alternative equal fits to those. When playing around in protofits, I immediately get annoyed by the need for pg/cpu mods. Using infantry fitting logic, it goes ADV hull + proto weapon and fill in relative mods with adv to std. This is not so easy with HAV's and reduces options. Another thing, not new, is that the problems usually come with stacking modules. How adverse are pilots to more "good mod" but only one per fitting? Vehicles fit more like sentinels than assaults - all the stats are on the 'suit', your only choices are like 2 modules and a weapon. They used to fit more like assaults than sentinels where you had huge numbers of slots but needed to skill into the modules to really 'make' a fit. There is almost no one I'm aware of that likes the current 'sentinel' style fitting model, as it devalues investment when the majority of stats are on the hull. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Evan Gotabor Prima Gallicus 132	Posted - 2015.01.21 07:40:00 - [1368] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I am not asking you to play your hand so we can nerf the OP. I am trying to find the best fit, so we can figure out at least 1 or two alternative equal fits to those. When playing around in protofits, I immediately get annoyed by the need for pg/cpu mods. Using infantry fitting logic, it goes ADV hull + proto weapon and fill in relative mods with adv to std. This is not so easy with HAV's and reduces options. Another thing, not new, is that the problems usually come with stacking modules. How adverse are pilots to more "good mod" but only one per fitting? It took you more than ONE year to figure it out ??? Damn... (I know, sarcasm don't help, but...) As for the fits you require, there are PC fits like this : The fits I take come from zkillboard, the 2 kill reports for each tanks are very good fits (or I consider so). Gunnlogi https://zkillboard.com/kill/43922035/ https://zkillboard.com/kill/43703009/ Their aim is mainly to destroy dropships and tanks. Madrugar https://zkillboard.com/kill/42906665/ https://zkillboard.com/kill/42852149/ The aim of thoses is more anti-infantry, but can also serve as AV support. As for dropships, there are some variations, but main fit is : Python. I personaly prefer the shield booster to the hardener, but outside that, this is the typical python fit for more than 80% of the community. For the Incubus, fits are a bit more different as people play it with missiles or with rails (so depending on your gameplay and turret, you will play it more for tank or for agility). There are not enough kills in the killboard to give you any indication. However I share with you my favorite fitting. Prima Gallicus diplomat Eve 21 day Trial
Skybladev2 LUX AETERNA INT RUST415 168	Posted - 2015.01.21 07:41:00 - [1369] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: Tank small turrets should be angle high enough to counter ADS to compensate. And large rail turrets should be angle little enough. <[^_^]>
Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens Capital Punishment. 3156	Posted - 2015.01.21 10:29:00 - [1370] - Quote True Adamance gave the Gunnlogi's fits that are pretty much "use these as they are simply better." There are also Glass Cannon fits but they are far, far less common than the more standard Double Extender-Hardener or Double Hardener-Extender with Double Extender being more common among them. This is more the result of Shield Boosters needing a ridiculous amount of PG and overall not being super useful. Madrugars are what I am far more comfortable with as I have used them until somewhat recently. There are a few Madrugar fits but they all share two things: 1. Every single one has a fuel injector. This is the biggest advantage to being a Madrugar; you can fit a fuel injector without sacrificing your precious defense. 2. Every single one uses at least one Armor Repairer. Again, because of the fitting difficulties, the Madrugar really only has templates. You can't throw in all Complex as easily so if you are using a Prototype Blaster, you are pretty bound to using mostly Advanced. Here are the templates: "The Original": Plate, Hardener, Repairer. This gives quite a high amount of burst protection. Ion Blaster and Basic Fuel Injector likely means Complex Hardener and Advanced Plate-Repairer. Putting in a Railgun lowers CPU so the Hardener is lowered while the Plate which uses less CPU is increased. "The Immortal": Double Repairer, Hardener. A single Complex Plate gives more EHP than a Hardener without Plates but the Effective Healing on this one makes it more suited for taking light AV damage. This is especially good against Blasters. Complex + Advanced Repairer with max skills is 237.5 repair a second. Turn the hardener on and it is 316.66 EHP a second. "The Immortal v2": Double Repairer, Plate. See above for how a single Plate is worth more EHP than a Hardener. It gives up the Hardener's "circumstantial bonus" for the Plate's "permanent bonus." That is really about it. Most of the fitting comes from trying to optimize DPS loss to Defense gain. Using a Basic Turret with better Defensive modules is better against Infantry attacks but is usually worse against other tanks aside if it is a Missile Tank that is suddenly unable to one shot you or if it is an inexperienced tanker using a Railgun and you can trick them into overheating on your "much tougher than it looks" body. Really, Tanks have been ultra limited from the get-go. Despite what people will like to say about all the options in Chromosome or pre-1.7 there has only ever been one go to fit simply because it was vastly superior. Chromosome: Blaster Madrugar, Triple Staggered Prototype Hardeners, Complex Repairer, Complex Plate, basic Heat Sink. That tank was simply the best. There was no comparison in it. It was more difficult to use, staggering the hardeners to keep 2 up at all times and 3 up a lot of the time, but it gave the best results of any other tank. You could swap Blaster for Rail obviously. Uprising Pre-1.7: Madrugar, Double Staggered Hardener, Complex Repairer, Complex Plate, basic Heat sink, 1 complex PG extender. I tried ALL the other fits when PG was nerfed, even going to Gunnlogi's. Still, the old fit with 1 less Staggered Hardener was superior to the rest. At least in 1.7 there were multiple different Madrugars: Triple Repairer, Double Hardener-Repairer, Plate-Hardener-Repairer, Double Repairer-Hardener. "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"

Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6643	Posted - 2015.01.21 11:18:00 - [1371] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: The idea is then to bring out dropships and or enforcers (well in my dreams) that are high speed, low hp blaster tanks (against shields) that have the maneuverability to engage and circle the gunnlogi, or high speed, rapid redeployment missile enforcers that get behind or on the side and alpha strike. So are my numbers barking completely up the wrong tree? If so I can find other things to do. If they're potentially viable for your purposes I'll finish. Also, found the logi tourist! Please cry directly into the bucket. -Ripley Riley
LudiKure ninda Dead Man's Game RUST415 186	Posted - 2015.01.21 11:24:00 - [1372] - Quote Im just gonna leave this link here... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KNSdD8PYgY ( -í° -£-û -í°) `SCAN ATTEMPT PREVENTED`
Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6643	Posted - 2015.01.21 11:34:00 - [1373] - Quote LudiKure ninda wrote: Im just gonna leave this link here... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KNSdD8PYgY I remember fights like this. That damn Surya. The Sagaris was evil the Surya was ridiculous. those red dots. not a single solid AV gunner among the lot of them. with that many swarms, one Wyrkomi or IAFG would have turned that Surya into slag with the supporting fire. Solo? not as much. Also, found the logi tourist! Please cry directly into the bucket. -Ripley Riley
Lazer Fo Cused Shining Flame Amarr Empire 570	Posted - 2015.01.21 13:54:00 - [1374] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. 1. Gunlogi - 2x Complex Hardeners, 1x Complex Extender - 1x PG Extender, Armor Plate of choice or Complex Ammo Expansion Unit with Complex CPU Upgrade this is if you want small turrets on - Prototype Turret of any choice 2. Gunlogi - 2x Complex Extenders, 1x Complex Hardeners - 1x PG Extender, Armor Plate of choice or Complex Ammo Expansion Unit or Complex CPU Upgrade this is if you want Small turrets on - Prototype Turret of any choice 3. PC Gunlogi - 2x Complex Hardeners, 1x Complex Damage Module - 1x 120 Complex Armor Plate, 1x Complex CPU Upgrade - Prototype Railgun Turret (can go glass with all damage modules or 2 and 1 hardener) 4. Madrugar - Really any fits are quite terrible mainly because you end up leaving 1 or both high sloys empty but here goes - 2x Complex Light Repairers, 1x Armor Plate of choice - 1x Nitro or Scanner if for AI fit - Blaster turret of choice (If you need CPU you can drop the scanner or drop the blatser turret/armor plate to a lower tier) 5. Python - Prototype XT-1 Missile Launcher - 1X Complex PG Upgrade - 1x Afterburner, 1x Enhanced Heavy Shield Extender with either another Light Extender or a Shield Hardener or Shield Booster if it can be fit depends on tiers 6. Incubus - Prototype Railgun - 1x Afterburner - 2x Complex Light Armor Repairers, 1x 120 Basic Armor Plate 7. Myron - 4x Enhanced Shield Hardeners - 1x Complex CPU Upgrade, 1x Complex PG Extender 8. Grimsnes - 4x Complex Light Armor Repairers - 1x Afterburner 9 Grimsnes - 3x Complex Light Armor Repairers, 1x Basic Light Armor Repairer - 1x Afterburner, 1x Basic MCRU - 1x Small Missile 10. Grimsnes - 2x Complex Light Armor Repairers, 1x Complex 120 Armor Plate, 1x Complex PG Extender - 1x Afterburner (free slot or put a turret on) 11. These can be debatable but i do not see many normal DS about apart from reaching a roof and the PC vehicles are mainly the python/incubus and the PC gunlogi
Lazer Fo Cused Shining Flame Amarr Empire 570	Posted - 2015.01.21 14:01:00 - [1375] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I am not asking you to play your hand so we can nerf the OP. I am trying to find the best fit, so we can figure out at least 1 or two alternative equal fits to those. When playing around in protofits, I immediately get annoyed by the need for pg/cpu mods. Using infantry fitting logic, it goes ADV hull + proto weapon and fill in relative mods with adv to std. This is not so easy with HAV's and reduces options. Another thing, not new, is that the problems usually come with stacking modules. How adverse are pilots to more "good mod" but only one per fitting? 1. PG/CPU modules are a must for quite a few fits - If you intend for the hulls to be tiercided then we need the ability to fit on all proto like i can do on quite a few suits or at least adv and proto - If it is not going by tiercide then we need adv/proto hulls but currently try fitting all proto on the madrugar and both high slots are empty 2. ADV hull? We have Basic HAVs only the ADS you could call ADV at best but even then the Python struggles to fit without a PG module 3. Not a fan really - Take the Saga II which has a shield hardener but a short activation time and long cooldown time which makes it worthless 4. Stacking penalties are more than enough - In EVE only certain modules i cannot stack such as propulsion modules but you only use 1 at a time anyways and plus you do have the option of rigs and implants to further customize your ship where as we have modules and if we are lucky some skills and skill bonuses and that is all
Lazer Fo Cused Shining Flame Amarr Empire 570	Posted - 2015.01.21 14:06:00 - [1376] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: The idea is then to bring out dropships and or enforcers (well in my dreams) that are high speed, low hp blaster tanks (against shields) that have the maneuverability to engage and circle the gunnlogi, or high speed, rapid redeployment missile enforcers that get behind or on the side and alpha strike. 1. Currently we seem to have that now 2. The madrugar can circle a gunlogi at the current speeds without a nitro which just improves straight line speed and does hinder turning since you end up going wider on the turn than usual so keeping it tight is harder 2a. The Gunlogi has a very poor gun depression so with the madrugar is also has terrain as its advanatage since it can engage on a hill or even in little dips where the gunlogi cannot look down 3. The gunlogi is best when it engages from range and where it can land the most without any misses and it has to pick and choose more carefully to begin with since it can look down that far and missiles do have travel time and can miss

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15322	Posted - 2015.01.21 14:25:00 - [1377] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: The idea is then to bring out dropships and or enforcers (well in my dreams) that are high speed, low hp blaster tanks (against shields) that have the maneuverability to engage and circle the gunnlogi, or high speed, rapid redeployment missile enforcers that get behind or on the side and alpha strike. So are my numbers barking completely up the wrong tree? If so I can find other things to do. If they're potentially viable for your purposes I'll finish. Absolutely not, please continue "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

CELTIC TARON Murphys-Law General Tso's Alliance 23	Posted - 2015.01.21 14:49:00 - [1378] - Quote Warning this may turn out to be fairly lengthy Ok so I had to log in for this however rare that might be. Speaking as a person who has 30 million SP in tanking and ADS, (and about 50 million as infantry on my other character so yes I am experienced with all forms of AV as well) Also note I speak from the prospective of someone who has hundreds of PC's under their belt...I do not mention all this to toat my own horn only to note that I am far from an inexperienced player when I mention below. As stated before True gave a good build for the logi and the other varent would be two extenders and one harder with pg and armor plate. As for maddy well lets just say due to lack of module diversity and the difficulty of fitting requirements due to the PG and CPU currently. One of the issues with the maddy currently is since the nerf to reps it is more beneficial to run complex light reps on most builds rather than heavy reps because of the huge difference in PG and CPU not to mention the very moderate difference now since the nerf between the light and heavy reppers. I won't get into builds as many good fits have already been mentioned however I will touch on one other big topic, and that is on turrets. Current Problems that should be addressed is: Rail--In good place currently although turret rotation speed per point should be reviewed Missile--In good place although missile reload speed per point AND turret rotation speed per point should be reviewed. Blaster-- SEE BELOW Oh where to start on blaster turrets. Quite frankly now that I look back it all boils down to the dispersion being way too high. A bunny hopping little scout you have next to no chance of killing even with an ion blaster assuming the scout is not like some and just stands around in a single spot lol ). Lets also touch on forge guns...A blaster gets hit by a fg from the ground it's time to run cause even if you are close you won't kill an even average level fg if it's proto before you lose your tank. Currently the dispersion is the killer that makes blasters not really worth using any longer in competitive play. It has boiled down to more RNG and Luck of the bullet spread than skill which is not how it should be. I will admit the old blasters was OP MY PROPOSAL ON BLASTER TURRETS: Have a skill within the tree that reduces dispersion of the bullet spread. Although I would also note that it should not be reduced down to the point it used to be but somewhere in between which obviously would take some devs testing time to figure out a better middle ground. Or even a module that say takes the spot of a small turret that reduces dispersion although that would be more difficult to implement as a programmer myself, I do understand how it works to a degree (since I don't work there obviously lol) I won't touch on the issues with AV other than to say swarms need reviewed don't get me wrong I love my swarms but any Cal or Min commando with swarms will single handedly shut down pretty much all tanks and drop ships. So if you have 3 tanks/dropships and that 1 person can shut them down yes inf may kill them then they re spawn and destroy a few more tanks/dropships* that there would not be in line with what CCP has intended based on their prior posts. FINAL THOUGHTS: In the end when it comes to tanks it's a shear lack of variety since all our modules was taken away from us. Striking balance between everything is always going to be an issue to some degree or another. That being said though the biggest issue right now is even with the much cheaper costs of tanks/ dropships than what it used to be even if you don't lose said vehicle you end up spending the majority of your time running from av. ****The big factor that I personally believed that changed is when points was implemented for partially doing damage to tanks and dropships. This one simple change (although I understand why and do like it don't get me wrong as much as I hate it) makes a bunch switch to AV the second a tank or dropship comes out. Why you ask? See senerio below: EXAMPLE: Triple rep maddy although glass against another tank can help fend off swarm attacks pretty easy from a single person. So the example is a person switches to AV and hits you twice waits reloads* and does it again and again and again. They have no intentions of killing you just keeping you useless while they farm a ton of points in the process. So you put your tank away well guarantee some blue will bring a new one out and the person will do the same even if it's on a soma. The points for just doing damage is one of the problems currently as everyone wants those free points. That being said AV needs rewarded though for having aided in the destruction or making of a tank / dropship run away. For this I am afraid I have no suggestion at this time. For the few who may read this line thank you for taking the time to read the long winded post of a person who normally reads but never posts in the forums lol. I will however reply to any post that addresses this post I am making here excluding trolls :p PC Tanker AND PROUD! Especially When I Shove A Missile Up Your Arse! Long Live Tanks :)
Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6643	Posted - 2015.01.21 14:55:00 - [1379] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: The idea is then to bring out dropships and or enforcers (well in my dreams) that are high speed, low hp blaster tanks (against shields) that have the maneuverability to engage and circle the gunnlogi, or high speed, rapid redeployment missile enforcers that get behind or on the side and alpha strike. So are my numbers barking completely up the wrong tree? If so I can find other things to do. If they're potentially viable for your purposes I'll finish. Absolutely not, please continue Excellent. All I care about is getting vehicles fun to drive and fun to fight again. I need to go back and bang out militia mods as well as many other things. I thought this would be simple. You may all point and laugh at my naivete. Also, found the logi tourist! Please cry directly into the bucket. -Ripley Riley
Brush Master Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1401	Posted - 2015.01.21 17:33:00 - [1380] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Hi everyone, can someone link/create "undebatable" prototype fits for both HAVs and Dropships. I need this for the next steps. Prometheus High Slots (2): Scanner, Booster Low Slots (4): 2 Heavy Reps, PG expansion, Heavy Armor Plating Turrets: 1 Adv/Proto Missile (previously would have been 2 as we could not remove turrets) For defensive support dropship it would be something like this. You would go for high reps, a bit more armor and then support modules in high slots, based on how the cpu/pg would work out would determine how much armor/reps you go for. Ideally the armor logistics dropship should be able to have a bit more reps and higher base armor to survive 1 more railgun/fg blast than a standard of the same fit. Dust Veteran. June 2012 - ? True Logi. Flying DS from the start. @dustreports



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