Agreed.

I have been a longtime Logi since I strated Dust. It is very frustrating to say the least. With that yellow color all the Douvale Tac rifes pick you off first before you can even see them. I started an alt and have put my main Logi on hold. I went Amarr because of my toons faction and regret it.

For a true Logistics the side arm is not needed. CCP had intended for the Amarr to work as the "assault" Logi but we see how that worked out.

You guys are thinking of it as a logi is the problem, it's just an assault that gave up some HP and speed so it could carry more equipment.

I'd given this some more thought, and think the Amarr Logi is more than a little off.

Caldari/Gallente/Minmatar all have 12-slot totals at Proto:
C=5H 4L 3E=12
G=3H 5L 4E=12
M=4H 4L 4E=12

The Amarr has 9 (3/3/3) and a sidearm. It's also worth mentioning that the sidearm doesn't become a factor till proto level, so it's not really a balancing factor on the lower tiers. Either way, they're effectively claim that ONE sidearm slot equals THREE slots, right?

However, if you check out something like the Caldari Assault for comparison (4H 3L) there's only a two-slot difference in modules capacity between the assault and the Logistics - the Logi has +2 module fitting that sets it apart from the assault version. The Amarr assault and logi are inexplicably the same - 3H 3L.

The PG difference seems like a typo honestly. Every other logistics/assault comparison will show the logistics getting higher PG (for fitting more crap), and the Amarr logistics mysteriously has less PG than the assault and basic frames.

I think the Amarr Logi does need to be better than the Amarr Assault in terms of slots, even with a sidearm. I'd give the Logistics ONE more low slot to make it 3H 4L. Then it's trading two slots for the sidearm.

The assault class needs other tweaks as well, but I think that would be fair to the Amarr Logi.

*Clears Throat*
Another high powered slot please - the fact that Amarr logis get an amour repair boost lessens the need for more low powered based modules... =D

The ability to use a sidearm along side a light weapon is a lot better than you seem to be giving it credit for.

Mass driver / SMG

Swarm launcher /SMG

AR / Flaylock

Scram rifle / Flaylock


All these options give you two clear methods of engaging hostile targets, either by allowing you to combat vehicles or by giving you a CQC weapon as well as an AOE support weapon.

I play logi and I went for Minmatar, since I want equipment slots, versatility and speed which the suit provides. I spent a long time weighing it against the amarr for the sidearm so I could use a mass driver in a support role and back it up with an SMG, its a very neat and unique option for a logi.

Amarr slot layout: (3/3/3)
Minmatar slot layout: (4/4/4)

If you gained another equip or module slot.. amarr would be a a clearly superior choice, I'd have gone for it for sure.

The ability to use a sidearm along side a light weapon is a lot better than you seem to be giving it credit for.

Mass driver / SMG

Swarm launcher /SMG

AR / Flaylock

Scram rifle / Flaylock


All these options give you two clear methods of engaging hostile targets, either by allowing you to combat vehicles or by giving you a CQC weapon as well as an AOE support weapon.

I play logi and I went for Minmatar, since I want equipment slots, versatility and speed which the suit provides. I spent a long time weighing it against the amarr for the sidearm so I could use a mass driver in a support role and back it up with an SMG, its a very neat and unique option for a logi.

Amarr slot layout: (3/3/3)
Minmatar slot layout: (4/4/4)

If you gained another equip or module slot.. amarr would be a a clearly superior choice, I'd have gone for it for sure.

I don't have much to add to this discussion but just wanted to point out - no assault (even proto) has more than 1 equipment slot. In fact only logi suits have more than 1 equipment slot in the entire game.

Not a logistics so take this with a grain of salt, but if armor rep mod stacking took a hard penalty dive after 2 or 3, would that not balance things out between the logistics by creating diminishing returns for the Gallante Logistics?

Edit:

The way I see it, the Amarr logistics was meant to be the logi assault hybrid, similar to how the Minmatar scout is the scout assault hybrid. A sidearm gives laser rifle and submachine gun to cover distance/damage types for this suit. That being said the above fix should sway the balance back to Amarr being better armor reppers.

THANK ALL OF YOU AMARR PROTO LOGI USERS WHO SPOKE UP...

The Amerr proto has been made too weak...
It's Really Just the Logi suit for me(aside from the fact it doesn't look like a Minmatar), however, the fact that it has a side arm slot - Just A Side Arm Slot - should NOT mean that it should loose a High Powered slot AND a Low Powered slot, AND an Equipment slot(it actually only lost 2 slots but......)...
GUYS - THREE SLOTS lost for supposedly gaining ONE? THAT'S A BIT HARSH(don't you think?)... =\
The Proto Amarr should have say, simply exchanged a low powered slot(which it can fairly spare due to it's armor repair boost), for the sidearm slot & keep 4 high powered & 4 equipment slots(or at least kept 4 high powered slots - at least)...
Having a side arm slot does not give any sort of advantage - it simply makes the already versatile Logi even more versatile - so I don't see why, Especially since it seems that y'all did simple rotations of slots with the other proto logis & because even though the Amarr Logi has a sidearm slot, it's CPU & PG is still limited & one can't just go into overkill with one's weapons - right?

So I'm Officially starting some sort of petition thing for the Amarr Logi Proto to at least get an additional High Powered slot...

GIVE THE AMARR PROTO LOGIS AN EQUAL AMOUNT OF SLOTS(or-at-least-another-high-powered-slot) - WHO'S WITH ME!!! O.O (=])

(For Your - the developers - consideration...)

I like your enthusiasm, but make it a low slot and you have a deal. Add a piece of equipment for a bonus. Amarr are armor driven, a High slot would mean more shields and would make it more Caldari... no, switch it to a low slot.

lvl 1 2/2/2
Adv 3/3/3
Proto 3/4/3

or 2/2/2
3/4/2
3/4/3

That is the way i see it. 1 side arm bonus is not equal to -1/-1/-2 in comparison to the other logis and the base logi from chromosome. He needs to be more. A beefier logi that loses an equipment slot and a high in the end for bonuses to armor.
Sure, it might seem op for some people, but it just seems right.

only AV & the laser profits from the sidearm because it has no other way of engaging up close. all other weapons listed can easily fight on their own at close range and the reloading time is not even long. the sidearms wont even come to use most of the time because the average engagement range is beyond 20m and all the sidearms have ~15 optimal range.

the sidearm is definately not worth 2 slots, especially when dont get it before proto. the AR is still superb at all ranges, why would someone take any other weapon?

my opinion stands, give the amarr logi the sidearm from the beginning and keep the slot layout as it is and incease the PG/CPU. amarr is the laser faction and the laser is useless up close thus you need a sidearm thus let them carry one.

Hi there.

I decided to go the logistics path in Dust, and as I like armor repair modules I chose Amarr because of the nice bonuses to it.
After 2 days now of playing I begun to notice something - the Amarr Logisuit is quite subpar when looking another, flat out better dropsuit -> the Gallente Logisuit.
Let me explain:

The T3 Amarr logisuit has 3x low slots, this results in one being able to carry 3x armor repairer modules at most.
The T3 Gallente logisuit has the amazing number of 5x low suits, making one being able to use 5x armor repairer modules.
Logistics Suit Bonus +1 HP to dropsuit armor repair rate per level.
Amarr Logi Bonus +5% to efficacy of armor repairer modules per level.
Amarr Repair Systems +5% to armor repair modules efficacy per level.
Complex Armor Repairer 5,0 HP/s.

These values only count if one has lvl 5 in the following skills skills:
Armor Repair Systems
Amarr Logistics Dropsuit / Gallente Logistics Dropsuit

Amarr Suit:

25%+25% = 50%
50% + 100% = 150%
150% / 100 = growth factor 1,50

5 HP/s x growth factor 1,5 = 7,5 HP/s
7,5 HP/s x 3 low slots = 22,5 HP/s
22,5 HP/s + 5 HP/s = 27,5 HP/s

Gallente Suit:

25% + 100% = 125%
125% / 100 = growth factor 1,25

5 HP/s x growth factor 1,25 = 6,25 HP/s
6,25 HP/s x 4 lowslots = 25 HP/s
25HP/s + 5 HP/s = 30 HP/s

6,25 HP/s x 5 lowslots = 31,25 HP/s
31,25 HP/s + 5HP/s = 36,25 HP/s


As you can see, the gallente dropsuit is superior in armor repairing because of its extra low slots.

I think it would be nice if the T3 Amarr Logisuit had one more low slot to make its suitbonus more useful for those (like me) who stack up on armor repair modules.



Need to end this thread now as I need to leave, but I will continue later about another amarr dropsuit topic that I have in mind.


- Haron Vathek

(sorry for any grammar / speling mistakes, english is not my native language)


Edit1: Fixed some wrong numbers

Still stupidly gimped. So a the Amarr has higher armor than the Gallente? Good. The Gallente has 5, count them 5 that he could dump armor into - i've seen it in stories. All the logis have a wider versatility than the Amarr. That is part of the reason for increasing his slot count or his equipment count.

As it stands he is soooo middle of the road.. Coolest looking armor, most average presence on the battlefield. Mediocre, characterless, common, conventional, dull, humdrum, inferior, intermediate, ordinary, passable, pedestrian, second-rate, undistinguished, unexceptional, uninspired, vanilla - when he is in proto form. Its' like he's missing the next level, a proto +1 or something.

and yes a thesaurus was involved.

Did this thread just die because we are out of suggestions or arguments or because the new weapons came out and we can finally kill those Caldari shield tankers and new meat to pubstomp?

My feelings haven't changed. I still think they need AT LEAST another low slot at at proto -and PG/CPU higher than the Assault, and even then I'm not sure I'd call it balanced.

Honestly, I'd figured the hp bonus (compared to the other logis) would be a bit higher too considering the speed and slot restriction. Part of the assault-difference from logis is they're faster, but the Amarr logi doesn't really see this, right? The tradeoff for being "assault" instead of logi gets you higher hp, higher speed, better regen, better stamina - normally, right?

I'm not sure if the Amarr logi hp and sidearm quite justifies them being the slowest, fewest slots, etc.

The low slot and PG fix is just an obvious correction to me (The logi should NOT have the same slots than the assault, even if it's just one more). However, depending on just how "assault-oriented" the Amarr logi is meant to be, it's possible other stats need to be looked at too. But, Jebus... give them another low slot and fix that PG.