First off, it's bad enough just having a female avatar having people follow you around going "OMG your character has ****! i better stare at them as much I can right now, 'cuz no woman would ever let me do that in real-life." If you try and walk away they just hound you down during the entire time you're waiting on the bridge before the match starts.
God forbid if I actually speak aloud to a squadmate, who then thinks he's allowed all manner of hate-speech imaginable for the insufferable nature of having a woman on his squad..

I'd rather not have the bridge that have people chase me every single game, then hear such wonderful things when I join a match without people I know. There needs to be a way to report these actions and to prevent them

agreed, my girlfriend and i play, and she catches alot when they hear her speaking, a few times i've had to step in because it got so bad. sexual harassment is no joke

everyone gets hounded in the warbarge at some point, theres nothing else to do. I think your looking into this to much. As for comments on mic....you actually have people speaking in pub matches?

I think you are wrong. Have you run a female alt yet?

I actually got email requests to be 'friends' for no other reason than my avatar was female. That was before the wipe and I have not yet restarted another but some reporting mechanism should be in place.

First off, it's bad enough just having a female avatar having people follow you around going "OMG your character has [mammary glands] ! i better stare at them as much I can right now, 'cuz no woman would ever let me do that in real-life." If you try and walk away they just hound you down during the entire time you're waiting on the bridge before the match starts.
God forbid if I actually speak aloud to a squadmate, who then thinks he's allowed all manner of hate-speech imaginable for the insufferable nature of having a woman on his squad..

I'd rather not have the bridge that have people chase me every single game, then hear such wonderful things when I join a match without people I know. There needs to be a way to report these actions and to prevent them

i wish all the ladys would check out my buff heavy

First off, it's bad enough just having a female avatar having people follow you around going "OMG your character has [mammary glands] ! i better stare at them as much I can right now, 'cuz no woman would ever let me do that in real-life." If you try and walk away they just hound you down during the entire time you're waiting on the bridge before the match starts.
God forbid if I actually speak aloud to a squadmate, who then thinks he's allowed all manner of hate-speech imaginable for the insufferable nature of having a woman on his squad..

I'd rather not have the bridge that have people chase me every single game, then hear such wonderful things when I join a match without people I know. There needs to be a way to report these actions and to prevent them

lol "hi, just saw your avitar and you are sexy, wanna be friends?" kinda creepy i guess, just report them here on the forums, there must be a place for it. And if you ever need a shoulder to cry on....jokes

There's a lot of dumbass in the online gaming community. This just illustrates the fact that the internet makes you stupid, and anonymity is the birthplace of morons.

It's comforting to note that people who have the time to note and get angry about having a pair of X chromosomes riding shotgun usually aren't exactly what one would call important to the rest of the world at large.

If I may, once the game goes live use a tank and drive over stupid blueberries who don't understand words like No, and Shuddup, and Ew you're repulsive, and "This is a bar of soap, it's a magical invention. Don't talk to me again until you have mastered it's use."

Friendly fire is going to be your savior in DUST 514. I encourage it's use to discourage stupidity. I also encourage the use of the customer support email to report specific incidents of actual sexual harassment. Because it's in violation of the EULA. And i think people getting slapped for being stupid is hilarious.

Which makes me think of you solving these issues and shouting "Breakin Stuff" into your mic. Good post, BTW.

Would this work both ways? ie. if a female harasses a male on the Internet? Would the male then be able to report them?

Its so rare that a woman will harass a man for being a man (for one, its rare enough to find one in game), but yes, if there was actual harassment

The reason you see less of it is one, a lot of us tend to play male characters to get away from that harassment. Since there is a lot of men you can't keep their mind out of the gutter, we play as men characters and act like it. we are automatically treated as equals. Its kinda sad, but that is how things tend to flow in the game world. I mean its not like we get the same pleasure out of staring at man's ass in a mmo like a man does playing a female character.

Petition system works wonders. Email [email protected] or play with friends in squad and never hear those people again. Recording them also is a good way to document the harassment, but you'll always have it in games like this. You have no idea how COD and BF3 are...

Oh noe's. You sound like you've never played an online game before. Everyone goes ape sh** when they hear a girl on the mic.

Oh noe's. You sound like you've never played an online game before. Everyone goes ape sh** when they hear a girl on the mic. And you making a big deal over it is not the best way to go about it. There is a block function, and a mute option. And getting irritated because some people are "hounding" you is a bit ridiculous... especially when everyone is stuck on the bridge without a choice anyway.

And there is always those people who are just ingrates, or annoying in general. Mute/block them.

I get "hounded" because i have Primordial militia gear. You don't see me posting a thread whining about all the people grinding on my suit trying to get the camera in my dudes crotch.


Please, grow up and enjoy the game for the love of god and all that is holy.

You're honestly just part of the problem.

"There's nothing wrong with getting lewd comments thrown at you and being harassed for something you cannot control. Just shut up and deal with it"

No. There is no reason for anyone to do that, and the guys that do (and those that defend them) are absolute scum.

I wonder when our society actually goes beyond this crap.

+1 but that is why I have been playing solo with out a mic squad, to avoid those idiots. It is hard enough having people hover around you in heavy suits and such while you are reading the line up in the waiting room; I don't need to hear them go through puberty at the same time. I get enough of that being on ps home.

I have cleaned up some inappropriate remarks in this thread.

Additionally, harassment of people based on their gender (or sexuality, or race, or religion, or anything of that nature) absolutely will not be tolerated. An e-mail to [email protected] will eventually will be looked at by our game masters and dealt with appropriately.

No offense, its easy for a guy to dress up in a girls suit and claim someone else has been harassing them. You need a better way than just taking the word of someone saying someone harassed them.

They have chat logs. And if it's over a mic they will probably just record the situation on that players record, and if it occurs multiple times act on it. Though, they can easily record mic conversations too - it's over their servers.

And I hope that anyone caught harassing any player is permabanned with no warning. I'm personally sick of this behavior still existing in the gaming community and it will continue to exist until someone (come on CCP) responds with bans and not slaps on the wrist for such disgusting behavior and we as a community don't stay quiet but speak up for the poor person being harassed.

Real men treat women with respect. It's little boys who pick on them and treat them like this...

Careful about making your own decisions that are based upon arbitrary understandings and assumptions. And this is not to say that your statement about not accepting that behavior is not on point, at least in my eyes. Yet the language you used to describe the purported assailant only perpetuates the cycle of attacking and staunchly defending ones actions, no matter how socially and universally out of tune and balance they are.

Throw discriminatory behavior at someone, don't be surprised if you get it back.

Just my 0.02 ISK, and an observation.

Only by actively addressing the issue at hand can you hope to produce the change that you seek, primarily through discussion and the development of understanding. Being passive on the mic and not airing the issue as it occurs, you can not hope to address the issue at the source of its occurrence.

I'd like to just take a moment to remind you that you are not really the person you see on your screen when playing this game. Neither are you really on a warbarge about to attack a planet with immortal clones. You are actually playing a game, which by its very definition tends to attract children or adults with a childlike disposition.

I can assure you that your terrible suffrage at the hands of people who are not actually there with you and cannot actually do anything relevant to you, does not warrant the title of 'harassment'.

*snipped sexist and political language* - CCP Eterne

Hey, people follow me around on the bridge because of my username, wheres my report button?

People following you around happens very often on the bridge, most people do it out of boredom.

Although people saying stuff that may be sexist or count as harrassment does need to be reported and acted upon, but seriously, people following you around on the bridge? Thats been happening to me since early Beta and I dont have a female character nor am I female.

This, was about to post this myself and I'm a female. Why get so worked up over someone staring at you in a video game in an area where there's literally nothing else to do anyway...

Voice harassment or harassment through messages on the other hand is something I don't tolerate.

Although I completely agree that people in games can be absolutely ret@rded when it comes to speaking appropriately to a female.........this cannot be something that they do. This would completely ruin the game. How could there ever be proof of a "sexual harrassment" charge? Are we just going to take the word of the person who made the charge? Talk about giving trolls the tools they need to grief any player they want. If women are having a hard time with this then there are a couple options for them (already mentioned but ohwell). A) squad up with people you know so you dont have to listen to moronic kids (or college students). B) Turn off your mic so that you dont have to listen to them if they are going on and you choose not do to option A (or noone is on to do option A). C) understand that people on the internet are stupid moronic ret@rds and this is not something you will be able to change the best thing you can do is ignore it if you want to continue playing.

Another option if they dont stop is to just start TKing them. Enjoy the ghost LAV to TK the idiots who wont leave you alone.

I'd like to just take a moment to remind you that you are not really the person you see on your screen when playing this game. Neither are you really on a warbarge about to attack a planet with immortal clones. You are actually playing a game, which by its very definition tends to attract children or adults with a childlike disposition.

I can assure you that your terrible suffrage at the hands of people who are not actually there with you and cannot actually do anything relevant to you, does not warrant the title of 'harassment'.

*snipped sexist and political language* - CCP Eterne

Whenever I get into a discussion on this subject, this always comes up: "Because you can't take some 'lighthearted joking' (the harassment, as described by people who allow it or encourage it) you need to shut up about it and not 'harass' (speak against) us."

Someone who harasses and/or assaults someone does not deserve kind words to be used to describe them; to do so would be accepting of their behavior and encourages it more. Calling them out for their idiotic behavior (because it is idiotic to harass someone for something they cannot control; it shows a distinct lack of education/intelligence, good sense, and respect for others) is not inherently wrong; it is truthful and an attempt to get them to change, or at least try to get them to realize that they are doing something that is wrong.

You say that I am basing things on "arbitrary understandings and assumptions"...you are wrong. Try having this behavior lobbed at you for several years, by many, many people, and most times you have your mic on with randoms. Maybe if you had something similar happen to you, you'd understand why its a problem.

Its not about having feelings hurt, or not liking someone; it is an inherent problem with gamer/nerd culture that NEEDS to be addressed and stopped. Allowing it, looking the other way, treating the harassers nicely; this allows it to continue. Women hate it, but with the harassers ignoring them or becoming even more harsh when spoken against, other guys need to take a stand against them.

I'm just going to say this: Most women fed up with this behavior have tried, many, many times, to ask (or told) guys to stop harassing them. Most of the time it results in MORE harassment. Very, very rarely will a guy stop because their target asked them to; it is a challenge to them to be worse.

You can say "keep trying and someone will eventually stop" but when the normal response is to be worse...is the remote possibility of getting it to stop really better than all the extra harassment received?

And...why is it on the woman to get them to stop? What about all the guys that sit there and say nothing?

Has nothing to do with joking around.

Someone pisses you off? Someone has a realllly annoying voice? Someone is trying to start static with you? Well, all you have to do is just *mute* then *block*. I know its difficult to be the bigger person and just ignore them altogether.... but c'mon.

This is a space game about killing people, and their reincarnations... repeatedly. I would think that would be the main focus other than the anatomical intricacies of the female model and how it garners attention from other players.

Exactly. It should be about the game and fighting merc vs merc, and implementing a way to report players for harassment would greatly shift personal interaction between players back to that. It doesn't matter if they can mute and block and offensive player, having to just hear it the first time is a terrible experience for anyone and we should be working as a community to push morons who harass others away from us. So long as it's done properly and swiftly, what's so wrong about cleaning up the community and making it better for everyone?

Eve voice has a voice changer, so should dust.

/shrug

In other words, "You have to change (literally alter your voice) to avoid harassment because I'm not going to do anything to alter the hostile environment."

That's your solution?

When did society get so weak, thin-skinned, and irrational that interactions that take place online, i.e., NOT REALLY HAPPENING IN THE REAL WORLD, can seriously be considered harassment?

This is all in the same theme as cyber bullying... which will probably be the theme of a new post after someone gets upset about being shot in an FPS game.

Nothing that happens online is REAL. You're actually in the comfort of your own home when these interactions are taking place. If you cannot discern that key difference on your own perhaps you aren't equipped to deal with interacting with faraway people in make believe lands.

When I was a kid and an older kid felt like 'harassing' me with his fists I couldn't just ignore him or turn off the PS3. Wish I could have but in the long run getting smacked around a bit probably did me some good. It just blows my mind that the quality of people can disintegrate so quickly as to allow fake interactions to be seriously mistaken for something like 'harassment'.

If you'd like to see actual examples of sexual harassment I'd recommend you wiki women's suffrage and quit embarrassing yourself with the pretense that anything of the like is possible in this GAME.

In other words, you have to change (literally not use your real name) to avoid harassment because i'm not going to do anything to alter the hostile environment.

See how that works?

So... Yes. It is a solution. So is reporting and moving on with your life. Welcome to; 'The Internet'; where obfuscation of personal details is always a good idea. Sorry if it offends you.

So, Grendel, is someone writing an anonymous letter to the newspaper, writing about how he feels all woman need to be completely submissive to men, and how any woman seen outside their homes without their man deserve to be beaten and ******, not considered to be harassing women? Is he not a threat to us? Are woman supposed to just not read the paper or look the other way?

What about a guy calling a woman's home, and threatening her sexually that way? Is she supposed to just hang up every time he calls, threatening her with harm?

Neither of these cases are a man saying these things face-to-face to a woman, but are they to be tolerated? If you don't think I've heard some absolutely sick things guys want to do to me online, you're only kidding yourself; to say that I should ignore this means you are part of the problem.

So you seem to have a very narrow view of harassment. However, I took part of your advice, and wiki'd harassment, and this is the defintion I got: "Harassment is commonly understood as behaviour intended to disturb or upset, and it is characteristically repetitive. In the legal sense, it is intentional behaviour which is found threatening or disturbing." Nowhere here is there anything that says harassment can take place only in face-to-face situations. Internet-bullying is entirely possible as seen in this case here.

It seems I have to repeat myself one more time. Am I saying all men are harassers? No. Am I saying all women are innocent? Also no. But there IS a culture on the internet of men harassing women, sexually or otherwise. As I've said before, all this is doing is harming DUST by driving away a significant potential player base (30% of gamers are women older than 18) because some people can't get their heads out of their collective asses. The best way to combat the unstated truth of female harassment in online games is to empower not just women, but all players with the knowledge that they can quickly and easy submit their grievances to CCP, and that those submitions will be seriously considered.

It's very, very easy for someone who has never experienced harassment, especially a man who has not, to claim that there is no problem, or that the problem can be easily dealt with through things like "only squadding with certain people," "voice changing," or "turning off the microphone." But these don't solve the real issue. Instead of telling women to "get over it" or "HTFU" or blaming them for their own victimization, think about what you, personally, can do to make them feel welcome on DUST. And this should extend to all players, because whether you admit it or not the more people playing DUST the better for everyone.

You misunderstand. My point is that expecting the harrased group to make all he changes is pretty lame.

Its sad, really sad, that Grendel thinks harassment is perfectly fine.

In a way, he's like those people who blame a woman for being ******; "she should have not been in that place at that time", "she should not have worn that outfit", "she should have fought back" and all those other absolutely BS "excuses" for the villain.

Makes me sick that these people are still accepted in today's society. They'd chance their tunes very quickly if something comparable happened to them, and they got no support or care.

and the crazy train goes CHOOO CHOOOO CHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. because OBVIOUSLY real world sexual assault is the same thing as your perceived (OHNOS) harassment in a video game. Get a grip.

So, by your own admission you have the mentality of an unstable child? because that is what your example equates to. My view of harassment is narrow with regards to the extent reality. If you can remove yourself from the harassment with no consequences then it's not really harassment. A further view could even be taken that by putting yourself repeatedly in these situations and then demanding everyone ELSE modify their behavior, perhaps the problem is actually you.

By the way, why are you being so disagreeable. I see you continually looking down at where my avatar's ***** would be and I feel quite violated right now. So violated that I can' t stop coming back here to be violated over and over again.

I think this is getting a little bit derailed... we are here trying to find a solution for the problem of getting boxed by four guys or more in the prebattle room (yes it happened to me more than once) or stalked like no tomorrow, I mean I don't mind that my character attracts attention (mostly when I'm using a scout dropsuit) but four people or more people stalking you? that's a little bit overkill, I can tell that I played as many female chars in several other MMO's and this is actually the first time I'm seeing this type of harassment, now I understand how the girls feels when they're facing this lol.

I think this is getting a little bit derailed... we are here trying to find a solution for the problem of getting boxed by four guys or more in the prebattle room (yes it happened to me more than once) or stalked like no tomorrow, I mean I don't mind that my character attracts attention (mostly when I'm using a scout dropsuit) but four people or more people stalking you? that's a little bit overkill, I can tell that I played as many female chars in several other MMO's and this is actually the first time I'm seeing this type of harassment, now I understand how the girls feels when they're facing this lol.

If getting boxed in is the "real" issue at hand... that's really immature to get mad about. Ya its annoying when it happens, but seriously. I cant believe anyone would think its such a huge problem that it needs to be addressed.

If that legitimately makes you mad, then you deserve it because you are probably not old enough to play this game anyways.

-- Snip of legitimate position --
If getting boxed in is the "real" issue at hand... that's really immature to get mad about.
-- and snip of Don V H with the ramble mode set on --

Ok guys, this is getting a bit out of hand so I would like to reiterate what has already been said:

Harassment will not be tolerated. Feel free to report anything to [email protected]. We will investigate the issue further and take appropriate actions.

I would also like to mention that Harassment is perceived differently by different people. Something that I find offensive might not be offensive to someone else and as such some consideration, to a certain degree, should be taken into account when such instance occurs.

DUST 514 is a single shard MMO FPS and we want a friendly, united community but let's face it, in this day and age of the internet, there will always be someone to ruin the fun for everyone else!

Ok guys, this is getting a bit out of hand so I would like to reiterate what has already been said:

Harassment will not be tolerated. Feel free to report anything to [email protected]. We will investigate the issue further and take appropriate actions.

I would also like to mention that Harassment is perceived differently by different people. Something that I find offensive might not be offensive to someone else and as such some consideration, to a certain degree, should be taken into account when such instance occurs.

DUST 514 is a single shard MMO FPS and we want a friendly, united community but let's face it, in this day and age of the internet, there will always be someone to ruin the fun for everyone else!

Is the act of boxing someone in, for no reason at all other than we can, considered harassment?

Is this similar to 'bumping' in eve? Where the simple act of is not punishable but repeated intentional griefing of a single player for an extended period of time is?

Ok guys, this is getting a bit out of hand so I would like to reiterate what has already been said:

Harassment will not be tolerated. Feel free to report anything to [email protected]. We will investigate the issue further and take appropriate actions.

I would also like to mention that Harassment is perceived differently by different people. Something that I find offensive might not be offensive to someone else and as such some consideration, to a certain degree, should be taken into account when such instance occurs.

DUST 514 is a single shard MMO FPS and we want a friendly, united community but let's face it, in this day and age of the internet, there will always be someone to ruin the fun for everyone else!

I try to block anyone I see actually walking around just for kickes. I dont care what the gender their clone might be.

Yeah if someone is stupid enough to do it on chat or voice they deserve to punished. What he is saying that what CCP Eterne said leaves a big gapping hole.

Sexual Harassment should be defined. It is not.

For example;- If I teabag someone be it a guy or girl does that count as sexual harassment? Gamers forever have been teabagging other gamers.

And if someone really has aproblem with another person they could always block them. Its simple.

Seems too sexist to me.

If getting boxed in is the "real" issue at hand... that's really immature to get mad about. Ya its annoying when it happens, but seriously. I cant believe anyone would think its such a huge problem that it needs to be addressed.

If that legitimately makes you mad, then you deserve it because you are probably not old enough to play this game anyways.

how creepy do you have to be to box in a character because its female? If you have to ask, you are in the wrong.

I'm just going to say this: Most women fed up with this behavior have tried, many, many times, to ask (or told) guys to stop harassing them. Most of the time it results in MORE harassment. Very, very rarely will a guy stop because their target asked them to; it is a challenge to them to be worse.

You can say "keep trying and someone will eventually stop" but when the normal response is to be worse...is the remote possibility of getting it to stop really better than all the extra harassment received?

And...why is it on the woman to get them to stop? What about all the guys that sit there and say nothing?

Fighting viciously with someone though doesn't really produce a long lasting result either. It is only a short term solution. And in all honesty, imposing your will upon someone only produces a situation where the the individual that was imposed upon only seeks those opportunities to escape the imposition of unwanted regimentation.

So be careful on how you begin to approach a problem and devise your solution. By actively interacting and engaging the perpetrator of the offense with a more compassionate stance, you will be able to educate them to the pain their action brings. It is not about it being the responsibility of either just the man or the woman, rather it is the responsibility of both in helping create a more equitable social situation.

Attacking my perceptions and view points are not winning you or anyone else brownie points. I am just offering you an alternative.

wall of text

You seem to assume that men have never dealt with harassment nor will they ever get the chance to be harassed therefore there is no possible way they can know anything about this subject.

Sorry but you're wrong.

wall of text

So please, stop the man hate. That's all.

So its OK...for men to hate on women...but not OK...for women to hate on men?

Makes sense...

So its OK...for men to hate on women...but not OK...for women to hate on men?

Makes sense...

And where exactly did I imply that?

Sexual harassment is not ok under any circumstance, and i doubt anyone would disagree with that statement.

Then, why do you keep implying that it is not a problem in game and saying that women need to stop complaining about it?

Again, where exactly did I ever imply that?

Dismissing posts as "wall of texts".

Not answering questions directed at you, but brushing them aside with irrelevant topics. Saying to "stop the man hate"

I've got to agree with you on some level. The childish babble that comes along with playing an online fps is probably the worst part of the game, with all due respect to the work that has been put into this title of course.

Two things, CCP has put in a block and a mute feature. That's how you get rid of those sexist bastards. That's about all they can do. I do agree that we need a way of reporting inappropriate names though. Like there was a guy's name who was just a racial slur. Not cool.

First off, it's bad enough just having a female avatar having people follow you around going "OMG your character has [mammary glands] ! i better stare at them as much I can right now, 'cuz no woman would ever let me do that in real-life." If you try and walk away they just hound you down during the entire time you're waiting on the bridge before the match starts.
God forbid if I actually speak aloud to a squadmate, who then thinks he's allowed all manner of hate-speech imaginable for the insufferable nature of having a woman on his squad..

I'd rather not have the bridge that have people chase me every single game, then hear such wonderful things when I join a match without people I know. There needs to be a way to report these actions and to prevent them

Oh noe's. You sound like you've never played an online game before. Everyone goes ape sh** when they hear a girl on the mic. And you making a big deal over it is not the best way to go about it. There is a block function, and a mute option. And getting irritated because some people are "hounding" you is a bit ridiculous... especially when everyone is stuck on the bridge without a choice anyway.

And there is always those people who are just ingrates, or annoying in general. Mute/block them.

I get "hounded" because i have Primordial militia gear. You don't see me posting a thread whining about all the people grinding on my suit trying to get the camera in my dudes crotch.


Please, grow up and enjoy the game for the love of god and all that is holy.

First off, it's bad enough just having a female avatar having people follow you around going "OMG your character has [mammary glands] ! i better stare at them as much I can right now, 'cuz no woman would ever let me do that in real-life." If you try and walk away they just hound you down during the entire time you're waiting on the bridge before the match starts.
God forbid if I actually speak aloud to a squadmate, who then thinks he's allowed all manner of hate-speech imaginable for the insufferable nature of having a woman on his squad..

I'd rather not have the bridge that have people chase me every single game, then hear such wonderful things when I join a match without people I know. There needs to be a way to report these actions and to prevent them