Please just scrap this hybrid Skill point system you guys currently have in the beta of Dust514, as some of you might know the Skill planning in Eve is much and much better then this ****** character progression we have right now.

Don't make the Game about who gets the most skill points = 1337 status, make it about getting the ISK!

I've been telling myself this game would be so much better off with the skill planning that Eve has and now its time for you guys to admit it, CCP has been tweaking around and nerfing and boosting the skill gain in the last couple of months and i had enough.

If they implement the SP system they have in Eve there wouldn't be a grind for SP, there wouldn't be boosting for SP, there wouldn't be this sooo unoriginal Kill = points = character progression ripoff system.

The Skill planning in Eve is what brings back the daily players to train their pilots (Together with all the other **** you can do in that game) Why NOT put it in Dust? like seriously my mind is blown right now.

TL;DR Just copy/paste the SP/Skill planning system from EVE into Dust already!

NO!
I shall spend seven years on this game, become the most powerful sentient being in the world,
AND YOU SHALL BOW DOWN TO ME!

Please just scrap this hybrid Skill point system you guys currently have in the beta of Dust514, as some of you might know the Skill planning in Eve is much and much better then this ****** character progression we have right now.

Don't make the Game about who gets the most skill points = 1337 status, make it about getting the ISK!

I've been telling myself this game would be so much better off with the skill planning that Eve has and now its time for you guys to admit it, CCP has been tweaking around and nerfing and boosting the skill gain in the last couple of months and i had enough.

If they implement the SP system they have in Eve there wouldn't be a grind for SP, there wouldn't be boosting for SP, there wouldn't be this sooo unoriginal Kill = points = character progression ripoff system.

The Skill planning in Eve is what brings back the daily players to train their pilots (Together with all the other **** you can do in that game) Why NOT put it in Dust? like seriously my mind is blown right now.

TL;DR Just copy/paste the SP/Skill planning system from EVE into Dust already!

Actually, i'd say that the current system is more or less the way to go.
I played a lot less than many of my teammates on this build since it started and i only have 250K SP less than them. And this number have to take into account that there was monday as a "bonus day".

This anti-grind system, no matter how hard some people criticize it is not that bad. It helps to avoid a huge gap to be created between players with very different time to invest in the game and keeps EVE and Dust on a more or less even field regarding shared skills while still allowing a reward for biggest gamer.

May not be perfect as biggest player are reaching the cap in a few days and can get frustrated but if they absolutely want to maintain this active SP thing, it's "better".

Personnaly, i always rooted for a Passive SP system only. Takes away the grinding aspect. Kills the run for WP in game in order to get more SP wich would help to favor teamplay imo. But i think it's now to late to go back. Imagine how hard people would QQ on getting no bonus SP for their 7 hours play per day.

ENOUGH! I could take it either way, but with all of this squabbling going on the Bosse has to step in. I can't even stand to read my way through all of these posts with all of this pathetic bickering going on.

Both systems have their merits.

The current system IS unfair to people who will get left behind because they can't play 24/7.

The EVE system IS a little to slow paced for a FPS audience.

How about you guys grow a pair (ladies are excluded from growing a set of dangalies) and compromise? This game has to be as fair for everyone as possible to reach the largest audience, so how about this:

1. Implement the EVE system

2. Allow players to gain small SP bonuses at the end of each battle that go towards the skill you are training so FPS players can feel better that they are working towards a goal instead of just playing for ISK and victory. Still scale the SP to how well you did in battle, but reduce the amount significantly and remove the cap.

This way those of you who play all of the time are still getting to work on improving your character, but those of you who can't play all of the time still get to play without worrying that all of your friends are getting light years ahead of you. in this way both sides give a little for the better of all. People who play all of the time progress more slowly, but the other people aren't entirely left behind. And those who don't play all of the time don't progress as fast, but they will still be within a decent range of where their friends/squad mates are.

As for new players, I see no reason why doing things this way wouldn't be easy enough for them to grasp if you believe they can already understand the insanely huge menu system and skill system we are dealing with now.

EDIT: If someone already mentioned this please forgive me, I couldn't stand to read through all the whining.

And for players who sometimes have to miss a week or two at a time? Or only get to play a couple of hour two or three days a week? People live busy lives, some far busier than others. I think going with an EVE SP system with a small SP bonus based on your performance at the end of battle and no SP cap is the way to go.

Grinders who are intent on grinding as much as they can will be able to do so, but without being able to get too very much further ahead than the rest of us. Grinding is a passion for those people, so as long as you let them grind and stay a little ways ahead of the pack they might whine a bit but they'll manage. For most of them they mainly want the bragging rights of being ahead of everyone else.

Casual players will be able to keep up with the game because it's paced in a way that allows them to have a life outside of Dust without being left behind inside Dust. That's the biggest issue there, these gamers want to be able to be a part of this without having to dedicate half of their life to it. And sometimes they want to play other games for a bit, but don't want to be left behind when they come back.

I'm telling you, EVE SP system/Small performance based SP bonus/No SP cap would be a good compromise to settle on that would let everyone get a little of what they want without one side giving up everything they want.

ENOUGH! I could take it either way, but with all of this squabbling going on the Bosse has to step in. I can't even stand to read my way through all of these posts with all of this pathetic bickering going on.

Both systems have their merits.

The current system IS unfair to people who will get left behind because they can't play 24/7.

LOLWUT?

and how is EVE time based system allowing newbies to catch up when they will ALWAYS be left behind with NO WAY to close the gap? an active system allows someone who starts months later to catch up to a casual player who had a headstart, EVE time based system does not allow this the gap will always be a FIXED amount

why is that so hard for some to understand? this is a FPS it needs active progression more than passive

the skillcap is in place for 24/7 players once thts reached passive SP will be the thing
ppl seem to forget that there will be PASSIVE boosters as well

if u cant play often slap on a passive booster.

EVE's system punishes those who dont join the game on day 1.

LOLWUT?

and how is EVE time based system allowing newbies to catch up when they will ALWAYS be left behind with NO WAY to close the gap? an active system allows someone who starts months later to catch up to a casual player who had a headstart, EVE time based system does not allow this the gap will always be a FIXED amount

why is that so hard for some to understand? this is a FPS it needs active progression more than passive

the skillcap is in place for 24/7 players once thts reached passive SP will be the thing
ppl seem to forget that there will be PASSIVE boosters as well

if u cant play often slap on a passive booster.

EVE's system punishes those who dont join the game on day 1.

I don't like the idea of making the SP gain passive. Like others have said here people like to win, but they also like to progress.

The hard cap is pretty painful, but it hasn't stopped me playing. I'm curious about where this game is going however.

The thing is I don't see the average joe FPS player out there putting up with it at all. They're all that used to being drip fed rewards every few matches that if they don't get it, they won't be sat there waiting 6 months for a new gun for example. I want people to shoot and this current system and one that purely uses time will put off the majority of FPS players out there if you ask me. Us players who are planning on playing this game will need people to shoot, so we have to cater for the cannon fodder.

The other thing I find pretty bemusing is when these threads come up and people defend CCP's decision to add something like this. They used the reasoning that it makes it so nobody gets that far ahead of the curve. Well what happens 6 months to a year down the line?. New players then will be 6months behind the curve. Do we impede the whole player base then to compensate those guys for not being around?.

The whole reason for this system is beyond ridiculous if you ask me.

You want a serious response?
EvE is, correct me if I'm wrong, NOT a first person shooter.
Dust 514, once again correct me if I'm wrong IS a first person shooter.
Despite being made by the same developer, they are completely different genres and should be structured as so, my point being no copy and paste.

That's not saying much, he seems to hate all games. The Biggest problem with EVE, is it's not much fun unless you're in Null sec or pirating in Low sec. Sitting in empire and watching skills train while spinning your ship is about as fun as watching paint dry. Which is of course why I myself don't play much unless I'm in an alliance in Null sec.

I agree half and half. The skill cap isn't necessarily a bad thing, it evens the playing field.

The only thing I could suggest would be after hitting the skill cap to have it convert all extra war points to ISK gain. But again, unless you're in a corp that believes in sharing wealth, that would also create an isk disparity. Though, that may end up being the purpose of the PVE portion of the game, to make isk outside of PVP.

I could see the merit of using EVE passive skill system in Dust. It would take the focus of gaining SP through Farming war points. It would in part make the skill table secondary or tertiary to actual game play or proper fitting from what you can use. In the last build I only had about 4m SP towards the end, and due to proper fitting, weapon usage, and sticking with teammates could still take down Advanced and proto vehicles, and people with proto suits and weapons. If done like EVE, in passive mode, the first 3 levels of any skill don't really take all that long to train. Then after level 4 it slows down greatly, the feeling of accomplishment you get from going to level 4 to 5 even in a passive system is still there, due to being able to use tech2 or prototype gear.

But on the other hand, there should be reward for actually playing the game.. That could be in the form of SP gain boost while actively playing I think. Say double SP gain during time actually active per match. War points would go completely towards ISK gain, or make War points work like Loyalty points in EVE where you can use them to purchase special faction gear BPC's.

Don't forget that they're going to be adding booster drugs, which temporarily add skill levels or skill clusters.

But, it still doesn't fix the fact that they need to fix the problem of people WP farming, for a great many reasons.

You want a serious response?
EvE is, correct me if I'm wrong, NOT a first person shooter.
Dust 514, once again correct me if I'm wrong IS a first person shooter.
Despite being made by the same developer, they are completely different genres and should be structured as so, my point being no copy and paste.

Please just scrap this hybrid Skill point system you guys currently have in the beta of Dust514, as some of you might know the Skill planning in Eve is much and much better then this ****** character progression we have right now.

Don't make the Game about who gets the most skill points = 1337 status, make it about getting the ISK!

I've been telling myself this game would be so much better off with the skill planning that Eve has and now its time for you guys to admit it, CCP has been tweaking around and nerfing and boosting the skill gain in the last couple of months and i had enough.

If they implement the SP system they have in Eve there wouldn't be a grind for SP, there wouldn't be boosting for SP, there wouldn't be this sooo unoriginal Kill = points = character progression ripoff system.

The Skill planning in Eve is what brings back the daily players to train their pilots (Together with all the other **** you can do in that game) Why NOT put it in Dust? like seriously my mind is blown right now.

TL;DR Just copy/paste the SP/Skill planning system from EVE into Dust already!

Dust is a radically different game from eve.

They would never toss the skill based skilling system they currently have.

Nor should they. You want to loose the shooter crowd? Dont award them for being good FPS players.

Eve skill system doesn't work in dust.

The end.

Please just scrap this hybrid Skill point system you guys currently have in the beta of Dust514, as some of you might know the Skill planning in Eve is much and much better then this ****** character progression we have right now.

Don't make the Game about who gets the most skill points = 1337 status, make it about getting the ISK!

I've been telling myself this game would be so much better off with the skill planning that Eve has and now its time for you guys to admit it, CCP has been tweaking around and nerfing and boosting the skill gain in the last couple of months and i had enough.

If they implement the SP system they have in Eve there wouldn't be a grind for SP, there wouldn't be boosting for SP, there wouldn't be this sooo unoriginal Kill = points = character progression ripoff system.

The Skill planning in Eve is what brings back the daily players to train their pilots (Together with all the other **** you can do in that game) Why NOT put it in Dust? like seriously my mind is blown right now.

TL;DR Just copy/paste the SP/Skill planning system from EVE into Dust already!

Most First Person Shooters Multiplayer element nowadays allow you to grind Experience Points to simply unlock Weaponry that is instantly usable without Skill Progression.

Still look at it like this, with your own logic techncially why doesn't the game simply remove Skills altogether for simple unlocking?
In any case... I would say the current implimentation in-place doesn't really cater itself well to either Casual or Hardcore players, as both realistically get the short end of the stick.

Skillpoints frankly shouldn't be seen in the same way as traditional FPS Experience Points.
We've already been down this path with EVE Online, this is why we have a purely passive system today that no longer even includes bonus' for new players.

CCP have tried many times to "improve" the situation of new vs old players, with each time causing issues. Yes this initially even meant there was an "Active Skillpoint" system, where honestly most players actually exploited to an absolutely horrible extent that frankly gave us a truely devastating advantage over average players.

I see this again within DUST 514, sure there is a limitation placed to prevent it getting ridiculous; but the fact really remains that honestly ... Active Skillpoint Aquisition frankly is a lost cause. I said it in another post, but I will echo it here.

I'm not against players who put more time in to the game getting a bonus of sorts; in a similar mannor that implants within EVE work. Given you die in DUST so often that realistically Implants would be a lost cause without them being incredibly cheap or unrealistically pluggin in constantly ... well instead it would make sense if this "boosting potencial" was handed over to active gameplay.

If you look at it like this, you should be allowed via AUR to purchase Skill Boosters; that provide similar enhancements as +1, +2 and +3 Implant Sets to gaining Passive Skillpoints. (The current Active Booster would be like a +3)

Though playing though you could enhance this boost amount up to the similar improvement you see with +5 Implants, however this bonus gradually degrades over time. (obviously not being able to go lower than whatever Active Booster you currently have implanted)

You could get 2 Social Skillbooks that could increase the amount of boost provided per game and reduce the degradation; that would be useful for players who perhaps might not be able to have as much time to play as Hardcore players.

If the amount added to the Active Boost decreased (diminishing return) based on how close they were to +5, then this mean that they would end up grinding more while still seeing a benefit albeit small to their SP gains... thus they would never feel like buying Active Boosters is a waste, nor would they feel like the games they play are also a waste of time for their Skillpoints.

Although personally I would suggest those who hit limitations probably need to actually turn off their consoles once in a while and go outside, point here is that this system would provide an "Edge" rather than a "Overwheling Advantage" that needs strict capping to prevent system exploitation.

Mind I also believe that DUST is (or was I guess given how close to launch it is) a good oppurtunity to fix some of the issues with the Skill System that EVE now has due to how the game has been expanded. They are currently retroactively fixing EVE right now, I don't think DUST should've fallen in to the same pitfalls.

Still I will leave that to another post.

Please just scrap this hybrid Skill point system you guys currently have in the beta of Dust514, as some of you might know the Skill planning in Eve is much and much better then this ****** character progression we have right now.

Don't make the Game about who gets the most skill points = 1337 status, make it about getting the ISK!

I've been telling myself this game would be so much better off with the skill planning that Eve has and now its time for you guys to admit it, CCP has been tweaking around and nerfing and boosting the skill gain in the last couple of months and i had enough.

If they implement the SP system they have in Eve there wouldn't be a grind for SP, there wouldn't be boosting for SP, there wouldn't be this sooo unoriginal Kill = points = character progression ripoff system.

The Skill planning in Eve is what brings back the daily players to train their pilots (Together with all the other **** you can do in that game) Why NOT put it in Dust? like seriously my mind is blown right now.

TL;DR Just copy/paste the SP/Skill planning system from EVE into Dust already!