This is all about AR type guns and gun game. So before you freak read

After a few matchs on dust comming out with a reasonable kill ratio, I was invited to a match in CoD and noticed something between the two games the differince between the twos hipfire accuacy and down the sights aiming. Now I know this isnt CoD and is unique, but CoD gun game is well perfected and lessons and ideas from it shouldnt be ignored completely

In dust I can peg anyone at medium/longrange with the hipfire, I can kill people accuarctly while running with hipfire, to the point that the looking down sights on dust is pointless when compared to all the advantage of running around with hipfire. For example crouching and aiming down sights should give you.a major advantage with a smaller hitbox and better accuarcy however it doesnt its far better to run around or strafe your enemy with hipfire.

on CoD however you have to aim down the sights to accuarctly hit targets, and crouching and aiming is always going to stomp.some moron running around spraying and praying. After a few matchs of getting used to diffrent games agian I realized I was immidtetally bring up my sights when I saw some one and crouching if circumstance allowed and I was king of Cod agian amonst my friends

The biggest reason for this is how accuarct hipfire is vs scoped. And the fact the scope is so slow to turn when the other guy is strafing. But I cant discont the diffrence between 3shot kills and 15 shot kills.

I think that hipfire should be more inaccuarct than what it is now, hipfire while running should be near impossible that and when scopes should have more turn speed,

Another thing thay could be done is have both be fairly difficult to aim hipfire and scoped and have 2 or 3 skills for each that make them better(spiecilizing in hipfire vs sights) but running and firing from the hip should be alot more inaccuart than it is now.

[quote=Avenger 245]

I think that hipfire should be more inaccuarct than what it is now, hipfire while running should be near impossible that and when scopes should have more turn speed,

Hip fire is accurate because we have Active Aim Assist.

Does your sig play into this? its the only area I can think of it having a serious effect right now. It would make sense to me that we mostly have DS skill at 1 and or lots of shield mods and have massive sig that helps people auto aim at us because we can't actually see what its doing.

Well atleast I not alone in my opinion I think CoD has a far better combat system than halo(even of it was stupid with armor) and think it would be better to have ADS be superior over hipfire at medium range which is why I suggested it

COD: MW2 has one of the best combat systems of any FPS I know.

l'd like to see aim assist removed but that's just me.

NO

I love accurate hipfire, and aiming down sights should only be required for longer ranges. I don't want hipfire to be more "inaccuarct " as the OP said. Don't nerf hipfire, just give aiming down sights a larger accuracy boost.
Forcing people to have to use aiming down sight to be accurate only makes sense in high damage/low health games like CoD or BF. This game is more like Section 8, where mobility is more important than who saw who first; people die instantly games like CoD so more about who sees who first and shoots first (since first few shots usually kill), so mobility isn't really as important. High health and low damage means seeing someone first and shooting first doesn't guarantee victory, so maneuvering is needed, hence why being able to effectively fire without aiming down sight is a must.

I renounce, reject, and repudiate this request.

Well then we should never need to aim we are so much evolved tech wise we should use smart bullets and they go after the nearest target. In fact anything that requires skill should be discouraged. Everyone should have the same gear, same hp and same advantage. Also instead of being called dust they can call it the new communist socialist project.

But kidding aside here, it takes a certain amount of skill to aim and maintain that aim on the target and what bothers me is while I'm aiming despite I am getting in head shots with the ar some bozo is hipfiring me with a militia grade weapon and running faster than I can target. Why reward the guy with no desire to learn skill in aiming hell why have a aim even in the game if its supposed to be worse than hipfire.

However hipfire close range should be more effective I suppose but when its medium to long that's bs sorry

I still dissagree that hipfiring takes more skill, after all its got a better range and hit ratio than someone at medium distanced shooting you in the head several times. When I find myself in a match where I'm being out gunned due to hipfiring I switch to hipfire and seem to do allright. The game should at least give no dissadvantage to those who want to use a scope and fire, next time ill check though to see if sensitivity affects scoped view that might be my issue and need to turn up the sensitivity.

+1 OP.

Does anyone use the sights on the smg ? try it, it's a joke.

People have no skill so they want this game to take no skill.

This isn't a CoD. CoD has low health this does not. Strafe speeds are a must in high health shooters.

I have a hard time believing that any of you have ever played a high health shooters if you believe a high health game should have bad hip fire. So much fail.

I hate when people try to bring realism to justify their video game arguments. What is realistically possible for a soldier today doesn't necessarily apply to mercenaries living thousands of years into the future using equipment more advanced than anything we currently have available.
More importantly, there are genuine gameplay reasons why its important to have accurate hipfire, which I explained previously.

So your saying you just want to play an ADS shooter where everybody plays defensively and camps.

I'm sorry but if you want to go play a game where you walk around with your scope up your ass go play COD.

well realism aside the games ADS is mess up and should be more accaurct than hipfire, so i suggest quicker movement while ads and hipfire is to accuarct at medium and long range and should reflect the difficulty of holding a gun stable. movement would still count simple because of the hi health but ads wont be useless and hipfire wont be ungodly accuarct.


actually my scope will be up your when i kill your ass dont forget that. try and make valid points like kagehoshi and dont tell me to go play another game.

Well that's good to hear that they plan on tweaking it, personally I would never like to see a nerf if something is overpowered then buff everything else to make up the difference.

I would love to see reduced hip fire accuracy, and more incentive to aim down the sights while shooting. Likewise, the rate at which we can turn should be increased along with our walking/running speed while aiming (obviously for a dramatic increase in camera shake and lack of accuracy).

I get the impression that above all most of us came here for the potential of realism this game has. It doesn't make sense to pour our collective creative resources into refining and balancing a game who's basic battle mechanic does not realistically represent combat. I find it hard to believe an advanced civilisation stages wars in which its sophisticated ground units strafe around each other whilst firing all over the place.

I fully support more accurate ADS. ADS should be more accurate than hipfire.
I fully support more accurate crouch firing. Crouching should give better accuracy than standing.
I'm not sure if these things already give an accuracy boost, and if it need an increase, or if these things give no boost at all.
That being said...

Just don't touch my hipfire accuracy. I like the current accuracy.
If CCP did this, I would have no problem.

ADS is more accurate than hipfire. Because people can't snap to ADS like COD or BF they cry

technically crouch hipfire is more accuacrt than standing and running hipfire IS less accuarct but you have to strain your eyes looking to even notice it, which is why i suggest running hipfire be made less accaurct by 30% less and standing hipfire be 10 or 15 % less accuart and leave crouch the same so there is some noticable diffrence between them.


idea, make a skill for snapping and make a skill for moving faster while scope, however scope tracking speed should be increased to be able to keep up with assaults.

another idea do the same for hipfire if they lower its accuarcy and make skills for improving hipfire to almost what it is now.

I like that having it as a skill you have to invest in hipfire or scope.

Stupid thread with stupid ideas. Go play COD if you want to ADS more.

actually i still for weakening hipfire but providing skills to make it almost as good as it is now.
but yes the primary reason for this thread is to make ADS better and more viable
protoman cant find any argument other than telling me to go play CoD, well he can go back to Halo for all i care, i think the game would benfit immensely for having both hipfire and ADS being viable methods for combat, provided the skills for it are trained up and for skills to improve hipfire to be added hipfire needs to be made less accaurct.

actually i still for weakening hipfire but providing skills to make it almost as good as it is now.
but yes the primary reason for this thread is to make ADS better and more viable
protoman cant find any argument other than telling me to go play CoD, well he can go back to Halo for all i care, i think the game would benfit immensely for having both hipfire and ADS being viable methods for combat, provided the skills for it are trained up and for skills to improve hipfire to be added hipfire needs to be made less accaurct.

First of all how isn't ADS viable when it's primarily used for long range kills as intended? Secondly you really want to run around a map snapping to ADS like in COD for every kill. ADSing for every kill is borderline ********. Not to mention people look stupid doing it. Third it limits your view when confronted with multiple enemy's.

Hipfire and ADS both work as intended. Skills already exist in the game to decrease bullet dispersion overall so ADS and hipfiring works more effectively so this whole thread makes no sense.

first I plused ya for giving a good argument on this.

second is I am thinking medium range to long should be a AR, well long would be a sniper yes, I switch to to hipfire when close to a target cause A. it makes sense being that close that hip fire should be better. However I don't want a nerf to hip fire but want aim or ADS to be more accurate at distances. If you are 50 meters from me why is it hipfire outweighs scoping? I mean tech wise in the future would not they improve hipfire so eye hand coordination is above par? Why can I not scope in with my visor and use the same mechanics as you? I don't want to see a nerf for either of us but I would like to use aim and be just as accurate as I should be. But I don't want those playing to be nerfed to benefit me after all I want the enjoyment of a good fight. I really think we all could be satisfied with a slight improvement to the ADS and no nerf to your hipfire abilities.

Sharpshooter skill it up....

look at it this way ADS and hipfire should have ineart weakness such as less visablity and less pinpoint accaurcy becuase of what they are and hipfire in general is far to accuarct when compared to ADS. each method should be used for its idea situation and the player should pick which one he speicelize in for example comming up on alone guy at medium range you should bring up your scope and put rounds down killing him if he doesnt react fast enough, and hipfire should be used for CQC and multiple targets neither should be good at the others job.

this game isnt anything like CoD but that doesnt mean it ADS should be worthless and hipfire should be only option, right now even with all our health i can walk up and gun someone(with hipfire) and kill them in 2 or 3 seconds if all the bullets hit. so ADS is viable if only its turning speed was a little faster and hipfire wasnt so overpowered.

Hipfire SHOULD not be able to accaurct and consistently hit and kill at medium and long range, i suggest lowering the accaurcy enough so hipfire still works at close range or when there our multiple enemys, which where it should be used, but inaccaurct enough so it cant kill at medium range. i even suggest having skills for improving hipfire if it were nerfed in that way, just not quite all the way back up to the impossible accaurcy.

i think ADS should be viable method for medium range or killing lone wolfs, i thinking increasing its turning speed whild ADS overall would be a simple help and maybe adding skills for quicker draw and for faster movement speed while ADS.

this has both CoD people and Halo(only one i could think of with lots of hipfire) people coming both methods should be viable options and have their places on the battle field, but as it stands hipfire is the good for every range and ADS is next to pointless

You lost quit posting. ADS and Hipfire is fine. This is basically a whine thread because people are destroying you.

well I would like the improvement to ADS first I feel I could stand toe to toe with the best hipfire guys out there with a decent ADS in my hands. Sure aiming should be better but if we have many players not wanting it why do we have to nerf them ? Lets make it equal so you have your choice and can enjoy the game the same as them?

So your saying you just want to play an ADS shooter where everybody plays defensively and camps.

Yes, that's what I want, at least for the team that's defending. If you want to attack an enemy that's behind cover, you need to use tactics. That's what flanking, vehicles, and orbital strikes are for.

The thing that many of you who've never played EVE don't realize is that it doesn't enforce balance at all. You should never get into a fight you don't think you can win. You should use any and all advantages to destroy your opponent. EVE (and probably DUST) is not about fighting fair, in fact fighting fair is completely antithetical to EVE.

So if your opponent is camping (presumably on defense) then bring more friends or throw more money at them in the form of weapons, orbital strikes, hiring mercs, or whatever else you can. It's the EVE way.

This is all about AR type guns and gun game. So before you freak read

After a few matchs on dust comming out with a reasonable kill ratio, I was invited to a match in CoD and noticed something between the two games the differince between the twos hipfire accuacy and down the sights aiming. Now I know this isnt CoD and is unique, but CoD gun game is well perfected and lessons and ideas from it shouldnt be ignored completely

CoD gun play may be perfected for CoD. But for reality it sits at a 0 Sigma level.

Look at combat footage from real battles. See anyone strafing?
No

See any running around, hip-fireing assault riffles?
I'd say: No.


What does that say about CoD?

look at it this way ADS and hipfire should have ineart weakness such as less visablity and less pinpoint accaurcy becuase of what they are and hipfire in general is far to accuarct when compared to ADS. each method should be used for its idea situation and the player should pick which one he speicelize in for example comming up on alone guy at medium range you should bring up your scope and put rounds down killing him if he doesnt react fast enough, and hipfire should be used for CQC and multiple targets neither should be good at the others job.

this game isnt anything like CoD but that doesnt mean it ADS should be worthless and hipfire should be only option, right now even with all our health i can walk up and gun someone(with hipfire) and kill them in 2 or 3 seconds if all the bullets hit. so ADS is viable if only its turning speed was a little faster and hipfire wasnt so overpowered.

Hipfire SHOULD not be able to accaurct and consistently hit and kill at medium and long range, i suggest lowering the accaurcy enough so hipfire still works at close range or when there our multiple enemys, which where it should be used, but inaccaurct enough so it cant kill at medium range. i even suggest having skills for improving hipfire if it were nerfed in that way, just not quite all the way back up to the impossible accaurcy.

i think ADS should be viable method for medium range or killing lone wolfs, i thinking increasing its turning speed whild ADS overall would be a simple help and maybe adding skills for quicker draw and for faster movement speed while ADS.

this has both CoD people and Halo(only one i could think of with lots of hipfire) people coming both methods should be viable options and have their places on the battle field, but as it stands hipfire is the good for every range and ADS is next to pointless

Why would you say that? Why would you make that point? You realize you're now going to drown in a tsunami of "gameplay trumps reality" and "reality sucks" and "quick-scoping is too possible!" and other such drivel?

At anyrate it is just foolish to try to use the sights at less 50-75m because the run and strafe speeds are to high for that. Your sights should be reserved for targets over 75-150m on the AR.

Wow. We should have to use to sights for anything past 25m.

At anyrate it is just foolish to try to use the sights at less 50-75m because the run and strafe speeds are to high for that. Your sights should be reserved for targets over 75-150m on the AR.

Try to remember how fast the guys run they will change that that distance real quick. And it hipfire in controlled bursts in completely possible out to almost 75m with an M4 not as good as ADS but very do-able for someone who practices. So thousands of years into the future yeah its easier. Also what AR are you using because if it is the breach no wonder you cant hit at longer ranges. It has no zoom at all.

I am aware that gameplay greater then realism. My point however is that in reality I don't need to aim at anything under 50m therefore why is it unreasonable to hit at all from 50m with hipfire. In CQC I put the front sight of my rifle on the target pull the trigger a few times and it is dead. ADS should be more accurate than hipfire but it is unecessary under 25-50m in almost any game or real life. I also asked which rifle avenger was using as they have different levels of zoom but they same ADS movement speed.

see thats what i was thinking i just cant figure out how the meters translate into ingame distance, upto 10 meters to me is close range and hipfire should be required, after that up to 15 meters and hipfire shoudl start falling off to hard to hit, at about 20 meters ADS shouldb e used 50 meters is long range and 75m is left to snipers.

i would love to post some gameplay just to prove how ******** this thread actually is.

i think both ADS and hipfire should be valid and should be useful if skills are trained up for it, i dont think hipfire should be as accaurct as it is now at what i consider medium range, i think ADS should be far better at medium range, which it is not in the current build hipfire is good at short medium range.

now according to you ADS should only be used for longr range 75m + i disagree hipfire should be useful for close range 20m - and ADS should be useful for medium range 25-60m.

realism and everything else aside i want a game where BOTH hipfire and ADS are valid methods that can be used in a range of combat sitution, i dont want a game where hipfire is dominate for most thing and ADS is only useful for long range.