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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
4
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:13:00 -
[1] - Quote
Everytime I post in one of those CPM threads about shields before it gets locked...my point gets glossed over. Does anyone else agree that shield regen/recharge is not the problem with the shield tanking?
Shield tanking is not viable cause you are melted by the double & triple damage modded amarr and gallente suits. Not to mention throwing flux grenades are like nukes to shield tankers and they are easier to use than a locus grenade.
I'm not familiar with all of the CPM's style of play or preferences but I do know one has been a longtime advocate for armor and has expressed many times that he felt that shields are in a great place (before he became CPM). Now, in Aeon's threads, everyone is agrees on what the problem with shield tanking is? I don't undersand at all.
It is a simple thing to understand. Armor suit maintain their primary tank and can stack double or triple damage mods on ARs or laser based weapons (20% damage bonus to shields). How can a shield tanker compete with the damage output if we have to sacrifice our primary tank to keep up with their damage output?
In even clearer terms....amarr assault gets to don 700hp of armor with damage mods on a weapon that has a 20% damage bonus to shields. Caldari assault would have a bit over 500 shields if we sacrifice two highs for damage mods. In order to compensate, you see cal assaults with armor plates. Armor tanking on a cal assault defeats the purpose of shield tanking. One plate may be ok but I see 400 hp of armor on cal assaults regularly.
Does everyone disagree with this being the big issue or do people agree that the focus needs to lie here?
"Bring out mass drivers & jump around goddamit"
Check RND out here
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:29:00 -
[2] - Quote
the shield stuff is multi-stage.
Stage 1 is straightening out recharge delays.
1A: This has a massive effect not only on survivability, but on fitting choices. Common wisdom is that a proper shield tank on an assault (if you don't want to just give in and put ferroscales on) is three regulators in the lows. That means a calassault has to devote eight slots to their tank versus a gal/amarr assault's four. One of the lows on a gal/am assault is usually reserved for biotics, sometimes two but usually two ferros or plates and one or two reps. By making regulators less mandatory for a good shield fit rather than absolutely critical it improves the calassault (and to a lesser degree, shield tanked minmatar suits) by a good deal. Suddenly damps, biotics and other modules become an option.
Stage 2 is adjusting modules so they aren't ass.
Stage 3 is making fun of me and my ideas. Seriously, I actually have a sense of humor. I can take it as good as I dish.
Stage 4 is comparing usage and, more importantly Kill per spawn metrics with armor to see if we're on the right track.
Lastly, if we find that we cannot stabilize Shields in a similar Kill/spawn range as the Armor mods, THEN we look at toning down armor.
There is no one on the CPM who is delusional enough to believe that this is the magic bullet that will save all. I push it because lowering shield delays means that fitting options are less automatically dictated for shield suit players if they don't want to have to fit armor for viability.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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Summa Militum
Art.of.Death
Smart Deploy
821
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
I feel like the Caldari should get a dropsuit bonus for shields. Buffing shield modules would help the Caldari but it would also help other factions when the focus right now should be primarily on the Caldari. |
Aeon Amadi
12
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:35:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Everytime I post in one of those CPM threads about shields before it gets locked...my point gets glossed over. Does anyone else agree that shield regen/recharge is not the problem with the shield tanking?
Shield tanking is not viable cause you are melted by the double & triple damage modded amarr and gallente suits. Not to mention throwing flux grenades are like nukes to shield tankers and they are easier to use than a locus grenade.
I'm not familiar with all of the CPM's style of play or preferences but I do know one has been a longtime advocate for armor and has expressed many times that he felt that shields are in a great place (before he became CPM). Now, in Aeon's threads, everyone is agrees on what the problem with shield tanking is? I don't undersand at all.
It is a simple thing to understand. Armor suit maintain their primary tank and can stack double or triple damage mods on ARs or laser based weapons (20% damage bonus to shields). How can a shield tanker compete with the damage output if we have to sacrifice our primary tank to keep up with their damage output?
In even clearer terms....amarr assault gets to don 700hp of armor with damage mods on a weapon that has a 20% damage bonus to shields. Caldari assault would have a bit over 500 shields if we sacrifice two highs for damage mods. In order to compensate, you see cal assaults with armor plates. Armor tanking on a cal assault defeats the purpose of shield tanking. One plate may be ok but I see 400 hp of armor on cal assaults regularly.
Does everyone disagree with this being the big issue or do people agree that the focus needs to lie here?
I think every CPM is pretty unanimous that we generally hate damage mods existing and if we had our way they'd probably go the way of the Dodo. Mostly because of situations exactly like you pointed out, which leaves us with one of two options: Either we move to introduce damage mods in the lows to boost shield usage in some six degrees of separation way, or we move for the removal or discouraged use of damage mods in the highs. It's sort of a pickle, for certain, and I don't think we have a solution.
What we are working on though is a multi-step shield proposal (you've seen step one, of which there are about four) because it is something we can advocate changing because it's been needing an overhaul anyway. Shields haven't seen much change since the early days of Uprising and the current system is chaotic and confusing. Which, we're all sort of hesitant to change armor, or damage mods, or basically anything until that system actually has some sort of planned and functional design.
All we're asking for is some feedback and patience. Yes, we understand that the current meta is armor. Yes, we understand that many players feel that a quick solution would be to nerf armor. We're not interested in quick band-aid solutions though, we're interested in long-term benefits that we don't have to keep having these sort of conversations over and to do that we need a functional design that we can work off of.
We want shields and armor to have their unique playstyles and it has always been a design philosophy in Dust 514 that armor was about high HP while shields were about high Regen. That is our baseline.
Cross Atu wrote:
#1 is the base suit stats having a method that provides a solid foundation
#2 is tuning the mods (and hopefully adding a few options as well) to give shields more love and diversity
#3 is looking at possible comparative issues with weapons, such a profile bias, this is more of a side step.
#4 is looking at the raw stats of the armor mods.
Negative Introspection - Aeon's CPM Blog
Skype: nomistrav
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Jonny D Buelle
The Warlords Legion
No Context
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
The problem is shield regen and shield delay. Amarr and Gallente weapons are anti-shield weapons just like Caldari and Minmatar weapons are anti-armour.
Flux grenades are a problem and need to take a look at. Even a basic flux is powerful enough to wipe a Caldari Sent's shields. My proposal is to nerf its damage vs infantry but keep the damage against vechiles the same. I have no idea about numbers.
I also agree that shield tanking is not viable as to have semi-decent shields, you are stacking shield mods in your highs and have no place to put damage modifiers or mylolfibs. Why not either make a new slot for damage modifiers in the suit or make it so they can be fitted in either high slots or low slots.
Logistics Officer of T-W-L
Keeper of the List
Scrub Lord
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Aeon Amadi
12
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:39:00 -
[6] - Quote
Jonny D Buelle wrote:The problem is shield regen and shield delay. Amarr and Gallente weapons are anti-shield weapons just like Caldari and Minmatar weapons are anti-armour.
Flux grenades are a problem and need to take a look at. Even a basic flux is powerful enough to wipe a Caldari Sent's shields. My proposal is to nerf its damage vs infantry but keep the damage against vechiles the same. I have no idea about numbers.
I also agree that shield tanking is not viable as to have semi-decent shields, you are stacking shield mods in your highs and have no place to put damage modifiers or mylolfibs. Why not either make a new slot for damage modifiers in the suit or make it so they can be fitted in either high slots or low slots.
Mostly because of the impact it'd have on TTK. Just imagine a Minmatar Assault running damage mods in the lows and Myos in the highs.
Negative Introspection - Aeon's CPM Blog
Skype: nomistrav
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Jonny D Buelle
The Warlords Legion
No Context
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:
I think every CPM is pretty unanimous that we generally hate damage mods existing and if we had our way they'd probably go the way of the Dodo. Mostly because of situations exactly like you pointed out, which leaves us with one of two options: Either we move to introduce damage mods in the lows to boost shield usage in some six degrees of separation way, or we move for the removal or discouraged use of damage mods in the highs. It's sort of a pickle, for certain, and I don't think we have a solution.
Sorry to nitpick here but removing damage mods completely will severly gimp the Gal Sentinel. The only advantage we have over the Amarr Sent right now is our increased damage output due to stacking damage mods. If you want to remove them, then boost Gal Sent reps.
Barring their removal, push for either damage mods to have their own slot or have them be both a high and low module.
Logistics Officer of T-W-L
Keeper of the List
Scrub Lord
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:45:00 -
[8] - Quote
None of us are pushing to remove anything.
Just because we're looking to push TTK to the slower side a LITTLE bit doesn't mean we're going to try and remove options rather than shore up failing ones
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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Jonny D Buelle
The Warlords Legion
No Context
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:46:00 -
[9] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Jonny D Buelle wrote:The problem is shield regen and shield delay. Amarr and Gallente weapons are anti-shield weapons just like Caldari and Minmatar weapons are anti-armour.
Flux grenades are a problem and need to take a look at. Even a basic flux is powerful enough to wipe a Caldari Sent's shields. My proposal is to nerf its damage vs infantry but keep the damage against vechiles the same. I have no idea about numbers.
I also agree that shield tanking is not viable as to have semi-decent shields, you are stacking shield mods in your highs and have no place to put damage modifiers or mylolfibs. Why not either make a new slot for damage modifiers in the suit or make it so they can be fitted in either high slots or low slots. Mostly because of the impact it'd have on TTK. Just imagine a Minmatar Assault running damage mods in the lows and Myos in the highs.
So give it it's own slot. A slot was added for SKINs, I dont see why it cant be doable to add a slot (lets call it a medium) and put damage mods there. Hell make myos a medium slot mod as well so people have to decide between jumping and melee damage or weapon damage.
Logistics Officer of T-W-L
Keeper of the List
Scrub Lord
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Jonny D Buelle
The Warlords Legion
No Context
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 05:51:00 -
[10] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:None of us are pushing to remove anything.
Just because we're looking to push TTK to the slower side a LITTLE bit doesn't mean we're going to try and remove options rather than shore up failing ones
Im all for reducing the TTK, but not at the risk of making a suit which members of the community use not viable. I apologize for my outburst, but any talk of removing (which, again sorry to nitpick, Aeon hinted at with his "the way of the dodo" comment) damage mods is something I will strongly oppose unless the Gal Sent is able to out rep the Amarr Sent.
Logistics Officer of T-W-L
Keeper of the List
Scrub Lord
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Thaddeus Reynolds
Facepunch Security
423
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:04:00 -
[11] - Quote
Since this thread is now damage mods...what about RoF Mods...or converting the current damage mods to half raw half RoF to help mitigate the Alpha-strike problems
Khanid Logi and Tanker, sometimes AV Heavy or Sniper.
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Jonny D Buelle
The Warlords Legion
No Context
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:07:00 -
[12] - Quote
Thaddeus Reynolds wrote:Since this thread is now damage mods...what about RoF Mods...or converting the current damage mods to half raw half RoF to help mitigate the Alpha-strike problems
Ill take the blame for this derail, making own thread.
Logistics Officer of T-W-L
Keeper of the List
Scrub Lord
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Thaddeus Reynolds
Facepunch Security
423
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:16:00 -
[13] - Quote
Jonny D Buelle wrote:Thaddeus Reynolds wrote:Since this thread is now damage mods...what about RoF Mods...or converting the current damage mods to half raw half RoF to help mitigate the Alpha-strike problems Ill take the blame for this derail, making own thread.
and I'm sorry for continuing it...although it technically is the topic of the OP xD
Shields have numerous issues...from the high-dps that armor necessitated on weapons with laser profiles (and no...a profile reduction isn't going to help shields out here), to the efficiency of the modules, to the support power armor has...to the lack of synergistic modules in the low slots...to Caldari having the worst mobility while using a buffer that is skirmish oriented (Amarr Style Stamina would help here)...but we start at the base level...which is the base stats on the suits, and the mechanics that affect them.
No one is saying that there aren't other problems with the shield suits, nor is anyone saying that if a change to shield recharge and delay is done in a patch that it will be the only shield change for that patch....but in all the discussions of shields, we run into numerous issues when examining the base stats...mostly that while they follow a general idea (mostly) they don't fit on an easily modified function.
Khanid Logi and Tanker, sometimes AV Heavy or Sniper.
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:18:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jonny D Buelle wrote: I will strongly oppose unless the Gal Sent is able to out rep the Amarr Sent.
Oh for want of free reign on one or three skills in the skill tree.
Can I do the dropsuit command and Frame Skills?
I have horrible, glorious ideas
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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Jonny D Buelle
The Warlords Legion
No Context
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:20:00 -
[15] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Jonny D Buelle wrote: I will strongly oppose unless the Gal Sent is able to out rep the Amarr Sent. Oh for want of free reign on one or three skills in the skill tree. Can I do the dropsuit command and Frame Skills? I have horrible, glorious ideas
I have a few ideas myself!
Logistics Officer of T-W-L
Keeper of the List
Scrub Lord
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Thaddeus Reynolds
Facepunch Security
423
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:22:00 -
[16] - Quote
Jonny D Buelle wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:Jonny D Buelle wrote: I will strongly oppose unless the Gal Sent is able to out rep the Amarr Sent. Oh for want of free reign on one or three skills in the skill tree. Can I do the dropsuit command and Frame Skills? I have horrible, glorious ideas I have a few ideas myself!
Now where did I put that spreadsheet
Khanid Logi and Tanker, sometimes AV Heavy or Sniper.
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Aeon Amadi
12
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:24:00 -
[17] - Quote
Jonny D Buelle wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:None of us are pushing to remove anything.
Just because we're looking to push TTK to the slower side a LITTLE bit doesn't mean we're going to try and remove options rather than shore up failing ones
Im all for reducing the TTK, but not at the risk of making a suit which members of the community use not viable. I apologize for my outburst, but any talk of removing (which, again sorry to nitpick, Aeon hinted at with his "the way of the dodo" comment) damage mods is something I will strongly oppose unless the Gal Sent is able to out rep the Amarr Sent.
Was less about increasing TTK (increasing = longer time, decreasing = lessening the time) and more about the fact that damage mods are high-mod exclusive. It's the lesser of two evils to just leave it in because the extremes would be removing it or throwing a pipe-wrench in the TTK by adding in another one and encouraging even more broken fits. In the end it'd only help shield users if they used it and there's nothing to stop an armor tanker from using them either (myos + damage mods is something I'd probably do).
So, the optimal solution is to make utility modules better to encourage their use over HP/Damage mod stacking.
Negative Introspection - Aeon's CPM Blog
Skype: nomistrav
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dzizur
Nos Nothi
1
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:40:00 -
[18] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Jonny D Buelle wrote:The problem is shield regen and shield delay. Amarr and Gallente weapons are anti-shield weapons just like Caldari and Minmatar weapons are anti-armour.
Flux grenades are a problem and need to take a look at. Even a basic flux is powerful enough to wipe a Caldari Sent's shields. My proposal is to nerf its damage vs infantry but keep the damage against vechiles the same. I have no idea about numbers.
I also agree that shield tanking is not viable as to have semi-decent shields, you are stacking shield mods in your highs and have no place to put damage modifiers or mylolfibs. Why not either make a new slot for damage modifiers in the suit or make it so they can be fitted in either high slots or low slots. Mostly because of the impact it'd have on TTK. Just imagine a Minmatar Assault running damage mods in the lows and Myos in the highs.
What's wrong with a glass cannon fit?
And could anyone give me one sensible argument why everyone wants TTK to be longer and longer and longer everytime. Like wtf, it's enough I have to empty 2 full clips from my sidearm to kill a dude...
On topic - as I said in previous thread - IMO there never will be balance between armor and shields if we have equipment that heals armor, and nades that totally wreck shields. But we are not getting any more content anyway so I guess all that fighting with numbers and trying to make armor out of shield is useless. But that's only my opinion |
Larkson Crazy Eye
WarRavens
Imperium Eden
306
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Posted - 2015.09.22 06:58:00 -
[19] - Quote
The problem with shields is there really is no middle ground with the way the game mechanics work right now. Before shields used to be what every one used. Scouts were invincible with hit and run tactics with things like the shot gun and flay lock. They could blitz threw enemy groups, take a few shots and regen to full by the time they turn around for another pass.
So things changed and now with an introduction of more anti shield weapons in the laser riffle, scram riffle, etc shields seem to weak. The problem is shields are insanely strong in some area's still. Even without putting any mods into your suit most shields will fully recover in no time in comparison to armor. Even the basic 400 or so armor a lot of suits start out with takes over 3 minutes to recover. Armor rep mods are expensive to fit and vastly weaker than shield regulators or rechargers in terms of effect.
It's not like there are not countless anti armor weapons out there that eat away against armor users. Core grenades pretty much one shot almost all armor fits but a shield fit with maybe 400 or so shields will tend to live. Yet people want to turn anti shield weapons into nerf darts and make them useless.
Shield values could be buffed, people want higher shield HP totals out of their mods just like armor. But imo then the basic recharge level of most suits should go down as well. After all it takes nearly all of an armor users slots to get 20-30 armor reps per second, yet a lot of drop suits basic recharge starts that high. Never mind the slight stuttering delay armor reps have, coming in two part ticks instead of one big number every second like it's supposed to.
In the end I feel shields are messed up right now but I don't think it's that bad and I would rather have nothing done than some half brained quick fix thrown in that upsets the balance of everything. After all there doesn't seem to be any kind of test server for dust. Almost ever major update had huge game crashing flaws that make it unto the live server. Which greatly diminishes my faith in 'proper balance' of any potential shield changes in the future.
Ib Halfheart, Goblin Tactician: "Everybody but me--CHARGE!"
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.09.22 07:38:00 -
[20] - Quote
Actually I take the philosophy of: the closer you take your shield HP towards armor levels, the closer to base armor regen values you should have to suffer.
It's why the proposal me, Cat merc and Ripley Riley cooked up a while back had a heavy duty extender that penalized the shield rep rate.
Damn thing would require a shield energizer to bring the calsent regen back UP to baseline if you fit three of them.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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TooMany Names AlreadyTaken
Going for the gold
1
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Posted - 2015.09.22 08:04:00 -
[21] - Quote
Lately I've been stomping with my C-I Assault...
4 basic shield ext.
1 basic shield energizer
3 enhanced shield regulators
ARR, BreachSMG, M1 locus, nanohive
I've made it to recharge fast and have miniscule delay, and it's only standard! I see no problem with shield suits apart from low HP.
My sweet summer is gone.
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Varoth Drac
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.09.22 08:37:00 -
[22] - Quote
Weapon profiles are a bit of a moot point, because whilst laser weapons do +20% to shields, explosives do +20% to armour. Also both combat rifles, and crucially HMGs, do +15% to armour.
So I don't think weapon profiles are the issue.
If we consider damage mods, yes armour suits can fit them without sacrificing tank. However, unlike armour suits, shield suits can improve their regen with regulators, without sacrificing tank.
Now, energisers are in an interesting place, as they compete with both extenders and damage mods, and regulators need to be used with them to gain full effect. That's a lot of sacrifice, and I believe that it should come with a high reward.
Also, the damage mod argument only really works in a world where you only fit tank and damage. There are other low slot modules that armour suits would have to sacrifice tank to fit.
I'm not saying shields and armour are balanced, I'm just saying it's not a problem with weapon profiles or damage mods. |
Varoth Drac
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.09.22 08:57:00 -
[23] - Quote
You can still fit damage mods to shield suits, which I do frequently. I don't think damage mods are the problem. |
Devadander
Woodgrain Atari
704
|
Posted - 2015.09.22 11:44:00 -
[24] - Quote
Careful, this kind of talk gets topics locked.
Gêå You want a toe? I can get you a toe dude. Gêå
Joined - 06-28-12 ~Deal with it~
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TheD1CK
Dead Man's Game
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 12:06:00 -
[25] - Quote
The flaw is trying to straighten out the Shield stats on all frames CA >> MN >> GA >> AM
I replied to the CPM thread saying Armour suit Shield stars could "jump off a cliff" and while being a sh!tposter I was making a point, there should not be a curve between the 4 races Shield base stats, as 2 of them are not meant for Shield tanking.
Shield base regen/delay is Shield tanking... normalizing this between all races.. just makes 4 ways to do the same thing, sounds good for balance and a Dust514 additon of COD, like many players I feel that current Shield tanking is OK, it just requires a different mentality and fitting setup. Normalizing this sounds pretty boring for gameplay imo..
The Speed:HP curve that Ratmaster put in place worked, as speed:hp total is a constant on all 4 suits
- Tanking styles are not a constant, as they should be set apart for Shield > Armour 
- want short regen delays with good regen amounts, you Shield tank
- want constant regen underfire, you Armour tank ..
The proposal aims to set current Shield suit regen stats on Armour suits.. just NO!
SOONtm
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TheD1CK
Dead Man's Game
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 12:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Shields are my own, and many mercs primary playstyle.. they work !!!
Tidying up the difference between Scout > Assault > Logistics > Commando > Sentinel +1
As for Recharge/Delays, the proposal made so far does not look good, it equalizes the Shields too much between all 4 races so while a Shield suit is waiting to regen, an Armour suit has 20hp/s reps constant and 20-30 Shields in 4-5sec.. NO.
If AM/GA want Shield stats, cough up some low slots to fit Shield mods, the base stats should not hand them to you.
Reasonable Shield regen stats, CA 35 > MN 30 >> GA 20 > AM 15
The have the delays in favour of MN > CA > AM > GA (for the life on me, do NOT have Armour suit delays less than 6 sec)
For me, Gal having higher amounts of Shield regen and longer delay than Amarr would work, I am less sure on placing MN ahead of CA on delays but it would leave CA higher amount of regen with longer delay than MN.. setting those apart there 
SOONtm
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TheD1CK
Dead Man's Game
2
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Posted - 2015.09.22 12:24:00 -
[27] - Quote
Devadander wrote:Careful, this kind of talk gets topics locked.
The last one got messy,
and I found myself with the same issue as Ydubbs no one gives a damn on your opinion, they just want to mass-debate..
You comment and consider what's there.. boom, the flames get ya
SOONtm
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MexXx Dust-Slayer
Fatal Absolution
497
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Posted - 2015.09.22 13:11:00 -
[28] - Quote
Another option would be to have shield regulators increase resistance by about 4/5/6% to help the balance against damage mods, and/or having regulators increase the shield damage threshold by %.
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Devadander
Woodgrain Atari
704
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Posted - 2015.09.22 13:14:00 -
[29] - Quote
TheD1CK wrote:Devadander wrote:Careful, this kind of talk gets topics locked. The last one got messy, and I found myself with the same issue as Ydubbs no one gives a damn on your opinion, they just want to mass-debate.. You comment and consider what's there.. boom, the flames get ya
If I see one gal/ama regen shields during a firefight I'll burn this mother down...
Gêå You want a toe? I can get you a toe dude. Gêå
Joined - 06-28-12 ~Deal with it~
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Okiniwa
Expert Intervention
Caldari State
20
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Posted - 2015.09.22 13:15:00 -
[30] - Quote
what if we had plasma/laser damage mods to be put in high's and rail/projectile damage mods to be put in lows whilst buffing recharge delays on cal + min assault. I see min + cal assaults with 200-300 shield and 500-340 armour regularly.
This way both armour and shield suits can stack dmg mods while being having viable tank....or they could run biotics....or dual-tank |
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