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N1ck Comeau
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2248
   |
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:02:00 -
[91] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:N1ck Comeau wrote:We really need to see all the changes in 1.8 before we jump to any huge conclusions.
I for one agree with this weapon nerf.
It will make battles more strategic, but in reality, you'll still be doing high damage, you just can't kill someone in 0.5 to 1 second.
if you die that fast, then you need to change your suit.
depending on the weapon that killed you and there skill in it, and how many damage mods they run, headshots or not, a suit with 600 EHP Can die in 1-2 seconds. No one can react that fast. It's crazy. Suits with any less health than that get wrecked even faster.
Tankers- 'Hit us when are hardeners are down"
Proceeds to run three hardeners.
Proud member of RND
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Kristoff Atruin
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
1779
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:04:00 -
[92] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Kristoff Atruin wrote:This will take us back many builds to where teamwork and attention to where you're standing was very important. The interesting thing about proto suits being harder to kill is it makes the wearer cocky and overly aggressive. I killed lots of those guys back in the day. When our squadmate in the lower tier suit retreated mr protobear would push when he should have repositioned, and wound up getting shot at from two or three sides.
That is what you call tactics, not blapping everyone as fast as you can press a button. Why don't guys use tactics now and teamwork? Think about it like this......when I see a heavy, I try to flank him. I don't engage them full on unless I got caught up and have no choice. New players or players with low ehp should do the same. Flank and catch them off guard. With all of these dmg nerfs, you may not be able to do that anymore. They're removing our 15% dmg from rifle proficiency, 5% from complex dmg mods, and reducing the damage per bullet of all the weapons. The duvolle will be an exile.........how will you able to flank someone with a lot of health and kill him if he's running with so much health?
What you're missing is that before when mr protobear appeared, people could react and run away. There was a decision process - do I shoot or change positions. Now the dude gets vaporized the moment he is seen. People literally don't even have time to say over comms, "There's a bad guy here" before they die. Low TTK is death to tactics and teamwork because people die too quickly for battle lines to form in all but the rarest of circumstances. It makes seizing the high ground the only strategy and kills all tactics other than blitz and twitch, which shouldn't even be dignified by calling it a tactic.
"how will you able to flank someone with a lot of health and kill him if he's running with so much health?"
One person shooting someone in the back isn't flanking. You need to stop thinking about 1v1. Flanking is when more than one person is shooting at a target. That's how you'll kill someone with that much health. Ugh...teamwork...it's just horrible, isn't it?
The reduced overall damage, and in particular the proficiency change, will reintroduce thinking to Dust at both the individual and squad level. If you're all carrying combat rifles and you come up against a Caldari heavy you're gonna have a bad time. People are going to start thinking about designing suits that complement others in their squad. People are going to start evaluating encounters - "I don't think I can kill this guy, I should retreat so the guy in my squad who can kill him can help" (note that currently, retreat is not an option). This last point is why squad cohesion is going to start being really important again...you're not going to have dudes lone wolfing it and taking out whole squads of people who happened to be looking the wrong way. The tactics will be maneuvering your forces to put more guns on target than the other side. The superior firepower of a group will matter more than the individuals in that group, and firing lines lasting more than a second or two will create opportunities for people to skirmishers to move and shoot from the sides or behind, negating the advantage of cover. |
axis alpha
Red Star.
EoN.
242
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:32:00 -
[93] - Quote
I just can't wait till 1.8 hits and let's see what the care bears qq bout next. Let's see what other excuses they can come up with for sucking. I'm telling you now in no way shape or form is this new ttk going to help newbs or anyone else for that matter. Yeah this update is the results of skilless players qqing on forums but in reality it's going to benefit them in no way shape or form its going to show who has gun game and who dont
Welcome to CareBear514. Brought to you by the QQ'rs.
Ccp isn't destroying this game the community is.
|
ads alt
DROID EXILES
General Tso's Alliance
40
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:37:00 -
[94] - Quote
axis alpha wrote:I just can't wait till 1.8 hits and let's see what the care bears qq bout next. Let's see what other excuses they can come up with for sucking. I'm telling you now in no way shape or form is this new ttk going to help newbs or anyone else for that matter. Yeah this update is the results of skilless players qqing on forums but in reality it's going to benefit them in no way shape or form its going to show who has gun game and who dont
Its going to make the game more enjoyable... |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2554
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:43:00 -
[95] - Quote
N1ck Comeau wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:N1ck Comeau wrote:We really need to see all the changes in 1.8 before we jump to any huge conclusions.
I for one agree with this weapon nerf.
It will make battles more strategic, but in reality, you'll still be doing high damage, you just can't kill someone in 0.5 to 1 second.
if you die that fast, then you need to change your suit. depending on the weapon that killed you and there skill in it, and how many damage mods they run, headshots or not, a suit with 600 EHP Can die in 1-2 seconds. No one can react that fast. It's crazy. Suits with any less health than that get wrecked even faster.
It's a good thing that I'm recording my pubs now.....video will be up tomorrow
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2554
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:45:00 -
[96] - Quote
ads alt wrote:axis alpha wrote:I just can't wait till 1.8 hits and let's see what the care bears qq bout next. Let's see what other excuses they can come up with for sucking. I'm telling you now in no way shape or form is this new ttk going to help newbs or anyone else for that matter. Yeah this update is the results of skilless players qqing on forums but in reality it's going to benefit them in no way shape or form its going to show who has gun game and who dont Its going to make the game more enjoyable...
It's going to be more frustrating. Especially for guys that can't aim on average skill
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
|
Nothing Certain
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
288
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:52:00 -
[97] - Quote
I guess we are arguing a matter of taste. Personally i find the fact that i die before i have time to react much more frustrating and less fun than i do not being able to kill someone before they react. I might be happiest if i got to kill them instantly but they couldn't do the same, but since we have to choose, I choose a longer TTK.
Because, that's why.
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Nothing Certain
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
288
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:56:00 -
[98] - Quote
axis alpha wrote:I just can't wait till 1.8 hits and let's see what the care bears qq bout next. Let's see what other excuses they can come up with for sucking. I'm telling you now in no way shape or form is this new ttk going to help newbs or anyone else for that matter. Yeah this update is the results of skilless players qqing on forums but in reality it's going to benefit them in no way shape or form its going to show who has gun game and who dont
You seem to be making two contradictory arguments. If this change is going to require a better gun game to be successful in, why are you against it? Your original point was that a good gun game would no longer be important and only tanking HP would work.
Because, that's why.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2554
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 15:58:00 -
[99] - Quote
Kristoff Atruin wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Kristoff Atruin wrote:This will take us back many builds to where teamwork and attention to where you're standing was very important. The interesting thing about proto suits being harder to kill is it makes the wearer cocky and overly aggressive. I killed lots of those guys back in the day. When our squadmate in the lower tier suit retreated mr protobear would push when he should have repositioned, and wound up getting shot at from two or three sides.
That is what you call tactics, not blapping everyone as fast as you can press a button. Why don't guys use tactics now and teamwork? Think about it like this......when I see a heavy, I try to flank him. I don't engage them full on unless I got caught up and have no choice. New players or players with low ehp should do the same. Flank and catch them off guard. With all of these dmg nerfs, you may not be able to do that anymore. They're removing our 15% dmg from rifle proficiency, 5% from complex dmg mods, and reducing the damage per bullet of all the weapons. The duvolle will be an exile.........how will you able to flank someone with a lot of health and kill him if he's running with so much health? What you're missing is that before when mr protobear appeared, people could react and run away. There was a decision process - do I shoot or change positions. Now the dude gets vaporized the moment he is seen. People literally don't even have time to say over comms, "There's a bad guy here" before they die. Low TTK is death to tactics and teamwork because people die too quickly for battle lines to form in all but the rarest of circumstances. It makes seizing the high ground the only strategy and kills all tactics other than blitz and twitch, which shouldn't even be dignified by calling it a tactic. "how will you able to flank someone with a lot of health and kill him if he's running with so much health?" One person shooting someone in the back isn't flanking. You need to stop thinking about 1v1. Flanking is when more than one person is shooting at a target. That's how you'll kill someone with that much health. Ugh...teamwork...it's just horrible, isn't it? The reduced overall damage, and in particular the proficiency change, will reintroduce thinking to Dust at both the individual and squad level. If you're all carrying combat rifles and you come up against a Caldari heavy you're gonna have a bad time. People are going to start thinking about designing suits that complement others in their squad. People are going to start evaluating encounters - "I don't think I can kill this guy, I should retreat so the guy in my squad who can kill him can help" (note that currently, retreat is not an option). This last point is why squad cohesion is going to start being really important again...you're not going to have dudes lone wolfing it and taking out whole squads of people who happened to be looking the wrong way. The tactics will be maneuvering your forces to put more guns on target than the other side. The superior firepower of a group will matter more than the individuals in that group, and firing lines lasting more than a second or two will create opportunities for people to skirmishers to move and shoot from the sides or behind, negating the advantage of cover.
"How will you be able to flank someone with a lot of health and kill him...."???
When I use the term "flank"..I'm talking about not engaging your enemy face to face. I'm talking about trying to position yourself so that you can shoot your enemy at his side or in his back.
So, if flanking isn't the term that describes that, then we'll use the word that does. So, whatever the term is....that's what you have to do in order to kill a heavy or someone with more ehp than you. It's the guys that try to take higher ehp players on 1v1 are the ones that are having the most difficulty.
I don't know about how you guys are playing this game. But when I play this game, I try to think on many levels. What sort of fits and weapons are my enemies using? That may determine what I will use.
Or, "there goes a heavy...what do I do"? Do I run at him or do I retreat a little and place myself in a position to shoot the heavy in the side or the back?
Or, when I'm running up on a guy and I see how much armor and shields he has. I decide how I'm going to approach him to kill him. If he's shield heavy or armor heavy..may determine the moment where I'm most aggressive.
You guys are bugging if you're saying that you can't use tactics now. Same stuff you guys are saying will happen when dmg gets nerfed are the same things that competent players are doing now.
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2554
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:34:00 -
[100] - Quote
Check out this clip.....that was my first match after seeing TTK is to be increased and reading you guys' posts in this thread.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWXcHdQe6jE
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
|
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ads alt
DROID EXILES
General Tso's Alliance
42
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:38:00 -
[101] - Quote
ttk isnt fine
he sucked |
Ydubbs81
Ahrendee Holdings
0
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:44:00 -
[102] - Quote
HAHAHAHA
of course he does but that happens to 95% of the dust community. Nerf damage and increase TTK, they wouldn't stand a chance.
Point is, you guys say that you don't have time to react.....you saw the dude had the total drop on me and did the damage he did and I had time to react. |
Kaeralli Sturmovos
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
147
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:46:00 -
[103] - Quote
TTK cant be done till weapons are fully balanced right, and both Shield and Armor Tanking on infantry soldiers dont feel like a throwaway of mods per suit.
there needs to be a distinguishable difference in shooting an armor or shield tanked suit, (and the rare dual tank), a feeling of difference between weapons and what they actually do when shot, and a negative impact in using a weapon that is ineffective against certain tanks.
my personal preference is less COD or BF3/4 feel and more of an active time to respond to a few shots and maybe able to walk away from the fight to continue with the battle.
that would lengthen battles, make cloning the enemy team a challenge instead of a "oh, we cloned them?" feel |
Leadfoot10
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
634
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:47:00 -
[104] - Quote
I like this game precisely because the TTK is not as fast as BF/COD, and IMO it could be a bit longer.
I disagree wholeheartedly with the OP, but respect his right to his opinion and expressing it.
IMO, CCP is doing the right thing by lengthening it...Lead |
ads alt
DROID EXILES
General Tso's Alliance
42
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:48:00 -
[105] - Quote
Ydubbs81 wrote:HAHAHAHA of course he does but that happens to 95% of the dust community. Nerf damage and increase TTK, they wouldn't stand a chance. Point is, you guys say that you don't have time to react.....you saw the dude had the total drop on me and did the damage he did and I had time to react.
get off your ******* new alt
and the noob stopped shooting, and the guy had 30 armor left basically.....so its not fine |
Yagihige
Crux Special Tasks Group
Gallente Federation
579
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:51:00 -
[106] - Quote
Leadfoot10 wrote:I like this game precisely because the TTK is not as fast as BF/COD, and IMO it could be a bit longer.
I disagree wholeheartedly with the OP, but respect his right to his opinion and expressing it.
IMO, CCP is doing the right thing by lengthening it...Lead
We'll see about that. Maybe they can increase it a bit and still work. Or maybe they can increase it too much and ruin everything. I'll wait to see it in action.
em ta kool t'nod
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2555
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:52:00 -
[107] - Quote
Leadfoot10 wrote:I like this game precisely because the TTK is not as fast as BF/COD, and IMO it could be a bit longer.
I disagree wholeheartedly with the OP, but respect his right to his opinion and expressing it.
IMO, CCP is doing the right thing by lengthening it...Lead
I like that you aren't insta-killed like in BF either. But there's a limit, and we shouldn't have to shoot at someone for long lengths of time to kill them. I have awesome 1v1s with the current TTK. I also can turn on people..let's not make the game frustrating to play.
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
|
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2555
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:53:00 -
[108] - Quote
ads alt wrote:Ydubbs81 wrote:HAHAHAHA of course he does but that happens to 95% of the dust community. Nerf damage and increase TTK, they wouldn't stand a chance. Point is, you guys say that you don't have time to react.....you saw the dude had the total drop on me and did the damage he did and I had time to react. get off your ******* new alt and the noob stopped shooting, and the guy had 30 armor left basically.....so its not fine
he ran out of bullets and was reloading obviously...he had full health when I started shooting at him
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
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Zeylon Rho
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
3720
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:55:00 -
[109] - Quote
And here's a video of TTK being shorter than BF or such (pre-RR too):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QI4wmuzjmU&feature=youtu.be&t=1m41s
It needed a change, and you're apparently a near-lone voice against longer TTK.
Dren and Templar equipment stats, wrong since release.
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ReGnYuM
Escrow Removal and Acquisition
2411
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:56:00 -
[110] - Quote
Dubbs just turned on that noob!!!
Official Imperfect Title: Supreme Leader of the Endless Sunset
I Slay, for thy Empress
Do you even PC... Brah
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ads alt
DROID EXILES
General Tso's Alliance
42
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:56:00 -
[111] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:ads alt wrote:Ydubbs81 wrote:HAHAHAHA of course he does but that happens to 95% of the dust community. Nerf damage and increase TTK, they wouldn't stand a chance. Point is, you guys say that you don't have time to react.....you saw the dude had the total drop on me and did the damage he did and I had time to react. get off your ******* new alt and the noob stopped shooting, and the guy had 30 armor left basically.....so its not fine he ran out of bullets and was reloading obviously...he had full health when I started shooting at him
hes a noob with a MLT ar who would have killed you if he had 48 bullets
the fact that he basically killed you in a starter fit proves it... |
Crimson Cerberes
Hammer Of Light
Vanguard of the Phoenix
387
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:58:00 -
[112] - Quote
#1) Use the base combat rifle, you do + 50% DPS
#2) you are alone in your belief. |
Knight Solitaire
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
574
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 16:59:00 -
[113] - Quote
MDs shouldn't have been buffed at the same time as a TTK increase, thats my biggest problem with it. The way weapons work should've been changed, not their damage.
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
ISK Milkshakes for all! (Except the pubbers)
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2555
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 17:08:00 -
[114] - Quote
ads alt wrote:
he ran out of bullets and was reloading obviously...he had full health when I started shooting at him
hes a noob with a MLT ar who would have killed you if he had 48 bullets
the fact that he basically killed you in a starter fit proves it...[/quote]
I'm uploading a vid of a goodshooter now
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
|
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2555
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 17:11:00 -
[115] - Quote
The guy had 200 total ehp!! What do you expect??? That's my point man....you guys are running around here in **** fits and not expect to die fast.
How is it logical that a guy with 200ehp can go up against a guy with 800ehp and not expect to die fast???
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
|
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2555
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 17:13:00 -
[116] - Quote
To ads alt::
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YOwIwk02
Are you going to tell me that he sucked too??
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
|
ads alt
DROID EXILES
General Tso's Alliance
42
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 17:16:00 -
[117] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The guy had 200 total ehp!! What do you expect??? That's my point man....you guys are running around here in **** fits and not expect to die fast. How is it logical that a guy with 200ehp can go up against a guy with 800ehp and not expect to die fast???
Lol your part 2 bideo is bullshit
He was using an ar and not all his bullets hit, most of them did, but not all.....and why do you aim at that range... |
Zeylon Rho
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
3722
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 17:19:00 -
[118] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The guy had 200 total ehp!! What do you expect??? That's my point man....you guys are running around here in **** fits and not expect to die fast. How is it logical that a guy with 200ehp can go up against a guy with 800ehp and not expect to die fast???
We have shield extenders that give you 22 hp on suits with 3 slots total. How much longer do you think a shield extender (choice to tank) should help you live?
Dren and Templar equipment stats, wrong since release.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
2555
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 17:19:00 -
[119] - Quote
ads alt wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The guy had 200 total ehp!! What do you expect??? That's my point man....you guys are running around here in **** fits and not expect to die fast. How is it logical that a guy with 200ehp can go up against a guy with 800ehp and not expect to die fast??? Lol your part 2 bideo is bullshit He was using an ar and not all his bullets hit, most of them did, but not all.....and why do you aim at that range... Oh and your using ******* proto
We were both using ARs...wtf are you talking about? The point is he started shooting first and he is one of the better shots in the game. And we're both using protos, derp....it was a pc match.
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
RND's recruitment official phrase
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ads alt
DROID EXILES
General Tso's Alliance
42
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 17:21:00 -
[120] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:ads alt wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The guy had 200 total ehp!! What do you expect??? That's my point man....you guys are running around here in **** fits and not expect to die fast. How is it logical that a guy with 200ehp can go up against a guy with 800ehp and not expect to die fast??? Lol your part 2 bideo is bullshit He was using an ar and not all his bullets hit, most of them did, but not all.....and why do you aim at that range... Oh and your using ******* proto We were both using ARs...wtf are you talking about? The point is he started shooting first and he is one of the better shots in the game. And we're both using protos, derp....it was a pc match.
Ars dont count, and btw if you hipfired him in the open it would have been quick
Part 1 of your vid you killed a guy in less of a second, ttk isnt fine.
And you guys were using full ******* proto.
Ttk isnt fine
Ttk isnt fine
Ttk isnt fine
Now please stop with bullshit videos with underpowered wepons and full proto... |
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