Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
McFurious
TeamPlayers EoN.
243
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 04:52:00 -
[1] - Quote
Idea from RydogV in another mass driver *****-a-thon thread:
RydogV wrote:Incorporate a minimum number of "twists" or minimum distance the projectile has to travel before it is armed and will explode. This is a simple feature of most real world grenade launchers as a safety measure and will help ensure the weapon cannot be used as some kind of super-shotgun. It keeps the weapon locked into mid-range combat. You can still give the projectile some damage capability if you get a direct hit at close range...just not explosive damage..
Basically the MD round won't "explode" within the minimum distance and will only deal direct damage to someone if the round hits them. Seems like an idea that should have been in the game already.
I'd say the minimum distance should be 5 meters since that's the highest blast radius of the weapon but perhaps it could be even further. What do you all think?
|
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
5344
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 04:59:00 -
[2] - Quote
I don't like, removes risk involved with the MD. |
McFurious
TeamPlayers EoN.
243
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 05:04:00 -
[3] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:I don't like, removes risk involved with the MD.
Also could remove the shotgun-MD playstyle everyone's complaining about. |
Ulysses Knapse
Bojo's School of the Trades
461
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 06:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Removes risk involved with the MD. I have to disagree. Personally, I think it adds risk. If you get caught at close-quarters, you're not going to be able to defend yourself with it unless you are a ridiculously good shot with it. Though, a splash radius increase would be nice. Being able to use grenades at point-blank range without being hit at all is sort of ridiculous. There should be a penalty for using it as close-range. |
Cosgar
ParagonX
4071
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 06:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
I'd only accept this if we got the range hard cap back. |
McFurious
TeamPlayers EoN.
243
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 07:42:00 -
[6] - Quote
Ulysses Knapse wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Removes risk involved with the MD. I have to disagree. Personally, I think it adds risk. If you get caught at close-quarters, you're not going to be able to defend yourself with it unless you are a ridiculously good shot with it. Though, a splash radius increase would be nice. Being able to use grenades at point-blank range without being hit at all is sort of ridiculous. There should be a penalty for using it as close-range.
Yes exactly what I'm getting at. It's supposed to be mid to long range not short range and this seems like the best way to fix that without making it completely useless.
You could increase the minimum range to 6, 8, or 10 meters even. Perhaps it could vary between different mass driver types. |
excillon
united we stand x
9
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 08:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
Absolutely! 100% agree with this. I've been getting shelled in close quarters for weeks by high rate of fire MD's. I guess you might have to worry about kamikaze tactics like shooting at the ground and killing himself along with you, but it's still better than what's going on now. |
Leovarian L Lavitz
Better Academy.
484
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 09:15:00 -
[8] - Quote
The mass driver is sighted at 5 meters, 10 meters, 20, 30, and 40 meters. It is specifically made to be used in these distances. It is not a mid-long range weapon, it is a close-mid range weapon. Anything further than 40 meters is not sighted and must be guestimated by the user.
EDIT: Instead of running up close to the MD user, engage at 50 meters. This is further than the furthest sight bar on the md, and is easy for you to avoid the shots while mowing him down with your hit-scan 750 bullet per second AR. |
McFurious
TeamPlayers EoN.
249
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 11:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
Leovarian L Lavitz wrote:The mass driver is sighted at 5 meters, 10 meters, 20, 30, and 40 meters.
Ok then, so minimum 5 meters. I think that's reasonable.
|
|
CCP Logibro
C C P C C P Alliance
329
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:23:00 -
[10] - Quote
If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance? CCP Logibro // EVE Universe Community Team // Distributor of Nanites // Patron Saint of Logistics
@CCP_Logibro |
|
|
Bittersteel the Bastard
WarRavens League of Infamy
92
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:26:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance?
I guess I would be fine with that, but what if the user starts panic spamming and actually kills you. :/
|
Viktor Zokas
187.
174
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Bittersteel the Bastard wrote:CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance? I guess I would be fine with that, but what if the user starts panic spamming and actually kills you. :/
It's called spraying and praying. |
The World isMine
Defective by Design
12
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
As a mass driver user I like this, it would make it fair. But if we shoot within the 5 meters could it still explode but on a delay. Like i could drop a whole bunch at my feet then run away and let them all explode 5 sec later. It would make it useful for destroying equipment if I run out of stamina. |
N1ck Comeau
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
934
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:50:00 -
[14] - Quote
How about all mass driver rounds have a timer, but if they hit someone else they explode on impact. Makes sense it is the future after all. |
Sgt Buttscratch
G I A N T EoN.
594
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:51:00 -
[15] - Quote
So this idea is to make it so MD users spamming in cqc can hit at very close range with a grenade launcher, but not take explosive damage..... gtfo |
Snaps Tremor
Tritan's Onslaught RISE of LEGION
319
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:53:00 -
[16] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance?
Only if it has a really funny sound effect and gives you a +500WP BEANBAG KILL if you manage to end someone with it. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
1003
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:54:00 -
[17] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance?
Good idea, hell I wouldn't mind if it hit me due to over all force of the projectile then detonated afterwards as long as all other physics are applied like lower damage at the edge of the radius and a minimum arming distance. |
Alena Ventrallis
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
52
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:05:00 -
[18] - Quote
Modern grenade launchers, such as 40mm, have an arming range of about 15-30m depending on type, so that the user can avoid blowing themselves up. Still, getting hit with a 40mm projectile moving at about 250 feet per second is more than enough to kill a man even without exploding. I don't know the mass drivers range currently, as I've never used it, but maybe give it an arming range of 10m to avoid blowing yourself up, and to stop people spamming. Plus it will make it work as intended, providing area denial from behind the main effort. |
ADAM-OF-EVE
Svartur Bjorn
165
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:41:00 -
[19] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance?
there are stories in RL of rifle grenades and rpg type weapons not exploding when they hit soft targets i.e people or in the case of dust its merc's. the round would penetrate the person and get lodged inside but the impact detonator in the round would not trigger as the target was too soft. the victim would howether die from the kinetic force sustained from the impact or they would sustain heavy internal damage from it.
if we apply this to MD we have a weapon that does radius damage as usual but if it hits a soft target direct then it would do zero radius damage but would impact that player with direct damage instead. add in the minimum arming range and it sets the MD direct into its expected role.
if ccp worked out some sort of impact calculater then impact damage could be worked out on a range/speed basis.at point blank your MD round would be traveling at its top speed but at this range would not arm but would do max impact damage. as it gets further away the speed decreases and the impact damage would decrease.
at close range impact direct damage is all it will do,
at mid range the round arms allowing for radius/impact damage(but for less impact damage)
at long range(outside optimal) then radius damage still works upto its max range but impact damage is reduced upto a point where it does no damage. |
Talos Alomar
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1384
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:50:00 -
[20] - Quote
Bittersteel the Bastard wrote:but what if the user starts panic spamming and actually kills you. :/
then that'd be awesome. |
|
Driftward
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
344
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 17:24:00 -
[21] - Quote
ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance? there are stories in RL of rifle grenades and rpg type weapons not exploding when they hit soft targets i.e people or in the case of dust its merc's. the round would penetrate the person and get lodged inside but the impact detonator in the round would not trigger as the target was too soft. the victim would howether die from the kinetic force sustained from the impact or they would sustain heavy internal damage from it. if we apply this to MD we have a weapon that does radius damage as usual but if it hits a soft target direct then it would do zero radius damage but would impact that player with direct damage instead. add in the minimum arming range and it sets the MD direct into its expected role. if ccp worked out some sort of impact calculater then impact damage could be worked out on a range/speed basis.at point blank your MD round would be traveling at its top speed but at this range would not arm but would do max impact damage. as it gets further away the speed decreases and the impact damage would decrease. at close range impact direct damage is all it will do, at mid range the round arms allowing for radius/impact damage(but for less impact damage) at long range(outside optimal) then radius damage still works upto its max range but impact damage is reduced upto a point where it does no damage.
THIS^^
As a scout, I get killed occasionally at distance by a mass driver (fair enough), but when I'm within maybe 5-10 m range and they notice me. Goodnight Sally. Which is rather odd to me. Seems like it's doing a bit too good of a job at CQC when it's a ranged AOD weapon. Providing a safety switch sounds like it would fix the issue to me.
If they can score a direct hit when I'm close up and trying to blap their face off with a shotgun then props to them, but no longer would they be able to just shoot at my feet and 1 shot me with splash damage (scout suit remember). |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1428
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 17:50:00 -
[22] - Quote
McFurious wrote:Idea from RydogV in another mass driver *****-a-thon thread: RydogV wrote:Incorporate a minimum number of "twists" or minimum distance the projectile has to travel before it is armed and will explode. This is a simple feature of most real world grenade launchers as a safety measure and will help ensure the weapon cannot be used as some kind of super-shotgun. It keeps the weapon locked into mid-range combat. You can still give the projectile some damage capability if you get a direct hit at close range...just not explosive damage.. Basically the MD round won't "explode" within the minimum distance and will only deal direct damage to someone if the round hits them. Seems like an idea that should have been in the game already. I'd say the minimum distance should be 5 meters since that's the highest blast radius of the weapon but perhaps it could be even further. What do you all think? I think a better solution would be to get the "flat" splash damage fixed. If explosions were occurring in a sphere rather than a circle the CQC value of explosives would be reduced for any player who does not wish to commit suicide.
I'm also dubious about taking more choices out of the players hands, making it "you can't shoot within X range" is a lot more heavy handed than "if you shoot within X range you'll blow yourself up". If we're talking "real world" there's very little reason for an immortal clone solider to have the kind of safety feature described because their loss factor is all in ISK and sometimes it's more effective to take a loss of your own gear while destroying that of the hostile force, so for clones in disposable bodies it just doesn't make sense.
The other, and much bigger issue, is that the MD is a suppression weapon which has been under Uprising geared more and more towards direct/'slayer' combat. This is very much the wrong direction to be taking the MD. Making it more focused on direct/high damage and less on moderate/dispersion (aka splash) damage puts the weapon more and more into direct competition with other offerings in regards to its battlefield role. Dust needs more diversity not less, changes which make the MD function more like the AR in role are going to be bad changes, if they fill the same role or nearly the same role the direct competition will nearly always render one of them fundamentally inferior, replacing greater game diversity (as is the case with the more area denial MD of Chrome) with greater game imbalance (as will be the case if the MD is biased into be a direct/'slayer' primary weapon).
0.02 ISK Cross
|
Beeeees
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
93
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:00:00 -
[23] - Quote
Meant to suggest this for some time now.
Im all for it. |
McFurious
TeamPlayers EoN.
260
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:27:00 -
[24] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance?
That's the idea. I'm thinking the round itself would still do the direct damage of the weapon, just no explosion. So EXO-5 round does 254.1, EC-3 does 152.5, etc.. |
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER
TeamPlayers EoN.
1130
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:30:00 -
[25] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance?
this is how explosives are handled in several other games.. shooting the explosive round such as the MD would equate to a 'dud' at short range |
Text Grant
Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore
80
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:08:00 -
[26] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance? No thank you. Where is the risk in this? Mass drivers do NOT need a buff. |
FLAYLOCK Steve
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
198
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:30:00 -
[27] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance? Than how would he defend himself in cqc? Yes it's risky but I at times had to fight cqc and no because I charged in but because they rushed me. Sigh.... This because all the qq. Leave the alone seriously. And adding the safety is dumb it will render the gun useless and everyone and their mom would just charge you and you're dead seriously? And that would also take away the risk off killing your self. Or at least make it a feature you can toggle on and off. Like remove the mass driver sights because no one even uses them and make the mass driver user choose if he wants a timed explode or the regular |
FLAYLOCK Steve
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
198
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:40:00 -
[28] - Quote
Bittersteel the Bastard wrote:CCP Logibro wrote:If the safety was implemented, what do you think of the idea that a direct hit would still do damage but not explode if within the minimum arming distance? I guess I would be fine with that, but what if the user starts panic spamming and actually kills you. :/ So you just don't want to die? Wtf is up with this community seriously. Okay if CCP does this make the damn Assault rifle not be able to be as effective in hip fire. |
Fire of Prometheus
DUST University Ivy League
65
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:44:00 -
[29] - Quote
I.........actually like this idea.
Perhaps at a proto level it has a reduced "arming distance". So if regular arming distance is 10m then at proto it would be 5-7m (just a shot in the dark) |
Rugudorull Apophicyria
Supercalifragilisticexpialidocius
22
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:45:00 -
[30] - Quote
Leovarian L Lavitz wrote:The mass driver is sighted at 5 meters, 10 meters, 20, 30, and 40 meters. It is specifically made to be used in these distances. It is not a mid-long range weapon, it is a close-mid range weapon. Anything further than 40 meters is not sighted and must be guestimated by the user.
EDIT: Instead of running up close to the MD user, engage at 50 meters. This is further than the furthest sight bar on the md, and is easy for you to avoid the shots while mowing him down with your hit-scan 750 bullet per minute AR.
I'd have to agree and disagree. The basic and breach variants thrive in the close to mid range while the assault imo excels more at the mid to far ranges. The assault can be used at close range but having the largest blast radius of the three makes it more likely for the user to damage himself.
Now as for the minimum arming distance, I would be completely on board with this. I used to play with grenade launchers in call of duty and even that had a minimum arming distance. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |