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Poonmunch
Sand Mercenary Corps Inc. Interstellar Conquest Enterprises
12
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Posted - 2013.06.26 17:15:00 -
[91] - Quote
I think that respecs should be allowed whenever changes are made to game mechanics or changes in equipment function or statistics. But not for new equipment. Nobody should be saddled with specifications they chose when the game was in a previous state, then has been "upgraded" because of imbalances.
We should not have to suffer if the Devs decide the game needs to be rebalanced. Otherwise people will have a butt-load of SP into certain things that later get nerfed and either become useless or loose their uber status. |
TEBOW BAGGINS
Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN.
614
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Posted - 2013.06.26 18:08:00 -
[92] - Quote
they should make a respec NPC like in star wars galaxies, that way we can all flop to the FOTM each new build until we get it nerfed for the next build, then repeat that process for the next 7 years. |
Darken-Sol
BIG BAD W0LVES Eternal Syndicate
376
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Posted - 2013.06.26 18:18:00 -
[93] - Quote
Respecs should come at the costs of skill books. Respec the SP but do not refund ISK for skill books. People could try things out and find a character they are comfortable with. It should be an ingame mechanic. Why are we so worried about other players becoming good? Do you want dust to always feature onesided fights? I think all of you are scum for trying to hold each other back. SCUM.
When i hear New Eden it is always some douch bag quoting some other douch bag. Parroting a n ideal like "welcome to new eden" is a statement about the quality of person you are.
Back on topic. How could you abuse a respec system that causes you to go broke? |
CuuCH Crusher
Commando Perkone Caldari State
40
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Posted - 2013.06.26 19:36:00 -
[94] - Quote
I think we are starting to get to the root of the problem. Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems people are concerned that if they spec into something, it will be nerfed. I propose that once the current weapons are balanced, they should never be touched again. Only newly released weapons/ gear should be allowed to be nerfed or buffed. Once an item is balanced it should never be touched again. This gets rid of the uncertainty. |
THEDRiZZLE Aqua teen
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
29
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Posted - 2013.06.26 20:34:00 -
[95] - Quote
NO RESETS LEARN TO SPEND YOUR SP LIKE A RESPONSABLE GAMER OR STOP QQ ITS YOUR OWN DAMN FAULTS FOR SPECING INTO A HUNDRED THINGS I HAVE LESS THEN 25 SKILLS BUT THERE ALL ALMOST MAXED YOU KNOW WHY BECUASE I DIDNT SPEND LITTLE AMOUNTS I SAVED FOR MONTHS TO GET SOME SKILLS IT SUX STOP BITCHING THIS GAME ISENT FOR CASUAL PLAYERS GO PLAY COD OR SOMETHING |
Keyser Soze VerbalKint
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
425
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Posted - 2013.06.26 20:53:00 -
[96] - Quote
You people have no imagination whatsoever.
Fact is the game is full of content that most people don't spec into because it isnt functional and they don't want to be "stuck" with it.
The notion that we should limit respecs to force people into making decisions or to prevent FOTM respecs is ludicrous and only exists because the game developers create a weapon or item that is out of balance with the rest. To fault the players for flocking to it put blame squarely on the wrong people.
Now that said unlimited respeccing would be problematic and really wasteful. For those players that think the universe should be about making your descision matter I would counter by saying its as simple as changing neural implants that result in a mercs ability to respec and thus follow lore if its really that important to you.
From a financial standpoint a Respec should cost money and to me is a better way to get money from dust players without nickel and dimeing them over SP.
Now it may be impossible to limit individual respecs to only 2x/year but if possible they should aim to do so in addition to how they allow respec to occur. Which should be in the form of an augmentation.
This augmentation should be avaiable for ISK and AUR. But the pricing should be somewhere in the plex range if not higher. The idea here being it isn't fully P2W if the item is avaialble for ISK and AUR and if the cost is high enough it wont be used constantly but sparingly. If CCP can enforce 2 use policy every 12 months or something then CCP has created their own version of DLC. By purchasing these augmentations CCP is giving players the opportunity to access new content in the form a different specialty 2x/year.
It may be wise to even allow 1x/year Free respecs to really keep the game fresh for players and allow them to experience the game in a different way.
The benefits of this far outweighs the negatives of FOTM speccing, more to the point FOTM speccing only becomes a problem if the Devs make FOTM stuff. Add in the limitations of respecs should CCP enforce such a mechanic the risk of FOTM speccing become hazardous to anyone who goes that route if CCP is quick on balancing.
It took a month to make changes to the TAC. An optional respect would at best mean they are stuck with their decisions for the rest of the year if they use their one freebie right after or if they purchase they only have 1 additional paid respec. |
CuuCH Crusher
Commando Perkone Caldari State
40
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Posted - 2013.06.26 23:32:00 -
[97] - Quote
THEDRiZZLE Aqua teen wrote:NO RESETS LEARN TO SPEND YOUR SP LIKE A RESPONSABLE GAMER OR STOP QQ ITS YOUR OWN DAMN FAULTS FOR SPECING INTO A HUNDRED THINGS I HAVE LESS THEN 25 SKILLS BUT THERE ALL ALMOST MAXED YOU KNOW WHY BECUASE I DIDNT SPEND LITTLE AMOUNTS I SAVED FOR MONTHS TO GET SOME SKILLS IT SUX STOP BITCHING THIS GAME ISENT FOR CASUAL PLAYERS GO PLAY COD OR SOMETHING
And that brings up another point. What about people that did spend their SP wisely, what about them? The people who spend months saving up for a certain skill should have priority over some casual who wants a respec every five minutes. |
THEDRiZZLE Aqua teen
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
33
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Posted - 2013.06.27 03:50:00 -
[98] - Quote
If you are then you have to stick it out i want sp back but you know what its not the issue they havegameplay problems luxury fixes can be taken care of after |
Twomanchew
Goose Bite
8
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Posted - 2013.06.27 06:57:00 -
[99] - Quote
meri jin wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Weather or not people can flock to an OP weapon has no bearing on if the weapon is OP or not. The real issue is the OP weapon itself, and once they are balanced, then your argument is in the garbage. Also people respeccing to skill into OP items are screwing themselves since OP items eventually get nerfed.
Keep in mind that we don't have the full set of racial ARs, dropsuits and specializations yet, so many of us have to specialize into weapons and dropsuits that would not have been our first choice. Specialization is needed to be competitive, yet it is unfair to expect people to specialize when all the options aren't present yet; this makes respecs warranted. I agree with you here. A freind of mine like to play havy, but not as amarr for example. Still ne must skill this so he can learn how it is to a heavy. Its not like he likes to be in a amarr suit. I feel that this game is extremly unfinished we need the core things, all racial weapons and standart suits.
Amen
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RKKR
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
126
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:21:00 -
[100] - Quote
@CuuCH Crusher No-one is saying you should be able to respec every 5min or without a cost, I don't really see your problem against respecs and don't you think that the game will become more interesting if you can switch up your play styles? |
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Viktor Zokas
187. League of Infamy
3
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Posted - 2013.06.27 13:13:00 -
[101] - Quote
I for one can't wait for aurum paid respecs. |
IR Scifi
Silver Talon Corporation
39
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Posted - 2013.06.27 14:18:00 -
[102] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:Esp considering using the same build day after day gets so boring.
What if I wanna try speed shotgun logi? Nope... gotta grind 3 million SP (6-8 weeks depending on booster usage) for proto kin cats and proto shotguns first...
$10 respec with a 1 month cooldown? Almost everyone is happy as they can escape poor choices they made or just spice things up a bit with a new build. CCP gets a new revenue stream that is not pay to win...
I honestly see very little reason not to do it anymore...
Maybe I'm crazy but when I read "try X" I don't picture "MAX ALL THE SKILLS!" in my head. |
CuuCH Crusher
Commando Perkone Caldari State
44
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 14:26:00 -
[103] - Quote
RKKR wrote:@CuuCH Crusher No-one is saying you should be able to respec every 5min or without a cost, I don't really see your problem against respecs and don't you think that the game will become more interesting if you can switch up your play styles?
Then what is the whole point of the SP system? If you could change roles on the fly wouldn't it be like any other FPS out there. I think people forget that this is not just a FPS, it is also a RPG. If you allow respecs, you don't really the need SP system, which effectively eliminates the the RPG part of the game. Can you people just let us have one game that isn't a COD clone? |
Luk Manag
of Terror
27
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 14:29:00 -
[104] - Quote
If CCP has to give ReSpecs to keep the casuals interested, they might as well give up on all character development. You might keep players who are bored for a little bit longer, but it wouldn't be worth it (Dust 514 fails on pure shooter merits). They will still get bored. If they (the gamer) believe in the future of Dust 514, you (CCP) can demand their patience and dedication to character development. You can expect turnover, but I think that will result in a steadily growing population of dedicated people who can see themselves playing Dust 514 for 5 or 10 years. Why would you bother trying to eek a couple more months out of some casual gamer who is interested in a flavor of the month? This month it's LLAV, next month it will be BF4 or PS2, and I say, "let them go." |
Keyser Soze VerbalKint
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
426
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 14:33:00 -
[105] - Quote
Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote:You people have no imagination whatsoever.
Fact is the game is full of content that most people don't spec into because it isnt functional and they don't want to be "stuck" with it.
The notion that we should limit respecs to force people into making decisions or to prevent FOTM respecs is ludicrous and only exists because the game developers create a weapon or item that is out of balance with the rest. To fault the players for flocking to it put blame squarely on the wrong people.
Now that said unlimited respeccing would be problematic and really wasteful. For those players that think the universe should be about making your descision matter I would counter by saying its as simple as changing neural implants that result in a mercs ability to respec and thus follow lore if its really that important to you.
From a financial standpoint a Respec should cost money and to me is a better way to get money from dust players without nickel and dimeing them over SP.
Now it may be impossible to limit individual respecs to only 2x/year but if possible they should aim to do so in addition to how they allow respec to occur. Which should be in the form of an augmentation.
This augmentation should be avaiable for ISK and AUR. But the pricing should be somewhere in the plex range if not higher. The idea here being it isn't fully P2W if the item is avaialble for ISK and AUR and if the cost is high enough it wont be used constantly but sparingly. If CCP can enforce 2 use policy every 12 months or something then CCP has created their own version of DLC. By purchasing these augmentations CCP is giving players the opportunity to access new content in the form a different specialty 2x/year.
It may be wise to even allow 1x/year Free respecs to really keep the game fresh for players and allow them to experience the game in a different way.
The benefits of this far outweighs the negatives of FOTM speccing, more to the point FOTM speccing only becomes a problem if the Devs make FOTM stuff. Add in the limitations of respecs should CCP enforce such a mechanic the risk of FOTM speccing become hazardous to anyone who goes that route if CCP is quick on balancing.
It took a month to make changes to the TAC. An optional respect would at best mean they are stuck with their decisions for the rest of the year if they use their one freebie right after or if they purchase they only have 1 additional paid respec.
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CuuCH Crusher
Commando Perkone Caldari State
45
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 14:39:00 -
[106] - Quote
Luk Manag wrote:If CCP has to give ReSpecs to keep the casuals interested, they might as well give up on all character development. You might keep players who are bored for a little bit longer, but it wouldn't be worth it (Dust 514 fails on pure shooter merits). They will still get bored. If they (the gamer) believe in the future of Dust 514, you (CCP) can demand their patience and dedication to character development. You can expect turnover, but I think that will result in a steadily growing population of dedicated people who can see themselves playing Dust 514 for 5 or 10 years. Why would you bother trying to eek a couple more months out of some casual gamer who is interested in a flavor of the month? This month it's LLAV, next month it will be BF4 or PS2, and I say, "let them go."
Well said. Casuals come and go. It's the hardcore gamers that stay. CCP should try to appeal to the hardcore gamers and make the gameplay so great that it converts casuals into hardcore. They should focus on gameplay. Not holding peoples hand. |
Keyser Soze VerbalKint
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
426
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 14:46:00 -
[107] - Quote
CuuCH Crusher wrote:Luk Manag wrote:If CCP has to give ReSpecs to keep the casuals interested, they might as well give up on all character development. You might keep players who are bored for a little bit longer, but it wouldn't be worth it (Dust 514 fails on pure shooter merits). They will still get bored. If they (the gamer) believe in the future of Dust 514, you (CCP) can demand their patience and dedication to character development. You can expect turnover, but I think that will result in a steadily growing population of dedicated people who can see themselves playing Dust 514 for 5 or 10 years. Why would you bother trying to eek a couple more months out of some casual gamer who is interested in a flavor of the month? This month it's LLAV, next month it will be BF4 or PS2, and I say, "let them go." Well said. Casuals come and go. It's the hardcore gamers that stay. CCP should try to appeal to the hardcore gamers and make the gameplay so great that it converts casuals into hardcore. They should focus on gameplay. Not holding peoples hand.
I think you and I have different definitions of hardcore gamers. You are probably thinking of Hardcore RPGers who are so invested into their characters it borders on an emotional codependence.
Hardcore shooters want to experience great shooting and want to try new things. Its about content consumption. Allowing respecs
1 free and 1 paid per year creates a hybrid model of what CCP does in EVE while allowing for essentially a paid DLC model to enter into the game. By allowing for up to 2 respecs a year you are keeping hardcore shooter fans interested with the ability to experience new content without having free reign and a limitless number of repecs.
Ive already given a lore perspective on how this may be possible so if hardcore RPGing is your thing well ive already provided the needed rationales from a lore perspective that would permit it.
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CuuCH Crusher
Commando Perkone Caldari State
45
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Posted - 2013.06.27 14:55:00 -
[108] - Quote
Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote:CuuCH Crusher wrote:Luk Manag wrote:If CCP has to give ReSpecs to keep the casuals interested, they might as well give up on all character development. You might keep players who are bored for a little bit longer, but it wouldn't be worth it (Dust 514 fails on pure shooter merits). They will still get bored. If they (the gamer) believe in the future of Dust 514, you (CCP) can demand their patience and dedication to character development. You can expect turnover, but I think that will result in a steadily growing population of dedicated people who can see themselves playing Dust 514 for 5 or 10 years. Why would you bother trying to eek a couple more months out of some casual gamer who is interested in a flavor of the month? This month it's LLAV, next month it will be BF4 or PS2, and I say, "let them go." Well said. Casuals come and go. It's the hardcore gamers that stay. CCP should try to appeal to the hardcore gamers and make the gameplay so great that it converts casuals into hardcore. They should focus on gameplay. Not holding peoples hand. I think you and I have different definitions of hardcore gamers. You are probably thinking of Hardcore RPGers who are so invested into their characters it borders on an emotional codependence. Hardcore shooters want to experience great shooting and want to try new things. Its about content consumption. Allowing respecs 1 free and 1 paid per year creates a hybrid model of what CCP does in EVE while allowing for essentially a paid DLC model to enter into the game. By allowing for up to 2 respecs a year you are keeping hardcore shooter fans interested with the ability to experience new content without having free reign and a limitless number of repecs. Ive already given a lore perspective on how this may be possible so if hardcore RPGing is your thing well ive already provided the needed rationales from a lore perspective that would permit it.
Who said you cannot try new things? It is not like you are stuck with only a certain amount of SP. You can always earn more whether that be passively or actively. My point is that you must choose what "new things" you want to try. This requires making good decisions. This makes Dust different from other shooters. Why are people so eager to change it into a COD clone? |
Jin Robot
Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance
1118
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 14:57:00 -
[109] - Quote
If a respec system was implemented(opposed, btw) any more than 1 or 2 a year would remove the consequences of decisions to dump SP into an OP style (caldari logi). "Who cares, I will just respec when the fix it" I never want to hear that. |
THEDRiZZLE Aqua teen
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
42
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:13:00 -
[110] - Quote
Thereshould be no respec unless they change skills imsick of ppl specing into the flavor ofthe month deal with it ahh qq wahh |
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RKKR
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
126
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:14:00 -
[111] - Quote
Your logic is that we can't switch between different roles and weapons because we end up with a COD clone?
I never played COD can u explain? What's so bad about it?
If the game ages and people have access to more SP won't they be able to switch it up? So it still will be COD in the long run?
What makes the players able to switch it up all the time if there is a restricted respec?
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RKKR
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
126
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:23:00 -
[112] - Quote
Jin Robot wrote:If a respec system was implemented(opposed, btw) any more than 1 or 2 a year would remove the consequences of decisions to dump SP into an OP style (caldari logi). "Who cares, I will just respec when the fix it" I never want to hear that.
Then they shouldn't adjust gear when it's released because all you people are saying you have to stick with your choice, but when they adjust it, it isn't your choice anymore. Resulting in a **** game. |
CuuCH Crusher
Commando Perkone Caldari State
46
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:27:00 -
[113] - Quote
RKKR wrote:Your logic is that we can't switch between different roles and weapons because we end up with a COD clone?
I never played COD can u explain? What's so bad about it?
If the game ages and people have access to more SP won't they be able to switch it up? So it still will be COD in the long run?
What makes the players able to switch it up all the time if there is a restricted respec?
I use COD loosely. By that I mean just another cookie cutter FPS with no real innovation. People are getting sick of the same old shooters. I you get rid of the SP system or make it irrelevant, you effectively killed what made the game different. Yes in the long run people will be able to diversify. This is the main reason we don't need respecs. In the short run it is cool that people have to specialize. In the end we will all end up in the same place, but how we all got there will be different, which I think sets dust apart from the rest of the shooters. |
Jin Robot
Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance
1118
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:29:00 -
[114] - Quote
RKKR wrote:Jin Robot wrote:If a respec system was implemented(opposed, btw) any more than 1 or 2 a year would remove the consequences of decisions to dump SP into an OP style (caldari logi). "Who cares, I will just respec when the fix it" I never want to hear that. Then they shouldn't adjust gear when it's released because all you people are saying you have to stick with your choice, but when they adjust it, it isn't your choice anymore. Resulting in a **** game. You act as if they are pulling teeth, just deal with it. Your tears are not worth ruining what appealed to many. May as well drop all skill requirements on gear, if it becomes so easy to switch SP around. |
RKKR
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
126
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:30:00 -
[115] - Quote
THEDRiZZLE Aqua teen wrote:Thereshould be no respec unless they change skills imsick of ppl specing into the flavor ofthe month deal with it ahh qq wahh
What about people that don't want to respec in FOTM? (What where the FOTMs up untill now BTW?) |
Jin Robot
Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance
1118
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:34:00 -
[116] - Quote
Viktor Zokas wrote:I for one can't wait for aurum paid respecs. I hope you are not bothered by disappointment. Jk idc |
RKKR
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
126
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:38:00 -
[117] - Quote
Jin Robot wrote:RKKR wrote:Jin Robot wrote:If a respec system was implemented(opposed, btw) any more than 1 or 2 a year would remove the consequences of decisions to dump SP into an OP style (caldari logi). "Who cares, I will just respec when the fix it" I never want to hear that. Then they shouldn't adjust gear when it's released because all you people are saying you have to stick with your choice, but when they adjust it, it isn't your choice anymore. Resulting in a **** game. You act as if they are pulling teeth, just deal with it. Your tears are not worth ruining what appealed to many. May as well drop all skill requirements on gear, if it becomes so easy to switch SP around.
Is that your counter-argument? LOL I never said that respecs should be easy, only to test out stuff/balancing which they should have done in beta. After that they can get rid of respecs. Don't see What's so appealing in playing a broken game. |
Keyser Soze VerbalKint
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
428
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 15:43:00 -
[118] - Quote
CuuCH Crusher wrote: Who said you cannot try new things? It is not like you are stuck with only a certain amount of SP. You can always earn more whether that be passively or actively. My point is that you must choose what "new things" you want to try. This requires making good decisions. This makes Dust different from other shooters. Why are people so eager to change it into a COD clone?
It takes many months to try new things, IE switching from a heavy to say a dropship pilot or tanker or just a new suit weapon combination.
Yes over time respecs will be less useful to the veteran population but not for years down the road and that can still be extended as more content is introduced. Of which CCP says there will be plenty of. Your assertion that allowing a limited respec 1 FREE, 1 Paid would in anyway turn this game into a COD clone. You only get 2 chances a year and thats ONLY if you PAY. Otherwise once per year doesn't do anything to break the game.
It is not CCPs job to prevent players from speccing into FOTM gear, its their job to ensure none exist. Moreover given the rate at which content looks to be added a respec into a FOTM would easily trap a person in for a long time as they would have to use their LIMITED number of respecs.
My solution covers all angles,
Lore Content generation Balance Keeping the game Fresh Monetary acquisition for CCP. |
RKKR
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
126
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 16:01:00 -
[119] - Quote
CuuCH Crusher wrote:RKKR wrote:Your logic is that we can't switch between different roles and weapons because we end up with a COD clone?
I never played COD can u explain? What's so bad about it?
If the game ages and people have access to more SP won't they be able to switch it up? So it still will be COD in the long run?
What makes the players able to switch it up all the time if there is a restricted respec?
I use COD loosely. By that I mean just another cookie cutter FPS with no real innovation. People are getting sick of the same old shooters. I you get rid of the SP system or make it irrelevant, you effectively killed what made the game different. Yes in the long run people will be able to diversify. This is the main reason we don't need respecs. In the short run it is cool that people have to specialize. In the end we will all end up in the same place, but how we all got there will be different, which I think sets dust apart from the rest of the shooters.
Aren't you seeing all the people that are bored of DUST now? Don't really think that DUST has anything innovative as a FPS-mechanics, maybe in the future...DUST can be more innovative than a SP system so you guys are still happy. The current SP system is just a drag that attracts AFKers and makes people spec into the same thing out of fear.....sounds really fun to play. What are you going to do at that 'end-point'? Tell stories how you got the same build? |
THEDRiZZLE Aqua teen
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
44
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 16:50:00 -
[120] - Quote
RKKR wrote:THEDRiZZLE Aqua teen wrote:Thereshould be no respec unless they change skills imsick of ppl specing into the flavor ofthe month deal with it ahh qq wahh What about people that don't want to respec in FOTM? (What where the FOTMs up untill now BTW?) Your being an ignorant doppelganger thats the issue man up and deal with it thell will respec fora newbuild thatswhen it should happen not when crying players ask its ruining the mechanics of them game making it unbalanced it needs to be left alone and people will just try for more respects they wont stop at one |
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