Honestly, the real issue is that it the value of ISK is somewhat null and void...skilling up should be something that takes a long time...but it shouldn't really be the end goal. The end goal needs to be the market, the isk, value that ebbs and flows with the player metagame of warfare and conquest...not SP.

This is truly the direction I believe needs more love. There is virtually nothing we can manipulate in the skill cap or SP numbers that will satisfy everyone. The current system is the result of player feedback and the same comments you're all making now. Nothing has changed gentlemen, the system itself is fine, it's the context of the game it exists in which is the problem...instead of SP gap, empower the new players with more things he can do to help his team...That, gentlemen, is how we grow a game.

I think the whole community is becoming a little timid. Don't give up on the numbers, but let's not lose sight of the game as a whole. The question is not how do we make things 'fair' for everyone, but how do we give everyone the ability to fulfill a role for a group or friends without the need of SP or vast game experience?

lol, wut?

So... we take boosters out because that's "CCP Money-grabbing." How, exactly, do you want the game to be profitable?

Before you say "not my problem," you realize that unless the game is at least breaking even development will completely stop? CCP is probably large enough to allow the game to go negative on returns for quite a while to invest in making it better for hopes of future increase in revenue, but that's still going to require that they sell you something. Or would you like to see McDonald's adds every time you want to look at your fittings or watch short ED drug commercials every time you die? Either they sell us stuff in the game or they flood the game with real world advertising. Personally? 15$/month "subscription" >>>>>>>>>>>> adds to make my ***** work.

There is no Pay to Win in Dust. The aurum gear all has increased PG/CPU requirements which have big impacts on your fitting options, the boosters just help you get some more sp (but really, not that much. An active booster is what, one tier 5 skill every month? Maybe?). I personally like the boosters. I can give them a little money to show my support for the game, and if I decide to stop playing I just stop buying boosters and never had to shell out $60 up front. And, if I feel the value in buying enough 30 day boosters to equate $60, then I have been playing much longer than most titles stay fun so I feel like I got my money's worth.

CCP money grabbing? Really? You do realize that CCP can afford to make dust free to play and that they don't require anyone to spend a cent. Why? Eve Online costs $15 a month to play and they have how many active accounts including mine? And all they do is Eve Online and Dust 514. They're not trying to develop and support 6+ other games on top of that. That's why AUR gear provides very little, if any, advantage.

If you want to see what real money grabbing is like, play the social games on Facebook, or many of the games on Bigpoint, or Pirate Galaxy by Split Screen games. Those are truly pay to win.

Honestly, the real issue is that it the value of ISK is somewhat null and void...skilling up should be something that takes a long time...but it shouldn't really be the end goal. The end goal needs to be the market, the isk, value that ebbs and flows with the player metagame of warfare and conquest...not SP.

This is truly the direction I believe needs more love. There is virtually nothing we can manipulate in the skill cap or SP numbers that will satisfy everyone. The current system is the result of player feedback and the same comments you're all making now. Nothing has changed gentlemen, the system itself is fine, it's the context of the game it exists in which is the problem...instead of SP gap, empower the new players with more things he can do to help his team...That, gentlemen, is how we grow a game.

I think the whole community is becoming a little timid. Don't give up on the numbers, but let's not lose sight of the game as a whole. The question is not how do we make things 'fair' for everyone, but how do we give everyone the ability to fulfill a role for a group or friends without the need of SP or vast game experience?

It ensures new players can never catch up to active vets.

full time job, family of 4, weekend cottage...

and still in playing 5-6 hours a day have a boatload of SP

but thanks for the attempted troll, it failed with grace ;)

Why not just use tiered caps?

Less than 1 million Total SP = No Cap

Less than 3 million Total SP = 500k Cap/wk

Less than 5 million Total SP = 300k Cap/wk

Less than 10 million Total SP = 250k Cap/wk

More than 10 million Total SP = 200k Cap/wk

The SP cap was only useful for a couple months. Now it accomplishes nothing and only hurts new players.

How much is a boatload of sp? :) 20mill?

We have a winner!

Honestly no cap til u hit 10mil would be fine imo. Get people on the level they need to be to be able to compete asap. Start the grind once they hit 10mil.

Grind to 10mil, play more get there faster, hit 10mil and now u are in the same boat as everyone else. Id say most actice players average 11-13mil atm

Couple of points as someone pointed this out earlier:

1. Active boosters: Technically CCP/GM is correct when they say the active booster doesn't increase your cap. Take for example, a player that uses a booster on Monday, after hitting about 3/4 of his cap for the week. The cap doesn't magically extend by another 97,000. It's only because smart players figure that if you use a booster on Wednesday, you can extend the amount of bonus SP you get by 50% of the weekly cap.

2. 'Catching up': While newer players will never catch up in terms of raw SP with older players is true, however based on my understanding of the way CCP thinks, they have their reasoning behind maintaining a disparity between the SP levels of players. As a long time player of EVE (watch the crybabies start using this against my arguments), we've seen countless arguments from newer players that they will never catch up in SP amounts to the vets. However, as other posters have pointed out, at a certain point, the maximum amount of SP you can have affecting a particular build levels out, and more SP = more versatality.

Another point to the catching up thing, although I agree to a rolling cap, I can understand that CCP looks at their products from a long-term perspective. I do agree that CCP could do more in terms of communication with the playerbase, and that there should be more to do in game, the way CCP works is that they do not build games which get played and discarded after 6 months. if you look at it from a long term perspective where you'll be playing this game on and off for a few years (which CCP expects you to), in the long run a couple of million SP will not make that much of a difference.

In regards to 2 "Catching up" would be a non issue if having more sp didnt mean having drastically increased survivability
Knowing that you outplayed someone and they only survived due to their character being around longer is incredibly frustrating and a terrible thing to have in a fast paced action game
Tekken Revolution while a different genre completely also has a skill system in place and does it better by having skill points offer a tiny tiny bit of an advantage, for instance 30 extra points in vitality is barely an extra hit on the life bar

I understand what you mean, but honestly I still consider it a non-issue. The game tends to promote teamwork over individual skill, and a disparity between players seems intentional given my perception of how CCP works. This would you to adapt to different problems via different methods, i.e. if you can't kill that person 1v1, try leading him into concentrated fire from your team, or swap fits to counter his fit etc.

That being said, Dust (and EVE) is all about the minor bonuses. Remember that you only get a maximum of 5 levels in every skill, and that level 5 requires more SP than level 1-4 combined. Therefore, the slight drop in effectiveness by having a skill at 4 can be offset by adjustments in tactics or fits etc.

My 2 cents

Which also means that once you reach your cap, your Active booster bonus will be based on a 1SP for each WP to a maximum of 1,000 SP (1,500 SP with an Active Booster). Not very much an incentive to sell more booster if once you reached the cap you only get 500 SP/per battle as maximum bonus is it?

Just to mention that as well; The SP Cap has been modified several times in the past, and who knows, it could be altered again in the future. Feel free to share some feedback in the appropriate section if needed.

to keep me from maxing the skill tree in 3 months....

if there was no cap I would have about 50 million SP by now.. 6 months later.

that is why there is a SP cap. cause these kind of games will always have people like me ;P

Your sweet little thread begging that GM Vegas reopen your locked thread about the dead horse of SP gap.

Thought maybe you might have got banned after that.

Your thread disappeared real quick.

I made a video expressing the OP's Concerns

Please leave comment if you agree.

Thanks