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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
jenza aranda
BetaMax.
CRONOS.
1460
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:04:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hey all.
One of the ideas things that has been discussed with the CPM is the idea to have placeholder models for all the currently missing racial variants (gal, min, cal heavy, cal & amar light) to have placeholder models with all the intended slot loadouts, skills, skill bonuses and stats untill such a time where the art department is ready to implement them.
We think that currently, a lot of the suits seem to be trying to balance themselves for options that dont yet exist which is kinda flawed. Traditionally CCP doesn't really like the use of placeholders but in this instance we think its fairly important.
Any feedback and thoughts on this would be very valuable. |
Captain-Awesome
Internal Error.
Negative-Feedback
416
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
graphics should not stop functionality.
minecraft wasn't built for it's graphics yet look how that came.
if we can get a suitable placeholder, I would be fine with it and I think many others would too. |
DJINN Rampage
BetaMax.
CRONOS.
29
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
id like to side spec caldari scout, that'd be pretty sweet :P |
jenza aranda
BetaMax.
CRONOS.
1463
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:10:00 -
[4] - Quote
the main idea for the heavy for example is to just have the current amarr heavy as a placeholder model for the other ones then have the colour tinted red, green or grey for the racial variants. |
Knight SoIaire
Better Hide R Die
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
547
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:12:00 -
[5] - Quote
As long as there is some clear way of telling apart (Just an example) an Amarr Heavy from a Caldari Heavy, so we have an idea of the stats of the enemy we're going up against, and what weapons to use against them. |
Mithridates VI
IMPSwarm
Negative-Feedback
1631
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:13:00 -
[6] - Quote
I am all for this. As close to the current respec as possible, too. |
Herli Pascal
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
36
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:13:00 -
[7] - Quote
I support this idea wholeheartedly. Do it CCP. I know a lot of people are questioning their SP choices because almost half of the dropsuit variants have yet to implemented. A placeholder is an excellent compromise. |
KatanaPT
Tech Guard
General Tso's Alliance
120
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
Great idea, fully suport this. |
Laurent Cazaderon
What The French
CRONOS.
1397
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
jenza aranda wrote:Hey all.
One of the ideas things that has been discussed with the CPM is the idea to have placeholder models for all the currently missing racial variants (gal, min, cal heavy, cal & amar light) to have placeholder models with all the intended slot loadouts, skills, skill bonuses and stats untill such a time where the art department is ready to implement them.
We think that currently, a lot of the suits seem to be trying to balance themselves for options that dont yet exist which is kinda flawed. Traditionally CCP doesn't really like the use of placeholders but in this instance we think its fairly important.
Any feedback and thoughts on this would be very valuable.
As i already said when we discussed this, i'm totally in favor of doing this.
The current suits and specialized suits need some work to get back to a point where clear markers make them stick to the area of expertise they should cover. It can be done by balancing bonuses, shifting layouts and other statistics but it's kinda meaningless if we dont have the full package of suits to do this.
I can very much understand how painfull it would be for graphics and design teams to see new suits first come out without their unique skin but we cannot wait X months for this.
I hear many heavies being bored by not having new suits to get their hands on. And i think it may disgust those players at some point and drive them away.
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Laurent Cazaderon
What The French
CRONOS.
1397
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:19:00 -
[10] - Quote
Knight SoIaire wrote:As long as there is some clear way of telling apart (Just an example) an Amarr Heavy from a Caldari Heavy, so we have an idea of the stats of the enemy we're going up against, and what weapons to use against them.
This could be probably done using simple color pattern that are probably way faster to do than building a new suit altogether. |
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Starfire Revo
G I A N T
EoN.
66
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:19:00 -
[11] - Quote
Agree with Captain-Placeholder. The current races have fairly distinct colour schemes, so something as simple as recoloured versions of the current suits until suitable artwork is finished could work. |
Another Heavy SOB
TRUE TEA BAGGERS
68
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:24:00 -
[12] - Quote
I wholly support this idea. Varying colors of course would be necessary to identify them.
My only concern is that if they do go ahead with these placeholders they wouldn't come until after the current requested respec deadline and everyone would be asking for another try. |
Musta Tornius
BetaMax.
CRONOS.
341
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:26:00 -
[13] - Quote
Please do, this makes so much sense and would have tremendous impact on balancing the game. |
Jessica Montoya
Sand Mercenary Corps Inc.
Interstellar Conquest Enterprises
11
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:30:00 -
[14] - Quote
One thing I keep hearing is "this is unbalanced that is unbalanced" and all I do is shake my head and say "wait till everything is out then it will be balanced". Something like this could work but would kill my immersion in the game. So to stop the cry babies yes. To save my fun/immersion in the game no. |
Happy Violentime
OMFGZOMBIESRUN
75
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:34:00 -
[15] - Quote
Makes a lot of sense to do this and to do it now before optional respec |
jenza aranda
BetaMax.
CRONOS.
1465
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:35:00 -
[16] - Quote
Jessica Montoya wrote:One thing I keep hearing is "this is unbalanced that is unbalanced" and all I do is shake my head and say "wait till everything is out then it will be balanced". Something like this could work but would kill my immersion in the game. So to stop the cry babies yes. To save my fun/immersion in the game no.
What if there was some lore to go allong side it? like for example Caldari Navy spies have infiltrated the gallente navy, stealing and reverse engineering the light dropsuit or something along that those lines? |
ChromeBreaker
SVER True Blood
Unclaimed.
484
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:36:00 -
[17] - Quote
I disagree. The Sentinal has bonuses for a weapon that isnt out yet... you going to do the same with the weapon? what about the Galente heavy weapon?
Its a cheap fix and if anything... and i know im going to get stick for this... i would say remove the sentinal untill all variants are available! |
EnglishSnake
Zumari Force Projection
Caldari State
1106
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:40:00 -
[18] - Quote
Does this include pilot suits and modules for us vehicle users? |
jenza aranda
BetaMax.
CRONOS.
1465
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:46:00 -
[19] - Quote
EnglishSnake wrote:Does this include pilot suits and modules for us vehicle users?
no, thats a specialisation that hasnt been added yet, im talking about the missing basics, sentinals and scouts for now |
EnglishSnake
Zumari Force Projection
Caldari State
1106
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:51:00 -
[20] - Quote
So then does that include the missing Minmatar & Amarr vehicles then? |
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Scottie MaCallan
Krusual Covert Operators
Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:53:00 -
[21] - Quote
I'm definitely for this, but I think it needs to happen soon, if it's going to. If it takes too long players might start getting used to periodic skill refunds/respecs, partial or full, if it happens soon-ish, it'll just be another part of all the changes that have been going on lately. And with a respec already going on, CCP could just remind us of that, make a statement noting that if you have already received your respec, but want a new one, you can, and maybe extend the deadline if necessary, by like a week or two.
of course, if they want to get in on this respec, instead of offering a partial dropsuit command respec later, they would also need to have the placeholders ready pretty quickly. |
ChromeBreaker
SVER True Blood
Unclaimed.
484
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:53:00 -
[22] - Quote
Remove the sentinal until it has a weapon to match it. Then bring out all 4 variants at once.
Scouts are in a better position and just need filling out |
Captain-Awesome
Internal Error.
Negative-Feedback
416
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:53:00 -
[23] - Quote
ChromeBreaker wrote:I disagree. The Sentinal has bonuses for a weapon that isnt out yet... you going to do the same with the weapon? Use a FG model? what about the Galente heavy?
Its a cheap fix and if anything... and i know im going to get stick for this... i would say remove the sentinal untill all variants are available! AND there racial weapons.
Scouts are a different matter, they have a solid base to jump from... but i still think its a poor showing.
If balncing is an issue then you start with a solid foundation and build up... you dont just keep bolting things onto something that is rotten...
I think you are misunderstanding what jenza is saying.
They have been told the functionality for the suits are ready, but the suit graphics are not. They can release the suits with a basic variant for now if we would be happy with it. You get the functionality of the suit, they just look very similar, like the caldari logi looks so similar to the caldari assault and so forth. |
The Black Art
Pro Hic Immortalis
RISE of LEGION
48
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:55:00 -
[24] - Quote
Yes, but in terms of things looking alike, it'd be no different than last build where every assault was a caldari, and every logi was minmatar. People will get over it and be grateful for the options. |
ChromeBreaker
SVER True Blood
Unclaimed.
484
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:56:00 -
[25] - Quote
Captain-Awesome wrote:ChromeBreaker wrote:I disagree. The Sentinal has bonuses for a weapon that isnt out yet... you going to do the same with the weapon? Use a FG model? what about the Galente heavy?
Its a cheap fix and if anything... and i know im going to get stick for this... i would say remove the sentinal untill all variants are available! AND there racial weapons.
Scouts are a different matter, they have a solid base to jump from... but i still think its a poor showing.
If balncing is an issue then you start with a solid foundation and build up... you dont just keep bolting things onto something that is rotten... I think you are misunderstanding what jenza is saying. They have been told the functionality for the suits are ready, but the suit graphics are not. They can release the suits with a basic variant for now if we would be happy with it. You get the functionality of the suit, they just look very similar, like the caldari logi looks so similar to the caldari assault and so forth.
Basic suits... knock your selves out absolutely... but they were talking sentinels... it would be like bring out logis without repair tools.. |
Chris F2112
187.
Unclaimed.
181
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Posted - 2013.05.23 11:57:00 -
[26] - Quote
This is a great plan, and should be implemented as soon as possible. While it may be a bit odd to look at for a while, it's an overall great idea that allows for a lot more people to play the way they want and makes the game more fun. Do it! |
Jason Pearson
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
1288
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Posted - 2013.05.23 12:00:00 -
[27] - Quote
Could we not simply use the current models and make them bigger/smaller for each? So the Caldari Heavy would be a fat version of the current suits, scout being slimmer. No changes apart from them being bigger/smaller. |
Yosef Autaal
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
81
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Posted - 2013.05.23 12:07:00 -
[28] - Quote
I fully agree that we should have placeholders for missing suits 100%
but with adding these placeholders we will have to have another round of optional respecs, as without this respec the large numbers who went for heavys will be stuck with the amarr heavy and the majority of those investing into the new racial variants of suits will only be those who are new to that frame size and dont have any sp already invested.
as you wont see many people invest large amounts of sp to go into the racial types as it will be to sp intesive when they already have the sp invested into prototypes of current racial variants,
there is possibiltiy of partial reset of just the dropsuit skills heavy and light frames but this will solve only half the problem as those using the suits might not be specced into the different modules needed for the new racial suit they wanted so a full and if racial suits have bonus's to racial weapons (you can see how this rabbit whole works)
but with another respec why not do the vehicles at the same time because if we dont we will need another optional respec once the minmatar and amarr vehicles are released which a number of vehicles users are waiting for and want and due to the even large amount of sp needed to be invested to gain access to the HAVs and such as with the suits only those new to the vehicles will train into the new racial variants.
some people have come back to argument of optional respecs for every new items are added such as when we get MAVS and Pilot suits but unlike the current suits and vehicles no one has had to use a single racial variant of these items for large periods of time as there was no other choice so if some one wants to move into these areas everyone moves into the options equally.
that is the key point with current suits and vehicles and reason for optional respecs everyone should get the same choices and options available to them and not just grant the options to those new to game and say to the older players well you made your choices your stuck with them.
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iceyburnz
Crux Special Tasks Group
Gallente Federation
465
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Posted - 2013.05.23 12:09:00 -
[29] - Quote
Good idea.
As long as it doesn't induce art asset apathy, giving ccp the idea that graphics arn't important. Basically as long as we get the real models on the same timetable. |
Jin Robot
Foxhound Corporation
General Tso's Alliance
585
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Posted - 2013.05.23 12:14:00 -
[30] - Quote
Well, it would help eliminate future "respec my heavy SP" threads and would be better than being forced to
1. Spec Amarr
2. Wait for soon |
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