http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/05/15/massivelys-dust-514-launch-impressions/

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/05/15/massivelys-dust-514-launch-impressions/

Jef Reahard

http://massively.joystiq.com/editor/jef-reahard

"He has also covered EverQuest II and Darkfall at length..."

Quotes from article:

"I've played EVE in some strange places prior to this. In an airport terminal, for example. On my toilet, even "

"I'm not sure that DUST qualifies as an MMOFPS. I'd err on the side of no, not really because I've come to realize that games other than PlanetSide, PlanetSide 2, and World War II Online Battleground Europe have no business using the MMOFPS moniker."

Take from that what you will....

I love the idea of DUST just as I love the idea of EVE. The actual gameplay isn't particularly compelling, though. It's adequate in most respects, but there's nothing here that you haven't done in a thousand other shooters.

CCP really needs to do a better job bringing new players into the fold.

This guy was reviewing the game for a major online MMO news/review site, and didn't even join any squads or try getting together with a corporation. Imagine how lost a MMO newb would feel.

Jef Reahard

http://massively.joystiq.com/editor/jef-reahard

"He has also covered EverQuest II and Darkfall at length..."

Quotes from article:

"I've played EVE in some strange places prior to this. In an airport terminal, for example. On my toilet, even "

"I'm not sure that DUST qualifies as an MMOFPS. I'd err on the side of no, not really because I've come to realize that games other than PlanetSide, PlanetSide 2, and World War II Online Battleground Europe have no business using the MMOFPS moniker."

Take from that what you will....

also:

Cons:
Dated presentation/visuals
Sloppy, imprecise shooter controls
Inadequate keyboard/mouse support
Future potential tied to EVE Online <<<-----why is this a CON?

This game sucks for lone wolfing, but is awesome playing in squads and CCP needs to make this apparent for new players.

Sloppy, imprecise shooter controls

CCP really needs to do a better job bringing new players into the fold.

This guy was reviewing the game for a major online MMO news/review site, and didn't even join any squads or try getting together with a corporation. Imagine how lost a MMO newb would feel.

This game sucks for lone wolfing, but is awesome playing in squads and CCP needs to make this apparent for new players.

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/05/15/massivelys-dust-514-launch-impressions/

Playing EVE on my couch is bizarre. I know, technically it's called DUST 514, but let's be serious. DUST is basically the beginnings of a massive EVE Online expansion if you subscribe to the notion that EVE is a virtual world as opposed to merely a strategy game featuring internet spaceships and internet drama.

I thought it was a good article and true. We need honest critiques that highlight the good and the bad.

Preach the truth, brotha!

Heck, this game sucks for lone wolfing at 9.5 million SP. I can't imagine what the NPE is like.

New players have to do way too much work with their fittings, too. None of the reviews are going to take into account the times that you are stuck with the exact same fittings for months on end while grinding the SP for a proto suit.

Inadequate keyboard/mouse support

Inadequate to what? A PC?

Cuz i can't think of any game on the PS3 (or any console for that matter) that has keyboard/mouse support.

Jef Reahard

http://massively.joystiq.com/editor/jef-reahard

"He has also covered EverQuest II and Darkfall at length..."

Quotes from article:

"I've played EVE in some strange places prior to this. In an airport terminal, for example. On my toilet, even "

"I'm not sure that DUST qualifies as an MMOFPS. I'd err on the side of no, not really because I've come to realize that games other than PlanetSide, PlanetSide 2, and World War II Online Battleground Europe have no business using the MMOFPS moniker."

Take from that what you will....

also:

Cons:
Dated presentation/visuals
Sloppy, imprecise shooter controls
Inadequate keyboard/mouse support
Future potential tied to EVE Online <<<-----why is this a CON?

I played like 5 matches on my alt in Academy (then I WP capped)....to be honest fighting players with equal gear/sp is more fun then the regular game.

Future potential tied to EVE Online <<<-----why is this a CON?

+1 my thoughts exactly

He only played 6 hours? And im supposed to take this review seriously?
He should go back playing with Lego's.
****** written review tbh.

This has been and continues to be the biggest drawback of Dust - legitimate concern, as were the list of Cons in his article.

Lot of potential but a premature launch.

The Academy was screwing up yesterday, so I manually looked for a Merc game. Found one with one spot open and figured what the heck.

Full 32 man games. Full corps with full loadouts (heavies, scouts etc). Eve ship stuff from above. Or something coming down from above. Full voice chat with objective callouts. Revives, resupplies, the full experience.

It was a thing of beauty. I had felt pretty smug with my 5.1 headset/mic and KB/M on Academy servers. This here - I was getting stomped hard. And it was awesome.

Compared to Academy games, it might as well have been two different games.

Inadequate to what? A PC?

Cuz i can't think of any game on the PS3 (or any console for that matter) that has keyboard/mouse support.

Completely agree. There is no comparison between playing a random battle and playing a fully synced battle with your corporation. Unfortunately, CCP doesn't really have a grasp on how to present this extremely drastic difference to new players.

Academy is fun because there is no SP/gear gap....what you said has nothing to do with that gap......there is no reason why "big corp battles" could also do away with SP/gear and have the matches based on skill not how long you have let passive Sp accrue.

If being fully loaded is so very very fun then why not let everyone be fully loaded? rather then waiting and grinding against horrible players with 10 million SP?

I noticed that too, its a bloody console game, on the PS3. TBH CCP should never have bothered implementing KBM support to try and placate PC FPS players (I've played many myself over the years). For the PS3 I just force myself to use DS3, I may be rubbish at it, but I am slowly getting better.

Eve online had a very premature launch. In fact, Eve Online started out with fat less features and limited visuals than how DUST has started now. Yes, it needs work, but that's the whole point of having free updates and constant hotfixes for the next ten years. Just like Eve and just like Rome, DUST was not built in a day.

Eve online had a very premature launch. In fact, Eve Online started out with fat less features and limited visuals than how DUST has started now. Yes, it needs work, but that's the whole point of having free updates and constant hotfixes for the next ten years. Just like Eve and just like Rome, DUST was not built in a day.

A short voiceover cut scene saying something like "New Eden is a harsh place, and you're not going to make it far on your own. You must find other mercenaries who share your goals and vision to fight by your side, and you by theirs." With some quick snips of how to invite players to squad, or search corporations, and then maybe some cut scene style "gameplay" where a Merc is getting owned and goes down, but as the voice says "you must find other mercenaries..." another merc comes into the shot and revives the guy, would do wonders.

Cons:
Dated presentation/visuals
Sloppy, imprecise shooter controls
Inadequate keyboard/mouse support
Future potential tied to EVE Online <<<-----why is this a CON?

I rather get a guy who doesn't paint himself as a fanboi of other games and takes every game for itself from the raw. Clearly this guy hates New Eden and doesn't understand it.

four-star restaurant (don't go to a five star, they are not fulfilling, ever, and it always costs you more for less, a lot less).

Hate to be the one to say it, but restaurants only go to three star. Hotels go up to five, but restaurants go up to three. And earning even one is a prestigious award.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelin_Guide#Stars

he listed the joining of EVE and DUST as a CON.

Academy is fun because there is no SP/gear gap....what you said has nothing to do with that gap......there is no reason why "big corp battles" could also do away with SP/gear and have the matches based on skill not how long you have let passive Sp accrue.

If being fully loaded is so very very fun then why not let everyone be fully loaded? rather then waiting and grinding against horrible players with 10 million SP?

Yeah cuz roles in FPSs is a new and undiscovered idea that only just now was discovered by CCP. Enemy Territory, BF1942 and Team Fortress are just phantoms of our imagination.

Also the SP/level system comes from RPGs not MMO....most MMOs these days are trashing that RPG model for the simple reason that it sucks.

Leveling up tells a story...it does not allow you to write that story yourself. Great for RPG story telling...terrible for sandbox MMOs. Even worse for an FPS MMO that by its very nature is action based.

In BF1942 and TF2, your roles are very fixed. In TF2, as a medic, you're a medic. You do nothing but heal. Sure, you can shoot, but the only role you're truly suited for is healing. Engineers are for area denial, as are, to some degree, the demoman. To some degee, the same with BF1942.

My point is that you can be much more flexible, or specialised, in DUST. If you're a logi, you're not stuck to healing; you can provide spawn uplinks, ammo refills, or reviving players. If you're a scout, you're not stuck in the role of using your mobility to get close and deal tons of damage (you can snipe instead, or be a quick AV suit). If you're an assault, you're not stuck using the assault rifle, as you can use MD's instead - effectively a cross between the demoman and the heavy of TF2.

Effectively, your role is what you want to define it to be, even if you pick a specific dropsuit.

Dust is a PC game on console. It's fair to give it a PC MMO site review (there are no MMOs on console in the first place). KBM support is bad, not only for lack of menus.

What I don't get is this guy claims he's a hardcore EVE player [even I don't play on my toilet], yet he can't understand how the skill system works or anything. It's like he dumbed himself down on purpose for no real reason other than attempt to put himself in a 'true newbie's' shoes, and went too far. [The quote, "You can never go full ******!" from Tropic Thunder comes to mind]. And the fact that he listed the joining of EVE and DUST as a CON. What the blue hell man; any EVE fanboy/girl would put that as a pro five times over.

Other than that, it was a solid review, with some tones of legitimate concern for the game, which is good. And he does have some fair points about piloting controls and KB/M, the almost sluggish movement on the ground [don't get me started on getting stuck on everything in the terrain], stuff like that.

There are several MMOs on consoles, and there have been since a console generation back. Everquest OA, FF XI, Phantasy Star Online, and FF XIV (to ps3 I think?) at some point. Those are the ones I can think of anyhow.


MMO?

Dust isn't much of an MMO or an RPG though. That's not meant to be an insult necessarily, I'm just thinking that outside of the chat and corp system - it's basically a game with randomized team deathmatch and poor matchmaking. There's a gear/class element, but the classes/gear remain very simple:

Race/class?

e.g. : There are four races, and 4 "classes", but only 11 of those possible combos are available right now - and only 4 of them have much definition role-wise.

Gear?

e.g. : Compared to what one might consider other MMOs (or even regular console RPGs) the weapon choice tends to be very restricted within type. Most weapons inside a given type have basically three weapons (std gun, adv gun, pro gun). Sometimes there's a variant, in which case you might add "different adv gun and different pro gun" to the mix... anything else is probably an Aurum variant of one of those.

Try to imagine if you played an RPG as a sword expert, and by game's end your choices were: Broadsword (you could use this as the start), Broadsword +1, and Broadsword +2. This is pretty accurate to Dust for specializing in a given weapon, most don't have "lots" of types like ARs do. The weapons themselves look mostly identical to prior weapons and act identically in every way but slight damage increases.

Story?

What can be called a story isn't accessible in Dust... at all. Aside from the intro movie, in what way, shape, or form does any player have any involvement in the universe (personally)? Some MMOs aren't great at this either mind you, but the extent of player engagement in the world is instant battles. The instant battles have no apparent attachment to anything. It's like if WoW or Everquest had launched only with a PvP arena, which you can level at.

The names of corporations, the roles of governments, the way players might interact or influence any of it is.... completely missing. A player has no stake in anything, and the impetus to get stronger for a new player has to come from wanting higher skills for more team deathmatches. Team deathmatches where the matchmaking is sketchy, and you can't necessarily choose your team.

So, the game is completely blank here. Any story would have to be gleaned from reading websites. The universe doesn't exist outside some art design for Dust players. There are no "quests", there are no "stories", there is no "content" - there are only random team PvP matches, and starting tomorrow - what are basically arranged pvp matches between player "clans/guilds". All of it exist outside the universe - especially for a random ps3 user.

And unfortunately again all the people in the beta get a massive head start. No one wants to admit that the SP gap creates a completely unbalanced game, but I bet you a lot of people would have quit had CCP reset everyone's account at the launch of the game yesterday.

Controls?

This is a very legitimate gripe. Just about ALL of even the crappiest games ever made on PC still come with a menu where you can customize the key layout, and it's really common in console games that have competitive elements as well. They recently added "alternate" layouts for controllers, but they still aren't willing to just hand the player a list of functions and let them attach the button/key they want.

This is dead stupid. It's not a complicated feature. It's not something that requires balance. It's something managed in just about every game ever released. Dust is released. Controls you don't like shouldn't be something you just cope with. How you interface with the game itself is about as basic and fundamental to the game as things get. It's easily the first shooter I've seen with keyboard support that said basically, "use our mappings or gtfo". I still hate the controller options too, and it seems stupid that a list of functions we could assign buttons to wasn't part of the initial release.

So, yeah. If I reviewed MMOs, I'd say this game sucks too. It's like being an RPG player handed a shooter with only a head to head player mode, no single-player, etc. What else would you make of it?

CCP really needs to do a better job bringing new players into the fold.

This guy was reviewing the game for a major online MMO news/review site, and didn't even join any squads or try getting together with a corporation. Imagine how lost a MMO newb would feel.

One can't force people to see a (realistic) vision of what a continuously developed game will be like to someone who is used to release->next game kind of game development.

...

CCP really needs to do a better job bringing new players into the fold.

This guy was reviewing the game for a major online MMO news/review site, and didn't even join any squads or try getting together with a corporation. Imagine how lost a MMO newb would feel.

This game sucks for lone wolfing, but is awesome playing in squads and CCP needs to make this apparent for new players.

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/05/15/massivelys-dust-514-launch-impressions/

Unless you're a coder yourself and have a simpler solution to offer to include customisable layouts in the current iteration of the engine, you can't just call it "dead stupid". Constructive criticism is one thing, calling something explicitly crap without offering an alternative and explaining the methodology is something else entirely. Now, I would agree with you actually that the lack of control customisation is a drawback to the experience on the game. I'm pretty sure it's on CCP's to do list along with a whole range of other updates and expansions to come, as I explained previously.



What would I make of it?

I rather get a guy who doesn't paint himself as a fanboi of other games and takes every game for itself from the raw. Clearly this guy hates New Eden and doesn't understand it.

I played like 5 matches on my alt in Academy (then I WP capped)....to be honest fighting players with equal gear/sp is more fun then the regular game.

i dont exactly understand new eden.

ive been playing since feb or so. it seems new eden doesnt like real money coming its way. ive bought 4 merc packs. chromosome was so fun. nowadays its just getting by till things get better. i dont see the point of buying active boosters and suits. battle isnt fun. we sit in lobbies and bs. its a blast but i can do that elsewhere. are you guys gonna do anything about community concerns? are the forums the only place to talk? u guys go into the field?

hit me up sometime saber. u cud hear what ppl who dont frequent this forum feel about this game.

the guy's a moron

he has trouble understanding the skill system even after it was dumbed down.

Soon as the house stops burning for a bit Ill be entrenching soon enough.

Get a Tack AR if u want to compete.

You know what is the bigger's problem with Dust 514 ?

That it's own community is trying to kill the game...I have never seen anything like this before, and i been playing games for many, many years.

Dust 514 have one of the more divided communities ever. Is actually socking ....

Fixed.

I know consoles are much more suited for casuals and the young'uns so you have got to bear this in mind.

SO when you first started you knew what every skill did and what it unlocked. Also what levels of different skills effect your toon and fits and were able to precisely apply all your SP in such a manner that not one was wasted. I'm thinking you are the moron here, and CCP needs to add a better interface for comparing items and seeing what each skill unlocks. Unlike EVE, DUST is way more convoluted as to what all you need to make the fit you are after, and the only reason I say EVE is better at it is because of addons like EVEMON and PYFA. But unlike the PC most DUST users aren't going to download a program on their PC to help them navigate the maze that is the skill tree.

Bassmeant, I swear, a couple months ago you were absolutely hating on CCP. Now, all the posts I've come across of yours seem to be defending them in some way or another. What happened?!

"SO when you first started you knew what every skill did and what it unlocked"

of course not.

that's why i hit triangle and read what it did. and did some basic math.

took maybe half a minute?

so what's your point.


oh yeah:
the reviewer is supposed to be their go to MMO guy.
he claims he plays EvE.

514s skill tree, as it is, is too confusing for him.


again:
the guy's a moron.

Peace
B

Dust is NO like EVE

Dust will NEVER by like EVE.

In some respects, you're right. In others, you aren't.

In EVE Online, you're not exactly discouraged to lie, cheat and steal your way to the top. Espionage is also a great way to make money, as well as betraying your friends. Politics is rife in New Eden, in most other games it usually comes down to "I hate that guy, he's now my enemy". In New Eden, it's not about personal relationships. In New Eden, you take territory because it's good business. You make people compete because YOU want to make money, and to do so, you undercut your competition's prices.

It will be the same in DUST. You don't go to war with any corporation or alliance because you have a personal grudge; you'll do it because it makes good business sense. You don't launch attacks on the same districts over and over again, because you won't be able to afford to keep up that kind of effort.

Sure, the gameplay isn't exactly the same, but the principle behind both games, the idea which both games are drawn from, is that you, as a player, have the ultimate freedom to decide your OWN fate and to make your own storyline.

jesus.

vage much?


you got your facts all twisted.

ps4, son. ps4. not ps3. desinty is on ps4. planetside 2? you guys are having trouble with this. how you gonna play a game that is even bigger? unless it's just a big watered down version of cod, which would make sense.



other then that, might i suggest:

decaf


Peace
B

CCP really needs to do a better job bringing new players into the fold.

This guy was reviewing the game for a major online MMO news/review site, and didn't even join any squads or try getting together with a corporation. Imagine how lost a MMO newb would feel.

I wasted time reading an review by a person who ran solo, didnt try to group up, didnt use a mic and complained about 'its too hard to understand' and didnt even try to get into the game tbh

The guy is a ******* dumbass, how the **** do these ppl get jobs writing reviews?

I wasted time reading an comment from a person who offers no suggestions to new players, dismisses any criticism about the game, wasn't courteous, and complained about newbies not being able to understand the game and didn't even try to sympathize tbh

This guy is a ******* dumbass, how the **** do these ppl become such obnoxious assholes?

CCP will eventually have to move this to PS4 if they want it to survive. That or PC so my point still stands that it will have competition in a year from now.

"He has also covered EverQuest II and Darkfall at length..."

Future potential tied to EVE Online <<<-----why is this a CON?

Future potential tied to EVE Online <<<-----why is this a CON?

the guy's a moron

he has trouble understanding the skill system even after it was dumbed down.

not much more you can do other then draw pictures with crayons to help explain it for folks like that.

Peace
B

Right, addressing all your comments in the same post. First things first, your concern about proto suits. The instant battle academy helps to address those concerns. As for the "proto" gear banned in some places of EVE, you're talking about supercapitals in highsec. Yes. That's more so that there's actually some risk to having one, so that you can't b're deuild a capital in highsec and then take it into lowsec. The best way to learn is by being thrown in at the deep end. I actually relish fighting against those in proto suits, simply because it forces me to adapt and grow as a player.

Second one... As I've said before, there are rumors they're developing on the Unreal 4, and porting to the Unreal 3. Unreal 4 is used for PS4. Concern addressed?

Third one. The guy who reviewed on Joystiq claims he plays EVE, where the skill system is possibly more convoluted than in DUST, and yet he complains that the skill system is complex. There's some inconsistency there.

"And how many more new players will do the same and forget this game? The above mentality is why this game will suffer and go away just like EVE is no more than an ever shrinking core group of elitist snobs. CCP has not been able to increase their player base yet in any permenant way. They need to worry about potential customers like the reviewer."



that's a whole lotta words just to say


"CCP have to protect dummies"


Peace
B

I wasted time reading an review by a person who ran solo, didnt try to group up, didnt use a mic and complained about 'its too hard to understand' and didnt even try to get into the game tbh

The guy is a ******* dumbass, how the **** do these ppl get jobs writing reviews?

So people are just supposed to jump right in and understand all that or CCP's intent on how to play?

You so smart! Have my Chitlins.