DUST Search - Please DEV's fix the scout suit

STB-stlcarlos989 EV wrote:

Aeon Amadi wrote:

-Sigh- Heavies and Machine-guns and now Scouts and their Submachine Guns... Can't you people just accept the fact that there is **** in this game designed to kill you?

They even said at Fanfest that if a Scout suit gets close enough to move around you that you're ****** because you won't be able to turn fast enough - that is what they do. They are there to act as hit-and-run specialists. This "character model isn't big enough" bullshit honestly needs to stop right here and now.

Honestly, you people don't know how to adapt to a battlefield. We're about to enter a new build and you ******* -FINALLY- realized that tanks don't go away unless they're killed - so you all went Anti-Vehicle. Now, whenever you're faced with heavy Anti-vehicle on the opposition, you don't know how to go back to Infantry and bring the fight to them. You just spawn in more vehicles and die a lot saying that the Swarm Launcher/Forge Gun is over-powered.

YOU DIE. LEARN THIS ALREADY. ACCEPT IT. ADAPT AND SURVIVE.

Jesus christ - you know, I don't have any issues with this game. I get killed, I look back and learn what I did wrong and evolve on that. I used to run Scout suits frequently and for the past three weeks I've run Logistics - Scouts don't bother me. I aim, I fire, they die. They get too close, I die. That's the nature of this game.

I highly doubt CCP intended for them to be able to DODGE BULLETS.

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lDocHollidayl Imperfects Negative-Feedback 171	Posted - 2012.08.06 05:50:00 - [1] - Quote I have heard that once hit detection is fixed it will not be an issue. I am not convinced. Moving or a straight line scouts do not receive damage like other suits. Is this part of the game or an area that will be addressed? The scout is the hardest suit to hit. Everyone can see it is broken. Without RE's to corner scouts with, they will be matrix-like. I have had two friends quit already: saying "scouts are too unbalanced", "hit detection is whack". I went through 120 rounds once with a scout zigzagging 3 meters from me. It is... irritating. Not having them in the game would be an improvement.
William HBonney Imperfects Negative-Feedback 318	Posted - 2012.08.06 05:56:00 - [2] - Quote I think the main issue I have with the scout suit is that they have no fear of running into a fight....they have the most "fragile" suit, but they can easily 1v1 people as long as the twitch strafe back and forth. This makes the assault suit null and void. The assault suit shouldn't have to fear a confrontation with a scout suit, but even with triple the health it is rare that an assault can kill a strafing scout...except with a shotgun or AOE weapons such as tanks, the other problem is that assault suits don't last much longer vs AOE anyhow. On this route everyone will be a scout and it will come down to the luck of hit detection during gunfights.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:00:00 - [3] - Quote Or you could just accept that scout suits have less armour as a trade off to better speed and agility. They are also smaller BY DESIGN. If I design something to be smaller and quicker but as a result it has less armour, where's the imbalance? And no, not everyone will be a scout. They have horrible CPU/PG and can't really carry anything useful.
Majin Vejeta Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 13	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:03:00 - [4] - Quote Grit Breather wrote: Or you could just accept that scout suits have less armour as a trade off to better speed and agility. They are also smaller BY DESIGN. If I design something to be smaller and quicker but as a result it has less armour, where's the imbalance? And no, not everyone will be a scout. They have horrible CPU/PG and can't really carry anything useful. the imbalance is currently they have little to no hit detection.
xprotoman23 Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 1452	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:04:00 - [5] - Quote Besides hit detection issues the character model of the scout is too small.
Crimson MoonV Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 658	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:04:00 - [6] - Quote Scout suit will be fine once they fix hit detection. I play scout and I get tore up against people with assault suits that can aim. I wish I would have never put all those SP into scout. Scout is for people who like to run away and use RE. I like to stand and fight. I Should have skilled into assault.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:06:00 - [7] - Quote xprotoman23 wrote: Besides hit detection issues the character model of the scout is too small. They are basically wearing spandex instead of armour. Of course that makes them small.
lDocHollidayl Imperfects Negative-Feedback 171	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:14:00 - [8] - Quote Are we playing the same game? Consistently...90% a scout will just not receive damage.(proto scout). I talk to loads of people that cry the same foul. Crimson I value your words so I just assume your not side stepping back and forth...or wiggling your L3 in a circular motion. Or perhaps you jump a lot because gravity seems to be the same for them and they actually move slower when airborne. My concern is this is by design. I can say %50 of players I have talked to in game share this same experience. Jump in an ambush game. If someone on the other team is running a proto scout, everyone on mics have something ill to say about that.
William HBonney Imperfects Negative-Feedback 318	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:14:00 - [9] - Quote Crimson MoonV wrote: Scout suit will be fine once they fix hit detection. I play scout and I get tore up against people with assault suits that can aim. I wish I would have never put all those SP into scout. Scout is for people who like to run away and use RE. I like to stand and fight. I Should have skilled into assault. Not aim. Get lucky. Aiming has nothing to do with it. The rate at which a scout strafe causes on to have to lead by as much as 2 character models to hit. If they cut and strafe the other way they no longer meet the bullet so no hit is registered in most cases there is another person shooting the scout in the side so the strafing does not affect him. I am not the best player when it comes to gun game...that title goes to proto, but I am also not a scrub by any means. Scouts die fast when they aren't moving.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:18:00 - [10] - Quote Three weeks ago it was tanks. Then it was swarms and forges. Then it was the proto ARs. Now it's scouts. Every week there will be something that seems imbalanced to people. That's ok. That's how the game works. Something is only overpowered until others find a way to counter it. Then the countering agent is considered overpowered until overthrown. It's the circle of Perfect Imbalance. Edit: I'm not saying it's perfect NOW. I just think fixing hit detection will fix this entirely.

xprotoman23 Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 1452	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:25:00 - [11] - Quote Grit Breather wrote: Three weeks ago it was tanks. Then it was swarms and forges. Then it was the proto ARs. Now it's scouts. Every week there will be something that seems imbalanced to people. That's ok. That's how the game works. Something is only overpowered until others find a way to counter it. Then the countering agent is considered overpowered until overthrown. It's the circle of Perfect Imbalance. Edit: I'm not saying it's perfect NOW. I just think fixing hit detection will fix this entirely. Scouts have had issues with hit detection ever since the build back in december. The character models need to be bigger.
William HBonney Imperfects Negative-Feedback 318	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:28:00 - [12] - Quote I hope fixing hit detection will also remedy this issue as well, time will tell. Of all the things u mentioned, ARs are the only thing the devs haven't changed because they were not balanced. Your defenestration's actually proves Doc's point, if a large amount of people playing say it is an issue, it is most likely an issue. That is why we are in a beta.
Regis Mark V 249	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:32:00 - [13] - Quote Crimson MoonV wrote: Scout suit will be fine once they fix hit detection. I play scout and I get tore up against people with assault suits that can aim. I wish I would have never put all those SP into scout. Scout is for people who like to run away and use RE. I like to stand and fight. I Should have skilled into assault. I remember you use to rock the heavy with the HW lol!
Icedslayer 56	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:42:00 - [14] - Quote I think the problem is a compound of bad hit detection, lag, and low FPS or chunking, and smaller hit box (which they shouldn't change btw, we're basically glass already) All of which will be fixed in the next build.
STB-stlcarlos989 EV Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 936	Posted - 2012.08.06 06:58:00 - [15] - Quote William HBonney wrote: Crimson MoonV wrote: Scout suit will be fine once they fix hit detection. I play scout and I get tore up against people with assault suits that can aim. I wish I would have never put all those SP into scout. Scout is for people who like to run away and use RE. I like to stand and fight. I Should have skilled into assault. Not aim. Get lucky. Aiming has nothing to do with it. The rate at which a scout strafe causes on to have to lead by as much as 2 character models to hit. If they cut and strafe the other way they no longer meet the bullet so no hit is registered in most cases there is another person shooting the scout in the side so the strafing does not affect him. I am not the best player when it comes to gun game...that title goes to proto, but I am also not a scrub by any means. Scouts die fast when they aren't moving. That title does not go to proto.
Crimson MoonV Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 658	Posted - 2012.08.06 07:14:00 - [16] - Quote Regis Mark V wrote: Crimson MoonV wrote: Scout suit will be fine once they fix hit detection. I play scout and I get tore up against people with assault suits that can aim. I wish I would have never put all those SP into scout. Scout is for people who like to run away and use RE. I like to stand and fight. I Should have skilled into assault. I remember you use to rock the heavy with the HW lol! Electronics and silencers are for nubs yo. Those were the days. I miss valor flock
Buzzwords Deadly Blue Dots RISE of LEGION 416	Posted - 2012.08.06 07:21:00 - [17] - Quote i don't think scouts are quite so fragile as people think... speed is defense AND utility. the scout can pick his battles like no other suit, and disengage easily. combine their amazing running away powers with remote explosives and you get something that i don't think was intentional. you can't chase him around the corner, because you will explode, so you have to back up and slice the pie. this takes crucial seconds, to a scout that's a huge shield regen. it really makes them ungodly frustrating to fight. to the point where i end up treating them like heavies in the last build. keep my distance and make them cross open ground to get to me. if you can bait them out far enough from cover they're not to bad.
KingBabar 37	Posted - 2012.08.06 07:28:00 - [18] - Quote I agree 100% I've actually spent skillpoints into the scout suit just to check it out. As long as i strafe just a little bit from side to sode I can more or less stand 3 metres from anyone and not receive any damage. I don't even have to over-strafe, I just hold down R1 and sooner or later the gut in front of me will drop, normally I don't get hit at all. I did this because nothing annoyed me more in this game. Is not a matter of character size, that I can accept. But when someone can move faster than the game is updating on my screen then its definately an issue that needs to be adressed.
Dr Octagon3000 Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 16	Posted - 2012.08.06 07:54:00 - [19] - Quote .
DrunkMonk 1 Walmart Brand Mercenaries 26	Posted - 2012.08.06 08:10:00 - [20] - Quote lDocHollidayl wrote: I have heard that once hit detection is fixed it will not be an issue. I am not convinced. Moving or a straight line scouts do not receive damage like other suits. Is this part of the game or an area that will be addressed? The scout is the hardest suit to hit. Everyone can see it is broken. Without RE's to corner scouts with, they will be matrix-like. I have had two friends quit already: saying "scouts are too unbalanced", "hit detection is whack". I went through 120 rounds once with a scout zigzagging 3 meters from me. It is... irritating. Not having them in the game would be an improvement. lead with your bullets scouts will drop same as everybody and easier

DrunkMonk 1 Walmart Brand Mercenaries 26	Posted - 2012.08.06 08:14:00 - [21] - Quote Dr Octagon3000 wrote: . are you trying to say point?
Zander Rodriguez 41	Posted - 2012.08.06 09:14:00 - [22] - Quote Wha.... you want to nerf my scout but seriously hit detection should fix the issue, speed is the only advantage scouts have i don't want to make them useless.
STB-stlcarlos989 EV Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 936	Posted - 2012.08.06 10:04:00 - [23] - Quote Scout suit is fast enough to dodge bullets, anyone denying its broken is just up their own ass.
Aeon Amadi Maverick Conflict Solutions 1003	Posted - 2012.08.06 10:11:00 - [24] - Quote -Sigh- Heavies and Machine-guns and now Scouts and their Submachine Guns... Can't you people just accept the fact that there is ** in this game designed to kill you? They even said at Fanfest that if a Scout suit gets close enough to move around you that you're ** because you won't be able to turn fast enough - that is what they do. They are there to act as hit-and-run specialists. This "character model isn't big enough" bullshit honestly needs to stop right here and now. Honestly, you people don't know how to adapt to a battlefield. We're about to enter a new build and you ***** -FINALLY- realized that tanks don't go away unless they're killed - so you all went Anti-Vehicle. Now, whenever you're faced with heavy Anti-vehicle on the opposition, you don't know how to go back to Infantry and bring the fight to them. You just spawn in more vehicles and die a lot saying that the Swarm Launcher/Forge Gun is over-powered. YOU DIE. LEARN THIS ALREADY. ACCEPT IT. ADAPT AND SURVIVE. Jesus christ - you know, I don't have any issues with this game. I get killed, I look back and learn what I did wrong and evolve on that. I used to run Scout suits frequently and for the past three weeks I've run Logistics - Scouts don't bother me. I aim, I fire, they die. They get too close, I die. That's the nature of this game.
STB-stlcarlos989 EV Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 936	Posted - 2012.08.06 10:25:00 - [25] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: -Sigh- Heavies and Machine-guns and now Scouts and their Submachine Guns... Can't you people just accept the fact that there is ** in this game designed to kill you? They even said at Fanfest that if a Scout suit gets close enough to move around you that you're ** because you won't be able to turn fast enough - that is what they do. They are there to act as hit-and-run specialists. This "character model isn't big enough" bullshit honestly needs to stop right here and now. Honestly, you people don't know how to adapt to a battlefield. We're about to enter a new build and you ***** -FINALLY- realized that tanks don't go away unless they're killed - so you all went Anti-Vehicle. Now, whenever you're faced with heavy Anti-vehicle on the opposition, you don't know how to go back to Infantry and bring the fight to them. You just spawn in more vehicles and die a lot saying that the Swarm Launcher/Forge Gun is over-powered. YOU DIE. LEARN THIS ALREADY. ACCEPT IT. ADAPT AND SURVIVE. Jesus christ - you know, I don't have any issues with this game. I get killed, I look back and learn what I did wrong and evolve on that. I used to run Scout suits frequently and for the past three weeks I've run Logistics - Scouts don't bother me. I aim, I fire, they die. They get too close, I die. That's the nature of this game. I highly doubt CCP intended for them to be able to DODGE BULLETS.
RankRancid Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 51	Posted - 2012.08.06 10:30:00 - [26] - Quote xprotoman23 wrote: Grit Breather wrote: Three weeks ago it was tanks. Then it was swarms and forges. Then it was the proto ARs. Now it's scouts. Every week there will be something that seems imbalanced to people. That's ok. That's how the game works. Something is only overpowered until others find a way to counter it. Then the countering agent is considered overpowered until overthrown. It's the circle of Perfect Imbalance. Edit: I'm not saying it's perfect NOW. I just think fixing hit detection will fix this entirely. Scouts have had issues with hit detection ever since the build back in december. The character models need to be bigger. All for this as long as when they increase the size, all characters get increases. So increase hit box by 1.5 increase assault and heavy by 1.5. Don't make it easier to hit me without making it easier for me to hit you. That would just be stupid.
Aeon Amadi Maverick Conflict Solutions 1003	Posted - 2012.08.06 10:38:00 - [27] - Quote STB-stlcarlos989 EV wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: -Sigh- Heavies and Machine-guns and now Scouts and their Submachine Guns... Can't you people just accept the fact that there is ** in this game designed to kill you? They even said at Fanfest that if a Scout suit gets close enough to move around you that you're ** because you won't be able to turn fast enough - that is what they do. They are there to act as hit-and-run specialists. This "character model isn't big enough" bullshit honestly needs to stop right here and now. Honestly, you people don't know how to adapt to a battlefield. We're about to enter a new build and you *** -FINALLY- realized that tanks don't go away unless they're killed - so you all went Anti-Vehicle. Now, whenever you're faced with heavy Anti-vehicle on the opposition, you don't know how to go back to Infantry and bring the fight to them. You just spawn in more vehicles and die a lot saying that the Swarm Launcher/Forge Gun is over-powered. YOU DIE. LEARN THIS ALREADY. ACCEPT IT. ADAPT AND SURVIVE. Jesus christ - you know, I don't have any issues with this game. I get killed, I look back and learn what I did wrong and evolve on that. I used to run Scout suits frequently and for the past three weeks I've run Logistics - Scouts don't bother me. I aim, I fire, they die. They get too close, I die. That's the nature of this game. I highly doubt CCP intended for them to be able to DODGE BULLETS. Really? Are you so sure? The Scout suit's base movement speed: 5.6 meters/sec. Sprint Speed: 7.8 meters/sec. Compared to the Assault suit's with 5 meters/sec and 7 meters/sec. This is called Speed Tanking - they fit Kinetic Catalyzers so they can sprint -faster- and invest all of the skill points you would invest in shields/armor skills into their Endurance/Mobility/Vigor. They are doing exactly what they were designed for - you're just dying because you can't grasp that it's not just an HP Bar and point-shoot style gaming. Armor. Shield. Speed. Electronic Warfare. The four main types of combat in Eve Online. If you go Speed, you can control combat range. When you control combat range - no matter how dangerous or powerful the opposition is they are at your mercy. They're powered by servo-motors, their suit is a mechanized war machine that allows them to move faster. This is science fiction - not modern combat. I'll say it again: The reason you are dying is because they invested in a combat style that is meant to counter yours. Find something to counter theirs. If you think Hit Detection is such a *** than start using a Mass Driver.
Zander Rodriguez 41	Posted - 2012.08.06 11:24:00 - [28] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: I'll say it again: The reason you are dying is because they invested in a combat style that is meant to counter yours. Find something to counter theirs. If you think Hit Detection is such a ***** than start using a Mass Driver. Hint: counter is heavy using an HMG, more effective if his back is against the wall
Zander Rodriguez 41	Posted - 2012.08.06 11:26:00 - [29] - Quote ps shotguns can also be effective
Rorek IronBlood ZionTCD Legacy Rising 746	Posted - 2012.08.06 11:35:00 - [30] - Quote Please. Scouts are the most well balances character models in-game bar none. I'll grant you that the hit detection is not worth much at the moment in-game, but even still the scout is most balanced. I would have said that I could not believe tat this would have come up as an issue, but then again considering how everyone loves to just whine and complain about everything here I am not so surprised as I may have should have been. Scout is balanced. We have horrid shield, and armor ratings and as pointed our CPU (Central Processing Unit) and PG (Power Grid) output is for crap. Especially compared to -- heavy, logistic, or even assault. We trade all of that off for what? A little advantage in base speed and sprint? Wow. Totally worth complaining about. I'll be looking for you come wednesday. My SMG wants to say hello.



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