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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1073
   |
Posted - 2014.07.05 07:52:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you!
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
25
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you!
Not that technicalities matter with idiots but a HS in this game is not an I win button. It has a damage multiplier yes but shooting someone in the head does not kill them for the very same reason shooting someone with body armor on doesnt kill them. You didnt get through the armor, if you did they would be dead. No one in this game that matters wants snipers sitting in the red line getting a ohk just because you land a head shot. They have that game already, it's called COD, try your luck there. And stop typing the word ***** you look like a filthy animal with no home training. |
Will Driver
Horizons' Edge
Proficiency V.
117
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:13:00 -
[3] - Quote
Scrub complaining about not 1-hit killing a hostile. Scrub, get good or pick up a shotgun and get in the game.
GÇ£Creativity is knowing how to hide your sourcesGÇ¥
GÇò Albert Einstein
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Ryme Intrinseca
The Rainbow Effect
1417
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:18:00 -
[4] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you!
Worst. Post. Ever. |
Venerable Phage
Red Shirts Away Team
147
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:32:00 -
[5] - Quote
Give the 450% headshot bonus to sniper shots.
Outside the redzone.
Not One Lifetime
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
25
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:36:00 -
[6] - Quote
Venerable Phage wrote:Give the 450% headshot bonus to sniper shots.
Outside the redzone.
I don't think you get it. No? |
Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally!
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
|
jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1597
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:41:00 -
[8] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you!
http://i.imgur.com/bMz4XpK.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/LXiOUEi.gif
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
25
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:42:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally!
Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper, |
Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:57:00 -
[10] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper,
That is the purpose of a headshot, with a sniper rifle. That is the purpose of every gun in this game! To take more HP then your target possesses.
"Yo passion n' antipathy betrays yo fearrr!!"
My fellow snipers, answer the call of your ally! Put out the numbers. Put out the proposals! Do not let the vocal minority haters win again.
A small and dedicated group of you, struggle to play with your weapon of choice. CCP sees your population, but they read your dedication to your weapon incorrectly. They believe you use it because "it's in a good spot". What they do not see, is your sorrow when you are passed over for PC... or when you have to lay your sniper rifle down and use some OTHER weapon because it's more competitive.
How about abandoning sniper rifles completely my brethren...? So that CCP understands that the weapon is NOT where you would like it to be?
Answer the callllllll of your ally!
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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Ryme Intrinseca
The Rainbow Effect
1419
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 08:59:00 -
[11] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper,
Exactly. No one comes on here QQing about the 'technicality' that someone with 600HP survived because they only did 590HP damage with their Duvolle. Every FPS ever has required that you remove all of someone's HP to kill them. Is that really so hard to grasp? |
jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1598
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 09:01:00 -
[12] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper, That is the purpose of a headshot, with a sniper rifle. That is the purpose of every gun in this game! To take more HP then your target possesses. "Yo passion n' antipathy betrays yo fearrr!!" My fellow snipers, answer the call of your ally! Put out the numbers. Put out the proposals! Do not let the vocal minority haters win again. A small and dedicated group of you, struggle to play with your weapon of choice. CCP sees your population, but they read your dedication to your weapon incorrectly. They believe you use it because "it's in a good spot". What they do not see, is your sorrow when you are passed over for PC... or when you have to lay your sniper rifle down and use some OTHER weapon because it's more competitive. Were not Nova Knives in the same position once....? How about abandoning sniper rifles completely my brethren...? So that CCP understands that the weapon is NOT where you would like it to be? Answer the callllllll of your ally!
look...
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 09:05:00 -
[13] - Quote
Ryme Intrinseca wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper, Exactly. No one comes on here QQing about the 'technicality' that someone with 600HP survived because they only did 590HP damage with their Duvolle. Every FPS ever has required that you remove all of someone's HP to kill them. Is that really so hard to grasp?
And that is the point is - it - not?
That the sniper rifle does not remove HP efficiently.
Effectively, yes.
Efficiently, no.
My fellow snipers, why would our enemies not take a sniper rifle short of a Thale's into a PC match...?
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
|
aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
26
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 09:10:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Ryme Intrinseca wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper, Exactly. No one comes on here QQing about the 'technicality' that someone with 600HP survived because they only did 590HP damage with their Duvolle. Every FPS ever has required that you remove all of someone's HP to kill them. Is that really so hard to grasp? And that is the point is - it - not? That the sniper rifle does not remove HP efficiently. Effectively, yes. Efficiently, no. My fellow snipers, why would our enemies not take a sniper rifle short of a Thale's into a PC match...? In attempting to troll.... thine enemies make thy case for the sniper rifle. The weapon is a joke. Killing with it... is not enough to silence them... they must be killed by it... efficiently.  Because an immobile sniper up in the hills is not dynamic enough for pc. Things are constantly shifting in pc and you must be also ready to shift.
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 09:21:00 -
[15] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:Ryme Intrinseca wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper, Exactly. No one comes on here QQing about the 'technicality' that someone with 600HP survived because they only did 590HP damage with their Duvolle. Every FPS ever has required that you remove all of someone's HP to kill them. Is that really so hard to grasp? And that is the point is - it - not? That the sniper rifle does not remove HP efficiently. Effectively, yes. Efficiently, no. My fellow snipers, why would our enemies not take a sniper rifle short of a Thale's into a PC match...? In attempting to troll.... thine enemies make thy case for the sniper rifle. The weapon is a joke. Killing with it... is not enough to silence them... they must be killed by it... efficiently. Because an immobile sniper up in the hills is not dynamic enough for pc. Things are constantly shifting in pc and you must be also ready to shift.
"Yes.... yes... my dear troll.... vedy vedy guuuud."
That... is precisely why the sniper rifle must be buffed/rebalanced.
Sitting in a redzone shooting into a map is no fun way to play... it is purposeless, and yet that is how it has been balanced, to punish sniper creativity and versatility.
You, my little dumpling have made ze case...
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1598
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 09:24:00 -
[16] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:Ryme Intrinseca wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel
Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper, Exactly. No one comes on here QQing about the 'technicality' that someone with 600HP survived because they only did 590HP damage with their Duvolle. Every FPS ever has required that you remove all of someone's HP to kill them. Is that really so hard to grasp? And that is the point is - it - not? That the sniper rifle does not remove HP efficiently. Effectively, yes. Efficiently, no. My fellow snipers, why would our enemies not take a sniper rifle short of a Thale's into a PC match...? In attempting to troll.... thine enemies make thy case for the sniper rifle. The weapon is a joke. Killing with it... is not enough to silence them... they must be killed by it... efficiently. [:twisted wrote: Because an immobile sniper up in the hills is not dynamic enough for pc. Things are constantly shifting in pc and you must be also ready to shift. "Yes.... yes... my dear troll.... vedy vedy guuuud." That... is precisely why the sniper rifle must be buffed/rebalanced. Sitting in a redzone shooting into a map is no fun way to play... it is purposeless, and yet that is how it has been balanced, to punish sniper creativity and versatility. You, my little dumpling have made ze case...
http://i.imgur.com/pu40zNw.jpg
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 09:53:00 -
[17] - Quote
jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:
has no more f*cks to give.
....because snipers took too many turns with him, at some point in his life.
Take your time with those quotes, pumpkin. Dont be so bitter.
My fellow snipers, answer the call of your ally! Contact CCP Rattati.
Because sniper rifles should work better than they do.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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LUGMOS
YELLOW JESUS EXP FORCE
571
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 09:54:00 -
[18] - Quote
IDK, but IMO, headshots with a hard hitting rifle should be OHKOs. Its like with the ScP, you take the time to aim, ou get a better reward.
And the brony has to stop...
Quafe
A question doesn't always have an answer, but a problem does,
So what is DUST? A problem or a question?
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1598
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:14:00 -
[19] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:
has no more f*cks to give.
....because snipers took too many turns with him, at some point in his life. Take your time with those quotes, pumpkin. Dont be so bitter. My fellow snipers, answer the call of your ally! Contact CCP Rattati. Because sniper rifles should work better than they do.
Ok, but if you want your ohk machines on every suit then go play cod.
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:20:00 -
[20] - Quote
LUGMOS wrote:IDK, but IMO, headshots with a hard hitting rifle should be OHKOs. Its like with the ScP, you take the time to aim, ou get a better reward. And the brony has to stop...
I agree. I find some players reasoning on the headshot multiplier for the sniper rifle to be absurd. It was made for a different time period, and a Dust for a different build.
CCP Rattati said he wanted concrete proposals on balancing that weapon. I fear that snipers have been ignored and disregarded by ccp for so long, that they dont even want to bother say anything.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:26:00 -
[21] - Quote
jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:Jathniel wrote:jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:
has no more f*cks to give.
....because snipers took too many turns with him, at some point in his life. Take your time with those quotes, pumpkin. Dont be so bitter. My fellow snipers, answer the call of your ally! Contact CCP Rattati. Because sniper rifles should work better than they do. Ok, but if you want your ohk machines on every suit then go play cod.
Dude, no. A HS. A headshot with a sniper rifle puts down. Period.
Planetside 2. It puts down. Battlefield 4? Down you go. CoD? EVERYTHING puts down so fast in that game, it may as well be ohk.
Dust is a different animal. But a headshot from a sniper should always put down, on sheer balancing grounds that up close, it will lose everytime. Even if sniper rifle had zero sway like the RR and AR, it would STILL lose up close, because it doesn't have the RoF to produce the necessary ttk for cqc.
The sniper rifle is horribly balanced on nearly every front.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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Hakyou Brutor
G0DS AM0NG MEN
832
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:26:00 -
[22] - Quote
No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
"I never pull out" ~Ace Boone, 2014.
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Hakyou Brutor
G0DS AM0NG MEN
832
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:29:00 -
[23] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Planetside 2. It puts down. Battlefield 4? Down you go. CoD? EVERYTHING puts down so fast in that game, it may as well be ohk.
Well.. Planetside: extremely low TTK in the first place.
Battlefield: Sniper has drop and delay, it actually takes skill.
CoD: TTK so low that even getting looked at gets you killed.
"I never pull out" ~Ace Boone, 2014.
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1599
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:58:00 -
[24] - Quote
Hakyou Brutor wrote:Jathniel wrote:Planetside 2. It puts down. Battlefield 4? Down you go. CoD? EVERYTHING puts down so fast in that game, it may as well be ohk. Well.. Planetside: extremely low TTK in the first place. Battlefield: Sniper has drop and delay, it actually takes skill. CoD: TTK so low that even getting looked at gets you killed.
Planetside also has bullet velocities and drop....
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:59:00 -
[25] - Quote
Hakyou Brutor wrote:No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
A sniper. Someone worthy of discussing this with. At last.
There's the "redline" again. What is that? I don't recall ever bringing that up.
Don't fall for the ad hominem of trolls dude. My post has nothing to do with the redline, nor an "I win button".
(Some people don't assume, when they should; and then they assume incorrectly, when they shouldn't. Don't be like those people.)
It's important that discussion on this gets underway, so that people can know.
Check this out: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=166007
Jathniel wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:I didn't see anything concrete here, increase headshot multiplier, range, make other snipers than Thale's powerful, increase scope zoom....
Anecdotally I haven't been killed by a sniper in ages, get picked off once in a blue moon if I am careless and in open under half hp. I need to look at the numbers, but sniper use is very stable, none of the rifles or new weapons have had a meaningful impact on the use of sniper rifles, so it's a steady group of people who like to snipe apparantly, I am not even sure they venture into Tac AR or SCR at all.
Feel free to share, we have no specific hate/love with snipers, they should have a viable place on the battlefield like all of our weapons. Okay, you want concrete. I propose the following changes to all Tactical Sniper Rifle variants: - Increase clip size to 5 rounds. - Reduce optimal range to 175m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 225m. - Reduce scope zoom by 40%. - Eliminate "sniper sway" in ADS completely to enable fast tactical firing on the move. - Increase recoil in ADS by 70% to control follow-up shot spam, and prevent quick-scoping abuse at closer ranges. - Eliminate 70% recoil penalty if the tactical sniper rifle is used while crouched. - Reduce damage by 30%. - Reduce reload time by 20%. I propose the following changes to Sniper Rifle variants: - Reduce clip size to 3 rounds. (Militia reduced to 1 round) - Reduce optimal range to 300m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 420m. - Eliminate the "sniper sway" delay if the sniper moves in ADS while crouched. - Reduce recoil by 50%. - Increase damage by 50% - Increase headshot damage bonus to 4x. - Add variable scope zoom. I propose the following changes to the Charge Sniper Rifle: - Reduce clip size to 1 round. - Reduce optimal range to 275m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 375m. - Increase damage by 100%. - Increase headshot damage bonus to 10x. - Increase reload time by 50% - Reduce maximum carried ammo by 40% - Add variable scope zoom. - Add fat, glowing blue streak to projectile path that slowly fades. - Add distinctive resonating noise. - Do not permit firing unless fully charged. How's that for concrete? Range nerfs bring the snipers closer, but not too close. The tactical sniper becomes a carefully balanced light sniper, that dedicated snipers can use on slightly closer-in maps, but this advantage is carefully mitigated by a recoil and damage nerf to prevent it from dominating RR, TAR, and SCR in their optimal ranges. The regular sniper gets a universally powerful 1-2 punch that will put down most (including proto) with its damage and recoil mitigation buffs, but this new power is carefully mitigated by a smaller 3 round clip. To offset this slightly, a variable zoom scope is introduced, and the regular sniper rifle user is now permitted to move while crouched without penalty in ADS. The charge sniper becomes the finger of God (no disrespect intended to Amarr RPers out there), but is resisted by a Devilishly small 1 round clip, increased reload time, a spectacular and cool looking streak (and sound) that reveals their position, and only 15 rounds max ammo (without ammo buffs). EDIT: No hip fire reticule is implemented.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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Monkey MAC
Rough Riders..
3022
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:00:00 -
[26] - Quote
While lower tier snipers could indeed use a slight buff, I'm not going to explain why a OHK from any range is a bad idea.
The only exception to this rule should be forge gun, though the perfect accuracy needs to be attended to.
They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank!
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1599
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:07:00 -
[27] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Hakyou Brutor wrote:No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
A sniper. Someone worthy of discussing this with. At last. There's the "redline" again. What is that? I don't recall ever bringing that up. Don't fall for the ad hominem of trolls dude. My post has nothing to do with the redline, nor an "I win button". (Some people don't assume, when they should; and then they assume incorrectly, when they shouldn't. Don't be like those people.) It's important that discussion on this gets underway, so that people can know. Check this out: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=166007Jathniel wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:I didn't see anything concrete here, increase headshot multiplier, range, make other snipers than Thale's powerful, increase scope zoom....
Anecdotally I haven't been killed by a sniper in ages, get picked off once in a blue moon if I am careless and in open under half hp. I need to look at the numbers, but sniper use is very stable, none of the rifles or new weapons have had a meaningful impact on the use of sniper rifles, so it's a steady group of people who like to snipe apparantly, I am not even sure they venture into Tac AR or SCR at all.
Feel free to share, we have no specific hate/love with snipers, they should have a viable place on the battlefield like all of our weapons. I propose the following changes to the Charge Sniper Rifle: - Increase damage by 100%. .
http://i.imgur.com/a3Lx7EP.gif
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FopyRHHlt3M
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1074
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:09:00 -
[28] - Quote
Monkey MAC wrote:While lower tier snipers could indeed use a slight buff, I'm not going to explain why a OHK from any range is a bad idea.
The only exception to this rule should be forge gun, though the perfect accuracy needs to be attended to.
lol hot damn another one thinking this has to do with the redline?
Did ANYBODY actually read the situation I described in the OP? lol?
Trolls resonate with people WAY too loudly in these forums.
Pay no attention to the trolls ad hominem, please. lol It's meant to distract.
jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:Planetside also has bullet velocities and drop....
Hakyou Brutor wrote:
Well.. Planetside: extremely low TTK in the first place.
Battlefield: Sniper has drop and delay, it actually takes skill.
CoD: TTK so low that even getting looked at gets you killed.
Both of you are correct. We don't have BALLISTICS in Dust. If we had ballistics than a sniper's damage at range wouldn't matter. He deserves his kill.
But Dust has hitscan sniper rifles that are unwieldly, and pointless to use upclose... and in their current shape, they are a headache for people to deal with. They complain about redline snipers. They demand snipers get creative and come up close, yet there is plenty of risk to the sniper at that point, and zero reward.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1598
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:11:00 -
[29] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:While lower tier snipers could indeed use a slight buff, I'm not going to explain why a OHK from any range is a bad idea.
The only exception to this rule should be forge gun, though the perfect accuracy needs to be attended to. lol hot damn another one thinking this has to do with the redline? Did ANYBODY actually read the situation I described in the OP? lol? Trolls resonate with people WAY too loudly in these forums. Pay no attention to the trolls ad hominem, please. lol It's meant to distract. jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:Planetside also has bullet velocities and drop.... Hakyou Brutor wrote:
Well.. Planetside: extremely low TTK in the first place.
Battlefield: Sniper has drop and delay, it actually takes skill.
CoD: TTK so low that even getting looked at gets you killed.
Both of you are correct. We don't have BALLISTICS in Dust. If we had ballistics than a sniper's damage at range wouldn't matter. He deserves his kill. But Dust has hitscan sniper rifles that are unwieldly, and pointless to use upclose... and in their current shape, they are a headache for people to deal with. They complain about redline snipers. They demand snipers get creative and come up close, yet there is plenty of risk to the sniper at that point, and zero reward.
Ohk for a weapon longer than 100m range is just broken, why do you think everyone hates thales?
And if shotguns weren't bad enough...also, snipers have almost no risk, they should get low reward in a game where you pay for everything.
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
|
Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1075
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:22:00 -
[30] - Quote
jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:
Ohk for a weapon longer than 100m range is just broken, why do you think everyone hates thales?
And if shotguns weren't bad enough...
I understand your frustration, but we can't sit here and call a headshot OHK broken nor unreasonable. Someone is running and jumping around, their head is small target.
Shotguns are point blank weapons, with high alpha they MUST kill you up close or they are useless; and a sniper rifle does not have the RoF necessary to justify it NOT having a OHK on headshot.
A shotgun OHKing you is to be expected, it's gunning you right in the teeth. A headshot from a sniper rifle OHKing you should be expected. Per function of these niche weapons, an OHK can't possibly reasonably be considered OP.
You can't complain about OHK, when reasonable circumstances like that are met.
Hence the phrase, keep your head down.
If anything, I 'feel' it's this hatred for short TTK and OHK (no matter what) that has caused Dust to fail. People just hate dying in this game that badly.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
15176
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:25:00 -
[31] - Quote
Jathniel, you can complain that people are mentioning the redline all you like but it is still relevant. If you do a direct buff to snipers, you also directly buff redline sniping.
If snipers could be forced out of the redline I'd quite happily support some buffing. Nothing like some of the absurd buffs I've seen suggested in the past (820 damage per shot from a charge sniper rifle is not reasonable) but some moderate buffs would be worth considering.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
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Vapor Forseti
Nyain Chan
General Tso's Alliance
677
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:28:00 -
[32] - Quote
I'd agree with you if everyone wasn't against you.
pâ¬péñpâòpâ½pü«tÄïpü½pü¬péïpÇé --pâ¬pâùpâ¬pâ+pâ¬péñpâ¬pâ+
NyainChan Forever
|
Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1075
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:31:00 -
[33] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Jathniel, you can complain that people are mentioning the redline all you like but it is still relevant. If you do a direct buff to snipers, you also directly buff redline sniping.
If snipers could be forced out of the redline I'd quite happily support some buffing. Nothing like some of the absurd buffs I've seen suggested in the past (820 damage per shot from a charge sniper rifle is not reasonable) but some moderate buffs would be worth considering.
That's why I cut the range, Arkena.
You've been here longer than the others that have posted, and I've seen your proposals before.
What do you think of my percentages?
I want Rattati to get something concrete.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1598
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:31:00 -
[34] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:
Ohk for a weapon longer than 100m range is just broken, why do you think everyone hates thales?
And if shotguns weren't bad enough...
I understand your frustration, but we can't sit here and call a headshot OHK broken nor unreasonable. Someone is running and jumping around, their head is small target. Shotguns are point blank weapons, with high alpha they MUST kill you up close or they are useless; and a sniper rifle does not have the RoF necessary to justify it NOT having a OHK on headshot. A shotgun OHKing you is to be expected, it's gunning you right in the teeth. A headshot from a sniper rifle OHKing you should be expected. Per function of these niche weapons, an OHK can't possibly reasonably be considered OP. You can't complain about OHK, when reasonable circumstances like that are met. Hence the phrase, keep your head down. If anything, I 'feel' it's this hatred for short TTK and OHK (no matter what) that has caused Dust to fail. People just hate dying in this game that badly.
On expensive suits it's just ********
It's already broken enough randomly getting 1 shotted by a forge, and if a sniper could 1hk any suit past 150m it's just broken, unless it's a scout, in which case it's fine.
skrub wrote: I propose the following changes to the Charge Sniper Rifle:
- Increase damage by 100%. .
http://i.imgur.com/a3Lx7EP.gif
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FopyRHHlt3M
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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boba's fetta
Dead Man's Game
723
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:42:00 -
[35] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you!
i hope a truck falls on your head. you backward bigoted ****.
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1076
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:44:00 -
[36] - Quote
Vapor Forseti wrote:I'd agree with you if everyone wasn't against you.
Thanks a lot, Pontius Pilate... lol 
But "everyone" broke the game.
Maybe it's just how I presented it.
The 'vocal one' in particular isn't offering remedies. Just expressing his hatred of dying.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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Vapor Forseti
Nyain Chan
General Tso's Alliance
677
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:46:00 -
[37] - Quote
boba's fetta wrote:Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you! i hope a truck falls on your head. you backward bigoted ****.
Good lord, it's just a video game lmao.
pâ¬péñpâòpâ½pü«tÄïpü½pü¬péïpÇé --pâ¬pâùpâ¬pâ+pâ¬péñpâ¬pâ+
NyainChan Forever
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1598
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:47:00 -
[38] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Vapor Forseti wrote:I'd agree with you if everyone wasn't against you. Thanks a lot, Pontius Pilate... lol But "everyone" broke the game. Maybe it's just how I presented it. The 'vocal one' in particular isn't offering remedies. Just expressing his hatred of dying to some noob 1 shotting nomatter what and further than 150m
Also, no frame exept a heavy can take a charged headshot, so yea.
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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TechMechMeds
Inner.Hell
3777
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:49:00 -
[39] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you!
No, you removed all his shields and their armour is 70% damaged.
It does kind of suck but I'm just saying, I have the charged with profs although I don't main sniper.
Just like every other Englishmen, I bath in tea, have no teeth and live in a castle.
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1599
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:50:00 -
[40] - Quote
You know what, im tired of somenody justifying ohk's so....
http://i.imgur.com/UekmzAj.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/LXiOUEi.gif
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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|
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TechMechMeds
Inner.Hell
3777
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:52:00 -
[41] - Quote
Hakyou Brutor wrote:No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
This, I don't want to see sniper kills every other second on the feed.
I have gone 48/1 sniping back when it was 'realistic'.
Some matches had about 6-8 snipers a side when they were 'realistic'.
Just like every other Englishmen, I bath in tea, have no teeth and live in a castle.
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Vapor Forseti
Nyain Chan
General Tso's Alliance
677
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:54:00 -
[42] - Quote
jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:Jathniel wrote:Vapor Forseti wrote:I'd agree with you if everyone wasn't against you. Thanks a lot, Pontius Pilate... lol But "everyone" broke the game. Maybe it's just how I presented it. The 'vocal one' in particular isn't offering remedies. Just expressing his hatred of dying to some noob 1 shotting nomatter what and further than 150m Also, no frame exept a heavy can take a charged headshot, so yea.
Few tanked logis/assaults can withstand headshots, so not really.
Ponies. Jerrmy, I thought I raised you better.
pâ¬péñpâòpâ½pü«tÄïpü½pü¬péïpÇé --pâ¬pâùpâ¬pâ+pâ¬péñpâ¬pâ+
NyainChan Forever
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1599
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:55:00 -
[43] - Quote
Vapor Forseti wrote:jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:Jathniel wrote:Vapor Forseti wrote:I'd agree with you if everyone wasn't against you. Thanks a lot, Pontius Pilate... lol But "everyone" broke the game. Maybe it's just how I presented it. The 'vocal one' in particular isn't offering remedies. Just expressing his hatred of dying to some noob 1 shotting nomatter what and further than 150m Also, no frame exept a heavy can take a charged headshot, so yea. Few tanked logis/assaults can withstand headshots, so not really. Ponies. Jerrmy, I thought I raised you better.
http://i.imgur.com/rYm9fHm.jpg
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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Louis Domi
Pradox One
Proficiency V.
414
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 12:55:00 -
[44] - Quote
Hakyou Brutor wrote:No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
Bruh I remember back in... Chromo(maybe) I think I tried countersniping Nod, bruh I got in one shot, and he insta finds me and snipes me dead boom, Literally less than a second after my shot... Have never seen him in a game after that, does he play on a different server or something? I'd love to get a chance to try and kill him just once with a sniper, If I can do that, my life as a sniper will have meant something.
Oh and also a way to buff back sniper rifles would be to bring back 10% damage mods, or bring the proto % to 8. I mean I was never really OHK protos back then, but now its hard to even kill a standard or even MLT with anything but a thales... I would use a Charge, but the scope on that thing is kinda horrendous... |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
15181
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 13:27:00 -
[45] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Jathniel, you can complain that people are mentioning the redline all you like but it is still relevant. If you do a direct buff to snipers, you also directly buff redline sniping.
If snipers could be forced out of the redline I'd quite happily support some buffing. Nothing like some of the absurd buffs I've seen suggested in the past (820 damage per shot from a charge sniper rifle is not reasonable) but some moderate buffs would be worth considering. That's why I cut the range, Arkena. You've been here longer than the others that have posted, and I've seen your proposals before. What do you think of my percentages? I want Rattati to get something concrete.
I'm sorry, I must have missed your percentages.
I didn't see your suggestion to cut the range either. I did only skim the thread, though. Give me a sec, will have another look.
EDIT: Found it.
EDIT 2: Not bad. Will write a little more on it later. Some of the suggested changes are a little extreme (e.g. 6000 damage shots) but some of the suggestions are decent enough.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
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Scheneighnay McBob
Cult of Gasai
5570
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 13:39:00 -
[46] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you! Not that technicalities matter with idiots but a HS in this game is not an I win button. It has a damage multiplier yes but shooting someone in the head does not kill them for the very same reason shooting someone with body armor on doesnt kill them. You didnt get through the armor, if you did they would be dead. No one in this game that matters wants snipers sitting in the red line getting a ohk just because you land a head shot. They have that game already, it's called COD, try your luck there. And stop typing the word ***** you look like a filthy animal with no home training.
They're talking about a prototype weapon with an extremely slow RoF not OHKing someone, even with a 175% damage bonus.
I would be upset as well.
It's like if someone had a prototype breach forge gun, shot an HAV's weakpoint, and the HAV rolled away with half of its armor left.
pé¦pâ+pé¦pâ½pâäpâ¬pâ¦pé¦pâ¼pâ+pâêpü»sñ¬S+ïpéè
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Hakyou Brutor
G0DS AM0NG MEN
836
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 13:49:00 -
[47] - Quote
Scheneighnay McBob wrote:It's like if someone had a prototype breach forge gun, shot an HAV's weakpoint, and the HAV rolled away with half of its armor left.
Well.. 
"I never pull out" ~Ace Boone, 2014.
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Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui
Cornballs Get Stonewalled
837
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 13:52:00 -
[48] - Quote
Hakyou Brutor wrote:No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
I can agree with this and I have prof 3 and snipe with just Caldari commando suits but I'm just at advanced with those .
You want more power use a commando suit and love the results .
The only thing the rifles could really use is an adjustable sight .
Power comes with distance and sight markers , meaning ... get out of the redline .
Some fields that just can not be avoided but for the most part .... ^^^ umm yeah .
Over doing changes would just kill the role , weapon and the game .
You would think that CCP would have given the infantry refund that should have been in 1.8.
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TechMechMeds
Inner.Hell
3787
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 14:03:00 -
[49] - Quote
I think part of the problem is that snipers expect their weapon to simply kill when damaging and pinning are very useful.
If we had a spot enemy function + wp to go with it then snipers would feel more useful. Still though, I prefer a sniper who damages and pins over one that concentrates on one target after another, which is where most of this QQ comes from.
Just like every other Englishmen, I bath in tea, have no teeth and live in a castle.
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TechMechMeds
Inner.Hell
3787
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 14:06:00 -
[50] - Quote
Cere harkens.
Tailss power.
Djinn kujo.
All very good marksman snipers, what's your excuse?.
Try pinning and damaging people. Sniping is one of the smallest if not the smallest sp sink as well.
Just like every other Englishmen, I bath in tea, have no teeth and live in a castle.
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
2391
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 14:07:00 -
[51] - Quote
+ increase sniper rifle headshot multiplier
Shoot scout with yes...
- Ripley Riley
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RogueTrooper 2000AD
Neckbeard Absolution
145
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 14:10:00 -
[52] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:+ increase sniper rifle headshot multiplier
Roughly translated ~ I needz a crutch yo!.
Service with a smile
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Atiim
Fooly Cooly.
Anime Empire.
10193
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 14:10:00 -
[53] - Quote
Ignore jerrmy12.
He's not really known around here for his logical abilities to form an argument, or conclusion.
Long Live The Anime Empire
-HAND
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Atiim
Fooly Cooly.
Anime Empire.
10193
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 14:11:00 -
[54] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:Cere harkens.
Sniping is one of the smallest if not the smallest sp sink as well.
That actually belongs to the Assault Class.
Long Live The Anime Empire
-HAND
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TechMechMeds
Inner.Hell
3787
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 14:19:00 -
[55] - Quote
Atiim wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Cere harkens.
Sniping is one of the smallest if not the smallest sp sink as well. That actually belongs to the Assault Class.
Sniper- sniper, suit, damage mods, armour, shields, uplinks, nanohives.
Assult- Sidearms, various weapons, shields, armour, suit, nanohives, injector, uplinks, damage mods
I'd say assault is marginally more actually. I guess its all got a bit of preference added as well.
Iv also forgotten if nanohives are...yeah they come with the injector skill right?.
Techmechmeds - mains logistics, can't remember if nano circuitry covers injectors and nanohives at the same time.
'Self facepalm'.
I am off now so I may not reply.
o7.
Just like every other Englishmen, I bath in tea, have no teeth and live in a castle.
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
15182
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 15:43:00 -
[56] - Quote
Atiim wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Cere harkens.
Sniping is one of the smallest if not the smallest sp sink as well. That actually belongs to the Assault Class.
No, it doesn't.
Sniping is not SP intensive at all. I'm quite sure assaults are more SP intensive.
That doesn't matter though. I've never liked arguments based on SP - by that argument, heavies and scouts are rightly OP, which isn't really sane.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
|
Derpty Derp
It's All Gone Derp
202
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 15:57:00 -
[57] - Quote
It's as simple as increasing the headshot multiplier depending on how close you are, so redliners no longer need to aim for the head they can do nothing as per usual, while real snipers get to pew pew more damage from inside the battle area.
Also a quick heads up to any wannabe redline snipers sitting on the MCC... I can and will shoot you with my dropship, even if you don a heavy suit. |
Mobius Wyvern
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
5303
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 17:04:00 -
[58] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Hakyou Brutor wrote:No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
A sniper. Someone worthy of discussing this with. At last. There's the "redline" again. What is that? I don't recall ever bringing that up. Don't fall for the ad hominem of trolls dude. My post has nothing to do with the redline, nor an "I win button". (Some people don't assume, when they should; and then they assume incorrectly, when they shouldn't. Don't be like those people.) It's important that discussion on this gets underway, so that people can know. Check this out: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=166007Jathniel wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:I didn't see anything concrete here, increase headshot multiplier, range, make other snipers than Thale's powerful, increase scope zoom....
Anecdotally I haven't been killed by a sniper in ages, get picked off once in a blue moon if I am careless and in open under half hp. I need to look at the numbers, but sniper use is very stable, none of the rifles or new weapons have had a meaningful impact on the use of sniper rifles, so it's a steady group of people who like to snipe apparantly, I am not even sure they venture into Tac AR or SCR at all.
Feel free to share, we have no specific hate/love with snipers, they should have a viable place on the battlefield like all of our weapons. Okay, you want concrete. I propose the following changes to all Tactical Sniper Rifle variants: - Increase clip size to 5 rounds. - Reduce optimal range to 175m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 225m. - Reduce scope zoom by 40%. - Eliminate "sniper sway" in ADS completely to enable fast tactical firing on the move. - Increase recoil in ADS by 70% to control follow-up shot spam, and prevent quick-scoping abuse at closer ranges. - Eliminate 70% recoil penalty if the tactical sniper rifle is used while crouched. - Reduce damage by 30%. - Reduce reload time by 20%. I propose the following changes to Sniper Rifle variants: - Reduce clip size to 3 rounds. (Militia reduced to 1 round) - Reduce optimal range to 300m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 420m. - Eliminate the "sniper sway" delay if the sniper moves in ADS while crouched. - Reduce recoil by 50%. - Increase damage by 50% - Increase headshot damage bonus to 4x. - Add variable scope zoom. I propose the following changes to the Charge Sniper Rifle: - Reduce clip size to 1 round. - Reduce optimal range to 275m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 375m. - Increase damage by 100%. - Increase headshot damage bonus to 10x. - Increase reload time by 50% - Reduce maximum carried ammo by 40% - Add variable scope zoom. - Add fat, glowing blue streak to projectile path that slowly fades. - Add distinctive resonating noise. - Do not permit firing unless fully charged. How's that for concrete? Range nerfs bring the snipers closer, but not too close. The tactical sniper becomes a carefully balanced light sniper, that dedicated snipers can use on slightly closer-in maps, but this advantage is carefully mitigated by a recoil and damage nerf to prevent it from dominating RR, TAR, and SCR in their optimal ranges. The regular sniper gets a universally powerful 1-2 punch that will put down most (including proto) with its damage and recoil mitigation buffs, but this new power is carefully mitigated by a smaller 3 round clip. To offset this slightly, a variable zoom scope is introduced, and the regular sniper rifle user is now permitted to move while crouched without penalty in ADS. The charge sniper becomes the finger of God (no disrespect intended to Amarr RPers out there), but is resisted by a Devilishly small 1 round clip, increased reload time, a spectacular and cool looking streak (and sound) that reveals their position, and only 15 rounds max ammo (without ammo buffs). EDIT: No hip fire reticule is implemented.
Would you consent to a charge-up time on all these weapons as well as the stats you just proposed?
I think most people's aversion to stats like this are based in the fact that you can do this damage with no delay since Dust uses hitscan. The need to factor for a brief charge-up period (0.25-0.5 seconds) would probably get more people on board with posts like this.
I make this suggestion as a counter-sniper, by the way. While I don't snipe myself, I always keep a Tactical Sniper fit handy for engaging enemy snipers.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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Zindorak
CaUsE-4-CoNcErN
45
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Posted - 2014.07.05 17:07:00 -
[59] - Quote
jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:Jathniel wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! Your gun does a set amount of damage, the target has a set amount of hp, if you do more dmagae than he has hp you win. Get it? Its that way for everyone, and its also not the hardest hitting sniper, That is the purpose of a headshot, with a sniper rifle. That is the purpose of every gun in this game! To take more HP then your target possesses. "Yo passion n' antipathy betrays yo fearrr!!" My fellow snipers, answer the call of your ally! Put out the numbers. Put out the proposals! Do not let the vocal minority haters win again. A small and dedicated group of you, struggle to play with your weapon of choice. CCP sees your population, but they read your dedication to your weapon incorrectly. They believe you use it because "it's in a good spot". What they do not see, is your sorrow when you are passed over for PC... or when you have to lay your sniper rifle down and use some OTHER weapon because it's more competitive. Were not Nova Knives in the same position once....? How about abandoning sniper rifles completely my brethren...? So that CCP understands that the weapon is NOT where you would like it to be? Answer the callllllll of your ally! look...
that was funny |
Cat Merc
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
10674
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 17:12:00 -
[60] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Hakyou Brutor wrote:No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
A sniper. Someone worthy of discussing this with. At last. There's the "redline" again. What is that? I don't recall ever bringing that up. Don't fall for the ad hominem of trolls dude. My post has nothing to do with the redline, nor an "I win button". (Some people don't assume, when they should; and then they assume incorrectly, when they shouldn't. Don't be like those people.) It's important that discussion on this gets underway, so that people can know. Check this out: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=166007Jathniel wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:I didn't see anything concrete here, increase headshot multiplier, range, make other snipers than Thale's powerful, increase scope zoom....
Anecdotally I haven't been killed by a sniper in ages, get picked off once in a blue moon if I am careless and in open under half hp. I need to look at the numbers, but sniper use is very stable, none of the rifles or new weapons have had a meaningful impact on the use of sniper rifles, so it's a steady group of people who like to snipe apparantly, I am not even sure they venture into Tac AR or SCR at all.
Feel free to share, we have no specific hate/love with snipers, they should have a viable place on the battlefield like all of our weapons. Okay, you want concrete. I propose the following changes to all Tactical Sniper Rifle variants: - Increase clip size to 5 rounds. - Reduce optimal range to 175m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 225m. - Reduce scope zoom by 40%. - Eliminate "sniper sway" in ADS completely to enable fast tactical firing on the move. - Increase recoil in ADS by 70% to control follow-up shot spam, and prevent quick-scoping abuse at closer ranges. - Eliminate 70% recoil penalty if the tactical sniper rifle is used while crouched. - Reduce damage by 30%. - Reduce reload time by 20%. I propose the following changes to Sniper Rifle variants: - Reduce clip size to 3 rounds. (Militia reduced to 1 round) - Reduce optimal range to 300m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 420m. - Eliminate the "sniper sway" delay if the sniper moves in ADS while crouched. - Reduce recoil by 50%. - Increase damage by 50% - Increase headshot damage bonus to 4x. - Add variable scope zoom. I propose the following changes to the Charge Sniper Rifle: - Reduce clip size to 1 round. - Reduce optimal range to 275m. - Reduce maximum effective range to 375m. - Increase damage by 100%. - Increase headshot damage bonus to 10x. - Increase reload time by 50% - Reduce maximum carried ammo by 40% - Add variable scope zoom. - Add fat, glowing blue streak to projectile path that slowly fades. - Add distinctive resonating noise. - Do not permit firing unless fully charged. How's that for concrete? Range nerfs bring the snipers closer, but not too close. The tactical sniper becomes a carefully balanced light sniper, that dedicated snipers can use on slightly closer-in maps, but this advantage is carefully mitigated by a recoil and damage nerf to prevent it from dominating RR, TAR, and SCR in their optimal ranges. The regular sniper gets a universally powerful 1-2 punch that will put down most (including proto) with its damage and recoil mitigation buffs, but this new power is carefully mitigated by a smaller 3 round clip. To offset this slightly, a variable zoom scope is introduced, and the regular sniper rifle user is now permitted to move while crouched without penalty in ADS. The charge sniper becomes the finger of God (no disrespect intended to Amarr RPers out there), but is resisted by a Devilishly small 1 round clip, increased reload time, a spectacular and cool looking streak (and sound) that reveals their position, and only 15 rounds max ammo (without ammo buffs). EDIT: No hip fire reticule is implemented.
Add an 0.5 charge up time to all sniper variants.
1-2 punch is really powerful considering it's hit scan.
It's fine in games like battlefield because of bullet drop and bullet travel time, but since it's not going to happen in DUST, a short 0.5 charge up time could do wonders to increase the skill cap.
Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1602
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 17:56:00 -
[61] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Ignore jerrmy12.
He's not really known around here for his logical abilities to form an argument, or conclusion.
Who says I was trying to, the op serms like a troll.
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
30
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 18:11:00 -
[62] - Quote
Scheneighnay McBob wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you! Not that technicalities matter with idiots but a HS in this game is not an I win button. It has a damage multiplier yes but shooting someone in the head does not kill them for the very same reason shooting someone with body armor on doesnt kill them. You didnt get through the armor, if you did they would be dead. No one in this game that matters wants snipers sitting in the red line getting a ohk just because you land a head shot. They have that game already, it's called COD, try your luck there. And stop typing the word ***** you look like a filthy animal with no home training. They're talking about a prototype weapon with an extremely slow RoF not OHKing someone, even with a 175% damage bonus. I would be upset as well. It's like if someone had a prototype breach forge gun, shot an HAV's weakpoint, and the HAV rolled away with half of its armor left.
Dependimg on the forge they can do just that. |
aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
30
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 18:14:00 -
[63] - Quote
Hakyou Brutor wrote:No dude. I am a sniper, prof 4.
I agree with none of this, why should you OHK every suit in the game from 1-599 meters? I mean seriously, snipers like Pelognis and Nod Keras have been sniping for a long time, and they still are beastly.
This game is all about risk for reward. Sitting 300 meters in the redline is not risky, so is not very rewarding.
Agreed, there are some sick snipers in this game. |
Lloyd Orfay
Fantom Company
18
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Posted - 2014.07.05 18:21:00 -
[64] - Quote
With the elements of this game it's suppost to be teamwork based. Snipers, just like scouts, barely even play a role in teamwork and the majority of players only snipe to boost their kdr. Snipers already have all the things they need for their gameplay. Quite literally almost anyone can take a sniper and get easy kills. Some snipers are just players that find it fun to kill people in games with little to no challenge, unnecessarily ruining their player experience every match... Just like cloaked shotties. The only sniper I could find to respect are the kind that use snipers to either pick off specific targets that would negatively affect their squad/teams performance in a match, or provide overwatch. There are also other things that need tweaking way before snipers.
Yah gonna give me my wp or NAH?
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gauntlet44 LbowDeep
Heaven84 Devils
General Tso's Alliance
77
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 19:32:00 -
[65] - Quote
i kill clones everyday with my ishukone
on my commando
in close quarters (and again because they keep looking to the hills behind me)
i saved a scout in my squad yesterday on the flag in a dom match. (your welcome raph)
i have as of yet gone "one bullet one kill" for a clip,
but four for five thrills me to no end.
i have ohk more people at point blank range by switching to the rifle and pulling the trigger with no ads,
but ive run thru alot of ammo at a wall to see where it lands at different distances(i do this with all my weapons)
im only on 2 for proficiency
the only problem i have is when they are behind cover it should not turn my reticule red,
but it lets me see everyone in cover and tells me how for away they are and tells my squadmates where they are
the reason i do commando is the need for snipers is limited so i dont have to change suits to continue with the cqc fight.
i like my sniper rifle just the way it is even if i use it to spot more than i kill with it
i dont use the charged rifle cause the delay gets me killed, kinda like it did you OP
Absorb what is useful,
discard what is not,
make it uniquely your own........ Bruce Lee
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Mike De Luca
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
151
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Posted - 2014.07.05 19:41:00 -
[66] - Quote
Hit detection need some fixes for snipers before anything else, the other day I hit a starter fir sniper in the head 6 times to put him down because the first 5 didn't register even though I got the hit marker and his shields flashed.
what i think of when charging fg
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Monkey MAC
Rough Riders..
3023
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Posted - 2014.07.05 19:51:00 -
[67] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:While lower tier snipers could indeed use a slight buff, I'm not going to explain why a OHK from any range is a bad idea.
The only exception to this rule should be forge gun, though the perfect accuracy needs to be attended to. lol hot damn another one thinking this has to do with the redline? Did ANYBODY actually read the situation I described in the OP? lol? Trolls resonate with people WAY too loudly in these forums. Pay no attention to the trolls ad hominem, please. lol It's meant to distract. jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote:Planetside also has bullet velocities and drop.... Hakyou Brutor wrote:
Well.. Planetside: extremely low TTK in the first place.
Battlefield: Sniper has drop and delay, it actually takes skill.
CoD: TTK so low that even getting looked at gets you killed.
Both of you are correct. We don't have BALLISTICS in Dust. If we had ballistics than a sniper's damage at range wouldn't matter. He deserves his kill. But Dust has hitscan sniper rifles that are unwieldly, and pointless to use upclose... and in their current shape, they are a headache for people to deal with. They complain about redline snipers. They demand snipers get creative and come up close, yet there is plenty of risk to the sniper at that point, and zero reward.
Dude? I never mentioned the redline!
All I said was that OHK shouldn't really be possible at any range.
This means shotguns as well as snipers.
I never mentioned the redline. Since if you can remember all those months, you and I had a rather lengthy chat about it, how the new gallante socket didn't allow for 'Extreme Range' sniping.
So Ill say again, yes Sniper Rifles need a look at in the current climate.
But No you should not be allowed to OHK even with a Head shot, in a track shooter such as DUST it's a poor mechanic, because it produces lots of reward yet your enemy has no chance to exact a rebuke.
At the absolute least it should take 2 shots (2 body shots or 1 head Shot and a body shot. Though the headshot will do more damage) . However with the faster firing TACSR which for all intensive purposes is a marksmans rifle, 4 would not be out of place.
They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank!
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
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CommanderBolt
ACME SPECIAL FORCES
RISE of LEGION
1247
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Posted - 2014.07.05 22:23:00 -
[68] - Quote
If you want to snipe like a boss then use the forge gun.
MY LIFE FOR AIUR! Protoss
You gonna' give me orders? Terran
"Cat got your tongue? Zerg Queen of Blades.
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TechMechMeds
Inner.Hell
3794
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Posted - 2014.07.06 02:09:00 -
[69] - Quote
Let's just remove snipers.
Just like every other Englishmen, I bath in tea, have no teeth and live in a castle.
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THUNDERGROOVE
Fatal Absolution
982
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 02:13:00 -
[70] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:See the hostility, my fellow snipers? If you dont speak up to CCP Rattati and get some love, no one else will.
Fools in here believe you getting a headshot with the hardest hitting sniper rifle means you didn't earn a kill. Then they call it a technicality and call you a scrub.
Fools, need some reading comprehension before they cry about redline sniping.
My fellow snipers, I am reaching out to you. *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally! May the lone wolfers rise up! May the overwatch sniper that guards his unit from above RISE UP! *howls*
Answer the calllll of your ally! May the Will of your Haters be denied! *howls*
You have no place in PC, they say! Your gun has no place on the battlefield, they say! Your purpose and roll is better off replaced with a shotgun, they say!
Their guns are allowed to work with one shot, but they say yours MAY NOT! They envy you... they call this "balance". Will you simply accept this?! *howls*
Answer the calllllll of your ally!
I can't hear you. Maybe you should leave your spawn.
The Amarr scout bonus is like the old Amarr sentinel bonus. No one needed 25% reduction to overheat damage on a heavy;_;
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Auris Lionesse
Kang Lo Directorate
Gallente Federation
921
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Posted - 2014.07.06 04:32:00 -
[71] - Quote
There is no such thing as a sniper rifle in this game.
The weapons called smokers just need to be removed already. They don't ohk, they aren't accurate, they don't have variable zoom or any zoom for that matter. And the issues with lag and rendering at range reduce their limited effectiveness anyway.
Shanghai should have fired whoever handled sniper rifles along time agoand started over.
Too late now, just remove them/lock them rattati and apologize on behalf of your less competent coworkers.
That's the best case scenario at this point. If you want to snipe we can go play battlefield bad company 2 or bf3 because dice knew what they were doing back then.
Don't vote for iron wolf saber.
Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.
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Cat Merc
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
10690
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 04:39:00 -
[72] - Quote
Auris Lionesse wrote:There is no such thing as a sniper rifle in this game.
The weapons called smokers just need to be removed already. They don't ohk, they aren't accurate, they don't have variable zoom or any zoom for that matter. And the issues with lag and rendering at range reduce their limited effectiveness anyway.
Shanghai should have fired whoever handled sniper rifles along time agoand started over.
Too late now, just remove them/lock them rattati and apologize on behalf of your less competent coworkers.
That's the best case scenario at this point. If you want to snipe we can go play battlefield bad company 2 or bf3 because dice knew what they were doing back then.
Yes, DICE knew that snipers should only OHK on headshot, and it should be really difficult to land a long range shot.
There's bullet drop and bullet travel time, making it MUCH, MUUUUUUUUCH more skillful than the hitscan snipers in DUST.
As for the rest of the post, snipers are dead center accurate and have plenty of zoom.
Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
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Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
856
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 05:06:00 -
[73] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Jathniel, you can complain that people are mentioning the redline all you like but it is still relevant. If you do a direct buff to snipers, you also directly buff redline sniping.
If snipers could be forced out of the redline I'd quite happily support some buffing. Nothing like some of the absurd buffs I've seen suggested in the past (820 damage per shot from a charge sniper rifle is not reasonable) but some moderate buffs would be worth considering.
I have a question for you... Where on any of the maps can a sniper get a view of further than 120m with a target point wider than 5m?
I have yet to see a single map that actually allows snipers to play anywhere other than the hills.
http://youtu.be/dtXupQg77SU
Dust to Dust
Remember the dream you had before the day you were born.
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
31
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 05:14:00 -
[74] - Quote
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Jathniel, you can complain that people are mentioning the redline all you like but it is still relevant. If you do a direct buff to snipers, you also directly buff redline sniping.
If snipers could be forced out of the redline I'd quite happily support some buffing. Nothing like some of the absurd buffs I've seen suggested in the past (820 damage per shot from a charge sniper rifle is not reasonable) but some moderate buffs would be worth considering. I have a question for you... Where on any of the maps can a sniper get a view of further than 120m with a target point wider than 5m? I have yet to see a single map that actually allows snipers to play anywhere other than the hills.
Lolz, then you are not being creative, hell go to Manus Peaks and sit anywhere. You can shoot anywhere. Perhaps you could set on a specific place on any map and cover the objective, any objective. Some maps are not best suited for sniping, and Manus Peaks is not great for heavies either. I refuse to admit that balance of a class is based on full time use of tbat class. Many noobs have not figured out yet in dust, its about having many fits in your closet, sniping is one fit that can work sometimes, on somemaps, but if you are the guy saying well im just going to sit here and snipe the whole time im playing dust then you are playing this game to lose. |
aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
31
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 05:19:00 -
[75] - Quote
Auris Lionesse wrote:There is no such thing as a sniper rifle in this game.
The weapons called smokers just need to be removed already. They don't ohk, they aren't accurate, they don't have variable zoom or any zoom for that matter. And the issues with lag and rendering at range reduce their limited effectiveness anyway.
Shanghai should have fired whoever handled sniper rifles along time agoand started over.
Too late now, just remove them/lock them rattati and apologize on behalf of your less competent coworkers.
That's the best case scenario at this point. If you want to snipe we can go play battlefield bad company 2 or bf3 because dice knew what they were doing back then.
Can your dumb azz not comprehend that we dont want ohk weapons at long range like that? This is dust noob, you deal damage X, based on y and z. Its not just oh I got a hit so you are dead. This is DUST. *said with voice of Leonidas*, in this game we are deeper than your simple minded idea about a bullet hits a target and its dead. Can you not see how simple and backwards that is? |
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
856
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 05:30:00 -
[76] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Jathniel, you can complain that people are mentioning the redline all you like but it is still relevant. If you do a direct buff to snipers, you also directly buff redline sniping.
If snipers could be forced out of the redline I'd quite happily support some buffing. Nothing like some of the absurd buffs I've seen suggested in the past (820 damage per shot from a charge sniper rifle is not reasonable) but some moderate buffs would be worth considering. I have a question for you... Where on any of the maps can a sniper get a view of further than 120m with a target point wider than 5m? I have yet to see a single map that actually allows snipers to play anywhere other than the hills. Lolz, then you are not being creative, hell go to Manus Peaks and sit anywhere. You can shoot anywhere. Perhaps you could set on a specific place on any map and cover the objective, any objective. Some maps are not best suited for sniping, and Manus Peaks is not great for heavies either. I refuse to admit that balance of a class is based on full time use of tbat class. Many noobs have not figured out yet in dust, its about having many fits in your closet, sniping is one fit that can work sometimes, on somemaps, but if you are the guy saying well im just going to sit here and snipe the whole time im playing dust then you are playing this game to lose.
Aaaand I get a reply from a user who didn't actually read what I wrote. Not surprising. Also, you referenced the map where everyone basically stays inside of a large node the entire time. You sit on that hill you're gonna get diddly squit. Plus you are referring to a SINGLE point on only ONE map and calling it good?
http://youtu.be/dtXupQg77SU
Dust to Dust
Remember the dream you had before the day you were born.
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
New Age Empire.
General Tso's Alliance
1604
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 05:31:00 -
[77] - Quote
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Jathniel, you can complain that people are mentioning the redline all you like but it is still relevant. If you do a direct buff to snipers, you also directly buff redline sniping.
If snipers could be forced out of the redline I'd quite happily support some buffing. Nothing like some of the absurd buffs I've seen suggested in the past (820 damage per shot from a charge sniper rifle is not reasonable) but some moderate buffs would be worth considering. I have a question for you... Where on any of the maps can a sniper get a view of further than 120m with a target point wider than 5m? I have yet to see a single map that actually allows snipers to play anywhere other than the hills. Lolz, then you are not being creative, hell go to Manus Peaks and sit anywhere. You can shoot anywhere. Perhaps you could set on a specific place on any map and cover the objective, any objective. Some maps are not best suited for sniping, and Manus Peaks is not great for heavies either. I refuse to admit that balance of a class is based on full time use of tbat class. Many noobs have not figured out yet in dust, its about having many fits in your closet, sniping is one fit that can work sometimes, on somemaps, but if you are the guy saying well im just going to sit here and snipe the whole time im playing dust then you are playing this game to lose. Aaaand I get a reply from a user who didn't actually read what I wrote. Not surprising. Also, you referenced the map where everyone basically stays inside of a large node the entire time. You sit on that hill you're gonna get diddly squit. Plus you are referring to a SINGLE point on only ONE map and calling it good?
He's calling it good cuz it's a good apot, he doesn't have to list all spots.
Closed beta vet.
If bo burnham was on my little pony: friendship is magic
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DontChimpOut
Kang Lo Directorate
Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 05:33:00 -
[78] - Quote
Never understood how a headshot could be a damage multiplier in a game with active shielding that covers the whole body... |
Lynn Beck
Fooly Cooly.
Anime Empire.
2010
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 05:54:00 -
[79] - Quote
Jerrmy, it's getting ridiculous. Stop spammin the ponies.(brony here)
As per 'redline' naysayers, if we actually had a reward for even leaving the redline, as compared to staying in there, we wouldn't have redline snipers.
For example: Snipers are complained about, having 600m range, and 'decent' damage.
Proposal: reduce Optimal Range by 200m(399m now)
Reduce Maximum by 100m(499m Absolute)
Increase damage by 30% on non-charged variants.
Increase headshot modifier by 50%+
Normalize zoom across tiers.
Now, we are actually REWARDED for killing with headshots(the skill)
And, with some additional tweaking needed, people are REWARDED for leavin the redline.
BAM!
We've fixed both ends of the problem:
Snipers complain about not dealing near enough damage(IMO you shouldn't 1hko a Sentinel, as that's their job(to be tough) but dealing 1k damage in a HS isn't TOO unreasonable, considering we remove them from the redline.)
And non-snipers complain about Redliners(using that as the ONLY basis for not buffing Snipers.) through discouragin redline abuse, and severely limiting damage outside of said R/L
Now... If only that Jerrmy12 guy could put a 'it's so cute when you think you know what you're talking about' Pony Pic. Then my life would be complete.
General John Ripper
-BAM! I'm Emeril Lagasse.
This message was approved by the 'Nobody Loved You' Foundation
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
31
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 06:09:00 -
[80] - Quote
DontChimpOut wrote:Never understood how a headshot could be a damage multiplier in a game with active shielding that covers the whole body...
Weak spot for both shields and armor, it doesnt have to make, technical sense to you, all this is fiction, thats how it was designed. Dont try to bring your real life ideas into a futuristic sci fi, that wont work. Its like reading Asimov and saying time travel isnt possible. You dont not need to make sense of the construct, simply undrrstand the rules and exploit them in your favor. |
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Gemini Cuspid
113
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 06:11:00 -
[81] - Quote
DontChimpOut wrote:Never understood how a headshot could be a damage multiplier in a game with active shielding that covers the whole body...
It's not exactly how most non~snipers see the issue; its the relative fact that typically speaking in r/l, armor value and placement is strongest in the center torso area and significantly weakens as you approach further away from it. It would've been a pretty interesting concept for Dust to have implemented where it did a better valuing of how this damage was calculated but I digress. A better example are actually shotguns oddly enough; if you aim at the center area around the chest of a heavy or an armor focused scout/logi then it's usually two shots most of the time with the shotgun. Likewise if you aim that lovely circle around their head you can often times score a single headshot kill.
Personally speaking a headshot multiplier for damage always did make sense for snipers but their (CCP) approach to how snipers should work are pretty odd to say the least; you either get fire rate and get multiple shots in with lower recoil or you get one "lucky" shot in and hope it does kill them instantly.
I actually find it a sort of joke that even hundreds of years from now snipers in this day of age have better optics than anyone in the future; adjustable zoom and better distance overall with better clarity. Then again I don't blame CCP as snipers tend to be a bane for FPS games in general. |
aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
31
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 06:16:00 -
[82] - Quote
Gemini Cuspid wrote:DontChimpOut wrote:Never understood how a headshot could be a damage multiplier in a game with active shielding that covers the whole body... It's not exactly how most non~snipers see the issue; its the relative fact that typically speaking in r/l, armor value and placement is strongest in the center torso area and significantly weakens as you approach further away from it. It would've been a pretty interesting concept for Dust to have implemented where it did a better valuing of how this damage was calculated but I digress. A better example are actually shotguns oddly enough; if you aim at the center area around the chest of a heavy or an armor focused scout/logi then it's usually two shots most of the time with the shotgun. Likewise if you aim that lovely circle around their head you can often times score a single headshot kill. Personally speaking a headshot multiplier for damage always did make sense for snipers but their (CCP) approach to how snipers should work are pretty odd to say the least; you either get fire rate and get multiple shots in with lower recoil or you get one "lucky" shot in and hope it does kill them instantly. I actually find it a sort of joke that even hundreds of years from now snipers in this day of age have better optics than anyone in the future; adjustable zoom and better distance overall with better clarity. Then again I don't blame CCP as snipers tend to be a bane for FPS games in general.
Your last sentence explains it all. Snipers ruin FPS games, always have, always will. Therefore they must be kept in check constantly, and not allowed to run wild. The same way tanks did after 1.8! |
Atiim
Fooly Cooly.
Anime Empire.
10214
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 06:29:00 -
[83] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:Atiim wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Cere harkens.
Sniping is one of the smallest if not the smallest sp sink as well. That actually belongs to the Assault Class. Sniper- sniper, suit, damage mods, armour, shields, uplinks, nanohives. Assult- Sidearms, various weapons, shields, armour, suit, nanohives, injector, uplinks, damage mods I'd say assault is marginally more actually. I guess its all got a bit of preference added as well..
Let me break it down for you:
Snipers
- Caldari Commando V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Engineering III
- Dropsuit Electronics III
- Profile Dampening V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Drop Uplink Deployment V
- Systems Hacking V
- Sniper Rifle Operation V
- Sniper Rifle Proficiency V
- Sniper Rifle Ammo Capacity V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 13,562,300 SP
Assault
- Assault Dropsuit V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades III
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Primary HP Module V
- Primary HP Support Module V
- Secondary HP Module V
- Active Scanner Operation V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Grenadier V
- Primary Weapon V
- Primary Weapon Proficiency V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 11,559,980
As you can clearly see, the Sniper Role is more SP intensive than the Assault Role is. However, the margin is so small (2m SP is not much in the grand scheme of things) that it doesn't make a meaningful difference.
Not to mention, that for reasons I've stated plenty of times, how intensive a role is in terms of SP is not a valid point when discussing balance. Moving on now.
Long Live The Anime Empire
"You know what? You really, REALLY, like to dampen the mood" - Lea Silencio
-HAND
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General12912
Gallente Marine Corps
205
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 06:50:00 -
[84] - Quote
Not all snipers camp. im a thale-style sniper, but i dont camp. i pick off a few targets, then i look for another angle to snipe from or i move to a new area where there are more targets.
anyways, i dont think a chrage sniper slug to the head should do much. we are talking about suits that are, for the most part, tough. they can survive explosions and missiles. so do you really think a tiny electromagnetically boosted slug is going to do anything?
Every suit Gk.0 <3
Gallente Federation Patriot
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
31
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 07:03:00 -
[85] - Quote
General12912 wrote:Not all snipers camp. im a thale-style sniper, but i dont camp. i pick off a few targets, then i look for another angle to snipe from or i move to a new area where there are more targets.
anyways, i dont think a chrage sniper slug to the head should do much. we are talking about suits that are, for the most part, tough. they can survive explosions and missiles. so do you really think a tiny electromagnetically boosted slug is going to do anything?
There is no such thing as camping, though im not a huge sniper fan, I don't believe in that concept. Thats a butt hurt call of duty term, its called defending. And if you are not defending and you are just sitting in the redline shooting randomly, then you are useless, but not a camper. |
Guiltless D667
41
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 07:53:00 -
[86] - Quote
1. Increase the headshot multiplier by a ungodly amount(way more damage over all than before)
2. Lower base damage through sniper tiers, so no one bitches they got one shotted because a thale sniper shot because he was in their mind, a badshot and aimed for the anything that wasnt the head.
There everything is better for the actually skilled.
Happy community?
A Strange Game.
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Cogadh Draco
WarRavens
Final Resolution.
80
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 08:53:00 -
[87] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you! Not that technicalities matter with idiots but a HS in this game is not an I win button. It has a damage multiplier yes but shooting someone in the head does not kill them for the very same reason shooting someone with body armor on doesnt kill them. You didnt get through the armor, if you did they would be dead. No one in this game that matters wants snipers sitting in the red line getting a ohk just because you land a head shot. They have that game already, it's called COD, try your luck there. And stop typing the word ***** you look like a filthy animal with no home training.
PLEASE no 1 hit kills like CoD(even if it's a headshot)... Even a damn stomach or waist shot is a 1 hit kill in CoD with a few sniper rifles... |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
15211
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 09:17:00 -
[88] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Let me break it down for you: Snipers
- Caldari Commando V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Engineering III
- Dropsuit Electronics III
- Profile Dampening V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Drop Uplink Deployment V
- Systems Hacking V
- Sniper Rifle Operation V
- Sniper Rifle Proficiency V
- Sniper Rifle Ammo Capacity V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 13,562,300 SP
Assault
- Assault Dropsuit V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades III
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Primary HP Module V
- Primary HP Support Module V
- Secondary HP Module V
- Active Scanner Operation V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Grenadier V
- Primary Weapon V
- Primary Weapon Proficiency V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 11,559,980
This is a ridiculously terrible comparison. Show me the assault who has prof 5 in their weapon but doesn't have any electronics or engineering skills. Snipers don't train systems hacking 5. Nor do they really train profile dampening if they've gone Calmando - a complex dampener won't bring profile down enough to evade anything but the most rudimentary scans.
A sniper isn't going to train level 5 ammo capacity if carrying proto hives. "But what if he's carrying uplinks?" An assault is almost as likely to be carrying uplinks and is likely to burn through ammo much quicker.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
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Monkey MAC
Rough Riders..
3026
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 11:56:00 -
[89] - Quote
Atiim wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Atiim wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Cere harkens.
Sniping is one of the smallest if not the smallest sp sink as well. That actually belongs to the Assault Class. Sniper- sniper, suit, damage mods, armour, shields, uplinks, nanohives. Assult- Sidearms, various weapons, shields, armour, suit, nanohives, injector, uplinks, damage mods I'd say assault is marginally more actually. I guess its all got a bit of preference added as well.. Let me break it down for you: Snipers
- Caldari Commando V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Engineering III
- Dropsuit Electronics III
- Profile Dampening V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Drop Uplink Deployment V
- Systems Hacking V
- Sniper Rifle Operation V
- Sniper Rifle Proficiency V
- Sniper Rifle Ammo Capacity V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 13,562,300 SP
Assault
- Assault Dropsuit V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades III
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Primary HP Module V
- Primary HP Support Module V
- Secondary HP Module V
- Active Scanner Operation V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Grenadier V
- Primary Weapon V
- Primary Weapon Proficiency V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 11,559,980
As you can clearly see, the Sniper Role is more SP intensive than the Assault Role is. However, the margin is so small (2m SP is not much in the grand scheme of things) that it doesn't make a meaningful difference. Not to mention, that for reasons I've stated plenty of times, how intensive a role is in terms of SP is not a valid point when discussing balance. Moving on now.
No no no no no, this overly biased.
Snipers
1 Light Weapon
1 Sidearm
1 Hive
1 Uplink
Assaults
1 Light Weapon
1 Sidearm
1 Grenade
1 Equipment
Both roles are pretty much the same, nor is this important as SP should not be a balancing factor between roles.
The problems with Snipers are simple
As a Sniper
1) Not enough damage at lower tiers
2) Lack of variable zoom
As a target
1) Redline
Therefore the fix is simple, raisemthe base damage of STD and ADV rifiles, incorporate the ability to change between 3 zoom levels on all rifles.
Reduce range to 200m Optimal, 250m Effective
Jathaniel, you should not be 1 shotting ANYONE EVER, if you are skilled sniper hitting a moving target twice should not be that difficult.
They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank!
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1095
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 20:41:00 -
[90] - Quote
Monkey MAC wrote:Atiim wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Atiim wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Cere harkens.
Sniping is one of the smallest if not the smallest sp sink as well. That actually belongs to the Assault Class. Sniper- sniper, suit, damage mods, armour, shields, uplinks, nanohives. Assult- Sidearms, various weapons, shields, armour, suit, nanohives, injector, uplinks, damage mods I'd say assault is marginally more actually. I guess its all got a bit of preference added as well.. Let me break it down for you: Snipers
- Caldari Commando V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Engineering III
- Dropsuit Electronics III
- Profile Dampening V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Drop Uplink Deployment V
- Systems Hacking V
- Sniper Rifle Operation V
- Sniper Rifle Proficiency V
- Sniper Rifle Ammo Capacity V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 13,562,300 SP
Assault
- Assault Dropsuit V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades III
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Primary HP Module V
- Primary HP Support Module V
- Secondary HP Module V
- Active Scanner Operation V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Grenadier V
- Primary Weapon V
- Primary Weapon Proficiency V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 11,559,980
As you can clearly see, the Sniper Role is more SP intensive than the Assault Role is. However, the margin is so small (2m SP is not much in the grand scheme of things) that it doesn't make a meaningful difference. Not to mention, that for reasons I've stated plenty of times, how intensive a role is in terms of SP is not a valid point when discussing balance. Moving on now. No no no no no, this overly biased. Snipers 1 Light Weapon 1 Sidearm 1 Hive 1 Uplink Assaults 1 Light Weapon 1 Sidearm 1 Grenade 1 Equipment Both roles are pretty much the same, nor is this important as SP should not be a balancing factor between roles. The problems with Snipers are simple As a Sniper 1) Not enough damage at lower tiers 2) Lack of variable zoom As a target 1) Redline Therefore the fix is simple, raisemthe base damage of STD and ADV rifiles, incorporate the ability to change between 3 zoom levels on all rifles. Reduce range to 200m Optimal, 250m Effective Jathaniel, you should not be 1 shotting ANYONE EVER, if you are skilled sniper hitting a moving target twice should not be that difficult.
Dude, Monkey. I've seen you on the forums and in this game, about as long as myself and Arkena. Maybe you saw my proposal on page 2 (or 3?) or not.
I'm realizing something very ugly here.
This really has nothing to do with snipers.
This doesn't have anything to do with scouts or shotguns.
It has nothing to do with wanting a fair and balanced game.
A lot of players in this game, simply have a phobia of getting killed quickly. I'm seriously sitting here, imagining people screaming and cursing because something kills them efficiently. (and boy have i heard it on public match team comms).
Dust already has the longest (and most absurd) TTKs I have ever seen, in ANY shooter, EVER, across ALL time, on ANY platform.
This is why Dust failed.
The ridiculosuly absurd TTK exacerbated further by the skill point gap between vets and noobs.
Players just don't like to die fast.
And they don't give a damn what that means for Dust. "Fk the noobs and fk balance, so long as nothing kills me fast, I'm happy."
No wonder CCP is trying to distance itself from this playerbase, and move to PC!
The Charge sniper shoots about as slow as the forge gun, when you are releasing fully charged rounds. And even if the gun had NO sway, and you could aim it as easily as a Rail Rifle, and use it in close-range, it would still suck because of how slow it is.
The gun has *nothing* going for it except it's range, which EVERYONE says it should not have.   Like wow!
"A headshot from a slow and powerful gun should not kill me?" Really? How ELSE do SLOW weapons compensate for a lack of RoF? Geniuses!
The level of whine on this thread indicates brain damage when it comes to game balance.
(Maybe that's why hit detection is broken for kb/m, but working perfectly for ds3.)
But it's okay. I'm just going to go ahead and make proposals to the proper channels. I used to believe in this community. That's how we got the TAR rebalanced.
But not anymore.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
38
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 20:56:00 -
[91] - Quote
It has to do with what we do and do not want from snipers. Most of us simply do not want snipers more powerful and you do. What you are seeing that is so ugly is disagreement with your ideas. Call it what you want. Most of this community is fine with snipers. There are loads of games dedicated to them, go play those. Dont get mad when your ideas are rejected. |
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
856
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:15:00 -
[92] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Atiim wrote:Let me break it down for you: Snipers
- Caldari Commando V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Engineering III
- Dropsuit Electronics III
- Profile Dampening V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Drop Uplink Deployment V
- Systems Hacking V
- Sniper Rifle Operation V
- Sniper Rifle Proficiency V
- Sniper Rifle Ammo Capacity V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 13,562,300 SP
Assault
- Assault Dropsuit V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades III
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Primary HP Module V
- Primary HP Support Module V
- Secondary HP Module V
- Active Scanner Operation V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Grenadier V
- Primary Weapon V
- Primary Weapon Proficiency V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 11,559,980
This is a ridiculously terrible comparison. Show me the assault who has prof 5 in their weapon but doesn't have any electronics or engineering skills. Snipers don't train systems hacking 5. Nor do they really train profile dampening if they've gone Calmando - a complex dampener won't bring profile down enough to evade anything but the most rudimentary scans. A sniper isn't going to train level 5 ammo capacity if carrying proto hives. "But what if he's carrying uplinks?" An assault is almost as likely to be carrying uplinks and is likely to burn through ammo much quicker.
Hacking? Everyone who wants to use a point does hacking, most often active snipers will be found around the objectives...
Profile dampening is almost indispensable... It helps you from appearing when someone hastily passes their vision over your location. More often than not, this will save your character. :/ Scanners are pointless if you are actually sniping, they get your scan, then move away from the location. Visual ID is a much more deadly venue.
Drop uplink... Many snipers will place an uplink on a desired location, so if they are killed, they can come back to the spot quickly. Such as the top of a tower etc...
I can tell from your responses, that you don't have much awareness of the field around you... You respond quickly without even trying to think of a reason that one might use something or another.
I can also clearly tell that you have never done sniping. I can tell you that from basic to Proto, there is only 20 hp difference in damage (10 per tier) DPS is around 100-110 for snipers, while assaults have what? 300-400 DPS (can't remember accurately, but that is close), not to mention that at range, you can miss a target directly in the center of your crosshairs, that is NOT moving due to buggy projectile pathing. Also, targets that are running can literally teleport across the region your bullet enters because of server latency not registering the body between two points.
It's not uncommon to empty an entire inventory of bullets and wind up with only 4 or 5 kills tops before having to nanohive back to maximum. Assaults on the other hand can get 2 or so kills per reload, making 12-15 kills per nano very viable.
If we were to reduce all assault weapons down to the efficiency of sniper rifles, I have no doubt in my mind that you would complain almost every time you logged on, and might even possibly quit the game.
It is a fact in this game that accuracy and skill weapons do FAR LESS damage than spray and pray guns, meaning skill is being sidelined for automated fire.
http://youtu.be/dtXupQg77SU
Dust to Dust
Remember the dream you had before the day you were born.
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1096
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:24:00 -
[93] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:It has to do with what we do and do not want from snipers. Most of us simply do not want snipers more powerful and you do. What you are seeing that is so ugly is disagreement with your ideas. Call it what you want. Most of this community is fine with snipers. There are loads of games dedicated to them, go play those. Dont get mad when your ideas are rejected.
What YOU (not "we") do and do not want, does not necessarily mean a well balanced game. I want snipers rebalanced because they need to be, if they are they are to have a "viable place on the battlefield", outside of killing someone in an open field "once in a blue moon".
Most of this community is fine with snipers because they are immune to them.
What's ugly is not your disagreement with my ideas, but your viewpoint that it's all fine as it is, when this game's success overall indicates otherwise.
I'm not mad at my ideas being rejected. I'm mad at members (like you) in this community seeing things (such as snipers or otherwise) in a broken state, and liking it that way.
CCP Rattati wrote: I didn't see anything concrete here, increase headshot multiplier, range, make other snipers than Thale's powerful, increase scope zoom....
Anecdotally I haven't been killed by a sniper in ages, get picked off once in a blue moon if I am careless and in open under half hp. I need to look at the numbers, but sniper use is very stable, none of the rifles or new weapons have had a meaningful impact on the use of sniper rifles, so it's a steady group of people who like to snipe apparantly, I am not even sure they venture into Tac AR or SCR at all.
Feel free to share, we have no specific hate/love with snipers, they should have a viable place on the battlefield like all of our weapons.
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=166007&p=3 Post #58
Just doing my part.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
38
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:26:00 -
[94] - Quote
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Atiim wrote:Let me break it down for you: Snipers
- Caldari Commando V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Engineering III
- Dropsuit Electronics III
- Profile Dampening V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Drop Uplink Deployment V
- Systems Hacking V
- Sniper Rifle Operation V
- Sniper Rifle Proficiency V
- Sniper Rifle Ammo Capacity V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 13,562,300 SP
Assault
- Assault Dropsuit V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades III
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Primary HP Module V
- Primary HP Support Module V
- Secondary HP Module V
- Active Scanner Operation V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Grenadier V
- Primary Weapon V
- Primary Weapon Proficiency V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 11,559,980
This is a ridiculously terrible comparison. Show me the assault who has prof 5 in their weapon but doesn't have any electronics or engineering skills. Snipers don't train systems hacking 5. Nor do they really train profile dampening if they've gone Calmando - a complex dampener won't bring profile down enough to evade anything but the most rudimentary scans. A sniper isn't going to train level 5 ammo capacity if carrying proto hives. "But what if he's carrying uplinks?" An assault is almost as likely to be carrying uplinks and is likely to burn through ammo much quicker. Hacking? Everyone who wants to use a point does hacking, most often active snipers will be found around the objectives... Profile dampening is almost indispensable... It helps you from appearing when someone hastily passes their vision over your location. More often than not, this will save your character. :/ Scanners are pointless if you are actually sniping, they get your scan, then move away from the location. Visual ID is a much more deadly venue. Drop uplink... Many snipers will place an uplink on a desired location, so if they are killed, they can come back to the spot quickly. Such as the top of a tower etc... I can tell from your responses, that you don't have much awareness of the field around you... You respond quickly without even trying to think of a reason that one might use something or another. I can also clearly tell that you have never done sniping. I can tell you that from basic to Proto, there is only 20 hp difference in damage (10 per tier) DPS is around 100-110 for snipers, while assaults have what? 300-400 DPS (can't remember accurately, but that is close), not to mention that at range, you can miss a target directly in the center of your crosshairs, that is NOT moving due to buggy projectile pathing. Also, targets that are running can literally teleport across the region your bullet enters because of server latency not registering the body between two points. It's not uncommon to empty an entire inventory of bullets and wind up with only 4 or 5 kills tops before having to nanohive back to maximum. Assaults on the other hand can get 2 or so kills per reload, making 12-15 kills per nano very viable. If we were to reduce all assault weapons down to the efficiency of sniper rifles, I have no doubt in my mind that you would complain almost every time you logged on, and might even possibly quit the game. It is a fact in this game that accuracy and skill weapons do FAR LESS damage than spray and pray guns, meaning skill is being sidelined for automated fire. Look you crying a$$ noob, all that **** you are talking about we deal with also. Bullets not registering, bad hit, detection etc, etc. The diffrence is we are boots on the ground in the fight risking life and isk, and while we are fighting we are not kneelimg down on some high tower. We are dodging enemy fire that may or may not register, side stepping grenades, strafing back and forth, looking for the other guy we dont see, trying not to get ran over by lavs, shot by tanks, or killed by some noob sniper in the redline. You are not in the fight if you are a sniper, you are a spectator that can disproportionately affect the outcome of the battle between my self and someone else with little to no risk involved. Get off the redline, get off the sniper tit, get in the fight and get good.
|
Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1096
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:30:00 -
[95] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Atiim wrote:Let me break it down for you: Snipers
- Caldari Commando V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Engineering III
- Dropsuit Electronics III
- Profile Dampening V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Drop Uplink Deployment V
- Systems Hacking V
- Sniper Rifle Operation V
- Sniper Rifle Proficiency V
- Sniper Rifle Ammo Capacity V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 13,562,300 SP
Assault
- Assault Dropsuit V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades III
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Primary HP Module V
- Primary HP Support Module V
- Secondary HP Module V
- Active Scanner Operation V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Grenadier V
- Primary Weapon V
- Primary Weapon Proficiency V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 11,559,980
This is a ridiculously terrible comparison. Show me the assault who has prof 5 in their weapon but doesn't have any electronics or engineering skills. Snipers don't train systems hacking 5. Nor do they really train profile dampening if they've gone Calmando - a complex dampener won't bring profile down enough to evade anything but the most rudimentary scans. A sniper isn't going to train level 5 ammo capacity if carrying proto hives. "But what if he's carrying uplinks?" An assault is almost as likely to be carrying uplinks and is likely to burn through ammo much quicker. Hacking? Everyone who wants to use a point does hacking, most often active snipers will be found around the objectives... Profile dampening is almost indispensable... It helps you from appearing when someone hastily passes their vision over your location. More often than not, this will save your character. :/ Scanners are pointless if you are actually sniping, they get your scan, then move away from the location. Visual ID is a much more deadly venue. Drop uplink... Many snipers will place an uplink on a desired location, so if they are killed, they can come back to the spot quickly. Such as the top of a tower etc... I can tell from your responses, that you don't have much awareness of the field around you... You respond quickly without even trying to think of a reason that one might use something or another. I can also clearly tell that you have never done sniping. I can tell you that from basic to Proto, there is only 20 hp difference in damage (10 per tier) DPS is around 100-110 for snipers, while assaults have what? 300-400 DPS (can't remember accurately, but that is close), not to mention that at range, you can miss a target directly in the center of your crosshairs, that is NOT moving due to buggy projectile pathing. Also, targets that are running can literally teleport across the region your bullet enters because of server latency not registering the body between two points. It's not uncommon to empty an entire inventory of bullets and wind up with only 4 or 5 kills tops before having to nanohive back to maximum. Assaults on the other hand can get 2 or so kills per reload, making 12-15 kills per nano very viable. If we were to reduce all assault weapons down to the efficiency of sniper rifles, I have no doubt in my mind that you would complain almost every time you logged on, and might even possibly quit the game. It is a fact in this game that accuracy and skill weapons do FAR LESS damage than spray and pray guns, meaning skill is being sidelined for automated fire. Look you crying a$$ noob, all that **** you are talking about we deal with also. Bullets not registering, bad hit, detection etc, etc. The diffrence is we are boots on the ground in the fight risking life and isk, and while we are fighting we are not kneelimg down on some high tower. We are dodging enemy fire that may or may not register, side stepping grenades, strafing back and forth, looking for the other guy we dont see, trying not to get ran over by lavs, shot by tanks, or killed by some noob sniper in the redline. You are not in the fight if you are a sniper, you are a spectator that can disproportionately affect the outcome of the battle between my self and someone else with little to no risk involved. Get off the redline, get off the sniper tit, get in the fight and get good.
How oblivious are you?
What world are you coming from, where you think snipers are disproportionately affecting anything anymore?
You might have been able to talk that kind of nonsense, back when Manus' Peak had an actual peak.
But snipers are fkin useless in a match worth a damn.
What do you do? Pub all day?
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
|
TechMechMeds
Inner.Hell
3796
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:32:00 -
[96] - Quote
Well that was fun lol.
Just like every other Englishmen, I bath in tea, have no teeth and live in a castle.
|
Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1096
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:35:00 -
[97] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:Well that was fun lol.
Gonna have to repost the topic with only numbers.
List proposals, and put it through to folks that actually matter when it comes to these things.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
|
TechMechMeds
Inner.Hell
3796
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:42:00 -
[98] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Well that was fun lol. Gonna have to repost the topic with only numbers. List proposals, and put it through to folks that actually matter when it comes to these things.
Mail CCP.
Just like every other Englishmen, I bath in tea, have no teeth and live in a castle.
|
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
857
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:46:00 -
[99] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Atiim wrote:Let me break it down for you: Snipers
- Caldari Commando V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Engineering III
- Dropsuit Electronics III
- Profile Dampening V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Drop Uplink Deployment V
- Systems Hacking V
- Sniper Rifle Operation V
- Sniper Rifle Proficiency V
- Sniper Rifle Ammo Capacity V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 13,562,300 SP
Assault
- Assault Dropsuit V
- Handheld Weapon Upgrades III
- Dropsuit Armor Upgrades V
- Dropsuit Shield Upgrades V
- Primary HP Module V
- Primary HP Support Module V
- Secondary HP Module V
- Active Scanner Operation V
- Nanocircuitry V
- Grenadier V
- Primary Weapon V
- Primary Weapon Proficiency V
- Secondary Weapon V
- Secondary Weapon Proficiency I
Total: 11,559,980
This is a ridiculously terrible comparison. Show me the assault who has prof 5 in their weapon but doesn't have any electronics or engineering skills. Snipers don't train systems hacking 5. Nor do they really train profile dampening if they've gone Calmando - a complex dampener won't bring profile down enough to evade anything but the most rudimentary scans. A sniper isn't going to train level 5 ammo capacity if carrying proto hives. "But what if he's carrying uplinks?" An assault is almost as likely to be carrying uplinks and is likely to burn through ammo much quicker. Hacking? Everyone who wants to use a point does hacking, most often active snipers will be found around the objectives... Profile dampening is almost indispensable... It helps you from appearing when someone hastily passes their vision over your location. More often than not, this will save your character. :/ Scanners are pointless if you are actually sniping, they get your scan, then move away from the location. Visual ID is a much more deadly venue. Drop uplink... Many snipers will place an uplink on a desired location, so if they are killed, they can come back to the spot quickly. Such as the top of a tower etc... I can tell from your responses, that you don't have much awareness of the field around you... You respond quickly without even trying to think of a reason that one might use something or another. I can also clearly tell that you have never done sniping. I can tell you that from basic to Proto, there is only 20 hp difference in damage (10 per tier) DPS is around 100-110 for snipers, while assaults have what? 300-400 DPS (can't remember accurately, but that is close), not to mention that at range, you can miss a target directly in the center of your crosshairs, that is NOT moving due to buggy projectile pathing. Also, targets that are running can literally teleport across the region your bullet enters because of server latency not registering the body between two points. It's not uncommon to empty an entire inventory of bullets and wind up with only 4 or 5 kills tops before having to nanohive back to maximum. Assaults on the other hand can get 2 or so kills per reload, making 12-15 kills per nano very viable. If we were to reduce all assault weapons down to the efficiency of sniper rifles, I have no doubt in my mind that you would complain almost every time you logged on, and might even possibly quit the game. It is a fact in this game that accuracy and skill weapons do FAR LESS damage than spray and pray guns, meaning skill is being sidelined for automated fire. Look you crying a$$ noob, all that **** you are talking about we deal with also. Bullets not registering, bad hit, detection etc, etc. The diffrence is we are boots on the ground in the fight risking life and isk, and while we are fighting we are not kneelimg down on some high tower. We are dodging enemy fire that may or may not register, side stepping grenades, strafing back and forth, looking for the other guy we dont see, trying not to get ran over by lavs, shot by tanks, or killed by some noob sniper in the redline. You are not in the fight if you are a sniper, you are a spectator that can disproportionately affect the outcome of the battle between my self and someone else with little to no risk involved. Get off the redline, get off the sniper tit, get in the fight and get good.
I am dual...tri... quad... whatever the hell.. role specced. The only things I don't have an investment in at this point are scout suits, Assault Dropships and shotguns.
I can confidently tell you that you are complaining about spilled milk. Hit failures at 70m or less are insanely miniscule. Tanks have such horrible spread now i can run and literally frolic in front of them for a good 20 seconds before they can kill me. More than enough time to swarm them to death. LAV's are easy as peach to dodge unless you aren't paying attention to their trajectory... strafing at close range is easily countered by bullet spam, only scout suits strafe fast enough to avoid damage moving through the bullet streams. (hence the reason I don't use them because that is obviously broken)
http://youtu.be/dtXupQg77SU
Dust to Dust
Remember the dream you had before the day you were born.
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
38
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 21:49:00 -
[100] - Quote
I didnt say they disproportionately affect the out come of the game. Rather in instances they affect the outcome of a single battle between myself and some other actual warrior with reflexes and the need for hand eye coordination with the risk for his personal well being, the outcome of my goal, his stats, his isk, his pride, and you get to shoot me while low on health take his kill, cause you look for weakened armor right?
I mean thats, the profiency for the sniper and all. Now what did you risk by sitting back there, up there, or wherever and eating popcorn with your right hand on a mouse, chilling? You want to talk about being afraid to die? Why do you think your kind sets in the redline?
Fear of losing the proto gear they use? How many snipers are using adv and std level weapons? In pubs as you say why? Because you are not dynamic enough players. Pc is an ever changing meta, boots on the ground can quickly swap roles, and with that being said I have seen great snipers, ive even seen snipers in PC, pubs also.
Give Wulfgard a Thales on Manus Peaks. Put SymbioticForks ANYWHERE, Ive seen him beast on Peaks, Fracture Road, Iron Delta. With a charge no less. Watch FunkmasterWhale on Skim Junction setting up on those rings, going Ham with a forge, ewwwww.... You know the real problem here? You arent that good.... |
|
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Mike De Luca
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
154
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 22:13:00 -
[101] - Quote
This is getting quite hilarious, that's all.
what i think of when charging fg
|
Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
15227
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 22:27:00 -
[102] - Quote
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:
Hacking? Everyone who wants to use a point does hacking, most often active snipers will be found around the objectives...
A sniper is much less likely to be found on the objective than an assault is. An assault is much more likely to want to hack that point and be in a position to do so. It's stupid, then, to assume that a sniper will want maxed out hacking skills and assaults won't.
Quote:
Profile dampening is almost indispensable... It helps you from appearing when someone hastily passes their vision over your location. More often than not, this will save your character. :/ Scanners are pointless if you are actually sniping, they get your scan, then move away from the location. Visual ID is a much more deadly venue.
Profile dampeners have no effect on how easily you get tagged by someone looking at you. If someone looks directly at you, puts their crosshairs on you, you are tagged on their TACnet. It doesn't matter how many profile dampeners you put on, the only thing that will save you from that effect is a cloak.
If you're using a Calmando, the only thing a complex profile dampener will save you from is a standard active scanner, or the passive scan of a heavy. If you're at the point where you're worrying about getting passively scanned by heavies you are doing something horrendously wrong.
Quote:
Drop uplink... Many snipers will place an uplink on a desired location, so if they are killed, they can come back to the spot quickly. Such as the top of a tower etc...
Sure. Many assaults will also carry uplinks or another equipment item. It's hideously biased to assume that the only equipment an assault will ever use is a nanohive.
Quote:
-snip ranting and ignorant whining-
Oh boy, it's the classic 'waaah you didnt agree with evrything i belive in' response.
I can tell from your response that you are a terribly biased sniper. Just as biased as some of the people in here bitching that snipers should never be viable.
All I said was that the projected skill comparison was flawed. It was.
Despite a simple factual correction, you went off on a long rant about how I'm clearly a biased assault player.
Your assertion that you can 'clearly tell that I've never done sniping' is so wrong I almost laughed at it. I have proficiency 4 sniper rifles. I use snipers several times a week. I am aware that they are not viable.
Whining about how the damage only marginally goes up between tiers is laughable. That's exactly the case for every weapon. There is no weapon which jumps more than about 10% in damage from standard to proto.
Now, if you're going to ask why your sniper rifle isn't doing the same DPS as an assault rifle, I have a question for you.
Why doesn't a rifle do as much damage as a shotgun?
Because of the range. If shotguns did the same damage as an assault rifle despite having point blank range, it would be unbalanced.
The range of the sniper rifle is a huge advantage. Obviously. That's what it's for. What do you want, the sniper to do as much damage as a shotgun?
If you're emptying your entire inventory of bullets for 4-5 kills, you're bad. As someone who allegedly 'never snipes', I can quite easily get more than that and do so regularly.
The sniper does not instantly kill things from half a kilometre away because it's a case of risk vs reward. The ability to sit back in the redline (and like it or not, that will be done) with a sniper and instasplat players at very little risk would be broken.
If we look at Jathniel here, someone debating this in a more civilised fashion (albeit still in a frustrated tone) instead of exploding at people in a pathetic manner, they're trying to make sensible suggestions on how to help the sniper become viable without going straight to the other extreme of being overpowered.
I snipe somewhat regularly. I do it as a relaxing activity and rarely get bothered by enemy players as I hide in a scout suit in places that aren't the centrepiece for firefights.
I do okay with it. But I see issues. It's not quite as good as it should be. It has too few mechanics supporting it to make it an interesting role. It has bugs associated with it, normally the kind of terrible hit detection bugs that are almost prehistoric.
It would be nice to see those fixed. With Rattati making actual sensible tweaks, there could be a real chance to make some good changes to help the role.
It's frustrating to me, then, to see trash posts from people like you who don't have any real concept of anything approaching a balanced system clogging up what a thread that could otherwise be something that could be shown to Rattati to ask for some moderate buffs.
I want to see snipers helped so they're a role which is viable and interesting. Not so that they're EZmode instakill machines that you can sit in the redline with which promptly get nerfed back into the dark ages never to be touched again. A reasonable case could be made to improve them.
Being so sensitive as to go off on a rant at the slightest sign of someone not completely agreeing with all the buffs ever does not help the cause.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
|
KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1116
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 22:28:00 -
[103] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you!
With quality posts like this, I just can't believe this person has had 1000+ likes on the forums so far.
Not that likes matter. Guess it's just a reminder of the nature of the Internetz.
:-S
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Monkey MAC
Rough Riders..
3030
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 22:37:00 -
[104] - Quote
KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:Jathniel wrote:I'm tired of headshots with the Charge Sniper Rifle not killing people. Like for real. Dude gets within range on me, and I send a round into the center of his skull at literally 9,000,000 mph (14,484,096 km/h).
And the game is audacious enough to still leave him with 30% of his armor! Nlgga I just removed 30% your brain! I hit the goddamn pineal gland! Fk you! With quality posts like this, I just can't believe this person has had 1000+ likes on the forums so far. Not that likes matter. Guess it's just a reminder of the nature of the Internetz.
No matter what is said somewhere, somehow, someone will agree, its human nature.
Unfortunately, evidence, opinions and the misconstrusions of both are also a human nature.
We can all argue till we are Blue in the face and none of us will chamge our minds, the best you can do is present your case as best you can, hope people agree with you and go from there.
They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank!
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
15230
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 22:39:00 -
[105] - Quote
@Civil people
It should be entirely possible to get a coherent analysis of the present state of snipers together. From there, it ought to be possible to discuss this in a more reasonable fashion and get a proposal that might actually be looked at by someone who matters.
As frustrating as sniping may be to you, this started off as a rant thread and was met with similarly low quality responses. Some good started to develop out of it as a small number of people started to begin thinking with a modicum of intelligence about the problem.
It was never going to become a thread genuinely worth looking at for smart proposals about where snipers should go though.
So I suggest that if you're really concerned about the role of sniping, you should cool off and in a civilised manner put together some correct statements and build a proposal out of that.
I might do that myself.
Ranting in GD only enhances the perception of snipers as whiners and makes people think that nothing serious should be done. Come back with a decent argument presented in a manner that isn't blatantly biased and people might be more inclined to listen.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
|
Monkey MAC
Rough Riders..
3031
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 22:56:00 -
[106] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:@Civil people
It should be entirely possible to get a coherent analysis of the present state of snipers together. From there, it ought to be possible to discuss this in a more reasonable fashion and get a proposal that might actually be looked at by someone who matters.
As frustrating as sniping may be to you, this started off as a rant thread and was met with similarly low quality responses. Some good started to develop out of it as a small number of people started to begin thinking with a modicum of intelligence about the problem.
It was never going to become a thread genuinely worth looking at for smart proposals about where snipers should go though.
So I suggest that if you're really concerned about the role of sniping, you should cool off and in a civilised manner put together some correct statements and build a proposal out of that.
I might do that myself.
Ranting in GD only enhances the perception of snipers as whiners and makes people think that nothing serious should be done. Come back with a decent argument presented in a manner that isn't blatantly biased and people might be more inclined to listen.
Link me in if you do, I'd love to have a civilissed discussion on the matter.
They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank!
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
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LUGMOS
YELLOW JESUS EXP FORCE
577
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 23:30:00 -
[107] - Quote
The thing with snipers is that they are only viable at long ranges (please read the rest)
Everyone keeps saying that snipers need to come out of the redline or into the fray, but it is literally suicide to do that as any rifle will do better in the heat of battle. Scrambler rifles, combat rifles, and more importantly, rail rifles (90 meter range) outperforms the sniper rifle where it's supposed to shine. I woild propose a few changes similar to what others have been saying:
-Reduce absolute range to ~200-250 meters, allowing it to outrange the orher rifles and still have a relatively long range
-increase damage only marginally (maybe 10-20 damage)
-increase headshot multiplier marginally (add about 10%)
These are only suggestions, so numbers may change
Quafe
A question doesn't always have an answer, but a problem does,
So what is DUST? A problem or a question?
|
Monkey MAC
Rough Riders..
3032
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 23:46:00 -
[108] - Quote
LUGMOS wrote:The thing with snipers is that they are only viable at long ranges (please read the rest)
Everyone keeps saying that snipers need to come out of the redline or into the fray, but it is literally suicide to do that as any rifle will do better in the heat of battle. Scrambler rifles, combat rifles, and more importantly, rail rifles (90 meter range) outperforms the sniper rifle where it's supposed to shine. I woild propose a few changes similar to what others have been saying:
-Reduce absolute range to ~200-250 meters, allowing it to outrange the orher rifles and still have a relatively long range
-increase damage only marginally (maybe 10-20 damage)
-increase headshot multiplier marginally (add about 10%)
These are only suggestions, so numbers may change
When we say come into the fray a bit more we don't expect to start seeing Snipers hacking points and so forth. But we do expect them to be on them fringes of a battle, there are plenty of spots inside the map that snipers can use. It's just we never really see them actually being used like that.
They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank!
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
|
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
858
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 23:50:00 -
[109] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:
Hacking? Everyone who wants to use a point does hacking, most often active snipers will be found around the objectives...
A sniper is much less likely to be found on the objective than an assault is. An assault is much more likely to want to hack that point and be in a position to do so. It's stupid, then, to assume that a sniper will want maxed out hacking skills and assaults won't. Profile dampeners have no effect on how easily you get tagged by someone looking at you. If someone looks directly at you, puts their crosshairs on you, you are tagged on their TACnet. It doesn't matter how many profile dampeners you put on, the only thing that will save you from that effect is a cloak. If you're using a Calmando, the only thing a complex profile dampener will save you from is a standard active scanner, or the passive scan of a heavy. If you're at the point where you're worrying about getting passively scanned by heavies you are doing something horrendously wrong.
Next time you load into a game, you might want to look at the people deploying around you. You can tell who has dampeners on because their blue chevrons disappear before others who are further out. This is the same thing with someone looking in. They then have to actively pass the center of the reticule over you to get you to light up.
- I had assumed you had more general knowledge of dampening, but I was apparently mistaken.
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:
Sure. Many assaults will also carry uplinks or another equipment item. It's hideously biased to assume that the only equipment an assault will ever use is a nanohive.
May I remind you of your statement that a sniper wouldnGÇÖt need uplink skills.
I can also tell that you have a reduced ability to separate out different conversations, and reasons for those conversations, due to the heavilyGǪ strange response below, complete with a self-depreciating header?
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:
Oh boy, it's the classic 'waaah you didnt agree with evrything i belive in' response.
I can tell from your response that you are a terribly biased sniper. Just as biased as some of the people in here bitching that snipers should never be viable.
All I said was that the projected skill comparison was flawed. It was.
Despite a simple factual correction, you went off on a long rant about how I'm clearly a biased assault player.
Your assertion that you can 'clearly tell that I've never done sniping' is so wrong I almost laughed at it. I have proficiency 4 sniper rifles. I use snipers several times a week. I am aware that they are not viable.
Whining about how the damage only marginally goes up between tiers is laughable. That's exactly the case for every weapon. There is no weapon which jumps more than about 10% in damage from standard to proto.
Now, if you're going to ask why your sniper rifle isn't doing the same DPS as an assault rifle, I have a question for you.
Why doesn't a rifle do as much damage as a shotgun?
Because of the range. If shotguns did the same damage as an assault rifle despite having point blank range, it would be unbalanced.
The range of the sniper rifle is a huge advantage. Obviously. That's what it's for. What do you want, the sniper to do as much damage as a shotgun?
If you're emptying your entire inventory of bullets for 4-5 kills, you're bad. As someone who allegedly 'never snipes', I can quite easily get more than that and do so regularly.
First thing I must mention, is where did I say the sniper needs to have the same damage as the shotgun, or as my example brought up, the assault rifle? I made no such claim. I was stating that the damage scaling is incorrect for snipers.
Apparently, the size of the target, window of opportunity, and speed of the target have no value for weighting damage in regards to balance? Those are rather major points to overlook.
Having skill in the sniper tree does not mean that one knows how to use the sniper. Sitting around like a lump on a hill does not mean you know how to snipe, it means you know how to pull the trigger of the sniper.
Do you even know of any points on the map that one can snipe from aside from the hills?
Have you ever weaved your way around a line of assaults to get a better firing angle at the rear of their attack?
Have you ever actually covered a point, then went in to counter-hack it when someone breaks through?
Do you know the optimum ranges of mobile sniping?
I highly doubt you could get such a score without a Proto scope, (which snipers donGÇÖt need in the least) with heavily stacked armor exploit fittings, or one of those lazy, damage amp only suits.
That's not sniping, that's being a lump.
--Continued Below--
http://youtu.be/dtXupQg77SU
Dust to Dust
Remember the dream you had before the day you were born.
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Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
858
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Posted - 2014.07.06 23:52:00 -
[110] - Quote
Continued due to being too long for one post.
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:
The sniper does not instantly kill things from half a kilometre away because it's a case of risk vs reward. The ability to sit back in the redline (and like it or not, that will be done) with a sniper and instasplat players at very little risk would be broken.
If we look at Jathniel here, someone debating this in a more civilised fashion (albeit still in an overly frustrated tone) instead of exploding at people in a pathetic manner, they're trying to make sensible suggestions on how to help the sniper become viable without going straight to the other extreme of being overpowered.
I snipe somewhat regularly. I do it as a relaxing activity and rarely get bothered by enemy players as I hide in a scout suit in places that aren't the centrepiece for firefights.
I do okay with it. But I see issues. It's not quite as good as it should be. It has too few mechanics supporting it to make it an interesting role. It has bugs associated with it, normally the kind of terrible hit detection bugs that are almost prehistoric.
It would be nice to see those fixed. With Rattati making actual sensible tweaks, there could be a real chance to make some good changes to help the role.
It's frustrating to me, then, to see trash posts from people like you who don't have any real concept of anything approaching a balanced system clogging up what a thread that could otherwise be something that could be shown to Rattati to ask for some moderate buffs.
I want to see snipers helped so they're a role which is viable and interesting. Not so that they're EZmode instakill machines that you can sit in the redline with which promptly get nerfed back into the dark ages never to be touched again. A reasonable case could be made to improve them.
Being so sensitive as to go off on a rant at the slightest sign of someone not completely agreeing with all the buffs ever does not help the cause.
I donGÇÖt expect you to have read anything from my posting history, but as I stand with sniping, the number of shots it takes for body impacts right now is at a decent level, IGÇÖve been pushing for armor and shield modules to have a downside that increases headshot damage.(possibly 1-2% per module?)
I canGÇÖt say itGÇÖs refreshing to see someone go on a blatant GÇ£hate rantGÇ¥ with no logical reason for the trigger, but that is what you just did. Please re-read the last line of the prior quote to yourself. O.o;
If youGÇÖve ever gone sniping with a regular sniper, and not one of those enhanced zoom handicaps (300 damage on the officer sniper is justGǪ horrible really) You would know that hitting a player in the head from a distance who is moving, is a rather difficult endeavor, and hitting a stationary target is much easier to line the shot up with. Hence, the changes I asked for regarding armor fittings. Such would bring down the value of tanking fittings a bit, and encourage a portion of fitting diversity.
http://youtu.be/dtXupQg77SU
Dust to Dust
Remember the dream you had before the day you were born.
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Miokai Zahou
The Southern Legion
Final Resolution.
313
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Posted - 2014.07.07 00:06:00 -
[111] - Quote
Tl;dr
Snipers are fine. The red line is fine.
I went 31/0 using the charge sniper rifle going solo yesterday and got a love mail from some random on my team wanting to squad up with me.
The only thing snipers need is better location outside the red line that they can defend or a module that give them an alert proximity of enemy team members within X meters.
Noob isn't really a status, it's the online equivalent of a 5-year old calling you a poopy fart head.
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Lynn Beck
Fooly Cooly.
Anime Empire.
2016
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Posted - 2014.07.07 08:07:00 -
[112] - Quote
Miokai Zahou wrote:Tl;dr
Snipers are fine. The red line is fine.
I went 31/0 using the charge sniper rifle going solo yesterday and got a love mail from some random on my team wanting to squad up with me.
The only thing snipers need is better location outside the red line that they can defend or a module that give them an alert proximity of enemy team members within X meters.
Beeper or windowbox, client update.
Not happening.
Scrambler Rifles have:
Highest In-game DPS
Highest hradshot modifier ingame
2nd best damage type's range.
Copious amounts of ammo.
Charge function to bring said damage/range into even more absurd levels.
In return, the SCR loses:
A few PG
A Heat function
Meanwhile- the sniper has:
Lowest DPS out of anything in-game, even Mass Drivers
Ridiculously low RPM
Standard headshot modifier, not properly encouraging this "Skillshot" the Amarrians keep speaking of
Nonstandardized zoom
In exchange, you get:
Long range ability
Instant Hatecard/ragemail every match
Not very balanced/fun/dynamic/skill based.
Increase headshot modifier to around Scr rifle levels
Standardize all zoom levels to Adv Tier
Start with that.
If snipers are still performing terribly(read: no better) then we can add some variants, tweak some damage, introduce new SS skills, blahblah.
Let's at least get them reasonably working within themselves.
General John Ripper
-BAM! I'm Emeril Lagasse.
This message was approved by the 'Nobody Loved You' Foundation
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Alena Ventrallis
S0VER31GN
1432
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Posted - 2014.07.07 08:21:00 -
[113] - Quote
A big part of the problem is that the Thales is the only sniper with a zoom good enough to reliably aim at much of anything, especially at extreme ranges. We need to buff the scopes at the very least.
Rattati has spoken. CalScout hitbox is fine. You're gun game is broken.
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Jathniel
G I A N T
General Tso's Alliance
1097
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Posted - 2014.07.07 10:29:00 -
[114] - Quote
aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:I didnt say they disproportionately affect the out come of the game. Rather in instances they affect the outcome of a single battle between myself and some other actual warrior with reflexes and the need for hand eye coordination with the risk for his personal well being, the outcome of my goal, his stats, his isk, his pride, and you get to shoot me while low on health take his kill, cause you look for weakened armor right?
I mean thats, the profiency for the sniper and all. Now what did you risk by sitting back there, up there, or wherever and eating popcorn with your right hand on a mouse, chilling? You want to talk about being afraid to die? Why do you think your kind sets in the redline?
Fear of losing the proto gear they use? How many snipers are using adv and std level weapons? In pubs as you say why? Because you are not dynamic enough players. Pc is an ever changing meta, boots on the ground can quickly swap roles, and with that being said I have seen great snipers, ive even seen snipers in PC, pubs also.
Give Wulfgard a Thales on Manus Peaks. Put SymbioticForks ANYWHERE, Ive seen him beast on Peaks, Fracture Road, Iron Delta. With a charge no less. Watch FunkmasterWhale on Skim Junction setting up on those rings, going Ham with a forge, ewwwww.... You know the real problem here? You arent that good.... Im talking about guys consistently putting up huge numbers every game, 20 or 30 kills. Then just go look at their kdr, if they arent dying whats that say about their isk? More importantly, what does it say about you? You dont want an I win button you want a help me get a kill button.
This whole post here reflects confusion.
You seriously just complained about a sniper doing his job, providing support fire and kills, and then praised players that actually do it.
Then you throw a clueless remark at me.
My friend, I AM a sniper that was invited to ring consistently for EoN when PC was in its prime. I got my consistent 20, 30, and more kills. Then I quit playing for nearly 7 months because CCP Remnant decided to design all future maps to prevent sniper activity, instead of rebalancing the gun. Stop making this about me. Your ad hominem for lack of argument is getting old. And if you couldn't tell that the OP was a light-hearted attempt to start a discussion, then you're even more clueless than your posts reflect.
The only reason I even bother to bring this up is because I have seen CCP Rattati, really take a proactive approach in fixing this games issues. Just him saying anything about it, shows more promise than anything before. It's a damn shame he wasn't here from the beginning.
Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
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aaaasdff ertgfdd
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
41
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Posted - 2014.07.07 11:56:00 -
[115] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote:I didnt say they disproportionately affect the out come of the game. Rather in instances they affect the outcome of a single battle between myself and some other actual warrior with reflexes and the need for hand eye coordination with the risk for his personal well being, the outcome of my goal, his stats, his isk, his pride, and you get to shoot me while low on health take his kill, cause you look for weakened armor right?
I mean thats, the profiency for the sniper and all. Now what did you risk by sitting back there, up there, or wherever and eating popcorn with your right hand on a mouse, chilling? You want to talk about being afraid to die? Why do you think your kind sets in the redline?
Fear of losing the proto gear they use? How many snipers are using adv and std level weapons? In pubs as you say why? Because you are not dynamic enough players. Pc is an ever changing meta, boots on the ground can quickly swap roles, and with that being said I have seen great snipers, ive even seen snipers in PC, pubs also.
Give Wulfgard a Thales on Manus Peaks. Put SymbioticForks ANYWHERE, Ive seen him beast on Peaks, Fracture Road, Iron Delta. With a charge no less. Watch FunkmasterWhale on Skim Junction setting up on those rings, going Ham with a forge, ewwwww.... You know the real problem here? You arent that good.... Im talking about guys consistently putting up huge numbers every game, 20 or 30 kills. Then just go look at their kdr, if they arent dying whats that say about their isk? More importantly, what does it say about you? You dont want an I win button you want a help me get a kill button. This whole post here reflects confusion. You seriously just complained about a sniper doing his job, providing support fire and kills, and then praised players that actually do it. Then you throw a clueless remark at me. My friend, I AM a sniper that was invited to ring consistently for EoN when PC was in its prime. I got my consistent 20, 30, and more kills. Then I quit playing for nearly 7 months because CCP Remnant decided to design all future maps to prevent sniper activity, instead of rebalancing the gun. Stop making this about me. Your ad hominem for lack of argument is getting old. And if you couldn't tell that the OP was a light-hearted attempt to start a discussion, then you're even more clueless than your posts reflect. The only reason I even bother to bring this up is because I have seen CCP Rattati, really take a proactive approach in fixing this games issues. Just him saying anything about it, shows more promise than anything before. It's a damn shame he wasn't here from the beginning.
I stick to what I said, good snipers in this game do well. Not all are that good, take it how you want. Btw its 5% between tiers of weapon for the sniper just like everyother gun in this game. Damage increases by 5%. Btw the players I praised, are guys who manage to do well, and some of them like Forks you never find in the red line. So ya some of you need to learn from them step up your game. I am a 60 mil sp player with 6 proto suits and every light weapon protoed, I have a sniper fit that I can grab from a depot and take out other snipers. When you advance in Dust for myself anyway I don't see sniping as a full time job, its just a role I play when I need to. |
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