DUST Search - [Feedback] Shield Tanking

All Channels

Feedback/Requests

[Feedback] Shield Tanking

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 [6] 7 :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. 1650	Posted - 2014.06.11 14:51:00 - [151] - Quote Redacted PSN ID: AlbelNox2569 Cross Atu for CPM1
Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1100	Posted - 2014.06.11 15:16:00 - [152] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: Alldin Kan wrote: Offering misleading feedback would result in unnecessary tweaks or balance issues (see current state of scouts). Anyways, reactives should remain on low due to armor suits already having huge HP, for the variant I suggested it's ok due to shields needing extra HP but still not being able to get too close to armor suit HP total (shields are quick to recover). Moving reactice to high would be overkill due to lower cpu/pg req than shields. Would these regulators be giving a percentage of base shields or total shields? Because if it's total, a Caldari assault fully shield tanked right now would go from 552.3 to 634.8 shields (not too terribly large of a jump if they only used a single module, potential for issues if stacked), but a Caldari heavy would go from 946.7 to 1088.7 and tbh with resistances boosting eHP the way they are already this could be something of an issue. I specified base shields. Alldin Kan has joined the battle!
Sum1ne Else G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1190	Posted - 2014.06.11 15:38:00 - [153] - Quote ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Thunderdome^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^? lol *grabs popcorn
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. 1651	Posted - 2014.06.11 15:52:00 - [154] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: Alldin Kan wrote: Offering misleading feedback would result in unnecessary tweaks or balance issues (see current state of scouts). Anyways, reactives should remain on low due to armor suits already having huge HP, for the variant I suggested it's ok due to shields needing extra HP but still not being able to get too close to armor suit HP total (shields are quick to recover). Moving reactice to high would be overkill due to lower cpu/pg req than shields. Would these regulators be giving a percentage of base shields or total shields? Because if it's total, a Caldari assault fully shield tanked right now would go from 552.3 to 634.8 shields (not too terribly large of a jump if they only used a single module, potential for issues if stacked), but a Caldari heavy would go from 946.7 to 1088.7 and tbh with resistances boosting eHP the way they are already this could be something of an issue. I specified base shields. Missed it, I see no issue with this then. PSN ID: AlbelNox2569 Cross Atu for CPM1
D legendary hero warravens Final Resolution. 1897	Posted - 2014.06.11 16:24:00 - [155] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: As announced, we want to tweak all aspects of shield tanking so it becomes viable. I don't foresee any boosting of Extender hp, but their progression is up for discussion. However, we really want regulators and rechargers to be competitive choices to Armor. Most anything is on the table, PG/CPU, recharge delay, depleted recharge delay, recharge rates etc. Even CPU upgrades to get more CPU for those hard to fit regulators. Your proposals must be tweaks, nothing game altering and have to be focused on fixing shield tanking, without making hybrid tanking an even better choice. Energizer's need to be adjusted to 30%, 50%, and 75% respectively. And have their penalty reduced. Caldari needs its shield recharge delay reduced by 1 second (depletion and regular recharge). Minmatar needs its shield recharge delay reduced by 2 seconds (depletion and regular recharge). Shields lend themselves to a duck and cover/hit and run play style. we need faster recovery. Minmatar and caldari both should have a bonus to shield extenders (or just an additional base 80 extra shields). Because shields don't hold up to the high powered weaponry we have now. And shields cannot be stacked with the same efficacy as armor. Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubados_Pronto saberá justiça
Phoenix 85 Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 122	Posted - 2014.06.11 16:27:00 - [156] - Quote WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. EDUCATE YOURSELF ABOUT PC VS CONSOLE
D legendary hero warravens Final Resolution. 1897	Posted - 2014.06.11 16:30:00 - [157] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: you just explained why minmatar are guerrilla warfare specialists. this is why the combat rifle does so much damage. combined with minmatar speed you get in fast, blast your target and leave before anyone can do anything about it. then you do it again to someone else. minmatar dont do slug matches. they are hit and run. more so than caldari. their stats are designed purposely so they cant stand toe to toe with anyone. theyre designed to force you into the hit and run play style No, I just described why Minmatar SHOULD be hit-and-run specialists. The Minmatar scout is a great hit-and-run suit because of it's native scans and damps combined with it's spectacular speed and balanced slot loadout. The Minmatar assault is not fast enough to be able to get the run part of "hit-and-run" down since every scout that's not completely loaded down with plates and any assault with a single basic kincat can keep up with. There is not enough good cover in this game to bounce from cover to cover avoiding gunfire. It has no bonus to scans or damps so even if you do run you are 75% of the time just picked off by a scout who saw what you were doing and got ahead of you. With 3 complex precision enhancers this suit cannot scan a scout with a single damp on (3 complex puts my scan at 26.35db, scout with 1 proto damp = 23.63), so that increases the % of people I can scan over no precision enhancers by about 3% since my maxed passives already pick up anyone not a scout or damped, so that's useless. I can't Damp tank to avoid scanners or scout passives since I only have 2 lows, one always held by a regulator. And since my ability to recover from damage is worse than anyone's, my suit fails at recovering in a pinch. So, basically all the things that could be used to put together a great hit-and-run class the Minmatar either fails at miserably or attempts but falls short of. No, sir, YOU are the one who has no clue what he is speaking of. I covered this issue in so many threads. but no one beleived me. Im glad someone who runs minmatar realized this. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=137506 Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubados_Pronto saberá justiça
D legendary hero warravens Final Resolution. 1897	Posted - 2014.06.11 16:33:00 - [158] - Quote Phoenix 85 wrote: WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. I also have been talking about this for months https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=137506 Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubados_Pronto saberá justiça
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS 336	Posted - 2014.06.11 17:00:00 - [159] - Quote Phoenix 85 wrote: WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. because they cant run like the minmatar can. caldari are more stationary. minmatar can just run away (when possible)
Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1102	Posted - 2014.06.11 17:11:00 - [160] - Quote Phoenix 85 wrote: WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. **** I almost forgot about this. Alldin Kan has joined the battle!

Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1104	Posted - 2014.06.11 17:15:00 - [161] - Quote D legendary hero wrote: Energizer's need to be adjusted to 30%, 50%, and 75% respectively. And have their penalty reduced. No. Alldin Kan has joined the battle!
duster 35000 Algintal Core Gallente Federation 23	Posted - 2014.06.11 17:49:00 - [162] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Energizer's need to be adjusted to 30%, 50%, and 75% respectively. And have their penalty reduced. No. Yes except penalty part Complex cpu is way too much too. Jerrmy12 Banned, reason, hotfix alpha thread. No joke, the reason was a devs first post, I was linked to the first post.
Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1104	Posted - 2014.06.11 17:53:00 - [163] - Quote duster 35000 wrote: Alldin Kan wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Energizer's need to be adjusted to 30%, 50%, and 75% respectively. And have their penalty reduced. No. Yes except penalty part Complex cpu is way too much too. Alldin Kan has joined the battle!
duster 35000 Algintal Core Gallente Federation 23	Posted - 2014.06.11 17:56:00 - [164] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: duster 35000 wrote: Alldin Kan wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Energizer's need to be adjusted to 30%, 50%, and 75% respectively. And have their penalty reduced. No. Yes except penalty part Complex cpu is way too much too. 96 cpu, more than 1/3rd of cpu on most suits. Jerrmy12 Banned, reason, hotfix alpha thread. No joke, the reason was a devs first post, I was linked to the first post.
The-Errorist SVER True Blood 749	Posted - 2014.06.11 17:59:00 - [165] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Hi, we are back with numbers here, we are aiming for tweaks as the bonuses are mostly % based, so stacking can lead to invincible suits. Numbers The numbers look good except for shield extenders and the prototype shield regulators. Enhanced shield extenders only offer 11 more HP over standard; barely anyone is going to use ADV for the same reason its not used right now. Also the HP buff to standard throws off the balance between standard reactive plates. Having a shield extenders be 22/44/66 at STD/ADV/PRO (22 per tier) and have the penalty at 0/4/8%, would incentive the use of all extenders instead of just STD and PRO. If you really think raising standard extenders to 33 is a good idea, then have the progression be 33/49.5/66 (16.5 per tier). The progression for shield regulars should be 10% per tier instead of a weird 10% from STA-ADV and 5% from ADV-PRO. Having the progression be 15/25/35 would be a lot better than 15/25/30. MAG + Dust cb vet, an alt of Velvet Overkill & Agent Overkill. http://vimeo.com/93181621
The-Errorist SVER True Blood 749	Posted - 2014.06.11 18:04:00 - [166] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: Phoenix 85 wrote: WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. **** I almost forgot about this. This would fix a lot of things. MAG + Dust cb vet, an alt of Velvet Overkill & Agent Overkill. http://vimeo.com/93181621
Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1105	Posted - 2014.06.11 18:17:00 - [167] - Quote duster 35000 wrote: 96 cpu, more than 1/3rd of cpu on most suits. You mean ADV suits? The cost is reasonable considering how fast I get my shields back, it's the best module for any heavy. Alldin Kan has joined the battle!
duster 35000 Algintal Core Gallente Federation 23	Posted - 2014.06.11 18:21:00 - [168] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: duster 35000 wrote: 96 cpu, more than 1/3rd of cpu on most suits. You mean ADV suits? The cost is reasonable considering how fast I get my shields back, it's the best module for any heavy. Yea, for heavies, for every other suit you can fit a max of 2. Jerrmy12 Banned, reason, hotfix alpha thread. No joke, the reason was a devs first post, I was linked to the first post.
bogeyman m Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 261	Posted - 2014.06.11 18:33:00 - [169] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: you just explained why minmatar are guerrilla warfare specialists. this is why the combat rifle does so much damage. combined with minmatar speed you get in fast, blast your target and leave before anyone can do anything about it. then you do it again to someone else. minmatar dont do slug matches. they are hit and run. more so than caldari. their stats are designed purposely so they cant stand toe to toe with anyone. theyre designed to force you into the hit and run play style No, I just described why Minmatar SHOULD be hit-and-run specialists. The Minmatar scout is a great hit-and-run suit because of it's native scans and damps combined with it's spectacular speed and balanced slot loadout. The Minmatar assault is not fast enough to be able to get the run part of "hit-and-run" down since every scout that's not completely loaded down with plates and any assault with a single basic kincat can keep up with. There is not enough good cover in this game to bounce from cover to cover avoiding gunfire. It has no bonus to scans or damps so even if you do run you are 75% of the time just picked off by a scout who saw what you were doing and got ahead of you. With 3 complex precision enhancers this suit cannot scan a scout with a single damp on (3 complex puts my scan at 26.35db, scout with 1 proto damp = 23.63), so that increases the % of people I can scan over no precision enhancers by about 3% since my maxed passives already pick up anyone not a scout or damped, so that's useless. I can't Damp tank to avoid scanners or scout passives since I only have 2 lows, one always held by a regulator. And since my ability to recover from damage is worse than anyone's, my suit fails at recovering in a pinch. So, basically all the things that could be used to put together a great hit-and-run class the Minmatar either fails at miserably or attempts but falls short of. No, sir, YOU are the one who has no clue what he is speaking of. Minmatar base suit summary: Scout = hit and run Assault = hit and jog Heavy = hit and saunter Duct tape 2.0 ... Have WD-40; will travel. Cross Atu for CPM1 Appia Vibbia for CPM1
bogeyman m Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 261	Posted - 2014.06.11 18:39:00 - [170] - Quote Phoenix 85 wrote: WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. Like. Duct tape 2.0 ... Have WD-40; will travel. Cross Atu for CPM1 Appia Vibbia for CPM1

Joseph Ridgeson warravens Final Resolution. 1990	Posted - 2014.06.11 19:22:00 - [171] - Quote PG/CPU costs of Extenders are bonkers still. They really need to change. I would also argue that 33->44->66 is a hell of a lot better than what it was but is still severely lacking. Compare that the the scaling plates get: Basic: 85 Advanced: 110 (29.4% increase from Basic) Complex: 135 (22.27% increase from Advanced and 58.8% increase from Basic) Shields are looking to be 33% from Basic to Advanced, 50% increase from Advanced to Complex, and a 100% increase from Basic to Complex. The numbers still overly favor using Complex only. I understand the Catch 22; Extenders have such a low that if it was an equivilant increase similar to Plates that there would be next to no reason to use Complex. However... that is how it works for Armor. Most of the time, Basic Plates are more than enough. Is it so ridiculous to think that Basic Extenders should have the same mentality? If we go with Armor and Plates give the same amount of "defense" and we accept that 66 is the correct number for Complex Shield extenders to have, we can divide one by the other to get a baseline. 2.045. So dividing armor values by that gives us: Basic Extender: 41.56 (41) Advanced Extender: 53.79 (53) Complex Extender: 66 "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
jaksol JAK darnson Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 17	Posted - 2014.06.11 19:55:00 - [172] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: As announced, we want to tweak all aspects of shield tanking so it becomes viable. I don't foresee any boosting of Extender hp, but their progression is up for discussion. However, we really want regulators and rechargers to be competitive choices to Armor. Most anything is on the table, PG/CPU, recharge delay, depleted recharge delay, recharge rates etc. Even CPU upgrades to get more CPU for those hard to fit regulators. Your proposals must be tweaks, nothing game altering and have to be focused on fixing shield tanking, without making hybrid tanking an even better choice. maby giving a shield based asault suits a like 4% increase to all shield moduals NOT SCOUTS (becouse most of them have 600+ armor allready) "Sacrifice is a choice you make. Loss is a choice made for you."
jaksol JAK darnson Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 17	Posted - 2014.06.11 19:58:00 - [173] - Quote The-Errorist wrote: Alldin Kan wrote: Phoenix 85 wrote: WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. **** I almost forgot about this. This would fix a lot of things. caldari main streangth is its shield minmatar main streangth is it mobility "Sacrifice is a choice you make. Loss is a choice made for you."
Boot Booter Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 559	Posted - 2014.06.11 20:24:00 - [174] - Quote On the Caldari vs minmatar shield fitting philosophy discussion, I'm sure this will get worked out when they give medium frames a pass (hopefully in the hot fix following bravo). Right now it's more important to get the modules right i.e. making shield modules good enough for shield suits to stop dual tanking (looking at you cal assault). SMG Specialist
Phoenix 85 Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 127	Posted - 2014.06.11 21:45:00 - [175] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Phoenix 85 wrote: WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. because they cant run like the minmatar can. caldari are more stationary. minmatar can just run away (when possible) Throw a proto kincat on a cal suit and its just as fast. EDUCATE YOURSELF ABOUT PC VS CONSOLE
Floyd20 Azizora L.O.T.I.S. 58	Posted - 2014.06.11 21:48:00 - [176] - Quote Phoenix 85 wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: Phoenix 85 wrote: WHY IS IT THAT CALDARI SUITS HAVE STATS BETTER SUITED FOR HIT AND RUN AND THE MOST POTENTIAL SHIELD HP WHEN MINMATAR HAS THE LEAST SHIELD HP AND WEAK REGEN. Seriously, Ive been at this for months now, please fix minmatar suits. CAL should be relying on HP, MIN on regen. Please fix by swaping the layouts on some of the suits (especially assault) as well as swaping their shield recharge delays. because they cant run like the minmatar can. caldari are more stationary. minmatar can just run away (when possible) Throw a proto kincat on a cal suit and its just as fast. cal scout is down a low slot on minmatar. assault dont tend to care, cal logi have a habit of fitting armor plates, heavies dont tend to do anything fast, except mow down stuff in front of it.
RAIDER 04 The Exemplars Top Men. 14	Posted - 2014.06.11 22:08:00 - [177] - Quote Sum1ne Else wrote: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Thunderdome^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^? lol *grabs popcorn No, I'm not doing that again... The Corporate Raiders PAC Endorses Free Tacos Nixon for CPM
RAIDER 04 The Exemplars Top Men. 14	Posted - 2014.06.11 22:10:00 - [178] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Energizer's need to be adjusted to 30%, 50%, and 75% respectively. And have their penalty reduced. No. Alldin, you still play? Damn... The Corporate Raiders PAC Endorses Free Tacos Nixon for CPM
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 104	Posted - 2014.06.11 22:11:00 - [179] - Quote not bad but not great, yes the regulators look better and more appealing, but they still don't help when it comes to squad play.. most of the time the cal sentinel will still be better off with plates for the extra healing support they can get from a logi on armour. no shield support means the caldari heavy is not worth repping at it's base armour stats and therefore will always be unaided even in a squad, whereas their opposites the gallente can run logibro tactics. generally speaking a player alone doesn't win vs a full squad. the extender values aren't really gonna do much except for on basic fits. the complex recharger could of done with a little more of a buff I think energisers now look good and I'm glad to see the penalties stay put, not like shield tankers have a lot of hp to spare. trying to reserve judgement for now though I don't think it will be enough. Thank you all for starting to fix shields though
Sum1ne Else G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1191	Posted - 2014.06.11 22:32:00 - [180] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: http://www.protofits.com/fittings/view/0/4935 Correction. One invincible suit. Edit: To clarify I think those percentages are acceptable. But I'd watch the Caldari Sentinel closely after you make this change. Not Really, dont forget this is NOT through battle, unlike armour. What CCP need to work on is this Depleted delay; it rarely is used. If you get hit into armour its not used, similarly if your shields aren't completely gone it will not be used. The number is lower because its a BS stat IMHO. It needs to be once the shields are completely gone then your Depleted Shield Delay would kick in everytime.



Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 [6] 7 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page