There is something being overlooked here. The ability to kill a dropship and how that can be done, and how long it takes is one side of the discussion. The other side we must consider is threat level.

How much threat is a dropship. Forget Ambush, it's broken. In Skirmish and Domination does an ADS, which is a full on proto asset pose as much threat as a full on proto infantry player? I have been tracking kills. I posted this data before but I'll mention it here again.

In 36 matches where I did not fly but another pilot on our team did, the other ADS never went higher that 6th on the kill chart, getting at best around 15 kills, averaging 7 kills. In all cases Infantry of similar proto level easily out killed the dropship. Please avoid posting examples from each end of the bell curve, they are not representative.

My point here is to remember to factor in the threat level when deciding on the measure of the response.

CCP perhaps you might take a look at what are considered top pilots. Do a database query of the top 10. Pull all dom and skrimish matches for these players and count the ADS weapon kills per match. Exactly how dangerous are we?

Point: A common complaint is that Dropships boost out of trouble and are hard to kill.
Counterpoint: Dropships have no other viable way of tanking damage, and are very easily killed if not incredibly careful.

We can change the assault swarm launcher to have fast, long range missiles so there is a way to chase dropships away, but pilots have also told us that sometimes infantry isn't rendered properly so they don't even appear to pilots before the missiles are hitting their dropship.

Please discuss, we want both sides to weigh in.

The lock range is fine.

but i heard they're talking about making the Assault version have better range but weaker damage

it wouldn't affect you much. it'd be like infantry getting shot with a Militia sniper rifle. No one really cares, we just shrug it off.

a) Anti-Air specialist variant. Increased lock range (300 m), increased lock time (roughly 30% increase), significantly increased effectiveness against DS and less against ground vehicles and turrets.

It was a disaster before, and would be again.

This is all nice but there is still a huge issue with armor based dropships. They currently only take 55% damage from swarms. That means when i put only a single basic heavy rep on a armor dropship it becomes literally imune vs. swarm launchers. That needs to be brought in line with shield dropships which take proper damage.

A problem I have is that I can outrun swarms in a python with no AB. If I had an AB sure, I would be fine with it, but as is, when I see tiny specs of light wink out of existence behind me, I feel like I just cheated someone out of their rightfully deserved kill...I usually try to make it up to them by giving them some more missiles (although I probably shouldn't have armed them first).

Standard dropships need an EHP buff though...they can't survive much punishment, and lack the mobility of ADSs to avoid fire, making them a rare sight indeed. (ADSs could use more HP as well, since FG and 80GJ railguns are the big killers...most of which can 1HKO you with a well placed shot)

The lock range is fine. As I showed in my links 175m is a long way away, it's a third of the map. As i showed a swarm can easily see, lock and hit me at that range while I can't tell you from a rock unless you start shooting.

Increasing the lock range will put us back at the intolerable 1.6 situation. Swarms can lock down several objectives from the redline and be so far away they can hit a dropship 6 times before they even render.

Changes need to be made. But not to lock range.

Rendering is not fixed. And requires clint changes to be fixed. Did you see these?

Comparison of what we look like to each other at 85 meters.

Example of rendering issue


In that second example you can clearly see a swarmer at 50m pop into existence and fire swarms almost as soon as he does. This means he is getting lock on before I can even see him even when I am 50m away. I can only run in these cases. I am facing the wrong way, fighting an enemy who has a massive head start on me that he gained due to unbalanced rendering. Give that guy 250m lock range and I don't have a chance.

Pilots fit ABs to run mainly because we suddenly find ourselves flying strait at a forge or swarm player like idiots because as far as we can tell its all clear.. until suddenly a fully charged breach ready to shoot pops into existance that rendering made impossible to see.

We effectively go into battle blind half the time. We run because we cannot see who is shooting us, just shots from the void.

Yessss standard dropships need more health. Vipers, and even Myrons are sub par at the moment, easily taken out. It's a high risk low reward play style. Since you are almost guaranteed to get very few points, and get killed at least once.

For those talking about lock on range increases. What is your opinion on this segment of the video - Watch from this point until 2:40. Just a 2 minute segment.

I would like ADSes to get a major price cut; they are way to expensive. Thread on the subject https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=142594&find=unread

I would also like ADSes to be realistically killable by infantry AV.

There is something being overlooked here. The ability to kill a dropship and how that can be done, and how long it takes is one side of the discussion. The other side we must consider is threat level.

How much threat is a dropship. Forget Ambush, it's broken. In Skirmish and Domination does an ADS, which is a full on proto asset pose as much threat as a full on proto infantry player? I have been tracking kills. I posted this data before but I'll mention it here again.

In 36 matches where I did not fly but another pilot on our team did, the other ADS never went higher that 6th on the kill chart, getting at best around 15 kills, averaging 7 kills. In all cases Infantry of similar proto level easily out killed the dropship. Please avoid posting examples from each end of the bell curve, they are not representative.

My point here is to remember to factor in the threat level when deciding on the measure of the response.

CCP perhaps you might take a look at what are considered top pilots. Do a database query of the top 10. Pull all dom and skrimish matches for these players and count the ADS weapon kills per match. Exactly how dangerous are we?