I feel your pain and many threads have been devoted to this subject... my own included. :)

CCP , the CPM and most of the community have confirmed and acknowledged the issue - all we can do is wait for 1.8 for their potential fixes. It may be in the form of improving infantry AV or limiting the stats on militia HAV's, or a combination of both. I'm surprised it has been allowed to run on for so long... it reminds me of the murder taxi sagas where they were left to run riot for 2-3 patch cycles (about 3 monthss if I recall)....

Well, I agree with everything besides the modules. HAV's should only be allowed a single Hardener, or at the very least somehow add in a stacking penalty (would probably be troublesome to code however).

Until MAV's come into the picture, HAV's simply HAVE to be equivalent to the current weapons and playstyles available. Changing their turret to be Anti-Vehicle only would do absolute wonders in the current environment, as well as make an easy transition when MAV's are finally released.

MAV's should be the infantry killer, and be as easily soloable from the infantry perspective. But until then, HAV's imo need to be able to be solo'd by a pro(skillfull) AVer for cohesive game balance. I'm not saying a MLT Forge Gun should tear through an HAV with ease, but having a Proto Forge gun with prof 5 and 2 complex damage mods need to dominate as much as a STD HAV hull with proto Mods fitted onto it. This is a rock/paper/scissors, not rock/rock/rock.

One hardener? LOL who are you? Do you even tank? Who the hell are you to decide how I'm supposed to fit my tank?

Tankers need to stop insisting that they can solo AV, and subsequently have CCP nerf AV so that they can continue to solo them.








Anyone see what I did there?

Not if they don't have the prerequisite AV, takes 2 adv/proto forge gunners sure but that takes a lot of sp and isn't something all new players should/would skill into. And keep in mind, we are talking MILITIA tanks. Militia and standard AV is garbage and takes half the team to down one militia tank which is imbalanced when the tank can spin its blaster and mow down the entire enemy team.

I use the best counter to tanks, which is to hide indoors. That's what infantry, even good infantry, has been reduced to.

Still think a tank should require more than one operator.

16 infantry v 16 infantry = 16 v 16

A Madrugar has 8 times the armor of a proto heavy and a proto blaster deals 47 times the damage of a proto HMG.

You're turning one bad player into the equivalent of 4 or more proto heavies. for this thread i'll say at least two.

if you equate how many people it would take to counter 6 tanks at once with infantry AV. For this post i will say two; a proto forge gun and AV grenades (swarms are a joke). now you have

12av + 4 infantry v 6 tanks(6 infantry) + 10 infantry = 16 v 22 (without av and tanks 4 v 10)

We all know that at best get one squad worth of AV and 90% of the time its disorganized and does not time attacks properly to catch the tank when its not in god mode (hardened). So our numbers still look bleak for the team without tanks.

Think of a tank as one dropsuit, one infantry man, that is all that is required to operate it. So it is no more than a dropsuit with tracks and a cannon. Doesn't seem to fair in that perspective, but, it is a tank, it should be strong and deadly, hell thats why they were invented in the first place.... in real life... in this game a items purpose in real life doesn't always matter (see sniper rifle). Requiring more than one operator makes a tank take from the infantry exactly what it is getting in return through vehicle support.

If a Tank required at a minimum two operators the balance would be in the numbers

6AV + 10 Infantry v 6 tanks(12 infantry) + 4 infantry + 16 v 16

the downside to spamming tanks is that you infantry support diminishes offering AV a chance to be effective. This forces a team to find balance between tanks and infantry. Similar to a team with 6 or more snipers, it becomes ineffective after too many people do it.

Responses i've gotten to this suggestion
"i'm not letting some blueberry drive my tank around"
"OK, Let some blueberry operate you dropsuit while you fire the gun"

My response before you post them are
1. It should take teamwork to kill your tank... it should take teamwork to operate it
2. when my dropsuit has 4000 armor and 1200 shield and my proto gun deals around 58000 DPS.... sure!!

Why cant LAV drivers fire their turrets? Assault LAV's!!!!

You did nothing. The higher echelon tankers are easily worth at least 5 enemy red tanks before they go down. I had to be surrounded by 3 and pinned by one of them to be destroyed.

Tanks are better able to deal with tanks, for obvious reasons.

Still think a tank should require more than one operator.

16 infantry v 16 infantry = 16 v 16

A Madrugar has 8 times the armor of a proto heavy and a proto blaster deals 47 times the damage of a proto HMG.

You're turning one bad player into the equivalent of 4 or more proto heavies. for this thread i'll say at least two.

if you equate how many people it would take to counter 6 tanks at once with infantry AV. For this post i will say two; a proto forge gun and AV grenades (swarms are a joke). now you have

12av + 4 infantry v 6 tanks(6 infantry) + 10 infantry = 16 v 22 (without av and tanks 4 v 10)

We all know that at best get one squad worth of AV and 90% of the time its disorganized and does not time attacks properly to catch the tank when its not in god mode (hardened). So our numbers still look bleak for the team without tanks.

Think of a tank as one dropsuit, one infantry man, that is all that is required to operate it. So it is no more than a dropsuit with tracks and a cannon. Doesn't seem to fair in that perspective, but, it is a tank, it should be strong and deadly, hell thats why they were invented in the first place.... in real life... in this game a items purpose in real life doesn't always matter (see sniper rifle). Requiring more than one operator makes a tank take from the infantry exactly what it is getting in return through vehicle support.

If a Tank required at a minimum two operators the balance would be in the numbers

6AV + 10 Infantry v 6 tanks(12 infantry) + 4 infantry + 16 v 16

the downside to spamming tanks is that you infantry support diminishes offering AV a chance to be effective. This forces a team to find balance between tanks and infantry. Similar to a team with 6 or more snipers, it becomes ineffective after too many people do it.

Responses i've gotten to this suggestion
"i'm not letting some blueberry drive my tank around"
"OK, Let some blueberry operate you dropsuit while you fire the gun"

My response before you post them are
1. It should take teamwork to kill your tank... it should take teamwork to operate it
2. when my dropsuit has 4000 armor and 1200 shield and my proto gun deals around 58000 DPS.... sure!!

Why cant LAV drivers fire their turrets? Assault LAV's!!!!

Still think a tank should require more than one operator.

16 infantry v 16 infantry = 16 v 16

A Madrugar has 8 times the armor of a proto heavy and a proto blaster deals 47 times the damage of a proto HMG.

Even then you are doing it wrong.

2 at most is required to effectively drop a tank.

Hard to solo one, really hard. 2 People should drop one easy. If I get away from 3x people shooting at me, they are just bad AV players.

I however armour tank, if a breach forge catches me in the open with a swarmer for DPS....so help me I am a goner, unless I can get out of range or break the missile lock.

2?

I just got out of a match where I was going up against Senator Snipe and another dude's Forge Gun.

They didn't manage to come close to killing me, and I still managed to kill 3 enemy HAVs.

Are they bad?

Clearly, they were playing the objective and you were staying way the hell out of danger farming WP.

That is why you are not a tanker.

Even then you are doing it wrong.

2 at most is required to effectively drop a tank.

Hard to solo one, really hard. 2 People should drop one easy. If I get away from 3x people shooting at me, they are just bad AV players.

I however armour tank, if a breach forge catches me in the open with a swarmer for DPS....so help me I am a goner, unless I can get out of range or break the missile lock.

TL;DR
However, I agree tanks should require at least 2 people to operate.
Now, this is where you're going wrong: Madrugars have 4 times the armor of a proto heavy, not 8. Also blasters have roughly the same DPS as HMGs, I admit tho that on proto level the blaster takes a slight lead. Obviously basters have longer range but we could talk about the insignificant differences between a heavy and a tank all day long and it wouldn't really matter since they are both meant for two very different purposes.
Heavies for tight confined spaces and tanks for large open fields seeing how tanks don't have any weapons that can rip through 1mm thick steel obstacles / structures, not to mention anything thicker than that.
Can you imagine the QQ if Dust tanks could actually shoot through stuff like they can in the real world? :P

Ok, now I read a little bit further.
So, why would all your AV guys be hitting different tanks? Makes no sense to me. Obviously you nuke one tank down and then move on to the next one. Hitting them all at once is really ineffective. Hitting one at a time is really effective. Thus 3 good AV players can totally deny any enemy tanks from coming anywhere where you don't want. You don't need 12 to kill 6, you don't need 16 to kill 8, you only need 3 to kill 1, 2, 3, 4... 16. Doesn't matter how many tanks they bring, you can take them all out with just 3 AV. This is assuming they are not redline cowards.
Trust me, I know, I've been instakilled so many times by simultaneous AV bombardment. One second I'm totally fine with 2 or more hardeners on, the next I'm gone. Lol.

They were on top of a tower, and The only times I retreated is when all my modules died.

Farming WP? How? All of the HAVs I killed were in CQC.

Apparently I'm am a bad tanker, and he has a PRO forge and another guy running around with a DAU. Shouldn't they have absolutely demolished my puny little tank?

So either they are just bad, or I am just good?

Depends on the map.

Did you win the match?

Snipe isn't bad, so I suspect you were not being aggressive, and were probably getting redlined.

But feel free to make up more of a cool story bro.

Given your record of hyperbole, it is difficult to believe your story.

Tankers are really hurting their credibility, especially the veteran ones who can't acknowledge how OP tanks are in pub match setting.

They are not OP in a PC match where you can control the variables of your own team. But in a pub match the odds are against you that you'll be able to control the infantry and deal with the tanks.

It's really one or the other and sometimes neither depending on the quality of your blueberries. Call me crazy but I don't think two or three tanks in a pub match of an FPS should be able to completely dictate a battle.

I've seen ONE dude able to maul infantry in a PC match. There are probably many more, but the one that stood out to me is Legend. Everyone else it doing tank on tank and tank vs dropship warfare.

So Snipe Isn't bad. That makes me good right?

Tankers are really hurting their credibility, especially the veteran ones who can't acknowledge how OP tanks are in pub match setting.

They are not OP in a PC match where you can control the variables of your own team. But in a pub match the odds are against you that you'll be able to control the infantry and deal with the tanks.

It's really one or the other and sometimes neither depending on the quality of your blueberries. Call me crazy but I don't think two or three tanks in a pub match of an FPS should be able to completely dictate a battle.

I've seen ONE dude able to maul infantry in a PC match. There are probably many more, but the one that stood out to me is Legend. Everyone else it doing tank on tank and tank vs dropship warfare.

Legend and Clay were pretty much the only two.

Do you know what you control in a match? Yourself and your squad. If you are having tank problems, take two forge users, play DOM, and take the high ground right at the start of the match. No more tank problem, at least as far as winning the match goes.

If people are not going into pub matches without at least making sure that their squad contains either a serious AV player or a tanker is just doing it wrong, and they deserve to get stepped on.

I feel bad for people who are new to this game, and I think that CCP should just remove vehicles from ambush to give the crybabies somewhere safe to play.

Beyond that, people playing objective game modes who do not even attempt to control the high ground make me laugh. You can determine the outcome of the match in the first 30 seconds. If the enemy doesn't even attempt to go for the heights it will be a slaughter.

What I find most hilarious about that is that before, when tanks were not as strong, you would always see people flying up with FGs and Swarms at match start. Everyone was in a rush to get the best upper deck positions to farm anyone dumb enough to call in vehicles. Now that they actually need to do this, no one does. Maybe it has something to do with it not being easy mode any more.

Thats all i care about that my tank is no longer meh in PC

Pubs is pub namely because lolmatchmaking which since the hotfix has become alot better and has given more even sided games where it could go either way and also where i get to fight other tanks because the other side also bring out tanks so tanks do there things and infantry do theres