| Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 [6] 7 8 :: one page |
|
|
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Marad''er
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
472
   |
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:26:00 -
[151] - Quote
I have been a scout since uprising came out. I have probably the most PC experience as a scout in the game.
I'm here to say speed > stamina. Especially in PC.
That's right I said it.
GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢
Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà
Forum Warrior LV. 4 | pâÅpéñpâápü»tºüpü«µëôµÆâpéÆF¦ápüúpüªpüäpéï | PSN: I-NINJA-ALL-DAY
|
IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
546
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:26:00 -
[152] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:
Facepalm. I am not talking about single mod replacements. I already said I agree with the fact its not a "fair" mod/slots wise. But its the sum of the parts that makes it a good/fair bonus.
If you actually take your example to completion you would see the minmitar is not any better. The minmitar has one less low slot and less CPU/PG, which HAS to be factored into the equation. You cant just cherry pick the individual stats you want and supplant all the rest.
With 50% bonus an amarr scout could fit 1 cGREEN and 2 cREDS and would be nigh impossible to catch. It could also outrun every scout suit in the game for days. You have to think at the highest level. Not the basic mod to mod variations.
The amarr scout could actually run faster and farther than every scout in the game with its current bonuses and you want to quadruple/double that?
Again the bonus itself has nothing to do with replacement of mods but what it CAN DO if optimized. Running forever at >10m/s = broken.
But the Minmatar has one more high slot than the Amarr, so it balances out. If you don't believe so, I gave the same example with a scout gk.0 which has the same slot layout as the Amarr and it was the same results - they could both do the same thing except Gallente could run longer and faster.
No it doesn't balance out. High slots have nothing to do with movement/biotics. An A-scout can run faster and farther than any minmintar scout. Again this is something IWS has been stating, synergy of the suit is important.
How about this, I agree with your 20% bonus to stamina if you take away a low slot and make it a high slot.
PHI Recruitment
or PHIsh Tank in game
Youtube
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5771
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:27:00 -
[153] - Quote
mollerz wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:
Are you suggesting that anyone is going to run two complex cardiac regulators in sacrifice for other modules they could of used that low slot for?
No. I am saying that every minja can only run one, but also, that they HAVE to run one. There are situations where you'd value a red jar over a green jar, of course. No one would run 2 green jars because they couldn't, but I would absolutely love to have the stamina it bestowed. I know the critical advantages that comes of it. I don't need to go over the limits of the math of the bonus, because I know any stamina over 500 is the sweet spot that covers every map objective no matter where you are. I'd know that with that regen rate and the extra EHP I;d be ready to rock and roll upon arrival as opposed to making it to a staging area to recover and surveil, potentially losing precious initiative. You going back to numbers completely negates the advantages only a skilled scout would see beyond the numbers. even 2 seconds more sprint equates to a huge advantage for a scout. For you to not know this, tells me you don't run scout enough. Or you don't push the limits of the suit if you do, and probably should just cave and take up the suit that matches the role you want to play because amarr scout definitely is not the role for you.
But what about the Scout gk.0? Same slot layout, same problem
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5771
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:28:00 -
[154] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:
Again the bonus itself has nothing to do with replacement of mods but what it CAN DO if optimized. Running forever at >10m/s = broken.
Oh thank you for saying this! Scout gk.0 optimized with 2 complex kinetic catalyzers and 2 complex cardiac regulators Sprint speed: 9.53 m/s Stamina: 82 seconds Scout gk.0 optimized with 3 complex kinetic catalyzers and 1 complex cardiac regulator Sprint: 10.22 m/s Stamina: 42 seconds Care to continue your argument about optimized fits? Going to quote myself here since everyone is now complaining that it is unfair to the Minmatar scout because it only gets 3 lows, but here is something to chew on for the Gallente scout with the same slot layout.
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
546
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:29:00 -
[155] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:
Again the bonus itself has nothing to do with replacement of mods but what it CAN DO if optimized. Running forever at >10m/s = broken.
Oh thank you for saying this! Scout gk.0 optimized with 2 complex kinetic catalyzers and 2 complex cardiac regulators Sprint speed: 9.53 m/s Stamina: 82 seconds Scout gk.0 optimized with 3 complex kinetic catalyzers and 1 complex cardiac regulator Sprint: 10.22 m/s Stamina: 42 seconds Care to continue your argument about optimized fits?
And you want to double that with the amarr who has the same low slot count with only slightly lower sprint speed? 80 seconds of sprinting at 10m/s is a life time. The minimtar can only do that for 20 seconds.
PHI Recruitment
or PHIsh Tank in game
Youtube
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5772
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:30:00 -
[156] - Quote
I sincerely hope CCP has more logic and reasoning than all you people who simply say "It looks good because I run scout and can look at things practically."
I run proto scouts too, you know 
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
12434
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:31:00 -
[157] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:I sincerely hope CCP has more logic and reasoning than all you people who simply say "It looks good because I run scout and can look at things practically." I run proto scouts too, you know
They do have more logic. Why do you think I am arguing with you over how silly this looks?
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist
\\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5772
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:32:00 -
[158] - Quote
IgniteableAura wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:
Again the bonus itself has nothing to do with replacement of mods but what it CAN DO if optimized. Running forever at >10m/s = broken.
Oh thank you for saying this! Scout gk.0 optimized with 2 complex kinetic catalyzers and 2 complex cardiac regulators Sprint speed: 9.53 m/s Stamina: 82 seconds Scout gk.0 optimized with 3 complex kinetic catalyzers and 1 complex cardiac regulator Sprint: 10.22 m/s Stamina: 42 seconds Care to continue your argument about optimized fits? And you want to double that with the amarr who has the same low slot count with only slightly lower sprint speed? 80 seconds of sprinting at 10m/s is a life time. The minimtar can only do that for 20 seconds.
The Amarr scout would not be able to sprint as fast, and the Gal scout would be able to do all of this while avoiding proto scanners (save the Focused and Gal logis). The Amarr scout would only be able to do this if he is ok with getting scanned by proto scanners, which is hardly a good trade-off considering there isn't much practical use of sprinting 164 seconds in Dust opposed to 82. Both are essentially "infinite."
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
Cyrius Li-Moody
The New Age Outlaws
WINMATAR.
3067
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:32:00 -
[159] - Quote
The way you talk to us is like telling your car mechanic he's wrong because you looked at the instruction manual when he has experience being a mechanic.
Your attitude is simply irritating and it discourages anyone from wanting to help you.
Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
|
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
12434
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:32:00 -
[160] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:
Again the bonus itself has nothing to do with replacement of mods but what it CAN DO if optimized. Running forever at >10m/s = broken.
Oh thank you for saying this! Scout gk.0 optimized with 2 complex kinetic catalyzers and 2 complex cardiac regulators Sprint speed: 9.53 m/s Stamina: 82 seconds Scout gk.0 optimized with 3 complex kinetic catalyzers and 1 complex cardiac regulator Sprint: 10.22 m/s Stamina: 42 seconds Care to continue your argument about optimized fits? Going to quote myself here since everyone is now complaining that it is unfair to the Minmatar scout because it only gets 3 lows, but here is something to chew on for the Gallente scout with the same slot layout.
Based on initial information Gallente will be the BEST cloaker suit, PERIOD.
Amarr would be nearly third worst despite the same slot layout
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist
\\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
|
|
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5772
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:33:00 -
[161] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:I sincerely hope CCP has more logic and reasoning than all you people who simply say "It looks good because I run scout and can look at things practically." I run proto scouts too, you know They do have more logic. Why do you think I am arguing with you over how silly this looks?
Because all your arguments are based on just that, looks opposed to reason. I am very thankful you do not work for CCP.
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5772
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:34:00 -
[162] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:
Again the bonus itself has nothing to do with replacement of mods but what it CAN DO if optimized. Running forever at >10m/s = broken.
Oh thank you for saying this! Scout gk.0 optimized with 2 complex kinetic catalyzers and 2 complex cardiac regulators Sprint speed: 9.53 m/s Stamina: 82 seconds Scout gk.0 optimized with 3 complex kinetic catalyzers and 1 complex cardiac regulator Sprint: 10.22 m/s Stamina: 42 seconds Care to continue your argument about optimized fits? And you want to double that with the amarr who has the same low slot count with only slightly lower sprint speed? 80 seconds of sprinting at 10m/s is a life time. The minimtar can only do that for 20 seconds. The Amarr scout would not be able to sprint as fast, and the Gal scout would be able to do all of this while avoiding proto scanners (save the Focused and Gal logis). The Amarr scout would only be able to do this if he is ok with getting scanned by proto scanners, which is hardly a good trade-off considering there isn't much practical use of sprinting 164 seconds in Dust opposed to 82. Both are essentially "infinite." Quoting for new page.
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
Marad''er
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
472
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:34:00 -
[163] - Quote
Lets compromise.
10% per level. That's it. Is that too much IWS and igniteable aura?
GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢
Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà
Forum Warrior LV. 4 | pâÅpéñpâápü»tºüpü«µëôµÆâpéÆF¦ápüúpüªpüäpéï | PSN: I-NINJA-ALL-DAY
|
mollerz
Minja Scouts
2057
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:35:00 -
[164] - Quote
no. not what about any other scout.
This goat rodeo merry go round of an argument you have lacks any further interest for me. It is blander than my taint.
You might be the biggest scout tourist I've ever come across. I feel bad for actual Amarr scouts who have to suffer your hijacking of their role.
You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5772
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:35:00 -
[165] - Quote
Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:The way you talk to us is like telling your car mechanic he's wrong because you looked at the instruction manual when he has experience being a mechanic.
Your attitude is simply irritating and it discourages anyone from wanting to help you.
Poor analogy is poor analogy. But it's ok, I enjoy reading common fallacies.
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5772
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:37:00 -
[166] - Quote
mollerz wrote:no. not what about any other scout.
This goat rodeo merry go round of an argument you have lacks any further interest for me. It is blander than my taint.
You might be the biggest scout tourist I've ever come across. I feel bad for actual Amarr scouts who have to suffer your hijacking of their role.
And the counter arguments have officially turned into name calling! 
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
Cyrius Li-Moody
The New Age Outlaws
WINMATAR.
3067
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:38:00 -
[167] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:The way you talk to us is like telling your car mechanic he's wrong because you looked at the instruction manual when he has experience being a mechanic.
Your attitude is simply irritating and it discourages anyone from wanting to help you. Poor analogy is poor analogy. But it's ok, I enjoy reading common fallacies.
Lol
You're well liked a person I can tell.
Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
|
IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
546
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:39:00 -
[168] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:
Again the bonus itself has nothing to do with replacement of mods but what it CAN DO if optimized. Running forever at >10m/s = broken.
Oh thank you for saying this! Scout gk.0 optimized with 2 complex kinetic catalyzers and 2 complex cardiac regulators Sprint speed: 9.53 m/s Stamina: 82 seconds Scout gk.0 optimized with 3 complex kinetic catalyzers and 1 complex cardiac regulator Sprint: 10.22 m/s Stamina: 42 seconds Care to continue your argument about optimized fits? And you want to double that with the amarr who has the same low slot count with only slightly lower sprint speed? 80 seconds of sprinting at 10m/s is a life time. The minimtar can only do that for 20 seconds. The Amarr scout would not be able to sprint as fast, and the Gal scout would be able to do all of this while avoiding proto scanners (save the Focused and Gal logis). The Amarr scout would only be able to do this if he is ok with getting scanned by proto scanners, which is hardly a good trade-off considering there isn't much practical use of sprinting 164 seconds in Dust opposed to 82. Both are essentially "infinite."
The amarr scouts sprint would be nearly 10m/s and could do it for a full 80 seconds. If the A-scout got scanned the dude wouldn't be able to catch him and the A-scout would be looooong gone by the time they got there. The A-scout would only need to fit a single damp to avoid a non-gal pro scan and would still be able to outrun a gal.
Slot layout matters, base stats matter, the whole package matters when you look at balancing the role bonus.
PHI Recruitment
or PHIsh Tank in game
Youtube
|
Marad''er
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
474
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:39:00 -
[169] - Quote
Stop throwing **** at each other.
Compromise on a bonus. I proposed 10% per level. Is that too much? Do you want it to stay at 5%?
Edit: if you want it to stay at 5%.. Can we ask for a secondary bonus then?
GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢
Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà
Forum Warrior LV. 4 | pâÅpéñpâápü»tºüpü«µëôµÆâpéÆF¦ápüúpüªpüäpéï | PSN: I-NINJA-ALL-DAY
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5773
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:40:00 -
[170] - Quote
Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:The way you talk to us is like telling your car mechanic he's wrong because you looked at the instruction manual when he has experience being a mechanic.
Your attitude is simply irritating and it discourages anyone from wanting to help you. Poor analogy is poor analogy. But it's ok, I enjoy reading common fallacies. Lol You're well liked a person I can tell.
Cyrius, at least IWS and Igniteable have been using actual data to back up their claims. All you have used in your counter arguments is "I am proto scout I am right."
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
|
|
IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
546
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:41:00 -
[171] - Quote
Marad''er wrote:Stop throwing **** at each other.
Compromise on a bonus. I proposed 10% per level. Is that too much? Do you want it to stay at 5%?
I think 10% is still too great of a bonus. 50% extra stamina is friggin huge. Thats an enormous stamina pool with even a single card reg and you have to realize people will fit those to get infinite stamina.
What about a bonus to stamina consumption of jumping? 5% /level
PHI Recruitment
or PHIsh Tank in game
Youtube
|
Marad''er
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
474
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:42:00 -
[172] - Quote
IgniteableAura wrote:Marad''er wrote:Stop throwing **** at each other.
Compromise on a bonus. I proposed 10% per level. Is that too much? Do you want it to stay at 5%? I think 10% is still too great of a bonus. 50% extra stamina is friggin huge. Thats an enormous stamina pool with even a single card reg and you have to realize people will fit those to get infinite stamina.
I see. Then may we ask for a secondary bonus?
GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢
Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà
Forum Warrior LV. 4 | pâÅpéñpâápü»tºüpü«µëôµÆâpéÆF¦ápüúpüªpüäpéï | PSN: I-NINJA-ALL-DAY
|
mollerz
Minja Scouts
2058
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:43:00 -
[173] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:mollerz wrote:no. not what about any other scout.
This goat rodeo merry go round of an argument you have lacks any further interest for me. It is blander than my taint.
You might be the biggest scout tourist I've ever come across. I feel bad for actual Amarr scouts who have to suffer your hijacking of their role.
And the counter arguments have officially turned into name calling!
name calling? lolololol okay whatever. my apologies.
So you aren't a scout tourist?
You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
|
True Adamance
Kameira Lodge
Amarr Empire
6040
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:43:00 -
[174] - Quote
IgniteableAura wrote:Marad''er wrote:Stop throwing **** at each other.
Compromise on a bonus. I proposed 10% per level. Is that too much? Do you want it to stay at 5%? I think 10% is still too great of a bonus. 50% extra stamina is friggin huge. Thats an enormous stamina pool with even a single card reg and you have to realize people will fit those to get infinite stamina.
Fair given that 25% profile dampening, and 25% faster hack speeds with no stacking penalties are massive bonuses.
"My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity."
|
IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
546
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:44:00 -
[175] - Quote
Marad''er wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:Marad''er wrote:Stop throwing **** at each other.
Compromise on a bonus. I proposed 10% per level. Is that too much? Do you want it to stay at 5%? I think 10% is still too great of a bonus. 50% extra stamina is friggin huge. Thats an enormous stamina pool with even a single card reg and you have to realize people will fit those to get infinite stamina. I see. Then may we ask for a secondary bonus?
What about a bonus to stamina consumption of jumping? 5% /level
PHI Recruitment
or PHIsh Tank in game
Youtube
|
Cyrius Li-Moody
The New Age Outlaws
WINMATAR.
3069
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:44:00 -
[176] - Quote
Marad''er wrote:Stop throwing **** at each other.
Compromise on a bonus. I proposed 10% per level. Is that too much? Do you want it to stay at 5%?
With max skills and one complex regulator you're running for nearly 75 seconds with a recharge of around 7 seconds. that's kind of ridiculous.
Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5773
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:44:00 -
[177] - Quote
IgniteableAura wrote:Marad''er wrote:Stop throwing **** at each other.
Compromise on a bonus. I proposed 10% per level. Is that too much? Do you want it to stay at 5%? I think 10% is still too great of a bonus. 50% extra stamina is friggin huge. Thats an enormous stamina pool with even a single card reg and you have to realize people will fit those to get infinite stamina.
But would it not be the same thing as any other scout using two complex cardiac regulators to get infinite stamina? And yes you can argue slot layout, but you can't ignore the Gal scout which has the same slot layout. And if you are running a scout, you HAVE to at least get your profile below 28 dB, Amarr scout would need to use one it's lows to do that and Gal would not, so it is fair to compare a Gal scout with 2 compelx cardiacs to an Amarr scout with 1.
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
mollerz
Minja Scouts
2058
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:45:00 -
[178] - Quote
I was wondering- with lv 5 skills-
Does this fit work for ak.0?
2xC C Regs
2xC Kin Cats
2xC Extenders
Viziam SCR
Viziam SCP
You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
|
Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5773
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:45:00 -
[179] - Quote
mollerz wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:mollerz wrote:no. not what about any other scout.
This goat rodeo merry go round of an argument you have lacks any further interest for me. It is blander than my taint.
You might be the biggest scout tourist I've ever come across. I feel bad for actual Amarr scouts who have to suffer your hijacking of their role.
And the counter arguments have officially turned into name calling! name calling? lolololol okay whatever. my apologies. So you aren't a scout tourist? I've been scouting since Chromosome and have an alt with Scout gk.0 maxed out that I have had since the beginning of Uprising.
ARC Commander
CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
|
IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
546
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 20:45:00 -
[180] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:IgniteableAura wrote:Marad''er wrote:Stop throwing **** at each other.
Compromise on a bonus. I proposed 10% per level. Is that too much? Do you want it to stay at 5%? I think 10% is still too great of a bonus. 50% extra stamina is friggin huge. Thats an enormous stamina pool with even a single card reg and you have to realize people will fit those to get infinite stamina. Fair given that 25% profile dampening, and 25% faster hack speeds with no stacking penalties are massive bonuses.
Those are not massive, 2 seconds faster hack and ability to hide against one more meta level of scanner.
PHI Recruitment
or PHIsh Tank in game
Youtube
|
|
|
|
|
| |
|
| Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 [6] 7 8 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |