Let's be honest here, the logistics suit needs SOME kind of nerf. I am not specifying ANYTHING before anyone flies off the handle on me, but I am interested to see what other people think the best choice of nerf would be.

I've already heard the following:

-Only a sidearm weapon.

-Reduced WPs for kills and greater WPs for support

-Must fill all equipment slots to be a valid fitting.

-50% reduced damage like the Logistics LAVs

-Change the current +1 armor repair per level to the current Gallente -5% equipment CPU/PG usage per level

I'm not saying you have to choose from my list, I'm just saying that I've already heard these ideas, and if you suggest them, please provide a reasonable argument.

Assaults don't have flexibility. ..your argument is invalid.....assaults have to be slayers they only get 1 equipment where as logis can be logis or slayers with 3 equipment slots and more hp...give assaults more hp or give them their second equipment back

i see a fully fitted logi suit at proto level can easily get more hp than a fully fitted assault suit of the same tier.

why dont we change that around?

The witch hunt continues... you people make me sick. Worst of all are the logibros trying to negotiate. They won't stop at one nerf, they never do. They won't be satisfied until we're as useless and paper thin as scouts. Assaults need some attention? Nerf logis! Such a great idea! By that logic, scouts should be complaining that the larger frames need a nerf.

This isn't about killer bees anymore- the CaLogis has been neutered. This is butthurt assaults that want their suit to do it all and nothing else. Don't fool yourselves, they won't rest until we're as useless as Chromosome again, mark my words.

Assaults don't have flexibility. ..your argument is invalid.....assaults have to be slayers they only get 1 equipment where as logis can be logis or slayers with 3 equipment slots and more hp...give assaults more hp or give them their second equipment back

-Must fill all equipment slots to be a valid fitting.

Or

-Change the current +1 armor repair per level to the current Gallente -5% equipment CPU/PG usage per level

Okay I will be honest. This is my honest reply to your suggestion, Logi Bro:

I am sick to death of this game, SP grinding, CCP and these forums.

Every time some CoD dork and their twins from BF* get beat on the Kill Board in WP by a Logi we get this entire cycle of crap repeated. OMG! Nerf the Logi!

In the future try this: If you say, we are going to Nerf any Suit, Weapon, Module, Vehicle or Skill give me my damned money back. At the very least, give me the option of resetting my SP ... in game. Not forcing me to abandon the game for weeks because CCP couldn't be bothered to reset mine while others got theirs.

The Beta isn't over. It is Dead. Just like Chromosome. What we have now is an empty shell of the great potential that was DUST514 BETA, twisted by its connection to EVE and that horrid Skill ranking (which is based on passive SP exclusively), stupid modules (Hey, it saved making new icons!) and a chainsaw to the game once a month. I would love to know where this is headed because I would bet real world cash that CCP has no stinking clue. Just keep hacking in the grass, snow and breaking the game.

Logi Bro, stuff it. I never want to hear your name again.

I honestly mean it, Logi Bro.

They use CaLogis because that suit was super OP in early uprising. The slot layout is still questionable at best (should be 5H/3L/4E, opposite of GaLogi) but was re-balanced while all logis took a recharge delay nerf. The logisault issue has been fixed, but misinformed players butthurt over dying to a yellow suit carry a torch. They hate us for getting more WP, they hate us for being able to carry more equipment, they hate us for getting kills when they think yellow = easy kill. Stop looking for free kills in an FPS with these per-concieved notions that a logistics class should be tethered to a heavy or a squad's personal pack mule. There's no Geneva Convention in New Eden. Grow a pair and stop crying.

For real, this whole issue could be solved by changes to the suit bonuses like:

Assault : +30% Damage Modifier Module Efficacy

Logistics: -40% Damage Modifier Module Efficacy


I run Gallente Logi exclusively, and as a support oriented player, I've never seriously considered Damage Modifiers for my high slots. Killing is a distinct secondary, but if you practice you can be very effective with no Damage Mods and a Toxin BP rifle.

I'm hoping to see a more detailed bonus system coming to suits soon. There's a lot of shaping of suits and roles that can be done by changing fitting costs or module efficacy on a per suit basis.

How about we see if we can buff the assault before we nerf the entire logi class because only one variant is slightly OP at the proto tier *cough callogi cough cough*

No,(1) they are ALL OP at proto. Some are slightly OP, some are extremely OP.
As mutliple people have now pointed out, there is no sane reason for logis to have MORE SLOTS than a regular assault.

(2)Proto assaults, have 6 or 7 slots.
Proto logis, have 8, or 9 ???
That is insane. (3)At best, they should have the same amount as assaults. But really, they should have one *less*, because due to logi skill, they get a free repper.
So there's no excuse to have anything more than (assault suit -1) slots.

Specifically, lose 1low slot from the matching race's proto assault suit slots, and balancing is all done.

...
4. Logis get more slots because their base stats are lower than Assault suit stats.

And they have less base stats, Because they're supposed to be less powerful than assault suits.

The original game designer made a foolish assumption that if they made a suit with 2 eq slots, people would use them.
If they used them, then they wouldnt have the power to super-tank with free slots.
But suit abusers dont use the slots.

"So force people to use the slots!!"

No, that's lame. you shouldnt force people to do stuff like that, any more than you should force people to use the grenade slot in other suits.
Besides, its really nice to give people the freedom to spec into only ONE proto suit, and be able to use it for logi type stuff, OR frontline assault type stuff.
Just dont make its frontline capabilities better than the supposed frontline suits.

There are only two remaining, reasonable ways to do that:
1. reduce power (not appropropriate, due to EQ demands)
or
2. reduce slots. Which is totally appropriate, since its effect is to directly remove the capability for abuse.

There has been no rational argument along the lines of "dont reduce slots, because..."
There has been only "(do this other thing instead)"

That would be because there IS NO rational argument to support keeping that number of slots on a logi.
That number of slots does not in any way match up with the supposed goal of making an equipment-deploying suit.

The goal here is to take away the super-tank-ness of logistics suits, that comes from stacking shields plus armor slots in the abnormally high slot count logis.
So take away the excessive slots.

*EXACTLY*.

Because they're supposed to be less powerful than assault suits.

The original game designer made a foolish assumption that if they made a suit with 2 eq slots, people would use them.
If they used them, then they wouldnt have the power to super-tank with free slots.
But suit abusers dont use the slots.

"So force people to use the slots!!"

No, that's lame. you shouldnt force people to do stuff like that, any more than you should force people to use the grenade slot in other suits.
Besides, its really nice to give people the freedom to spec into only ONE proto suit, and be able to use it for logi type stuff, OR frontline assault type stuff.
Just dont make its frontline capabilities better than the supposed frontline suits.

There are only two remaining, reasonable ways to do that:
1. reduce power (not appropropriate, due to EQ demands)
or
2. reduce slots. Which is totally appropriate, since its effect is to directly remove the capability for abuse.

There has been no rational argument along the lines of "dont reduce slots, because..."
There has been only "(do this other thing instead)"

That would be because there IS NO rational argument to support keeping that number of slots on a logi.
That number of slots does not in any way match up with the supposed goal of making an equipment-deploying suit.

The goal here is to take away the super-tank-ness of logistics suits, that comes from stacking shields plus armor slots in the abnormally high slot count logis.
So take away the excessive slots.

Neither, I'm tired of seeing this game nerfed to the standards of assaults with rifles. Take your stand fellow logibros! Don't give these casual bastards an inch!

Amen to this...I as a fellow Assault Rifle user would honestly think the game would be more fun right now if we just took Assault Rifles out lol. This is Dust514 not battlefield. We are suppose to be in freaking space. You dont see assault rifles in Halo do you?

Amen to this...I as a fellow Assault Rifle user would honestly think the game would be more fun right now if we just took Assault Rifles out lol. This is Dust514 not battlefield. We are suppose to be in freaking space. You dont see assault rifles in Halo do you?

reducing slots is far from appropriate. removing slots would have to be replaced with increased base ehp .

not increasing base stats would be a huge nerf on true logis.

not to mention removing a slot would then require the reduction of pg/cpu to compensate.

I dont see any reason to do that.



how are you defining "true logis"? Because using the normal definition of "using 2x EQ to help the team" is in no way affected by the above.

If you're additionally defining true logis as ".... and having heavy-levels of survivability"... your definition is wrong.
Someone who is running around dropping eq, and repairing/reviving people, should not be seeing sustained fire, therefore, they shouldnt NEED heavy-levels of survivability.



why?

They could have infinite pg and cpu, and it wouldnt make a difference, if the slot count were suitably low. They'd just have left-over pg/cpu if they chose to under-equip EQ.
Just the same as any OTHER suit.
The biggest limiting factor to almost any suit, is its number of slots. logi shouldnt be any different.

Therefore, the slot count reduction by itself, is fine

It would then effectively be a straight up,
"assault suit, with sidearm slot traded for extra EQ slot"

That by itself, is mostly balanced. Certainly more balanced than the current situation. Although as I said, removing an additional low-slot in trade for the free repper, would be even more balanced.

Neither, I'm tired of seeing this game nerfed to the standards of assaults with rifles. Take your stand fellow logibros! Don't give these casual bastards an inch!

-50% reduced damage like the Logistics LAVs