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Foxhound Elite
Ancient Exiles
378
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Posted - 2013.10.30 21:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
I like to see people giving out about the upcoming changes to AV. You've had it coming, and stop complaining about how it's going to look about in the future vs. Tanks. I see nobodys saying 'but we won't have any way to fend off stomping dropship pilots' , ... it's because dropship pilots rarely get a chance to make any impact. Why, you say? Because it only takes one swarm launcher, one forge gunner or one rail installation user to remove the threat of even the most skilled of pilots from the battlefield.
Stop your whining, you'll have together to take out vehicles, which is what it should be. Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. Only where you use your surroundings and fellow teammates to help, then you should overcome the vehicular opposition, unless they fail due to pilot error otherwise.
Python pilot, troop-transport specialist and an all-round ballbag.
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KING CHECKMATE
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
2149
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Posted - 2013.10.30 21:33:00 -
[2] - Quote
Foxhound Elite wrote:I like to see people giving out about the upcoming changes to AV. You've had it coming, and stop complaining about how it's going to look about in the future vs. Tanks. I see nobodys saying 'but we won't have any way to fend off stomping dropship pilots' , ... it's because dropship pilots rarely get a chance to make any impact. Why, you say? Because it only takes one swarm launcher, one forge gunner or one rail installation user to remove the threat of even the most skilled of pilots from the battlefield.
Stop your whining, you'll have together to take out vehicles, which is what it should be. Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. Only where you use your surroundings and fellow teammates to help, then you should overcome the vehicular opposition, unless they fail due to pilot error otherwise.
Im not crying, im learning how to drive tanks....
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Justin Tymes
Dem Durrty Boyz
Public Disorder.
465
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Posted - 2013.10.30 21:35:00 -
[3] - Quote
 Yet another "X SP should mean superiority" thread. Save your SP > skill rant for when 1.7 comes out. |
Judge Rhadamanthus
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
586
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Posted - 2013.10.30 21:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
Justin Tymes wrote:Yet another "X SP should mean superiority" thread. Save your SP > skill rant for when 1.7 comes out.
Your roll eyes emote and your 1 line dismissive response lies on-top of a confusing point. Your say that SP should not add value, i.e superior abilities or gear. If this is not the function of SP as you say then what do you think skill points should do? What are they for in your version of DUST?
Everything Dropship youtube channel
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CharCharOdell
1402
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Posted - 2013.10.30 21:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
How about this: LIGHT AV weapons should be good at taking out light vehicles, but ineffective at taking out heavy vehicles, while heavy AV kills all vehicles relatively quickly. Doesn't that make sense?
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KING CHECKMATE
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
2150
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Posted - 2013.10.30 21:52:00 -
[6] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Justin Tymes wrote:Yet another "X SP should mean superiority" thread. Save your SP > skill rant for when 1.7 comes out. Your roll eyes emote and your 1 line dismissive response lies on-top of a confusing point. Your say that SP should not add value, i.e superior abilities or gear. If this is not the function of SP as you say then what do you think skill points should do? What are they for in your version of DUST?
By your logic, and the OPs, when i have 20 millions SP (in about a week or two) and since i spent almost all of it in AV (Have everything proto) and suits and skills for using it, then, NO VEHICLE USER UNDER 20mill SP should be able to survive one of my AV attacks?
Seems fun. TY
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Judge Rhadamanthus
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
586
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Posted - 2013.10.30 21:58:00 -
[7] - Quote
King you are straw manning. This is not useful. My question was about added value. Nothing about default domination or inherent superiority.
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Godin Thekiller
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
1335
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Posted - 2013.10.30 21:59:00 -
[8] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Justin Tymes wrote:Yet another "X SP should mean superiority" thread. Save your SP > skill rant for when 1.7 comes out. Your roll eyes emote and your 1 line dismissive response lies on-top of a confusing point. Your say that SP should not add value, i.e superior abilities or gear. If this is not the function of SP as you say then what do you think skill points should do? What are they for in your version of DUST? By your logic, and the OPs, when i have 20 millions SP (in about a week or two) and since i spent almost all of it in AV (Have everything proto) and suits and skills for using it, then, NO VEHICLE USER UNDER 20mill SP should be able to survive one of my AV attacks? Seems fun. TY
It doesn't take 20 mil SP to use AV well. Not even close.
'lights cigar' fuck with me, and I'll melt your face off. Gallente forever!
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KING CHECKMATE
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
2152
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:King you are straw manning. This is not useful. My question was about added value. Nothing about default domination or inherent superiority.
Well sorry about the misunderstanding, too much time dealing with SPR4 has left me this ability to put words in peoples mouth. I apologize.
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KING CHECKMATE
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
2152
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:00:00 -
[10] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:
It doesn't take 20 mil SP to use AV well. Not even close.
Well of course not, who said that>? not me for sure.
But again thats not what we are talking about here godin. :3
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Paran Tadec
Ancient Exiles
1524
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:02:00 -
[11] - Quote
Foxhound Elite wrote:I like to see people giving out about the upcoming changes to AV. You've had it coming, and stop complaining about how it's going to look about in the future vs. Tanks. I see nobodys saying 'but we won't have any way to fend off stomping dropship pilots' , ... it's because dropship pilots rarely get a chance to make any impact. Why, you say? Because it only takes one swarm launcher, one forge gunner or one rail installation user to remove the threat of even the most skilled of pilots from the battlefield.
Stop your whining, you'll have together to take out vehicles, which is what it should be. Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. Only where you use your surroundings and fellow teammates to help, then you should overcome the vehicular opposition, unless they fail due to pilot error otherwise.
Or you know, buff dropships and give them flares, but thats too simple
Bittervet Proficiency V
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3802
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:03:00 -
[12] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Foxhound Elite wrote:I like to see people giving out about the upcoming changes to AV. You've had it coming, and stop complaining about how it's going to look about in the future vs. Tanks. I see nobodys saying 'but we won't have any way to fend off stomping dropship pilots' , ... it's because dropship pilots rarely get a chance to make any impact. Why, you say? Because it only takes one swarm launcher, one forge gunner or one rail installation user to remove the threat of even the most skilled of pilots from the battlefield.
Stop your whining, you'll have together to take out vehicles, which is what it should be. Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. Only where you use your surroundings and fellow teammates to help, then you should overcome the vehicular opposition, unless they fail due to pilot error otherwise.
Im not crying, im learning how to drive tanks....BTW this: '' Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. '' Is the most stupid thing i've read. If this game ends up being: Better equipment > Skill IM LEAVING.I dont give a flying f*** if your tank costs 50 million isk, if im better i should be able to drop your butt. PERIOD. @ the end of the day, as you said, is 1 on 1 , you are just wearing a mechanical, more expensive suit.... A 1 on 1 battle that cannot be won no matter what , makes a game broken.
Just saying King...
1v1 Tanker vs AV- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spends 5 Mill......
1vs 2 Tanker vs AVers- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spend, between them 10 Million. Balance of SP, ISK, and effort is equalised.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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Godin Thekiller
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
1335
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:03:00 -
[13] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Godin Thekiller wrote:
It doesn't take 20 mil SP to use AV well. Not even close.
Well of course not, who said that>? not me for sure.
But again thats not what we are talking about here godin. :3
You said you spent almost all of it into AV, so es you did.
'lights cigar' fuck with me, and I'll melt your face off. Gallente forever!
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Judge Rhadamanthus
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
586
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:05:00 -
[14] - Quote
That's cool. I'm am interested by opinions like the posters where he says "SP should not do this" yet I never hear what they should do. If SP do NOT give a advantage then by reason a duvalle should be exactly like a militia gun and a proto suit like a starter fit. I.e the SP to get them does not give you an advantage.
If this were the case, what would be the point? This was my question. Perhaps cosmetics? That post by Justin is quite unclear.
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KING CHECKMATE
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
2152
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:09:00 -
[15] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:
Just saying King...
1v1 Tanker vs AV- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spends 5 Mill......
1vs 2 Tanker vs AVers- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spend, between them 10 Million. Balance of SP, ISK, and effort is equalised.
Ok.
1st the problem is vehicle users think the only thing we have to level up is the weapon its proficiency and thats that.
a GOOD AV fitting that is both capable of firing constantly vs vehicles AND does not need team support to survive, has auto repairers that are effective and can ressuply its AV weapon on his own, Plus having enough stamina and speed to reach locations suitable for AV operation does not go below 8 mill.
2nd- AV weapons are to easy to use, this is correct.
3rd- So in good theory,if we INCREASE the SP needed to get to Proto AV and increase the learning curve of AV you would be happy for 1 on 1 vehicle vs tanks?
OF COURSE NOT. .....
Tankers have repeatedly expressed their desires of roflstomping infantry without retaliation unless is a full 3-5 AV proto squad.... LOL
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IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY
Molon Labe.
RISE of LEGION
216
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:09:00 -
[16] - Quote
Outside of wasteland junk removal I don't know of any AV users, I only know of people trying to survive getting killed by the death machines. Viewing av as your opposition is wrong, instead its your complimentary counter that is equally needed. If not will it play out in the end against you if you have any doubt ask Lurchasauras how badass his missile tank works now. Dust514 a game with vehicles, cool jump on board. DUST514 a game with insufficient counters to vehicles (anyone in closed beta remember missiles didn't matter if they were DS/LAV/HAV it equalled death.) In the end a buff to AV would have actually been a better solution to counter these awesome vehicles. Instead the wave of waaa that vehicles are OP led to inevitable vehicle nerfs that are still continuing and have been going on since August of 2012. If you want strong vehicle you actually should be encouraging strong AV if you want neutered vehicles continue to ***** about AV. |
KING CHECKMATE
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
2155
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:10:00 -
[17] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:KING CHECKMATE wrote:Godin Thekiller wrote:
It doesn't take 20 mil SP to use AV well. Not even close.
Well of course not, who said that>? not me for sure.
But again thats not what we are talking about here godin. :3 You said you spent almost all of it into AV, so es you did.
Its impossible spending 20 mill into AV. Remember ; the only way to harm vehicles is with 4 weapons.
Which except plasma cannon i have all proto, and the suits with proto modules,proficiency ,etc... needed to fully run them.
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3803
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:14:00 -
[18] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:True Adamance wrote:
Just saying King...
1v1 Tanker vs AV- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spends 5 Mill......
1vs 2 Tanker vs AVers- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spend, between them 10 Million. Balance of SP, ISK, and effort is equalised.
Ok. 1st the problem is vehicle users think the only thing we have to level up is the weapon its proficiency and thats that. a GOOD AV fitting that is both capable of firing constantly vs vehicles AND does not need team support to survive (good vs 1 or 2 enemies at the time), has auto repairers that are effective and can ressuply its AV weapon on his own, Plus having enough stamina and speed to reach locations suitable for AV operation does not go below 8 mill. 2nd- AV weapons are to easy to use, this is correct. 3rd- So in good theory, if we INCREASE the SP needed to get to Proto AV and increase the learning curve of AV you would be happy for 1 on 1 vehicle vs tanks? Again you are assuming things about me. I too was an AVer, I know what you have to skill into etc and I still keep coming back to the point that the weapons were too effective at their jobs to be balanced within the game. I have piloted ADS, Aero lends them to me when I'm bored, those things are practically like paper planes, I'm surprised so many people make them work. Tanks are jokes and you know it. LAV's well they were always stupid. OF COURSE NOT. ..... Tankers have repeatedly expressed their desires of roflstomping infantry without retaliation unless is a full 3-5 AV proto squad.... LOL
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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KING CHECKMATE
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
2155
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:20:00 -
[19] - Quote
@ True Adamance
wait wait wait. WHY ARE YOU EVEN ARGUING WITH ME XD
we already reached an agreement before:
GÖª Tanks are a lot more sturdy but can be disabled.
GÖª AV gets WP for pushing back and disabling tanks
GÖª 2-3+ AVs are needed to DESTROY A TANK,but not to push it back or disable it.
Agreed? nice, now let me argue with people i havnt met before. TY XD
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
4463
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:21:00 -
[20] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Justin Tymes wrote:Yet another "X SP should mean superiority" thread. Save your SP > skill rant for when 1.7 comes out. Your roll eyes emote and your 1 line dismissive response lies on-top of a confusing point. Your say that SP should not add value, i.e superior abilities or gear. If this is not the function of SP as you say then what do you think skill points should do? What are they for in your version of DUST?
As I know you're a reasonable man Judge, I would like to add my concerns to this.
The idea that SP and ISK confers more than just a straight combat advantage is abhorrent to myself and a number of others - I suspect King Checkmate is objecting less to the idea of vehicles being strong and more to the idea of them being completely dominant simply because the users have spent more ISK and SP.
If, say, a forge gun has perfectly positioned itself behind a tank with an excellent aim at the weak point, but it is only a standard forge gun, should it ever be able to take out the tank? There are active modules to account for, of course, but in the average situation should that forge gun be able to take out that tank? The tank user has spent more ISK - perhaps SP too, but that is debatable.
I would compare this to a militia assault rifle user successfully flanking a prototype suit and aiming at the head. In that case, the militia gear is perfectly capable of destroying the protosuit. What I would like to see in AV/Vehicle balance is a situation where SP confers an advantage, but where large amounts of spending does not ensure complete dominance over lesser equipment.
The situation that is potentially developing (should the forge gun nerf be as severe as the swarm launcher nerf) is that low tier gear is physically incapable of destroying a vehicle at its tier. Again, many would argue that it should take multiple people to destroy vehicles, and that everything should be balanced based on a vehicle's performance in PC against grouped proto AV - but what happens then is that in pubmatches tanks become stomping machines. Of course there's the option of bringing out co-ordinated AV, but how often does that actually happen in a pubmatch? New players join the game only to find themselves repeatedly dominated by tanks. They may well switch to their AV fits - but if the advantage conferred by spending so much isk on the tank is too great, they will be completely unable to do anything against the machine terrorising their team.
Certainly that isk should have value - but should it have enough value to create a frustrating experience for all the other players? Rather than see vehicles in an expensive but dominant position like this, would it not be better to, say, reduce the price of vehicles instead?
Level 4 Forum Warrior
Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
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Godin Thekiller
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
1338
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:21:00 -
[21] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:True Adamance wrote:
Just saying King...
1v1 Tanker vs AV- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spends 5 Mill......
1vs 2 Tanker vs AVers- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spend, between them 10 Million. Balance of SP, ISK, and effort is equalised.
Ok. 1st the problem is vehicle users think the only thing we have to level up is the weapon its proficiency and thats that. a GOOD AV fitting that is both capable of firing constantly vs vehicles AND does not need team support to survive (good vs 1 or 2 enemies at the time), has auto repairers that are effective and can ressuply its AV weapon on his own, Plus having enough stamina and speed to reach locations suitable for AV operation does not go below 8 mill. 2nd- AV weapons are to easy to use, this is correct. 3rd- So in good theory, if we INCREASE the SP needed to get to Proto AV and increase the learning curve of AV you would be happy for 1 on 1 vehicle vs AV? Pertty sure I've see mostly asking for 2-3 people using teamwork and ADV-PROTO to take out The best pilots in the game during about a 15-20 second period, and if the pilot escapes (AV'ers didn't tackle the HAV, yes we still need EWAR to do tackling, but still), it's all good, as the AV'ers should be rewarded for damaging the vehicle. OF COURSE NOT. .....Tankers (not YOU adamance ,you still have some sense in you...but overall)have repeatedly expressed their desires of roflstomping infantry without retaliation unless is a full 3-5 AV proto squad.... LOL
'lights cigar' fuck with me, and I'll melt your face off. Gallente forever!
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
4463
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:23:00 -
[22] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:KING CHECKMATE wrote:Foxhound Elite wrote:I like to see people giving out about the upcoming changes to AV. You've had it coming, and stop complaining about how it's going to look about in the future vs. Tanks. I see nobodys saying 'but we won't have any way to fend off stomping dropship pilots' , ... it's because dropship pilots rarely get a chance to make any impact. Why, you say? Because it only takes one swarm launcher, one forge gunner or one rail installation user to remove the threat of even the most skilled of pilots from the battlefield.
Stop your whining, you'll have together to take out vehicles, which is what it should be. Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. Only where you use your surroundings and fellow teammates to help, then you should overcome the vehicular opposition, unless they fail due to pilot error otherwise.
Im not crying, im learning how to drive tanks....BTW this: '' Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. '' Is the most stupid thing i've read. If this game ends up being: Better equipment > Skill IM LEAVING.I dont give a flying f*** if your tank costs 50 million isk, if im better i should be able to drop your butt. PERIOD. @ the end of the day, as you said, is 1 on 1 , you are just wearing a mechanical, more expensive suit.... A 1 on 1 battle that cannot be won no matter what , makes a game broken. Just saying King... 1v1 Tanker vs AV- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spends 5 Mill...... 1vs 2 Tanker vs AVers- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spend, between them 10 Million. Balance of SP, ISK, and effort is equalised.
Manpower and versatility is a significant factor as well. An HAV can kill AV, infantry, and other vehicles. An AV user can only really effectively kill vehicles, forge gun sniping aside. Additionally, if it takes two AV players to take out one person in a tank, then that takes two players off the field who are dedicated to taking out that tank while it only takes off one person from the other team, who can do a lot more than that.
Level 4 Forum Warrior
Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
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Void Echo
Blades of Dust
2005
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:25:00 -
[23] - Quote
....hehehe....
that is all.
Gallente Pure Blood
Level 2 Forum Warrior
"In my experience love doesnt exist, only cold, dark betrayal does."
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Meeko Fent
expert intervention
Caldari State
1345
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:25:00 -
[24] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Foxhound Elite wrote:I like to see people giving out about the upcoming changes to AV. You've had it coming, and stop complaining about how it's going to look about in the future vs. Tanks. I see nobodys saying 'but we won't have any way to fend off stomping dropship pilots' , ... it's because dropship pilots rarely get a chance to make any impact. Why, you say? Because it only takes one swarm launcher, one forge gunner or one rail installation user to remove the threat of even the most skilled of pilots from the battlefield.
Stop your whining, you'll have together to take out vehicles, which is what it should be. Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. Only where you use your surroundings and fellow teammates to help, then you should overcome the vehicular opposition, unless they fail due to pilot error otherwise.
Im not crying, im learning how to drive tanks....BTW this: '' Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. '' Is the most stupid thing i've read. If this game ends up being: Better equipment > Skill IM LEAVING.I dont give a flying f*** if your tank costs 50 million isk, if im better i should be able to drop your butt. PERIOD. @ the end of the day, as you said, is 1 on 1 , you are just wearing a mechanical, more expensive suit.... A 1 on 1 battle that cannot be won no matter what , makes a game broken.
Perfect logic Checkmate.
"I played 6 matches to earn enough to buy my tank! Yay!"
*Goes into match*
"Let's bring out that tank! Whoop some ass!"
*Dies to AR with Lai Dai Grenades*
Balanced, right?
You choose to use 1 million SP for a weapon to fend off vehicles.
Tanker alt choose to put 10 million to decently fit a HAV.
You win because you can pop in an out of cover faster then my HAV can turn.
Balanced, right?
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3804
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:26:00 -
[25] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:@ True Adamance
wait wait wait. WHY ARE YOU EVEN ARGUING WITH ME XD
we already reached an agreement before:
GÖª Tanks are a lot more sturdy but can be disabled.
GÖª AV gets WP for pushing back and disabling tanks
GÖª 2-3+ AVs are needed to DESTROY A TANK,but not to push it back or disable it.
Agreed? nice, now let me argue with people i havnt met before. TY XD
Lol yeah we did.
Just seems like and overly cyclic argument than both sides continually argue, agree, then do it all over again.
Basically at its core
Tankers
-Want to be useful, only good ones are in this game right now, the weak are shafted by potent AV.
AV
-want to prevent themselves being stomped by tanks, a job that by all accounts, even AVer, is very very easy.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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Judge Rhadamanthus
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
586
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:27:00 -
[26] - Quote
I was not advocating one position or the other. I wanted to know if Justin, who thinks SP should not give an advantage, would see the purpose and function of skill points.
If skill points do givr and advantage, the determination of the size of this advantage is the balance. If they give no advantage what then?
Everything Dropship youtube channel
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Void Echo
Blades of Dust
2005
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:28:00 -
[27] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I was not advocating one position or the other. I wanted to know if Justin, who thinks SP should not give an advantage, would see the purpose and function of skill points.
If skill points do givr and advantage, the determination of the size of this advantage is the balance. If they give no advantage what then?
call of duty logic, don't question it or you will be flamed
Gallente Pure Blood
Level 2 Forum Warrior
"In my experience love doesnt exist, only cold, dark betrayal does."
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
4463
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:29:00 -
[28] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I was not advocating one position or the other. I wanted to know if Justin, who thinks SP should not give an advantage, would see the purpose and function of skill points.
If skill points do givr and advantage, the determination of the size of this advantage is the balance. If they give no advantage what then?
This is the crucial point - how much of an advantage does that SP and ISK give?
It certainly should give an advantage. It shouldn't be too little, otherwise it would be pointless to spend that SP and ISK. But it shouldn't be too great either, or people would simply invest that ISK/SP and stomp everything.
Level 4 Forum Warrior
Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3804
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:34:00 -
[29] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I was not advocating one position or the other. I wanted to know if Justin, who thinks SP should not give an advantage, would see the purpose and function of skill points.
If skill points do givr and advantage, the determination of the size of this advantage is the balance. If they give no advantage what then? This is the crucial point - how much of an advantage does that SP and ISK give? It certainly should give an advantage. It shouldn't be too little, otherwise it would be pointless to spend that SP and ISK. But it shouldn't be too great either, or people would simply invest that ISK/SP and stomp everything.
You fly EVE side though Arkena you know how much SP and ISK give in terms of advantages. Why should Dust be any different?
Admittedly this is a new format for a competitive FPS.... which without SP does not feel all that competitive.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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KING CHECKMATE
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
2156
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:35:00 -
[30] - Quote
Void Echo wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I was not advocating one position or the other. I wanted to know if Justin, who thinks SP should not give an advantage, would see the purpose and function of skill points.
If skill points do givr and advantage, the determination of the size of this advantage is the balance. If they give no advantage what then? call of duty logic, don't question it or you will be flamed
Oh great. Void is here. Abandon thread, useless posts incoming....
@Godin: Yeah i know what you are saying and i agree with you, bu i use Lai dai Grenades, Wyrikomi Swarms launchers and Ishikune/Kaalakiota Forge guns, sometimes (depending on the map) I canot effectivley destroy a tank,because he was very fast or the map helped him with cover, so he can attack ,leave,repair,rinse and repeat, and i can spend a whole match just damaging him and at the end of the match i'll get mayed 0 WP for spending all match pushing him back AND if a change my suit,the tank will come and ravage my team ,because exagerations appart, MLT/STD weaponry is crap vs good tanks...
Now do i solo tanks? Sure, any epxerienced AV can solo tanks. with the right positioning and SOME form of backup its doable.
For tankers to tell me i shouldnt be able to SOLO MLT tanks with my 180k Proto AV dropsuit is just madness....
u+Élop s-¦ -Äll+Én-ç+ö+É
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