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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3802
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:03:00 -
[1] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Foxhound Elite wrote:I like to see people giving out about the upcoming changes to AV. You've had it coming, and stop complaining about how it's going to look about in the future vs. Tanks. I see nobodys saying 'but we won't have any way to fend off stomping dropship pilots' , ... it's because dropship pilots rarely get a chance to make any impact. Why, you say? Because it only takes one swarm launcher, one forge gunner or one rail installation user to remove the threat of even the most skilled of pilots from the battlefield.
Stop your whining, you'll have together to take out vehicles, which is what it should be. Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. Only where you use your surroundings and fellow teammates to help, then you should overcome the vehicular opposition, unless they fail due to pilot error otherwise.
Im not crying, im learning how to drive tanks....BTW this: '' Vehicle users spend more ISK and SP than you, in an open one vs one battle, they should always crush you. '' Is the most stupid thing i've read. If this game ends up being: Better equipment > Skill IM LEAVING.I dont give a flying f*** if your tank costs 50 million isk, if im better i should be able to drop your butt. PERIOD. @ the end of the day, as you said, is 1 on 1 , you are just wearing a mechanical, more expensive suit.... A 1 on 1 battle that cannot be won no matter what , makes a game broken.
Just saying King...
1v1 Tanker vs AV- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spends 5 Mill......
1vs 2 Tanker vs AVers- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spend, between them 10 Million. Balance of SP, ISK, and effort is equalised.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3803
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:True Adamance wrote:
Just saying King...
1v1 Tanker vs AV- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spends 5 Mill......
1vs 2 Tanker vs AVers- Tanker spends 10 Mill to get where they are at, AV spend, between them 10 Million. Balance of SP, ISK, and effort is equalised.
Ok. 1st the problem is vehicle users think the only thing we have to level up is the weapon its proficiency and thats that. a GOOD AV fitting that is both capable of firing constantly vs vehicles AND does not need team support to survive (good vs 1 or 2 enemies at the time), has auto repairers that are effective and can ressuply its AV weapon on his own, Plus having enough stamina and speed to reach locations suitable for AV operation does not go below 8 mill. 2nd- AV weapons are to easy to use, this is correct. 3rd- So in good theory, if we INCREASE the SP needed to get to Proto AV and increase the learning curve of AV you would be happy for 1 on 1 vehicle vs tanks? Again you are assuming things about me. I too was an AVer, I know what you have to skill into etc and I still keep coming back to the point that the weapons were too effective at their jobs to be balanced within the game. I have piloted ADS, Aero lends them to me when I'm bored, those things are practically like paper planes, I'm surprised so many people make them work. Tanks are jokes and you know it. LAV's well they were always stupid. OF COURSE NOT. ..... Tankers have repeatedly expressed their desires of roflstomping infantry without retaliation unless is a full 3-5 AV proto squad.... LOL
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3804
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:@ True Adamance
wait wait wait. WHY ARE YOU EVEN ARGUING WITH ME XD
we already reached an agreement before:
GÖª Tanks are a lot more sturdy but can be disabled.
GÖª AV gets WP for pushing back and disabling tanks
GÖª 2-3+ AVs are needed to DESTROY A TANK,but not to push it back or disable it.
Agreed? nice, now let me argue with people i havnt met before. TY XD
Lol yeah we did.
Just seems like and overly cyclic argument than both sides continually argue, agree, then do it all over again.
Basically at its core
Tankers
-Want to be useful, only good ones are in this game right now, the weak are shafted by potent AV.
AV
-want to prevent themselves being stomped by tanks, a job that by all accounts, even AVer, is very very easy.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3804
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:34:00 -
[4] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I was not advocating one position or the other. I wanted to know if Justin, who thinks SP should not give an advantage, would see the purpose and function of skill points.
If skill points do givr and advantage, the determination of the size of this advantage is the balance. If they give no advantage what then? This is the crucial point - how much of an advantage does that SP and ISK give? It certainly should give an advantage. It shouldn't be too little, otherwise it would be pointless to spend that SP and ISK. But it shouldn't be too great either, or people would simply invest that ISK/SP and stomp everything.
You fly EVE side though Arkena you know how much SP and ISK give in terms of advantages. Why should Dust be any different?
Admittedly this is a new format for a competitive FPS.... which without SP does not feel all that competitive.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3810
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Posted - 2013.10.30 22:55:00 -
[5] - Quote
Justin Tymes wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I was not advocating one position or the other. I wanted to know what Justin, who thinks SP should not give an advantage, would see as the purpose and function of skill points.
If skill points do give and advantage, the determination of the size of this advantage is the balance. If they give no advantage what then? It should give an advantage but that advantage must be relative with everything else in the game. I have about 15mill invested into making a complete Gallente Logistics suit right now. I should always be able to be solo'd, because that's the way Dust works. Tanks already have an advantage to being immune to most weapons, and have the ability to kill anything in seconds, if that. Which is fine but AV has to be your counter. 1 man should be able to solo another man regardless of the SP wall. 1 man should not be bending numerical advantage to his will, simply because he decided to bring a well-fit tank in play, that completely goes against skill.
Okay solo fine but your talking about a frigate trying to destroy a battle cruiser here.
Its not that ******* easy.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3827
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Posted - 2013.10.31 04:29:00 -
[6] - Quote
Rusty Shallows wrote:True Adamance wrote:Justin Tymes wrote:[quote=Judge Rhadamanthus]snip Okay solo fine but your talking about a frigate trying to destroy a battle cruiser here. Its not that ******* easy. Bad analogy, in Eve cheap T1 gank ships take out one billion isk Marauders. CCP even drastically toned down a module that would have matched the ships market cost to its combat value.
Admittedly you have to have a lot of them, T1 is ******* **** unless you are using T2 guns.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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