Flaylock pistols should be removed.

Mass drivers need to be re balanced.

AoE is incredibly strong. I die more to MD because of the larger splash. Armor tanking is horrendous.

Please go away if your not going to post legitimate reasons as to why a weapon needs a rebalance or removal.

Mass driver is getting a little ridiculous too in fairness, given that a lot of people have started just throwing explosions everywhere it's f'ing ridiculous. I think CCP are trolling armour hard, especially given the recent discount on advanced contact grenades.

MD needs a tiny damage reduction and maybe one less round in the chamber. The other thing the MD needs above anything is to be lethal to the user. I have been toe to toe with MD users, SMG'ing their face off for them to point blank shoot the floor underneath me (and themselves) for the damage to outright kill me and not even scratch them.

Mass driver is getting a little ridiculous too in fairness, given that a lot of people have started just throwing explosions everywhere it's f'ing ridiculous. I think CCP are trolling armour hard, especially given the recent discount on advanced contact grenades.

MD needs a tiny damage reduction and maybe one less round in the chamber. The other thing the MD needs above anything is to be lethal to the user. I have been toe to toe with MD users, SMG'ing their face off for them to point blank shoot the floor underneath me (and themselves) for the damage to outright kill me and not even scratch them.

The mass driver damage is already pretty low for what it is and has very little difference between std-pro level at the moment damage wise at the moment bringing it down would make it ineffective at it's intended role(Area denial) we had a similar problem in 1.0-1.1 where because of the splash damage not working correctly it was almost useless in that role as it didn't do enough damage to have the 'fear factor' that it dose now and make the person/group you were shooting at retreat,instead they would push forward while you fired multiple rounds simply gunning you down as you futility tried to hold them back.

The suggestion you made on clipsize yields similar problems with that it would decrease it's effectiveness as an area denial weapon as the mass driver is already short on ammo and clipsize reducing one (or both) of those would impact it negatively as well making it nothing more then a troll/fun weapon like the plasma cannon:Fun to use but not effective compared to other weapons in it's class.

I understand Your frustration but it seems to come more from many using it and you being killed repeatedly by it rather then any balance issues(don't wanna put words in your mouth but that's what I'm picking up,not saying that's the case),any weapon used on the field can be overwhelming when used by multiple hostiles even if it's not the best. (example:HMG)

As for armor....yeah it sucks,not the mass drivers fault though.

P.S:mass drivers do kill the user if they are in the splash radius but because not many use the assault mass driver they can easily stay out of said range as it's smaller on the 'normal' mass driver then the assault,it's also the mass driver that dose more splash damage.

P.S.S:I think you'll be happy to know contact nade price has been increased again (should be removed)

PS.S.S: My grammar sucks

The only thing I hate about the MD (besides it's existence) is it's clip size. I see this "Gun" and think "A free war machine?"
What would make me happy? Any of the fallowing really;

* Get rid of it.
* Reduce clip size.
* Nanohives don't resupply it (hell do this for all explosives if you wanna be fair)

I wasn't here in uprising but even with the nurf I probably would've still hated it.

Flaylocks take some level of skill to use but with such an AoE it's still just too much. If it were to be toned down a notch then I would probably not care if I die by it.

Mass driver is getting a little ridiculous too in fairness, given that a lot of people have started just throwing explosions everywhere it's f'ing ridiculous. I think CCP are trolling armour hard, especially given the recent discount on advanced contact grenades.

MD needs a tiny damage reduction and maybe one less round in the chamber. The other thing the MD needs above anything is to be lethal to the user. I have been toe to toe with MD users, SMG'ing their face off for them to point blank shoot the floor underneath me (and themselves) for the damage to outright kill me and not even scratch them.

You do realize the MD took a damage and splash radius nerf already, right? It got overnerfed in Uprising but got buffed back up slightly in 1.2 but has worse field longevity compared to Chrome because of the nanohive nerf and EHP buff on dropsuits. It's pretty much gimped, but some people manage to make it look good.

I do know that, yes. I'm not asking to nerf it back onto the moons of Luminaire (if it even has any moons) but it does need a tiiiiny nerf now and it'll be perfect. It should be area denial because it softens targets for others, not outright kills them.

Flaylock pistols should be removed.

Mass drivers need to be re balanced.

Flaylock pistols should be removed.

Mass drivers need to be re balanced.

Explosives will always be more powerful than any weapon.....what you just requested makes no sense....

Except in New Eden, they aren't. Well at least against shields. They only deal 80% to shields but 120% to armor. Flaylocks are so devastating because it's only a 3-4 round clip and applies damage in a large chunk, just like sniper rifles and forge guns.

but.....but there explosives

Wen I'm having fun I run standard memitar logi with the Ec-3 assualt mass driver , I'm usally run heavy with proto laser, now mass drivers aren't op and I swear DON'T get the devs confused my mass driver has 7.5 m splash radius 75rpm and and 75hp splash damage ..... At level 4 that's pretty balanced to me at least I'm not spray and praying with a gek or duvoll ......

Despite what you say I laugh at the fact that you call any AR/scrambler user spray and pray when your using a weapon that can hit for alot of dmg in a 7.5 meter radius...no doubt you dont pray...you dont freakin have to when your weapon had a radius that big. You can miss them by a mile and still do decent damage to them.

Anti-Shields are precision other than Flux which poses no lethality alone.

I call bull, I'v been killed by flux grenades many times.

same
I've even killed myself on occasion
Once I took out a tank but in all fairness it was kinda wrecked. But still it wasn't on fire so a dam flux shouldn't have had an effect on it at all.... was still kinda cool to see though.

Flux grenades are glitched. I blew up a blaster intillation at full health just by lobbing one at the guy manning it.

Flaylock pistols should be removed.

Mass drivers need to be re balanced.

Mass Driver user here. Mass Drivers are OP in my opinion, but to be fair, I don't exactly have Proficiency levels in other weapons. Feels like base damage is enough to make even shield tankers cringe and don't get me started on how easy it is to make Armor tankers disappear.

All the weapons in the game have situations in which they are at great disadvantage and the Mass Driver is no exception. The Mass Driver rounds do not fly as fast as a Flaylock Pistol's, so its only a little bit harder to direct hit moving targets and further targets. Really close targets and obstructions have made me kill myself or come pretty close on many an occasion. Ultimately, the Mass Driver is deadliest when the user is on a greater elevation than his opponent and his opponent is not on a slope, but on flat ground. Walls and objects to shoot near the Mass Driver victim is also pretty sweet. Mass Drivers are best engaged at extreme close range, long range, on tricky slopes where the Mass Driver is higher on the slope you both are on, on elevations in your favor, or in shield based vehicles.

I've discovered the joy of cooked Flux Grenades and a couple shots from my EXO-5 Mass Driver (the regular variant of Advanced level) could take anybody out regardless of what they ran. Heavies go down pretty easily with that combination especially by direct hits. Light dropsuits barely exist before the might of explosive weaponry in general. Needless to say, most enemies hate me.

My suggestion is to lower the base direct damage by 5%, the splash damage by 15%, and give it much less damage to anything below the blast but greater damage to anything above the blast. If you get to cover at a lower elevation, crouch, or prone (please let us go prone), then explosive weaponry in general should be less of a threat. If you jump away from an explosive round, you should be ragdolled. I've jumped away and eluded a bit of damage from grenades and other Mass Driver users much to their dismay, and the opposite has been true.

TL;DR version: slight nerf, new splash damage mechanics

Like I said before, I don't have proficiency in any other weapons. It is just my opinion.

Proficiently or not, you're citing that you use the weapon in its proper situation, with flux grenades, and claim that it's OP. Try going to-to-toe against an AR or ScR without flux grenades while on level ground in an open area and see how OP the MD really is.

You're right. Its scary being as slow as I am in an Amarr Logi in open areas. I'm not invincible with the Mass Driver, but I still hold the opinion that they're a little too strong.

Most mass driver kills on the feed are Either kill steals or a flux/mass double wammy which by the way is not necessary to use with any other weapon making the mass driver the only weapon that needs the synergy to be really effective.

I don't see people complaining about being one shot by a shotgun, which if you play enough you know to fear them. I dont see poeple complaining about scrambler rifles charge shot, which again can one shot people. I don't see people complaining that the duvlle assault rifle can now kill you at 90+ meters. I just see a bunch of people complaining about them dying to a weapon that needs to splash you 4 to 6 times minimum just to dent your shields if your shield tanked or have a kill if you are armor tanked.

Please don't get me started on it being a noob tube and not needing any skill. This is shameful coming from assault rifle users, SMG users, HMG users and any other weapon with enough Shots per second to be able to spray and pray, which are most weapons being actively used in the game by percentage. Which if we go by percentage the assault rile still is king and the mass driver is not even second on the list.

So please stop making posts like these. They are shameful and make a big scene about something that is not broken. I am speaking for the mass driver and want nothing to do with the flaylock part of the discussion. May the flaylock user come in and defend their weapon. Me I speak for me And Mine. The mass driver. The weapon that was nerfed to near extinction without so much of a heads up. The weapon that had a thread with thousands of posts without getting a dev response. Stop the nonsense and act like your worth your isk. Change your strategy and HTFU.

The only problem any explosive weapon does is that it hits shield for only 70% damage but blaps armor for 130% damage. Weaponry such as scrambler rifles do 120% to shield and 80% to armor having the damage feel more consistent. Most mass driver kills on the feed are Either kill steals or a flux/mass double wammy which by the way is not necessary to use with any other weapon making the mass driver the only weapon that needs the synergy to be really effective. I would like to add that Mass drivers are already starved for ammo having 19 shots (exo-5 variant) and deplete nanohives in the same way grenades deplete them, very very quickly not even having one full clip on the militia, regular nanohive and the compact variant. Adding these two details, the 30% reduction to shield damage the ammo starvation and the need to use 2 weapons to be able to have the effectivenes of 1 makes the mass driver balanced.

Another thing I see people is saying mass drivers are op but I've said it a thousand times and I will say it again. The main problem I see people having with the mass driver is that point and shoot weapon users love to stay around corners or inside little cargo crates thinking they are safe. All of the sudden a mass driver round pops in there and bashes them and they stay in there not wanting to come out; so naturally they die. I see half dead people crouching and getting killed with splash, of course. What did you expect. I mean I see people run more when a sniper hits them and deny the kill but all of the sudden they get mad because they get killed in a corner they chose to stay around even when receiving damage. So please. Step your game up. I don't see people complaining about being one shot by a shotgun, which if you play enough you know to fear them. I dont see poeple complaining about scrambler rifles charge shot, which again can one shot people. I don't see people complaining that the duvlle assault rifle can now kill you at 90+ meters. I just see a bunch of people complaining about them dying to a weapon that needs to splash you 4 to 6 times minimum just to dent your shields if your shield tanked or have a kill if you are armor tanked.

Please don't get me started on it being a noob tube and not needing any skill. This is shameful coming from assault rifle users, SMG users, HMG users and any other weapon with enough Shots per second to be able to spray and pray, which are most weapons being actively used in the game by percentage. Which if we go by percentage the assault rile still is king and the mass driver is not even second on the list.

So please stop making posts like these. They are shameful and make a big scene about something that is not broken. I am speaking for the mass driver and want nothing to do with the flaylock part of the discussion. May the flaylock user come in and defend their weapon. Me I speak for me And Mine. The mass driver. The weapon that was nerfed to near extinction without so much of a heads up. The weapon that had a thread with thousands of posts without getting a dev response. Stop the nonsense and act like your worth your isk. Change your strategy and HTFU.

Shotguns - It's all about stratigy as if you mess up then you're dead... period.

Scrambler/Sniper rifle - This can only be done by actually lining up your shots and hitting the target. Do you know what happens if you mess up? You get hunted down like a dog and put down. What happens when you miss with a MD? You damage the guy anyway AND you still get a few more rapid shots to kill not only your target but a few of his buddies as well.

It's true that these are "Spray and pray" weapons but think of what would happen if even a skilled player tried to line up there shots on you. You would blow them to hell as you DON'T have to line up your shots and there for they have no chance. The "pray" is not that they hit you but that you DON'T hit them!

Don't like the poste? DON'T F*****G READ IT! You know what it's going to be about b4 you even click on it so if you know it's going to annoy you then just pass it up instead of commenting on it which will, in turn, bump it back to page 1 causing more people to comment and eventually "make a big scene".
`sigh. That felt good

]

Okay ALL explosive weapons are 120 to armor and 80 to shields we need to stop spreading lies that it is greater as this just gets armor tankers up in arms. Check out this Dev Blog: [url=http:// http://dust514.com/news/blog/2013/07/weapon-ranges-in-uprising-1.2-and-beyond/]

Back to the OP. The MD is really fine but I understand that people don't like the AOE. It's a mid to close range weapon at best without elevation. Seriously fight these as longer range and they will struggle to hit you even with splash. Now the Flaylock is way OP as splash is 90% of direct dmg with a high ROF, it's the ultimate feet killer.

The Flaylock Pistol and the Mass Driver need
- Reduction of the splash radius to match that of standard level
- Reduction of the splash damage to do 10% and 15% of direct hit respectively


Mass Driver was made with the purpose of being area of denial not an easy mode weapon that you can just flux your enemy and spam 1 ~ 2 rounds to kill it

Explosives 514 can't continue

At the rate those whinner make everything get nerf ...........


I'm starting to wonder if someday instead of bullet we are gonna get flower and rainbow getting out of our Weapon so we can all dance together in this Carebear Paradise.

Remove AR's for a week and force the AR users to try other weapons so they shut up and fix armor tanking. MD problems sloved
Flaylocks have too high of splash damage and ROF.

Shotguns are a weapon that shoot at 85.7 shots per minute, fastest mass driver is 75. No mass driver has the ability to kill an opponent with splash damage in one shot. If you aren't using the shotgun to get behind your opponent and blap him for full damage which is fairly easy with scout suits, then the weapon is being used incorrectly. Strafing speed of these suits even at militia level is beyond the need to make your opponent miss repeatedly while you use your spread to kill or injure him and GTFO. So no, you don't only have one shot to kill a guy and the strategy is not fubared by one single mistake.

---

Sniper rifles are in a little cozy nest and need not worry about most half the things a mass driver user has to worry about. As for the scrambler rifle, he has options. Either use his charge shot or is assault capabilities of rapid fire. The user is the one that chooses in which way to manage his weapon and his overheat prevention strategy.

The second point about the statement above is: Rapid shots on a mass driver? I don't know what mass driver you have been against but mass driver are less than rapid. For those less than willing to actually look up the stats of weapons before raging against any post made to defend the mass driver, I have some numbers for you.

Example

militia assault 750 shots per minute = 10 shots for every 1 shot of the ec-3 assault mass driver (75 shots per minute fastest mass driver and is advanced compared to militia) mass driver damage done = 73 max 93 with damage mods / militia assault rifle damage done without damage mods = 350.

Militia assault rifle vs exo-5 (60 rounds per minute advanced) mass driver = 1 mass driver round per every 12 militia assault rifle rounds. Total damage of the mass driver is 121 max 150 with 1 damage mod and spec / militia assault rifle damage no mods or

As you can see even if half the shots of a militia assaut rifle hits the target they are still hitting for either more or the same damage as advanced tier mass drivers with a damage mod and proficiency.

As for killing him and his buddies, I already posted something about that on my last post.

---

In relation to lining up shots; don't talk to me about lining up shots when your spraying. As stated in the above defense, even if only half the bullets on the militia assault rifle ( no mods or spec) hit the target they are still outdoing or matching the damage of an advanced tier mass driver with damage mods and proficiency into it.

And a simple FYI. Mass driver users have to line up shots. Some of them are very tricky in fact if you ever try killing someone thats above you. If someone is far away you have to compensate the arc and lead the target (shoot in front to be able to cause damage) If he is on level ground and going 1 vs 1 we have to take care in cooking our grenades ( no other weapon NEEDS this).

I'll add more. We have to be even more careful with our shots because more times than not we find ourselves without any ammo. Assault rifle users on the other hand have 300 rounds minimum for a total of 10,200 damage in the the gun unspecced and unmodded. The potential damage of a mass driver, focusing on splash, is 2,700 damage (taking into account it being an advanced weapon 1 complex damage mod and level 3 proficiency rounded). Even if we where to only count direct hits, which are rare indeed, would only be 5,303. So I still don't know what all the fuss is about.

---

If saying all that made you feel good. I urge you to read the last two sentences of my last post so you understand that you dont have to play this game if you don't like the mechanics and are a worthless shot.

Stop playing? Lol I played CoD so a little noob tube is not gonna make me put down the game that easy
My feelings aren't going to change, EVER! so there's no point in trying to convince me otherwise.
I'm not delusional in the fact that you are the same so continuing this argument would be a serous waste of time for the both of us, right?
With that being said I'm gonna walk away with the fact that MD has an advantage over anyone! That's how I feel, that's my opinion. I'm sick of wasting the other player's time with walls of text. Good day and good luck in you future endeavors. (Still feels good )

So after spending the entire weekend on one of my alts (Minmatar Assault) with dual flaylocks, Flaylock/AR, Flaylock/SMG, I have some thoughts to share. The idea of an alpha strike sidearm is interesting and creative, making the flaylock a fun to use weapon. If balanced properly, the flaylock should be at least powerful enough to be considered as a main weapon but with enough drawbacks to add some risk to the rewards of getting a kill with it. As of right now, we have a highly damaging weapon that's easy to fit, has plenty of ammo, and can be spammed for ungodly amounts of DPS. Personally, the damage and blast radius are fine, but it's the lenient fitting, high ammo capacity, and how easy you can spam shots that make the flaylock a problem:



Overall, the CPU/PG requirements have to be raised so everyone and the mother can't equip it and go buck wild. I'm thinking we make the costs significantly higher while taking a page from the specialist shotgun sub variant with more lenient requirements for the specialist pistols at the cost of ammunition capacity. (9~12 rounds) This way, you get a variant that's easier to equip, but doesn't have enough ammo to go around spamming while the standard ones have a decent ammo supply but require more CPU/PG so they have to give something up to fit it. This would be a good way to diminish a dual flaylock user's ammo capacity since they wouldn't be able to fit dual prototypes as well. The breach could probably benifit from a revamp as well, with a CPU/PG requirement similar to the specialists, but a splash or damage buff to make it more viable at the cost of the smaller clip.

Splash radius scaling is another issue that might need to be addressed since explosive weapons are more consistent in the the latest patch and the desynch issues are completely gone. But keep in mind that if the splash damage is reduced, damage might need to be increased across the board to compensate to keep the reward side of risk vs reward consistent while keeping the flaylock viable.



As I've already mentioned, it's not the damage that makes the flaylock imbalanced- it's the spam. So one good option would be to simply reduce the weapons RoF. (somewhere in the neighborhood of 60~70 rpm) This would cut down the rocket spam significantly, allowing someone on the opposing end to have a chance to fight back while forcing the user to aim. The flaylock already has a slower moving projectile compared to DoT based weapons, so this would force the user to make those shots matter more in an encounter instead of lobbing missiles in someone's general direction, hoping for a kill. Reload speed and ammunition capacity can remain untouched, but the damage might need a slight increase to keep with the weapons spike damage theme, keeping it more viable in CQC/Close engagements while requiring skill at mid range and beyond. Making this change would also significantly affect people using dual flaylocks as well since the advantage of having two of them is significantly reduced.

Another option to prevent spamming would be to reduce the ammunition capacity. One of things that keeps the MD balanced is that it has terrible field longevity. With 18 rounds (24 for the assault) you have to really choose your engagements with the MD while either staying in proximity of a supply depot or keeping a steady supply of nanohives. With 21 shots in reserve, the flaylock doesn't have this problem and has field longevity comparable to a riskier spike damage weapons like the shotgun. Reducing the reserve ammo down to maybe 12~9 rounds (9~6 for the specialist) would force a flaylock user to carefully choose when to engage and make nanohives a requirement when using it as a main weapon. Damage and splash could stay relatively same with this option because the weapon would be significantly starved, cutting down its field longevity. This wouldn't affect dual users as much at a glance, but with my idea of increasing the CPU/PG requirements as mentioned above, they would most likely be restricted to dual specialists anyway.

Reducing the reload speed could be another route. As of right now, the flaylock has a 0.5 sec faster reload speed than an AR. For as much damage as it does, there's no real risk in spamming rockets since you can simply pop in another clip in 2.5 seconds. By increasing how fast you need to reload would be a good way to give someone on the opposing end a chance to fight back and force the weapons' user have to make sure those 3-4 rockets connect. Now with this idea, we have to consider how it would affect players using dual flaylocks. So making significant changes to rate of fire or ammo capacity would still need to be considered as well. This is still a viable option, but would require the most work in the long run compared to the others.

These are only a few options I have in regards to spamming. I have some more in regards to splash damage and falloff. I'll probably get around to it after some more testing. But whatever changes CCP makes, I hope they keep it as a highly damaging weapon, but make it riskier to use outside of its niche situation because it really is a fun to use weapon.

Subjected to periodical edits for grammar.

Stop playing? Lol I played CoD

Flaylock pistols should be removed.

Mass drivers need to be re balanced.

Meh If I can get over it then so can you.... half a week ago I was at that point too.... these guns need no nerf Armour needs its goddamned buff!

Buff Armor? eh.. I suppose that could work.

That says it all.. Everything you have said is now invalid...

THIS IS NOT CoD.. it requires skill here.. Unlike Crap on Disc.

1. I never said this is CoD. I merely referenced the fact that grenade launchers are OP and overused in some CoD games. They are deemed an even bigger nuisance then the MD in DUST.
2. In CoD the person with the most skill will win in a 1v1 encounter. In DUST it's the person with the best gear.
3. I take it your the type of player that would go 0-30 right? lol yea don't deny it.

The only REAL problem with CoD is the people that attempt to exploit every part of the game to get an edge. The game it self is actually really good.
I came to DUST to get away from those types of players... Sucks that it seems they are everywhere.

shudda up. MD and FL are not op. I barely hit anyone with it and when I do it chips them. SO shuda up with dat sht.

and the award for worst gamer ever goes to....

Flaylocks are fine the way they are there made to compete with heavys and caldari logis CCP should sto nerfing and start implementing and buffing wepons cause there making it super hard to use half the gun anyone seee a plasma cannon in use with a team of laser rifles with him?

Flaylocks are fine the way they are there made to compete with heavys and caldari logis CCP should sto nerfing and start implementing and buffing wepons cause there making it super hard to use half the gun anyone seee a plasma cannon in use with a team of laser rifles with him?

um... yea you have a point actually. Plasmas are so rare to see. I think I seen like 3 maybe 4 players using them this month. About 6 since I've been playing. Those things must be seriously UP.

Flaylocks are fine the way they are there made to compete with heavys and caldari logis CCP should sto nerfing and start implementing and buffing wepons cause there making it super hard to use half the gun anyone seee a plasma cannon in use with a team of laser rifles with him?

I suppose if you compare the two (plasma and swarm) the plasma would be something players would be more familiar with. And this would also mean that you would have to spec into av(for the swarm) in order to really be effective.

Exactly!

I''m pretty sure people neglected swarm launchers because they weren't dumb fire and never specced into them. So you wind up with players using 3 fittings, all ARs and almost 0 incentive to use something different. Even inexperienced FPS players who like New Eden deserve a krutch. Essentially, the plasma cannon is a rocket launcher, a poorly designed, difficult to use rocket launcher. I'd say make the shots fire straight, slightly faster, get rid of the charging mechanic, and make the operation skill pertain to damage or radius, while creating a militia variant for starter fits. Instant n00b tube.

Idea for starter Fits

Caldari Starters
Frontline Rail Rifle+Bolt Pistol+Nanohive
Medic same as Frontline but with injector and Magsec SMG
AV Swarms+Bolt Pistol
Specialty Fit Sniper Rifle+Magsec SMG

Gallente Starters
Frontline Blaster Rifle + Ion Pistol + Active Scanner
Medic Same as Frontline with injector
AV Plasma Cannon + Ion Pistol
Specialty Fit Shotgun + Ion Pistol

Amarr Starters
Frontline Scrambler Rifle+Bolt Pistol+Drop Pads
Medic same as Frontline but with injector and Scrambler Pistol
AV Amarr light AV weapon +Scrambler Pistol
Specialty Fit Laser Rifle + Scrambler Pistol

Minnie Starters
Frontline Combat Rifle+ Flaylock + RE
Medic same as Frontline but with injector and SMG
AV Minnie AV weapon +SMG
Specialty Fit Mass Driver+SMG

All Militia Variants

Mlt Plasma Cannon will have current Plasma Cannon all other PLC's will have greater Direct damage
Mlt Active Scanner will have have longer cooldown time
Mlt Sc Rifle will have higher heat cost per shot
Mlt Laser Rifle will have longer cooldown speed
Mlt RE's can have 1 RE at a time
Mlt Flaylock will have 2 shots per mag and 10 total shots
Mlt MD will have 4 shots per mag and the 3 meter AoE

Make a new thread about this.

Do it.

Please?

Yeah 1 second

The first person in the history of shooters to have trouble hitting something with a grenade launcher

Okay so its me then? I have two flaylock pistols and I switch to them after 3 shots for a total of 6. AND I STILL MISS! Not miss like oh its over his head. I mean miss like I shot the ground next to him and his life is untouched. ALSO. I am NOT the worse gamer ever. That is just bullsht to assume because I have an issue with a game that many ppl have an issue with that I am simply bad. IF anything. I am simply a victim of bad game design.

They are op the proof is when one side is a squad running Massdriver's and flaylock's and they destroy the other team. In ambush how many have lost and seen the other side have 40+ clones left due to this. Or you were in a skirmish and you could not take the objective because there was a squad sitting there spamming madddrivers and flaylocks while tossing contact nades. If you say very little its because you either do not play enough or your the side doing it. How can you take any objective if they are spamming every inch of the ground with explosives its impossible. The only thing that stops this is an orbital strike. This is madness, the only solution is to sit up on the hill and play sniper all day. No thank you.

They are op the proof is when one side is a squad running Massdriver's and flaylock's and they destroy the other team. In ambush how many have lost and seen the other side have 40+ clones left due to this. Or you were in a skirmish and you could not take the objective because there was a squad sitting there spamming madddrivers and flaylocks while tossing contact nades. If you say very little its because you either do not play enough or your the side doing it. How can you take any objective if they are spamming every inch of the ground with explosives its impossible. The only thing that stops this is an orbital strike. This is madness, the only solution is to sit up on the hill and play sniper all day. No thank you.

Okay so its me then? I have two flaylock pistols and I switch to them after 3 shots for a total of 6. AND I STILL MISS! Not miss like oh its over his head. I mean miss like I shot the ground next to him and his life is untouched. ALSO. I am NOT the worse gamer ever. That is just bullsht to assume because I have an issue with a game that many ppl have an issue with that I am simply bad. IF anything. I am simply a victim of bad game design.

I honestly feel that everyone asking for a MD nerf are the same d-bags that run head on at a heavy hip firing their duvolle AR. No one ever thinks, "me Grimlock need new strategy..."

Okay so its me then? I have two flaylock pistols and I switch to them after 3 shots for a total of 6. AND I STILL MISS! Not miss like oh its over his head. I mean miss like I shot the ground next to him and his life is untouched. ALSO. I am NOT the worse gamer ever. That is just bullsht to assume because I have an issue with a game that many ppl have an issue with that I am simply bad. IF anything. I am simply a victim of bad game design.

So you just admitted you dont even aim at the enemy and go for the gaylock splash attack and are running two of them? You sir are bad and should feel bad.

Ok troll over:)

CCP should have given a miltia fit of most if not all of the fits for eve1 to try out, that would have resulted in moreppltrying new guns rather then just the AR. I have tried MD, dont like them much tbh, not my kind of weapon. My thoughts on the guns that eve1 is whining about to some degree:-

MD - the issue is not for me the splash damage or the direct hit damage, but when you see entire squads/teams running them just spamming the f*ck out of the enemy team (Maphia clan for example seem to run ALOT of MD in game but they are not the only ones). It is hard to use tactics to counter 6 ppl camping by a supply depot spraying grenades in a circle constantly.

FLaylocks, my issue is the guys that run 2 of them and spam the ground relying on the splash damage while thinking they are gods and eve1 should kiss their proverbial digital pucker-ports.

Potential fixes?

MD: LIMIT the NUMBER of MD used by a team, its an area dispersal/crowd control weapon, its not crowd control if there are 6 or more of them in the same space! Has no one playing this game heard of the combined arms strategy? Use them to wear ppl down while a fire team of Scrambler/AR/SMG/ whatever attacks from another direction. Leave the damage as is, they have to be usefull or they are a waste of time coding them and SP into them.

FL: It is a SIDEARM, LOCK THE DAMN THING TO SIDEARM ONLY SLOT! It is not a Light weapon and should be going into the light weapons lot, just the sidearm one. It needs a slight nerf to fire rate, one more in the clip, and half the splash damage. UP the CPU or PG rateing for them and considering how effective they are increase the cost of the damn things for ISK variants.

For what its worth I run AR or Scrambler rifles (both kinds) and the occasional sniper setup trying a few dif guns out is fun:) Once I have these SP maxed out and am happy with my dropsuit builds, I will spec into other weapons to see what they are like.

Try to adapt to these guns too, not easy sometimes (I stopped playing in beta for a while Kind of wish I had the patience to carry on now, as I am still learning the maps myself.

Also bear in mind this game is still not finished, I am mad a bout a few things (the bugs the asshats that use the invisiblity glitch the game costing me 35k ISK for a dropsuit cos I spawn under the flking map in a endless freefall.)
But I believe if ppl stick with the game and give them time to get there they will get there, I hope so at least cos after the bugged up mess of BF3 I am doubtful about buying BF4 for PS3 or PS4. I cam back to DUST because I wanted something different to COD or BF.

I should have been clearer there: the Light/heavy weapon slots on suits should be locked to those weapons while the sidearms should be locked to sidearm slots. The only exception shouldbe those classes/suits that dont run 2 weapon slots for example.

I am not trying to be a douche to other players,I just am trying to suggest away to fix the current "I cannot aim so I am going to splash ppl to death" crap that the game has become, its not AR514 tome its become SPLASH DAMAGE514

Punishing everything for one imbalanced weapon may be taking to the extreme. I personally think the Flaylock damage/splash is fine, it's just the spam and lenient fitting requirements. Raise the fitting costs, keep the specialist cheaper to fit but with less ammo, and lower the RoF so it can't be spammed. It still has to hurt like hell, but people should at least have to aim and give something up to fit it.

Ty for the feedback there, that does make sense, I know this is a touchy issue, the ppl that abuse the splash damage are going to defend it to the death while others will say its massivley OP. I just want to play the game, being killed by a well aimed shot is one thing, but being concussed to death by a scrub firing at the ground is more annoying then the scrubs in the murder jeep that dont seem to know they have a gun

I agree, nobody likes a cheap death. (this is why tankers hate AV grenades so much) But at the same time you have to experience a weapon on both sides to get an idea of it. I used an alt of mine all last weekend to play around with all the flaylocks and all the variants to come up with the conclusion above. If you haven't tried the flaylock, give it a shot. It's a fun weapon to use, but ti's just too damn common.

Maphia clan for example seem to run ALOT of MD in game but they are not the only ones