Lol! Please just quiet down pup. Let the big dogs talk.

I don't know why your talking then little pup.thought you said the big dogs are talking. So quiet down and sit in the back.

1. It shoots missiles not baby grenades
2. It's useless till level 5 = almost 7mill sp
3. It has a three shot clip
4. It's the proficiency damage, rapid reload, an clip increase that makes it scary an for that much sp it should!
5. Instead of whinning about it or getting killed by it, follow suit an get one.
As a scout it's about the only usefull range scary weapon I can use to back up my my knives so please don't go scream nerf hammer when almost every weapon I spec into gets beat because people spec it powerful an it kills you, play smarter, evade, switch weapons , hell get one, just don't ruin mine! Shotty already got slapped from people like you so just play wiser don't cry!

It is OP for sure. I see them destroy even shield tankers. I can't dodge their splash damage, sometimes I get lucky and dodge it but it's a pistol so it reloads really quickly. It needs to be nerfed definitely. The people that say it's fine is because they're the ones going 30-0 every match. I understand it can take an armor tanker like me down pretty well but not like it is. They hit me once and I'm at below half armor. Shield tankers have a problem too. Ridiculous.

The gun is not fine, the people who say it is are the ones going 20-1 who don't want their toys taken away

Triple or quadruple the ISK price of the gun IMO

It's only good when hit detection works properly. You can jump over the explosion.

So you want to turn this into bunnyhop 514?

No thanks.

Are you guys aware of how godlike it is? Is there plans to nerf it down a little bit? It's getting to the point where people are just running around using nothing else specially in the Planetary Conquest that was suppose to bring Longevity to the game. Nobody will want to go up against full teams of guys using Rapid fire grenade launchers that are more than capable of killing with splash damage.

Are you guys aware of how godlike it is? Is there plans to nerf it down a little bit? It's getting to the point where people are just running around using nothing else specially in the Planetary Conquest that was suppose to bring Longevity to the game. Nobody will want to go up against full teams of guys using Rapid fire grenade launchers that are more than capable of killing with splash damage.

The gun is not fine, the people who say it is are the ones going 20-1 who don't want their toys taken away

Triple or quadruple the ISK price of the gun IMO

it is going to be nerfed...sorry, CCP accidentally made it too OP when they introduced it as a new [overly] good weapon

Why Not Use an AR/ ScR with your Knives?

I Don't play Scout, so I don't know the Amount of fitting Resources.

I wouldn't think that Knives would take That much Fitting, since they are a Sidearm.

7mil SP? What are you smoking sir and where can I get some? nothing, NOTHING takes 7mil SP to get into. The Core is OP nothing else, no I don't use AR's, no i don't run miltia I have a heavy and an assualt on 2 alts. Core wins everytime, coincidence? I think not.

Put up some vids to back up your claims.

Otherwise, my text is as valid as yours.

Flaylock, including Core, is fine.

I've seen this before when people are protecting things...
The duvolle tac is fine, you just need to get good, stop complaining, the viazam is not OP (chromosome), its balanced, where's the proof.


For the record, doing what you suggest would eliminate the weapon from the game. Kinda like Lasers now, and to a slightly lesser degree MDs. Let me guess, you only use the AR right?

I think the gun is really cool. It's just kind of sad how many people use it. I would hate to see an inventive weapon be nerfed to oblivion. I would hope that PG/CPU values are increased before any other stat changes hit the weapon. Making it harder to carry 2 of them and fit decent modules all around should be the goal of balancing this thing out.

7,463,520 do the math before you make yourself look stupid https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv?key=0AmaDmQ0quOz3dEFPWktkUWdZcVpMWnRZSDRkZDFzUkE&pli=1&pli=1&pli=1&pli=1
That's the skill chart tell me I'm wrong!

I don't see it as abuse. That's what it does. The problem is how much persistant fire this thing can lay down with 2 of them equipped and it's fast reload time. Adjust those factors before you try to justify having a miniature rocket launcher that fires explosives that somehow only have a basketball size explosion. Or a weapon that has the concussion force of an airhorn. I just don't like games that have really awesome weapons, that make no sense in action.

I did some experiments last night and found the actual rate of fire(or at least close to it) at 105 RPM(for comparison using the same methodology used below the mass driver is 58 RPM - which is less than 4% off of what the documentation says which is 60 RPM).

Coincidentally the mass driver and the flaylock both take the same amount of time to fire all of their ammo(27s including reloads which makes this next part a better comparison). Damage for the entire amount is similar for direct damage at the prototype level but far off for splash damage. 266.2 direct and 127.6 splash on Freedom Mass driver, 239.8 direct and 214.5 splash on the Core Flaylock.

That is 4791.6 potential direct damage(266.2*18 shots) and 2296.8 splash damage for the Freedom Mass Driver(47.9% splash compared to direct damage).

That is 5035.8 potential direct damage(239.8*21 shots) and 4504.5 splash damage for the Core Flaylock Pistol(89.45% splash compared to direct damage).

Direct damage is fine(it takes some skill to get direct hits) but the splash damage is severely disproportionate to other weapons with splash damage.


TL;DR

For proper weapon balancing direct damage should remain the same but the splash damage should be reduced by half. The splash radius is fine on the Core Flaylock but it does need to be adjusted on the standard and advanced models(I would suggest increasing them to 1.75m and 1.85m).


RPM Methodology
Methodology: take fully stocked standard flaylock, create macro on mouse to trigger m1 every 60ms, hold fire until rounds finished, time with stopwatch.

Average time to finish rounds is 27s(makes it easier - actual times were 27.78, 27.56 ,26.83, 26.95, 26.70 ,26.92 - actual average of 27.1s or 27.061s removing the upper and lower outliers).

21 rounds
2.5s reload
3 rounds per clip
21 / 3 = 7 clips
7 - 1 = 6 reloads(no reload after last clip)
6 * 2.5 = 15s reload time

27 - 15 = 12s to fire all 21 rounds

21 / 12 = 1.75 rounds per second
1.75 * 60s = 105 RPM
END RPM Methodology





Flaylock Pistol Operation - 621,920 - required - spec into
Flaylock Pistol Proficiency - 1,554,920 - very useful - spec into
Flaylock Pistol Rapid Reload - 1,865,920 - mildly useful(2.5s reload down to 1.88s reload) - do not spec as you can kill most suits in 1 clip)
Flaylock Pistol Fitting Optimization - 1,865,920 - nearly worthless - do not spec unless you need a single PG on the core flaylock(no effect on other variants)
Flaylock Pistol Ammo Capacity - 932,920 - mildly useful - an extra 5 shots - do not spec, advanced nanohives are a better investment than this skill

While you are technically correct you are realistically wrong. Just over 2 million to fully utilize this weapon, just under another 5 for nearly useless bonuses(they are placeholder bonuses and may eventually become useful but as it is nobody will have fully specced into flaylock pistols).

[Hey genius dumb dumb, now that you proved how smart you are that post was for the knob that said no weapon in the game takes a total 7 million sp to skill into fully that was the proof hence the skill chart not that anyone would fully but that was the point.!
Tha fact that you had to get all math god mod means you can't read and spend your time trying to prove people wrong all the time an probably live alone with 8 cats.
I never said to skill it all the way , I said to do so costs over 7 million an I think everyone knows that shyts a waste of time so tell me mister smarty pants do you feel like a genius all proud still ?
Or like a moron that didn't read?!

2. It's useless till level 5 = almost 7mill sp

Hey genius dumb dumb, now that you proved how smart you are that post was for the knob that said no weapon in the game takes a total 7 million sp to skill into fully that was the proof hence the skill chart not that anyone would fully but that was the point.!
Tha fact that you had to get all math god mod means you can't read and spend your time trying to prove people wrong all the time an probably live alone with 8 cats.
I never said to skill it all the way , I said to do so costs over 7 million an I think everyone knows that shyts a waste of time so tell me mister smarty pants do you feel like a genius all proud still ?
Or like a moron that didn't read?!

1. It shoots missiles not baby grenades
2. It's useless till level 5 = almost 7mill sp
3. It has a three shot clip
4. It's the proficiency damage, rapid reload, an clip increase that makes it scary an for that much sp it should!
5. Instead of whinning about it or getting killed by it, follow suit an get one.
As a scout it's about the only usefull range scary weapon I can use to back up my my knives so please don't go scream nerf hammer when almost every weapon I spec into gets beat because people spec it powerful an it kills you, play smarter, evade, switch weapons , hell get one, just don't ruin mine! Shotty already got slapped from people like you so just play wiser don't cry!

I think he proved himself pretty smart and shot your BS argument full of holes. Saying the gun isn't out of balance because it takes a lot of SP is not a valid argument. If everyone knows it's a waste of time why did you try to use it in your argument to begin with? He did his homework and demonstrated how the flaylock does not require accuracy to very quickly dish out crazy damage.