DUST Search - Transfering Isk to Dust wallets from EvE

Altina McAlterson wrote:

Dias Bailey wrote:

if we were allowed to keep the isk, you would be able to see the distribution of wealth form over the course of this build. this is insight into a group dynamic. if CCP are concerned about their more casual players, understanding how isk is distributed from the wealthy to the poor is incredibly insightful. currently, there is not much more information to gain on the economics of this build. the unintended behavior is an opportunity to study unintended behavior.

Sort of but not really. There's not going to be any real redistribution because when you buy something the money simply vanishes. It's not going to move from the corps that transferred the ISK to anyone else, it just vanishes. That's really the main reason that this could throw off the balance of the game for a bit. It's never going to work itself out. Prices are set, quantities are infinite and nothing trickles down. The only distribution is from CEO to corp member. Everyone else is completely isolated. This could possibly turn out to be a big deal, might turn out to be nothing Be interesting to see what CCP does with this one.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
Ydubbs81 RND Ahrendee Mercenaries Legacy Rising 886	Posted - 2012.10.21 08:05:00 - [181] - Quote How kitten backwards is this though? They set a cap on skill points so that newbies can compete yet eve vets can transfer billions of isk to dust characters like its nothing. What's the deal with that???
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.10.21 08:07:00 - [182] - Quote Zion Shad wrote: The part that sucks the most is that this is taking time and man power away from CCP in working on Dust No. They are working on dust. If tonight's instability is in any way or form related to the probably HUGE number of items suddenly being bought from the market, along with an unknown number of players and corps with very large wallets, we found a major bug. They are working on figuring this bug out. So time is not being taken away from DUST.
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.10.21 08:50:00 - [183] - Quote @CCP May I suggest putting up a sticky with for instance the message "Don't transfer ISK from EVE" in the headline?
Jariel Manton SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 210	Posted - 2012.10.21 09:13:00 - [184] - Quote Dewie Cheecham wrote: Zion Shad wrote: The part that sucks the most is that this is taking time and man power away from CCP in working on Dust No. They are working on dust. If tonight's instability is in any way or form related to the probably HUGE number of items suddenly being bought from the market, along with an unknown number of players and corps with very large wallets, we found a major bug. They are working on figuring this bug out. So time is not being taken away from DUST. I''m not sure what you reasoning behind this is. I dont see the logic i guess, why would buying more than normal amounts of products account for a mic bug.
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.10.21 09:19:00 - [185] - Quote Jariel Manton wrote: Dewie Cheecham wrote: Zion Shad wrote: The part that sucks the most is that this is taking time and man power away from CCP in working on Dust No. They are working on dust. If tonight's instability is in any way or form related to the probably HUGE number of items suddenly being bought from the market, along with an unknown number of players and corps with very large wallets, we found a major bug. They are working on figuring this bug out. So time is not being taken away from DUST. I''m not sure what you reasoning behind this is. I dont see the logic i guess, why would buying more than normal amounts of products account for a mic bug. I have no idea. I don't think they are, I'm referring to the ISK "bug" where some problems have been observed when people do it. My guess is that they had to restart the server over instabilities that may have arisen over the large amounts of ISK that flooded into DUST. The Mic bug then happened when the server was brought up again.
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.10.21 09:21:00 - [186] - Quote Ydubbs81 RND wrote: How kitten backwards is this though? They set a cap on skill points so that newbies can compete yet eve vets can transfer billions of isk to dust characters like its nothing. What's the deal with that??? For now, it is unintended behaviour (CCP's word). Once DUST is released, it'll be fully intended with the difference that the ISK won't be "free"
Angrim Khan Bragian Order Amarr Empire 21	Posted - 2012.10.21 09:37:00 - [187] - Quote Dewie Cheecham wrote: Zion Shad wrote: The part that sucks the most is that this is taking time and man power away from CCP in working on Dust No. They are working on dust. If tonight's instability is in any way or form related to the probably HUGE number of items suddenly being bought from the market, along with an unknown number of players and corps with very large wallets, we found a major bug. They are working on figuring this bug out. So time is not being taken away from DUST. The whole point of a Beta. So ultimately this is a good thing. Imagine if the full release came without this being discovered. The reimbursements and confiscations would be a nightmare for players and the GM's.
Altina McAlterson TRUE TEA BAGGERS 362	Posted - 2012.10.21 10:06:00 - [188] - Quote Angrim Khan wrote: Dewie Cheecham wrote: Zion Shad wrote: The part that sucks the most is that this is taking time and man power away from CCP in working on Dust No. They are working on dust. If tonight's instability is in any way or form related to the probably HUGE number of items suddenly being bought from the market, along with an unknown number of players and corps with very large wallets, we found a major bug. They are working on figuring this bug out. So time is not being taken away from DUST. The whole point of a Beta. So ultimately this is a good thing. Imagine if the full release came without this being discovered. The reimbursements and confiscations would be a nightmare for players and the GM's. It's actually going to be intended when the game launches, so it won't be an issue. I've been hearing a lot about this could be a good thing. Not really. This is a situation that will never happen after release. Once the game has an economy stuff like this could provide some insight, but now. Not like this.
Osiris Greywolf Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 80	Posted - 2012.10.21 10:35:00 - [189] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: Angrim Khan wrote: Dewie Cheecham wrote: Zion Shad wrote: The part that sucks the most is that this is taking time and man power away from CCP in working on Dust No. They are working on dust. If tonight's instability is in any way or form related to the probably HUGE number of items suddenly being bought from the market, along with an unknown number of players and corps with very large wallets, we found a major bug. They are working on figuring this bug out. So time is not being taken away from DUST. The whole point of a Beta. So ultimately this is a good thing. Imagine if the full release came without this being discovered. The reimbursements and confiscations would be a nightmare for players and the GM's. It's actually going to be intended when the game launches, so it won't be an issue. I've been hearing a lot about this could be a good thing. Not really. This is a situation that will never happen after release. Once the game has an economy stuff like this could provide some insight, but now. Not like this. Well, considering the fact that this happenned, I wouldn't be too sure.
poopchucker9900 SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 30	Posted - 2012.10.21 11:24:00 - [190] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Transferring ISK from an EVE account to a DUST account is unintended behaviour. I would recommend the corporations who have done this to leave it in their corporation wallets while we investigate. you guys just got served!

Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.10.21 11:43:00 - [191] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: Angrim Khan wrote: Dewie Cheecham wrote: Zion Shad wrote: The part that sucks the most is that this is taking time and man power away from CCP in working on Dust No. They are working on dust. If tonight's instability is in any way or form related to the probably HUGE number of items suddenly being bought from the market, along with an unknown number of players and corps with very large wallets, we found a major bug. They are working on figuring this bug out. So time is not being taken away from DUST. The whole point of a Beta. So ultimately this is a good thing. Imagine if the full release came without this being discovered. The reimbursements and confiscations would be a nightmare for players and the GM's. It's actually going to be intended when the game launches, so it won't be an issue. I've been hearing a lot about this could be a good thing. Not really. This is a situation that will never happen after release. Once the game has an economy stuff like this could provide some insight, but now. Not like this. The potential bugs observed in this certainly weren't intended. That is a good thing though.
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.10.21 11:45:00 - [192] - Quote poopchucker9900 wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Transferring ISK from an EVE account to a DUST account is unintended behaviour. I would recommend the corporations who have done this to leave it in their corporation wallets while we investigate. you guys just got served! Did we? We weren't being secretive at all, even going so far as to ask the forum if this was really intended. We got our answer, and hopefully people stopped doing it.
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.10.21 11:48:00 - [193] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: This is a situation that will never happen after release. Once the game has an economy stuff like this could provide some insight, but now. Not like this. This was unintended, but as for it being useless, not by a long shot. Remember we are only a handful of players working on the market. if it destabilize the server now, as some indication may suggest it did, imagine what will happen with 10 or 20 times the number of players. Even failure provides valuable data. Often more than success does.
Laurent Cazaderon Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 1155	Posted - 2012.10.21 12:07:00 - [194] - Quote i have trouble understanding this being considered an exploit . Isnt the whole purpose of the game to mix the two communities ? To have EVE corporations and dust ones working together ? I thought ISK would be the best mean to do it. Fund mercs, get back something in return. Now, What the french started a corp 8 month ago in EVE and worked to get that ISK. And we shouldnt be able to use it in dust ? Why exactly ? Now, i see people being worried about corps using tons of ISK in every contract they'll get. But, those rich corp will have no interest in wasting tons of ISK, no matter how deep their pocket are, unless the end game cant earn back more isk than was used. Yet, i get it when coming to the tester's tournament that it will make things a LOT unbalanced for corps who have big HAVs users. But, this is an extraordinary case as i dont see this type of tournament being organised that often.
Dias Bailey the Aurum Grinder and Company 10	Posted - 2012.10.21 14:18:00 - [195] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: Dias Bailey wrote: if we were allowed to keep the isk, you would be able to see the distribution of wealth form over the course of this build. this is insight into a group dynamic. if CCP are concerned about their more casual players, understanding how isk is distributed from the wealthy to the poor is incredibly insightful. currently, there is not much more information to gain on the economics of this build. the unintended behavior is an opportunity to study unintended behavior. Sort of but not really. There's not going to be any real redistribution because when you buy something the money simply vanishes. It's not going to move from the corps that transferred the ISK to anyone else, it just vanishes. That's really the main reason that this could throw off the balance of the game for a bit. It's never going to work itself out. Prices are set, quantities are infinite and nothing trickles down. The only distribution is from CEO to corp member. Everyone else is completely isolated. This could possibly turn out to be a big deal, might turn out to be nothing Be interesting to see what CCP does with this one. I agree it doesn't give you the whole picture, but it would give some insightful perspective. and like i said, whatever they were studying about the isk rewards/isk cost before should be understood by now for this build.
Dias Bailey the Aurum Grinder and Company 10	Posted - 2012.10.21 14:29:00 - [196] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: Angrim Khan wrote: Dewie Cheecham wrote: Zion Shad wrote: The part that sucks the most is that this is taking time and man power away from CCP in working on Dust No. They are working on dust. If tonight's instability is in any way or form related to the probably HUGE number of items suddenly being bought from the market, along with an unknown number of players and corps with very large wallets, we found a major bug. They are working on figuring this bug out. So time is not being taken away from DUST. The whole point of a Beta. So ultimately this is a good thing. Imagine if the full release came without this being discovered. The reimbursements and confiscations would be a nightmare for players and the GM's. It's actually going to be intended when the game launches, so it won't be an issue. I've been hearing a lot about this could be a good thing. Not really. This is a situation that will never happen after release. Once the game has an economy stuff like this could provide some insight, but now. Not like this. in eve, i can make roughly 300m in a couple hours of playtime. I plan on fully supporting our sister corp in dust with those wages minus the cost of producing those wages. Now i'm not rich in eve. i have less than 10b in assets probably. Imagine what the big alliance will do. the beauty of dust is that it could wind up being Eve's greatest isk sink. it currently needs it. there is way too much isk inflation in the game as it is now.
tribal wyvern ZionTCD Legacy Rising 673	Posted - 2012.10.21 14:35:00 - [197] - Quote I don't understand how its 'not working as intended' though, I mean eve players can give fellow eve players isk, dust is in new eden and isk is a universal currency. Eve players hire dust players so it makes sense that they can give mercs isk to fund their needs on the battlefield, so how is it not working as intended? Ccp please be more clear about this and explain in better detail
Marlon cart-fost Doomheim 1	Posted - 2012.10.21 14:56:00 - [198] - Quote i thought the intention was that the mercs were suppose to win the ISK from EVE players through contracts if they succeed in do the contract terms they got paid and if they didn't they don't get paid the contract.
Deskalkulos Ildigan CrimeWave Syndicate 115	Posted - 2012.10.21 14:57:00 - [199] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Jariel Manton wrote: [...] We will obviously see ISK flow between the games at some point but there are 2 important reasons why we want to lock it down for now: - ISK on SiSi is meaningless for EVE players because it is their test server not the live server - We need to make sure everything is economically stable first and then ease the flow in or risk unbalancing one of the games. At this stage, the dust economy is still finding its feet so we are not ready for that yet. Well then i can only hope you have fun balancing the economics of two separate games without destroying/changing the feel of the older one (It sure seems to be quite a complex challenge, but some people like challenges i heard).
Kengfa Akcay Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 84	Posted - 2012.10.21 15:11:00 - [200] - Quote I say put everybody that spent their isk they transferred into the negatives!

Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. 1216	Posted - 2012.10.21 15:25:00 - [201] - Quote Kengfa Akcay wrote: I say put everybody that spent their isk they transferred into the negatives! That ISK is in my character's wallet. I would have to stop playing entirely to avoid using it. Also, they aren't going to punish anyone for finding this loophole, because they confirmed last night that this is part of why they put us back together in the first place. At worst, we'll get an ISK reset to what it was the day before this all happened, and I have no issue with that. Stop being angry that you "missed the party" or something.
Gregor stormwalker Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3	Posted - 2012.10.21 15:55:00 - [202] - Quote ok this is only my view and speculations but this is how i see it, the resson ccp did not want this to be happening yet is as they say they are trying to workout the economy, at this point they are trying to find a base lvl for the isk being created and used this is importent for the casual player that might not get involved in the high end side of this to start with at lest, they need to find a lvl of isk that allows players to buy the stuff they want but not be so high as not make isk worthless and also give players that have high skills a resson to move away from high sec into the bigger universe secondly the isk on this server EVE side is worthless im i right? this means that ok in the full game EVE players will be able to send isk over but it will have more importence, I am guessing most EVE corps are not going to just throw isk at dust they are going to want to see a return and wont be senting 5 bil to a corp to attack a planet that is only worth 150 mil a week (i know my numbers are probably wrong the you get the point) they are tring to build the econormy up step by step 1st with the quick battles this is to create money to put into the system now they have corp v corp so money is starting to flow between the corps, next they might open up the player to player market to allow player to supplement there income by selling loot and allow overplayers to spend less to get there top gear. and then there is player based manufacturing tobe worked out these are alot of things that need to be balanced. so as i see it this massive injection of isk into the server is not a good thing once everything is sorted the isk will flow between game but right now i think this will course more harm that the SP farming for precision strikes
Knightshade Belladonna Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 288	Posted - 2012.10.21 15:59:00 - [203] - Quote "unintended behavior" "hindering testing of a market" Did aur sales suddenly go to zero for the last 3 days?
Lonewolf514 79	Posted - 2012.10.21 16:04:00 - [204] - Quote Knightshade Belladonna wrote: "unintended behavior" "hindering testing of a market" Did aur sales suddenly go to zero for the last 3 days? think about it does it matter where they make money? eve or dust.
Knightshade Belladonna Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 288	Posted - 2012.10.21 16:10:00 - [205] - Quote Lonewolf514 wrote: Knightshade Belladonna wrote: "unintended behavior" "hindering testing of a market" Did aur sales suddenly go to zero for the last 3 days? think about it does it matter where they make money? eve or dust. Nah it doesn't, tbh I don't undersand why they have been trying push aur so hard lately. Eve is still climbing and gaining more revenue each year than the previous. I just wanted to stir some **** before I leave for the week hehe
Conraire Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 52	Posted - 2012.10.21 18:02:00 - [206] - Quote Knightshade Belladonna wrote: "unintended behavior" "hindering testing of a market" Did aur sales suddenly go to zero for the last 3 days? Doubt it, I've still been spending Aurum like normal to keep my weapons stocked. Blindfire, blastwave, and farsight. Still takes time to build up SP to use the higher level weapons.
Altina McAlterson TRUE TEA BAGGERS 362	Posted - 2012.10.21 18:15:00 - [207] - Quote Conraire wrote: Knightshade Belladonna wrote: "unintended behavior" "hindering testing of a market" Did aur sales suddenly go to zero for the last 3 days? Doubt it, I've still been spending Aurum like normal to keep my weapons stocked. Blindfire, blastwave, and farsight. Still takes time to build up SP to use the higher level weapons. Maybe part of the reason for the SP cap right there. Maybe not, but it would make pretty good business sense.
epicsting Doomheim 60	Posted - 2012.10.22 06:08:00 - [208] - Quote I had to grind though millions of people to get the chash I have now and im rich sitting a t a comfable 10million I just use the de default drop suit it not hard to kill some one point and shot.
D3aTH D3alER54 The Southern Legion 130	Posted - 2012.10.22 07:48:00 - [209] - Quote Knightshade Belladonna wrote: Lonewolf514 wrote: Knightshade Belladonna wrote: "unintended behavior" "hindering testing of a market" Did aur sales suddenly go to zero for the last 3 days? think about it does it matter where they make money? eve or dust. Nah it doesn't, tbh I don't undersand why they have been trying push aur so hard lately. Eve is still climbing and gaining more revenue each year than the previous. I just wanted to stir some **** before I leave for the week hehe Yeah, it seems all the good games are getting more and more popular as time goes by..
angelarch Algintal Core Gallente Federation 93	Posted - 2012.10.22 10:12:00 - [210] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Transferring ISK from an EVE account to a DUST account is unintended behaviour. I would recommend the corporations who have done this to leave it in their corporation wallets while we investigate. huh!? I thought that was the whole POINT of playing Dust if you were an EVE player. I'll have to rethink this whole thing now lol. . .



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