https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=346378#post346378

So this is in reference to the above thread, in which one person is insisting that Scouts are useless because of the strafing nerf. So I thought I'd ask the forum of they thought Scouts were useless.

Scouts weren't made for CQC, they were used for CQC simply because of poor hit detection added to insane strafing speeds. If the people crying they can't play their scouts the way they used to, it's because they were never meant to play that way in the first place.
Scouts were meant to be tactical, low sig profile plus high mobility allows for strategic flanking and/or mobile sniper tactics.

I just have a question to add to the thread.

What can scouts do that assault suits can't to the same or near same effectiveness?

I just have a question to add to the thread.

What can scouts do that assault suits can't to the same or near same effectiveness?

Yes, this is what people are missing. The scouts are now just slightly crappier versions of their equivalent assault suits. They are ever so slightly faster and get some tiny buffs to signature radius and pointless stuff life reload and draw speed, but have substantially less HP, CPU, and PG and also have less fitting slots. I'm not convinced that there is any situation in which a scout suit would be superior to an assault suit. The tradeoffs just don't add up. It doesn't matter if you're slightly faster if you die considerably sooner... that speed bonus doesn't make up for the drawbacks in a firefight. In any instance you can come up with, you're better off in the equivalent assault suit.

Scout suit is a pointless piece of gear now.

Not true. I have a Scout with a Shotgun and an Assault with a Shotgun...the Scout is magnitudes more efficient...the Assault is just too slow to close in. If you want to kill an AR with a Shotgun, you HAVE to flank. Run around some cover to get them from behind or the side, while they are distracted. You can't really do this with an Assault. And if the AR sees you while you're still not close, you're dead, regardless of what suit you wear.

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=346378#post346378

So this is in reference to the above thread, in which one person is insisting that Scouts are useless because of the strafing nerf. So I thought I'd ask the forum of they thought Scouts were useless.

How about some numbers. Assault suit sprint is 7m/s. Scout suit sprint? 7.8m/s. So, the assault suit has 90% of the speed that scout suits have. And then you look at CPU/PG and hit points. I guess it would be fair for the scout suits to have 90% of what the assaults do, right? Wrong. They have roughly 2/3 of PG/CPU and hit points.

I don't care about strafing. But the scout should be able to outrun an assault by more than 10%. Especially if scouts only have 2/3 of capacity and hit points.

Everyone said scouts were OP before, but a lot of us knew it was bad hit detection. Hit detection is fixed, and the real scout suit is revealed. It's paper thin and not that fast.

Don't mind that they're paper thin, but give them something to compensate. More CPU/PG, or much much faster sprinting speed. Assaults should only be able to sprint 60% or 70% of what the scouts can if we're going by the CPU/PG and hit points comparison.

As is, scouts = worthless.

Exactly. The really funny thing is, the assault suit has enough extra CPU/PG (as well as extra fitting spots) to actually make up for AND EVEN SURPASS the scout suit in sprint speed and STILL have more CPU/PG and higher HP.

Scouts weren't made for CQC, they were used for CQC simply because of poor hit detection added to insane strafing speeds. If the people crying they can't play their scouts the way they used to, it's because they were never meant to play that way in the first place.
Scouts were meant to be tactical, low sig profile plus high mobility allows for strategic flanking and/or mobile sniper tactics.

Scouts weren't made for CQC, they were used for CQC simply because of poor hit detection added to insane strafing speeds. If the people crying they can't play their scouts the way they used to, it's because they were never meant to play that way in the first place.
Scouts were meant to be tactical, low sig profile plus high mobility allows for strategic flanking and/or mobile sniper tactics.

I just have a question to add to the thread.

What can scouts do that assault suits can't to the same or near same effectiveness?

I say remove SMG, nove knifes and all CQC weapons if there is no suit that is made for close quarters..

saying it's not made for that is just dumb. They promoted a scout suit with SMG in the merc pack...

flanking works sometimes but if you can't speed tank or shield tank as the first one in the fight flanking, it's not a flank, it's prolonging death for a min or two more.

CCP stated that you can specialize in what you want. I don't put down people in heavies sniping.. why can't a scout suit be up in your face?

Why are people agreeing with this type of foolishness?

Suits are not made to fit one role, they are made to be versatile and for players to have options in how they want to play.

Now a whole play style has been nerfed/removed from the game. It was ridiculous to nerf the strafing, and to change the SMG.

The strafing was never a problem, only the hit detection and frame rate issues. Doing all things at once just made the Scout a useless suit.

Maybe if the Profile Dampeners did anything, or if any of the scanning skills or equipment mattered there would be something for the Scout, but right now it has lost everything.

Nothing, and that is the problem.

The Scout use to start recharging shield quickly, then they lost that.
The Scouts use to be able to dance and move quickly to avoid getting shot, but they lost that.

The Scout is supposed to be harder to detect, and it isn't.
The Scout is supposed to be able to detect people better, it isn't.

The Scout suit was ruined in this build because the decided to listen to the crowd that cried when shooting at a moving target.

There was NEVER a reason to reduce strafing, expect to appease those who can not shoot.

It can be up in your face, but wasn't designed to be. I can flank someone with a shotgun as a scout and nail them in the back of the head with it at close range, but I don't consider that CQC, but based on what you've said, I imagine you DO consider that CQC, which by all means makes the scout a CQC suit, it's just supposed to be a stealthy one. I can also do this with an SMG, as promoted with the merc pack.

And nova knives SHOULD be removed due to their uselessness this build.

As a long time AV/SMG scout, I'm starting to wonder this question myself.. scout suits really got nerfed hard.

Are you seriously saying strafing is a valid combat tactic? Physics doesn't support this, why don't you run at a full sprint sideways, then try to instantly go the same exact speed you were just going but in the opposite direction by turning on a dime?

You won't.

And there was never a reason to nerf the heavy, except to appease people who couldnt be bothered to attack outside of the heavies streghts,

there was never a reason to nerf the tank,except to appease people who wanted to kill them without being dedicated anti armour characters

At least the strafe nerf was based on a real issue with hit detection we still dont know if the game could be this solid running on last builds speed or even if maybe the scout was still > assult who know all we know this has happened the same as the others and id say this was more justified than the other nerfs

Nova Knives are cool idea with how it is now.. but useless till already right on someone.

Back to topic at hand.

I would consider shotguns close quarters for sure. cause that's where it's optimal is.
Scouts could be used for stealth but if an assault suit can fit a speed module to keep up with scouts and still have more CPU/PG to fit more damaging gun and it has more base HP (which it should) then the scout has obviously been broken.

I'll be looking into the assault with speed modules to see if they can be stealthier then scouts AND have more survivability.

And there was never a reason to nerf the heavy, except to appease people who couldnt be bothered to attack outside of the heavies streghts,

there was never a reason to nerf the tank,except to appease people who wanted to kill them without being dedicated anti armour characters

At least the strafe nerf was based on a real issue with hit detection we still dont know if the game could be this solid running on last builds speed or even if maybe the scout was still > assult who know all we know this has happened the same as the others and id say this was more justified than the other nerfs

Your SMG was nerfed too cause the basic skill for SMG's doesn't increase it's damage as it has in older builds.
Or at least I'm told.

Yes I am saying that, and nothing about physics is against me. Your example has nothing to do with the issue.

I am also saying there is no valid reason to disagree with me. Only vain foolish reasons.