People want walking in stations what can you do?

Why it may not happen but ccp might like the concept

Stations make far more sense than ships do. They are stationary, indestructible, and as far as I am aware, can change hands between corporations.

and like i said before, the players of EVE have their say in this also, and i think, no, i'm positively sure they're not gonna let it happen

Why it may not happen but ccp might like the concept

It's only even gonna happen if someone gets separated from the group of ships as in to randoms in eve

I'm sure that they do like the concept; it's such a fun idea, it would be amazing, but it cannot happen without putting EVE players at the mercy of Dust players. It would come down to mercenaries saying "move us here or we wont defend you" or "give us this or we will kill you" perhaps even "ha, you paid us to board and protect your ship.... bad idea. *proceed to list ransom demands*".

what i'm saying is beyond in-situ..... but you're not listening....

And again mercs would be at the mercy of eve players because they need eve players to move them onto a ship by using a ship that can launch pods, then damaging the ship enough where pods are can be launched safely

Then tell me, how are mercs going to move between stantions/planets/systems/regions if we have to be lugged around by EVE players? Dust mercs are capable of independent movement.

#3 Making Dust mercs able to board ships in EVE, would make them FAR to valuable an asset, it would be simply impossible to do anything without having tons of mercs at your disposal. It would create an imbalance between the games, so that Dust would have a dominating effect on EVE, while EVE would have a much less harmful effect on Dust. The games are meant to have equal influence on each other. What I mean is, I don't think a Titan, or even a small frigate, will be able to board your dropsuit.

Except they'll be able to bomb the living **** out of us.

I'm sure that they do like the concept; it's such a fun idea, it would be amazing, but it cannot happen without putting EVE players at the mercy of Dust players. It would come down to mercenaries saying "move us here or we wont defend you" or "give us this or we will kill you" perhaps even "ha, you paid us to board and protect your ship.... bad idea. *proceed to list ransom demands*".

you assume dusties will move an act as a whole? if these dusties wont help you find some other or friends. besides it is a interesting concept for larger ships and well we would still rely on eve for manuacturing logistics and space control boarding could tip the scales in a battle but not destroy it we dusties would still be dependent on eve players for everything

The fact that you think Dust is supposed to rely on EVE for all of its supply, shows that you are unaware of what Dust is meant to be in relation to EVE. CCP have directly stated that if one game were removed from the server, the other would survive just fine.

Dust is going to have manufacturing, resource gathering, somehow even sovereignty. Having a corporation made 100% of Dust players, will be able to provide for all of their own needs, and own their own planets/systems.

That said, giving Dust players the ability to board player owned ships, would sky rocket their value, and suddenly EVE would rely on Dust. It would make having mercenaries aboard your ship for protection, a necessity in hauling, PvP, exploring, mining, etc. If you did not having anyone aboard your ship, a group of total noobs would be able to take you out, so long as they have some Dust players to throw at you.

Make the mercs have to do certain actions aboard the eve ship that if improperly done could result in a seizure of assets ftom the merc, enough to make it a risk v reward scenario

Then tell me, how are mercs going to move between stantions/planets/systems/regions if we have to be lugged around by EVE players? Dust mercs are capable of independent movement.

Final reason.

It be cheaper to blow it (the ship) up than to hire mercs.

Station and Outpost take overs are however different and can prove cost effective.

Thats been answered already.

Tell the computer where you want to upload and revive next
point scrambler to head
pull

As long as there is a clone there (this is where eve player comes in handy) then you can wake up there.

The all of the ships main functions are controlled by the capsuleer as far as I know

mercenaries are created specifically as war machines, they don't have much other value. So what "actions" would they be tasked with?

If an EVE player is required for the clone movement, then everything CCP wants for this game wont work. The game is supposed to work 100% without any reliance what so ever on EVE - and visa versa.

The all of the ships main functions are controlled by the capsuleer as far as I know, and mercenaries are created specifically as war machines, they don't have much other value. So what "actions" would they be tasked with?

Mentally activates the neocom and holds his hand to head like a phone.

"Hey non immortal dude over there at the biomass facility?
Yeah uhm here I am going to wire over some some isk I wanna buy clones and enough nanite paste to cover all the manufacturing my liscences need.
I am going to need it for an upcomming battle on your planet...
Of course Ill not level your entire home city I only am interested in your place of work just be sure to evacuate the area before we land.
Yeah your boss should have alerted you guys there was an attack contract made this morning.
Okay thanks. Money should be over shortly."

That is where I'm stumped. Basically the actions regular crew would perform but exactly how to do it, i can't say

We could use dust soldiers to harvest areas far to dangerous/expensive to pay a for a non immortal to give up 20 years of schooling for in one shot.

Belive it or not mercs and capsuleers are 'cost effective' vs using regular humans.

When you take away the thought that things are impossible, you find ways to make them possible.

I will never stop requesting it

The only kind of ship boarding that's possible is mcc boarding in the style of bf2142, there are ex dice at ccp so maybe that will happen at some point, but as far as eve ship boarding goes.........forGET it! Not gonna happen......ev-er.
like someone else posted on this thread....they would have to create full maps for the ships interior, x that buy the amount of ships IN new eden.....on top of all the data for the planetary maps.............toooooooo much data.

and like i said before, the players of EVE have their say in this also, and i think, no, i'm positively sure they're not gonna let it happen

The major issue with ship boarding is that both parties will have to sit around for 10-20 minutes. In high sec concord will just come and blow the offender up, In Nullsec the person being boarded can just call his friends and they'll destroy the other guy.

Plus it is much easier to just kill someone yourself then sit around for that long waiting.

What if taking a ship could be done in a manner more complicated than simply killing the crew. Maybe a complicated hack sequence that takes a shorter time then having a full battle but something to keep taking a ship difficult

I don't know how movement is going to work, but I'm sure it wont rely on EVE. The games are not suppose to rely on each other, they're supposed to add a strengthening element to each other.

Maybe something like they did w custom offices; Concord decides to make some kind of space structure holding clones/MCCs so they can be deployed around the solar system/planet.

Those structures should be conquerable/destructible in low/0.0 (maybe just in 0.0)

It's in 0.0 when the war barges comes handy; the system/planetary structure isn't yours, so you gotta deploy a war barge, but they need a pilot, and that makes DUST dependent of EVE, but only in 0.0/[low?], places that actually belong to capsuleers.

If you want to be independent, stick to high/[low?], but sure not 0.0, DUST should be quite dependent of EVE there. (So forget about all those plans of destroying the Goons with just mercs and a lot of will)

The major issue with ship boarding is that both parties will have to sit around for 10-20 minutes..

I'm just gonna say it again - ship boarding would make mercenaries to valuable. Any number of ways could make it a more "complicated" endeavor, but complex or not complex it would still be far to valuable. It would make having mercenaries at your disposal a necessity rather than an opportunity.

and like i said before, the players of EVE have their say in this also, and i think, no, i'm positively sure they're not gonna let it happen

console players screamed at ccp not to add kb/m but they never listened, why should screaming eve players be any different, oh wait...they care more about the eve players.

I would just set ship to self destruct if I got boarded. Hope you can leave within 30 seconds. Cheaper to but new ship then let you have mine.

console players screamed at ccp not to add kb/m but they never listened, why should screaming eve players be any different, oh wait...they care more about the eve players.

Unless of course you're flying around in a ship that costs 50,000,000,000 ISK. That translates to about $200 I believe.

If you are going to lose it anyway due to ****** mechanics. Why would you let the enemy steal your big ship? You dont. Scorched earth. you aint getting jack. "Someone please bomb my wreck too"

#6 If and where possible eve players will deny any chances of capture of anything useful to the enemy and will fire on thier own ships being comprimised.

we will never stop pointing out why it is not gonna happen

I'm sure that they do like the concept; it's such a fun idea, it would be amazing, but it cannot happen without putting EVE players at the mercy of Dust players. It would come down to mercenaries saying "move us here or we wont defend you" or "give us this or we will kill you" perhaps even "ha, you paid us to board and protect your ship.... bad idea. *proceed to list ransom demands*".

Then tell me, how are mercs going to move between stantions/planets/systems/regions if we have to be lugged around by EVE players? Dust mercs are capable of independent movement.

We will move around the same way we will without and kind of ship boarding in the system

"ha, you paid us to board and protect your ship.... bad idea. *proceed to list ransom demands*".

It would make having mercenaries aboard your ship for protection, a necessity in hauling, PvP, exploring, mining, etc. If you did not having anyone aboard your ship, a group of total noobs would be able to take you out, so long as they have some Dust players to throw at you.

Um? I think you misunderstood what I was saying, possibly you didn't read what I was responding to. Also, I'm not really sure what you're saying, you wrote that sentence awkwardly.

they would have to create full maps for the ships interior, x that buy the amount of ships IN new eden.....on top of all the data for the planetary maps.............toooooooo much data.

dusties rely on eve players to be moved around???
once released dusties are supposed to be used to "take over objectives on planets for eve players"
IRL im not going to be waiting in a transport to get to said planet

Not really a point against it, more so a defense mechanism.

Which is going to hvae dust players asking why bother? if they melt the ship 10 seconds into the match.

I'm not the one that said Dust players will require EVE players to move them around. Someone else was saying that, and I was telling them that Dust players are capable of independent movement. You should read what you're replying to.

I think boarding could work as another line of siege defense - random out in the middle of nowhere, probably not for awhile.
But if say, a customs office could be upgraded with CRU boarding craft in its hold to defend itself...

Thats in line with POS and stations. a perfectly acceptable idea. Stationary high time investment structures.

#1 Boarding a ship in EVE would require one or both of two different defense mechanisms.

A) Contract another set of mercs to defend your ship. Issues:
A1) As the universe of New Eden is immense, it could take a very, very long time for anyone to come to your aid, and you have absolutely -no- way of defending yourself against an attack from inside your own ship.

B) Set up defense tech (ie. lasors, rockets, auto-turrets) inside your ship. Issues:
B1) "Oh look an auto turret! Hey Bob, you're a heavy, go tank it while I hack it so it will shoot that rocket launcher!"
B2) Having rockets or lasers being fired inside your own ship, would be... rather detrimental to your ship's structure.
B3) AI vs Humans, who do you think wins? Unless you make the AI practically god mode/aim bot (anyone played training in Black Ops on the hardest difficulty? LMAO at the kill cams).

#2 Boarding ships in EVE, would require creating a map for the entire interior of each ship. Personally, as amazing as CCP is, I don't think they will ever design a map for each Titan, each Dreadnaught, and so on and so forth. Some of the ships in EVE are MASSIVE, they would be much larger than the current maps that we have on the X/Y axis, and they are also much taller on the Z axis, requiring multiple stories. Such an endeavor would require MASSIVE amounts of data storage.

#3 Making Dust mercs able to board ships in EVE, would make them FAR to valuable an asset, it would be simply impossible to do anything without having tons of mercs at your disposal. It would create an imbalance between the games, so that Dust would have a dominating effect on EVE, while EVE would have a much less harmful effect on Dust. The games are meant to have equal influence on each other. What I mean is, I don't think a Titan, or even a small frigate, will be able to board your dropsuit.

#4 In order to defend against an attack, you may decide to preemptively hire some mercenaries to defend you. Those mercenaries could easily take your contract and receive your payment, only to board your ship and hold it for ransom.

Another issue would be if you were boarded, prompting you to create a defense contract so some mercs can come save you, only to find out that either A) the defending mercs are actually working with the attacking mercs, and they hold you for ransom anyway; or B) the defending mercs come, kill the attacking mercs, salvage their remains, and hold you for ransom.

#5 Hiring mercenaries to attack a ship, would cost significantly more than simply blowing the ship up in most scenarios. Perhaps it would be effective for small frigates or mining ships, but in PvP situations such as pirating or gate blocking, it wouldn't make sense.

#6 This would not be viable in fleet fights, if the goal was to capture something on the ship in question. As soon as you boarded your target, their team would target them and melt them immediately, to prevent you from taking whatever valuables you happen to be after. So the match would really never even happen.

If we get to board NPC ships for story line missions, cool, I'll take down Sansha from the inside. Fighting AI in PvE makes sense, but having AI as a defense mechanism for PvP encounters would be simply... stupid. It would be more like PvEVE-ship, as the EVE player would really have no effect on the AI defending him, other than which weapons he chose to give it.

I will never stop requesting it

And we can fire the Skyfire Battery right back at them. However, the inherent issues with your argument - #1 someone on the ground has to request that Orbital Strike, #2 that isn't killing us from the inside where we cannot defend, where as boarding them is.

These are just some ideas that I do think would balance it out.

Then all the mercs would die, losing stock. I think what would be a nice idea is giving mercs the ability to sneak onto ships and try to avoid detection. Doing so would net them the ability to complete whatever objective they were given in the contract they chose, or what they decide to do with the ship if they choose to divert from the contract. There could also be a system that marks each merc for treacherous actions. Like a "karma" system that shows off whom is more likely to turn coat. This could be counter-intuitive to the concept of being a merc, but could also serve as a "reputation system" like on XBOX Live.

How many of my fellow Dust players supporting the boarding idea have played EVE? And how many of those have actually been in 0.0 wars involving fleet engagements and station/POS takedowns?

Having done all of the above I want no part in ship boarding. For one, many fleets engagements involve one fleet rolling over another. Like the day Goonswarm jumped more carriers then I had time to count on top of the fleet I was apart of. There was no chance for boarding, we were wiped the **** out before we could count the amount of carriers dumped in our lap!

The rest of the engagements took forever. Lots of jumping in and out, managing range, blah blah blah. Fleet commander calls a Target we melt em in a few seconds all the while hoping we aren't the target the opposition fleet commander calls for his guys.

If you are a Duster who has signed a contract to be a boarding party you're gonna just sit and wait, and wait and wait ad naseum, then find out the ship carrying you just got called as a target because the opposition is pulling in their big ships and they want possible boarding attempts prevented. So good job wasting your time.

It's a great idea that sounds fun, but it won't work in application without seriously reworking fleet warfare mechanics. As it is now you'd wind up with a bunch of mercs sitting around waiting to do something just to be prevented from seeing action by an intelligent fleet commander.

Now a place where boarding will work and should be implemented is stations and POS. Last time I was in a fleet attacking either of those two it was incredibly dull after the defending fleet was dealt with. The process of taking out individual parts of the station and blah blah could be circumvented and stream lined. Instead of forcing EVE pilots to pound away on immensely high HP station pieces just have them take anti ship defenses then send in the Dusters to capture a station from the inside. It gives the Dusters something fun to do and eliminates a tedious part of EVE warfare, a win win in my book.

Giving mercs the ability to "sneak" onto a ship would only strengthen their value, another argument against this. Sure you could have an AI defense system, but unless it is a computer controlled god mode, the players will always outsmart it. It would be necessary to have mercenaries defending you, as such their value would skyrocket and they would become a necessity outside all "safe zones" ie. HighSec.

A karma system will already be in place, known as standing. If you wrong someone, they will lower your standing with them, which will in turn lower your overall effective standing.

cough, cough ur a *** cough, cough

Edit: TL:DR? amirite?
As much fun as it would be, it will not happen. It will not happen for various reasons, some of which have been voiced, some of which may or may not have been voiced. Not all reasons and ideas listed here are my own, and as such they are not necessarily my concern, however they are still valid reasons against this.

#1 Boarding a ship in EVE would require one or both of two different defense mechanisms.

A) Contract another set of mercs to defend your ship. Issues:
A1) As the universe of New Eden is immense, it could take a very, very long time for anyone to come to your aid, and you have absolutely -no- way of defending yourself against an attack from inside your own ship.

B) Set up defense tech (ie. lasors, rockets, auto-turrets) inside your ship. Issues:
B1) "Oh look an auto turret! Hey Bob, you're a heavy, go tank it while I hack it so it will shoot that rocket launcher!"
B2) Having rockets or lasers being fired inside your own ship, would be... rather detrimental to your ship's structure.
B3) AI vs Humans, who do you think wins? Unless you make the AI practically god mode/aim bot (anyone played training in Black Ops on the hardest difficulty? LMAO at the kill cams).

---

#2 Boarding ships in EVE, would require creating a map for the entire interior of each ship. Personally, as amazing as CCP is, I don't think they will ever design a map for each Titan, each Dreadnaught, and so on and so forth. Some of the ships in EVE are MASSIVE, they would be much larger than the current maps that we have on the X/Y axis, and they are also much taller on the Z axis, requiring multiple stories. Such an endeavor would require MASSIVE amounts of data storage.

---

#3 Making Dust mercs able to board ships in EVE, would make them FAR to valuable an asset, it would be simply impossible to do anything without having tons of mercs at your disposal. It would create an imbalance between the games, so that Dust would have a dominating effect on EVE, while EVE would have a much less harmful effect on Dust. The games are meant to have equal influence on each other. What I mean is, I don't think a Titan, or even a small frigate, will be able to board your dropsuit.

#4 In order to defend against an attack, you may decide to preemptively hire some mercenaries to defend you. Those mercenaries could easily take your contract and receive your payment, only to board your ship and hold it for ransom. Of course, unlike EVE players, they may not be able to pod you; which of course could be untrue, as the interior of the ship would certainly have access to the pod room, all you would have to do is hack the ship so that the pod cannot eject.

Another issue would be if you were boarded, prompting you to create a defense contract so some mercs can come save you, only to find out that either A) the defending mercs are actually working with the attacking mercs, and they hold you for ransom anyway; or B) the defending mercs come, kill the attacking mercs, salvage their remains, and hold you for ransom.

---

#5 Hiring mercenaries to attack a ship, would cost significantly more than simply blowing the ship up in most scenarios. Perhaps it would be effective for small frigates or mining ships, but in PvP situations such as pirating or gate blocking, it wouldn't make sense.

---

#6 This would not be viable in fleet fights, if the goal was to capture something on the ship in question. As soon as you boarded your target, their team would target them and melt them immediately, to prevent you from taking whatever valuables you happen to be after. So the match would really never even happen.

---

If we get to board NPC ships for story line missions, cool, I'll take down Sansha from the inside. Fighting AI in PvE makes sense, but having AI as a defense mechanism for PvP encounters would be simply... stupid. It would be more like PvEVE-ship, as the EVE player would really have no effect on the AI defending him, other than which weapons he chose to give it.

How many of my fellow Dust players supporting the boarding idea have played EVE? And how many of those have actually been in 0.0 wars involving fleet engagements and station/POS takedowns?

Having done all of the above I want no part in ship boarding. For one, many fleets engagements involve one fleet rolling over another. Like the day Goonswarm jumped more carriers then I had time to count on top of the fleet I was apart of. There was no chance for boarding, we were wiped the **** out before we could count the amount of carriers dumped in our lap!

The rest of the engagements took forever. Lots of jumping in and out, managing range, blah blah blah. Fleet commander calls a Target we melt em in a few seconds all the while hoping we aren't the target the opposition fleet commander calls for his guys.

If you are a Duster who has signed a contract to be a boarding party you're gonna just sit and wait, and wait and wait ad naseum, then find out the ship carrying you just got called as a target because the opposition is pulling in their big ships and they want possible boarding attempts prevented. So good job wasting your time.

It's a great idea that sounds fun, but it won't work in application without seriously reworking fleet warfare mechanics. As it is now you'd wind up with a bunch of mercs sitting around waiting to do something just to be prevented from seeing action by an intelligent fleet commander.

Now a place where boarding will work and should be implemented is stations and POS. Last time I was in a fleet attacking either of those two it was incredibly dull after the defending fleet was dealt with. The process of taking out individual parts of the station and blah blah could be circumvented and stream lined. Instead of forcing EVE pilots to pound away on immensely high HP station pieces just have them take anti ship defenses then send in the Dusters to capture a station from the inside. It gives the Dusters something fun to do and eliminates a tedious part of EVE warfare, a win win in my book.

Show me where the lore states that all ships have built in internal security systems.

If I'm not mistaken a battleship can be use to mine (i wouldn't but it's possible)

While it can be used to mine its a waste of a hull with the new mining changes in that gives some barges more hp than some battleships and of course better yeild.

Unfourtuantely its in published material, EON magazines. Capsuleer ships have some extremly nasty defenses becuase they can be more automated than regular crewed ships which is more reliant on crew to repell intruders and even worse is the outership defenses, trying to dock with an active eve ship that doesnt want you to dock can be rather dangerous.

Only once in the lore had a capsuleer ship had ever been boarded without inbound incident all because slaves aboard the ships released a poision that forced evactuation of the entire crew and pod captain. The slaver hounds left on the ship ate well that night however and they wherent even part of the original defense plans.

Mo Gallas thinking that battleships to be used for mining...

On that note, boarding a capsuleeer ship is suicide. A capsuleer can easily airvent/gravity crush/caustive atmosphere/reactor flush/coolant flush/microwave hostile mercs out without even thinking about it as his body's natural defenses react to the intrusion.

Also most ships are old warfare design and are still built to counter invaders when and where possible as these designs dual function in ship to ship combat survival. Countermeasures against ship boarding got so good nobody does it much anymore. Shielded compartments, heavily armed crew, blast doors everywhere and the nature of current shipbuilding.

MCCs are cruiser sized and dont go all that fast in space and based on how much damage and size of the guns. they dont take abuse too well either.

Also any 'gimmick' any of you mercs purpose to make a ship 'invunerable' during boarder is going to be ABUSED to hell.

Also of note its not just one ship opening gate, its usually several, becuase chances are the first one to lite off gets blown to bits first.

The reason why its more valuable for a dust mercenary to be hired for station take overs is becuase stations takes HOURS to kill no matter how large the fleets are. Dust 514 mercs woulc be the cost effective option.

Another bad thing about your ram, /flips on warp scrambler/ Good luck operating it with one of these on it.

Finally if any ship is being boarder and it doesnt look good the capsuleer will turn tank modules off. Ships without tank die instantly on the field usually.

Also no artifcalating, players make reasons to have fights, CCP cannot and will not and never will force you to fight the spawn rare item thing is just simply cannot exist in new eden ever. Also value of said item is up to the player, its impossible to make an item 'worth' trillions if all its going to do is get your ship blown to bits.

Finally a dust controlled ship is never as effective as a eve pilots.

Eve Capsuleers when they jack into a ship the ship becomes them. Every bit of damage every bit of function translate to an equatable bodily function. The ships sensors becomes the pilots eyes, weapons activating on his rage.

Dust Pod Pilots dont get this feedback, they're slower to respond to stimulus and they are only feed the stimulus the holostatic pods feed them. So even if you do manage to take the ship how are you going to bring up the same algrorthyms and mimic the thought process for the hardeners which where finely mentally attuned to the pilots unique feel for the ship? How are you going to fight against the ships memorized settings for that pilot? Operating a shield booster on a previoulsy owned capsuleer ship could require erratically different coding from the other ship all becuase one pilots feel euphoric when activating the shield booster while other one gets unscratchable static itchy feeling.