Not all Console people are 'kiddies', I'm 30....and just as hardcore as your regular PC player (respect to PC)........I still even play rainbow 6 Vegas 1 + 2, they were released 5/6 years ago

You know everyone that is saying the reset is so beta participants dont have an unfair advantage are just contradicting the game. I mean if we have so much of a head start now how do you think the newbies who start playing dust a year from now will feel. It will be impossible for them to even kill anything. Especially with the huge damage boosters that weapon skills give right now. Also all the eve players will start giving their characters isk or at least rigging contracts so who has the unfair advantage now. This game is all about unfair advantages thats what makes the eve universe.

Well thats why i said its what DUST was supposed to be. CCP's mission statement was to get people who just couldnt get into EVE for being to hard core into the EVE universe. You cant turn an mmo into an fps because of the overwhelming power that older players will have over the new ones. I just calculated some skills and this is what i got. So if you max out the AR proficiency at level 5 youll get 25% damage increase ok thats already unfair but not by much. BUT OH WAIT WEAPONRY level 5 gives you another 15% so now we are at 40% damage boost. NOw you can pretty much kill a militia geared nooby in like three hits assuming your at advanced or higher level gear. BUT OH WAIT, there is more Assuming you have a prototype suit you now have two high level power slots so you slap on two 10% light weapons damage boosters. WELL GOD JEZZUZ now 60% damage increase. You could kill in just a few hits with militia gear while it still takes them a clip or more to even take down your shield. All in all im saying this game is turning into an mmo and there is a reason you dont mix mmo and fps because in WOW you wouldnt make a level 5 go up agaisnt a lvl 80.

The only way to make sure this game isnt a disaster is to have a really good matchmaking service to make sure noobies have time to grow and learn and level up before they take on a big challenge just like in an mmo.

And if you think this is wrong then your doing FPS wrong my friend. This is supposed to be a fun way to get new players to enjoy EVE. NOT turn into some "LEVEL 80" gank fest for you veteran EVE players. AND if thats what you want this game to be then you can count me out.

Well thats why i said its what DUST was supposed to be. CCP's mission statement was to get people who just couldnt get into EVE for being to hard core into the EVE universe. You cant turn an mmo into an fps because of the overwhelming power that older players will have over the new ones. I just calculated some skills and this is what i got. So if you max out the AR proficiency at level 5 youll get 25% damage increase ok thats already unfair but not by much. BUT OH WAIT WEAPONRY level 5 gives you another 15% so now we are at 40% damage boost. NOw you can pretty much kill a militia geared nooby in like three hits assuming your at advanced or higher level gear. BUT OH WAIT, there is more Assuming you have a prototype suit you now have two high level power slots so you slap on two 10% light weapons damage boosters. WELL GOD JEZZUZ now 60% damage increase. You could kill in just a few hits with militia gear while it still takes them a clip or more to even take down your shield. All in all im saying this game is turning into an mmo and there is a reason you dont mix mmo and fps because in WOW you wouldnt make a level 5 go up agaisnt a lvl 80.

The only way to make sure this game isnt a disaster is to have a really good matchmaking service to make sure noobies have time to grow and learn and level up before they take on a big challenge just like in an mmo.

And if you think this is wrong then your doing FPS wrong my friend. This is supposed to be a fun way to get new players to enjoy EVE. NOT turn into some "LEVEL 80" gank fest for you veteran EVE players. AND if thats what you want this game to be then you can count me out.

Im not but hurt about losing my stats. Im butt hurt about the system being unfair to noobs. AND IM TRYING TO TELL YOU. That yes we will have a slower SP increase, but this also applies to new players that start after a year from launch and it will take them a year to get to your level by which time youll have two years under your belt. See the math there.

LIKE I SAID you cant mix an fps and mmo. MMO is stat based FPS is supposed to be skill based you cant jsut allow people who have played longer to have an advantage. It should be so that a nooby player could kick a high level players butt if he has more skill. Granted if it is a one on one situation both facing each other.

W/E this is my last post about this. I really enjoy dust as it is but ive played alot of FPS games in my 30 years alive and I can tell you as is, its not a very good FPS, its too unfair for new players and that cant happen in an fps. And im talking about new players 1-2 years from now. NOT at launch. I gave you a solution make sure veteran players dont get mixed with noobies in the matchmaking system but find dont listen. I THOUGHT this game was to bring in a new audience to get more people to join the EVE universe but apparently its just another EVE for EVE players and you seem to not be very friendly to us as you call "Soffie" COD players. I once tried to get into EVE and i really wanted to like it but it asked for too much time and dedication to learn so i never did. Then i heard about DUST and how it would allow for an experience where people who didnt get EVE would have a chance to be apart of your world but apparently you dont want us.

Yeah like i said im not gonna hide it. Im not an Eve online player, but Ive always wanted to join in but in all honesty i just dont have the attention span and determination to play just one game. As the Eve players say there is no such thing as a casual EVE player. Then i heard about DUST 514 and thought now i had a chance to be apart of the EVE universe but its turning out to be just another EVE but with guns. Ill still play from day one but still what im worried about is not about myself but for new players.

My feelings are that i REALLY want DUST to be a success and not another niche game like EVE. Thats the truth. Now EVE is a really good MMO but even with all its hardcore players thats just it they are mostly all hardcore players. With DUST we have a chance to bring in fresh blood sometimes people who arent all that good at games but its better for that.

Im also not very happy with the response from EVE players towards us non-EVE players. Not everyone whos interested in DUST has played EVE, me for example. And we want to play DUST because its an FPS but the reaction from most veterans is that we suck and need to go back to COD. One person even said that they would hate for newbies to join because they dont want to spend hard earned isk on new players and relying on them to capture important planets. It just makes me upset that the reaction towards new people joining the CCP ranks is so volatile.

You're putting words in their mouth. They never said anything about it being hardcore being the issue. They simply said they wanted to get more than the typical EVE audience (i.e. space and all the mechanics that make up EVE.) None of their statements preclude a deep and complex skill system, consequences, a hardcore experience, or anything else we're seeing here. Nothing they've said precludes the need for teamwork, supports the "can't compete" fallacy you and others seem to subscribe to (and many of the newbies in EVE that don't comprehend how the skill system works erroneously believe too). Pick something, specialize, and you'll be the equal of that 10 year player in that one area within about 2-3 months (maybe days or weeks here, since you get bonus SP just for playing). Also, none of those damage bonuses do you a damn bit of good if you can't hit your target, making skill the more important factor. Wanna know my usual loadouts? Militia gear + the merc pack drop suit and SMG. I haven't used a single consumable, average top 3 in most of my matches, and generally have a K/D of around 1.4 (overall is down around 1.05 due to some bad matches and the fact that controllers suck for FPS games.)

This is in spite of all the people with higher skills from having more time to play than I do, and using much better gear.

Matchmaking is 1) a bad joke in almost all cases, and 2) completely antithetical to this game's concept. All well and good for the high-sec stuff, which they said would be NPC contracts (you could theoretically work a matchmaking system into it and still let you work for the desired factions), but is completely unworkable in low- and null-sec.

Furthermore, the beauty of the skill system, and what you're some fantastically wrong about, is that it PREVENTS it turning into a "level 80 gankfest," as explained above and in other posts. I'm sorry it's too much for you. WoW and CoD are over there -->>

Please explain that.... how does having 50% more damage, shields, armor, etc stop the "Level 80 Gankfest"?

wow really? yeah thats not good beta players will absolutely DEEEEEEESTROY all the newcomers on release

In WoW a level 80 can auto attack a level 10 and pop him in a few seconds. Now let's assume a level 80 takes 8 years and a level 10 takes 1 year (this is an eve scaling of WoW levels). The 8 year player may have maxed shields, maxed armor, maxed caldari dropsuit, maxed gallante dropsuit, maxed sniper, maxed assault, etc. This guy doesn't benefit from all of these skills at once. He has the option of versatility. A smart 1 year player will specialize and completely max everything needed for 1 lookout. Not only is that one year player competitive, he is actually equal or even better than the 8 year player depending on the 8 year player build. As a new player you should spend your first few weeks figuring out what you like and then picking something and maxing it before moving on.

I dont think they should slow down the rate of sp gain because its defintely going to turn new players off when they have to suffer through getting the ass kicked by protype gear players for a week or more before they even stand a remote chance. If they do slow down the sp rate then they should either make protype gear weaker or noob gear stronger.

To the best of my knowledge we currently are not gaining 4x SP anymore... We haven't for a few weeks now. At least, they told us in IRC that this is no longer the case. It's possible they adjusted the rate a bit from what it was back in uprising, but it seems pretty similar.

It's WAY too high right now as it is. It's fine for testing, but it'll be way to easy to max out if it's kept this way. It needs to be reduced. Easily compensated for by having your starter skills being high enough to use at least the second tier of weapon and armour for that chosen starter profession. That'll give you access to some decent equipment so you don't feel like a gimp while you're starting, but progress needs to be controlled, or it's going to be an end-game sprint, everyone burns out, and the skill mechanics end up having no meaning at all.

Remember, you're not supposed to be training EVERYTHING. Pick something and specialize. Jacks of all trades are masters of none.

I just think that as an FPS this game should be more skill based a starting player who is better should be able to kill a protype geared player, I cant imagine why people want it to be like an mmorpg.

Im not but hurt about losing my stats. Im butt hurt about the system being unfair to noobs. AND IM TRYING TO TELL YOU. That yes we will have a slower SP increase, but this also applies to new players that start after a year from launch and it will take them a year to get to your level by which time youll have two years under your belt. See the math there.

LIKE I SAID you cant mix an fps and mmo. MMO is stat based FPS is supposed to be skill based you cant jsut allow people who have played longer to have an advantage. It should be so that a nooby player could kick a high level players butt if he has more skill. Granted if it is a one on one situation both facing each other.

W/E this is my last post about this. I really enjoy dust as it is but ive played alot of FPS games in my 30 years alive and I can tell you as is, its not a very good FPS, its too unfair for new players and that cant happen in an fps. And im talking about new players 1-2 years from now. NOT at launch. I gave you a solution make sure veteran players dont get mixed with noobies in the matchmaking system but find dont listen. I THOUGHT this game was to bring in a new audience to get more people to join the EVE universe but apparently its just another EVE for EVE players and you seem to not be very friendly to us as you call "Soffie" COD players. I once tried to get into EVE and i really wanted to like it but it asked for too much time and dedication to learn so i never did. Then i heard about DUST and how it would allow for an experience where people who didnt get EVE would have a chance to be apart of your world but apparently you dont want us.

I keep telling people that it will only take about a month (since we are at 4x SP currently in beta) to get Proto Weapon and Armor (If you bee-line it obviously). But EVERYONE keeps telling me it will take 6+ Months and all this other ****... regardless of looking at the math (especially since diminishing returns ARE currently in).

Now, if it REALLY does take 6+ month just to unlock a proto weapon + armor then this community is going to be EXTREMELY small and niche!

You can argue all you want about getting headshots and all this "player skill;" but the fact is a veteran will have 50% more damage, shield, armor, etc.... and the new guy has to spend 6 months with that disadvantage to be on the same level of field that would then be dictated by "player skill."

I love EVE, skill system and ALLLLL the meta game; but this game is F2P on a restricted PS3 market! I have NEVER EVER heard of a game on the PS3 that sets you up against veterans with a 50% advantage across the board that you have to put up with months on end.

This game is F2P and you have to disregard launch as the game needs to GROW; especially if they move it to PC or even XBOX.

More people playing a F2P game is never a bad thing

Excatly! no one is going to want to suffer through loss after loss and death after death they will just quit the game all together and then you'll have no player base except for a small group of dedicated players who will liekly get bored fighting the same people over and over.