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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2078
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Posted - 2014.09.08 15:51:00 -
[1] - Quote
Ok, so I brought this up to CCP Archduke the other night in DevHangout and he told me that this should be posted here.
So we all know that we aren't getting a Player Market in Dust, though I think I have a suitable compromise in mind that is very doable (I described it as a decent consolation prize for the lack of a player market).
The idea is this, each week the Isk prices of items on the market would fluctuate with the demand as dictated by the previous week. If in week one the Kaalakiota Rail Rifle is the most bought item, then in week two, it would have its price increased by X%, items that weren't being bought would have their price decreased by X%. Each week, prices would be modified to reflect the previous weeks demand.
We'd still be impacting the market despite our lack of selling ability. Not only this, it would also help to curb FoTM spamming (too many people consistently buying an item and the price will skyrocket within weeks).
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2661
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Posted - 2014.09.08 16:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
Oh dear god I would laugh my ass off.
DO IT!
I want to watch proto and adv heavy suits and weapons skyrocket from overuse.
Scouts would go from 50k isk per pro siit to 500k overnight.
Edit: I just realized that this could make assaults the most cost-effective suits overnight. |
Draka Marintu
Pure Evil.
195
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Posted - 2014.09.08 16:38:00 -
[3] - Quote
This would also end up causing people to run more faction warfare in milita stock up on lp items to cut costs
Bacon nuff said
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Maken Tosch
DUST University
Ivy League
9279
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Posted - 2014.09.08 17:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Ok, so I brought this up to CCP Archduke the other night in DevHangout and he told me that this should be posted here.
So we all know that we aren't getting a Player Market in Dust, though I think I have a suitable compromise in mind that is very doable (I described it as a decent consolation prize for the lack of a player market).
The idea is this, each week the Isk prices of items on the market would fluctuate with the demand as dictated by the previous week. If in week one the Kaalakiota Rail Rifle is the most bought item, then in week two, it would have its price increased by X%, items that weren't being bought would have their price decreased by X%. Each week, prices would be modified to reflect the previous weeks demand.
We'd still be impacting the market despite our lack of selling ability. Not only this, it would also help to curb FoTM spamming (too many people consistently buying an item and the price will skyrocket within weeks).
As long as it can be done server-side I don't see a problem with this.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2078
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Posted - 2014.09.08 17:08:00 -
[5] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Alaika Arbosa wrote:Ok, so I brought this up to CCP Archduke the other night in DevHangout and he told me that this should be posted here.
So we all know that we aren't getting a Player Market in Dust, though I think I have a suitable compromise in mind that is very doable (I described it as a decent consolation prize for the lack of a player market).
The idea is this, each week the Isk prices of items on the market would fluctuate with the demand as dictated by the previous week. If in week one the Kaalakiota Rail Rifle is the most bought item, then in week two, it would have its price increased by X%, items that weren't being bought would have their price decreased by X%. Each week, prices would be modified to reflect the previous weeks demand.
We'd still be impacting the market despite our lack of selling ability. Not only this, it would also help to curb FoTM spamming (too many people consistently buying an item and the price will skyrocket within weeks). As long as it can be done server-side I don't see a problem with this.
It can, I also questioned if it could be scripted and I was given a "pass" (I assumed that meant it could).
If it is only a matter of writing the script and implementing it so that it runs weekly, it would be extremely easy for CCP to do so. They write one script and then no more manhours devoted to it, set and forget and it adds player driven dynamism to the game.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Kallas Hallytyr
Skullbreakers
748
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Posted - 2014.09.08 19:01:00 -
[6] - Quote
You've got my vote. +1
Alt of Halla Murr.
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Vulpes Dolosus
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
2025
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Posted - 2014.09.08 19:28:00 -
[7] - Quote
Only if we get a sell-back button for -X% of whatever the current cost is. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University
Ivy League
9283
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Posted - 2014.09.08 19:36:00 -
[8] - Quote
Vulpes Dolosus wrote:Only if we get a sell-back button for -X% of whatever the current cost is.
That will definitely require a client-side update because you have to change the UI and so far CCP is not focusing on any client-side updates. Just server-side.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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CommanderBolt
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
1493
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Posted - 2014.09.08 19:49:00 -
[9] - Quote
I have no idea how feasible this would be to do, but I do like the idea a lot
+1
-=#[ Gastun's Forge ]#=-
MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
"I'm wasting away here" - "Get me back into zee fight!
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Death Shadow117
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
406
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Posted - 2014.09.08 19:55:00 -
[10] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Ok, so I brought this up to CCP Archduke the other night in DevHangout and he told me that this should be posted here.
So we all know that we aren't getting a Player Market in Dust, though I think I have a suitable compromise in mind that is very doable (I described it as a decent consolation prize for the lack of a player market).
The idea is this, each week the Isk prices of items on the market would fluctuate with the demand as dictated by the previous week. If in week one the Kaalakiota Rail Rifle is the most bought item, then in week two, it would have its price increased by X%, items that weren't being bought would have their price decreased by X%. Each week, prices would be modified to reflect the previous weeks demand.
We'd still be impacting the market despite our lack of selling ability. Not only this, it would also help to curb FoTM spamming (too many people consistently buying an item and the price will skyrocket within weeks).
ok fine then ill just use the lp store all the time.
Why?
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2085
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Posted - 2014.09.08 20:28:00 -
[11] - Quote
Death Shadow117 wrote:Alaika Arbosa wrote:Ok, so I brought this up to CCP Archduke the other night in DevHangout and he told me that this should be posted here.
So we all know that we aren't getting a Player Market in Dust, though I think I have a suitable compromise in mind that is very doable (I described it as a decent consolation prize for the lack of a player market).
The idea is this, each week the Isk prices of items on the market would fluctuate with the demand as dictated by the previous week. If in week one the Kaalakiota Rail Rifle is the most bought item, then in week two, it would have its price increased by X%, items that weren't being bought would have their price decreased by X%. Each week, prices would be modified to reflect the previous weeks demand.
We'd still be impacting the market despite our lack of selling ability. Not only this, it would also help to curb FoTM spamming (too many people consistently buying an item and the price will skyrocket within weeks). ok fine then ill just use the lp store all the time.
I would imagine that it could be done for the LP store too.
I am not saying that it should or shouldn't just that it wouldn't be hard to apply the same script to the LP store as well.
Either way, it wouldn't hurt to encourage even more people to participate in FW, tried and failed three times today to get a match for Minmatar. I shouldn't have to wait more than 10 minutes to get into a match, even if the server needs to create another match just to have me sit in the Warbarge until there are enough people. At least then I would feel like some progress was being made rather than sitting in my MQ while my eyes bleed watching the timer tick up.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
3918
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Posted - 2014.09.08 20:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
I think they should try it.
The worst thing that could happen is that it doesn't work out, and they revert back to what it is now.
And like someone else said, it may increase the FW play.
You can always tell a Millford Minja
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Spademan
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
3566
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Posted - 2014.09.08 22:03:00 -
[13] - Quote
Huh.
The "frames" would be essentially free.
I am part shovel, part man, full scout, and a little bit special.
Official Time Lord of the Scout Community
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Derpty Derp
Dead Man's Game
441
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Posted - 2014.09.09 02:07:00 -
[14] - Quote
As I use a lot of items that most people don't bother with I'd love this... Then again dropship and tank prices... Oh god xD
Just be sure to buy in bulk when the price is low!
I'll vote yes on this, it sounds amusing. |
AEON VINTOREZ
ALLOTEC INC
0
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Posted - 2014.09.09 02:15:00 -
[15] - Quote
I've noticed that the prices of Infantry gear in Eve online are fixed at Dust prices. It would be interesting to see prices fluctuate in Eve as currently there is no incentive to buy or sell infantry gear in Eve.
It would be nice to be able to sell unwanted infantry gear at fixed market prices too. I would be happy to pay a sales tax if I was able to sell all of my surplus and unwanted salvage gear on the market.
I think this is definitely worth a try. |
iKILLu osborne
Dead Man's Game
298
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Posted - 2014.09.09 11:44:00 -
[16] - Quote
i've been thinking of retiring for awhile now, this idea if implemented would change that in a heartbeat.
As it is when you see a someone's name you can already know what they will be running and what you need to run to counter them before the match even starts. With this system in place it will provide variety to the battlefield because every player (excluding viktor and pyrex) will try to be isk efficient.
Not only that but it would help career logis a **** ton and help small corps grind isk for pc
"yeah i fought the redline it took it only 13 seconds....."
fought scotty too but something went wrong
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2088
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Posted - 2014.09.09 12:12:00 -
[17] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:i've been thinking of retiring for awhile now, this idea if implemented would change that in a heartbeat.
As it is when you see a someone's name you can already know what they will be running and what you need to run to counter them before the match even starts. With this system in place it will provide variety to the battlefield because every player (excluding viktor and pyrex) will try to be isk efficient.
Not only that but it would help career logis a **** ton and help small corps grind isk for pc
My Empire of Dirt for cheaper Alloteks (the nanohives that is)
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3715
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Posted - 2014.09.09 12:49:00 -
[18] - Quote
I like it. There's room for good manipulation here, even from an occasional lore event perspective.
The special contracts tab is very underutilized. Structure events every once in a while where player are defending a weapons supply factory. Depending on the outcome of a series of matches over a weekend, particular weapon prices increase or decrease.
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2091
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Posted - 2014.09.09 13:12:00 -
[19] - Quote
Jadek Menaheim wrote:I like it. There's room for good manipulation here, even from an occasional lore event perspective.
The special contracts tab is very underutilized. Structure events every once in a while where player are defending a weapons supply factory. Depending on the outcome of a series of matches over a weekend, particular weapon prices increase or decrease.
I hadn't even thought of it like that, I like it, I like it a lot.
Not only is it player-driven dynamism, it is also a vehicle for sensible events!
The attackers made away with the stockpile so they all get 1000 of X item as well as causing its price to spike an extra 25% beyond what the market would change it.
They could even be hybrid events, some pubs, some FW.
You should make a thread solely devoted to pursuing that idea if this gets implemented.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
4159
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Posted - 2014.09.09 13:44:00 -
[20] - Quote
This would encourage experimental fits using less popular modules. I like it.
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
4162
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Posted - 2014.09.09 13:52:00 -
[21] - Quote
AEON VINTOREZ wrote:I've noticed that the prices of Infantry gear in Eve online are fixed at Dust prices. It would be interesting to see prices fluctuate in Eve as currently there is no incentive to buy or sell infantry gear in Eve.
It would be nice to be able to sell unwanted infantry gear at fixed market prices too. I would be happy to pay a sales tax if I was able to sell all of my surplus and unwanted salvage gear on the market.
I think this is definitely worth a try.
If EVE players started to play the DUST market, I would count that as a win!
The more EVE players start to care about DUST, the more CCP upper management will start to care about DUST.
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
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Foundation Seldon
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
743
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Posted - 2014.09.09 13:59:00 -
[22] - Quote
Really like this idea. May my Saga-II and Methana drop in price due to non-use!
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Kevall Longstride
DUST University
Ivy League
1647
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:08:00 -
[23] - Quote
Interesting.... Very interesting..
CPM 1 member
CEO of DUST University
Vist dustcpm.com
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3717
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:11:00 -
[24] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:AEON VINTOREZ wrote:I've noticed that the prices of Infantry gear in Eve online are fixed at Dust prices. It would be interesting to see prices fluctuate in Eve as currently there is no incentive to buy or sell infantry gear in Eve.
It would be nice to be able to sell unwanted infantry gear at fixed market prices too. I would be happy to pay a sales tax if I was able to sell all of my surplus and unwanted salvage gear on the market.
I think this is definitely worth a try. If EVE players started to play the DUST market, I would count that as a win! The more EVE players start to care about DUST, the more CCP upper management will start to care about DUST.
How could we make that work EVE side? Would the use habits of where dust players are located have some impact in prices in the given races sovereign zones?
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
16387
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:14:00 -
[25] - Quote
Hmm... needs exploring.
CPM 1
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior
\\= Advanced Large Blaster =// Unlocked
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3720
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:20:00 -
[26] - Quote
The one class that would be regularly effected is sentinals and hmgs pushing a lot of players specifically into Mimatar FW
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:22:00 -
[27] - Quote
So I'll never run logi again?.
Do you realise how expensive the repair tool would be?, or is this just for weapons?.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3720
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:25:00 -
[28] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:So I'll never run logi again?.
Do you realise how expensive the repair tool would be?, or is this just for weapons?.
That's where either running FW or special community reclamation contracts could come in.
Reclamation contracts activate in the special contracts tab when a weapon/item/suit class rises above or below 15% of the base cost.
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2095
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:25:00 -
[29] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:So I'll never run logi again?.
Do you realise how expensive the repair tool would be?, or is this just for weapons?.
It would be your choice on if you ran logi again or not.
Repair tools would get balanced by Triage Hives, local reppers and needles
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:27:00 -
[30] - Quote
Jadek Menaheim wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:So I'll never run logi again?.
Do you realise how expensive the repair tool would be?, or is this just for weapons?. That's where either running FW or special community reclamation contracts could come in.
So, further moving away from the 'play my way' philosophy and having to run fw?.
Sounds pure crap.
And this is coming from someone who spams bpos and proto aurum.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:30:00 -
[31] - Quote
The moment something is introduced as a direct forced grind is the moment that dust really will die.
The lack of content already doesn't warrant a grind but people see the freedom at the end of the tunnel with fittings.
And you want to take that away basically?.
And possibly make it completely impossible for newbs to run even an ADV weapon because of us?.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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a brackers
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
44
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:33:00 -
[32] - Quote
+1 also any op gear will become un op as so many people push the price up
Proto dropship pilot
The sandbox shooter
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:34:00 -
[33] - Quote
Well if it gets introduced, I guess some quick cash will be made in aurum before people really do quit dust for good.
This borders on the 'we make it sht so you spend' model, I don't like it.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3105
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:37:00 -
[34] - Quote
Very interesting idea. Potential for abuse though depending on how its set up.
What would stop a group of players with large amounts from ISK, mass stockpiling high end gear one week, thus driving the price up extremely high the next week, and then terrorizing players with Proto gear that the players can not afford because of the price hike?
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:39:00 -
[35] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:This would encourage experimental fits using less popular modules. I like it.
No it really wouldn't.
People would have to use crap they don't want or just not play until maybe next week.
This idea removes freedom in choice which is all that dust has going for it at the mo.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:43:00 -
[36] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:Very interesting idea. Potential for abuse though depending on how its set up.
What would stop a group of players with large amounts from ISK, mass stockpiling high end gear one week, thus driving the price up extremely high the next week, and then terrorizing players with Proto gear that the players can not afford because of the price hike?
This.
The only people who would not be affected are people who use aurum.
So dust will become a 'pay to not care, early unlock and bypass meta' game.
Right now, its pay to not care and unlock early.
None of this would bother me but its definitely not healthy for the game. It would be fine if dust was going places because people would pay yo unlock early, not care and bypass meta.
But its not going anywhere yet/ever.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2096
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:59:00 -
[37] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:The moment something is introduced as a direct forced grind is the moment that dust really will die.
The lack of content already doesn't warrant a grind but people see the freedom at the end of the tunnel with fittings.
And you want to take that away basically?.
And possibly make it completely impossible for newbs to run even an ADV weapon because of us?.
Wow, thank you for the bumps but you really are trying to demonize this.
There is nothing saying that it couldn't be capped, something like "no more than a 25% increase/decrease per week" or who is to say that the inflated prices on the market increase the NPC corporations profit margins which allows them to increase pay somewhat?
It is far from a "complete feature" at this point, but there is no need for you to be such a negative nancy about it.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:01:00 -
[38] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:The moment something is introduced as a direct forced grind is the moment that dust really will die.
The lack of content already doesn't warrant a grind but people see the freedom at the end of the tunnel with fittings.
And you want to take that away basically?.
And possibly make it completely impossible for newbs to run even an ADV weapon because of us?. Wow, thank you for the bumps but you really are trying to demonize this. There is nothing saying that it couldn't be capped, something like "no more than a 25% increase/decrease per week" or who is to say that the inflated prices on the market increase the NPC corporations profit margins which allows them to increase pay somewhat? It is far from a "complete feature" at this point, but there is no need for you to be such a negative nancy about it.
There's nothing negative about what I said.
I'm sorry it touched you so deeply lol.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3106
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:07:00 -
[39] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:
There is nothing saying that it couldn't be capped, something like "no more than a 25% increase/decrease per week" or who is to say that the inflated prices on the market increase the NPC corporations profit margins which allows them to increase pay somewhat?
It is far from a "complete feature" at this point, but there is no need for you to be such a negative nancy about it.
Like I said as long as proper care is taken to prevent abuse, it could be interesting. In situations like this you need to ask yourself "WWGD?" or rather, What Would the Goons Do? 
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:10:00 -
[40] - Quote
Like I said, it doesn't affect me. I have been spamming proto aurum and bpos since beta.
I just care about the newbs.
It just appears to be an unnecessary restraint on new players while seasoned players and vets simply swap fits depending on what costs too much per week.
This also means that the cost will literally just restrict people by isk gaps.
Jimmy newb cake gets fked, vet laughs as he drives the cost up and knows he is p!ssing in new players cornflakes.
Or simply swaps what he/she is using.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2097
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:10:00 -
[41] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:
There's nothing negative about what I said.
I'm sorry it touched you so deeply lol.
Yes there is
TechMechMeds wrote:None of this would bother me but its definitely not healthy for the game. It would be fine if dust was going places because people would pay yo unlock early, not care and bypass meta.
"definitely not healthy for the game" sounds negative to me.
TechMechMeds wrote:This idea removes freedom in choice which is all that dust has going for it at the mo.
^^purely opinion since it doesn't force people to make any choice, it merely simulates economic shifts
TechMechMeds wrote:I guess some quick cash will be made in aurum before people really do quit dust for good.
oh noes, doom and gloom, #dustisdying #soundfamiliar? #thisagain?
5 of the 7 posts before my response are from you fearmongering and injecting doom and gloom into the thread.
I'd call that negative.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5526
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:13:00 -
[42] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:
There's nothing negative about what I said.
I'm sorry it touched you so deeply lol.
Yes there is TechMechMeds wrote:None of this would bother me but its definitely not healthy for the game. It would be fine if dust was going places because people would pay yo unlock early, not care and bypass meta. "definitely not healthy for the game" sounds negative to me. TechMechMeds wrote:This idea removes freedom in choice which is all that dust has going for it at the mo. ^^purely opinion since it doesn't force people to make any choice, it merely simulates economic shifts TechMechMeds wrote:I guess some quick cash will be made in aurum before people really do quit dust for good. oh noes, doom and gloom, #dustisdying #soundfamiliar? #thisagain? 5 of the 7 posts before my response are from you fearmongering and injecting doom and gloom into the thread. I'd call that negative.
Actually, you are bring negative about my opinion.
Try focussing on the actual issue and showing me something that states otherwise or would be a POSITIVE IMPACT on the game.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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ZDub 303
Escrow Removal and Acquisition
Negative-Feedback
3257
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:17:00 -
[43] - Quote
Just keep in mind supply vs demand.
So you're looking at one side of the equation... demand. As demand for an item increases, at a constant supply, its price would naturally increase. Your idea would, in theory, simulate this to some degree.
but... what about supply? In any market structure, EVE's included, if the demand for an item continues to increase then the market will react by (eventually) producing more of that item.
In fact, items with extremely high demand, end up saturating and the price goes very low as a result. People will produce for less per item profit if they can push massive volumes.
A good example would be the store we all love to hate... Wal Mart.
How would you simulate production changes and variable supply into this model? It could become very complex (and not worth the time to implement) or it could just be something a third year economics undergrad could write up in a day... hard for me to say/know... I'm not an economist.
B C R U are letters, not words - Wierd Al Yankovich
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3112
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 16:26:00 -
[44] - Quote
I don't think it really restricts gameplay any more than a normal market would. Hell if anything if the price increase is capped, that's going to be more stable than an EVE market.
I mean if we had a player market, it would be 'restrictive' in that highly popular items would be more expensive, simply because producers can charge more for them because demand is high. If anything a simulated economy kinda helps people get used to the idea of price changes, and is easier to ease them into a true player economy.
SO yeah, as long as the idea is properly balanced and avenues for abuse are accounted for before implementation, this could be pretty slick. I'll give you a +1.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege
Top Men.
3352
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 16:26:00 -
[45] - Quote
The thing to bear in mind with an idea like this, is that you'd either have some dude at CCP having to set the prices on every item in the game every week (a full-time job), or they'd have to develop an entirely new method for updating the price on items in the backend.
Either way, it's a much larger investment than it may seem.
I love the idea, but my immediate thought on viewing it, is that there are smaller time investment projects than can reap far better rewards for the players than this.
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5528
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 16:32:00 -
[46] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:The thing to bear in mind with an idea like this, is that you'd either have some dude at CCP having to set the prices on every item in the game every week (a full-time job), or they'd have to develop an entirely new method for updating the price on items in the backend.
Either way, it's a much larger investment than it may seem.
I love the idea, but my immediate thought on viewing it, is that there are smaller time investment projects than can reap far better rewards for the players than this.
The first thing we should ask is 'how does this affect new players?', they are the lifeblood of the game.
Most of us would simply shrug off the extra cost or just keep using aurum.
What about new players?.
What is the actual point exactly in implementing a mechanic that simply keeps vets cosy and screws newer players?.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3112
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 16:40:00 -
[47] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:Just keep in mind supply vs demand.
So you're looking at one side of the equation... demand. As demand for an item increases, at a constant supply, its price would naturally increase. Your idea would, in theory, simulate this to some degree.
but... what about supply? In any market structure, EVE's included, if the demand for an item continues to increase then the market will react by (eventually) producing more of that item.
In fact, items with extremely high demand, end up saturating and the price goes very low as a result. People will produce for less per item profit if they can push massive volumes.
A good example would be the store we all love to hate... Wal Mart.
This idea goes the other way as well... as demand for an item plummets.. the price doesn't necessarily plummet as a result. Most producers will just stop producing it and the few that will, will produce in limited runs for high per-item profit at lower overall revenue due to lower volume of sales.
This is also why you have 'trade hubs' in eve and why the price for most items outside of those trade hubs is higher.
How would you simulate production changes and variable supply into this model? It could become very complex (and not worth the time to implement) or it could just be something a third year economics undergrad could write up in a day... hard for me to say/know... I'm not an economist.
Well essentially how it would need to work is that increase in demand would cause an increase in price. In a normal market situation like EVE, high prices increases the desire to produce that item, and thus supply would increase over time. So you would need to have a decay function where 'supply' would increase and thus lower overall price. So while prices spike from high demand, they price would slowly decay over time even if demand remained high because supply catches up.
It's also imporant to look at supply and demand as a function of every item in the game as a whole. We have to assume that supply is finite, and if they're producing more of item A, they're then producing less of item B. Cheaper items are of course, less expensive to produce however so you can't look at it as purely an equal exchange; you need to adjust for relative cost. If you produce 1 less proto suit, you can probably produce 10-15 standard ones, so the supply equation becomes complicated at that point.
The hardest part is the balance. If the purchase of a certain suit becomes expensive, you need to make sure that people will shift to something cheaper...this is going to be primarily influenced by the ISK payouts from battles. That really comes down to market data though but I dont have access to so I can't really comment much on it.
But yes you're right, it gets extremely complicated very quickly. And people wonder why CCP has an economist on staff for EVE...
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3112
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 16:41:00 -
[48] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:The thing to bear in mind with an idea like this, is that you'd either have some dude at CCP having to set the prices on every item in the game every week (a full-time job), or they'd have to develop an entirely new method for updating the price on items in the backend.
Either way, it's a much larger investment than it may seem.
I love the idea, but my immediate thought on viewing it, is that there are smaller time investment projects than can reap far better rewards for the players than this. The first thing we should ask is 'how does this affect new players?', they are the lifeblood of the game. Most of us would simply shrug off the extra cost or just keep using aurum. What about new players?. What is the actual point exactly in implementing a mechanic that simply keeps vets cosy and screws newer players?.
Im not exactly sure how a market system screws new players? Assuming that you can simulate a market to behave 100% like say, EVE, it would be self regulating. If **** gets too expensive, people just won't buy it, and thus demand and prices drop until people are willing to buy it.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5529
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 16:43:00 -
[49] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:The thing to bear in mind with an idea like this, is that you'd either have some dude at CCP having to set the prices on every item in the game every week (a full-time job), or they'd have to develop an entirely new method for updating the price on items in the backend.
Either way, it's a much larger investment than it may seem.
I love the idea, but my immediate thought on viewing it, is that there are smaller time investment projects than can reap far better rewards for the players than this. The first thing we should ask is 'how does this affect new players?', they are the lifeblood of the game. Most of us would simply shrug off the extra cost or just keep using aurum. What about new players?. What is the actual point exactly in implementing a mechanic that simply keeps vets cosy and screws newer players?. Im not exactly sure how a market system screws new players? Assuming that you can simulate a market to behave 100% like say, EVE, it would be self regulating. If **** gets too expensive, people just won't buy it, and thus demand and prices drop until people are willing to buy it.
The prices going up wouldn't affect new players?.
It wouldn't be a market either. Just a mechanic where x weapon is being used x amount, do therefore it goes up x amount.
It wouldn't be a market.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3112
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 16:48:00 -
[50] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:
The prices going up wouldn't affect new players?.
It wouldn't be a market either. Just a mechanic where x weapon is being used x amount, do therefore it goes up x amount.
It wouldn't be a market.
Well as I pointed out before in a previous post, maybe you missed it, you would need to address prices going down for other items as part of an overall supply/demand scheme. If A increases and B decreases, eventually people will start using more of B which will raise the price of B and decrease A. This is typical in macroeconomics, and while the market can flux, overall its trend it towards equilibrium.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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|
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5529
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:52:00 -
[51] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:
The prices going up wouldn't affect new players?.
It wouldn't be a market either. Just a mechanic where x weapon is being used x amount, do therefore it goes up x amount.
It wouldn't be a market.
Well as I pointed out before in a previous post, maybe you missed it, you would need to address prices going down for other items as part of an overall supply/demand scheme. If A increases and B decreases, eventually people will start using more of B which will raise the price of B and decrease A. This is typical in macroeconomics, and while the market can flux, overall its trend it towards equilibrium.
Except in dust, us vets would never care about a price rise so its broken from the get go.
I hear what you are saying but its only new/newer players that will be affected by this, we will continue spamming and directly affect those players with a slice of laughing at them.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5529
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:53:00 -
[52] - Quote
If this got implemented, I buy my aurum items in stacks of 600-1000.
So that right there is fked unless aurum wouldn't factor?.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3113
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 16:58:00 -
[53] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:
The prices going up wouldn't affect new players?.
It wouldn't be a market either. Just a mechanic where x weapon is being used x amount, do therefore it goes up x amount.
It wouldn't be a market.
Well as I pointed out before in a previous post, maybe you missed it, you would need to address prices going down for other items as part of an overall supply/demand scheme. If A increases and B decreases, eventually people will start using more of B which will raise the price of B and decrease A. This is typical in macroeconomics, and while the market can flux, overall its trend it towards equilibrium. Except in dust, us vets would never care about a price rise so its broken from the get go. I hear what you are saying but its only new/newer players that will be affected by this, we will continue spamming and directly affect those players with a slice of laughing at them.
Well heres my point. Most vets use Advanced and Proto gear, that's just the nature of the beast, this means that the demand for standard gear would go down, thus lowering the price. Since most new players are running standard gear, they would actually have an easier time.
The point I was trying to make is that if you work in a supply-side situation, the ability to 'produce' standard gear is much higher than proto gear. This means that its easy to quickly supply cheap gear to meet the markets need, and that the loss of a sale of proto gear means a lot of standard gear can be produced if needed.
So essentially the lower tiered items are more resistant to market fluxations because the sale of a single standard item has mess of an impact on the overal supply, whereas a proto item has far more weight.
Again, I'm an engineer not an economist so I'm by no means an expert on macroeconomics haha, but I do know a bit.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
3955
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:01:00 -
[54] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:If this got implemented, I buy my aurum items in stacks of 600-1000.
So that right there is fked unless aurum wouldn't factor?.
Yeah, I don't think it should include aurum items. That would not go over well if they suddenly increased dramatically in price.
It would just come off as a money grab.
Besides, I think that the fact aurum is actually correlated with real money brings an aspect of risk that is not present with ISK transactions. I think part of what makes this idea great is that it would create much greater risk/reward as the most popular items will also be the highest cost items.
You can always tell a Millford Minja
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5529
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:02:00 -
[55] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:
The prices going up wouldn't affect new players?.
It wouldn't be a market either. Just a mechanic where x weapon is being used x amount, do therefore it goes up x amount.
It wouldn't be a market.
Well as I pointed out before in a previous post, maybe you missed it, you would need to address prices going down for other items as part of an overall supply/demand scheme. If A increases and B decreases, eventually people will start using more of B which will raise the price of B and decrease A. This is typical in macroeconomics, and while the market can flux, overall its trend it towards equilibrium. Except in dust, us vets would never care about a price rise so its broken from the get go. I hear what you are saying but its only new/newer players that will be affected by this, we will continue spamming and directly affect those players with a slice of laughing at them. Well heres my point. Most vets use Advanced and Proto gear, that's just the nature of the beast, this means that the demand for standard gear would go down, thus lowering the price. Since most new players are running standard gear, they would actually have an easier time. The point I was trying to make is that if you work in a supply-side situation, the ability to 'produce' standard gear is much higher than proto gear. This means that its easy to quickly supply cheap gear to meet the markets need, and that the loss of a sale of proto gear means a lot of standard gear can be produced if needed. So essentially the lower tiered items are more resistant to market fluxations because the sale of a single standard item has mess of an impact on the overal supply, whereas a proto item has far more weight. Again, I'm an engineer not an economist so I'm by no means an expert on macroeconomics haha, but I do know a bit.
I see what you are saying aye.
I know a fair bit as well and none of this would have a negative impact on me ever, I just care about the newbs.
I guess it depends on how you look at it.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5529
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:04:00 -
[56] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:If this got implemented, I buy my aurum items in stacks of 600-1000.
So that right there is fked unless aurum wouldn't factor?. Yeah, I don't think it should include aurum items. That would not go over well if they suddenly increased dramatically in price. It would just come off as a money grab. Besides, I think that the fact aurum is actually correlated with real money brings an aspect of risk that is not present with ISK transactions. I think part of what makes this idea great is that it would create much greater risk/reward as the most popular items will also be the highest cost items.
Hehe, its relative.
I pay so that no death matters, ever.
But yeah agreed.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3118
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:04:00 -
[57] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:If this got implemented, I buy my aurum items in stacks of 600-1000.
So that right there is fked unless aurum wouldn't factor?. Yeah, I don't think it should include aurum items. That would not go over well if they suddenly increased dramatically in price. It would just come off as a money grab. Besides, I think that the fact aurum is actually correlated with real money brings an aspect of risk that is not present with ISK transactions. I think part of what makes this idea great is that it would create much greater risk/reward as the most popular items will also be the highest cost items.
AUR items admittedly are the real wrench in the works because you get risky if you start making those change, and if they don't change, you're guaranteeing that high demand items are better purchased with AUR than ISK. So that is a major problem.
EVE gets away with it because AUR items cannot be produced and are unique items that cannot normally be purchased otherwise. But if you could buy in-game items with AUR like ships and whatnot....well that gets messy very quickly.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3118
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:08:00 -
[58] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:
I see what you are saying aye.
I know a fair bit as well and none of this would have a negative impact on me ever, I just care about the newbs.
I guess it depends on how you look at it.
Nah I hear ya man, I'm always trying to look out for the newbies too. Dust is overly harsh on them.
Suffice it to say free markets are extremely complicated and difficult to track, and even harder to simulate accurately, especially in a game setting.
Overall its an interesting idea, not sure if it's really feasible for Dust but its an interesting idea nonetheless. Its just one of those things thats VERY difficult to get right, and getting it wrong would be catastrophic. If it could be done right? Freaking sweet. Just be careful moving forward.
Regardless it's cool stuff to discuss, and its good that people are thinking about stuff like this.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5530
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:08:00 -
[59] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:One Eyed King wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:If this got implemented, I buy my aurum items in stacks of 600-1000.
So that right there is fked unless aurum wouldn't factor?. Yeah, I don't think it should include aurum items. That would not go over well if they suddenly increased dramatically in price. It would just come off as a money grab. Besides, I think that the fact aurum is actually correlated with real money brings an aspect of risk that is not present with ISK transactions. I think part of what makes this idea great is that it would create much greater risk/reward as the most popular items will also be the highest cost items. AUR items admittedly are the real wrench in the works because you get risky if you start making those change, and if they don't change, you're guaranteeing that high demand items are better purchased with AUR than ISK. So that is a major problem. EVE gets away with it because AUR items cannot be produced and are unique items that cannot normally be purchased otherwise. But if you could buy in-game items with AUR like ships and whatnot....well that gets messy very quickly.
I have had hate mail from spamming proto aurum and going about 9/24 before lol.
They started in proto and ended up in bpos while I still mindlessly spammed their face.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
|
TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5530
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:10:00 -
[60] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:
I see what you are saying aye.
I know a fair bit as well and none of this would have a negative impact on me ever, I just care about the newbs.
I guess it depends on how you look at it.
Nah I hear ya man, I'm always trying to look out for the newbies too. Dust is overly harsh on them. Suffice it to say free markets are extremely complicated and difficult to track, and even harder to simulate accurately, especially in a game setting. Overall its an interesting idea, not sure if it's really feasible for Dust but its an interesting idea nonetheless. Its just one of those things thats VERY difficult to get right, and getting it wrong would be catastrophic. If it could be done right? Freaking sweet. Just be careful moving forward. Regardless it's cool stuff to discuss, and its good that people are thinking about stuff like this.
I think its a shite idea for dust but agreed lol.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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|
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3121
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:12:00 -
[61] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:I have had hate mail from spamming proto aurum and going about 9/24 before lol. They started in proto and ended up in bpos while I still mindlessly spammed their face.
Lol I have the EVE mentality "I just cost that guy ______ and I only spent ______!!" I love when people use AUR, makes that kill taste even sweeter. And I always start in BPOs and and in them. Zero Fucks given about my KDR, and Im a cheap bastard so BPOs suit me just fine...I always win the ISK war.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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Kaze Eyrou
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
596
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:13:00 -
[62] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:The thing to bear in mind with an idea like this, is that you'd either have some dude at CCP having to set the prices on every item in the game every week (a full-time job), or they'd have to develop an entirely new method for updating the price on items in the backend.
Either way, it's a much larger investment than it may seem.
I love the idea, but my immediate thought on viewing it, is that there are smaller time investment projects than can reap far better rewards for the players than this.
Alaika Arbosa wrote:If it is only a matter of writing the script and implementing it so that it runs weekly, it would be extremely easy for CCP to do so. They write one script and then no more manhours devoted to it, set and forget and it adds player driven dynamism to the game.
Quick question to Alaika:
Would this not only make items more expensive, but also make items LESS expensive?
And would this apply to Militia items/weapons/frames?
Closed Beta Vet // Logi Bro // @KazeEyrou
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5530
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Posted - 2014.09.09 17:16:00 -
[63] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:I have had hate mail from spamming proto aurum and going about 9/24 before lol. They started in proto and ended up in bpos while I still mindlessly spammed their face. Lol I have the EVE mentality "I just cost that guy ______ and I only spent ______!!" I love when people use AUR, makes that kill taste even sweeter. And I always start in BPOs and and in them. Zero Fucks given about my KDR, and Im a cheap bastard so BPOs suit me just fine...I always win the ISK war.
Its relative though.
Iv spammed proto aurum since beta to never care about dying.
Lack of matchmaking is p!swing in my cornflakes right now though.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
|
One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
3956
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Posted - 2014.09.09 17:18:00 -
[64] - Quote
RE: Newbs
I see this as a great deal for them. Unless they so significantly outnumber vets that std level weapon purchases far exceed proto and adv purchases, it should result in lower standard weapon prices.
Also, when looking at potential abuse by lots of proto purchasing in the first week or so, that would also very much help new players as the number of proto weapons would initially be held in fewer hands once prices increased. This would result in a period of time where proto stomping was less available, and mercs would be economically forced to run adv or even std gear.
The reality is there are so many possibilities that it could be one of the best things to happen in Dust, one of the worse, or somewhere in between.
I perceive the ease of removing such a system would limit any potential negatives and that this could be a calculated risk that would inject some incredible and interesting aspects into Dust.
You can always tell a Millford Minja
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3125
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:19:00 -
[65] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:I have had hate mail from spamming proto aurum and going about 9/24 before lol. They started in proto and ended up in bpos while I still mindlessly spammed their face. Lol I have the EVE mentality "I just cost that guy ______ and I only spent ______!!" I love when people use AUR, makes that kill taste even sweeter. And I always start in BPOs and and in them. Zero Fucks given about my KDR, and Im a cheap bastard so BPOs suit me just fine...I always win the ISK war. Its relative though. Iv spammed proto aurum since beta to never care about dying. Lack of matchmaking is p!swing in my cornflakes right now though.
*shrugs* To each his own. I'm kinda the same way with my BPOs. I enjoy the game more when I can be more aggressive and die more often without going in the red, plus I prefer to spend my AUR on boosters instead of items.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5533
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:21:00 -
[66] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:I have had hate mail from spamming proto aurum and going about 9/24 before lol. They started in proto and ended up in bpos while I still mindlessly spammed their face. Lol I have the EVE mentality "I just cost that guy ______ and I only spent ______!!" I love when people use AUR, makes that kill taste even sweeter. And I always start in BPOs and and in them. Zero Fucks given about my KDR, and Im a cheap bastard so BPOs suit me just fine...I always win the ISK war.
Once matchmaking is in place, I'll have reliable team mates so I can continue the proto aurum spam comfortably lol.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
|
TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5533
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:22:00 -
[67] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:I have had hate mail from spamming proto aurum and going about 9/24 before lol. They started in proto and ended up in bpos while I still mindlessly spammed their face. Lol I have the EVE mentality "I just cost that guy ______ and I only spent ______!!" I love when people use AUR, makes that kill taste even sweeter. And I always start in BPOs and and in them. Zero Fucks given about my KDR, and Im a cheap bastard so BPOs suit me just fine...I always win the ISK war. Its relative though. Iv spammed proto aurum since beta to never care about dying. Lack of matchmaking is p!swing in my cornflakes right now though. *shrugs* To each his own. I'm kinda the same way with my BPOs. I enjoy the game more when I can be more aggressive and die more often without going in the red, plus I prefer to spend my AUR on boosters instead of items.
Hehe, I run my bpos for the beta swag effect lol.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
|
One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
3957
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:25:00 -
[68] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:The thing to bear in mind with an idea like this, is that you'd either have some dude at CCP having to set the prices on every item in the game every week (a full-time job), or they'd have to develop an entirely new method for updating the price on items in the backend.
Either way, it's a much larger investment than it may seem.
I love the idea, but my immediate thought on viewing it, is that there are smaller time investment projects than can reap far better rewards for the players than this.
I am sure there are some formulas they could put together that would by and large negate the need for someone to constantly monitor this.
I think it would be less effective even if prices were merely subjective based upon that individual's moods etc.
You can always tell a Millford Minja
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3125
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 17:28:00 -
[69] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:I have had hate mail from spamming proto aurum and going about 9/24 before lol. They started in proto and ended up in bpos while I still mindlessly spammed their face. Lol I have the EVE mentality "I just cost that guy ______ and I only spent ______!!" I love when people use AUR, makes that kill taste even sweeter. And I always start in BPOs and and in them. Zero Fucks given about my KDR, and Im a cheap bastard so BPOs suit me just fine...I always win the ISK war. Its relative though. Iv spammed proto aurum since beta to never care about dying. Lack of matchmaking is p!swing in my cornflakes right now though. *shrugs* To each his own. I'm kinda the same way with my BPOs. I enjoy the game more when I can be more aggressive and die more often without going in the red, plus I prefer to spend my AUR on boosters instead of items. Hehe, I run my bpos for the beta swag effect lol.
I fit my Yellow Biotic BPO. That's BetaSwag that people don't even know I'm using. 
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5533
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Posted - 2014.09.09 17:31:00 -
[70] - Quote
I don't even know of that swag, that's how swag it is lol.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3127
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Posted - 2014.09.09 17:34:00 -
[71] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:I don't even know of that swag, that's how swag it is lol.
Real men Hull Tank and use Yellow Biotics.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5533
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Posted - 2014.09.09 17:36:00 -
[72] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:I don't even know of that swag, that's how swag it is lol. Real men Hull Tank and use Yellow Biotics.
Ah I get you.
My hometown beat Manchester united.
Git gud man utd.
4-0
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2108
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 19:22:00 -
[73] - Quote
Kaze Eyrou wrote:
Quick question to Alaika:
Would this not only make items more expensive, but also make items LESS expensive?
And would this apply to Militia items/weapons/frames?
Yes, I had imagined it would increase prices by a % for items that were being purchased heavily and it would also decrease prices for items that were being neglected on the market.
As for Militia items, I would imagine that they would have an enforced artificial cap to prevent things from being too hard on the newbs, something like "No MLT items will be priced more than 1500 isk". This would give a little wiggle room for them but prevent things from getting too expensive that newbs can't even fall back to MLT gear.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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ZDub 303
Escrow Removal and Acquisition
Negative-Feedback
3258
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Posted - 2014.09.09 19:31:00 -
[74] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:
The hardest part is the balance. If the purchase of a certain suit becomes expensive, you need to make sure that people will shift to something cheaper...this is going to be primarily influenced by the ISK payouts from battles. That really comes down to market data though but I dont have access to so I can't really comment much on it.
But yes you're right, it gets extremely complicated very quickly. And people wonder why CCP has an economist on staff for EVE...
Exactly. From a very high level perspective everything you say is pretty straightforward, and its what you would expect of most players behavior sans environmental aspects (like certain raw material shortages due to x event).
But this next point is where I think, as neat as this idea might be, it no longer makes any sense. Finding a correct set of models numbers to essentially mimic the supply side of player/person behavior is not a simple task. There are much better things the few devs working on Dust can do to better impact player experience I think.
As neat as it is, I would say this type of feature just needs to wait for Legion, where a true player market (supply and demand) can be implemented.
B C R U are letters, not words - Wierd Al Yankovich
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2108
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 19:35:00 -
[75] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:
The hardest part is the balance. If the purchase of a certain suit becomes expensive, you need to make sure that people will shift to something cheaper...this is going to be primarily influenced by the ISK payouts from battles. That really comes down to market data though but I dont have access to so I can't really comment much on it.
But yes you're right, it gets extremely complicated very quickly. And people wonder why CCP has an economist on staff for EVE...
Exactly. From a very high level perspective everything you say is pretty straightforward, and its what you would expect of most players behavior sans environmental aspects (like certain raw material shortages due to x event). But this next point is where I think, as neat as this idea might be, it no longer makes any sense. Finding a correct set of models numbers to essentially mimic the supply side of player/person behavior is not a simple task. There are much better things the few devs working on Dust can do to better impact player experience I think. As neat as it is, I would say this type of feature just needs to wait for Legion, where a true player market (supply and demand) can be implemented.
Our purchasing habits are being used to create the demand half of things, why not use item stockpiles held by active players to represent the supply side of things?
Our patterns of purchasing and usage would create an ebb and flow to the market conditions. It would be a player simulated market.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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The-Errorist
SVER True Blood
820
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Posted - 2014.09.09 20:21:00 -
[76] - Quote
I would like something like this.
MAG + Dust cb vet, an alt of Velvet Overkill & Agent Overkill. http://vimeo.com/93181621
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
3128
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 20:46:00 -
[77] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:
The hardest part is the balance. If the purchase of a certain suit becomes expensive, you need to make sure that people will shift to something cheaper...this is going to be primarily influenced by the ISK payouts from battles. That really comes down to market data though but I dont have access to so I can't really comment much on it.
But yes you're right, it gets extremely complicated very quickly. And people wonder why CCP has an economist on staff for EVE...
Exactly. From a very high level perspective everything you say is pretty straightforward, and its what you would expect of most players behavior sans environmental aspects (like certain raw material shortages due to x event). But this next point is where I think, as neat as this idea might be, it no longer makes any sense. Finding a correct set of models numbers to essentially mimic the supply side of player/person behavior is not a simple task. There are much better things the few devs working on Dust can do to better impact player experience I think. As neat as it is, I would say this type of feature just needs to wait for Legion, where a true player market (supply and demand) can be implemented.
Yep, totally hear ya. Its difficult because even supply is not constant in a true market. Sure supply is allocated differently over time, but the base supply can also fluctuate based on market conditions. Its easier then its a real market because it adjusts itself in real time, but trying to keep up and artificially balance it all would either require an insane automated system, or as Xel said someone doing it full tie.
GIven a different situation with development resources I could see it, but sadly we're very limited. It's a really cool idea, I'll give the OP that, but sadly I dont think we could properly implement it...and if we were gonna take the time to do it, it would need to be done right, and that's damn hard to do.
Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
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medomai grey
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
974
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 21:28:00 -
[78] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Ok, so I brought this up to CCP Archduke the other night in DevHangout and he told me that this should be posted here.
So we all know that we aren't getting a Player Market in Dust, though I think I have a suitable compromise in mind that is very doable (I described it as a decent consolation prize for the lack of a player market).
The idea is this, each week the Isk prices of items on the market would fluctuate with the demand as dictated by the previous week. If in week one the Kaalakiota Rail Rifle is the most bought item, then in week two, it would have its price increased by X%, items that weren't being bought would have their price decreased by X%. Each week, prices would be modified to reflect the previous weeks demand.
We'd still be impacting the market despite our lack of selling ability. Not only this, it would also help to curb FoTM spamming (too many people consistently buying an item and the price will skyrocket within weeks). Came expecting something stupid. Found something interesting instead.
What percentile of Dust514's infantry arsenal belongs to the category of machine guns?
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Dustbunny Durrr
ReD or DeaD
276
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Posted - 2014.09.09 21:36:00 -
[79] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Ok, so I brought this up to CCP Archduke the other night in DevHangout and he told me that this should be posted here.
So we all know that we aren't getting a Player Market in Dust, though I think I have a suitable compromise in mind that is very doable (I described it as a decent consolation prize for the lack of a player market).
The idea is this, each week the Isk prices of items on the market would fluctuate with the demand as dictated by the previous week. If in week one the Kaalakiota Rail Rifle is the most bought item, then in week two, it would have its price increased by X%, items that weren't being bought would have their price decreased by X%. Each week, prices would be modified to reflect the previous weeks demand.
We'd still be impacting the market despite our lack of selling ability. Not only this, it would also help to curb FoTM spamming (too many people consistently buying an item and the price will skyrocket within weeks).
Very interesting idea. I have to +1 |
Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
4173
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 22:13:00 -
[80] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:AEON VINTOREZ wrote:I've noticed that the prices of Infantry gear in Eve online are fixed at Dust prices. It would be interesting to see prices fluctuate in Eve as currently there is no incentive to buy or sell infantry gear in Eve.
It would be nice to be able to sell unwanted infantry gear at fixed market prices too. I would be happy to pay a sales tax if I was able to sell all of my surplus and unwanted salvage gear on the market.
I think this is definitely worth a try. If EVE players started to play the DUST market, I would count that as a win! The more EVE players start to care about DUST, the more CCP upper management will start to care about DUST.
Lets take it one step further. Have Infantry gear only sold in the 48 DUST systems. Have the cost of infantry gear in each system affected by how many of each item is purchased by DUST players in that system.
Have Infantry gear purchasable and sellable EVE side, with daily supplies limited. Have EVE side purchases raise the price and EVE side sales lower the price, as that would lower or increase supplies in that system.
Then EVE players buying from systems with the lowest prices and selling in systems with a high price would act to return prices to a more stable medium.
This could spawn a full career in EVE where people can track the DUST market and travel between DUST systems buying low and selling high. I think there is something like this in EVE involving NPC trade goods, but Infantry gear would be based on real player supply and demand, so it would be much more interesting than any NPC market.
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3722
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Posted - 2014.09.09 22:20:00 -
[81] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Lets take it one step further. Have Infantry gear only sold in the 48 DUST systems. Have the cost of infantry gear in each system affected by how many of each item is purchased by DUST players in that system.
Have Infantry gear purchasable and sellable EVE side, with daily supplies limited. Have EVE side purchases raise the price and EVE side sales lower the price, as that would lower or increase supplies in that system.
Then EVE players buying from systems with the lowest prices and selling in systems with a high price would act to return prices to a more stable medium.
This could spawn a full career in EVE where people can track the DUST market and travel between DUST systems buying low and selling high. I think there is something like this in EVE involving NPC trade goods, but Infantry gear would be based on real player supply and demand, so it would be much more interesting than any NPC market.
@Fox Gaden
You're on a good path. Alaika, I suggest the OP help direct the conversation toward considering more applications for these already available EVEside assets which are regrettably price locked at the moment.
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3722
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 22:26:00 -
[82] - Quote
For reference these are NPC trade goods in EVE Online.
https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Item_Database:Trade_Goods:Consumer_Products
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
4173
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 22:29:00 -
[83] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:
The first thing we should ask is 'how does this affect new players?', they are the lifeblood of the game.
I would not expect this system to apply to Militia gear.
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2114
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 22:30:00 -
[84] - Quote
Jadek Menaheim wrote:Fox Gaden wrote:Lets take it one step further. Have Infantry gear only sold in the 48 DUST systems. Have the cost of infantry gear in each system affected by how many of each item is purchased by DUST players in that system.
Have Infantry gear purchasable and sellable EVE side, with daily supplies limited. Have EVE side purchases raise the price and EVE side sales lower the price, as that would lower or increase supplies in that system.
Then EVE players buying from systems with the lowest prices and selling in systems with a high price would act to return prices to a more stable medium.
This could spawn a full career in EVE where people can track the DUST market and travel between DUST systems buying low and selling high. I think there is something like this in EVE involving NPC trade goods, but Infantry gear would be based on real player supply and demand, so it would be much more interesting than any NPC market. @Fox Gaden You're on a good path. Alaika, I suggest the OP help direct the conversation toward considering more applications for these already available EVEside assets which are regrettably price locked at the moment.
OP updated, I like this idea though I will say that IMHO, the eve side buys/sales should modify our own ebb and flow, Eve should have only a marginal effect on us as we have only a marginal effect on them.
TBH though, my original idea was intended to be a simplistic simulation of market conditions, not a full-blown simulated economy as some are putting forward.
I put forward the consolation prize for not getting the player market, some in this thread want that consolation prize to be a full player market sans buying/selling to/from players.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
1632
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Posted - 2014.09.09 22:31:00 -
[85] - Quote
all this will do is get people buying in bulk on the cheap weeks and then using them on the expensive weeks to bring the costs back down.
i think it will actually increase FOTM use as the cheap weeks allow for people to buy more in preparation for the expensive week that will follow.
a lot of people already do this with aurum gear. wait for a good discount and buy in bulk. i did this with core locus grenades a while back. bought thousands. the same would happen with the normal items. we would just buy suits in bulk on the first week causing the price the following week to go up. as we have them in bulk we won't buy any on that expensive week and the prices will drop due to none being purchased. the following week prices will be lower than the first week so again buy in bulk and repeat the process.
if it can be manipulated into benefiting a player it will be
All Hail Legion
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3724
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Posted - 2014.09.09 22:35:00 -
[86] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:OP updated, I like this idea though I will say that IMHO, the eve side buys/sales should modify our own ebb and flow.
Ideally, interaction would somehow work both ways. Our use affects their prices and their sales and transfer of goods affects our prices to a certain extent. Even if all we did was affect their system that's still a step in a good direction because it gets Eve Player interested in the dynamics of Dust.
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2114
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 22:36:00 -
[87] - Quote
ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:all this will do is get people buying in bulk on the cheap weeks and then using them on the expensive weeks to bring the costs back down.
i think it will actually increase FOTM use as the cheap weeks allow for people to buy more in preparation for the expensive week that will follow.
a lot of people already do this with aurum gear. wait for a good discount and buy in bulk. i did this with core locus grenades a while back. bought thousands. the same would happen with the normal items. we would just buy suits in bulk on the first week causing the price the following week to go up. as we have them in bulk we won't buy any on that expensive week and the prices will drop due to none being purchased. the following week prices will be lower than the first week so again buy in bulk and repeat the process.
if it can be manipulated into benefiting a player it will be
Though it would become an Isk sink due to the lack of selling and players own willing conversion of liquid Isk into Asset wealth that they may or may not end up fully utilizing.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
1633
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Posted - 2014.09.09 22:45:00 -
[88] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:all this will do is get people buying in bulk on the cheap weeks and then using them on the expensive weeks to bring the costs back down.
i think it will actually increase FOTM use as the cheap weeks allow for people to buy more in preparation for the expensive week that will follow.
a lot of people already do this with aurum gear. wait for a good discount and buy in bulk. i did this with core locus grenades a while back. bought thousands. the same would happen with the normal items. we would just buy suits in bulk on the first week causing the price the following week to go up. as we have them in bulk we won't buy any on that expensive week and the prices will drop due to none being purchased. the following week prices will be lower than the first week so again buy in bulk and repeat the process.
if it can be manipulated into benefiting a player it will be Though it would become an Isk sink due to the lack of selling and players own willing conversion of liquid Isk into Asset wealth that they may or may not end up fully utilizing.
lets say it was a 20% fluctuation in either direction. i buy 100 complete fits in the first week at 100% costs. the following week costs go up as this fit is made up of the most used items so week 2 the cost is 120% but i have surplus so i don't need to buy that 2nd week so in week 3 the cost go down to 80%. at this point i restock saving myself 20% on my costs and ignoring the 20% isk sink on the expensive weeks.
it wont take long for players to collectively influence the market in their favour to save themselves a lot of isk
All Hail Legion
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3724
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 22:45:00 -
[89] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Lets take it one step further. Have Infantry gear only sold in the 48 DUST systems. Have the cost of infantry gear in each system affected by how many of each item is purchased by DUST players in that system.
A consideration I do have for this is Dust players are locked into system, so if an Eve player was able to ascertain the playstyle of people living in those systems, or 'game' the character creation system to end up in a desired system they could begin to manipulate market prices of various goods.
The positive catch to this in both cases is the EVE player must interact with Dust, either by talking with players to playing the game themselves.
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3724
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Posted - 2014.09.09 22:47:00 -
[90] - Quote
ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:it wont take long for players to collectively influence the market in their favour to save themselves a lot of isk
That doesn't sound like a bad thing to me.
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
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Zindorak
1.U.P
888
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Posted - 2014.09.09 23:16:00 -
[91] - Quote
Oooo i like this idea. That means Duvolles will be really cheap
Pokemon master!
I suck at Tekken lol
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Apocalyptic Destroyer
RestlessSpirits
124
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Posted - 2014.09.10 05:19:00 -
[92] - Quote
This is great !
~R1P
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Cat Merc
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
12095
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Posted - 2014.09.10 16:07:00 -
[93] - Quote
Valve had this system for Counter Strike Source at the beginning.
Armor and helmet cost more than the max amount of money you can hold at any given time XD
Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2120
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Posted - 2014.09.10 17:45:00 -
[94] - Quote
OP updated once again to make some things clear on page one.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Maken Tosch
Dust University
Ivy League
9294
|
Posted - 2014.09.10 17:51:00 -
[95] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:Very interesting idea. Potential for abuse though depending on how its set up.
What would stop a group of players with large amounts from ISK, mass stockpiling high end gear one week, thus driving the price up extremely high the next week, and then terrorizing players with Proto gear that the players can not afford because of the price hike?
I think that's the point.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2120
|
Posted - 2014.09.10 18:04:00 -
[96] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:Very interesting idea. Potential for abuse though depending on how its set up.
What would stop a group of players with large amounts from ISK, mass stockpiling high end gear one week, thus driving the price up extremely high the next week, and then terrorizing players with Proto gear that the players can not afford because of the price hike? I think that's the point.
My point isn't that, my point is to give some fluidity to the market. Something that tricks us into feeling like we actually have a player market with shifting conditions rather than the stagnant market we currently have.
Do I think it is a bad idea to increase the price of Proto gear? No, the price isn't providing the balancing effect it was originally supposed to (thank you runaway farming /sarcasm).
Would I cry if Proto gear became prohibitively expensive? No, IMHO Proto gear is far too common as it is and anything that causes it to become rarer is a good thing.
I understand that this could drive Proto gear into the hands of a select few rich, however how is this different from things currently? If you see Nyain Chan/San in a match do you expect to see anything but Proto spam?
Potential for abuse will exist for any system introduced to this playerbase who seem to make it their sole purpose in this game to game the system (sorry if that annoys me somewhat).
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Maken Tosch
Dust University
Ivy League
9296
|
Posted - 2014.09.10 18:12:00 -
[97] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:Very interesting idea. Potential for abuse though depending on how its set up.
What would stop a group of players with large amounts from ISK, mass stockpiling high end gear one week, thus driving the price up extremely high the next week, and then terrorizing players with Proto gear that the players can not afford because of the price hike? I think that's the point. My point isn't that, my point is to give some fluidity to the market. Something that tricks us into feeling like we actually have a player market with shifting conditions rather than the stagnant market we currently have. Do I think it is a bad idea to increase the price of Proto gear? No, the price isn't providing the balancing effect it was originally supposed to (thank you runaway farming /sarcasm). Would I cry if Proto gear became prohibitively expensive? No, IMHO Proto gear is far too common as it is and anything that causes it to become rarer is a good thing. I understand that this could drive Proto gear into the hands of a select few rich, however how is this different from things currently? If you see Nyain Chan/San in a match do you expect to see anything but Proto spam? Potential for abuse will exist for any system introduced to this playerbase who seem to make it their sole purpose in this game to game the system (sorry if that annoys me somewhat). Maken Tosch wrote:PS: Imagine how much ISK this system will remove from the game if implemented. All that ISK circulating as a result of PC District Locking in the past will be drained at a significant rate and could help alleviate CCP's worry about having to transfer any ISK at all to Legion when the time comes. Plus any ISK gained from ALT farming can be drained the same way as well. Thank you for articulating that for me, honestly, thank you.
That's actually the underlying reason why I wanted to see a secondary market where players have full control of the prices and not the NPCs. Unfortunately, that kind of dream will only be coming to Legion* so we have to make do with a simulated market instead as you suggested. But at the very least, fluctuating prices can ensure that proto stomping can be put under control. It will be a bit crazy at first, and I know what crazy looks like since I play the market in Eve Online, but in the end after everything settles down proto stomping will be a thing of the past. No one wants to spent 10,000,000 ISK for a single fitting of a dropsuit and die in it 20 times in a single match.
* - stupid typo
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Derpty Derp
Dead Man's Game
444
|
Posted - 2014.09.10 18:16:00 -
[98] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:
The first thing we should ask is 'how does this affect new players?', they are the lifeblood of the game.
I would not expect this system to apply to Militia gear.
I would... We have starter fits for new players. Militia is mostly used by people in the game for some time to pull in money with the strongest 'cheap' fit they can build... Would be nice to push everyone towards the happy middle tier. |
Maken Tosch
Dust University
Ivy League
9297
|
Posted - 2014.09.10 18:22:00 -
[99] - Quote
Oh dear god! I just realized. Imagine vehicles and people like me stabbing them to death with cheap knives. OMG!
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Mauren NOON
The Exemplars
457
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Posted - 2014.09.10 18:38:00 -
[100] - Quote
+1 bump for dev response
Scr and commando enthusiast.
Amarrica!
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2123
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Posted - 2014.09.10 18:51:00 -
[101] - Quote
Derpty Derp wrote:Fox Gaden wrote:TechMechMeds wrote:
The first thing we should ask is 'how does this affect new players?', they are the lifeblood of the game.
I would not expect this system to apply to Militia gear. I would... We have starter fits for new players. Militia is mostly used by people in the game for some time to pull in money with the strongest 'cheap' fit they can build... Would be nice to push everyone towards the happy middle tier.
I like the way you think.
Standard/Advanced should be the most common items on the field. As it stands now, it is either Proto or BPO/Militia items I see mostly. I do see some standard and advanced items but no where near the same numbers of them as I do the PRO/BPO/MLT.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2123
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Posted - 2014.09.11 16:09:00 -
[102] - Quote
Are there any Blue Tags who have thoughts on this topic?
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Maken Tosch
Dust University
Ivy League
9309
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Posted - 2014.09.11 16:13:00 -
[103] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Are there any Blue Tags who have thoughts on this topic?
People have brought this idea up before but the vast majority of the players ruled against it. It was back when all of us were looking forward to having a secondary market in Dust and people like me didn't like the idea of the simulated market as you suggested because it would prove to be counter to what CCP was trying to achieve. However, now that we know the secondary market will never be coming to Dust, it's time to revisit that idea.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2123
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 16:26:00 -
[104] - Quote
I remember being one of those players, though as you said, things are different now.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Maken Tosch
Dust University
Ivy League
9312
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 18:20:00 -
[105] - Quote
So yeah, clearly CCP does have the metrics to calculate which item in Dust is being used the most and which is being used the least. Using those metrics as a reference, all CCP has to do is create a script that runs every week on the same day as the weekly SP cap reset.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
|
Bright Steel
Horizons' Edge
Proficiency V.
74
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 18:26:00 -
[106] - Quote
We don't have to over complicate it:
Make the prices based on actual use in game not purchases, this helps curve the FOTM.
Militia gear can be exempted as gov issued and therefore regulated such as our power bills and water bills. This leads to a very stable market. This could be handled by a simple formula that averages over X amount of months to keep that from being manipulated much.
We also would need the cap set on the price flux in the beginning.
Now after this very simple variable market is in place for a while we can make changes and tweaks slowly. This would also let CCP have an idea of how dust and or legion would react to a true players market.
The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
|
Captian Tulve
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 19:10:00 -
[107] - Quote
Bright Steel wrote:We don't have to over complicate it:
Make the prices based on actual use in game not purchases, this helps curve the FOTM.
Militia gear can be exempted as gov issued and therefore regulated such as our power bills and water bills. This leads to a very stable market. This could be handled by a simple formula that averages over X amount of months to keep that from being manipulated much.
We also would need the cap set on the price flux in the beginning.
Now after this very simple variable market is in place for a while we can make changes and tweaks slowly. This would also let CCP have an idea of how dust and or legion would react to a true players market.
This would isolate dust from eve in the beginning taking away the risk of upsetting the eve economy. And if the caps start out low enough there won't be any major effects on dust either. As we see the results we can raise the caps or what ever. |
Maken Tosch
Dust University
Ivy League
9318
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 19:29:00 -
[108] - Quote
Bright Steel wrote:We don't have to over complicate it:
Make the prices based on actual use in game not purchases, this helps curve the FOTM.
That seems like a better idea. This would help discourage anyone from wanting to stockpile stuff in an attempt to game the market. Again, CCP does have the metrics in place to determine what gear was used and how often.
Of course, this means AUR sales might go up since AUR prices cannot be directly manipulated by the script and thus provide a temporary workaround to the ISK price hike. But let's be real here, who spends AUR anymore on consumables for this game in this state?
...
/realizes he just bought 100 units of 'Pyrus' Nova Knives of varying tiers
...
Nevermind that last sentence.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
|
Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3756
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 19:33:00 -
[109] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:/realizes he just bought 100 units of 'Pyrus' Nova Knives of varying tiers
I knew it was a good idea to suggest bringing those back. CCP marketing can thank me sometime. 
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
|
TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
5559
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 19:34:00 -
[110] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Bright Steel wrote:We don't have to over complicate it:
Make the prices based on actual use in game not purchases, this helps curve the FOTM. That seems like a better idea. This would help discourage anyone from wanting to stockpile stuff in an attempt to game the market. Again, CCP does have the metrics in place to determine what gear was used and how often. Of course, this means AUR sales might go up since AUR prices cannot be directly manipulated by the script and thus provide a temporary workaround to the ISK price hike. But let's be real here, who spends AUR anymore on consumables for this game in this state? ... /realizes he just bought 100 units of 'Pyrus' Nova Knives of varying tiers ... Nevermind that last sentence.
Me, ill be restocking items in stacks of 1000 within two months for another six months+ of pay to not care lol.
That was spiffing.
|
|
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Immortal John Ripper
24448
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 19:34:00 -
[111] - Quote
Do it. It should make things really interesting.
Doubling Billions of isk!
I will double ALL isk from now until the15th!!
No amounts under 5m. Don't waste my time.
|
General John Ripper
24599
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 19:34:00 -
[112] - Quote
Do it. It should make things really interesting.
Doubling Billions of isk!
I will double ALL isk from now until the15th!!
No amounts under 5m. Don't waste my time.
|
Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3756
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 19:40:00 -
[113] - Quote
Bright Steel wrote:We don't have to over complicate it:
Make the prices based on actual use in game not purchases, this helps curve the FOTM.
...
Now after this very simple variable market is in place for a while we can make changes and tweaks slowly. This would also let CCP have an idea of how dust and or legion would react to a true players market.
I do like this approach. Do bear in mind people can still suicide their gear in match as a possible workaround if you are determining prices by use? The upswing is there is a larger grind factor in this as you can only suicide around 40 to 60 suits per match--and vehicles much less.
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
|
deezy dabest
IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP
967
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 21:32:00 -
[114] - Quote
I am a fan of this idea with one exception.
Make it so that we can sell back to those NPCs any thing we do not want or can not use at x% of the current price and alot of people selling these things would offset purchases in the manner of causing the price to go up.
It would at least be a great way to test the client mechanics of the market. |
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2123
|
Posted - 2014.09.11 22:00:00 -
[115] - Quote
deezy dabest wrote:I am a fan of this idea with one exception.
Make it so that we can sell back to those NPCs any thing we do not want or can not use at x% of the current price and alot of people selling these things would offset purchases in the manner of causing the price to go up.
It would at least be a great way to test the client mechanics of the market.
As previously mentioned, that would require a client update which we aren't getting.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2124
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 14:03:00 -
[116] - Quote
I wonder if there are any Devs online who've posted recently (within the past hour or so) who might have input on this topic?
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
matsumoto yuichi san
The Elite Few Inc.
The Methodical Alliance
50
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 18:34:00 -
[117] - Quote
seems legit, ship it |
a brackers
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
46
|
Posted - 2014.09.13 21:47:00 -
[118] - Quote
Come on. Ccp read this
Proto dropship pilot
The sandbox shooter
|
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2127
|
Posted - 2014.09.14 14:19:00 -
[119] - Quote
a brackers wrote:Come on. Ccp read this
I too hope they read this and provide their own input.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Jadek Menaheim
Xer Cloud Consortium
3780
|
Posted - 2014.09.14 20:25:00 -
[120] - Quote
@Alaika Arbosa
Maybe this will help grab some attention. ;)
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=175272&find=unread
Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
|
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2129
|
Posted - 2014.09.14 22:30:00 -
[121] - Quote
Lol, here's hoping
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Denchlad 7
Dead Man's Game
549
|
Posted - 2014.09.14 23:36:00 -
[122] - Quote
My God.
Having every weapon at prototype would actually benefit me?!?!
*sheds a manly tear*
The only person in Dust stupid enough to Proto every single god-damn weapon. 19/19.
|
Bright Steel
Horizons' Edge
Proficiency V.
82
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 14:14:00 -
[123] - Quote
Bump for dev response
The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
|
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2137
|
Posted - 2014.09.16 11:08:00 -
[124] - Quote
So Rattati, any thoughts on this?
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Bright Steel
Horizons' Edge
Proficiency V.
85
|
Posted - 2014.09.16 13:07:00 -
[125] - Quote
I get the feeling they are purposely not commenting 
The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
|
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2139
|
Posted - 2014.09.16 15:11:00 -
[126] - Quote
Bright Steel wrote:I get the feeling they are purposely not commenting
I hope this means that they are seriously discussing it among themselves before saying anything about it on the forums and not just ignoring it outright.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2140
|
Posted - 2014.09.17 13:08:00 -
[127] - Quote
What is the going rate on Logi mk.0's?
Oh, yeah, that is right, it is the same as always, prices don't change.....
Yet.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Bright Steel
Horizons' Edge
Proficiency V.
91
|
Posted - 2014.09.17 19:08:00 -
[128] - Quote
Can't we at least get an acknowledgement from a blue tag?????
Like "we heard you and will discuss"
The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
|
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2141
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 12:04:00 -
[129] - Quote
Any CPM members that want to poke CCP with a stick until they come post here?
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Kalante Schiffer
xXNatural-DisasterXx
745
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 15:23:00 -
[130] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:i've been thinking of retiring for awhile now, this idea if implemented would change that in a heartbeat.
As it is when you see a someone's name you can already know what they will be running and what you need to run to counter them before the match even starts. With this system in place it will provide variety to the battlefield because every player (excluding viktor and pyrex) will try to be isk efficient.
Not only that but it would help career logis a **** ton and help small corps grind isk for pc viktor is not the only multi billionaire there are a lot more and are far more skilled.
jiffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffmxfffffffoiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiifvossssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
|
|
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Dust User
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
644
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 15:25:00 -
[131] - Quote
Kalante Schiffer wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:i've been thinking of retiring for awhile now, this idea if implemented would change that in a heartbeat.
As it is when you see a someone's name you can already know what they will be running and what you need to run to counter them before the match even starts. With this system in place it will provide variety to the battlefield because every player (excluding viktor and pyrex) will try to be isk efficient.
Not only that but it would help career logis a **** ton and help small corps grind isk for pc viktor is not the only multi billionaire there are a lot more and are far more skilled.
How dare you question Sir Hadah's wealth. Be gone peasant. |
Kalante Schiffer
xXNatural-DisasterXx
745
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 15:44:00 -
[132] - Quote
Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:i've been thinking of retiring for awhile now, this idea if implemented would change that in a heartbeat.
As it is when you see a someone's name you can already know what they will be running and what you need to run to counter them before the match even starts. With this system in place it will provide variety to the battlefield because every player (excluding viktor and pyrex) will try to be isk efficient.
Not only that but it would help career logis a **** ton and help small corps grind isk for pc viktor is not the only multi billionaire there are a lot more and are far more skilled. How dare you question Sir Hadah's wealth. Be gone peasant. go back triple attacking districts you glitch em quick peasant.
jiffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffmxfffffffoiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiifvossssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
|
Dust User
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
644
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 16:18:00 -
[133] - Quote
Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:i've been thinking of retiring for awhile now, this idea if implemented would change that in a heartbeat.
As it is when you see a someone's name you can already know what they will be running and what you need to run to counter them before the match even starts. With this system in place it will provide variety to the battlefield because every player (excluding viktor and pyrex) will try to be isk efficient.
Not only that but it would help career logis a **** ton and help small corps grind isk for pc viktor is not the only multi billionaire there are a lot more and are far more skilled. How dare you question Sir Hadah's wealth. Be gone peasant. What i have billions too and a couple more in the AE bank. Could have more if i sold 300m codes. Just because some people do not like to show off and remind everyone how rich they are, it doesn't mean that they are the only ones.
Pics or it didn't happen. |
Kalante Schiffer
xXNatural-DisasterXx
745
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 16:26:00 -
[134] - Quote
Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:i've been thinking of retiring for awhile now, this idea if implemented would change that in a heartbeat.
As it is when you see a someone's name you can already know what they will be running and what you need to run to counter them before the match even starts. With this system in place it will provide variety to the battlefield because every player (excluding viktor and pyrex) will try to be isk efficient.
Not only that but it would help career logis a **** ton and help small corps grind isk for pc viktor is not the only multi billionaire there are a lot more and are far more skilled. How dare you question Sir Hadah's wealth. Be gone peasant. What i have billions too and a couple more in the AE bank. Could have more if i sold 300m codes. Just because some people do not like to show off and remind everyone how rich they are, it doesn't mean that they are the only ones. Pics or it didn't happen. pics? how about a video. this was almost a year ago imagine now.
jiffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffmxfffffffoiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiifvossssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
|
Dust User
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
644
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 16:35:00 -
[135] - Quote
Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:
Pics or it didn't happen.
pics? how about a video. this was almost a year ago imagine now.
Video? Ain't nobody got time for that. |
Kalante Schiffer
xXNatural-DisasterXx
745
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 16:43:00 -
[136] - Quote
Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:
Pics or it didn't happen.
pics? how about a video. this was almost a year ago imagine now. Video? Ain't nobody got time for that. whats the matter cant skip to the end. Just admit you are a dumb ass for calling me out.
jiffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffmxfffffffoiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiifvossssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
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Derrith Erador
Fatal Absolution
2635
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 16:59:00 -
[137] - Quote
Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:i've been thinking of retiring for awhile now, this idea if implemented would change that in a heartbeat.
As it is when you see a someone's name you can already know what they will be running and what you need to run to counter them before the match even starts. With this system in place it will provide variety to the battlefield because every player (excluding viktor and pyrex) will try to be isk efficient.
Not only that but it would help career logis a **** ton and help small corps grind isk for pc viktor is not the only multi billionaire there are a lot more and are far more skilled. How dare you question Sir Hadah's wealth. Be gone peasant. What i have billions too and a couple more in the AE bank. Could have more if i sold 300m codes. Just because some people do not like to show off and remind everyone how rich they are, it doesn't mean that they are the only ones.
Looks like we got a regular Russell Simmons here.
The preacher of Betty White, may her pimp hand guide me.
|
Dust User
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
644
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 18:26:00 -
[138] - Quote
Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:
Pics or it didn't happen.
pics? how about a video. this was almost a year ago imagine now. Video? Ain't nobody got time for that. whats the matter cant skip to the end. Just admit you are a dumb ass for calling me out.
My job is done here. |
Kalante Schiffer
xXNatural-DisasterXx
746
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 18:44:00 -
[139] - Quote
Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:
Pics or it didn't happen.
pics? how about a video. this was almost a year ago imagine now. Video? Ain't nobody got time for that. whats the matter cant skip to the end. Just admit you are a dumb ass for calling me out. My job is done here. lol i love it when people lose and get cornered they act like they did this on purpose just to save face.
jiffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffmxfffffffoiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiifvossssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
|
Dust User
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
644
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 18:49:00 -
[140] - Quote
Kalante Schiffer wrote:Dust User wrote:
My job is done here.
lol i love it when people lose and get cornered they act like they did this on purpose just to save face.
Are you new? |
|
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2142
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 19:21:00 -
[141] - Quote
Gentlemen, please refrain from argumentative behavior in this thread.
Aside from that, ty kindly for the bumps and the entertainment.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Bright Steel
Horizons' Edge
Proficiency V.
99
|
Posted - 2014.09.19 13:40:00 -
[142] - Quote
Bump for dev response
The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
|
Bright Steel
Horizons' Edge
Proficiency V.
99
|
Posted - 2014.09.19 17:34:00 -
[143] - Quote
Will bump until dev response
The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
|
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2143
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 13:22:00 -
[144] - Quote
^what he said
C'mon CCP, at least give us some form of recognition, there is a decent segment of the community that seems to believe it would be a good idea.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Zindorak
1.U.P
927
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 20:56:00 -
[145] - Quote
Yes now Kaalakiota RR's will be 1mil ISK
Pokemon master!
I suck at Tekken lol
|
One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
4266
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 20:58:00 -
[146] - Quote
This could be pretty interesting now that matchmaking is causing more deaths for many pub stompers out there.
You can always tell a Millford Minja
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2144
|
Posted - 2014.09.21 13:42:00 -
[147] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:This could be pretty interesting now that matchmaking is causing more deaths for many pub stompers out there.
There is only one way we'd find out
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2144
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 01:30:00 -
[148] - Quote
Hello, how are you today fine thread??
What is that you say? You're sad that no Blue Tags have been added to you?
Sorry, I don't have one or I'd give it to you.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Bright Steel
Horizons' Edge
Proficiency V.
103
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 14:02:00 -
[149] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Hello, how are you today fine thread??
What is that you say? You're sad that no Blue Tags have been added to you?
Sorry, I don't have one or I'd give it to you.
^ can't we get a blue tag
The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
|
Jarod Garamonde Jr
Sardaukar Merc Guild
General Tso's Alliance
171
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 14:48:00 -
[150] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote: **message truncated, bad idea that OP should feel bad for saying**
This is a pointless and silly idea, and the reason you haven't got a dev response is because it is pointless and silly.
Also:
Posting in a stealth "nerf proto and/or slayer scout" thread.
Silly Infantrymen... CAS Requests are for Forward Observers...
|
|
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2153
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 19:01:00 -
[151] - Quote
Jarod Garamonde Jr wrote:Alaika Arbosa wrote: **message truncated, bad idea that OP should feel bad for saying** This is a pointless and silly idea, and the reason you haven't got a dev response is because it is pointless and silly. Also: Posting in a stealth "nerf proto and/or slayer scout" thread.
Thank you for the bump.
You're entitled to your own opinion no matter how wrong it may be.
I'll take your lack of explanation on how this idea is bad as an admission that you realize your opinion is wrong.
kthxbai!!
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
Maken Tosch
DUST University
Ivy League
9518
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 01:54:00 -
[152] - Quote
Jarod Garamonde Jr wrote:Alaika Arbosa wrote: **message truncated, bad idea that OP should feel bad for saying** This is a pointless and silly idea, and the reason you haven't got a dev response is because it is pointless and silly. Also: Posting in a stealth "nerf proto and/or slayer scout" thread.
I support the idea of a simulated market for Dust on the grounds that Dust will not be getting an ACTUAL secondary market anymore -- that's going for Project Legion instead if you haven't heard -- therefore your argument is invalid.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2154
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 19:28:00 -
[153] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Jarod Garamonde Jr wrote:Alaika Arbosa wrote: **message truncated, bad idea that OP should feel bad for saying** This is a pointless and silly idea, and the reason you haven't got a dev response is because it is pointless and silly. Also: Posting in a stealth "nerf proto and/or slayer scout" thread. I support the idea of a simulated market for Dust on the grounds that Dust will not be getting an ACTUAL secondary market anymore -- that's going for Project Legion instead if you haven't heard -- therefore your argument is invalid.
I like how they said it is a stealth nerf thread. They obviously don't realize how terrible a nerf it would be since prices would constantly shift on a week to week basis.
What is prohibitively expensive one week will be adjusted after a few weeks and buying patterns trend towards something else.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
|
a brackers
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
53
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 22:02:00 -
[154] - Quote
Bump
Proto dropship pilot
The sandbox shooter
|
Pseudogenesis
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
574
|
Posted - 2014.09.25 00:21:00 -
[155] - Quote
This would be hilarious. +1
I still would like a player trading system to be implemented, though. This + player trading = almost functional player market!
Stabby-stabber extraordinaire
I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
|
One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
4379
|
Posted - 2014.09.25 00:26:00 -
[156] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Jarod Garamonde Jr wrote:Alaika Arbosa wrote: **message truncated, bad idea that OP should feel bad for saying** This is a pointless and silly idea, and the reason you haven't got a dev response is because it is pointless and silly. Also: Posting in a stealth "nerf proto and/or slayer scout" thread. I support the idea of a simulated market for Dust on the grounds that Dust will not be getting an ACTUAL secondary market anymore -- that's going for Project Legion instead if you haven't heard -- therefore your argument is invalid.
Seriously though, if this were in any way a nerf to proto and slayer scouts, I would be pointing that out, especially as a scout.
What this would most likely do is increase the price on anything considered FOTM and reward many people who stick to a style even if it is unpopular.
You can always tell a Millford Minja
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2156
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Posted - 2014.09.25 15:31:00 -
[157] - Quote
ahem, now that Delta is out of the way, should we start talking about Echo?
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Maken Tosch
Dust University
Ivy League
9544
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Posted - 2014.09.25 21:54:00 -
[158] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:ahem, now that Delta is out of the way, should we start talking about Echo?
I agree. Now is the time to revive this topic with a proto-level nanite injector. And once again I support this idea.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege
Top Men.
3717
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Posted - 2014.09.25 22:02:00 -
[159] - Quote
I will restate this, and also point out that continually making new threads linking to this is spam.
Soraya Xel wrote:The thing to bear in mind with an idea like this, is that you'd either have some dude at CCP having to set the prices on every item in the game every week (a full-time job), or they'd have to develop an entirely new method for updating the price on items in the backend.
Either way, it's a much larger investment than it may seem.
I love the idea, but my immediate thought on viewing it, is that there are smaller time investment projects than can reap far better rewards for the players than this.
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
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Maken Tosch
Dust University
Ivy League
9544
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Posted - 2014.09.25 22:08:00 -
[160] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:I will restate this, and also point out that continually making new threads linking to this is spam. Soraya Xel wrote:The thing to bear in mind with an idea like this, is that you'd either have some dude at CCP having to set the prices on every item in the game every week (a full-time job), or they'd have to develop an entirely new method for updating the price on items in the backend.
Either way, it's a much larger investment than it may seem.
I love the idea, but my immediate thought on viewing it, is that there are smaller time investment projects than can reap far better rewards for the players than this.
The practical choice would be to develop an automated script that updates the market every week. CCP already has the metrics on which suits, modules, weapons, and equipment are using during a specific period. It might take a while to apply such a script but that's why this topic was brought up a little while ago so that we can get the conversation started. If it doesn't get implemented by Echo, I'm fine with that as long as it's done right. Considering how well done the previous hotfixes are, I'm confident it can be done right this time.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege
Top Men.
3717
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Posted - 2014.09.25 22:22:00 -
[161] - Quote
Every idea does not get a CCP response. Continuing to spam the forums does not change that fact. o_O
Yes, it would require a script. A script that would add more overhead to the downtime process, and probably be bug-prone, and cause significant issues. The cost of developing the script would be high for the return on investment, and it would also enable additional whining as people pitched fits about their fits being expensive, and income not being high enough to compensate.
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
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Z3dog
BIG BAD W0LVES
Canis Eliminatus Operatives
6
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Posted - 2014.09.26 01:57:00 -
[162] - Quote
Bump
Dust 5/14
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2162
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Posted - 2014.09.26 16:34:00 -
[163] - Quote
In lieu of a Blue Tag, could we get some correspondence on the topic via a CPM member?
Your constituency desires answers and Dev input, go poke CCP with a stick until they produce.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege
Top Men.
3758
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Posted - 2014.09.26 16:53:00 -
[164] - Quote
I want to say I recall bringing up the idea, and it was not thought of as practical.
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2163
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Posted - 2014.09.26 17:22:00 -
[165] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:I want to say I recall bringing up the idea, and it was not thought of as practical.
Elaborate please, I am sure there are many of us who would like to know why.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege
Top Men.
3758
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Posted - 2014.09.26 17:29:00 -
[166] - Quote
I explained in an earlier post in the thread why it would be a lot of work. But the reason "I want to say" and not "I did", is I can't find a conversation log that says I brought it up with the devs, because it's a lot of chat to search through. But I think I did, because I recall doing so.
Personally, I think they could accomplish much more useful improvements to the game with a lot less work than this. It's not to say it's a bad idea, but just to say there are better ones, and CCP has to prioritize.
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2163
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Posted - 2014.09.26 17:33:00 -
[167] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:I explained in an earlier post in the thread why it would be a lot of work. But the reason "I want to say" and not "I did", is I can't find a conversation log that says I brought it up with the devs, because it's a lot of chat to search through. But I think I did, because I recall doing so.
Personally, I think they could accomplish much more useful improvements to the game with a lot less work than this. It's not to say it's a bad idea, but just to say there are better ones, and CCP has to prioritize.
What "much more useful improvements to the game" can be done in less than the ~20 minutes I would imagine it would take someone versed in the codebase to write out >50 lines (too many?) of script?
Please, I would love to know, especially seeing as how that would mean that we should be getting all sorts of "useful improvements to the game" soon since they can all be done in less than ~20 minutes.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege
Top Men.
3760
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Posted - 2014.09.26 17:48:00 -
[168] - Quote
The problem is where you believe the sum total of this is >50 lines of code and ~20 minutes of dev time. ;)
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2163
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Posted - 2014.09.26 17:56:00 -
[169] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:The problem is where you believe the sum total of this is >50 lines of code and ~20 minutes of dev time. ;)
It's more than query->math->write?
Really?
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege
Top Men.
3764
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Posted - 2014.09.26 18:54:00 -
[170] - Quote
Yes. Really.
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2163
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Posted - 2014.09.26 19:24:00 -
[171] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:Yes. Really.
Why then was I led to believe otherwise by someone with CCP in their name rather than CPM?
Or are you saying that CCP is too incompetent to write a simple script?
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege
Top Men.
3765
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Posted - 2014.09.26 19:34:00 -
[172] - Quote
Well, for one, there's a somewhat bad track record of weird screw ups during events that require scripts, like reward distribution or SP cap modification being done wrong.
But I mean, there's QA, it adds yet another thing to weekly downtime maintenance, designing the pricing system, ensuring it doesn't price certain things out of usable existence, etc. You also risk people considering it cash-grabby since the AUR prices won't move. (Suddenly, the best way to buy popular fits becomes AUR.) You're also talking about a system that needs to be tied into EVE's market system, which is where our market resides, so it probably has to be run by people in Iceland too.
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2163
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Posted - 2014.09.27 19:04:00 -
[173] - Quote
Back again.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2163
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Posted - 2014.09.28 19:02:00 -
[174] - Quote
Still waiting on a blue tag rather than intangibles from someone with no blue tag.
"Heres the deal, in the 40s there was Normandy today you got punks, some need culling real bad." --Truth
Logi for Hire
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
16882
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Posted - 2014.09.29 00:59:00 -
[175] - Quote
How about once again. I hate to say it and being mean about it. CPM had loved the idea and we shopped it and ultimately the answer despite our support is.
No!
Move on put your creative energy into something else.
This is just another case of awesome idea dead in the water. Similar to placeholders idea for missing suits models.
Trying to rally more support for this idea is only going to end in tragedy. There is no victory here.
CPM 1
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior
\\= Prototype Sniper Rifles =// Unlocked
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Halla Murr
Skullbreakers
3dge of D4rkness.
2
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Posted - 2014.09.29 01:28:00 -
[176] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:How about once again. I hate to say it and being mean about it. CPM had loved the idea and we shopped it and ultimately the answer despite our support is.
No!
Move on put your creative energy into something else.
This is just another case of awesome idea dead in the water. Similar to placeholders idea for missing suits models.
Trying to rally more support for this idea is only going to end in tragedy. There is no victory here.
Is there a particular reason for the No!, or is it just a flat, 'you can't have nice things'?
What I'm driving at is, is there a good, developmental reason for this ides to be denied, or is it simply that CCP does not want to expend the resources on a game they gutted in May? |
Maken Tosch
DUST University
Ivy League
9587
|
Posted - 2014.09.29 02:07:00 -
[177] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:Well, for one, there's a somewhat bad track record of weird screw ups during events that require scripts, like reward distribution or SP cap modification being done wrong.
But I mean, there's QA, it adds yet another thing to weekly downtime maintenance, designing the pricing system, ensuring it doesn't price certain things out of usable existence, etc. You also risk people considering it cash-grabby since the AUR prices won't move. (Suddenly, the best way to buy popular fits becomes AUR.) You're also talking about a system that needs to be tied into EVE's market system, which is where our market resides, so it probably has to be run by people in Iceland too.
Now that you put it that way I think I can see why then it might not be practical. I just realized that CCP is not always known for creating flawless scripts here.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Maken Tosch
DUST University
Ivy League
9587
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Posted - 2014.09.29 02:11:00 -
[178] - Quote
Halla Murr wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:How about once again. I hate to say it and being mean about it. CPM had loved the idea and we shopped it and ultimately the answer despite our support is.
No!
Move on put your creative energy into something else.
This is just another case of awesome idea dead in the water. Similar to placeholders idea for missing suits models.
Trying to rally more support for this idea is only going to end in tragedy. There is no victory here. Is there a particular reason for the No!, or is it just a flat, 'you can't have nice things'? What I'm driving at is, is there a good, developmental reason for this ides to be denied, or is it simply that CCP does not want to expend the resources on a game they gutted in May?
I think we can get an idea on the 'why' with what IWS said about things on the market being error prone and possibly exploitable.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
2194
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Posted - 2014.10.21 11:34:00 -
[179] - Quote
lulz, OP still getting likes....
Gò¡Gê¬Gò«(Gùú_Gùó)Gò¡Gê¬Gò«
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Mahal Daj
Mahal Tactical Enterprises
83
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Posted - 2014.10.21 15:26:00 -
[180] - Quote
Food for thought, what if the ideas above are implemented, but the Eve side ONLY uses the item types: Militia Infantry Weapons, Basic Infantry Weapons, Advanced Infantry Weapons, Complex Infantry Weapons. These would be added to the market by selling into the NCP vendor Eve-Side equation ANY weapon of the class, and purchased back as ANY weapon in the class. This could begin the transition without a mature marketplace (where every single item is bought and sold individually) The weapon caches could even represent nanite-clusters and blueprints, which construct the weapons as a 'package' (to help with the lore).
-daj
I'd love to see the market, but the effects on FW from a very minimal Dust-side effect was huge. I hope CCP has a plan.
See my Post on Crashes: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2413361#post2413361
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