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So, are we gonna see some changes to matchmaking?

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Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 0	Posted - 2014.01.15 01:23:00 - [1] - Quote I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight.
LEHON Xeon Pradox XVI Proficiency V. 73	Posted - 2014.01.15 01:26:00 - [2] - Quote Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. Yeah, I hear ya. At least when I first came around Academy lasted for at least 12,000 WP. You new guys sadly don't have much of a prayer these days unless you let your account just sit for several months with boosters to get enough for at least advanced gear. I don't blame you for thinking of leaving. I probably would if I was in the same situation. Necrophillia: That Uncontrollable Urge To Crack Open A Cold One.
Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 1	Posted - 2014.01.15 01:33:00 - [3] - Quote LEHON Xeon wrote: Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. Yeah, I hear ya. At least when I first came around Academy lasted for at least 12,000 WP. You new guys sadly don't have much of a prayer these days unless you let your account just sit for several months with boosters to get enough for at least advanced gear. I don't blame you for thinking of leaving. I probably would if I was in the same situation. The worst part is to think that this is actually the simplest of the solutions and it seems to evade CCP entirely. Geez, i've been one-shot by practially everything today. If I try to face something, better my aim be completely true or I'm ****. And the worst part is that I can't even rush advanced or something to even counter this, unless I pay. CCP, news flash, you'll get money if you keep new players playing. Who the though it would be good to actually stomp newbies as a good idea? I though EVE Online would have already taught them the ropes. And worst, the longer they ignore this problem, the smaller the community gets. I know their logic behind this: "But then we won't have enough players for everyone to play with, and matches will take longer to begin." Well, bu ***** hu. I'd rather wait 3 minutes and get a cool match then having one every three seconds available and get stomped in 90% of the time. Fix this. Take your heads out of the sand and do what people actually want. Not a hard solution.
Patrick57 Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 3920	Posted - 2014.01.15 01:35:00 - [4] - Quote Been yelling at CCP for this forever. While they're at it, the Academy needs dire fixing too. Raise the WP cap to at least 20,000 WP, preferably 100,000 >_> Winner of at least 9 King ThunderBolt hate videos :D
Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 1	Posted - 2014.01.15 03:13:00 - [5] - Quote How does WP work? The higher you get, the higher your opponents as well? How the hell did they miss this so easily?
LEHON Xeon Pradox XVI Proficiency V. 73	Posted - 2014.01.15 03:21:00 - [6] - Quote Dkafamos wrote: How does WP work? The higher you get, the higher your opponents as well? How the hell did they miss this so easily? WP comes from multiple sources: killing other players, assisting with kills, vehicle kills, vehicle kill assists, team uplink respawns, team resupplies through nanohives, squad intel kills from active scanners, installation destruction, equipment destruction, hacking objectives or installations and assists for those, and triage functions. There's also a couple variations to this such as headshots gain slightly more WP than average kills. Hacking things while in a squad under a capture or in the proximity of a defend order gives slightly more WP, same for killing people. Killing LAVs or dropships gives less WP than tanks or turret installations. Squad leaders if they give a defend or capture order, also get small amounts of WP through "squad leader commendations" which comes from giving "effective" orders to squad members that carried them out. All of those actions add up to a cumulative total you receive at the end of the match. People that get very high WP totals usually multitask. They're very efficient at killing people, often use scanners and deploy uplinks or hack a ton of objectives. Others that get high WP do it through tanking by destroying lots of other tanks or installations. Get a total of 2000 WP in your squad and the leader gets an orbital bombardment strike to use anywhere on the map. Unless you're in a squad and in the vicinity of an order, everyone always redeploys with your uplinks, or you purposefully go out and destroy all turrets in a map or all vehicles, how much WP you receive has no bearing on what other players get. Necrophillia: That Uncontrollable Urge To Crack Open A Cold One.
Thang Bausch Pierrot Le Fou Industries 88	Posted - 2014.01.15 03:33:00 - [7] - Quote From what I can tell, they either disabled match making altogether or at the very least toned it down to uselessness. When they first introduced it, most matches felt relatively well matched, even when there was a very dominant winner. Admittedly, you had to wait 1-5 minutes to get into a match and there were serious bugs (Scotty the AI errors, matches with 8 vs 1), but the matches were mostly fun. Around the same time that scotty errors almost completely disappeared, match search times dropped to 1-30 seconds and they removed the warbarge (which allowed you to look at the player list before the match and leave if the player list was very obviously poorly balanced), matches became as unbalanced as they were before the match making was released. I see things now that a very basic algorithm could fix. I've been in matches were one team is filled with people from different corps and most of the corps no name ones or the auto-generated ones and the other team is made up mostly of 2-4 corp squads from high end corps. I mean, how hard is it to balance the corp squads out between the two teams? I have only sparse coding experience and I could write an algorithm to handle that. It has made me wonder if they intentionally turned match making off.
Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 1	Posted - 2014.01.15 03:37:00 - [8] - Quote Thang Bausch wrote: From what I can tell, they either disabled match making altogether or at the very least toned it down to uselessness. When they first introduced it, most matches felt relatively well matched, even when there was a very dominant winner. Admittedly, you had to wait 1-5 minutes to get into a match and there were serious bugs (Scotty the AI errors, matches with 8 vs 1), but the matches were mostly fun. Around the same time that scotty errors almost completely disappeared, match search times dropped to 1-30 seconds and they removed the warbarge (which allowed you to look at the player list before the match and leave if the player list was very obviously poorly balanced), matches became as unbalanced as they were before the match making was released. I see things now that a very basic algorithm could fix. I've been in matches were one team is filled with people from different corps and most of the corps no name ones or the auto-generated ones and the other team is made up mostly of 2-4 corp squads from high end corps. I mean, how hard is it to balance the corp squads out between the two teams? I have only sparse coding experience and I could write an algorithm to handle that. It has made me wonder if they intentionally turned match making off. I most likely believe so, specially since they need to retain their "paying costumers", which need cannon fodder as well. No wonder the retention is so low.

CCP Saberwing C C P C C P Alliance 925	Posted - 2014.01.15 04:43:00 - [9] - Quote Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. CCP Saberwing // DUST 514 Community Manager // @kanafchian

Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2590	Posted - 2014.01.15 04:48:00 - [10] - Quote On one side of the coin, I feel its messed up. On the other side, I say its a rite of passage. Getting lasered to death on Manus Peak against guys who were in this since the Beta wasn't any fun. I had to completely rethink my strategy and gamestyle. And to tell the truth, the learning never stops. The only viable solution I see is extending Academy or better yet, having a game mode that keeps protos from being in the match. But the truth of the matter is, proto or not...if you don't have the skill, you're going to get stomped regardless. The suit will just change the way they attack you. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]

Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 167	Posted - 2014.01.15 04:51:00 - [11] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Hey Saberwing I am hoping you might check out this post as a Suggestion for matchmaking and give me your feedback on it. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=135928&find=unread oh and read those 2 extra quotes beneath that post as I add more of my 2 cents into that idea.
JL3Eleven 1511	Posted - 2014.01.15 04:59:00 - [12] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Well it would really help if you left the newbies in the Academy for around 100k warpoints (or more) and promote anyone with a 3.0 kdr (after a certain amount of matches played) or above to prevent Academy losers from farming. Before I refuse to take your questions, I have an opening statement. -Regan A nickel ain't worth a dime anymore. -Berra
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 819	Posted - 2014.01.15 05:34:00 - [13] - Quote I know it's hard to do matchmaking when no one is playing the game but consistently stacking organized squads against randoms is just too cruel. Scotty is a fascist. Oh, sht! I just learned you can make a signature! Thanks, CCP! Forums are getting better!
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 819	Posted - 2014.01.15 05:38:00 - [14] - Quote JL3Eleven wrote: [quote=CCP Saberwing]Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Well it would really help if you left the newbies in the Academy for around 100k warpoints (or more) and promote anyone with a 3.0 kdr (after a certain amount of matches played) or above to prevent Academy losers from farming.[/quote How about Scotty stops putting a squad of Ahrendee on the team with a squad of Nyian San against a team of all randoms in Ambush? Here, the difficult problem of fine tuning the delicate balance of matchmaking solved. I am not even asking money for my idea, now it belongs in the public domain. CCP, it's yours for taking. Oh, sht! I just learned you can make a signature! Thanks, CCP! Forums are getting better!
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 824	Posted - 2014.01.15 05:38:00 - [15] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. This was on forums all over about matchmaking and NPE 5 months later... At some point we need to keep these kinds of gamers around... These players largely have an enjoyable time in DUST until this...
Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 5	Posted - 2014.01.15 05:40:00 - [16] - Quote JL3Eleven wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Well it would really help if you left the newbies in the Academy for around 100k warpoints (or more) and promote anyone with a 3.0 kdr (after a certain amount of matches played) or above to prevent Academy losers from farming. Considering the time it takes to grind the SP to reach a million points, I'd say 200.000. That is more then enough time to hook people up, for them to learn the ropes (since in newbiegrounds skill will dictate a lot of your actions, not gear necessarily), and after that you'll try to match him with people on standard and advanced gear, since he'll have the money and the SP to do so. Do NOT allow players outside of the 200,000 WP to battle against the players well after that, and have "tiers" of players based on WP: 0-200.000 - Novices (Militia, Standard mostly) 200,001 - 500.000 - learned the ropes but are no masters (Standard with advanced) 500,001- 1,000,000 - You are mastering one or several paths (Mostly advanced with some prototype) 1,000,001 -FFA I'm kinda sleeping here, maybe I'll come more clearer, but as a Planetside 2 veteran, I though abysmal the way new players are treated in Dust. While in planetside you are only handed a basic gear, that basic gear is strong to kill veteran players (which will have the skills to actually compensate for a not stellar equipment in comparison to you). In EVE, WITH the skill there is also equipment. MAny times I had the jump on the players and I actually pumped them full of lead, only to miss a few shots and end up one shotted in the floor. SEVERAL TIMES! This isn't fun at all. I can't even test gear for real because I have to spare SK and ISKs for fittings (My basic fitting is costing 10k, and while better then the free militia, it still nothing compared to proto wearers mostly because I don't have the SK to fight. I don't even know if Its possible to tackle full proto heavies in medium suits). The lack of tutorials is also something that hits new players very hard, but if the Academy idea went forward, it would alliviate a lot of problems and start to retain more and more people. As the game isn't fully fleshed out, it is simply being too punitive, bordering unfair to new players, and while we like challenges, we don't like a place where we are just an WP pi+¦ata. I might stya because I like EVE universe, but most won't.
Tch Tch Red Shirts Away Team 124	Posted - 2014.01.15 05:59:00 - [17] - Quote Why not allow players below x amount of SP to choose to play in matches with or without squads. Just like being able to choose not to play ambush have an option where can fight ambush without any squads in it. It allows them to learn the basics without having to learn/compete squads. Or at least for these types of matches once teams have been selected from individuals they are then randomly put into squads. So they will learn squad tactics. Removes the ability for squads to squat on ambush waiting for new players to trickle in. Will also stop matches where you have 3 vs 3 and suddenly a 6 man proto stomper squad joins and ruins it for both sides. Turrent - the sound a tankers pants makes when he finds out the four swarm militia doing squats around him aren't AFK.
Repe Susi Rautaleijona Top Men. 922	Posted - 2014.01.15 06:09:00 - [18] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Lallallaa. I don't for the life of me understand how could you not make it so that if there's 2 squads queuing for the battle, YOU PUT THEM ON OPPOSITE SIDES. But nooooooo, let's put them on the same side against npc corps Smeehf.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 825	Posted - 2014.01.15 06:10:00 - [19] - Quote Repe Susi wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Lallallaa. I don't for the life of me understand how could you not make it so that if there's 2 squads queuing for the battle, YOU PUT THEM ON OPPOSITE SIDES. But nooooooo, let's put them on the same side against npc corps For a year.
Shion Typhon Intara Direct Action Caldari State 362	Posted - 2014.01.15 07:47:00 - [20] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. You are massively overthinking this issue and trying to create a perfect Jesus solution while your game goes down the toilet. You can't have complex matchmaking with your tiny playerbase. So instead (if you aren't going to tiercide) then you just need a REALLY REALLY simple solution that moves the situation from utterly broken to simply mildly imbalanced. Ground rules: 1) maximum of 1 squad per side in pub matches 2) (Proto_OR_Adv_OR_SP>10mil) = 1 set of servers, everyone else = another set of servers 3) IF MCC_ARMOUR<70 THEN JOINMATCH = NO Even just doing the above would improve match quality 10-fold. Stop trying to build something perfect, just ACT.

JL3Eleven 1538	Posted - 2014.01.15 07:59:00 - [21] - Quote Ludvig Enraga wrote: JL3Eleven wrote: [quote=CCP Saberwing]Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Well it would really help if you left the newbies in the Academy for around 100k warpoints (or more) and promote anyone with a 3.0 kdr (after a certain amount of matches played) or above to prevent Academy losers from farming.[/quote How about Scotty stops putting a squad of Ahrendee on the team with a squad of Nyian San against a team of all randoms in Ambush? Here, the difficult problem of fine tuning the delicate balance of matchmaking solved. I am not even asking money for my idea, now it belongs in the public domain. CCP, it's yours for taking. I agree and have also noticed that Scotty likes to place full squads together while leaving the other team full of randoms. Before I refuse to take your questions, I have an opening statement. -Regan A nickel ain't worth a dime anymore. -Berra
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4337	Posted - 2014.01.15 08:10:00 - [22] - Quote For public non-FW matches, consider taking a line from HEAPS of other games, and DON'T LOCK TEAMS UNTIL THE MATCH IS READY TO START. Queue up the players, THEN split them right before the battle starts. That way, squads can be evenly spread between the two teams CONSISTENTLY, instead of relying on blind luck and randomness. This will also make queue-syncing less likely to work, because if all the squads in the match are from your team, you'll be evenly split between the two sides.
boba's fetta Dead Man's Game 196	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:15:00 - [23] - Quote yesterday running solo i was fighting the same corp over and over again with the same people on the other side. usally two full stacked squads. and im an average player and i was top of my teams board 95% of the time and we lost match after match being stomped into the dirt.
steve0809 GRIM MARCH D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 5	Posted - 2014.01.15 12:18:00 - [24] - Quote Shion Typhon wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. 3) IF MCC_ARMOUR<70 THEN JOINMATCH = NO Even just doing the above would improve match quality 10-fold. Stop trying to build something perfect, just ACT. I am in South Africa with a not particularly good internet connection so things are pretty slow between games, joining in a split second before you hear " MCC Has been destroyed" is kind of soul destroying, I would much rather wait a bit longer and join a starting game than this current cr@p!! Surely that must be fixable ?
Vrain Matari ZionTCD Public Disorder. 1459	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:27:00 - [25] - Quote Shion Typhon wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. You are massively overthinking this issue and trying to create a perfect Jesus solution while your game goes down the toilet. You can't have complex matchmaking with your tiny playerbase. So instead (if you aren't going to tiercide) then you just need a REALLY REALLY simple solution that moves the situation from utterly broken to simply mildly imbalanced. Ground rules: 1) maximum of 1 (or none) squad per side in pub matches 2) (Proto_OR_Adv_OR_SP>10mil) = 1 set of servers, everyone else = another set of servers (player chooses which type to line up for) 3) IF MCC_ARMOUR<70 THEN JOINMATCH = NO Even just doing the above would improve match quality 10-fold. Stop trying to build something perfect, just ACT. This is excellent game triage, far better a temporary solution that actually retains players. Later, when the blood has stopped geysering we can take the field dressing off and refine the match maker. I support SP rollover.
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 1562	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:30:00 - [26] - Quote JL3Eleven wrote: Ludvig Enraga wrote: JL3Eleven wrote: [quote=CCP Saberwing]Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Well it would really help if you left the newbies in the Academy for around 100k warpoints (or more) and promote anyone with a 3.0 kdr (after a certain amount of matches played) or above to prevent Academy losers from farming.[/quote How about Scotty stops putting a squad of Ahrendee on the team with a squad of Nyian San against a team of all randoms in Ambush? Here, the difficult problem of fine tuning the delicate balance of matchmaking solved. I am not even asking money for my idea, now it belongs in the public domain. CCP, it's yours for taking. I agree and have also noticed that Scotty likes to place full squads together while leaving the other team full of randoms. Just because they aren't from the same corp doesn't mean their not in a squad. I see squad markers all the time. GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride." Hunter S. Thompson
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 1562	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:32:00 - [27] - Quote Vrain Matari wrote: Shion Typhon wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. You are massively overthinking this issue and trying to create a perfect Jesus solution while your game goes down the toilet. You can't have complex matchmaking with your tiny playerbase. So instead (if you aren't going to tiercide) then you just need a REALLY REALLY simple solution that moves the situation from utterly broken to simply mildly imbalanced. Ground rules: 1) maximum of 1 (or none) squad per side in pub matches 2) (Proto_OR_Adv_OR_SP>10mil) = 1 set of servers, everyone else = another set of servers (player chooses which type to line up for) 3) IF MCC_ARMOUR<70 THEN JOINMATCH = NO Even just doing the above would improve match quality 10-fold. Stop trying to build something perfect, just ACT. This is excellent game triage, far better a temporary solution that actually retains players. Later, when the blood has stopped geysering we can take the field dressing off and refine the match maker. The amount of tears Scotty extracts is worth having him on board. These suggestions are junk. GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride." Hunter S. Thompson
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 520	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:34:00 - [28] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. At least, help the new guys by increasing the WP needed to graduate from Academy. The numbers changed fairly quickly in these months. Back when I joined, I think it was around 12k WP. Make it 15k and you'll be keeping some of these new players more.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 712	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:38:00 - [29] - Quote I don't really care if sides aren't balanced in terms of SP or actual player skill. Seems like this is beyond CCPs capabilities at present. What frustrates me most about matchmaking is the ****-poor queuing system that adds new players to games that are <1m away from ending, either by clones or null cannons. It's a huge waste of time and there's nothing better in convincing me to play other games or do something else than queuing into successive games that end before I can even deploy.
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 889	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:40:00 - [30] - Quote I firmly believe the Academy should be optional and also SP based when it comes to graduation. 3-5 Mil SP would be a good range. But with that being said, CCP has made some strides to making new players more welcomed...Take Faction Warfare for instance. Getting to Proto is always hard for new players but with the Loyalty Point(LP) equipment, you can buy Proto gear with Lvl 3 skills. It makes the grind easier because you're not stuck with what you actually have and can stand closer to those vets. Also. If you're looking to actually become a better player much quicker than soloing all the time, https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=135609&find=unread "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus

calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 1618	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:41:00 - [31] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. I had suggested what you should do to handle match making. step 1 - remove pub matches in their current form. step 2 - have the system randomly generate games for players to choose from, the player will look at the open contracts evaluate the pay outs for winning and losing and pick the game they wish to fight in. the higher payout matches should have a lower security rating, this doesn't actually do anything but should help new players understand these fights will have better players. step 3 - as the games fill up have the system generate more games, this handles low player population making sure theirs exactly enough games for the player base to handle. side notes and ideas - 1) players should be able to see exactly what the rewards will be, I.E they will know the payout for fighting in X match will be a 350k bonus for winning, and 1 thale for the top scorer. losing will pay out 150k. 2) joining an in progress match on the losing side will come with bonuses if you win, call it a calvary bonus, you can see the bonus listed maybe it's a balac's gar if you join and the losing team and it results in a win. this puts match making in the hands of the players, and gives you a lot more control in balancing the games. sure pro players could join a match that is only paying out 50k for the win, but he's not going to get much from it, he could just join the match paying out a million. it's not perfect but it's a step in the right direction, and you could take further steps in helping that, applying gear restrictions to security rankings, and other stuff to help push pro players into the upper tiered matches.
iceyburnz Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 1322	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:44:00 - [32] - Quote Public battles at the moment appears to be PVE for the PC guys, they come in a beat up a force vastly inferior to themselves. Sort of like a solo campaign in a shooter. Also the squad stacking issue is really starting to **** me off. How hard is it when a battle starts to stick one squad in one team and another in the other. For some reason dust seems to think its a good idea to stick all the proto players in one team. Which isn't good for anyone. "We spent so much time huddling inside buildings with tanks circling outside like a swarm of sharks around bait"
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 1562	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:47:00 - [33] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: I firmly believe the Academy should be optional and also SP based when it comes to graduation. 3-5 Mil SP would be a good range. But with that being said, CCP has made some strides to making new players more welcomed...Take Faction Warfare for instance. Getting to Proto is always hard for new players but with the Loyalty Point(LP) equipment, you can buy Proto gear with Lvl 3 skills. It makes the grind easier because you're not stuck with what you actually have and can stand closer to those vets. Also. If you're looking to actually become a better player much quicker than soloing all the time, https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=135609&find=unread Bit of a long time to not be able to play the real game. It isn't that bad, it just takes time to understand everything and the to get into a decent corp. We can't hold these peoples hand for a month, at some point in time the need to be able to play the actual game and not just the tutorial. GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride." Hunter S. Thompson
Thumb Green Titans of Phoenix Legacy Rising 675	Posted - 2014.01.15 15:06:00 - [34] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Just turn off Scotty, we had better matchmakiing when there was no matchmaking. CCP: Is it the most asinine way possible to do this? Yes. Then that's how we're doing it.
Guilbert 515 United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 23	Posted - 2014.01.15 15:07:00 - [35] - Quote I would suggest having matches for only Basic suits and matches for adv and proto suits. One can decide which match to join. This way newbies can play against each other and veterans are forced to use lower tier suits if they want to fight along and make some isk. "No reason to buy any of the packs without receiving aurum and boosters alongside, especially since BPOs are taken away"
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 829	Posted - 2014.01.15 16:39:00 - [36] - Quote Guilbert 515 wrote: I would suggest having matches for only Basic suits and matches for adv and proto suits. One can decide which match to join. This way newbies can play against each other and veterans are forced to use lower tier suits if they want to fight along and make some isk. Even new players coming into this game see the benefit of a sandbox matchmaking system. but we got an automated one? that is even worse then chromosomes. RPS: How do you have persistence in a match-based game? CCP Wolfman wrote: Thomas: We have, much like EVE GÇô in fact exactly like EVE! GÇô we have different security levels. We have high security, low security, and nulsec, where anything goes. And thatGÇÖs where weGÇÖre pretty much hands off. When youGÇÖre in highsec we have NPC generated battles, so youGÇÖll always be able to find a battle, youGÇÖre able to grind and get money, but without being exposed to the depth building an infrastructure on the surface of planets, things like that. But then as you play through into the lower levels of security it starts to be about: okay, IGÇÖve got the hang of the game, IGÇÖve got a group of friends, weGÇÖve formed a corporation, and weGÇÖve got backing from some EVE members for the corporation, so weGÇÖre going to hire a war barge, weGÇÖre going to load it up with supplies, and weGÇÖre going to try to attack this location. WeGÇÖre going to get our first foothold on a planet. And that is all scheduled and controlled. Those matches are planned, and the defenders are warned in advance so they have the opportunity to defend. Once you get into that kind of game youGÇÖre making a larger commitment in terms of time to be able to defend your things. And so the more you invest, the more commitment you have to have to protect whatGÇÖs yours. But thereGÇÖs always matches rolling in highsec.
Lason Rift Dark Praetorian Order 4	Posted - 2014.01.15 16:48:00 - [37] - Quote calisk galern wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. I had suggested what you should do to handle match making. step 1 - remove pub matches in their current form. step 2 - have the system randomly generate games for players to choose from, the player will look at the open contracts evaluate the pay outs for winning and losing and pick the game they wish to fight in. the higher payout matches should have a lower security rating, this doesn't actually do anything but should help new players understand these fights will have better players. step 3 - as the games fill up have the system generate more games, this handles low player population making sure theirs exactly enough games for the player base to handle. side notes and ideas - 1) players should be able to see exactly what the rewards will be, I.E they will know the payout for fighting in X match will be a 350k bonus for winning, and 1 thale for the top scorer. losing will pay out 150k.( this can still be modified by the current system that is applied, via war points, i.e a game may pay out 4 million to the team, the guy who scores 0 wp gets none of it. ) 2) joining an in progress match on the losing side will come with bonuses if you win, call it a calvary bonus, you can see the bonus listed maybe it's a balac's gar if you join and the losing team and it results in a win. this puts match making in the hands of the players, and gives you a lot more control in balancing the games. sure pro players could join a match that is only paying out 50k for the win, but he's not going to get much from it, he could just join the match paying out a million. it's not perfect but it's a step in the right direction, and you could take further steps in helping that, applying gear restrictions to security rankings, and other stuff to help push pro players into the upper tiered matches. I really like this idea! I always thought that this was the way it was supposed to be as it fits with us being merc's and all. Your idea also fits in well with EVE's contract system.
Akdhar Saif Intaki Liberation Front Intaki Prosperity Initiative 172	Posted - 2014.01.15 17:19:00 - [38] - Quote boba's fetta wrote: yesterday running solo i was fighting the same corp over and over again with the same people on the other side. usally two full stacked squads. and im an average player and i was top of my teams board 95% of the time and we lost match after match being stomped into the dirt. This has happened to me several times. We need PVE or something just so that when this happens there's something else to do.
Fenix Alexarr BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 36	Posted - 2014.01.15 17:50:00 - [39] - Quote calisk galern wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. I had suggested what you should do to handle match making. step 1 - remove pub matches in their current form. step 2 - have the system randomly generate games for players to choose from, the player will look at the open contracts evaluate the pay outs for winning and losing and pick the game they wish to fight in. the higher payout matches should have a lower security rating, this doesn't actually do anything but should help new players understand these fights will have better players. step 3 - as the games fill up have the system generate more games, this handles low player population making sure theirs exactly enough games for the player base to handle. side notes and ideas - 1) players should be able to see exactly what the rewards will be, I.E they will know the payout for fighting in X match will be a 350k bonus for winning, and 1 thale for the top scorer. losing will pay out 150k.( this can still be modified by the current system that is applied, via war points, i.e a game may pay out 4 million to the team, the guy who scores 0 wp gets none of it. ) 2) joining an in progress match on the losing side will come with bonuses if you win, call it a calvary bonus, you can see the bonus listed maybe it's a balac's gar if you join and the losing team and it results in a win. this puts match making in the hands of the players, and gives you a lot more control in balancing the games. sure pro players could join a match that is only paying out 50k for the win, but he's not going to get much from it, he could just join the match paying out a million. it's not perfect but it's a step in the right direction, and you could take further steps in helping that, applying gear restrictions to security rankings, and other stuff to help push pro players into the upper tiered matches. This is exactly what we need. All the talk about choice in Dust goes out the window when the match making matches are completely one-sided with prototstompers. I would suggest that you are only given a choice as to what battle you would be fighting in. The sides should be automatically chosen. This would require the "matchmaking" per match system to not suck, but there have been numerous suggestions about how to make things better in that regard.
PAROX YSM 0	Posted - 2014.01.15 17:50:00 - [40] - Quote One night I started a new match, and I wasn't late to the party. As I landed on the ground below my MCC I was immediately torn to shreds by a tank. At no point during the match was any of my teammates able to leave our deployment area. The opposing team somehow managed to field tanks before we even got out of the MCC at the beginning of the match. It was a small domination map. By the end of the match, half the team was just hanging out in the MCC waiting for the match to end. I'm sure this was great fun for the tank operators, but how is this kind of game play going to encourage new players to come back. I've only been playing for about 2 months, so I'm used to being shredded. I just put on some free suits and jumped into the meat grinder over and over, but I can see where a brand new player trying the game for the first time, might say screw this and leave for good. Treat Everyone You Meet With Dignity And Respect But Always Have A Plan To Kill Them

CrotchGrab 360 The Men In The Mirror 1373	Posted - 2014.01.15 17:57:00 - [41] - Quote you know i feel the same way but it's crazy what you can do with a militia suit. a guy was giving me hassle but i eventually got him in a gallente proto suit. in my militia gallente suit. then i destroyed an ak.0 and a ck0, all in the same life! 3 proto suits,1 militia suit! it's not always the gear but the player, that being said suits and HP and damage do provide an advantage but you never know what you're capable of until you try.
Leonid Tybalt Dark Knightz Corp. 141	Posted - 2014.01.15 18:53:00 - [42] - Quote Ludvig Enraga wrote: I know it's hard to do matchmaking when no one is playing the game but consistently stacking organized squads against randoms is just too cruel. Scotty is a true a fascist. Organize into squads yourself then. That goes for all of you crybabies who ***** about getting dominated by people who play in squads. If you join a public match but refuse to use the squad finder or "lfs" then getting stomped by a squad or two squads of organized players is well deserved. There's a reason why there are so many warpoint bonuses for activities that help other members of your team (healing, repairing, using scanners, dropping uplinks etc.) it's because you're SUPPOSED to play AS A TEAM and not run solo. So stop bitching about getting owned by players who play the way the game is meant to be played because they aren't doing anything wrong, YOU ARE!
Kigurosaka Laaksonen DUST University Ivy League 119	Posted - 2014.01.15 19:10:00 - [43] - Quote The biggest problem with matchmaking isn't be being terrible and matched with good players. The problem is that twice yesterday, and already three times today I've been in matches of 2v7, 2v8, one was even 0v6. This should NEVER happen.
PAROX YSM 0	Posted - 2014.01.15 19:30:00 - [44] - Quote Quote: Organize into squads yourself then. That goes for all of you crybabies who ***** about getting dominated by people who play in squads. If you join a public match but refuse to use the squad finder or "lfs" then getting stomped by a squad or two squads of organized players is well deserved. There's a reason why there are so many warpoint bonuses for activities that help other members of your team (healing, repairing, using scanners, dropping uplinks etc.) it's because you're SUPPOSED to play AS A TEAM and not run solo. So stop bitching about getting owned by players who play the way the game is meant to be played because they aren't doing anything wrong, YOU ARE! I agree, the game is meant to be played in squads, working together to accomplish a goal. Win or lose, it's much more enjoyable when playing with competent people. But, don't you think your comments above are a bit harsh. We're talking about new players, unfamiliar with all the workings of the game. They're trying. They want to play. It's hard enough for them to learn the game, while getting crushed every few seconds. And if veteran players are going to treat them with such disdain, where's the incentive to stay and play. New players are the life blood of this game. Without new players, this game dies and the only thing you'll be left to play with is yourself. Instead of treating the new players so poorly, how about taking them under your wing and showing them the ropes. Maybe, just maybe, this will help improve the game play for all of us. Now back to the point of this thread ... imbalances in matchmaking. Treat Everyone You Meet With Dignity And Respect But Always Have A Plan To Kill Them
Soraya Xel The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1109	Posted - 2014.01.15 19:34:00 - [45] - Quote Repe Susi wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Lallallaa. I don't for the life of me understand how could you not make it so that if there's 2 squads queuing for the battle, YOU PUT THEM ON OPPOSITE SIDES. But nooooooo, let's put them on the same side against npc corps This nails the primary pain point. We understand it's hard to pick 32 equivalent players for a match. Just try and balance the good and bad players across the two teams, for heck's sake. I'd like to be your CPM1 candidate
Orin the Freak The Solecism of Limitation 682	Posted - 2014.01.15 19:48:00 - [46] - Quote Okay. So say CCP adds in a militia or militia/standard only mode. (basically, gear-restricted game mode). So now, we have 5 different modes to chose from. Skirmish, Domination, Ambush, Gear-Restricted, and FW. All of which people can play at any time. PC is private, and only for a handfull of corps/ringers. So now, instead of waiting 10 or so seconds for a skirmish/dom game, and 2 to 5 minutes for a FW game, you will be waiting probably at least a minute to get into any game mode, and possibly never find a FW game. the issue at hand currently, IMO, is the player base just isn't hearty enough to support all these new game modes. I find it frustrating that unless you play gallente FW, you can't find a FW game without waiting 10 minutes. So either we just put up with the stupidity we have now, of near-constant one-sided battles, (with a good match peppered in here and there) Or, they fix matchmaking, or add in a militia-only mode, and then we have long wait times before matches. I say they just release PvE. Open this game up. when PvE comes out, PvP will become a sporadic thing, like it is in EVE. I'd personally just prefer there to be PvE games, and then just let players join in on those games (like in EVE) at a whim. Eventually resulting in a 16v16 match. Or something along those lines. Just open the game up, instead of it being more or less a lobby shooter, with a market place. Let us chose the planet/district we want to go to, and then just let us go. Unless said district is full. THEN introduce matchmaking, where you get put into a random battle. shrug just a big-scope idea.
HAICD Dogs of War Gaming Zero-Day 76	Posted - 2014.01.15 20:17:00 - [47] - Quote People may not like this idea but make the squad limit 4 players. 4 proto running together is better than 6. DOWG
Soraya Xel The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1109	Posted - 2014.01.15 20:22:00 - [48] - Quote Orin the Freak wrote: Or something along those lines. Just open the game up, instead of it being more or less a lobby shooter, with a market place. Let us chose the planet/district we want to go to, and then just let us go. Unless said district is full. I almost wish you could experience that in DUST for a day, so you'd realize how terrible it would be. I'd like to be your CPM1 candidate
Maximus Stryker Who Are Those Guys 779	Posted - 2014.01.15 20:29:00 - [49] - Quote If you have under X amount of total SP, you gain SP at a 5x rate If you have under Y amount of total SP. you gain SP at a 3x rate If you have under Z amount of total SP, you gain SP at a 2x rate No cap on SP until above Z amount. Example If you have under 5,000,000 total SP, you gain SP at a 5x rate If you have under 10,000,000 total SP. you gain SP at a 3x rate If you have under 15,000,000 total SP, you gain SP at a 2x rate No cap on SP until a players SP is above 15,000,000. *Faction Channels for FW Staging* PIE Ground Control \| Caldari Hierarchy \| Turalyon \| Chosen Matari
Kaze Eyrou SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 426	Posted - 2014.01.15 20:35:00 - [50] - Quote Patrick57 wrote: Been yelling at CCP for this forever. While they're at it, the Academy needs dire fixing too. Raise the WP cap to at least 20,000 WP, preferably 100,000 >_> No. What they need to do is if you successfully hack an objective, you graduate the academy. You know how many blueberries I've seen recently that STAND AROUND AN OBJECTIVE SHOOTING IN THE AIR NEAR OBJECTIVE A? // Support Logi / Logi Bro // Forge Gunner // @KazeEyrou

Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 14	Posted - 2014.01.15 20:49:00 - [51] - Quote Kaze Eyrou wrote: Patrick57 wrote: Been yelling at CCP for this forever. While they're at it, the Academy needs dire fixing too. Raise the WP cap to at least 20,000 WP, preferably 100,000 >_> No. What they need to do is if you successfully hack an objective, you graduate the academy. You know how many blueberries I've seen recently that STAND AROUND AN OBJECTIVE SHOOTING IN THE AIR NEAR OBJECTIVE A? This is due to a lack of basic tutorial. Even pop ups would do much better then now. Since Im previously an EVE Player, I know my way around. Most people don't, and having one since newbie match does tend to make things stupid for new players.
Leonid Tybalt Dark Knightz Corp. 141	Posted - 2014.01.15 20:53:00 - [52] - Quote PAROX YSM wrote: Quote: Organize into squads yourself then. That goes for all of you crybabies who *** about getting dominated by people who play in squads. If you join a public match but refuse to use the squad finder or "lfs" then getting stomped by a squad or two squads of organized players is well deserved. There's a reason why there are so many warpoint bonuses for activities that help other members of your team (healing, repairing, using scanners, dropping uplinks etc.) it's because you're SUPPOSED to play AS A TEAM and not run solo. So stop bitching about getting owned by players who play the way the game is meant to be played because they aren't doing anything wrong, YOU ARE! I agree, the game is meant to be played in squads, working together to accomplish a goal. Win or lose, it's much more enjoyable when playing with competent people. But, don't you think your comments above are a bit harsh. We're talking about new players, unfamiliar with all the workings of the game. They're trying. They want to play. It's hard enough for them to learn the game, while getting crushed every few seconds. And if veteran players are going to treat them with such disdain, where's the incentive to stay and play. New players are the life blood of this game. Without new players, this game dies and the only thing you'll be left to play with is yourself. Instead of treating the new players so poorly, how about taking them under your wing and showing them the ropes. Maybe, just maybe, this will help improve the game play for all of us. Now back to the point of this thread ... imbalances in matchmaking. Sorry but no, just no. There will always be new players if a game gets enough exposure. So theres no reason to babying people. I don't care for players who reacts like they do in this thread when they lose due to their own mistakes and against better players. If you're gonna go "baaaw! This is so hard. Im gonna leave unless you make it easier" then I say: Leave, I sure as hell won't miss you. Way too many mmo's and shooters baby with the players and I hate that. I want dust players who think: "okay, ** this game is hard! How do I get better like the more experienced players?" Im not gonna shed any tears for seeing the crybabies leave. It's not the kind of players I want to play with or against anyway...
BAD FURRY Oh No You Didn't 281	Posted - 2014.01.15 20:57:00 - [53] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. just asking cant we just have pub games with squads and pub games with out ? Yes i am a Undead Hell Wolf ... nice to meat you!
Maximus Stryker Who Are Those Guys 779	Posted - 2014.01.15 20:59:00 - [54] - Quote Leonid Tybalt wrote: PAROX YSM wrote: Quote: Organize into squads yourself then. That goes for all of you crybabies who *** about getting dominated by people who play in squads. If you join a public match but refuse to use the squad finder or "lfs" then getting stomped by a squad or two squads of organized players is well deserved. There's a reason why there are so many warpoint bonuses for activities that help other members of your team (healing, repairing, using scanners, dropping uplinks etc.) it's because you're SUPPOSED to play AS A TEAM and not run solo. So stop bitching about getting owned by players who play the way the game is meant to be played because they aren't doing anything wrong, YOU ARE! I agree, the game is meant to be played in squads, working together to accomplish a goal. Win or lose, it's much more enjoyable when playing with competent people. But, don't you think your comments above are a bit harsh. We're talking about new players, unfamiliar with all the workings of the game. They're trying. They want to play. It's hard enough for them to learn the game, while getting crushed every few seconds. And if veteran players are going to treat them with such disdain, where's the incentive to stay and play. New players are the life blood of this game. Without new players, this game dies and the only thing you'll be left to play with is yourself. Instead of treating the new players so poorly, how about taking them under your wing and showing them the ropes. Maybe, just maybe, this will help improve the game play for all of us. Now back to the point of this thread ... imbalances in matchmaking. Sorry but no, just no. There will always be new players if a game gets enough exposure. So theres no reason to babying people. I don't care for players who reacts like they do in this thread when they lose due to their own mistakes and against better players. If you're gonna go "baaaw! This is so hard. Im gonna leave unless you make it easier" then I say: Leave, I sure as hell won't miss you. Way too many mmo's and shooters baby with the players and I hate that. I want dust players who think: "okay, this game is hard! How do I get better like the more experienced players?" Im not gonna shed any tears for seeing the crybabies leave. It's not the kind of players I want to play with or against anyway... I agree in that I like the game being difficult and not easymode COD. However, something does need to be done to keep new players around. In EVE, new players are not FORCED to fight against 10 year EVE vets...there are many many different things to do in EVE for all skill & experience levels. In Dust, there are not as many options. The more players Dust has, the better the experience will be for everyone. Faction Channels for FW Staging** PIE Ground Control \| Caldari Hierarchy \| Turalyon \| Chosen Matari
Maximus Stryker Who Are Those Guys 779	Posted - 2014.01.15 21:00:00 - [55] - Quote BAD FURRY wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. just asking cant we just have pub games with squads and pub games with out ? Like in COD, you can join matchmaking that is only for solo joiners or you can join a matchmaking with solo joiners & squads... *Faction Channels for FW Staging* PIE Ground Control \| Caldari Hierarchy \| Turalyon \| Chosen Matari
Leonid Tybalt Dark Knightz Corp. 141	Posted - 2014.01.15 21:48:00 - [56] - Quote Maximus Stryker wrote: Leonid Tybalt wrote: PAROX YSM wrote: Quote: Organize into squads yourself then. That goes for all of you crybabies who *** about getting dominated by people who play in squads. If you join a public match but refuse to use the squad finder or "lfs" then getting stomped by a squad or two squads of organized players is well deserved. There's a reason why there are so many warpoint bonuses for activities that help other members of your team (healing, repairing, using scanners, dropping uplinks etc.) it's because you're SUPPOSED to play AS A TEAM and not run solo. So stop bitching about getting owned by players who play the way the game is meant to be played because they aren't doing anything wrong, YOU ARE! I agree, the game is meant to be played in squads, working together to accomplish a goal. Win or lose, it's much more enjoyable when playing with competent people. But, don't you think your comments above are a bit harsh. We're talking about new players, unfamiliar with all the workings of the game. They're trying. They want to play. It's hard enough for them to learn the game, while getting crushed every few seconds. And if veteran players are going to treat them with such disdain, where's the incentive to stay and play. New players are the life blood of this game. Without new players, this game dies and the only thing you'll be left to play with is yourself. Instead of treating the new players so poorly, how about taking them under your wing and showing them the ropes. Maybe, just maybe, this will help improve the game play for all of us. Now back to the point of this thread ... imbalances in matchmaking. Sorry but no, just no. There will always be new players if a game gets enough exposure. So theres no reason to babying people. I don't care for players who reacts like they do in this thread when they lose due to their own mistakes and against better players. If you're gonna go "baaaw! This is so hard. Im gonna leave unless you make it easier" then I say: Leave, I sure as hell won't miss you. Way too many mmo's and shooters baby with the players and I hate that. I want dust players who think: "okay, ** this game is hard! How do I get better like the more experienced players?" Im not gonna shed any tears for seeing the crybabies leave. It's not the kind of players I want to play with or against anyway... I agree in that I like the game being difficult and not easymode COD. However, something does need to be done to keep new players around. In EVE, new players are not FORCED to fight against 10 year EVE vets...there are many many different things to do in EVE for all skill & experience levels. In Dust, there are not as many options. The more players Dust has, the better the experience will be for everyone. The thing is that new players in eve pretty much has to stay away from PvP entierly because if you venture to any PvP area there's always a possibility of running into not only more experienced players but also running into experienced players in groups ganging up on you. The only other activtirs you can do in eve without risking that as much is PvE, but let's face it carebear PvE is boring as hell in the long run. And the only way to make it equal to eve would be to bring in PvE elements in dust as well (which seem to be in the plans in regards to the "rogue drone hunting" occuring in the intro video). But I don't want to see any "player level apartheid" in the PvP elements of dust at all. There's gotta be a risk of running into more experienced players in squads. It makes the game more exciting and forces people to get better. If everyone could just "choose" which people they have to go up against then the game will get really lame really fast. And as I said before: there's always gonna be new players. New players come and go to every game. The hardcore atmosphere will appeal to enough people to make the game survive (while alienating others). So there's no reason to worry. Ccp shouldn't focus any efforts at all in trying to keep whiny noobs around. It would be a waste of resources and it would prevent them from adding new content that rewards players who show commitment.
Leonid Tybalt Dark Knightz Corp. 141	Posted - 2014.01.15 21:52:00 - [57] - Quote Maximus Stryker wrote: BAD FURRY wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. just asking cant we just have pub games with squads and pub games with out ? Like in COD, you can join matchmaking that is only for solo joiners or you can join a matchmaking with solo joiners & squads... But what's going to prevent glitch-abusing and proto stomping scrub hunters like Nyain San to qsynch into matches with only solo joiners and play like a squad anyway?
Nothing Certain Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 20	Posted - 2014.01.15 22:48:00 - [58] - Quote [quote=PAROX YSM]One night I started a new match, and I wasn't late to the party. As I landed on the ground below my MCC I was immediately torn to shreds by a tank. At no point during the match was any of my teammates able to leave our deployment area. The opposing team somehow managed to field tanks before we even got out of the MCC at the beginning of the match. It was a small domination map. By the end of the match, half the team was just hanging out in the MCC waiting for the match to end. I'm sure this was great fun for the tank operators, but how is this kind of game play going to encourage new players to come back. I've only been playing for about 2 months, so I'm used to being shredded. I just put on some free suits and jumped into the meat grinder over and over, but I can see where a brand new player trying the game for the first time, might say screw this and leave for good.[/quote Insert Molon Labe comment suggesting they get gud.
Jungian Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 291	Posted - 2014.01.15 22:59:00 - [59] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Wow, look! They are aware! Cant wait until their next step of awareness. Good luck. http://www.twitch.tv/rnd_jungian/ In New Eden no one can hear you whine.
Vrain Matari ZionTCD Public Disorder. 1460	Posted - 2014.01.15 23:08:00 - [60] - Quote CrotchGrab 360 wrote: you know i feel the same way but it's crazy what you can do with a militia suit. a guy was giving me hassle but i eventually got him in a gallente proto suit. in my militia gallente suit. then i destroyed an ak.0 and a ck0, all in the same life! 3 proto suits,1 militia suit! it's not always the gear but the player, that being said suits and HP and damage do provide an advantage but you never know what you're capable of until you try. This is very true, it comes down to the player, who they're fighting beside and who they're fighting against. Thinking about this over the past several months i've come to the conclusion that the stat that really measures how a player will do in a match is his historical end-of-match leaderboard ranking. If you think about how you yourself asses the coming fight based on the roster in the warbarge before a match, you'll see this is exactly how we assess our odds for the impending battle. These rankings would be calculated based on all your teammates' and your enemies' historical leaderboard rankings. The strength of a match making system based on this stat is that it is an empirical black-box system and does not depend on your, mine or anybody else's bullshit theories. Another advantage of the system is that its robust and finds its values(converges) quickly, and would prolly work reasonably well even with low player numbers. I support SP rollover.

Agrios Endendros Single Serving Friends 109	Posted - 2014.01.15 23:10:00 - [61] - Quote I definitely think that the Academy should last until a minimum of 25,000 WP. Additionally, after the original Academy, there should be another "Academy" mode listed with the PUB matches. Only players with less than 100k WPs(or 150k or something) would be allowed tho join these matches. This would give new players options to compete with those who have played approximately as long as they have without restricting their gear. The isk payout for these matches could be slightly reduced, as an incentive to run more inexpensive gear and to encourage play in regular PUB matches. The new players would still be able to participate in all the normal game modes, too, in case the want to run with their corp or just compete for better rewards. As far as matchmaking is concerned, until they work it out exactly, I think Scotty should just: 1. Put the same number of players in squads on each team. 2. Fill rest of team with appropriate singles to balance total SP on each team. Example: Squad A (6 Players<80mil total SP), Squad B (3<40mil SP), Squad C (4<50mil SP), Squad D (2<15mil SP), Players(P)<2mil Sp (4), P<4mil (3), P<8mil (3), P<12mil (3), P<16mil (2), P<20mil (1), P>20mil (1) The above all join a match. Scotty: Team 1:................................Team 2: Squad A (6).........................Squad B (3) Squad D (2).........................Squad C (4) P<20mil (1)..........................P>20mil (1) P<16mil (1)..........................P<16mil (1) P<12mil (1)..........................P<12mil (2) P<8mil (1)............................P<8mil (2) P<4mil (2)............................P<4mil (1) P<2mil (2)............................P<2mil (2) Total<163mil.......................Total<162mil This is far from perfect, but combined with the academy suggestion above, I think it would be a good quick fix until they work things out. I see FAR too many matches consisting of 2 or 3 stacked corp squads on one side and zero squads or even "named" corps on the other. They are going to have a bad time. Additionally, I waste more time getting stuck into 3/4 finished matches that players have bailed from because of imbalance, than I would wait if Scotty just took more time to get them right in the first place. I'm not entirely sure that giving a permanent "militia only", "standard only", or "advanced only" mode would be good for the game and would detract from the relative realism of the experience. I want a game that makes me think and isn't easy. Trying your hardest to overcome seemingly insurmountable odds is the best teacher on the battlefield, and nothing beats the rush when you actually do. Agrios Endendros Heavy Haruko Endendros AV Logi ~ Canti Endendros Pilot ~ Zero Endendros Support Logi
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 834	Posted - 2014.01.15 23:54:00 - [62] - Quote Make a militia only mode. Make militia items no longer register player skills. This will create an militia game mode that will work for new players for the time and a new mode for veteran players to enjoy with having no special advantage. The Battle Academy needs a ground up rework. From taking a new player by the hand and teaching them basic lessons like aiming in DUST, to advanced lessons where they teach how scanning works(dB etc..) Either that or we have to start working on the real EVE connection and make pub's just some meaningless ISK grind that has little focus on. Where as now its all everyone plays and is the source of a majority of the conversations.
Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 16	Posted - 2014.01.16 00:12:00 - [63] - Quote The main problem isn't the gear itself, but how the system decides to pit players with no skills whatsoever against players with a lot of Skill points. There is no need to make militia only matches. What needs to be done is this academy (which should also bring a hefty tutorial, explaining the systems in the game), and limit players win WPs. Higher SK should be fighting their likes, not curb stomping low SK players. We don't need to reimagine the wheel, just add these two things, and everything will go along more smoothly, with population increase. Warn the newbies that EVE is much more complex then just shooting, let them get shot a few times if they don't pay attention to fittings and stuff, and you'll see a better game.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 834	Posted - 2014.01.16 00:17:00 - [64] - Quote Dkafamos wrote: The main problem isn't the gear itself, but how the system decides to pit players with no skills whatsoever against players with a lot of Skill points. There is no need to make militia only matches. What needs to be done is this academy (which should also bring a hefty tutorial, explaining the systems in the game), and limit players win WPs. Higher SK should be fighting their likes, not curb stomping low SK players. We don't need to reimagine the wheel, just add these two things, and everything will go along more smoothly, with population increase. Warn the newbies that EVE is much more complex then just shooting, let them get shot a few times if they don't pay attention to fittings and stuff, and you'll see a better game. Matchmaking and new player experience has been something worked on for a year by CCP(I know its hard to see where) If they where just "two small things" they would of been half fixed. Making that mode just makes a viable option for new and couple month old players or even a solo player to play or relax after a stomping in the squad based game modes. Having militia items no longer registering player skills will also influence players that go into more competitive game modes to actually invest into their gear and equipment to have their skills influence it. Skill points are really pointless in a militia only game mode where Militia stuff no longer registers player skills. is it perfect? no but its an easy fix to tie the game over to 2.0 and the new expansion of DUST. allowing some player retention and a new game mode.
CYRAX SERVIUS Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 511	Posted - 2014.01.16 00:27:00 - [65] - Quote Guilbert 515 wrote: I would suggest having matches for only Basic suits and matches for adv and proto suits. One can decide which match to join. This way newbies can play against each other and veterans are forced to use lower tier suits if they want to fight along and make some isk. This, as a lot of us don't run proto in pub much and training new players is a ***** with all the "I earned it i'll run it" mentality in the game. Some times it's cool to go run starter fits and try new stuff without dealing with all the tryhards. CEO Invictus Maneo~ "I remain unvanquished"
CYRAX SERVIUS Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 511	Posted - 2014.01.16 00:34:00 - [66] - Quote Leonid Tybalt wrote: Ludvig Enraga wrote: I know it's hard to do matchmaking when no one is playing the game but consistently stacking organized squads against randoms is just too cruel. Scotty is a true a fascist. Organize into squads yourself then. That goes for all of you crybabies who ***** about getting dominated by people who play in squads. If you join a public match but refuse to use the squad finder or "lfs" then getting stomped by a squad or two squads of organized players is well deserved. There's a reason why there are so many warpoint bonuses for activities that help other members of your team (healing, repairing, using scanners, dropping uplinks etc.) it's because you're SUPPOSED to play AS A TEAM and not run solo. So stop bitching about getting owned by players who play the way the game is meant to be played because they aren't doing anything wrong, YOU ARE! I would like to see you and your squad run standard to adv gear and run against two squads from AE and Nyain San in their PC fits for a day, then get back to me with that. Think before you speak, the game has issues... CEO Invictus Maneo~ "I remain unvanquished"
CYRAX SERVIUS Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 511	Posted - 2014.01.16 00:37:00 - [67] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Repe Susi wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Lallallaa. I don't for the life of me understand how could you not make it so that if there's 2 squads queuing for the battle, YOU PUT THEM ON OPPOSITE SIDES. But nooooooo, let's put them on the same side against npc corps This nails the primary pain point. We understand it's hard to pick 32 equivalent players for a match. Just try and balance the good and bad players across the two teams, for heck's sake. Split up the same protostomp squads we see every day Proposterous!! CEO Invictus Maneo~ "I remain unvanquished"
CYRAX SERVIUS Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 511	Posted - 2014.01.16 00:49:00 - [68] - Quote Leonid Tybalt wrote: Maximus Stryker wrote: Leonid Tybalt wrote: PAROX YSM wrote: Quote: Organize into squads yourself then. That goes for all of you crybabies who *** about getting dominated by people who play in squads. If you join a public match but refuse to use the squad finder or "lfs" then getting stomped by a squad or two squads of organized players is well deserved. There's a reason why there are so many warpoint bonuses for activities that help other members of your team (healing, repairing, using scanners, dropping uplinks etc.) it's because you're SUPPOSED to play AS A TEAM and not run solo. So stop bitching about getting owned by players who play the way the game is meant to be played because they aren't doing anything wrong, YOU ARE! I agree, the game is meant to be played in squads, working together to accomplish a goal. Win or lose, it's much more enjoyable when playing with competent people. But, don't you think your comments above are a bit harsh. We're talking about new players, unfamiliar with all the workings of the game. They're trying. They want to play. It's hard enough for them to learn the game, while getting crushed every few seconds. And if veteran players are going to treat them with such disdain, where's the incentive to stay and play. New players are the life blood of this game. Without new players, this game dies and the only thing you'll be left to play with is yourself. Instead of treating the new players so poorly, how about taking them under your wing and showing them the ropes. Maybe, just maybe, this will help improve the game play for all of us. Now back to the point of this thread ... imbalances in matchmaking. Sorry but no, just no. There will always be new players if a game gets enough exposure. So theres no reason to babying people. I don't care for players who reacts like they do in this thread when they lose due to their own mistakes and against better players. If you're gonna go "baaaw! This is so hard. Im gonna leave unless you make it easier" then I say: Leave, I sure as hell won't miss you. Way too many mmo's and shooters baby with the players and I hate that. I want dust players who think: "okay, ** this game is hard! How do I get better like the more experienced players?" Im not gonna shed any tears for seeing the crybabies leave. It's not the kind of players I want to play with or against anyway... I agree in that I like the game being difficult and not easymode COD. However, something does need to be done to keep new players around. In EVE, new players are not FORCED to fight against 10 year EVE vets...there are many many different things to do in EVE for all skill & experience levels. In Dust, there are not as many options. The more players Dust has, the better the experience will be for everyone. The thing is that new players in eve pretty much has to stay away from PvP entierly because if you venture to any PvP area there's always a possibility of running into not only more experienced players but also running into experienced players in groups ganging up on you. The only other activtirs you can do in eve without risking that as much is PvE, but let's face it carebear PvE is boring as hell in the long run. And the only way to make it equal to eve would be to bring in PvE elements in dust as well (which seem to be in the plans in regards to the "rogue drone hunting" occuring in the intro video). But I don't want to see any "player level apartheid" in the PvP elements of dust at all. There's gotta be a risk of running into more experienced players in squads. It makes the game more exciting and forces people to get better. If everyone could just "choose" which people they have to go up against then the game will get really lame really fast. And as I said before: there's always gonna be new players. New players come and go to every game. The hardcore atmosphere will appeal to enough people to make the game survive (while alienating others). So there's no reason to worry. Ccp shouldn't focus any efforts at all in trying to keep whiny noobs around. It would be a waste of resources and it would prevent them from adding new content that rewards players who show commitment. You and your outlook are the exact example of what is wrong in this game. You want to run stompsquads go ahead against other stompsquads. Let the new players play against each other and bridge the gap when ready. Remember, without new players a lot of peoples K/D will go down the dumper, don't want that. CEO Invictus Maneo~ "I remain unvanquished"
CYRAX SERVIUS Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 511	Posted - 2014.01.16 00:54:00 - [69] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Make a militia only mode. Make militia items no longer register player skills. This will create an militia game mode that will work for new players for the time and a new mode for veteran players to enjoy with having no special advantage. The Battle Academy needs a ground up rework. From taking a new player by the hand and teaching them basic lessons like aiming in DUST, to advanced lessons where they teach how scanning works(dB etc..) Either that or we have to start working on the real EVE connection and make pub's just some meaningless ISK grind that has little focus on. Where as now its all everyone plays and is the source of a majority of the conversations. Best answer so far, well said. CEO Invictus Maneo~ "I remain unvanquished"
Henchmen21 Planet Express LLC 427	Posted - 2014.01.16 00:57:00 - [70] - Quote Leonid Tybalt wrote: Ludvig Enraga wrote: I know it's hard to do matchmaking when no one is playing the game but consistently stacking organized squads against randoms is just too cruel. Scotty is a true a fascist. Organize into squads yourself then. That goes for all of you crybabies who ***** about getting dominated by people who play in squads. If you join a public match but refuse to use the squad finder or "lfs" then getting stomped by a squad or two squads of organized players is well deserved. There's a reason why there are so many warpoint bonuses for activities that help other members of your team (healing, repairing, using scanners, dropping uplinks etc.) it's because you're SUPPOSED to play AS A TEAM and not run solo. So stop bitching about getting owned by players who play the way the game is meant to be played because they aren't doing anything wrong, YOU ARE! A squad of s players with a combined SP of 25 million SP will still get steam rolled by a squad of six totaling 100 million SP. Henchmen21: Infantry Gotyougood Ufkr: Vehicles

deezy dabest Warpoint Sharx 145	Posted - 2014.01.16 03:53:00 - [71] - Quote Everyone that has stuck around the game has been yelling about this since they left the academy. I recently made a new character which I have not done since about a month after first playing the game. What I heard and saw was painful to say the least. First of all there is definitely some small level of matchmaking but its very weak, the players I saw match after match were consistent on that character and did not include the people that I see match after match on my main. With that being said it is still terrible, I had to turn team chat off the entire time because I could not handle listening to the frustration of the others I was paired with who were also fresh out of the academy. I attempted to help some but their frustration quickly boiled over anyway. The skill tree is not new player friendly at all for newbies to even move up. The tutorial simple gives you a little reward for buying a skill, no explanation of how any of the skills work or anything. HEY CCP why would a player even think to buy a booster when they have no idea how the skill tree works in the first place. I can not say I am surprised as I tried out EVE and quit before the tutorial was over as well. TL;DR = Match making does suck. What sucks worse is the tutorial and new players' over all introduction to the game. Between being **** all over by 14 out of 16 players on the opposite team and having no idea how to fix it through skills (AN EXPLANATION OF CORE SKILLS MIGHT BE A GOOD START) new players are expected to delete the game in less time than it took them to download it. To OP: Thanks for attempting to bring this to light as many others have. There are many players in the game who happily help newbies as we try to make New Eden a better place on our own. Feel free to drop me a line in game and hopefully I will be around to at least bring you along with a good squad who will try to help you out as well as offer different perspectives on where you should put your SP based on what you enjoy about the game.
Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 20	Posted - 2014.01.16 06:49:00 - [72] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: To OP: Thanks for attempting to bring this to light as many others have. There are many players in the game who happily help newbies as we try to make New Eden a better place on our own. Feel free to drop me a line in game and hopefully I will be around to at least bring you along with a good squad who will try to help you out as well as offer different perspectives on where you should put your SP based on what you enjoy about the game. I already figured some out. I'm ditching KDR (as it is a meaningless stat), and I'm switching back to militia gear when I see it's a stomp. Better die and lose nothing, then simply use all my earning as restocking. CCP has done such a poor job at this, that it doesn't seem to be done at all. CCP, you can try thinks with the matchmaking and then, if they fail completely, turn the previous option back. As people said, a test server would do wonders in this case.
DAMIOS82 ACME SPECIAL FORCES Legacy Rising 74	Posted - 2014.01.16 07:20:00 - [73] - Quote The best way to sort this problem is base matchmaking on skillpoints OR add additional game modes. Like up untill 5 mill skilpoints your a noob, so They get a gamemode like a pubmatch that only allows noobs uptill 5 mill (like the bootcamp). Then add a game mode that can be entered by players between 5-15 mill, the advanced player. But this game mode can also be entered by noobs, but at there own risk. Players above the 15 mill can not enter. And lastly you would have the normal pubmatches that can be entered by anybody, but lower skill levels do it at there own risk. How ever to not exclude us vets i believe faction warfare should only be for player above the 10 mill. Meaning that if a noob wants to play faction warfare they will have to earn it. See basing it on skillpoints with a small difference in between does not work, since many of us would be in a lonely club of elites. But adding game modes based on skill points with a larger gab in between gives other players the better chance to advance, yet keeping all gamemode populated. So in other words just create a game mode called bootcamp with the level restriction of 5 mill, then create a gamemode called advanced training with a level restriction of 15 mill, entering other gamemodes is then at there own risk and then the problem is solved.
SILENTSAM 69 SONS of LEGION RISE of LEGION 614	Posted - 2014.01.16 07:25:00 - [74] - Quote I personally do not mind fighting against proto players with my Standard gear. I could use Proto gear as well, but I choose not to. If we ever get kill mails I can not wait to see how ISK efficient I am. I love seeing good proto players go down to my Standard Combat Rifle.
Denn Maell PIanet Express Canis Eliminatus Operatives 67	Posted - 2014.01.16 17:39:00 - [75] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Make a militia only mode. Make militia items no longer register player skills. This will create an militia game mode that will work for new players for the time and a new mode for veteran players to enjoy with having no special advantage. The Battle Academy needs a ground up rework. From taking a new player by the hand and teaching them basic lessons like aiming in DUST, to advanced lessons where they teach how scanning works(dB etc..) Either that or we have to start working on the real EVE connection and make pub's just some meaningless ISK grind that has little focus on. Where as now its all everyone plays and is the source of a majority of the conversations. Give the players the right to choose what quality of players they wish to go up against. Yes a thousand times. I recently started a new toon and got to check out the NPE myself. It was fun to run against people who were using equivalent gear. Not easy, fun. The kind of fun where veteran FPSers stood a better chance by skill alone. I was generally disappointed when I 'graduated' to public. GÇª And no its not a matter of HTFU. A bit of grit is a wonderful thing. But when older players are getting rolled and the new players are looking around and saying "what's the point if these 20k+ SP characters loose so horribly?" Then I can't blame them from looking for fairer games that actually reward them for doing well, rather than a game that punishes someone for playing? The most OP weapon on the Dust Battle Field: One good logi, one rep tool, and a heavy.
CYRAX SERVIUS Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 527	Posted - 2014.01.16 20:57:00 - [76] - Quote SILENTSAM 69 wrote: I personally do not mind fighting against proto players with my Standard gear. I could use Proto gear as well, but I choose not to. If we ever get kill mails I can not wait to see how ISK efficient I am. I love seeing good proto players go down to my Standard Combat Rifle. Neither do I, I love taking out proto's with my Toxin and BPO"S, with core skills maxed out. The new players do not have that luxury. Even starter fits with core skills proper are fun, but players with 1mil sp don't have that option. They are nothing more than K/D padding for these pricks that run proto 24/7-365. CEO Invictus Maneo~ "I remain unvanquished"
Chaos Scum Warcaste 18	Posted - 2014.01.16 20:59:00 - [77] - Quote CYRAX SERVIUS wrote: SILENTSAM 69 wrote: I personally do not mind fighting against proto players with my Standard gear. I could use Proto gear as well, but I choose not to. If we ever get kill mails I can not wait to see how ISK efficient I am. I love seeing good proto players go down to my Standard Combat Rifle. Neither do I, I love taking out proto's with my Toxin and BPO"S, with core skills maxed out. The new players do not have that luxury. Even starter fits with core skills proper are fun, but players with 1mil sp don't have that option. They are nothing more than K/D padding for these pricks that run proto 24/7-365. word Don't hate me because I'm dutiful.
gbh08 Intara Direct Action Caldari State 201	Posted - 2014.01.16 21:39:00 - [78] - Quote Am currently in a match with only me on one side vs 11 on the other thats my second game tonight where its been like this.... I dont see why matchmaking doesnt just grab 32 players and stick then in a lobby, and THEN do the matchmaking and split the teams a bit more fairly Also, regarding the academy, has anyone been in there lately? i made a new toon about a month ago, and both matches i played, i was the ONLY person in there, no reds, no blues, just me.... if i was a new player and saw that, i would have just thought that the game was dead and no one played it, hardly a good 1st impresion to the new players, if its like that all the time now, should probably just scrap acedemy and re-think npe
Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 23	Posted - 2014.01.17 00:31:00 - [79] - Quote Since I'm new here, I do want to understand something. Do weapons have range? Min-Max damage? I know I hit people sometimes, and they seem to register 0 damage, what gives? ON TOPIC: What is getting frustrating. Having less then a million doesn't give me many options in how to tackle a problem. Unless I unload a full clip at someone, there is a high probability I'll die quickly. I'm finding strange the professional shooters here, 1 shot, 1 kill. As I said, the worst thing to new players in shooters (this isn't a true MMO, yet at least) is to be horribily outgunned. Lets use Planetside 2 as an example: Lvl 100 is 10~20% stronger due to certificates then a lvl 1, so skill-wise, lvl 100 is stronger, but not immortal. lvl 1 player, if skilled, can easily kill lvl 100, mostly because he isn't massively stronger then lvl 1. Of course in Dust 514 this is different (and I don't have anything against it), but as in planetside 2, a lvl 100 is 10-20% stronger, in Dust, Proto is 300% stronger then a militia player. That being said, there is no stimulli for a new player to stick around, mostly because he knows he'll lose too much time to even get in the same level as the proto players, let alone be better. There is no stimulli for new players to stay, they are virtually (pun) WP pi+¦atas, with no real chance of actually tackling and killing advanced/prototype players. I can't understand why is CCP struggling with this. The longer they wait for the "perfect" solution, the worst it'll get once it is implemented. It is already a tough break because new players, virgins of the CCP MMO esque, will not stay and try to work to get their gear. They won't care. Not with the current match making. I don't mind facing High lvl SK players. I mind fighting them in hugely Overpowered suits (compared to the militia). Just hoping this will be fixed soon (and I mean VERY soon, I'm already aprehensive of showing this game to more people thanks to this).
demonkiller 12 G.L.O.R.Y Public Disorder. 331	Posted - 2014.01.17 00:34:00 - [80] - Quote Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. do you go into an mmo and expect to beat an end game player? no of course not - theyve spent more time playing and have invested a heap into the game

demonkiller 12 G.L.O.R.Y Public Disorder. 331	Posted - 2014.01.17 00:42:00 - [81] - Quote lets think about this a bit, at at best theres what 5000 dust players online? across 4 servers, lets say at peak times one server alone has %50 of the current players online. so 2500, now how many are afk? probably a quarter. no we're at 1875, then theres 5 different game modes, ambush, skirmish, dom, factional and PC. so say there are 355(??) in each mode and 32 players per battles, meaning at any time there COULD be 10 matches for each game mode, youre going to come across the same people VERY often, your best chance of avoiding particular teams is waiting a while before deploying after finishing a match with them to try and avoiding them
BuTtHuRtPEepZ Raging Pack of Homosapiens 175	Posted - 2014.01.17 00:45:00 - [82] - Quote Please match players with the amount of SP SPENT, not TOTAL.
Dkafamos Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 23	Posted - 2014.01.17 00:53:00 - [83] - Quote demonkiller 12 wrote: Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. do you go into an mmo and expect to beat an end game player? no of course not - theyve spent more time playing and have invested a heap into the game Well, if we consider a true MMO, then this would apply, as we have progression and all (and most players won't be forced to face their high leveled opponents soon). But in a shooter, the initial gameplay must be geared towards low level players as well. In a FPS, gear must be different, not necessarily better. If the gear is better, you start make a gap. That wouldn't much of a problem if the get didn't grow exponentially per tier. A full advanced medium armour is going to murder a militia, or even full standard armour, because there are big differences between them. If there were levels, then it would just be a matter of attaining that level. But since this is based on gear, and it takes a lot of time and patience to get it, you need something to adress the new player experience, or they'll simply leave, shrinking the player base.
demonkiller 12 G.L.O.R.Y Public Disorder. 336	Posted - 2014.01.18 05:20:00 - [84] - Quote Dkafamos wrote: demonkiller 12 wrote: Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. do you go into an mmo and expect to beat an end game player? no of course not - theyve spent more time playing and have invested a heap into the game Well, if we consider a true MMO, then this would apply, as we have progression and all (and most players won't be forced to face their high leveled opponents soon). But in a shooter, the initial gameplay must be geared towards low level players as well. In a FPS, gear must be different, not necessarily better. If the gear is better, you start make a gap. That wouldn't much of a problem if the get didn't grow exponentially per tier. A full advanced medium armour is going to murder a militia, or even full standard armour, because there are big differences between them. If there were levels, then it would just be a matter of attaining that level. But since this is based on gear, and it takes a lot of time and patience to get it, you need something to adress the new player experience, or they'll simply leave, shrinking the player base. really it all just comes down to risk and isk i unlocked proto hives yesterday, was so ******* happy, so being the great logi i am i threw my factional 100% injector, wyka nanos and ishukone hives on a suit with my uplinks, this is the ONLY time i have ever run full proto for a match, at the end of the match i made 500k!!!!! and lost 800k in suits, dust needs a better way to make money, i can afk in eve making hundreds of millions of isk from mining, but in this game the only way to make money is to que sync 2 proto squads and hope the other team isnt better than you, or lock your districts cough cough
demonkiller 12 G.L.O.R.Y Public Disorder. 336	Posted - 2014.01.18 05:21:00 - [85] - Quote Dkafamos wrote: demonkiller 12 wrote: Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. do you go into an mmo and expect to beat an end game player? no of course not - theyve spent more time playing and have invested a heap into the game Well, if we consider a true MMO, then this would apply, as we have progression and all (and most players won't be forced to face their high leveled opponents soon). But in a shooter, the initial gameplay must be geared towards low level players as well. In a FPS, gear must be different, not necessarily better. If the gear is better, you start make a gap. That wouldn't much of a problem if the get didn't grow exponentially per tier. A full advanced medium armour is going to murder a militia, or even full standard armour, because there are big differences between them. If there were levels, then it would just be a matter of attaining that level. But since this is based on gear, and it takes a lot of time and patience to get it, you need something to adress the new player experience, or they'll simply leave, shrinking the player base. and in terms of ehp i dont see much difference between levels std 600-700hp adv 700-800hp proto 700-900hp (sometimes)
demonkiller 12 G.L.O.R.Y Public Disorder. 336	Posted - 2014.01.18 05:23:00 - [86] - Quote BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Please match players with the amount of SP SPENT, not TOTAL. theyre the same thing, who would save 5 mil sp just to not be matched with some other people...?
Dkafamos Comando Brasil 27	Posted - 2014.01.18 05:50:00 - [87] - Quote demonkiller 12 wrote: i unlocked proto hives yesterday, was so ******* happy, so being the great logi i am i threw my factional 100% injector, wyka nanos and ishukone hives on a suit with my uplinks, this is the ONLY time i have ever run full proto for a match, at the end of the match i made 500k!!!!! and lost 800k in suits, dust needs a better way to make money, i can afk in eve making hundreds of millions of isk from mining, but in this game the only way to make money is to que sync 2 proto squads and hope the other team isnt better than you, or lock your districts cough cough This is understandable. But as you said yourself, the matchmaking isn't helping unless you are running a team.
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 2764	Posted - 2014.01.18 05:53:00 - [88] - Quote Force squads to fight other squads, and just use individuals to fill in the last few spots. I don't know why thats so difficult to program into your matchmaking system. Typically if you take the time to form a squad you have the patience to get matched up for a challenging game.
Dkafamos Comando Brasil 28	Posted - 2014.01.18 06:01:00 - [89] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Force squads to fight other squads, and just use individuals to fill in the last few spots. I don't know why thats so difficult to program into your matchmaking system. Typically if you take the time to form a squad you have the patience to get matched up for a challenging game. That is THE most odd of things in the current matchmaking system. Even in other games, where "bad matchmaking happens", they split teams equally. Whats pissing me off a lot lately is that it seems Im like 80% of the time on the losing team. Don't know if its just me, or if in reality does match so badly low SP vs. High SP.
deezy dabest Warpoint Sharx 157	Posted - 2014.01.18 09:21:00 - [90] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. This is one of the problems in the game that I definitely respect the problems you guys face. Given those problems and what I have seen from newbies I think you really should consider a small increase in academy time to try to increase new player retention getting the number of newbies up allows them to be paired with other newbies and only further increases retention. I for one as one of the players into the double digit millions would be fine with a bit longer wait times if it meant there was new players working their way up to being able to have the equipment necessary to put up a good match against us or be a greater aide as a team mate.

Shruikan Iceeye 0uter.Heaven Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 148	Posted - 2014.01.18 09:44:00 - [91] - Quote The problem with matchmaking that i can see is that squads are put on the same team. This means disorganized blues on one side and mostly killers on the other side ^^ The reason why stomps happen ^^ That Pretty Motherfucker
GET ATMESON Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 248	Posted - 2014.01.18 10:47:00 - [92] - Quote Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. Welcome to New Eden? We all had it happen to us. Not one player hasnt been stomped by PRO suits. The thing about dust. Is it makes or brakes the casual shooter. Either you go through out the pub stompes and start doing it your self or you quit and no one cares. If you think players with LOADS of SP and ISK will wait in line to fight? It will be you stuck in line waiting for 1mill under SP players. If your getting stomped all the time by ADV thats truly sad. PRO must be a nightmare. I do think its a little messed up that causal players(normally COD) want to jump on here and think they will be GOD. Do the grind we all did. Get stomped like we all did. Earn your way up like we all did. Its really not that hard to NOT RUN AND GUN . Running right into a HMG or a PRO suit isnt the smartest when using free fits. Even if they use the same suit as you, the free starter fits. They will still out DPS, out EHP, and have tactics you wont have. Time spent is time earned in Dust514. Steps to fix this 1 Dont QQ 2 Join a new corp 3. Make friends with corp members 3 GRIND 4 Did I say grind? 5 Yea I did say grind. 6 save up your SP until your at 3mill or so SP 7 Pick a role you want to be. Keep in mind this will be FOREVER. 8. Spend SP and enjoy the grind to 10mill SP. 9. Learn Top corp names so you know when to leave 10, Or skip all of this and read the "new players guide" it will help you. They need modes like PRO and down, ADV and down, and Militia only. That way YOU get to pick if you get pub stomped. Keep in mind that PRO would have highest play out. ADV would have ok pay out, and Militia would have lowest payout. To bad the player base inst high enough for this. CCP could test it out with ambush maybe then add it into other game modes for a week and count how many players played those modes of ambush. To see if it would be worth it. BUT to cry about ADV suits killing you thats very sad. I would never have said that on the forums. Less QQ more Pew Pew. Maybe you should ask for PvE Hopefully a causal player will know what PvE is. SHH dont tell and dont cheat using the internet. Open Beta Fed 16th 2013. Scout fix + Heavy suits + Heavy guns = soonGäó
GET ATMESON Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 248	Posted - 2014.01.18 10:56:00 - [93] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Matchmaking is a genuine pain point for us right now and is something we'd love to get sorted. I don't have any specific updates other than to let you guys know that we're aware of the issues and want to rectify them. Props to you Saberwing. You are all over the forums now. Even if its something players dont want to hear. You still give us somewhat of whats going on. I really starting to have respect for the CCP members again. Between you and logibro, I cant pick a favorite anymore. Logibro was my favorite for the longest. Maybe next time there is a DEV invasion I might pick to help you. Keep in mind I said MIGHT. Open Beta Fed 16th 2013. Scout fix + Heavy suits + Heavy guns = soonGäó
CYRAX SERVIUS Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 539	Posted - 2014.01.18 14:43:00 - [94] - Quote demonkiller 12 wrote: Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. do you go into an mmo and expect to beat an end game player? no of course not - theyve spent more time playing and have invested a heap into the game Agreed, no argument there, I earned mine as well, doesn't make it right to shite on new players. Remember when we first started playing, we were all pretty much on the same level and progressed evenly. Now a lot of us have 25-35 mil sp. We should have a game mode for us so we can truly test our "skills" against each other instead of PC as that is a lagfest joke right now. These new players are a full year or more behind us and should be in a different league... CEO Invictus Maneo~ "I remain unvanquished"
Dkafamos Comando Brasil 35	Posted - 2014.01.18 14:54:00 - [95] - Quote GET ATMESON wrote: Dkafamos wrote: I mean, I've played for a few hours only and I already see all the crap that Dust is (and why people aren't staying for long in it). I mean, really, am I supposed to face advanced and prototype players, with millions of isks under their belts, with teams actually facing PCs and expect us to stay? Not counting being blown to bits by every single weapon in hand. Jeez, is it so hard to actually stop the stomping and actually concentrating on the fun? I will never defeat another player unless my team is stomping them mostly because I, in milita fit, the free one, where I won't spend money, will get raped by literally everything. I mean, are new players expected to be cannon fodder and like it? WTF? I though CCP had a god damn design team, and playing a few hours already brings up this mess. Fix the god damn matchmaking, either you fight people with your gear level, or equal SP. You want to play against another team? Wait in line for a match with the same ammount of players on another team. This stomping isn't fun, and it sucked all the magic out of Dust 514 for me. I don't want stomping, I want a decent fight. Welcome to New Eden? We all had it happen to us. Not one player hasnt been stomped by PRO suits. The thing about dust. Is it makes or brakes the casual shooter. Either you go through out the pub stompes and start doing it your self or you quit and no one cares. If you think players with LOADS of SP and ISK will wait in line to fight? It will be you stuck in line waiting for 1mill under SP players. If your getting stomped all the time by ADV thats truly sad. PRO must be a nightmare. I do think its a little messed up that causal players(normally COD) want to jump on here and think they will be GOD. Do the grind we all did. Get stomped like we all did. Earn your way up like we all did. Its really not that hard to NOT RUN AND GUN . Running right into a HMG or a PRO suit isnt the smartest when using free fits. Even if they use the same suit as you, the free starter fits. They will still out DPS, out EHP, and have tactics you wont have. Time spent is time earned in Dust514. Steps to fix this 1 Dont QQ 2 Join a new corp 3. Make friends with corp members 3 GRIND 4 Did I say grind? 5 Yea I did say grind. 6 save up your SP until your at 3mill or so SP 7 Pick a role you want to be. Keep in mind this will be FOREVER. 8. Spend SP and enjoy the grind to 10mill SP. 9. Learn Top corp names so you know when to leave 10, Or skip all of this and read the "new players guide" it will help you. They need modes like PRO and down, ADV and down, and Militia only. That way YOU get to pick if you get pub stomped. Keep in mind that PRO would have highest play out. ADV would have ok pay out, and Militia would have lowest payout. To bad the player base inst high enough for this. CCP could test it out with ambush maybe then add it into other game modes for a week and count how many players played those modes of ambush. To see if it would be worth it. BUT to cry about ADV suits killing you thats very sad. I would never have said that on the forums. Less QQ more Pew Pew. Maybe you should ask for PvE Hopefully a causal player will know what PvE is. SHH dont tell and dont cheat using the internet. Edit: added link to new players guide https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=136343&find=unread I actually consider myself a Harcore Gamer (I wouldn't be one if I wasn't try to make a point in the forums). I love to play game for 1, maybe more years, as I feel my time was well invested. But the problem in this game isn't the QQing, is the **** poor way to allow newer players to advance. The Matchmaking doesn't split teams well. Specially when you see 12 out of 16 players of a single corporation in a Public Contract. New players seeing how stupidly unfair the game is actually don't care for fair fights anymore. They want to participate in the stomp matches as well, maybe to win sometimes as well. I finished my bonus XP of the Week on the first day and a half, so now I have no incentive to play (not even isk, as I have a good margin for it). I feel sorry for the BR 1~10 I kill in Planetside 2, that doesn't count as a kill, while I like killing lvl 80~100 BRs. There is no point in curb stomping new players unless it is beneficial for the curb stomper. I actually start to get happy when we are stomping. It means I can win a match or another before going back to the being stomped matches that are happening SO often. This is a change in matchmaking that needs to be done. Fix it, and you'll see a lot of happier players.
CYRAX SERVIUS Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 539	Posted - 2014.01.18 15:01:00 - [96] - Quote Matchmaking will work guys with a larger playerbase. Why would new players stay in this game when they get stomped every match? I keep two out of every ten players that join right out of the academy because they don't want to be matched against players running top gear all day every day. That being said, if the proto players had to go against other proto players 24/7 in a fair matchmaking system and really have some competition, you would see them drop to std and advanced gear lobbies. But until we wake up and realize a lot of it falls on us as a community to not be complete douchebags every fkng match and protostomp and go "look at me I'm on top of the leaderboard again, god I'm so good", when really all you did was beat up on noobs with no defense against gear not "skill". We should all step back and look at the real problem here, yes CCp can help but with a small playerbase, there's only so much they can do. If you don't have players to matchmake with, matchmaking will never work. CEO Invictus Maneo~ "I remain unvanquished"


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