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Mia Romani
Nexus Marines
28
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Posted - 2013.11.11 14:36:00 -
[1] - Quote
Of course, they'd need to get something else in exchange, such as an additional grenade slot, or the ability to deploy small turrets from their equipment slots...
But still, it would be nice to see much more differentiation between Logi and Assault suits...
Interstellar Crossroads
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S. Public Disorder.
782
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Posted - 2013.11.11 14:37:00 -
[2] - Quote
Please Don't.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
Burner of faces.
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
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Harpyja
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
758
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Posted - 2013.11.11 14:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
Terrible idea.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Mia Romani
Nexus Marines
28
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Posted - 2013.11.11 14:52:00 -
[4] - Quote
Not willing to let go of your AR logis, huh?
Alright, how would you guys go about stopping the Logi suit from stepping on the Assault suit's toes?
Interstellar Crossroads
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S. Public Disorder.
782
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Posted - 2013.11.11 14:55:00 -
[5] - Quote
I don't use ARs. Im not willing to give up my Plasma Cannon+Scanner+Hives+Repair Tool.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
Burner of faces.
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
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Mia Romani
Nexus Marines
28
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Posted - 2013.11.11 15:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
That's kinda my point. Doesn't that strike as you ridiculously better than anything an Assault suit could come up with?
Interstellar Crossroads
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Hecarim Van Hohen
Unkn0wn Killers
232
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Posted - 2013.11.11 15:31:00 -
[7] - Quote
Leave the dead horse alone, it has been beaten enough already.
D-í¦¦¦¦i-󦦦+¦¿¦ºv-ë-£i-ë¦ó¦¦d¦ò-Ǧíe¦¦-ë-í¦ò-ó ¦ò¦+-üw¦¿¦¦e-ü -ë¦òs¦¢¦+t-Ŧ+-£a¦¢-án-¥¦¢-ƒ¦¢d-ü-í-ó¦ó-ó ¦¦u-ÿ-󦦦+n-ÿ-í¦¦-ü-ëi¦ó-ó-Pt-Å-Åe¦º-Å-Çd-Å-ó -ü-ÿ-ü-íw¦¿-¥-£¦í-ëe¦¦-ÿ-ü -í-ü¦óf-ía¦¢¦+-P¦í-ól-ƒ¦ó
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Kaylee Veloc
ShootBreakStab
17
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Posted - 2013.11.11 15:32:00 -
[8] - Quote
I don't get where the ideas that Logi should use sidearms only or get reduced damage come from. They are still trained soldiers and as such carry the weapons of a soldier. Yes they have a role but it doesn't necessarily mean hiding behind the other troops being everyones *****. Support can mean alot of things. I'm drawing comparisons from other games I've played here and 1 aspect of real life that doesn't interfere with this being a sci fi video game. Combat-Medics, Logistics troops whatever name you want to put on them are still 1st and foremost trained as a soldier they then train for the role after, they go on patrol / fight alongside troops with different roles (Assault, AV etc) even on the frontline providing said support when it is needed not hanging around drinking tea untill it is time to lay an uplink, provide repairs, use a needle or what have you because their ability to fight is reduced. They need to be just as combat effective as other troops. If a logi is using any of the available equipment as well as killing enemys they are still doing their job and supporting the squad, team.
Of course that is not set in stone as this game is still billed as sandbox and it's up to the player how they want to fit or run their suit aswell. Basically there is no right or wrong way because it is choice and opinion.
Personally I carry a nano hive, repair tool and active scanner on my adv Logi, still being able to provide effective firepower and replenish ammo, armour and give intel when the squad needs it.
I also play adv Assault just as much as my Logi if not more so don't dismiss this as bias please.
If you think the Assault class or any other is lack luster try coming up with ways to more define their role instead. |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
1172
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Posted - 2013.11.11 15:47:00 -
[9] - Quote
Mia Romani wrote:Not willing to let go of your AR logis, huh?
Alright, how would you guys go about stopping the Logi suit from stepping on the Assault suit's toes?
very simply... give the assault suits a passive 10% dmg boost with all weapons. problem solved.
insert witty or profound statement here _______.
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Cosgar
ParagonX
7664
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Posted - 2013.11.11 17:07:00 -
[10] - Quote
Mia Romani wrote:Not willing to let go of your AR logis, huh?
Alright, how would you guys go about stopping the Logi suit from stepping on the Assault suit's toes? Do you really want an army of logis armed with Carthium Pistols and Ishukone SMGs?
I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
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Slen Kaleth
BlackWater Liquidations
56
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Posted - 2013.11.11 17:15:00 -
[11] - Quote
Kaylee Veloc wrote:I don't get where the ideas that Logi should use sidearms only or get reduced damage come from. They are still trained soldiers and as such carry the weapons of a soldier. Yes they have a role but it doesn't necessarily mean hiding behind the other troops being everyones *****. Support can mean alot of things. I'm drawing comparisons from other games I've played here and 1 aspect of real life that doesn't interfere with this being a sci fi video game. Combat-Medics, Logistics troops whatever name you want to put on them are still 1st and foremost trained as a soldier they then train for the role after, they go on patrol / fight alongside troops with different roles.
U.S. Marine medics are U.S. Navy Corpmen. They train as medical personnel before being assigned to a marine unit, if they are to be a Marine medic. So, what you said is not always the case. |
Ferindar
Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State
75
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Posted - 2013.11.11 17:50:00 -
[12] - Quote
Real Life has nothing to do with this game.
The problem with slayer-logis is that there's no real benefits to being Assault (Unless you're going Amarr with Laser/Scrambler).
Personally, I use a logi suit for my sniper, because I have more PG/CPU, can fit a few more and better nano-hives than a standard, and the passive armor repair is nice for when I get dinged by another shot, I can recover while moving to a new location. I do sacrifice a bit of movement speed and EHP, but those tradeoffs are pretty small compared to the perks.
Why not give Assaults similar perks, aside from faster reload times. Have you seen the clip size? Nobody reloads in an active firefight unless they're using Mass Drivers.
I am the middle finger of God. You may call me a Sniper.
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Mobius Kaethis
Molon Labe PC RISE of LEGION
922
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Posted - 2013.11.11 18:07:00 -
[13] - Quote
Real life asside, since it has absolutely no bearing on what makes a video game fun, I think that the idea of giving logi only a side-arm slot is actually a great one. Logi's get the vast majority of their points from their equipment so this switch will not drastically affect their WP earning potential. Additionally having no light weapon will force logis into more of a support role but they will still be combat capable, a full proto smg is a scary thing.
In the world of DUST/
The words are all in haiku/
Tweets are just too long
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Svartur Bjorn
481
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Posted - 2013.11.11 18:14:00 -
[14] - Quote
only iff you increase the range of sidearms on logi suits to compensate. must match AR range just to be fair :)
Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=99075&find
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843 nerfnut96
BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder.
156
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Posted - 2013.11.11 18:33:00 -
[15] - Quote
I think this will sum up my opinion pretty well (all though the other guys suggestion was more extreme it falls in the same category), if you have any further questions let me know. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1423708#post1423708
Capt. Nerfnut96
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Cosgar
ParagonX
7669
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Posted - 2013.11.11 18:58:00 -
[16] - Quote
ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:only iff you increase the range of sidearms on logi suits to compensate. must match AR range just to be fair :) Unerf the flaylock
I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
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CLONE117
planetary retaliation organisation
470
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Posted - 2013.11.11 19:09:00 -
[17] - Quote
y not just make the fully fitted logi suit weaker than the fully fitted assault suit of the same tier?
for all tiers levels. |
Cosgar
ParagonX
7669
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Posted - 2013.11.11 19:14:00 -
[18] - Quote
CLONE117 wrote:y not just make the fully fitted logi suit weaker than the fully fitted assault suit of the same tier?
for all tiers levels. Because they already are. Assaults have better base stats and a sidearm over logis, take less SP/ISK to use and can use a better variety of weapons. Logis get a bit more CPU/PG and equipment at the cost of base stats and a sidearm, but get one more module slot at prototype over assaults. (Except the CaLogi, which gets 2)
I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
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Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
1973
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Posted - 2013.11.11 20:15:00 -
[19] - Quote
Mia Romani wrote:or the ability to deploy small turrets from their equipment slots...
Wow this would actually be pretty cool. If we lost weapons and could do this I wouldn't mind. Sentry guns!
"When nothing is going your way, go out of your way to do nothing."
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Sana Rayya
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL
381
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Posted - 2013.11.11 20:56:00 -
[20] - Quote
Buff assaults by giving them passive damage bonuses to weapons (as mentioned above) or two grenade slots. |
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KingBabar
The Rainbow Effect
1369
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Posted - 2013.11.11 21:04:00 -
[21] - Quote
You're all deluded. Get a proto suit of both the logi and assault, from the same race, then you'll see that nothing is that out of balance.
The only thing that needs fixing is the class bonuses, and some of the racial bonuses like the CAL logi, + 2% effectiveness to shield regulators????
I'd suggst fitting bonus for all logi suits for equipment, and fitting bonuses for assaults for light weapons and sidearms. End.
http://s1286.photobucket.com/user/KingBabar/media/BannerKingbabarcopy.png.html
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Evolution-7
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
160
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Posted - 2013.11.11 21:07:00 -
[22] - Quote
KingBabar wrote:You're all deluded. Get a proto suit of both the logi and assault, from the same race, then you'll see that nothing is that out of balance.
The only thing that needs fixing is the class bonuses, and some of the racial bonuses like the CAL logi, + 2% effectiveness to shield regulators????
I'd suggst fitting bonus for all logi suits for equipment, and fitting bonuses for assaults for light weapons and sidearms. End.
Agreed.
Veteran Pilot
"Fight on and fly on to the last drop of blood and the last drop of fuel, to the last beat of the heart."
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Cosgar
ParagonX
7686
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Posted - 2013.11.11 21:57:00 -
[23] - Quote
KingBabar wrote:You're all deluded. Get a proto suit of both the logi and assault, from the same race, then you'll see that nothing is that out of balance.
The only thing that needs fixing is the class bonuses, and some of the racial bonuses like the CAL logi, + 2% effectiveness to shield regulators????
I'd suggst fitting bonus for all logi suits for equipment, and fitting bonuses for assaults for light weapons and sidearms. End. The way I see it, logis are so much different from basic medium suits compared to assaults, they're worth the prerequisite. Assaults aren't that much better than medium suits and some aren't even worth the SP sink. Make assaults better in their base stats compared to basic suits. It's not a logi problem, but an assault problem.
I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
121
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Posted - 2013.11.11 22:43:00 -
[24] - Quote
Mia Romani wrote:Of course, they'd need to get something else in exchange, such as an additional grenade slot, or the ability to deploy small turrets from their equipment slots...
But still, it would be nice to see much more differentiation between Logi and Assault suits...
Small turrets Vs Light weapon ?
I damn f*cking agree !!!!! (I'm a Logi)
Logi are for Support and Support fire. What else if we have small Turrets ? (Like Borderlands). They could use the AI of actuale turrets to make them work. We could have types of turrets for each Race. (Each type have STD/ADV/PRO.)
Normal version :We can have 2 they have a big ammo pool (Bigger if Proto or Advanced even 2 at the same time if Proto):
Amarr : Shoots scramblers (Like scrambler assault) Mid range. => High durabiliy Armor / Shield => High RoF => Big so easy to shoot Caldari : Shoots Rail rifle (Like the future Rail rifle) => long range => High Shield Low Armor => Low RoF. Gallente : Shoots Plasma (Like tha Plasma rifle) => Short Range => High armor low shield => High RoF. Minmatarr : Shoots Bullets (Like SMG or HMG) => Short range => Low ehp => Really high RoF => Smaller (Harder to shoot).
Heavy Version : Only one (2 at Proto level) low Ammo pool (Skills can make them more durable).
Amarr : 2 Lasers Cannon (Like the lasers rifle but two of them) => Mid-Long Range (60) => High DPS => High resistance (at least 600eHp.) => But they Overheat if they fire too much. Caldari : Small Forge gun (150-200 of damage) => Low roF => Long range (75Meters) Gallente : 2 small Plasma Cannon : (250 of damage shoots twice but are easy to dodge and need a load time) => Short range (30 meters). Minmatarr : 1 small Mass driver (Damage ar the same as a mass driver but divided by twice.) => Mid range.
Range : Start shooting when an ennemy is in sight AND in Range :
Short Range : 0-15meters. Mid range : 0-25 Mid-Long : 5-35 (Don't shoot if too close) Long Range : 10-50 |
Patrick57
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
1385
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Posted - 2013.11.11 23:53:00 -
[25] - Quote
Mia Romani wrote:Of course, they'd need to get something else in exchange, such as an additional grenade slot, or the ability to deploy small turrets from their equipment slots...
But still, it would be nice to see much more differentiation between Logi and Assault suits... Then the Amarr Logi's bonus (as in right now it is the only one with a sidearm) should be having a Light Weapon slot.
Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself.
-Mark Twain
:D
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Patrick57
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
1385
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Posted - 2013.11.11 23:54:00 -
[26] - Quote
KingBabar wrote:You're all deluded. Get a proto suit of both the logi and assault, from the same race, then you'll see that nothing is that out of balance.
The only thing that needs fixing is the class bonuses, and some of the racial bonuses like the CAL logi, + 2% effectiveness to shield regulators????
I'd suggst fitting bonus for all logi suits for equipment, and fitting bonuses for assaults for light weapons and sidearms. End. I got Advanced Amarr Assault, but with the Rifle Range changes, I'm not going any further.
Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself.
-Mark Twain
:D
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Draco Cerberus
Hell's Gate Inc
475
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Posted - 2013.11.12 00:04:00 -
[27] - Quote
What if... Assaults couldn't use Light weapons?
Or how about, what if Assaults couldn't use Equipment?
There is absolutely no reason to restrict someone to a sidearm at all.
Proto MD Proto AR Proto Sniper Proto Logi Proto Nanos Proto Links ... Zero skills in Sidearms
The what if, would amount to a RESPEC or the closing of all my Eve accounts and finding a new game (the cost of which would most likely be less than the combined total of cash spent on CCP products in one month).
One Universe...with friendly fire for all!
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Svartur Bjorn
482
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Posted - 2013.11.12 00:11:00 -
[28] - Quote
what about remove wp from weapon kills for logi suits but remove equipment from all other suits. fair tradeoff
Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=99075&find
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Cash Gash
1 36 Infantry Battalion
23
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Posted - 2013.11.12 00:19:00 -
[29] - Quote
Kaylee Veloc wrote:I don't get where the ideas that Logi should use sidearms only or get reduced damage come from. They are still trained soldiers and as such carry the weapons of a soldier. Yes they have a role but it doesn't necessarily mean hiding behind the other troops being everyones *****. Support can mean alot of things. I'm drawing comparisons from other games I've played here and 1 aspect of real life that doesn't interfere with this being a sci fi video game. Combat-Medics, Logistics troops whatever name you want to put on them are still 1st and foremost trained as a soldier they then train for the role after, they go on patrol / fight alongside troops with different roles (Assault, AV etc) even on the frontline providing said support when it is needed not hanging around drinking tea untill it is time to lay an uplink, provide repairs, use a needle or what have you because their ability to fight is reduced. They need to be just as combat effective as other troops. If a logi is using any of the available equipment as well as killing enemys they are still doing their job and supporting the squad, team.
Of course that is not set in stone as this game is still billed as sandbox and it's up to the player how they want to fit or run their suit aswell. Basically there is no right or wrong way because it is choice and opinion.
Personally I carry a nano hive, repair tool and active scanner on my adv Logi, still being able to provide effective firepower and replenish ammo, armour and give intel when the squad needs it.
I also play adv Assault just as much as my Logi if not more so don't dismiss this as bias please.
If you think the Assault class or any other is lack luster try coming up with ways to more define their role instead.
What you say about combat medics is true and often my best friends BUT I can assure you I have never met a medic that can be as combat effective as me or my squad.... So in reality yes you do fight but you are not as effective as a dedicated infantryman (who also trains to do YOUR job but cannot do it as effective as you). So in New Eden "combat medics" should not be as combat effective or more OP then a dedicated assault class. |
Draco Cerberus
Hell's Gate Inc
475
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Posted - 2013.11.12 00:26:00 -
[30] - Quote
Cash Gash wrote: What you say about combat medics is true and often my best friends BUT I can assure you I have never met a medic that can be as combat effective as me or my squad (served active duty as an infantryman).... So in reality yes you do fight but you are not as effective as a dedicated infantryman (who also trains to do YOUR job but cannot do it as effective as you). So in New Eden "combat medics" should not be as combat effective or more OP then a dedicated assault class.
They aren't.
One Universe...with friendly fire for all!
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