Does anyone use the HMG anymore?
CCP Rattati chimes in his own experience with the interesting Heavy HMG discussion going on with the players. Does anyone use the HMG anymore, apparently some do! :P

Thats right CCP, just because you designed the suit for a certain play style it shouldnt be that way and you need to cater to guys who want to kick in doors with 1k + ehp and kill from 60 meters away


Seriously though thats what its designed for, not everyone gets to be in the spear head and if you want to go assaulting guys then maybe wear an assault suit while you do it
Agree that scouts need some love though, Im thinking pump up their stamina since they travel light and rework hack speeds on suits so logis get the fastest hacks, scouts second, assaults 3rd and heavies last
Not talking huge gaps though, a heavy shouldnt take 60 seconds to hack something that a logi spends ten seconds on, more like 15 to a logis 10

Thats right CCP, just because you designed the suit for a certain play style it shouldnt be that way and you need to cater to guys who want to kick in doors with 1k + ehp and kill from 60 meters away


Seriously though thats what its designed for, not everyone gets to be in the spear head and if you want to go assaulting guys then maybe wear an assault suit while you do it
Agree that scouts need some love though, Im thinking pump up their stamina since they travel light and rework hack speeds on suits so logis get the fastest hacks, scouts second, assaults 3rd and heavies last
Not talking huge gaps though, a heavy shouldnt take 60 seconds to hack something that a logi spends ten seconds on, more like 15 to a logis 10

Im not saying what should be done, but designing the heavy with ONE playstyle in mind is a bad thing yes?

\I find myself a sad panda CCP seem to be blowing off an important topic, or are at least not getting the point.

For Eve Online some of the issues they've put off can be measured in years. Not that any acknowledgement would matter. They've already recognized that scout performance was dropping and would look into it. That was over two months ago with no forum updates.

On my main I play a heavy and the current position is to chill until 2.0 drops. The Devs have so much on their plates I'll be happy so long as they don't screw up the Forge Guns in a patch.

Thats right CCP, just because you designed the suit for a certain play style it shouldnt be that way and you need to cater to guys who want to kick in doors with 1k + ehp and kill from 60 meters away


Seriously though thats what its designed for, not everyone gets to be in the spear head and if you want to go assaulting guys then maybe wear an assault suit while you do it

Im going to try really hard not to talk about how i can use the FG better than the HMG in its own element ... crap just did

IKR

Unless that Dev is playing a suit that hasn't been released to us he's playing a basic or Sentinel.
THAT specific racial line of heavy suit(s) may be geared towards a defensive role, that doesn't
mean the other (long overdue) racial heavies need to be shoehorned into that role as well.

Amarr heavies are defensive... Fine.
Why do the other racial heavy suits have to be as well?
Honest question. Seriously, if a logi can out assault an assault and everyone is fine with it
why can't a heavy go offensive?

Going with what the "community" has told continually stated.

Everywhere I looked when concerning heavies it was always "the Devs stated the sentinel was/is
designed for defense. Play your role!" or some such variation of that.

So I posted a thread and asked why that was the case. Apparently some Dev said it so it became
gospel.

But that was Amarr heavy/Sentinel specific. That's where that's coming from.

I gave up on hoping for a different perspective on the Sentinel line.
The rest of the racial heavies though... We shouldn't let them get screwed over into a "defensive"
only sort of role.

Edit: See MM's post above. Some variation or another.

Once again just facts here, Im not ready to wade in!

But all suits currently at least have the same variations!

ALL lights will have pilot and scout
ALL mediums have assault and logi
ALL Heavies have sentinel and commando

But that doesn't mean you can't mod them!

You say the sentinal is defensive. Its design is based on that... then shouldnt logi be strictly support?

Think... know this is dangerous... this highlights an issue.... or at least a mentalitly in the suits.

The specialised suits, assault, logi, sentinal, commando... arent "equal" in regards to how restrictive they are.

The assault/Logi are very wide ranging. The sentinal/commando are pretty definitive in what they do.

You say the sentinal is defensive. Its design is based on that... then shouldnt logi be strictly support?

Then wade in I shall!



Assults specialisation much to a lot of peoples suprise is meant to be its versatility! An assault can be a chopshopped version of any other suit. It can run a decent scout, but not as good as a scout, it can be a brick tank heavy but not as good as a heavy!!

Logi units need a slight change, which ccp are apparently working on but having trouble with, they plan to lower pg/cpu on the suits but give bonuses to eq fitting costs, that way they can't out tank! But once again logistics is a diverse roll. As are they all!

A sentinel is designed for defence apparently, but what is a defensive role?
Is it guard a null cannon?
Is it tail end charlie?
Maybe its area denial and suppression?

The heavy is what you make lf it, but it should not be alone wolf gear, no suit should be!

It just so happens that the suit lends itself to places with good cover! When bubble sheilds are released and triage repair tools aremore useful, heavies will see more time on the frontline!

Im just gonna watch for now but I'll leave this here as a talking point!

Sentinel
(Noun)

A soldier or guard whose job is to stand and keep watch

Liking what you say up to the heavy bit makes sense

the sentinal role (atm) seem to just overlap with the basic heavy... just with a lightly different slot layout... it really isnt complete yet and personally i think it should never have been released... however much im craving new suits lol

Basic heavies... just feel a bit.... lame... by which i actually mean lame as in crippled

What if you got a little health boost and a speed drop on the sentinel?
Prehaps a few more module slots?

Also consider this is the amarian suit, which has always been about slow heavy tanking, the minmatar for example will find it much easier to move tactically across open ground! While gallante will be forced to stay in cities more often!

Bear in mind that any point defense role in RL is never done in a way as to let the enemy approach to practically CQC range and then engage it. Every realistic point defense setup is designed to prevent the enemy from approaching in the first place. If the enemy gets close, then point defense has already failed. Typical RL anti-infantry point defense weapon is the LMG. Now, what attribute RL LMG has that DUST HMG so badly lacks? You guessed it - it's range. Without range, HMG in not suitable for point defense role, no matter how powerful it is at close range.

HMG, as it is now, is an offensive weapon (or at least, it should be). To be effective, heavy has to close the distance between him an the enemy. And this is where the heavy/sentinel suit simply isn't up to the job. The approx. 500 extra HP (on average) it has compared to the medium suits amounts to a second-and-a-half longer life expectancy when tanking the ever popular AR. That's maybe 7-8 meters of distance at heavy's running speed. If you take into account the difference in effective range of the HMG and AR, that simply isn't enough. Also, expecting from a heavy to run from cover to cover, outflank, outmaneuver or "surprise" the enemy is clearly not something a sentinel can do effectively, nor what it is designed for.

So, basically you have a weapon that is good for assaulting stuck to a dropsuit that is only good for defense. The only other option is the FG, but that's a whole different story. Maybe when other heavy weapon variants are released (amarr heavy pulse laser?), sentinels will get the weapon with which they can perform their "sentineling" properly.

If you did that why would anyone use the basic?
The sentinal could get a HP boost, turn slower, but have a dmg bonus... or something i dont know, really need the whole line up and sort them all out in one go, with racial heavy weapons etc

Hmg is a minmatar weapon, in dust at least minmatar is known for short range breaching or long distance suppression/area denial! I believe the hmg needs a much longer effective to fit this bill somewhere along the lines of 80-100m effective, enough to really scare an enemy into hunkering down! But as I said this an amarr suit which are always better for longer ranges, which a minmatar weapon doesn't allow!