A few issues with your conversation. Assaults and heavies would nullify there bonus against each other. And they would destroy the other classes. And for double the range of the repper is no point. Its a risk and reward system. You have to earn the wp points. Double the range and becomes free wp which is unbalanced in its self.

If you want me to read that ****, you need bullet points.

I'll respond based on your title: CCP announced several weeks ago that they plan to have equipment based bonuses on the Logis but that there is an issue with the coding so they will be changing it sometime in the 'future'.

A few issues with your conversation. Assaults and heavies would nullify there bonus against each other. And they would destroy the other classes. And for double the range of the repper is no point. Its a risk and reward system. You have to earn the wp points. Double the range and becomes free wp which is unbalanced in its self.

Double Rep range is not a decent bonus. For one, with the changes to health bar visibility in the 1.4 update you can barely tell when someone needs reps even if they are standing right in front of you. So extending the range is no good IMO.

As for changing Logistics bonuses, I thought that was in the works already. Although, I am pretty happy with Minmater Logi bonuses as they stand right now.

And I honestly can't believe we are talking about Logistics being OP again. This is pipe dream fantasy world urban legend crap now. I am a 17+ million SP Minmater Logi with maxed Electronics/Engineering and pretty much all efficiency skills maxed and I cannot fit my Proto suit to reach 800 hit points. And that is running mediocre equipment.

I must be playing a different game tho, because I tend to get killed by all weapons and classes pretty evenly.

The problem with logis is that they have to many module slots, to much pg cpu and not enough relevant bonuses!! The bonuses dont have to be strong, but that doesnt mean you cant have more than 2?

Logis need to swap there module slots with the assult class

have the same pg/cpu as the assult currently,

a bonus then needs to be applied to drastically reduce the requirments of equipment,
so that a logi will be able to fit out all of their equipment for the same requirments as an assault running 1 equipment,

then you need a bonus to nanite cluster capacity, as much as 50%,
this should be applied to all nanohives

finally repair tools need either a range or number of targets to repair bonus, this makes the multi tool even more powerful

This would be a great improvement for logis

Yeah we have more slots...because we have less base HP than Assault. So in order to equip defense and support modules we need the extra slots.

Yeah we have more CPU/PG because we are 'expected' to carry support equipment to help the team.

The only way a Logistics suit becomes 'unbalanced' is when the player does not fill the equipment slots and uses the extra CPU/PG to equip better offensive/defensive modules. This can easily be eliminated by making the use of equipment slots in Logistics dropsuits mandatory for the suit to be valid, much like you have to equip a weapon for all suits to be valid.

Of course you have those who cry foul that such a requirement infringes on their 'freedom' to do what they want with a suit. These are generally players who don't play Logistics the way it should be played. So as a dedicated 'True Logi', I say take your 'freedom' QQ, roll it up and smoke it.

Because no self-respecting Logistics player ever deploys to the Burn Zone with empty equipment slots.

You're forgetting a better option that allows for the possibility of a player NOT fitting and playing the role of Logi "as instended", without letting them turn the suit into a super-Assault or super-Scout or speed-tanked Heavy.

Don't force players to fill the equipment slots, but majorly reduce PG/CPU on the suits. Then give Logis a massive reduction to fitting costs on ALL equipment as a role/suit bonus. Now, your Logi suits are limited in their ability to fit for a non-Logi role, but you CAN choose to drop your (absurdly cheap) Equipment in order to add a slightly better plate/extender/whatever instead.

If we're going to change logistic bonuses, they need to be based on equipment from a general sense and not tied specifically to certain modules. That's completely shortsighted when you think of other gadgets we might be getting. Also, if you take away my hacking bonus, I'm officially done with Dust.

If we're going to change logistic bonuses, they need to be based on equipment from a general sense and not tied specifically to certain modules. That's completely shortsighted when you think of other gadgets we might be getting. Also, if you take away my hacking bonus, I'm officially done with Dust.

A few issues with your conversation. Assaults and heavies would nullify there bonus against each other. And they would destroy the other classes. And for double the range of the repper is no point. Its a risk and reward system. You have to earn the wp points. Double the range and becomes free wp which is unbalanced in its self.

Yeah we have more slots...because we have less base HP than Assault. So in order to equip defense and support modules we need the extra slots.

Yeah we have more CPU/PG because we are 'expected' to carry support equipment to help the team.

The only way a Logistics suit becomes 'unbalanced' is when the player does not fill the equipment slots and uses the extra CPU/PG to equip better offensive/defensive modules. This can easily be eliminated by making the use of equipment slots in Logistics dropsuits mandatory for the suit to be valid, much like you have to equip a weapon for all suits to be valid.

Of course you have those who cry foul that such a requirement infringes on their 'freedom' to do what they want with a suit. These are generally players who don't play Logistics the way it should be played. So as a dedicated 'True Logi', I say take your 'freedom' QQ, roll it up and smoke it.

Because no self-respecting Logistics player ever deploys to the Burn Zone with empty equipment slots.

Why would that be?

If they changed the bonuses, there's a chance that as part of such a major revision, they'd re-credit SP spent in those specific areas, as we're talking about redefining a role entirely, not just nerfing a single suit.

As well, what if that hacking bonus were to be applied to Scout suits? Or maybe to the as-yet undiscussed Spec Ops specialization that could be seen to be a Medium suit back on Buckingham before they migrated us to other test servers?

Honestly, I think giving a reconnaissance focused suit a way to slip around and quickly flip objectives would be a great way to reward those who specced into that suit.

Why would that be?

If they changed the bonuses, there's a chance that as part of such a major revision, they'd re-credit SP spent in those specific areas, as we're talking about redefining a role entirely, not just nerfing a single suit.

As well, what if that hacking bonus were to be applied to Scout suits? Or maybe to the as-yet undiscussed Spec Ops specialization that could be seen to be a Medium suit back on Buckingham before they migrated us to other test servers?

Honestly, I think giving a reconnaissance focused suit a way to slip around and quickly flip objectives would be a great way to reward those who specced into that suit.

How to balance logis?

Change passive reps to 10% CPU/PG on equipment per level.
Give us the same PG/CPU as assault suits.

...

Profit!

Specific equipment bonuses are cool, as long as they don't pidgeonhole each suit into a specific role, making them inferior to the other suits for other equipment based tasks.

When I first logged in for Uprising 1.0 I carefully planned out my build. Calculated how much SP everything would cost, what kind of fit I wanted to run and what weapon I wanted to use. One of the hardest choices was what logi suit I wanted to use- Gallente or Minmatar. I spent a good 2 hours, weighing the options on if I wanted a fully equipment oriented armor tanking brick or a mobile scout/logi hybrid suit that could hack things like a boss. I specced into Minmatar logi because of that hacking bonus and made a build specifically for it along with my other equipment fittings. I'm sick and tired of CCP flipping everything around because of a bunch of ill informed morons listening to other ill informed morons to the point that people don't even know what they want anymore and the devs just bend over backwards to appease the current kneejerk reaction. All this drama started over one logistics suit that was extremely OP and I thought this would be resolved after it was nerfed (way too hard) but I was wrong. It's a matter of principles here. How many times is something that players invested their hard earned SP into going to be turned upside down due to a trail of tears by narrow minded, short sighted idiots? You take away my hacking bonus, I better get a SP respec so I can spec into Caldari Assault with an AR since that's apparently the only way you can safely play the game.
You guys can have your little IRC circle jerk about re-balancing the game if you want, but if we keep ******* each other over like this, nobody is going to stick around to play.

When I first logged in for Uprising 1.0 I carefully planned out my build. Calculated how much SP everything would cost, what kind of fit I wanted to run and what weapon I wanted to use. One of the hardest choices was what logi suit I wanted to use- Gallente or Minmatar. I spent a good 2 hours, weighing the options on if I wanted a fully equipment oriented armor tanking brick or a mobile scout/logi hybrid suit that could hack things like a boss. I specced into Minmatar logi because of that hacking bonus and made a build specifically for it along with my other equipment fittings. I'm sick and tired of CCP flipping everything around because of a bunch of ill informed morons listening to other ill informed morons to the point that people don't even know what they want anymore and the devs just bend over backwards to appease the current kneejerk reaction. All this drama started over one logistics suit that was extremely OP and I thought this would be resolved after it was nerfed (way too hard) but I was wrong. It's a matter of principles here. How many times is something that players invested their hard earned SP into going to be turned upside down due to a trail of tears by narrow minded, short sighted idiots? You take away my hacking bonus, I better get a SP respec so I can spec into Caldari Assault with an AR since that's apparently the only way you can safely play the game.
You guys can have your little IRC circle jerk about re-balancing the game if you want, but if we keep ******* each other over like this, nobody is going to stick around to play.

Why not give the Assaults the same slots and CPU/PG as Logis; buff Assaults, don't nerf Logis.

I have a hard enough time playing my role correctly without such a nerf.

I actually haven't been in IRC in ages, but I already understand where you were coming from.

We've had several members of the CPM express support for the idea of limited SP reverts in the case of major changes that redefine an asset, and given how they're looking at almost completely redefining vehicles for the next point release, I would imagine that a release that changed that many classes of suit all at once would fit the same bill.

Calm yourself, Logis can keep there module layout, hell the min can probably keep the hack bonus, I dont have a problem with the suits being OP what I do have problem with is that a logi can fill all the roles this game needs, if you cant see that then your just kidding yourself from a suit that really shines!!

Logis make better scouts than a scout suit,
Logis make better assaults than assaults,
Logis make better heavies than heavies

You cant deny it, you know you cant, we're not talking about ruining it, were talking about getting it to a point where it doesnt infringe on other suits roles!!

Logis should be able to play multiple roles, from hacker, to medic, to engineer, to demolitions, to communications, to ewarfare.
But other suits need to have their own roles to.

I'd be more than happy to get equipment PG/CPU role bonus on my Amarr logi but I'm left wondering how would this affect the Amarr logi as it is meant to be more of a frontline logi as it has both Lightweapon and Sidearm slots?

All in all this is a good idea and I hope for a constructive discussion :3

How many of these rebalances are going to be around short term fixes that CCP seems to have forgotten? Weapons got a 10% damage boost to compensate for the terrible aiming mechanics and vehicles got a PG nerf to "give new players a chance" when they decided matchmaking wasn't a priority. I'm not trusting any changes anymore with this game because nobody every focuses on cleaning up their mess. This is why we have 1.4 and this is why we can't have nice things.