I've been doing some thinking about sidearms lately, and I realized something about why people complain abut flaylocks.
I've seen similar complaints in every online game I can think of.

It deals burst damage

I don't mean a 3 shot burst; I mean it deals its full damage potential in a very short period of time.

Look at the other prototype sidearms next to the core flaylock, aside from nova knives- they don't deal as much damage as a flaylock within the first 2 seconds (unless it's a scrambler headshot), but deal more damage per clip.
While the other weapons are potentially more dangerous, the flaylock just seems more powerful (and scarier) because it deals its clip worth of damage most quickly.

So, how do you counter burst tactics?
Well, coming from my experience in dealing with them in other games: teamwork. As soon as those first 3 shots are done, the flaylock user is reloading and the buddies of whoever they killed are stomping on them. If they back off to cover when they reload, well, that's just tactics.

Admittedly, the flaylock is one of the more unique burst weapons/classes I've seen in that it also deals AOE damage.
Not saying it's necessarily overpowered, but if CCP does feel the need to nerf it, I think slowing down its reload speed is exactly what would work best.


TL;DR: flaylocks aren't all that powerful- they just scare the **** out of you because they go through their clip so quickly.

the problem is the range. some d-bag can sit on top of a building and drop splash damage on guys 40 feet down. it's foolish, and needs to be fixed.

the problem is the range. some d-bag can sit on top of a building and drop splash damage on guys 40 feet down. it's foolish, and needs to be fixed.

I've been doing some thinking about sidearms lately, and I realized something about why people complain abut flaylocks.
I've seen similar complaints in every online game I can think of.

It deals burst damage

I don't mean a 3 shot burst; I mean it deals its full damage potential in a very short period of time.

Look at the other prototype sidearms next to the core flaylock, aside from nova knives- they don't deal as much damage as a flaylock within the first 2 seconds (unless it's a scrambler headshot), but deal more damage per clip.
While the other weapons are potentially more dangerous, the flaylock just seems more powerful (and scarier) because it deals its clip worth of damage most quickly.

So, how do you counter burst tactics?
Well, coming from my experience in dealing with them in other games: teamwork. As soon as those first 3 shots are done, the flaylock user is reloading and the buddies of whoever they killed are stomping on them. If they back off to cover when they reload, well, that's just tactics.

Admittedly, the flaylock is one of the more unique burst weapons/classes I've seen in that it also deals AOE damage.
Not saying it's necessarily overpowered, but if CCP does feel the need to nerf it, I think slowing down its reload speed is exactly what would work best.


TL;DR: flaylocks aren't all that powerful- they just scare the **** out of you because they go through their clip so quickly.

the problem is the range. some d-bag can sit on top of a building and drop splash damage on guys 40 feet down. it's foolish, and needs to be fixed.

Like I said- it's called tactics.

Someone with an AR can sit on top of a building and spray at guys 40 meters down
Someone with a mass driver can sit on top of a building and drop splash on guys 40 meters down
Someone with a sniper rifle can sit on top of a building and snipe guys 40 meters down
Someone with a laser rifle can sit on top of a building and spray at guys 40 meters down
Someone with a forge gun can sit on top of a building and drop splash on guys 40 meters down

Light Weapon
Light Weapon
Light Weapon
Light Weapon
Heavy Weapon


Sidearm?

Light Weapon
Light Weapon
Light Weapon
Light Weapon
Heavy Weapon


Sidearm?

Scrambler pistol works just fine if you can aim. And just like the flaylock, even if your aim is OK, the majority of shots don't result in decent hits at range.

I've been doing some thinking about sidearms lately, and I realized something about why people complain abut flaylocks.
I've seen similar complaints in every online game I can think of.

It deals burst damage

I don't mean a 3 shot burst; I mean it deals its full damage potential in a very short period of time.

Look at the other prototype sidearms next to the core flaylock, aside from nova knives- they don't deal as much damage as a flaylock within the first 2 seconds (unless it's a scrambler headshot), but deal more damage per clip.
While the other weapons are potentially more dangerous, the flaylock just seems more powerful (and scarier) because it deals its clip worth of damage most quickly.

So, how do you counter burst tactics?
Well, coming from my experience in dealing with them in other games: teamwork. As soon as those first 3 shots are done, the flaylock user is reloading and the buddies of whoever they killed are stomping on them. If they back off to cover when they reload, well, that's just tactics.

Admittedly, the flaylock is one of the more unique burst weapons/classes I've seen in that it also deals AOE damage.
Not saying it's necessarily overpowered, but if CCP does feel the need to nerf it, I think slowing down its reload speed is exactly what would work best.


TL;DR: flaylocks aren't all that powerful- they just scare the **** out of you because they go through their clip so quickly.

I don't have it so I can't personally verify that is does, but I've seen people state because numbers are rounded up to the nearest 10th that a Proto Minmatar Assault will get 4 in the clip with a Flaylock. Players also double down with 2 Flaylocks, swapping instead of reloading, and 2 run or more KinCats which makes them incredibly fast. Teamwork doesn't work out so well when Flaylock 2 shots most suits other then proto, and can with enough SP in damage mods and proficiency 2 shot even Proto. At 6 or 8 Flaylock rounds, that's 3 to 4 enemies who can be put done before reloading. DPS is king, and it doesn't matter if it's burst or sustained.

Lowering reload speed is not enough. Flaylock should have some combination of a slower RoF, less splash damage, 2 shots in the clip and a slower reload speed in my opinion.

It's really just the Godlock that's an issue.

2.0 splash with powerful damage on a sidearm = Iceland has some damn good weed.

I actually don't think it's OP. At distance most shots miss just like when I'm using a scrambler pistol. Up close it does more damage than my scrambler pistol (unless I hit the head), but has to reload after only 3 shots while I keep going.

If anything, fitting stats need to be changed slightly to bring it more in line with other sidearms.

One of the problems is that people mostly focus on the core flaylock...yet most of those people haven't really bothered trying the other proto sidearms. They're all really strong...but have their drawbacks.

With the SP, I get more shots and damage against shields...the flaylock rocks against armor but sucks against shields and only has 3 shots...the nova knife wins against anything if it's in striking distance...and the SMG requires less accurate aim while rocking against armor (but sucks against shields).

Most of the complaints are from people who use non-proto suits/mods and then complain about getting slaughtered by a proto gun.

Wait until more people use the scrambler pistol, they're outright scary in the right hands (and out-damage the SR btw).

Wait until more people use the scrambler pistol, they're outright scary in the right hands (and out-damage the SR btw).

To be fair, my head is a much smaller target than the ground near my feet :/

Just get rid of the splash damage.Those small rockets should have only penetrating power to armor.I dont think that they are OP but do we realy need a secondary weapon that has bigger splash damage like a small missile turet?

Finally someone else that understands burst/spike damage. Like the MD, sniper rifle, forge gun, nova knives and shotgun, the Flaylock deals all of its damage at once vs DoT like any full auto or burst fire weapon. Guns in this game deal damage proportionate to their relative clip size and since the flaylock only has 3 shots, (4 on a Minmatar assault) that damage is massive. Also since it's explosive, it has a blast radius too. But even with all these strengths, the flaylock has terrible range and it's clumsy in open, level ground unless you're good at leading shots I rarely die to them because I stay out of CQC range and assume that everyone is carrying a flaylock. The times I do die are because someone is above or gets the drop on me.

What you describe is called "tactics"...and that requires thinking....most aren't willing to strain their brains like that and to actively look for a counter tactic is too much of a challenge

Story time!

I used to play "Star Wars: the Old Republic", as an operative. Operatives were stealth based glass cannons dealing burst damage; they would pop out of nowhere and kill you in no time, but as soon as that happens, all the nearby mobs/enemy players would stomp on them.
The first class to get nerfed after release? Well, operatives of course!

After they were nerfed, they became completely useless. They still opened with very heavy damage, but they could never get a kill against decent players, because the lowered damage gave their enemies time to react and easily kill the operative.

The point? without dealing heavy damage, burst tactics don't kill anything.

Its a good theory, and I bet its true in some games.. but,.

/cough,

But this is Dust, the fine line between weapon OP/ Balance is,

is the core flaylock to easy to use ?

Like I dont care what anyone says, the scrambler pistol is HARD to use, It has burst potential second to SG and it would never be called op.