Submachine guns are like concentrated sun to tears when applied to armor.

But your leaving out things like the shotguns potential to be a one hit kill at close range and the scrambler rifles charge feature which makes it deadly especially if it's a charge headshot.

The hmg will drop you quicker in a cqc fight because of the higher rate of fire. me having 1 complex heavy damage mod and proficiency to 4 i do 24.8 damage a bullet and 2000 rpm thats 49,600 damage a minute. even though you can't fire for a whole minute thats still a lot of damage per second.

I would expect a full balance when all AR's (caldari rail rifle, minmatar compact rifle) are in and possibly even the heavy weapons too

Its not the meant to have the shortest range of all weapon, just the shortest range for assault rifles.

I've been in beta for a long time, and I've literally heard every weapon be called overpowered (well, the plasma cannon was one of those things where people expected it to be OP before it was released). More often then not, it's an exaggeration.

But the real overpowered weapon? That's not hard to find- and it's the gallente assault rifle.

First, let's look at what it's meant to be.
It's a gallente weapon; that means having the shortest range, highest damage. It's also an assault rifle, which means it's supposed to be OK at everything. While its overall effectiveness in different situations isn't something you can prove easily, let's look at the Gallente side.

I'll be comparing the Duvolle assault rifle with the Imperial Scrambler rifle
Optimal ranges (according to the range thread): since the Duvolle is plasma and the Scrambler is a pulse laser, the scrambler should have significantly more range.

• Duvolle assault rifle: 42m
• Imperial scrambler rifle: 50m

8 meters isn't very significant, especially considering the (SoonGäó) Combat rifle has to fit between them, while it's also much easier to hit with the duvolle, since it's fully automatic. Outside of effective range, the duvolle is currently the bigger threat.

Now let's look at damage:

• Duvolle assault rifle: 34.1 per shot
RoF of 750
doesn't overheat, so it does 10230 in the 24 seconds before having to stop to reload
In 5.5 seconds, that's about 2344 damage

• Imperial Scrambler rifle: 79.2 per shot
max RoF is 705.9, but it's semi automatic, and can overheat. Firing at a RoF slow enough to conserve heat, I managed to fire 16 shots in 5.5 seconds before overheating (which does damage)
Counting the overheat as a reload, that's 1267 damage in 5.5 seconds before the user has to stop.

Going off of that, in the time it takes for the scrambler rifle (if fired carefully) to overheat, the duvolle does nearly twice the damage, at nearly the same range, while taking much less practice to use.

A few quick, less in-depth comparisons to other weapons:
Compared to the HMG, the assault rifle has more range and is more accurate. With the spread of HMG bullets, the AR also seems to deal more damage.
Compared to the shotgun, the assault rifle hits much more consistently (against a moving target), and at a much longer range.
Compared to the mass driver, the assault rifle takes less practice, or more effective against shield tanked people (almost all of them) and lasts longer before running out of ammo
Compared to the laser rifle, the assault rifle has comparable range and damage, while lacking the overheat and being more effective in CQC
Compared to the flaylock pistol (I don't want to compare it to a sidearm, but someone is bound to bring it up), the assault rifle has much longer range, is easier to hit with, and can fire for much longer before reloading.
On the current maps, most sniper positions can be now easily shot by assault rifles


The gallente assault rifle needs to be gallente- short ranged. It already has gallente damage, and takes no skill to use.

Compare the Duvolle to the Carthum assault scrambler rifle. Or the TACT to the Imperial

HMG? Please, try using it. MUCH shorter range, and it's inaccurate enough that you won't be hitting often enough for the RoF to matter anyway. The reload is also so long that you need to wait for the fighting to be far away before it's safe to try.

I'm comparing what's meant to be the primary gallente weapon to the primary amarr weapon.

I've been in beta for a long time, and I've literally heard every weapon be called overpowered (well, the plasma cannon was one of those things where people expected it to be OP before it was released). More often then not, it's an exaggeration.

But the real overpowered weapon? That's not hard to find- and it's the gallente assault rifle.

First, let's look at what it's meant to be.
It's a gallente weapon; that means having the shortest range, highest damage. It's also an assault rifle, which means it's supposed to be OK at everything. While its overall effectiveness in different situations isn't something you can prove easily, let's look at the Gallente side.

I'll be comparing the Duvolle assault rifle with the Imperial Scrambler rifle
Optimal ranges (according to the range thread): since the Duvolle is plasma and the Scrambler is a pulse laser, the scrambler should have significantly more range.

• Duvolle assault rifle: 42m
• Imperial scrambler rifle: 50m

8 meters isn't very significant, especially considering the (SoonGäó) Combat rifle has to fit between them, while it's also much easier to hit with the duvolle, since it's fully automatic. Outside of effective range, the duvolle is currently the bigger threat.

Now let's look at damage:

• Duvolle assault rifle: 34.1 per shot
RoF of 750
doesn't overheat, so it does 10230 in the 24 seconds before having to stop to reload
In 5.5 seconds, that's about 2344 damage

• Imperial Scrambler rifle: 79.2 per shot
max RoF is 705.9, but it's semi automatic, and can overheat. Firing at a RoF slow enough to conserve heat, I managed to fire 16 shots in 5.5 seconds before overheating (which does damage)
Counting the overheat as a reload, that's 1267 damage in 5.5 seconds before the user has to stop.

Going off of that, in the time it takes for the scrambler rifle (if fired carefully) to overheat, the duvolle does nearly twice the damage, at nearly the same range, while taking much less practice to use.

A few quick, less in-depth comparisons to other weapons:
Compared to the HMG, the assault rifle has more range and is more accurate. With the spread of HMG bullets, the AR also seems to deal more damage.
Compared to the shotgun, the assault rifle hits much more consistently (against a moving target), and at a much longer range.
Compared to the mass driver, the assault rifle takes less practice, or more effective against shield tanked people (almost all of them) and lasts longer before running out of ammo
Compared to the laser rifle, the assault rifle has comparable range and damage, while lacking the overheat and being more effective in CQC
Compared to the flaylock pistol (I don't want to compare it to a sidearm, but someone is bound to bring it up), the assault rifle has much longer range, is easier to hit with, and can fire for much longer before reloading.
On the current maps, most sniper positions can be now easily shot by assault rifles


The gallente assault rifle needs to be gallente- short ranged. It already has gallente damage, and takes no skill to use.

It has the same absolute range as a laser, which is supposed to have much much much more range.

I've been in beta for a long time, and I've literally heard every weapon be called overpowered (well, the plasma cannon was one of those things where people expected it to be OP before it was released). More often then not, it's an exaggeration.

But the real overpowered weapon? That's not hard to find- and it's the gallente assault rifle.

First, let's look at what it's meant to be.
It's a gallente weapon; that means having the shortest range, highest damage. It's also an assault rifle, which means it's supposed to be OK at everything. While its overall effectiveness in different situations isn't something you can prove easily, let's look at the Gallente side.

I'll be comparing the Duvolle assault rifle with the Imperial Scrambler rifle
Optimal ranges (according to the range thread): since the Duvolle is plasma and the Scrambler is a pulse laser, the scrambler should have significantly more range.

• Duvolle assault rifle: 42m
• Imperial scrambler rifle: 50m

8 meters isn't very significant, especially considering the (SoonGäó) Combat rifle has to fit between them, while it's also much easier to hit with the duvolle, since it's fully automatic. Outside of effective range, the duvolle is currently the bigger threat.

Now let's look at damage:

• Duvolle assault rifle: 34.1 per shot
RoF of 750
doesn't overheat, so it does 10230 in the 24 seconds before having to stop to reload
In 5.5 seconds, that's about 2344 damage

• Imperial Scrambler rifle: 79.2 per shot
max RoF is 705.9, but it's semi automatic, and can overheat. Firing at a RoF slow enough to conserve heat, I managed to fire 16 shots in 5.5 seconds before overheating (which does damage)
Counting the overheat as a reload, that's 1267 damage in 5.5 seconds before the user has to stop.

Going off of that, in the time it takes for the scrambler rifle (if fired carefully) to overheat, the duvolle does nearly twice the damage, at nearly the same range, while taking much less practice to use.

A few quick, less in-depth comparisons to other weapons:
Compared to the HMG, the assault rifle has more range and is more accurate. With the spread of HMG bullets, the AR also seems to deal more damage.
Compared to the shotgun, the assault rifle hits much more consistently (against a moving target), and at a much longer range.
Compared to the mass driver, the assault rifle takes less practice, or more effective against shield tanked people (almost all of them) and lasts longer before running out of ammo
Compared to the laser rifle, the assault rifle has comparable range and damage, while lacking the overheat and being more effective in CQC
Compared to the flaylock pistol (I don't want to compare it to a sidearm, but someone is bound to bring it up), the assault rifle has much longer range, is easier to hit with, and can fire for much longer before reloading.
On the current maps, most sniper positions can be now easily shot by assault rifles


The gallente assault rifle needs to be gallente- short ranged. It already has gallente damage, and takes no skill to use.

Yeah, we already knew this, but Remnant stating that the AR is a placeholder confirmed it. The AR has Gallente DPS, Minmatar ROF, and Caldari/Amarr range. It's not OP because its easy mode, the AR is just too versatile because its the best of 4 worlds in one weapon class. Hopefully, this issue will be resolved once all the racial rifles with their own strengths/weaknesses are added and the AR Plasma Rifle becomes the short range, high DPS hybrid weapon it was supposed to be.

Totally agree with no downside, near pinpoint accuracy, and virtually no recoil, the gar is the most powerfull weapon in the game by a long shot.

That being said.

The gar is also the most used weapon in the game by assault players the most numerous and vocal of the players in dust, fixing this would instantly be called out as an 'unfair nerf' and generate a tsunami of tears and qq threads not to mention an increase of 'dust is doomed' threads by said butthurt players who dispite throwing around the phrase : 'adapt or die'when other weapons and classes get the shaft, would be unwilling to do so.

We all know why the gar hasn't been fixed and it's got nothing to do with balance.

You misunderstood what he said... the varients are placeholders. IE the AR is the gallente version...the tact is the amarr...the burst is the minmatar and the breach is the caldari. This is what was meant by the dev.

Totally agree with no downside, near pinpoint accuracy, and virtually no recoil, the gar is the most powerfull weapon in the game by a long shot.

That being said.

The gar is also the most used weapon in the game by assault players the most numerous and vocal of the players in dust, fixing this would instantly be called out as an 'unfair nerf' and generate a tsunami of tears and qq threads not to mention an increase of 'dust is doomed' threads by said butthurt players who dispite throwing around the phrase : 'adapt or die'when other weapons and classes get the shaft, would be unwilling to do so.

We all know why the gar hasn't been fixed and it's got nothing to do with balance.

Explains the situation perfectly.

I remember when the recoil was fixed (they used to have laser-like accuracy no matter how long you fired it) the forum fallout was huge.

Its not the meant to have the shortest range of all weapon, just the shortest range for assault rifles.

Come on semperfi the Duvolle eats scrambler and I'm an avid scrambler wielder, I love that gun, but every time I step in front of some one with an AR or HMG I back the hell off. The scrambler is good at a distance and thankfully has a red dot sight (thanks so much ccp) which is why I always make distance between me and anyone I'm trying to hit.

There is no way a single shot weapon can compare with something you can just hold down and spray for a little while in a close range battle, I've tried it.

Explains the situation perfectly.

I remember when the recoil was fixed (they used to have laser-like accuracy no matter how long you fired it) the forum fallout was huge.

See I never though the TAC was a placeholder for Amarr, if anything I felt the standard AR was an Amarr placeholder.

The devs have stated caldari is getting the rail rifle, which is long range low damage. I just figured TAC was the closest we have to that.

I'm almost positive the Breach is supposed to be the Gallente Plasma Blaster.

The Burst is the Minmatar combat rifle.

That's how I've always thought it was, at least.

Just gonna chime in again here.

Where is everyone getting that the standard AR is the Gallente AR? Can someone give me a link, because no where in its description does it say that it's Gallente

:/

Just gonna chime in again here.

Where is everyone getting that the standard AR is the Gallente AR? Can someone give me a link, because no where in its description does it say that it's Gallente

:/

If nothing else check the prices. The racial varient that is specific for that race is less expensive then the alternate varients meant to copy other racial types. Imp scrambler is cheaper than the assault scrambler.....the plasma assault rifle is cheaper than the tact/burst/breach rifles. This along with some other things I have read leads me to believe this but......I could be wrong....either way i dont think is makes that big of a difference.

I think the two of you are looking from rose-tinted glasses, as it were. You're seeing the world through the forums - I've been in plenty of random squads with players who know nothing of the forums or the mechanics of the game and continue to play. CCP is not afraid of making unpopular decisions in their time and place. The game is still in a fairly heavy development phase and is going to be a continued work in project, just like any MMO and any tactical game. Balances will shift as new ideas are brought to the table and as new technology is introduced to the game.

I just started browsing the forum and while there is plenty of use here by players and plenty of players posting, I've been surprised by the tone. The game is free, for the most part. CCP engages its players in a way that most game companies do not and actively introduce player-drive content and ideas into their products. They take risks, plenty of them. CCP has never set out to make the most popular games, they seek to create innovative ways to experience gaming mechanics within a community and everything that goes with that (afkers, scammers, etc). Yes, Dust needs some work but why not think like a designer and a player and give some cred where its due rather than trite comments that do nothing to further the game that we are all playing to enjoy and help enhance the community instead? Just my two cents. I'm probably an *******.

duvolle is op, yup. the only gun that I dislike getting killed by at long range. yup, it's always the duvolle. the easiest weapon with a lot of damage to use. way to go guys.

What must you think of the scrambler since its more accurate, with higher dmg, less recoil/disperion, better sight, and faster reload. (range is similar).

This is even further proof of your fail. You enjoy strawman arguments dont you? The issue had nothing to do with recoil. AR users were upset about the weapon sight that was used (absolutely horrible ADS sight for the longest time on the AR). This was a legitimate issue. Noone that can even be considered remotely good complained about the recoil on the AR...infact we were calling for the recoil to be added back to the AR. Its the ppl who were arguing against the ppl who were complaining about the weapon sights that said all the complaints were about the recoil. Basically if you fell for that tactic then I hope you dont vote because that is just a horrible ability of discernment. The sights were horrible and have recently been made better. They are at least decent sights now so no more complaints about that as they probably couldnt get any better (this is due to CCP issues as they could still be better but its probably the best they will get).

So McBob what random argument with no basis are you going to pull out of your butt next? Will you actually provide an argument that will at least take me more then 5 seconds to see that you are using false data or shows that you have a complete ineptidude for math skills?

I think the two of you are looking from rose-tinted glasses, as it were. You're seeing the world through the forums - I've been in plenty of random squads with players who know nothing of the forums or the mechanics of the game and continue to play. CCP is not afraid of making unpopular decisions in their time and place. The game is still in a fairly heavy development phase and is going to be a continued work in project, just like any MMO and any tactical game. Balances will shift as new ideas are brought to the table and as new technology is introduced to the game.

I just started browsing the forum and while there is plenty of use here by players and plenty of players posting, I've been surprised by the tone. The game is free, for the most part. CCP engages its players in a way that most game companies do not and actively introduce player-drive content and ideas into their products. They take risks, plenty of them. CCP has never set out to make the most popular games, they seek to create innovative ways to experience gaming mechanics within a community and everything that goes with that (afkers, scammers, etc). Yes, Dust needs some work but why not think like a designer and a player and give some cred where its due rather than trite comments that do nothing to further the game that we are all playing to enjoy and help enhance the community instead? Just my two cents. I'm probably an *******.

People never want to take the SP system into account when claiming OP or UP. We aren't allowed to alter our choices, you're stuck with whatever you go for. Surprise surprise if more people are using the tried and true instead of investing deeply into a weapon that they may or may like / that may or may not get hit with the nerf nuke.

This isn't directed at you Semper, just stating that because you don't see something all the time in every game (or if you do) doesn't necessarily dictate how OP or UP it is. There's lots more going on, not just in the gun game and numbers, but also in player psychology and habits.

You're the dumabsses who asked for ironsights

I play the game- I see assault rifles dominating every niche except sniping and AV

The gar is also the most used weapon in the game by assault players the most numerous and vocal of the players in dust, fixing this would instantly be called out as an 'unfair nerf' and generate a tsunami of tears and qq threads not to mention an increase of 'dust is doomed' threads by said butthurt players who dispite throwing around the phrase : 'adapt or die'when other weapons and classes get the shaft, would be unwilling to do so.

We all know why the gar hasn't been fixed and it's got nothing to do with balance.

This was another reason I went with the scrambler. Its less SP to spec into is pretty deeply since you dont have to spec into the 2 different recoil/dispersion reducing skills (which reduces recoil/dispersion to similar levels of the scramblers base lvl).

You're the dumabsses who asked for ironsights

Wrong there was only a couple of ppl who asked for ironsights. Noone with was even mediocre in skill or above asked for iron sights. So what the 5% who wanted iron sights means that the entire group of players who use this weapon can be blamed for requesting iron sights? That makes a lot of sense...........please before you open you mouth again at least use the search system and look up all those old threads to refresh your obviously poor memory.

I was for customizable sights, having the option to use red dot, iron sight , acog whatever.. just having the option for the one to your liking. instead my rifle got just iron. I actually quit playing for 4 months after that lol. Now i'm over it and used to the irons

I've been in beta for a long time, and I've literally heard every weapon be called overpowered (well, the plasma cannon was one of those things where people expected it to be OP before it was released). More often then not, it's an exaggeration.

But the real overpowered weapon? That's not hard to find- and it's the gallente assault rifle.

First, let's look at what it's meant to be.
It's a gallente weapon; that means having the shortest range, highest damage. It's also an assault rifle, which means it's supposed to be OK at everything. While its overall effectiveness in different situations isn't something you can prove easily, let's look at the Gallente side.

I'll be comparing the Duvolle assault rifle with the Imperial Scrambler rifle
Optimal ranges (according to the range thread): since the Duvolle is plasma and the Scrambler is a pulse laser, the scrambler should have significantly more range.

• Duvolle assault rifle: 42m
• Imperial scrambler rifle: 50m

8 meters isn't very significant, especially considering the (SoonGäó) Combat rifle has to fit between them, while it's also much easier to hit with the duvolle, since it's fully automatic. Outside of effective range, the duvolle is currently the bigger threat.

Now let's look at damage:

• Duvolle assault rifle: 34.1 per shot
RoF of 750
doesn't overheat, so it does 10230 in the 24 seconds before having to stop to reload
In 5.5 seconds, that's about 2344 damage

• Imperial Scrambler rifle: 79.2 per shot
max RoF is 705.9, but it's semi automatic, and can overheat. Firing at a RoF slow enough to conserve heat, I managed to fire 16 shots in 5.5 seconds before overheating (which does damage)
Counting the overheat as a reload, that's 1267 damage in 5.5 seconds before the user has to stop.

Going off of that, in the time it takes for the scrambler rifle (if fired carefully) to overheat, the duvolle does nearly twice the damage, at nearly the same range, while taking much less practice to use.

A few quick, less in-depth comparisons to other weapons:
Compared to the HMG, the assault rifle has more range and is more accurate. With the spread of HMG bullets, the AR also seems to deal more damage.
Compared to the shotgun, the assault rifle hits much more consistently (against a moving target), and at a much longer range.
Compared to the mass driver, the assault rifle takes less practice, or more effective against shield tanked people (almost all of them) and lasts longer before running out of ammo
Compared to the laser rifle, the assault rifle has comparable range and damage, while lacking the overheat and being more effective in CQC
Compared to the flaylock pistol (I don't want to compare it to a sidearm, but someone is bound to bring it up), the assault rifle has much longer range, is easier to hit with, and can fire for much longer before reloading.
On the current maps, most sniper positions can be now easily shot by assault rifles


The gallente assault rifle needs to be gallente- short ranged. It already has gallente damage, and takes no skill to use.

Something I forgot to mention: you can improve the assault rifle more than any other light weapon.

Sharpshooter makes a huge difference

Your right it does.....it brings it to the level of the assault scrambler rifle. So you can spec into the sharpshooter to make the plasma rifle as effective as the scrambler in terms of recoil/dispersion. Goodjob...you spent 1.5ish mill SP to get the same effectiveness of a starter scrambler rifle (in terms of recoil/dispersion).

The SR has a downside: it's overheat it can injure or outright kill you if used incorrectly this is it's balance.

The AR has no downside besides slightly less damage then the SR which matters very little with it being so accurate.

No jamming mechanic

No overheat

No reduced ammo capacity

Nothing, no downside that I can see, and literally the easiest weapon to skill into.

easiest weapon to skill into? wth, maybe for the basic lvl 1 with no other side skills

Hell the gar is the only weapon that requires weaponry level 1 in it's class

It's not a Gallente Rifle, and if you're crying about the SP difference between Weaponry 1 and 3.....I just.....

Change it. Go for it. Make it lv 5. It's so petty and minor....

I can't believe I used to be on your side of the fence

:/

For shame.

The SR has a downside: it's overheat it can injure or outright kill you if used incorrectly this is it's balance.

The AR has no downside besides slightly less damage then the SR which matters very little with it being so accurate.

No jamming mechanic

No overheat

No reduced ammo capacity

Nothing, no downside that I can see, and literally the easiest weapon to skill into.

Oh and it is indeed a gallente rifle

The only possible indication for that is the art, and basically everything is a placeholder right now, so.

The gar has been confirmed as a gallente weapon by the devs.....

The look of the rifle is that of gallente.......

They are made by duvolle laboratories......

The gar has been confirmed as a gallente weapon by the devs.....

The look of the rifle is that of gallente.......

They are made by duvolle laboratories......

Pretty sure you are misunderstanding him. Right now the gallente have 4 variations. (one that is their own and then 3 copies of other racial varients). Fiend does not know if the specific racial version for gallente is supposed to be the AR or the burst AR. Personally I think its the AR but he is just not sure and that is what he is questioning. Every race will have 4 varients of the AR with 1 being more specific to their race and 3 being copies of other racial varients........I think that the easiest way to tell is probably see what varient is the least expensive..that is probably the varient for that specific race. It would make sense that the varients that are copies of other racial varients would be more expensive.

Overheat takes 1.5 mags.....I dont know about you but I have usually killed all of the enemies in my area by the time I have used this many shots......either that or I am dead already.

If your talking about the imp scrambler....well yea after 20 shots you have to wait if you dont want to overheat....but then again after 18 you have to reload the tact rifle so...............

In the end you point is meaningless. 1.5 mags of continuous fire to overheat actually means nothing in battle. I have to purposefully overheat the assault scrambler as I NEVER get even close to overheating it in actual combat. Well to be honest if you are talking about a downside to the scrambler.....the scrambler has no downside either. I dont rememeber the fittings but it might be that the scrambler takes a little more PG to fit but it takes less CPU while AR takes more CPU but less PG. The scrambler has the plasma rifle beat in every way.

Do i need to repeat myself? Its has a larger mag, faster reload, higher accuracy, less SP cost to skill into (has same recoil/dispersion from start that the AR gets after speccing fully into its tree), higher dmg (especially against shields which most ppl tank), similar ROF, similar range, better sight.............. only downfall the potential to overheat if you are ret@rded and cant release the trigger button after 1.5 mags and it costs 30K isk more per weapon.....what dont you understand about this? The numbers prove that the scrambler is better.

The Gallenta Plasma Blaster is the Gallente rifle

The look is a place holder.

Every other AR that is a placeholder is made by Duvolle laboratories.

Just saying, standard AR is not Gallente AR. Crappy mc crap crap Breach AR is Gallente.

The automatic ar is the gallente weapon.

Gallente ar=full auto

Minmatar combat rifle=burst

Ammarian SR= tactical

Calldari rail rifle= breach

The automatic ar is the lente weapon of choice everything else is a copy of the other racial ARs.

At this point based on your reasoning on why the scrambler is balanced (the fact that is can potentially overheat even though noone other than a moron would actually be able to overheat the scrambler rifle)......this means one could argue that the plasma AR is balanced because of the reload glitch and you have a chance to not reload your gun after the completed reload animation causing you to have to initiate reload a second time. I have not had this issue at ALL with the scrambler but had it constantly with the AR. This would indicate that the AR is perfectly balanced because it has something that will rarely if ever be seen in an actual combat situation but if it does happen completely screws over the user.

I can hit dudes from 50+km out in my megathron with large neutron blaster II


you make my assault rifle shoot with the range of an smg or shotgun, I'm out. and i'm sure plenty will follow

That is a bug, not a game mechanic, and I'm sure it will be fixed in time.

I'm speaking of an actual mechanic that give the ar a downside, overheat, jamming or something of the like.

Also I'm pretty sure that that goes for all weapons and is caused mainly by lag,I've certainly had it with my mass driver, probably wrong though and if this is truly a mistake on the devs part it needs to be fixed imediatly.

I was mainly being rediculous for a reason. It would be fine with me if you add a jamming mechanic where if you shoot 108 plasma bullets without stopping (other than to reload) then you will cause a problem with the gun that you have to take a few seconds to correct. In the end it means nothing. Assault scrambler users will NEVER overheat their gun.....its just not possible in actual combat to do that unless you are just a freaking moron with no aim whatsoever (currently takes about 108 shots stopping only to reload in order to overheat the assault scrambler). So if you make the "jamming" issue with the plasma gun act exactly the same then fine....noone will ever worry about it but at least it will look good on paper.

Isn't the Breach AR the primary Gallente AR?

Gallente - Breach
Amarr - Scrambler
Minmatar - Burst
Caldari - TAC

The "normal" AR is just that, it's just kind of there. I pray that they keep working on the breach variant, because the range fix did very little to help this weapon when coupled with the roller skates we got. The ROF is way too low for its damage and complete lack of anything resembling range.

The Gallenta Plasma Blaster is the Gallente rifle

The look is a place holder.

Every other AR that is a placeholder is made by Duvolle laboratories.

Just saying, standard AR is not Gallente AR. Crappy mc crap crap Breach AR is Gallente.

*shrugs* personally I think the ASR needs to overheat faster but that's just me.

Having a downside mechanic you actually have to monitor would be good for both weapons I think.

It has been Confirmed by CCp repeatedly.

Breach AR-Caldari Placeholder

Burst AR-Minmatar Placeholder

TAR- ScR Mockup

Standard AR- Gallante AR, Not the Gallante Placeholder.

All I know is they said the rail rifle is supposed to be Caldari, which has long range low damage, not high damage low range like the breach.

It's pointless semantics until 8097 when they're released anyways. The standard AR as we know it will likely not even exist come then. (especially if the TAR was supposed to be the SCRAM >_<)

The kept the TAR cause every AR will have those Variants eventually.

And since the nonvariant ScR is considered the real ScR, you would think that the Nonvariant GAR would be the real GAR.

Just saying...

You're all probably right, I just thought Gallente battle doctrine was to get up close and personal with Blasters and tear things apart with high, close range DPS.

Assuming your Drones haven't ripped them to shreds, that is.

Now that we have more Variety coming our way, they could Nerf the Range, and give the New Guns Less DPS *Looks at Breach*

The Breach is so amazingly bad now that we have rollerskates :/ Seriously, go try it out. I've messed with so many kinds of fits to make this thing worth half a damn and I just can't get it to be worth anything. I was hoping the range fix would help it by letting project out a bit further, but everyone runs around so fast now the horrific RoF on it makes half of your shots miss because the HD is still meh.

I dunno, here's hoping in 12090 when things get fully released we'll see some interesting, and more importantly, useful, changes to the Breach, whether for the Loldari or the glorious Gallente.

Honestly not even sure why a downside mechanic must be involved at all? Its just to try to make the guns "seem" unique when they are really just replicas of guns already in the game. CCP knew that 1.5 mag overheat would not matter. They made the overheating mechanic for the imp scrmb and then nerfed the tac such that its alot lower than the scrambler so its overheating means nothing if all other similar guns have to reload after 18 shots when you overheat at 21. Basically the overheating was a gimick they made to stay "true to new Eden" while making it not actually matter in game. The MD doesnt have a "bad round" negative where you have a potential for the nade to get stuck and blow up inside the gun....I could go on but you get the point.

So I assume that you will be complaining about the combat rifle and the rail rifle not having some kind of overheat/jamming mechanic right?

Your right it does.....it brings it to the level of the assault scrambler rifle. So you can spec into the sharpshooter to make the plasma rifle as effective as the scrambler in terms of recoil/dispersion. Goodjob...you spent 1.5ish mill SP to get the same effectiveness of a starter scrambler rifle (in terms of recoil/dispersion).

The automatic ar is the gallente weapon.

Gallente ar=full auto

Minmatar combat rifle=burst

Ammarian SR= tactical

Calldari rail rifle= breach

The automatic ar is the lente weapon of choice everything else is a copy of the other racial ARs.

I was mainly being rediculous for a reason. It would be fine with me if you add a jamming mechanic where if you shoot 108 plasma bullets without stopping (other than to reload) then you will cause a problem with the gun that you have to take a few seconds to correct. In the end it means nothing. Intelligent Assault scrambler users will NEVER overheat their gun.....its just not possible in actual combat to do that unless you are just a freaking moron with no aim whatsoever (currently takes about 108 shots stopping only to reload in order to overheat the assault scrambler). So if you make the "jamming" issue with the plasma gun act exactly the same then fine....noone will ever worry about it but at least it will look good on paper.

I've wanted overheat or bullet jam on Assault Rifles for forever.

As a born again AR user, I still stand by that.

So I assume that you will be complaining about the combat rifle and the rail rifle not having some kind of overheat/jamming mechanic right?

Yup ^-^ every weapon and item should have a negative to it in my opinion. It just makes sense.

I'll be using the combat rifle when it comes for I am a minja and minja want combat rifle, but should it not have a downside to it I'll set my love for it aside and request a downside for it.

These things make the game diverse and more challenging, I for one don't want to see proto logis with duvolles running this game forever, I want things to be fixed (plasma cannon) and for there to be no 'best' fit but seeing players using what they enjoy and not have to spec into certain things just to be able to compete.

Don't you?

P.S:having the combat rifle jam would:

A=make sense

And

B=be funny as hell

So I assume that you will be complaining about the combat rifle and the rail rifle not having some kind of overheat/jamming mechanic right?

I find it to be a stupid mechanic but hey make the mechanics fit the game. TBH calling this game challenging is a laugh. If by challenging you mean having to deal with all the bugs that STILL exist in this game since I started playing in beta (August of last year) then yes this game is challenging. If you mean challenging as in the competition thats just a laugh. This is the easiest FPS I have ever played in terms of competition...the average player base in this game is way below most FPS games.

I find it to be a stupid mechanic but hey make the mechanics fit the game. TBH calling this game challenging is a laugh. If by challenging you mean having to deal with all the bugs that STILL exist in this game since I started playing in beta (August of last year) then yes this game is challenging. If you mean challenging as in the competition thats just a laugh. This is the easiest FPS I have ever played in terms of competition...the average player base in this game is way below most FPS games.

Aww so negative :(

If you believe the game too easy wouldn't the best thing to do is attempt to make it more challenging?

That's the purpose of the forums yes? To share ideas and improve the game right?

Since I've been in dust I've seen many things change to make it more 'new guy' friendly.

The flattened health across suits, and the damage reduction throughout weapon levels come to mind.

If we have a chance to support something to make the game a bit more challenging shouldn't we?

I believe this is a dumb reason to add a "weapon jam feature" or whatever. But like I have said if its put to the lvl of the current assault scrambler it doesnt even really matter as only the morons will have to worry about this issue. If CCP did this then I would just chalk it up to 1 more stupid decision they have made as this game creeps ever so slowly towards oblivion.

Rail Rifle= long range =Tac AR
Breach and STD AR = Plasma Rifle

Give jamming to Rail Rifle and Plasma Rifle
Overheat to the ScR and CoR(like the HMG overheat)

Btw guys, thanks for absolutely obliterating my notifications, not sure if I got an answer for anything else or not

Give jamming to Rail Rifle and Plasma Rifle
Overheat to the ScR and CoR(like the HMG overheat)

The Breach is Caldari (IT makes me Fear for us RPers)

Or you could use the Gauss or Combat rifles... they have range but you have to give up something like DPS, ROF, or clip size. It's called a trade off.

And I could also use the sniper rifle, the flaylock. the forge gun, the scrambler rifle, the laser rifle , swarm launcher or any other gun in the game.. your point?

I use the auto AR, it gets turned to complete **** and is equal to a submachine gun I will quit. There is no more respecs, and I will not "adapt or die" , I will simply walk away.

Rail Rifle= long range =Tac AR
Breach and STD AR = Plasma Rifle

And I could also use the sniper rifle, the flaylock. the forge gun, the scrambler rifle, the laser rifle , swarm launcher or any other gun in the game.. your point?

I use the auto AR, it gets turned to complete **** and is equal to a submachine gun I will quit. There is no more respecs, and I will not "adapt or die" , I will simply walk away.

We already have the racial TAR. You never heard of the ScR?

I'm pretty sure that when they split up the AR, they're going to refund any SP invested. Also, I don't think they're going to nerf the range too hard or at all. Maybe an extreme damage falloff outside of optimal.

Gallente weapons are supposed to have short range. If you don't like it, don't use gallente weapons.

I could live with some decrease in range, my optimal is usually 30m anyhow. I just don't want an assault submachine gun in an assault rifle body, and that's what a lot of people basically want them to become.

And they are out ranged by a variety of weapons on here( don't you dare say TAC, I could care less if that thing disapeared from the database). And don't try to preach to me about gallente weapons, I have probably seen more combat using blasters over the last several years more than you I bet

Then explain to me why TARs have far more range than scrambler rifles.