roflmao omg really ..i never thought i would see another one of these thread xD lovely ccp this thread is not what u wanna base your patches off of please no lol

It seems that it's impossible to take down a proper fitted HAV. They stomp infantry so quickly that often it's impossible to even get a single AV grenade out. But it doesn't matter much, because the HAV's can anyway tank 5+ AV grenades. The militia forge gun. The standard AV weapons are a complete joke. They can't take out a HAV by any chance at all. I once shot a full forge gun clip and threw 3 av grenades at an armor tanked HAV, and he must have laughed as he drove a little away, tanked the damage I had done in a few seconds, and killed me. Do I really have to spec up in AV to take out a tank? I don't have to spec up in anything to take out a protosuit, I've done that many times with a militia fit. But HAV's can take a ridiculous amount of damage from standard AV weapons, drive a little away, out of range of AV grenades, in about three seconds. After that he just tanks the damage as he shoots you. I often see people driving tanks with 15+/0 kd ratios.

AV weapons are supposed to counter HAV's and LAV's. Not be laughed at, as they just tank the damage and shoot you.

(militia HAV's are not thought of in this entry, only standard or higher)

I must admit I've changed my mind somewhat. The best fix would be better matchmaking.

tanks are completely 100% soloable by anyone with the right gear and i havnt seen a tank run anything and /0 with me on the field or any competent av spec in like 3 months and before that only the best tankers could pull it off without massive support

My point was that not everyone has "the right gear". But it's probably better solved through proper matchmaking


Exactly. And it's the other way around for new mercs, and veteran tank players.

Yeah, it really frustrates me when people think they're underpowered. You're not supposed to be invincible in them. And well, i'm just trying to start a relevant discussion so people can actually end up agreeing.

Player ignorance it the problem. I've said this tons of times and I don't feel like going through my post history again to find the quote, so I'll paraphrase it:
The core problem with HAV and AV was infantry never took AV seriously. While they were focused on being anti-infantry and ignoring AV, HAV pilots invested all their SP into tanks. In a game where narrowing down into specific specializations rewards you, tanks were nearly unkillable because AV was ignored. If something is powerful, has an effective counter that exists, yet people ignore it, is it truly OP? Tankers got to be the best at what they were while infantry complained, wondering why they couldn't kill a Segaris or Surya with militia swarm launchers and forge guns, or even try to solo one with AV grenades and in the end CCP nerfed tankers for playing the game correctly. If that doesn't show how balancing is a joke in this game, I don't know what is.

It seems that it's impossible to take down a proper fitted HAV. They stomp infantry so quickly that often it's impossible to even get a single AV grenade out. But it doesn't matter much, because the HAV's can anyway tank 5+ AV grenades. The militia forge gun. The standard AV weapons are a complete joke. They can't take out a HAV by any chance at all. I once shot a full forge gun clip and threw 3 av grenades at an armor tanked HAV, and he must have laughed as he drove a little away, tanked the damage I had done in a few seconds, and killed me. Do I really have to spec up in AV to take out a tank? I don't have to spec up in anything to take out a protosuit, I've done that many times with a militia fit. But HAV's can take a ridiculous amount of damage from standard AV weapons, drive a little away, out of range of AV grenades, in about three seconds. After that he just tanks the damage as he shoots you. I often see people driving tanks with 15+/0 kd ratios.

AV weapons are supposed to counter HAV's and LAV's. Not be laughed at, as they just tank the damage and shoot you.

(militia HAV's are not thought of in this entry, only standard or higher)

No you're not being sarcastic. Stop doing personal attacks and actually argue against me.

And I don't think it's wrong for a 600 isk setup to be able to take out a 2.1million isk HAV. If a 600 isk setup can take out a 200k isk proto setup, by being better at aiming, I don't see why it's wrong for a militia AV person to be able to take out a 2.1million isk tank with superior tactics. As i keep saying

But right now it's outright impossible, the HAV can just eat all the bullets and tank it away. In fact a swarm launcher only removes around 1/8 of a HAV's armor/shield. Which means you'd have to have about five people to take down a tank. Meanwhile those five people can't counter the other foot troops, because swarmlaunchers and forge guns are horrible against them. It's incredibly easy to take out the AV troops, while they're trying to take out the tanks. Forge gun troops are completely immobile while charging, making it impossible to defend themselves. Meanwhile the HAV is incredibly mobile, and can just drive around the corner and do a armor/shield rep, if the damage is really a problem at all.

This is really frustrating for new players. Try making more people play dust when they basically are totally useless against tanks for the first few months. Yes. First few months. If you're supposed to counter HAV's with 1million sp setups, it'll take more than a month in passive sp just for the AV setup. But people don't want to have to level up in anti-tank, just to be able to have the slightest chance against a HAV.

No, I don't misunderstand the game mechanics. In other games, like Halo, or Planetside 2, it isn't impossible for anti-vehicle infantry to take out tanks solo, so why should it in Dust?

Do I really have to spec up in AV to take out a tank?

Can't believe this topic is still going....

Let me guess: you were probably going against one of the following tankers:

Mortedeamor, Slap26, psychotic shooter, 0 try harder, void echo, general grodd, exmaple, earl james, fighter4all, movado, and maybe ten more. Now, that's less than 20 out of every single tanker in the game. Believe me, it is not tanks that are overpowered; it is the players. I urge you to buy an aurum tank and with proto turrets and see if you can last 4 minutes without redline sniping. Believe me, after dropships, lasers, and mass drivers, tanks are probably the hardest weapons to use in this game.

You're probably new to this game and I understand that, but you will find that if you skill into even ADV level AV, youll be able to solo 95% of HAVs you encounter and any good tanker or AV player will tell you that.

Before you call for nerfs, try out that weapon system and learn it inside and out. If you find that it truly has no weaknesses, it is OP.

I'm sorry to hear that your militia AV isn't killing STD and ADV tanks... Yes you do have to put in close to 1 million sp to get Proto AV to 4 shot my 13 mil sp tank... I'm so sorry you have to waste so much SP >.<

HTFU

First of all, thanks for being so hostile, this community certainly needs more of that.

Now about SP. It shouldn't matter if you don't have any skillpoints. You're supposed to have an advantage with more skillpoints yes, but there's not supposed to be such a big difference that it's impossible to take out a HAV. That you've spent 13mil skillpoints and 2 million isk on tanks doesn't make you entitled to win anytime over anyone who spent less skillpoints than you at AV stuff. Skill is supposed to come into play, but it just doesn't matter when it comes to the HAV's.

I know a friend of mine doesn't want to play this game due to how unbalanced tanks are. Not everyone has 1m skillpoints to waste on AV, and certainly not the patience for it either.


There's no universal rule that says it has to be that way. Spending more isk should give you an advantage, not make you invincible.

Exer after reading first few pages I had to stop and reply:
You sound like a complete douche canoe.
That is all.

dust is fuckn diffrent to halo and all that ****. i've said this a few times nw. IF YOU WANT TO KILL A WELL FITTED TANK/ OR GOOD TANK DRIVER YOU NEED TO BE ON PAR WITH HIS MODULES. IE YOUR GOING TO NEED AT LEAST ADV FOR A CHANCE AT MAKEING A KILL. PROTO TO HAVE AN EXXELENT CHANCE AT KILLING HIM. MILLITA AND STANDARD ARE JUST GOING TO MAKE US LAUCH AND EVENTUALLY **** US OFF TO THE POINT WE KEEP BEATING THE CRAP OUT OF YOU. AND LASTLY IN WAHT WORLD IS IT POSSIBLE WE A SMALL HAND HELD WEAPON IS GOING TO BRING DOWN A LARGE TANK WITH A BIG GUN.

I don't buy that proto-tank argument. You'd have 2 squads going AV just to take down one if the tank has Infantry support, while the rest of the team is swarmed because of superior numbers. It would just be Chrome-Ambush 2.0.