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A challenge to all the UVT complainers out there.

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Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:07:00 - [1] - Quote I've posted this challenge in one of the Feedback/Requests threads as well, but I think it deserves a topic of its own. Corp voice chat now requires players to buy UVTs for access. Apparently this is a "problem" and a "mistake" because "every game" has this functionality for free. These claims are blatantly and provably false, and I'm here to explain why. I'm also willing to back up my claims with a nice challenge to anyone who reads through this thread and still thinks I'm wrong. And, in the spirit of not being an idiot, I'm willing to concede the point if someone beats me at my challenge. So, without further ado, my reasoning, starting with a pair of itemised lists comparing standard voice communication functionality with the free voice comms in the current state of the DUST 514 beta. *The list of what MOST games offer* 1. Voice chat in most games is restricted to - at most - the battle/mission you're currently involved with. You can't talk with players who are fighting in other battles. 2. Voice chat in most games is limited to your team only - sometimes to your squad (another term might be used for a subset of the team). Sometimes - but not always - they add proximity chat with enemy players on top of the team/squad chat. Sometimes they offer advanced functionality like separate voice channels for the whole team and for individual squads. 3. Voice Chat in most games is available when you're grouped with your teammates in a team or squad, and is limited to the team/squad you're in. You can talk to other players without needing to be in a battle, or even actively searching for one, but you have a limit on the number of players you can speak with based on the number of players a team or squad can hold. *The list of what DUST 514 offers for free, based on the above list* 1. The free voice chat in DUST, like the free chat in most other games, is limited to the current battle. This is normal and reasonable. 2. The free voice chat in DUST, like the free chat in most other games, is limited to only your team. Unlike some games, you don't get prox chat with enemies, but this isn't a standard feature, just an added extra that has drawbacks as well as benefits. Also, DUST includes the other common extra feature of dual-channel voice chat, allowing players to access chat with their entire team, or limit their voice comms to block everyone except their own squadmates. 3. The free voice chat in DUST, like the free chat in most other games, is available outside of missions when you're part of a squad. At the moment, we don't have the ability to search for games as a full team, so whole-team voice outside of battle doesn't (yet) exist, but I'm hopeful that this will become an option in the future. From the above, you should be able to see that DUST 514 does, in fact, offer the standard expected voice chat options that most other games come with. So what's the "important" feature that people are missing out on? Why are we complaining that we don't get out free corp chat? Lets take a look at what Corp chat is. in EVE Online, and by extension, in DUST 514, "Corporation" is the in-game term used to denote a formal group of players. Most console FPS gamers are familiar with the term "clan" having the same (or at least similar) meaning. For the MMO crowd, it's usually a "guild" - but there's a good chance of games in either genre (or any other genre for that matter) to have unique terms for the concept. So, basically, Corp chat means you're able to speak with anyone in your "clan" or "guild" who's online and in-game. Because some corporations are cross-game corps, this means you can have DUST players and EVE players in the same chat channel speaking with one another. But only if both of you have UVTs. Problem? I don't think so. And now, the moment you've all been waiting for... MY CHALLENGE You're all welcome to join in. ANYONE who thinks I'm wrong can provide the name of ONE game which has an in-game "clan chat" or "guild chat" feature that gives players FREE access to voice comms with their clanmates even while those players are in separate missions/battles/gameplay environments. In order to negate your example, and prove that the majority of games DON'T have a free equivalent to Corp chat, I'm prepared to provide the names of FIVE games which don't have the feature for every ONE game that's posted in this thread which does include it. Simple rules: 1. Obviously, if you lie, I will be looking up the game(s) named to confirm, and you will be caught out. So don't do that. 2. Current-gen only. This means the game must be no older than the XBox 360 console, but the game can exist on any major current-gen gaming platform. For these purposes, even though both have been superceded, the Nintendo DS and PSP can be counted as current-gen consoles, because for at least part of the time period we're looking at, they WERE current-gen consoles. 3. There must be a reason for the game to include voice chat. The original Assassin's Creed can't be used by me as an example of a game without a "clan chat" function, even though it's in a series with clan support, because that particular release was single-player only. 4. Good luck.
fred orpaul Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising 211	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:17:00 - [2] - Quote EVE online yes I know subscription based. THIS IS WHAT YOU PEOPLE GET for wanting dust to not be like eve(lost steam). meh what ever as long as it works out to less then my monthly subscription to eve for all three implants.
fred orpaul Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising 211	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:19:00 - [3] - Quote I can give you three free voice chat programs.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:21:00 - [4] - Quote fred orpaul wrote: EVE online yes I know subscription based. THIS IS WHAT YOU PEOPLE GET for wanting dust to not be like eve(lost steam). meh what ever as long as it works out to less then my monthly subscription to eve for all three implants. I somehow knew EVE would be the first game on the list. Here's my first 5. 1. Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood 2. Assassin's Creed: Revelations 3. Assassin's Creed 3 4. Transformers: War for Cybertron 5. Transformers: Fall of Cybertron Not only do none of the listed games not have a "clan chat" feature, 4/5 don't have any clan functionality implemented, and the one that does requires out-of-game interactions to make the clan functions work.
ICECREAMK1NG WARRIORS 1NC 391	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:29:00 - [5] - Quote TLDR. Increase stupidly small squad size, allow squads of more than 1 into same game. Then there is not really a problem. As it stands it is a problem. If I were CCP I'd keep squad sizes etc. as they are, so I could take the pi55 and charge for more than 4 people to be able to talk in game. Forgetting the uvt for a moment, the whole comms set up on this game is crap. Which is why you never hear any one in game apart from your 3 friends. EDIT... In fact we only use SKYPE when playing for these reasons. Never done this before in any online game. Right now i have 2 redundant headsets.
Ima Leet Imperfects Negative-Feedback 321	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:39:00 - [6] - Quote DCUO right? its been a while but i'm pretty sure i could voice chat with my League no matter where any of us are BTW, i dont care if i'm right or wrong lol just throwing something out there
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:41:00 - [7] - Quote ICECREAMK1NG wrote: TLDR. Not sure why you bothered posting when you don't even know what the thread is about. But I'll run with it. Quote: Increase stupidly small squad size, allow squads of more than 1 into same game. That was addressed in the OP. Quote: Forgetting the uvt for a moment, the whole comms set up on this game is crap. No. It just doesn't explain the system well, so most players either don't turn voice on at all, or don't know how to use it effectively if they do. Quote: Which is why you never hear any one in game apart from your 3 friends. No, YOU only hear YOUR 3 friends because of this: Quote: EDIT... In fact we only use SKYPE when playing for these reasons. Never done this before in any online game. Right now i have 2 redundant headsets. Not even using the in-game voice means you won't hear anyone in game. Funny that. When I've been in a squad that queue-synced with friendlies and ended up on the same team, we all moved to team chat and had 10/12 players communicating on mic. Two full squads who queue-synced, and a couple of randoms who heard all the talking and picked up their own mics.
SATORI CORUSCANTi Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 253	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:53:00 - [8] - Quote tl;dr Just because other games suck doesn't mean DUST should have to follow suit. Give us our corp voice back.
ICECREAMK1NG WARRIORS 1NC 391	Posted - 2012.12.19 03:55:00 - [9] - Quote Say what you want, twist what you want, IDC. This is the worst comms setup, invite / join game / squad / group / add / mail etc I've ever had to use online. Which is why we don't, we did FYI try to use them when we started months ago, now we just don't really bother. So charge away CCP, there are always idiots who'll pay. Ask Mr imbango care of. Bank of Nigeria.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.12.19 04:11:00 - [10] - Quote ICECREAMK1NG wrote: This is the worst comms setup, invite / join game / squad / group / add / mail etc I've ever had to use online. I definitely think that voice comms should default to "on", PTT should default to "off" and you should be put into the Team channel by default on entering a battle, instead of frequently being auto-assigned to squad chat. Fix those problems, and the majority of the game's other issues should take care of themselves. The basic functionality required to make a good team-based voice chat system is there. It's just that the default settings are all wrong and there's not enough in-game explanation for anything, so nobody even knows there's something to fix without being told, and even then, they often don't know what to fix or how. Further explanation should be provided by the game, and the defaults for basically everything comms-related need to be reversed. But can we go back on topic now please?

Ima Leet Imperfects Negative-Feedback 321	Posted - 2012.12.19 04:46:00 - [11] - Quote Ima Leet wrote: DCUO right? its been a while but i'm pretty sure i could voice chat with my League no matter where any of us are BTW, i dont care if i'm right or wrong lol just throwing something out there
Enji Elric Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Zombie Ninja Space Bears 176	Posted - 2012.12.19 04:49:00 - [12] - Quote for those of you with a pc anywhere near your ps3 I propose this option http://www.ventrilo.com/download.php or convince a company, whose sole purpose is to make a profit, to not make a profit ........ good luck
DJINN leukoplast Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 288	Posted - 2012.12.19 04:59:00 - [13] - Quote Bottom line is, it was free to use before and now we have to pay real money for it. NOBODY should be defending this. Seriously, you like having to pay money where you did not before? There is no gain here, it's 100% loss. As for the reasoning about this supporting CCP, I seriously doubt this was even remotely necessary, there is so many other Aurum items on the market that people spend tons of cash on. All this does it give CCP a tiny bit more money and hurt the corps, because not everybody will be able to buy the UVT on a regular basis, or at all. I for one will likely refuse to ever buy Aurum again because of this. It's a cheap move, plain and simple. Next they are going to start charging AUR to adjust the settings for my controller... or to change the brightness/audio options. Or, how about this, you will have to pay a monthly Aurum fee to use weapons above standard grade. Hey it's still f2p, you just need to use real cash to advance further than standard gear. Give them an inch, and they WILL take a mile. The more people support this kind of thing, the more CCP will be able to screw us over and get away with it.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.12.19 05:04:00 - [14] - Quote Ima Leet wrote: DCUO right? its been a while but i'm pretty sure i could voice chat with my League no matter where any of us are BTW, i dont care if i'm right or wrong lol just throwing something out there According to this, free accounts don't get voice chat, and Premium accounts only get proximity voice chat. You have to pay extra to get voice outside of party chat.
Enji Elric Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Zombie Ninja Space Bears 176	Posted - 2012.12.19 05:07:00 - [15] - Quote DJINN leukoplast wrote: Bottom line is, it was free to use before and now we have to pay real money for it. NOBODY should be defending this. Seriously, you like having to pay money where you did not before? There is no gain here, it's 100% loss. As for the reasoning about this supporting CCP, I seriously doubt this was even remotely necessary, there is so many other Aurum items on the market that people spend tons of cash on. All this does it give CCP a tiny bit more money and hurt the corps, because not everybody will be able to buy the UVT on a regular basis, or at all. I for one will likely refuse to ever buy Aurum again because of this. It's a cheap move, plain and simple. Next they are going to start charging AUR to adjust the settings for my controller... or to change the brightness/audio options. Or, how about this, you will have to pay a monthly Aurum fee to use weapons above standard grade. Hey it's still f2p, you just need to use real cash to advance further than standard gear. Give them an inch, and they WILL take a mile. The more people support this kind of thing, the more CCP will be able to screw us over and get away with it. You are wrong sir. Proof --- https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=263211#post263211 and it is still in a testing phase... so you didnt have to spend AUR to use it last build.... oh well their bad... guess what. You are complaining that they fixed something. Made it work properly. HTFU
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.12.19 05:11:00 - [16] - Quote DJINN leukoplast wrote: Bottom line is, it was free to use before and now we have to pay real money for it. NOBODY should be defending this. It was free before. While being specifically promoted as NOT being free when it was. Making the free state of the service a bug, and not intended functionality. Quote: Seriously, you like having to pay money where you did not before? There is no gain here, it's 100% loss. If you were getting free cable because of a mix-up, and it got fixed, would you complain and demand free cable because you had it before? Same thing here. Quote: As for the reasoning about this supporting CCP, I seriously doubt this was even remotely necessary, there is so many other Aurum items on the market that people spend tons of cash on. All this does it give CCP a tiny bit more money and hurt the corps, because not everybody will be able to buy the UVT on a regular basis, or at all. Have you even looked into the full details of that side of the argument? It doesn't sound like you have. AUR items are the game's profit, NOT cost-covering tools for the voice chat service which CCP have to pay for. In-game voice, where you're talking to other DUST players in the same battle as you, can be run directly via PSN, and those costs are part of the agreement between Sony and CCP. The corporation chat handles EVE/DUST interaction, which requires it to run via the voice service CCP use for EVE, which they pay for through a third party. That costs money, and the UVT is meant to offset/cover the cost of that service.
DJINN leukoplast Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 288	Posted - 2012.12.19 06:16:00 - [17] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: If you were getting free cable because of a mix-up, and it got fixed, would you complain and demand free cable because you had it before? Same thing here. It's the principle of the thing that makes this so bad. From what I know, the corp voice has been free since the betas release. Interesting it took them so long to fix something that was likely an easy fix. Saying it was a glitch/bug is just an escape clause. So when, and if, they do charge for it they can say "Hey look, we said it was a glitch!" But that doesn't mean they should have gone through with it. As it shows sleazy business practice on their end. Quote: Have you even looked into the full details of that side of the argument? It doesn't sound like you have. AUR items are the game's profit, NOT cost-covering tools for the voice chat service which CCP have to pay for. In-game voice, where you're talking to other DUST players in the same battle as you, can be run directly via PSN, and those costs are part of the agreement between Sony and CCP. The corporation chat handles EVE/DUST interaction, which requires it to run via the voice service CCP use for EVE, which they pay for through a third party. That costs money, and the UVT is meant to offset/cover the cost of that service. Cost is cost. Whether I buy Aurum for weapons purchases or for the UVT, it all goes to the same place and then gets spent on what needs to be paid out. And seriously, it's a f2p game, everything they are doing is costing them money. The game engine, any agreements they have with Sony and the PSN, their own ISP and net costs, running and maintaining servers, paying the devs, paying the electric bills etc etc. But is everything in the game done by micro Aurum purchases to cover all these costs? Is their a subscription fee? Is the game going to cost $60 up-front on release? No. It is being paid by the Aurum people purchase for weapons, boosters, merc packs, etc etc. It was not necessary in the least to charge for corp voice, as those costs were already being taken care of elsewhere. And is a slap in the face to their players. You ever wonder why the UVT price for the 1 day, 7 day and 30 day were all the same? You think it was a unintentional glitch? Possibly, but I figure they were testing the players and whether or not people would foolishly buy the 1 day UVT for the same price as the 30 day UVT. They were likely testing the players and their gullibility to fork over the same amount of money for a lesser product. I feel this is not much different, as they are probably seeing if the player base accepts this or not after getting it for free for so long. And if we do accept it, then they know they can do it for other things and get away with it.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.12.19 06:53:00 - [18] - Quote DJINN leukoplast wrote: It's the principle of the thing that makes this so bad. From what I know, the corp voice has been free since the betas release. Interesting it took them so long to fix something that was likely an easy fix. From the beginning of the beta when we didn't even have player-created corporations and were all in NPC corporations, back when UVTs didn't exist and neither did corp voice chat? Quote: Saying it was a glitch/bug is just an escape clause. So when, and if, they do charge for it they can say "Hey look, we said it was a glitch!" CCP explained, when UVTs were first introduced, that they were a requirement for ANY voice chat outside of team and squad chat. That specifically included corp chat. They said that WHEN CORP VOICE WAS ADDED. That's how it was ALWAYS meant to work. That's how they've advertised the system to work ALL ALONG. Quote: Cost is cost. Whether I buy Aurum for weapons purchases or for the UVT, it all goes to the same place and then gets spent on what needs to be paid out. When you spend money buying Aurum, it goes to CCP. When you buy that UVT, you're linked to their (paid) voice server that lets you connect with EVE players. That connection requires CCP to spend some of the money they have to provide you with that connection to that voice chat server. As a result, that portion of your Aurum purchase which you spent on the UVT is now going to another company in order to cover the cost of the service you're being provided. Quote: And seriously, it's a f2p game, everything they are doing is costing them money. The game engine, any agreements they have with Sony and the PSN, their own ISP and net costs, running and maintaining servers, paying the devs, paying the electric bills etc etc. Internal costs and third-party costs are separate. This isn't money they're paying to their staff, or money they're spending on assets for the company. it's money being paid to another company for an ongoing service that the other company is providing indirectly via the game client. Quote: You ever wonder why the UVT price for the 1 day, 7 day and 30 day were all the same? You think it was a unintentional glitch? Possibly, but I figure they were testing the players and whether or not people would foolishly buy the 1 day UVT for the same price as the 30 day UVT. They were likely testing the players and their gullibility to fork over the same amount of money for a lesser product. I feel this is not much different, as they are probably seeing if the player base accepts this or not after getting it for free for so long. And if we do accept it, then they know they can do it for other things and get away with it. They specifically said that, while testing the UVT, they've made them all the same (very low) price because they're wanting people to test the system and see how it works and what it does. They're actively trying to make people use UVTs. They've also said that a UVT-like item that unlocks corp voice for the entire corporation with a single purchase is something they're looking into as a possibility - it's not confirmed, but it's being considered, so hopefully that will happen.
Enji Elric Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Zombie Ninja Space Bears 176	Posted - 2012.12.19 07:11:00 - [19] - Quote djinn you dont read do you? devs already explained the purchase price the reasoning behind the old cost of 1AUR the reason they were all priced the same.......... ur trollin'
Sparten 269 Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 89	Posted - 2012.12.19 07:29:00 - [20] - Quote Skipped the wall of text I can name three special comms every good corp may use. TEAMSPEAK VENT SKYPE

Moonracer2000 Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 311	Posted - 2012.12.19 07:40:00 - [21] - Quote That was an extremely thorough argument. I agree there is a definite level of gamer entitlement going on here. I think the UVT chat requirement is a bad idea for a totally different reason. Mainly that I think adding more pay to enjoy (and sometimes arguably pay to win) feature requirements to the beta problematic. This is especially problematic to create these requirements before the player market is added to the game. I don't see why CCP couldn't have waited till a player market was open and or wait for release. Corp chat enables player communication beyond team chat that can be very useful for testing. Corp chat is a valuable tool for setting your corp up for a corp match (so a corp with mostly non paying testers may have a disadvantage getting organized quickly). So yes, Corp channel voice chat is special and fine it can cost the player base some money to use. Lets just not limit channels of communication that might add to testing during the beta. And lets not punish the beta testers who didn't pay to test.
Needless Sacermendor Red Fox Brigade 208	Posted - 2012.12.19 15:03:00 - [22] - Quote I'm just agreeing with everything Garett has said ... he's already made all the points I would have made having read people's objections to the corp chat UVT requirement ... it just wasn't ment to be that way. But I also agree with Moonracer to a degree, but the problem with his idea is that these AURUM items need to be tested properly aswell, so we can give feedback if they're OP, overpriced, or just unnecessary. As Garrett has said, we can't say the corp chat UVT requirement is unnecessary ... CCP knows what that mechanic costs them and we've been lucky to have it for free during Codex build. Technically it's still free until release as the AURUM we're spending isn't actually what we've paid for, it's just an opportunity to test what we will spend our AURUM on when we get the proper stuff at release.
xAckie Ahrendee Mercenaries Legacy Rising 125	Posted - 2012.12.19 15:24:00 - [23] - Quote Needless Sacermendor wrote: I'm just agreeing with everything Garett has said ... he's already made all the points I would have made having read people's objections to the corp chat UVT requirement ... it just wasn't ment to be that way. But I also agree with Moonracer to a degree, but the problem with his idea is that these AURUM items need to be tested properly aswell, so we can give feedback if they're OP, overpriced, or just unnecessary. As Garrett has said, we can't say the corp chat UVT requirement is unnecessary ... CCP knows what that mechanic costs them and we've been lucky to have it for free during Codex build. Technically it's still free until release as the AURUM we're spending isn't actually what we've paid for, it's just an opportunity to test what we will spend our AURUM on when we get the proper stuff at release. businesses don't charge for everything that costs as separate units. What often they do is offer free 'coffee' so you actually enter, stay, and spend more in the shop, covering the cost of the coffee. The idea in this game is to create a social gaming experience. Voice communication is key - particularly to get new people who wont have invested anything in to it to try it out - it being F2P - and can easily walk away from it with no loss. other fact is everyone will jkust move to free alternatives or Teamspeak like previous builds. It creates a wall against the social aspect. Cant be bothered to read the full wall of text by OP, but I think he is in favour of paid UVT. He is wrong in my opinion for the above. And he asked one game that had clan chat? MAG Oh and I have UVT
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 893	Posted - 2012.12.19 15:30:00 - [24] - Quote In my opinion the main issue is that there is no option to purchase a corp-wide UVT that is specifically for the Corp Chat channel. If this were available and reasonably priced then many of the problems would be solved. Requiring each individual corp member to purchase a UVT is problematic for a variety of reasons.
fahrenheitM Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION 212	Posted - 2012.12.19 15:30:00 - [25] - Quote xAckie wrote: Needless Sacermendor wrote: I'm just agreeing with everything Garett has said ... he's already made all the points I would have made having read people's objections to the corp chat UVT requirement ... it just wasn't ment to be that way. But I also agree with Moonracer to a degree, but the problem with his idea is that these AURUM items need to be tested properly aswell, so we can give feedback if they're OP, overpriced, or just unnecessary. As Garrett has said, we can't say the corp chat UVT requirement is unnecessary ... CCP knows what that mechanic costs them and we've been lucky to have it for free during Codex build. Technically it's still free until release as the AURUM we're spending isn't actually what we've paid for, it's just an opportunity to test what we will spend our AURUM on when we get the proper stuff at release. businesses don't charge for everything that costs as separate units. What often they do is offer free 'coffee' so you actually enter, stay, and spend more in the shop, covering the cost of the coffee. The idea in this game is to create a social gaming experience. Voice communication is key - particularly to get new people who wont have invested anything in to it to try it out - it being F2P - and can easily walk away from it with no loss. other fact is everyone will jkust move to free alternatives or Teamspeak like previous builds. It creates a wall against the social aspect. Cant be bothered to read the full wall of text by OP, but I think he is in favour of paid UVT. He is wrong in my opinion for the above. And he asked one game that had clan chat? MAG Oh and I have UVT MAG had clan chat? News to me. Unless you're talking about being in the clan deploy room, which didn't happen tell loooong after release, and really isn't a true clan chat.
fahrenheitM Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION 212	Posted - 2012.12.19 15:31:00 - [26] - Quote Hell MAG didn't even have a clan text chat to communicate.
fahrenheitM Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION 212	Posted - 2012.12.19 15:32:00 - [27] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: In my opinion the main issue is that there is no option to purchase a corp-wide UVT that is specifically for the Corp Chat channel. If this were available and reasonably priced then many of the problems would be solved. Requiring each individual corp member to purchase a UVT is problematic for a variety of reasons. CCP alluded to there being such an item in the future.
xAckie Ahrendee Mercenaries Legacy Rising 125	Posted - 2012.12.19 15:34:00 - [28] - Quote fahrenheitM wrote: Hell MAG didn't even have a clan text chat to communicate. unless I am mistaken, we could have voice before going into squads and deploying - as a full group. And am pretty sure we could move voice back and forth between choosing squads. Long time since I played but remember listening to everyone in a v large clan before deploying
fahrenheitM Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION 212	Posted - 2012.12.19 15:46:00 - [29] - Quote xAckie wrote: fahrenheitM wrote: Hell MAG didn't even have a clan text chat to communicate. unless I am mistaken, we could have voice before going into squads and deploying - as a full group. And am pretty sure we could move voice back and forth between choosing squads. Long time since I played but remember listening to everyone in a v large clan before deploying Your group could speak. But there was no clan text or clan voice in MAG. That's why we used PSN chats out of game to organize.
Django Quik R.I.f.t 219	Posted - 2012.12.19 16:15:00 - [30] - Quote You make the point that it's the fact that corp chat can crossover to Eve players that is the reason CCP have to use a third party system, costing them money, which we should have to pay for - how about instead of charging Dust players for chatting to other Dust players in their corps, they just make it so you only have to pay to chat between Dust and Eve players? When we eventually get actual full integraton and Eve players are in our teams in actual matches, will we not be able to talk to them on teamchat without UVT?



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