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Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 18:41:00 - [1] - Quote So, I start a pub match off in my scout sprinting like a bat out of hades to give my team a edge.... hack 1 and rush to enemy point.... die, after killing 2. Cool now we got 2 out of 4 points, fight on! So now I step into defense of blue objective in an assault! 4 kills in, and the zerg comes?! No worries! I got that zerg fix! Now at this point there's 6 enemy on a blinking home point, two shield tanks roving, and a dropship?! Enter Madruger Gv.0! I rush the first shield tank, one hardener and heat sink on, and boom! Start deterring troops from friendly point, and two friendlies spawn in tank guns blazing as they jump out! We retake the point, and here comes another shield tank! We battle it out, and I win, barely, and retreat to the red line burning?! I recover mods and health, only to see 3 more tanks on the field. I ask for assistance on the tanks, and my buddy screams "I'm down at B, AV on the way bro!" We roll up, after he spawns in the tank, and bang 2 of 3 tanks with turrets! Third tank gets me as we bail out?! I jump out gal logi dropping links, scans, and shooting, and my buddy gets the tank in a dying effort with swarms! As the match winds down we win by clones and 2 ticks on mcc! Great match, and well fought on both sides! We start talking about payouts, and reveling in the battle.... a small voice whispers.... 749,000 isk whoo hoo! Wow bro what were you doing? Logi! He was repping the entire match! He went 0/15, no assist, and 6500+ war points for a payout of 750k! What in the actual **** CCP! He essentially watch people die while milking their bodies for points?! Now I know a lot of logis will somehow justify how he was helping, but seriously in this battle everyone he was repping died tons! I heard him say he didn't have a needle, only rep tool, ammo, and links. He didn't pick up anyone in that case and setup, which would've been much more viable. We were down to 22 clones so yes, needle please! I manage to blow up 4 tanks, go 17/14/10, and dropped links, scans, and used a needle for a total of 473k??? What about that reptool is so isk producing? How come the actual fighters don't get paid more for actually winning the fight? This, to me, has bred a group of players more concerned with their own personal wallets than winning the battle?! If they win they get paid, and if they lose they still get paid.... and in most cases more than some of the winning members?! I always argue that the needle is more tactically beneficial than the rep tool, and logis argue that the rep tool is worth more "for keeping guys up"?! No it's not?! I kill heavy/logi tandems all the time! So they usually put more than one reptool on one heavy?! I see 3 sometimes 4 logis repping multiple heavies. This is part of the problem, I believe, as to why so many fights end up in red line stomps before the losing team loses shield on the mcc. So many players are just counting their wallets, and saying "nope, it's a loss". It's worth more to them to lose, and not die, than to push to win. Essentially the match was a loss for me, and my logi "friend" made bank?! On my upgrades skill tree section I have literally everything but shields and reptool. I'm Gallente everything so no shields right now. We can debate that later. I find it more useful for me, as a gal logi, to finish targets first then apply buddy aid with a needle.... ya know, like we do in the army shrugs common sense and all. Now the glitchy issues with reviving players with a needle needs to be looked at so the tool is more desirable. The bonus points for using better needles is nice, but is no comparison to the point whring capabilities of the the reptool. I would move for complete removal of the reptool, but you know this community and their crutches. As it stands the cal sentinel, and all caldari, need no reptool. My favorite kind of sentinel! If he falls pick him up with the 80% needle, and that's a fresh heavy again. The caldari got this right! Sense it won't be removed, which would give CCP more room for stuff we actually need, can we curtail the amount of isk you receive for essentially waiting for the match to be over and holding R1?? A fighter humbly ask for consideration so the fight in dust can come back to the pubs. Also, the next logi I catch repping my gal scout for points when I only have 200+ armor, I'll kill you myself! Shoot something you ****! Your faster than an assault, with more tank than a scout, and 4 equipment slots! Come on man! Curious to hear from actual logis (who fight and use equipment) and fighters! Also, to other roles on the field, how do you feel? https://youtu.be/CK5iYkTGJZs Good video of logis at work! https://youtu.be/OAA60D8g_28 Aother great video of a true logi at work, and this was before the buff! o7 "Anybody order chaos?"
Krixus Flux Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 896	Posted - 2015.07.17 18:45:00 - [2] - Quote So you're the kid who got presents too when it was your sibling's birthday party huh? Saying what's on people's minds
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 18:52:00 - [3] - Quote Krixus Flux wrote: So you're the kid who got presents too when it was your sibling's birthday party huh? Defuse my argument, or move on. Usually when most mercs have no argument they instead make light of the issue in hopes that no one notices the problem. Tell me what any guy repping the entire match on dying mercy did o deserve 750k? Not you, but the merc in the match above? "Anybody order chaos?"
Golden Day Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 2	Posted - 2015.07.17 19:08:00 - [4] - Quote I'm pretty sure the 6500+ WP and the win helped out in his payout..... Im just a glorified blueberry
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 19:13:00 - [5] - Quote Golden Day wrote: I'm pretty sure the 6500+ WP and the win helped out in his payout..... His squad dropped one OB, and he missed...... "Anybody order chaos?"
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 19:14:00 - [6] - Quote Anyone not scared to **** off logis? "Anybody order chaos?"
Vitharr Foebane 2	Posted - 2015.07.17 19:20:00 - [7] - Quote you wanna know why most logis dont pack needles anymore? KD whores(like yourself im sure) whined and whined and whined that logis were ruining their precious KD and made it so you cant pick someone up unless they ask for it. By the way next to noone requests a revive. Amarr Omnisoldier: Assault, Commando, Logistics, Scout, Sentinel at V My faith is in my God, my Empress, and my Laz0r
Logi Bro Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 3	Posted - 2015.07.17 19:24:00 - [8] - Quote I can't really understand what your point is. Personally, I don't like logi's who do nothing but carry around a rep tool the entire game, because I think they are pussies, but that's really the only reason that I don't like them. Somewhere in this mess of a post it seems like you are blaming them for the loss of an entire team, and that just isn't true. SP Sinks? Fixed.
No-one-ganks like-Gaston Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 307	Posted - 2015.07.17 19:25:00 - [9] - Quote I agreed with you at first about someone who was only going logi to make bank being detrimental to the team. But then you started whining and saying things should be done based entirely off your opinion. Like removing the rep tool. And you know very ******* well that, in the army, if they had some sort of tool that could heal their soldiers as they were getting shot they would use the fck* out of it, and there would be several dedicated healers in every troupe. Don't give us this bull **** about how in the army you guys do it differently than a futuristic sci-fi game does. Of course you f*cking do. You don't have nearly the same capabilities as this imaginary future army does. Go stick a needle up your ass if you want one so bad, and don't compare video game logistics priorities to actual people who actually get hurt and actually die.
Talos Vagheitan Ancient Exiles. 2	Posted - 2015.07.17 19:47:00 - [10] - Quote No-one-ganks like-Gaston wrote: I agreed with you at first about someone who was only going logi to make bank being detrimental to the team. But then you started whining and saying things should be done based entirely off your opinion. Like removing the rep tool. And you know very ******* well that, in the army, if they had some sort of tool that could heal their soldiers as they were getting shot they would use the fck* out of it, and there would be several dedicated healers in every troupe. Don't give us this bull **** about how in the army you guys do it differently than a futuristic sci-fi game does. Of course you fcking do. You don't have nearly the same capabilities as this imaginary future army does. Go stick a needle up your ass if you want one so bad, and don't compare video game logistics priorities to actual people who actually get hurt and actually die. This escalated quickly Official CPM Platform*

Lightning35 Delta514 48TH SPECIAL OPERATIONS FORCE 965	Posted - 2015.07.17 20:12:00 - [11] - Quote Repping gives you 25wp. It should be 15. Maybe 10. If not enough, I'm ok with 5. CEO of 48th Special Operations Force Twitter-@48SOF Scout and Assault GK.0/Rattati and Scotsman GK.0 OFF/EXP GEAR
Krixus Flux Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 901	Posted - 2015.07.17 20:19:00 - [12] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Krixus Flux wrote: So you're the kid who got presents too when it was your sibling's birthday party huh? Defuse my argument, or move on. Usually when most mercs have no argument they instead make light of the issue in hopes that no one notices the problem. Tell me what any guy repping the entire match on dying mercs did to deserve 750k? Not you, but the merc in the match above? Dude. Its not that serious. Your argument is silly. You asking why the most defenseless mercenary on the field, putting his life on the line supporting the team, is getting more money than others who are not. The argument is childish dude. Saying what's on people's minds
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 20:24:00 - [13] - Quote 0-15 isnt really helping, but based on the current payout system 6500 wp is how you get paid. I still feel that rep tools, while already having a wp threshold, should also have a capacitor or overheat function to prevent spam, as well as a sort of diminishing return based on how many rep tools ar3 active on a single target. To counter your argument, smart reps, coupled with players who know when to stop getting shot, is a valuable asset to the way the game is currently played. You cant fault players for using this system any more than you can fault players for using the strongest fotm fit rather than using elevated skill to augment their playing. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
Radiant Pancake3 Destinys Immortals Rise Of Legion. 426	Posted - 2015.07.17 20:45:00 - [14] - Quote Wait....... There are no "MLT Logi" Suits.. Standard and ADV have the same as their proto... if he was in an amarr logi he could only have 3 slots... Also amarr are pretty much suppress fire logis... Since they have a light and sidearm... if he had any std logi there is no reason for him not to carry a needle... you can have reps hive links and a needle... also wut Gaston said... Also Gaston if our modern Military had "The equipment like dust" Wouldn't you think they would carry our needle? But still you can't compare sci-fi to our Military but if our Military had our sci-fi items they would abuse the hell out of the needles whilst getting shot at just as much as abusing our rep tools... Personal Manager of Destinys Immortals Join Logi Heaven! Chat: "Triage Ward" Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ Minmatar Loyalist Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 20:47:00 - [15] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: I can't really understand what your point is. Personally, I don't like logi's who do nothing but carry around a rep tool the entire game, because I think they are pussies, but that's really the only reason that I don't like them. Somewhere in this mess of a post it seems like you are blaming them for the loss of an entire team, and that just isn't true. We won "Anybody order chaos?"
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 20:56:00 - [16] - Quote Krixus Flux wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Krixus Flux wrote: So you're the kid who got presents too when it was your sibling's birthday party huh? Defuse my argument, or move on. Usually when most mercs have no argument they instead make light of the issue in hopes that no one notices the problem. Tell me what any guy repping the entire match on dying mercs did to deserve 750k? Not you, but the merc in the match above? Dude. Its not that serious. Your argument is silly. You asking why the most defenseless mercenary on the field, putting his life on the line supporting the team, is getting more money than others who are not. The argument is childish dude. I was in a gal logi when I got seven of those 17 kills.... "Anybody order chaos?"
IceShifter Childhaspawn Rebels New Republic The Ditanian Alliance 721	Posted - 2015.07.17 21:40:00 - [17] - Quote Maybe we rep because we don't have a gun game. Maybe we rep because we WANT our squad to have ammo, links that aren't 15 second timers, or a proto scanner to keep them aware. Maybe Im thankful I get that payout when I die 10 times in a suit carrying proto scan, hives, links and my favorite FW repper. Sprinting around in a scout suit sounds fun. Shooting the Jump fit Officer MD fits sounds fun too, I cannot. I die. I come back and still help my squad however I can and that huge payout SOMETIMES helps me break even. Ill work on that running away (not getting shot) thing, but I cant leave my squad behind. Have fun with your tanks. It's hard to beat up hundreds of armor piercing bullets using only your face...
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 21:47:00 - [18] - Quote No-one-ganks like-Gaston wrote: I agreed with you at first about someone who was only going logi to make bank being detrimental to the team. But then you started whining and saying things should be done based entirely off your opinion. Like removing the rep tool. And you know very ******* well that, in the army, if they had some sort of tool that could heal their soldiers as they were getting shot they would use the fck* out of it, and there would be several dedicated healers in every troupe. Don't give us this bull **** about how in the army you guys do it differently than a futuristic sci-fi game does. Of course you f*cking do. You don't have nearly the same capabilities as this imaginary future army does. Go stick a needle up your ass if you want one so bad, and don't compare video game logistics priorities to actual people who actually get hurt and actually die. My reference to military tactics was to point out that, under no circumstance, will a soldier perform buddy aid while under fire! What he will do is pull his buddy to safely quickly (pick him up) if possible, ask him to perform self aid if he is capable (self reps), and help him after the firefight! As much as we like to seperate game from reality when it is convenient, the fact that tactics on a tactical shooter video game are remarkably similar! The fact that one prefers watching you take dmg while they make points like the slots, over helping you engage targets is the problem. How many matches do you see where some logi on the enemy team gets 4000+ wp on a loss at the top of the leaderboard with no kills? Then this far sack gets more isk payout over the guys who were actually trying to win? Yeah, even on a video game that backwards. "Anybody order chaos?"
Darken-Sol Intruder Excluder 2	Posted - 2015.07.17 21:51:00 - [19] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Anyone not scared to **** off logis? Get a job. Quit hatin. You should find more useful ways to contribute. Crush them
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 21:54:00 - [20] - Quote IceShifter Childhaspawn wrote: Maybe we rep because we don't have a gun game. Maybe we rep because we WANT our squad to have ammo, links that aren't 15 second timers, or a proto scanner to keep them aware. Maybe Im thankful I get that payout when I die 10 times in a suit carrying proto scan, hives, links and my favorite FW repper. Sprinting around in a scout suit sounds fun. Shooting the Jump fit Officer MD fits sounds fun too, I cannot. I die. I come back and still help my squad however I can and that huge payout SOMETIMES helps me break even. Ill work on that running away (not getting shot) thing, but I cant leave my squad behind. Have fun with your tanks. That's fine, but if you drop links, use needles, scan, and drop ammo at the same time to support the fight, the scrub who just reps will get paid more without any of those! That's the problem! I am a gal logi, and do all of those things. Lucky for me I know how to shoot too, but even if you don't, support can be rendered through equipment and support fire.... but your payout would be less?! However, if you rep, without doing any off the other 4, you'll be paid more? Why? Because points on the rep tools rack up! Even with advanced rep tools. The logi that's actually helping the team, for real, will get paid less because the other tools yield less points consistantly. Put a rep tool on an assault, and see if you don't get paid more lol! The thing is a 900k SP jackpot lol! My tank at proto cost more isk and SP, but I'll get paid less than someone with that tool? Really? "Anybody order chaos?"

Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 21:55:00 - [21] - Quote Darken-Sol wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Anyone not scared to **** off logis? Get a job. Quit hatin. You should find more useful ways to contribute. Apparently I just need a rep tool, and no spine lol! "Anybody order chaos?"
Talos Vagheitan Ancient Exiles. 2	Posted - 2015.07.17 22:01:00 - [22] - Quote I somewhat agree with what you're saying, and I've actually addressed it in some detail on this post: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2831241#post2831241 Official CPM Platform
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 22:07:00 - [23] - Quote Talos Vagheitan wrote: I somewhat agree with what you're saying, and I've actually addressed it in some detail on this post: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2831241#post2831241 This makes all the sense in the world! However, most war point "gathererers" won't agree?! Remember, watching everyone else work is hard. "Anybody order chaos?"
Talos Vagheitan Ancient Exiles. 2	Posted - 2015.07.17 22:32:00 - [24] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Talos Vagheitan wrote: I somewhat agree with what you're saying, and I've actually addressed it in some detail on this post: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2831241#post2831241 This makes all the sense in the world! However, most war point "gathererers" won't agree?! Remember, watching everyone else work is hard. Well the good news there is that I'm Primarily a Logi myself, so I have some insight on this topic. I just feel the WP can be more representative of how much you actually contribute to your team. Not to nitpick though, impossible to say precisely what a WP should be worth in all instances, but some of it is noticeably off. Official CPM Platform
No-one-ganks like-Gaston Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 311	Posted - 2015.07.17 22:37:00 - [25] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: No-one-ganks like-Gaston wrote: I agreed with you at first about someone who was only going logi to make bank being detrimental to the team. But then you started whining and saying things should be done based entirely off your opinion. Like removing the rep tool. And you know very ******* well that, in the army, if they had some sort of tool that could heal their soldiers as they were getting shot they would use the fck* out of it, and there would be several dedicated healers in every troupe. Don't give us this bull **** about how in the army you guys do it differently than a futuristic sci-fi game does. Of course you fcking do. You don't have nearly the same capabilities as this imaginary future army does. Go stick a needle up your ass if you want one so bad, and don't compare video game logistics priorities to actual people who actually get hurt and actually die. My reference to military tactics was to point out that, under no circumstance, will a soldier perform buddy aid while under fire! What he will do is pull his buddy to safely quickly (pick him up) if possible, ask him to perform self aid if he is capable (self reps), and help him after the firefight! As much as we like to seperate game from reality when it is convenient, the fact that tactics on a tactical shooter video game are remarkably similar! The fact that one prefers watching you take dmg while they make points like the slots, over helping you engage targets is the problem. How many matches do you see where some logi on the enemy team gets 4000+ wp on a loss at the top of the leaderboard with no kills? Then this far sack gets more isk payout over the guys who were actually trying to win? Yeah, even on a video game that backwards. Under no circumstances at present date with present technology**should* a soldier perform medical aid in the midst of combat, but it very likely does happen at least sometimes if the soldier is in dire need and the threat isn't too large. But are you seriously trying to say that if we had access to a magical heal-me gun that could perfectly patch up wounds as they were being inflicted that the army would not try to have at least one dedicated healer to every two or three combatant soldiers just because, at present with present technology, we drag them out of danger and ask them to tend to themselves? When, if we had the magical heal-me guns, we could just point it at him for a few seconds and he'd be right back up on his feet? Reviving someone is incredibly important, yes. But keeping guns in the fight actually is more important than putting a gun back into the fight. And I will explain it to you. You are healing your allies who are guarding the doorway and keeping enemy troops from infiltrating. A few stray bullets get through and catch the guy next to you, who was firing out the doorway to keep enemies back. He falls. You have two options here. You can keep repping the guys who are in immediate danger and making sure everyone inside the building stays alive and the point is secure until you have the time to get your fallen comrade and hope you're in time, OR you can stop for just a meager three, four, maybe five seconds while you stop healing, turn around, put the rep tool away, pull out your needle, stab the guy back into conciousness, turn back around, pull your rep tool back out a- whoops, one of the guys guarding the door got shot too much while you were busy and he is down. You're now being rushed. You can't revive the guy who got downed in the doorway without being killed, yourself, leaving the rest of your team down a vital asset and ensuring loss. You, as a logi, are literally the holding point. When you die, match over. Your only option is to pull back and hold them in the halls, but the enemy has now gained entrance to the building. How long do you think that's going to last? Even here in Dust when there's literally no risk except a point added to your KD/R, there will be small lulls in combat that are the opportune time to stick the needle to someone. And when, in Dust, there's a spawn point just a few meters away, you're probably fine with letting the guy sit for a second or two. Real life is different, though, and if you can manage to keep someone from falling in the first place, that is vastly more important. Now, I'm not saying that repping is the most defining factor in a victory. I'm not saying that people who only rep should get a free pass because 'they're helping their team'. I'm not saying not to bother with a needle because the rep tool is more important. Every logi should have a needle. A tanked commando carrying a needle would be damn amazing. Taking the hits and covering the body while he picks up a guy. Even better if he's got someone to rep him while he's under fire doing it. Hell, I'd like it if scouts who had a spare equipment slot would carry at least a basic needle if they pass by someone who needs it and wasn't double tapped. Reviving someone should only be done when it's safe for both parties. You should not rep or revive people unless you're both under cover or there are multiple allies around to draw away fire. Tagging behind someone with a rep tool for the sole purpose of letting them get hit is a ** thing to do. But it's sheer stupidity to say the rep tool should be removed just because some ***** is using it to farm your teammates for ISK and SP and he's... making more than you.
jane stalin free dropships for newbs 368	Posted - 2015.07.17 22:41:00 - [26] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: So, He was repping the entire match! He went 0/15, no assist, and 6500+ war points for a payout of 750k! What in the actual ** CCP! He essentially watch people die while milking their bodies for points?! The was a nerf the rep tool post and I agreed with the consensus that the warpoint bonus should be reduced from 25 to 15, I do get more war points than slayers and that is unfair However I would suggest you reduce the emotion in your complaints in this forum, People will just mock you for a being a whiny ***
No-one-ganks like-Gaston Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 313	Posted - 2015.07.17 22:43:00 - [27] - Quote Now, I get what you're saying. The payout for being a 'dedicated' repper is tremendous. And generally more than the people who actually work for their pay get. But you need to work on how you phrase things, because you're mostly coming off as whining.
Thokk Nightshade Montana Militia 1	Posted - 2015.07.17 22:47:00 - [28] - Quote I will use a rep tool occasionally when I logi. It is "better money" to use a basic/standard one than a proto because the longer you rep, the more WP you get. If they want to fix rep tools, just change the WP they give based on the equipment Proto: 25 Adv: 15 Std/Mlt: 5 See if more people don't break out proto rep tools if they want to rep. They will repair faster so less WP gained per and there is an excuse to do something OTHER than just rep the whole time and milk points off teammates. Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
JARREL THOMAS Dead Man's Game 818	Posted - 2015.07.17 23:11:00 - [29] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: I can't really understand what your point is. Personally, I don't like logi's who do nothing but carry around a rep tool the entire game, because I think they are pussies. wait a second... And bradic I don't understand what your trying to prove. You want to Nerf logins? Improve reward system? Or tell us about a past event that doesn't matter or happens often enough to matter? Meh don't care. Caldari Loyalist. ( -í° -£-û -í°) No.
Vesta Opalus Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 886	Posted - 2015.07.17 23:15:00 - [30] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Stuff Thats peanuts, brother. Ive made 1.5 million and some change from a public match as a logi before. Everyone knows repair tool and uplinks give way too many points (and nanohives give way too few).

Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 11	Posted - 2015.07.17 23:25:00 - [31] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: I can't really understand what your point is. Personally, I don't like logi's who do nothing but carry around a rep tool the entire game, because I think they are pussies, but that's really the only reason that I don't like them. Somewhere in this mess of a post it seems like you are blaming them for the loss of an entire team, and that just isn't true. THE GREAT LOGIBRO HAS SPOKEN! Sgt Kirk's Official Propaganda Youtube Channel
Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2	Posted - 2015.07.17 23:26:00 - [32] - Quote I find it funny that this community has gotten to the point of jealousy over something as petty as ISK payouts... Glad I left you losers. Home at Last <3
Veg Hegirin DUST University Ivy League 100	Posted - 2015.07.17 23:39:00 - [33] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: He essentially watch people die while milking their bodies for points?! Now I know a lot of logis will somehow justify how he was helping, but seriously in this battle everyone he was repping died tons! Because they could get back into battle quicker? You don't understand the value of a rep tool and I weep for you. Go play 100 games of trying to win through logi and you might start to understand. Bradric Banewolf wrote: What about that reptool is so isk producing? How come the actual fighters don't get paid more for actually winning the fight? Action is inherently more gratifying than logistics. High WP return is both a reward and a reflection, of the fact that you act as a force multiplier, and how well you performed said role. The fact that you think killers are the only thing that win the game shows that you have no appreciation for how a team wins a game. Which team do you think is more likely to win: The team made up of 16 assaults and heavies all competing for kills, constantly running out of ammo and grenades, waiting 30s for their HP to regen, and with 15s spawn timers at uplinks that're practically in the redline The team with a proper tanker+repper combo playing point defense somewhere important, scouts running around the back lines picking off stragglers and uplinks, assaults to keep back the horde, and logi to ensurse speedy reinforcements and keep their teams ammo and HP topped up. Bradric Banewolf wrote: I always argue that the needle is more tactically beneficial than the rep tool, and logis argue that the rep tool is worth more "for keeping guys up"?! No it's not?! I kill heavy/logi tandems all the time! Being alone with 3+ plates and a compact nanohive... you appreciate start to appreciate just how much time a rep tool saves you. All the different kinds of equipment have a use, all of them are useful to run, especially on a logi, depending on the situation. I can understand why you think a rep tool isn't useful. I prefer to run a needle or a nanohive on my assault suits, pretty much the only equipment I wouldn't consider is a rep tool: having a rep out means not being able to shoot; repping involves switching your mindset from hunter-killer to hide-and-cower; in a combat suit you're tankier and closer to the front line where all the corpses are; and mostly trying to play both the logistics and combat games at once splits your attention, making you about -¡-+ as effective at either Bradric Banewolf wrote: This, to me, has bred a group of players more concerned with their own personal wallets than winning the battle? I could say the same thing about people more concerned about their KD than winning the battle. But seriously, that statement is equivalent to "Other people should waste their money so that I can feel like I've won, because my enjoyment is more important than theirs". Srsly. I'm as self-centered as you are, I get it, but please stop shitting on other people just because you lost. It's unattractive. Bradric Banewolf wrote: Essentially the match was a loss for me Because you ran a ******* Prototype Tank. You've got nobody to blame but yourself for losing the isk war. TL;DR Most kills doesn't automatically make you MVP Scrub-a-dub-dub
Sergeant Sazu Mantodea MC 693	Posted - 2015.07.18 00:06:00 - [34] - Quote Thokk Nightshade wrote: I will use a rep tool occasionally when I logi. It is "better money" to use a basic/standard one than a proto because the longer you rep, the more WP you get. If they want to fix rep tools, just change the WP they give based on the equipment Proto: 25 Adv: 15 Std/Mlt: 5 See if more people don't break out proto rep tools if they want to rep. They will repair faster so less WP gained per and there is an excuse to do something OTHER than just rep the whole time and milk points off teammates. Incorrect. The rate of triage WP gain is based on the amount of armor repaired, not the amount of time repairing. [64.9m SP] Sazu's Trading
General Mosquito Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 124	Posted - 2015.07.18 00:08:00 - [35] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Tell me what any guy repping the entire match on dying mercs did to deserve 750k? He earned more WP than you. Pretty simple really. General Butt Naked - Biomassed The Attorney General - Biomassed when unbanned Only 9 more alts to go.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 00:47:00 - [36] - Quote I'm missing the part where the logi in question has earned the highest pay? You can nitpick the post, but the fact remains.... he just held R1?! The choice of tank was per the situation! There were 2 tanks and a dropship at the time of the request for the tank! Also, the point I was defending was zerged! Should I have called a sica? Regardless to what I called in the fact is I would not have gotten paid to even cover the sica?! Apparently calling in the rep tool though would've yielded much more isk lol! And for the fools that don't understand the army doctrine. Don't speak on it! You will be drug yo safety, apply self aid, wait for the threat to be neutralized, or bleed out. Cold hard reality. With that there is no buts?! I promise you! Call me what you want, as this community tends to get butthurt easy, but the facts remain. Say I'm whining all you want, but these rep logis responding now will keep getting paid to watch you die. How I worded it is how I felt about the issue, and have felt for quite some time. I've heard guys sat they were only repping on certain maps regardless to how much work it was for other roles to fight on that map. Either the payouts get fixed, or the rep tool gets an adjustment that not only I, but many have mentioned. "Anybody order chaos?"
Thokk Nightshade Montana Militia 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 00:57:00 - [37] - Quote Sergeant Sazu wrote: Thokk Nightshade wrote: I will use a rep tool occasionally when I logi. It is "better money" to use a basic/standard one than a proto because the longer you rep, the more WP you get. If they want to fix rep tools, just change the WP they give based on the equipment Proto: 25 Adv: 15 Std/Mlt: 5 See if more people don't break out proto rep tools if they want to rep. They will repair faster so less WP gained per and there is an excuse to do something OTHER than just rep the whole time and milk points off teammates. Incorrect. The rate of triage WP gain is based on the amount of armor repaired, not the amount of time repairing. Really? Oh, well hell, good to know. I just see the +25's rolling in. I never took the time to figure out what they were coming from. Thanks for the clarificatino Sarge! Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
Sergeant Sazu Mantodea MC 697	Posted - 2015.07.18 00:59:00 - [38] - Quote Rep tools generate way too much WP, that I agree with. My record is 1,119,000 ISK in a public Skirmish. Otherwise, your unveiled bias and lack of understanding is not proving anything. It's easy to say "they just hold R1 the whole match", but do tell what slayers do. That's right, I could say the same thing. There's a lot of positioning and awareness that goes into healing allies that are under fire. You have to work around their movements and not get in their way. There's a considerable amount of thought that goes into being a logi, just like being a slayer. And for the record; I fight just like everyone else and pull out the rep tool whenever someone needs it. That's what logis should be. [65.1m SP] Sazu's Trading
7 Djin The Hundred Acre Hood Rise Of Legion. 63	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:00:00 - [39] - Quote Krixus Flux wrote: So you're the kid who got presents too when it was your sibling's birthday party huh? ^ this Spoil't
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:05:00 - [40] - Quote Sergeant Sazu wrote: Rep tools generate way too much WP, that I agree with. My record is 1,119,000 ISK in a public Skirmish. Otherwise, your unveiled bias and lack of understanding is not proving anything. It's easy to say "they just hold R1 the whole match", but do tell what slayers do. That's right, I could say the same thing. There's a lot of positioning and awareness that goes into healing allies that are under fire. You have to work around their movements and not get in their way. There's a considerable amount of thought that goes into being a logi, just like being a slayer. And for the record; I fight just like everyone else and pull out the rep tool whenever someone needs it. That's what logis should be. Slayers just hold R1....? Seriously? Unveiled bias is funny since I am a logo lol! Ask anyone who has fought me in PC what I'm likely to be running mostly. The fit I run in my tank is a logi. You guys give "reppers" the credit "logies" deserve smh?! "Anybody order chaos?"

Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:06:00 - [41] - Quote 7 Djin wrote: Krixus Flux wrote: So you're the kid who got presents too when it was your sibling's birthday party huh? ^ this Spoil't Anyone from the hundred acre hood isn't biased at all lol! "Anybody order chaos?"
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:08:00 - [42] - Quote Thokk Nightshade wrote: Sergeant Sazu wrote: Thokk Nightshade wrote: I will use a rep tool occasionally when I logi. It is "better money" to use a basic/standard one than a proto because the longer you rep, the more WP you get. If they want to fix rep tools, just change the WP they give based on the equipment Proto: 25 Adv: 15 Std/Mlt: 5 See if more people don't break out proto rep tools if they want to rep. They will repair faster so less WP gained per and there is an excuse to do something OTHER than just rep the whole time and milk points off teammates. Incorrect. The rate of triage WP gain is based on the amount of armor repaired, not the amount of time repairing. Really? Oh, well hell, good to know. I just see the +25's rolling in. I never took the time to figure out what they were coming from. Thanks for the clarificatino Sarge! My point "Anybody order chaos?"
Larkson Crazy Eye WarRavens D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 92	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:12:00 - [43] - Quote I didn't really read every post.. or even all of the first post. This thread seemed to have deteriorated pretty fast. That said your earnings has nothing to do with getting paid, just the enemy losses and your rank on the team. True higher WP might make you rank one, but the difference between the top 2-3 positions isn't usually that huge. Being a logi is a pretty unrewarding experience in every way other than WP. Your suits are rather expensive in that your fielding a full 8-9 mods between the high/low slots. A weapon, 3-4 equipment slots and a grenade. Everyone wants a logi to run proto equip, f they get picked up with less than 90% HP and die they whine like babies in a lot of cases and blame the logi for even trying. Pick ups get more logi killed than anything else. Your extremely vulnerable and people tend to call out even if their in the open under fire. By the sounds of things your a scout, with 2-3 equipment slots. I doubt you have a needle despite your claims it would save the team. Which leads to the other problem being a logi. You help every one else but when your armor is down or your dead good luck at finding any one else to rep or pick you up. We have had the rep tool nerfed before. It used to only give 5 ticks or so before it stopped giving out WP for almost a full minute or two. We no longer get WP from repping vehicles or turrets despite there being rep tools that are exclusively good at repairing vehicles. Any real nerf to rep tools will just mean people stop using them. Their not that effective in combat unless you have the best rep tool on some one with a decent recovery rate in their suit already. Plus it's kind of slow to switch from a weapon to tool and back. If an enemy starts firing at you, your basically helpless and caught with your pants down. So if they stopped giving WP imo people would mostly go to another piece of equipment. Last thing you want is rep tools to turn out like nano hives. They used to be every where but now they only give 10 wp, expire really fast from restocking grenades and have a huge delay built in between the supply bonus your lucky get 20-50wp total out of a hive before it's gone. Even with 6 hives that's nothing for the cost in SP and isk to use them. Which is why almost no one carries them any more. In a squad your lucky if a person other than a logi has any hives, if they do it's usually the compact one which doesn't last long.
Veg Hegirin DUST University Ivy League 100	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:16:00 - [44] - Quote Compact hives do at least rep you up to full before popping, which is nice Scrub-a-dub-dub
Sergeant Sazu Mantodea MC 698	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:17:00 - [45] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Slayers just hold R1....? Seriously? Yes. You tried to dumb down the other side to further your own argument. I'm throwing it back at you to show you how illogical it is. Bradric Banewolf wrote: Unveiled bias is funny since I am a logo lol! Ask anyone who has fought me in PC what I'm likely to be running mostly. The fit I run in my tank is a logi. That's not being a logi. That's hopping out to drop links or a scan, then doing tank stuff, correct? Bradric Banewolf wrote: You guys give "reppers" the credit "logies" deserve smh?! Nope. The guys who remain locked-on to allies endlessly even when their HP is full are what we call "tourist logis". They're the guys who do it for the broken amount of WP that triage gives, not because they actually want to be a support unit. [65.1m SP] Sazu's Trading
Larkson Crazy Eye WarRavens D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 95	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:29:00 - [46] - Quote Sergeant Sazu wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: You guys give "reppers" the credit "logies" deserve smh?! Nope. The guys who remain locked-on to allies endlessly even when their HP is full are what we call "tourist logis". They're the guys who do it for the broken amount of WP that triage gives, not because they actually want to be a support unit. To be fair it's a valid tactic in a tight defensive location when you know dmg will be incoming. You don't want to run around the map attached to some guys back but it has it's uses. You can hide out of the line of fire while giving that heavy/assault an extra second or two of life. 60-100ish HP per sec will make a huge difference. But it has to be done before the person is hurt. If you wait till they are already getting shot then it's to late. Their dead before you switched to your rep tool and locked on to them. Never mind how hard it is to lock on to target in a crowded area with people always stepping in the way. It's easier to stay locked on to your squad mate most of the time. As a purely out of combat tool the rep tool is kind of lame. Most people barely have enough armor to give you one tick of the WP, nor do they even need it. If you have less than 400 armor you'll repair on your own in under 30 seconds most of the time. Which means if the logi is not already there, your good on your own by the time they move over to you. Which again if you remove pro active healing from logi's you might as well not have a rep tool and just go with other equipment. You can go the whole match without some one being noticeably hurt. In many fights you can just carry a needle and forget the rep tool if your honest. A lot of suits like scouts have nothing between alive and dead so the rep tool barely helps.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:29:00 - [47] - Quote Sergeant Sazu wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Slayers just hold R1....? Seriously? Yes. You tried to dumb down the other side to further your own argument. I'm throwing it back at you to show you how illogical it is. Bradric Banewolf wrote: Unveiled bias is funny since I am a logo lol! Ask anyone who has fought me in PC what I'm likely to be running mostly. The fit I run in my tank is a logi. That's not being a logi. That's hopping out to drop links or a scan, then doing tank stuff, correct? Bradric Banewolf wrote: You guys give "reppers" the credit "logies" deserve smh?! Nope. The guys who remain locked-on to allies endlessly even when their HP is full are what we call "tourist logis". They're the guys who do it for the broken amount of WP that triage gives, not because they actually want to be a support unit. So what I'm doing is flawed, but "tourist logis" get the pass of the century lol! About to go hold R1, and get these kills in my logi lol! "Anybody order chaos?"
Kierkegaard Soren Eridani Light Horse Battalion 859	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:34:00 - [48] - Quote wp shou be cut in half, other equipment Reppingwpwpequipmenyshould be increased so that payouts are normalised across all equipmeny types. Problem solved. Dedicated Commando. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Sergeant Sazu Mantodea MC 704	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:39:00 - [49] - Quote Larkson Crazy Eye wrote: Sergeant Sazu wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: You guys give "reppers" the credit "logies" deserve smh?! Nope. The guys who remain locked-on to allies endlessly even when their HP is full are what we call "tourist logis". They're the guys who do it for the broken amount of WP that triage gives, not because they actually want to be a support unit. To be fair it's a valid tactic in a tight defensive location when you know dmg will be incoming. You don't want to run around the map attached to some guys back but it has it's uses. You can hide out of the line of fire while giving that heavy/assault an extra second or two of life. 60-100ish HP per sec will make a huge difference. But it has to be done before the person is hurt. If you wait till they are already getting shot then it's to late. Their dead before you switched to your rep tool and locked on to them. Never mind how hard it is to lock on to target in a crowded area with people always stepping in the way. It's easier to stay locked on to your squad mate most of the time. As a purely out of combat tool the rep tool is kind of lame. Most people barely have enough armor to give you one tick of the WP, nor do they even need it. If you have less than 400 armor you'll repair on your own in under 30 seconds most of the time. Which means if the logi is not already there, your good on your own by the time they move over to you. Which again if you remove pro active healing from logi's you might as well not have a rep tool and just go with other equipment. You can go the whole match without some one being noticeably hurt. In many fights you can just carry a needle and forget the rep tool if your honest. A lot of suits like scouts have nothing between alive and dead so the rep tool barely helps. Agreed. If someone is consistently getting shot, I'll keep the rep tool on. I logi when I squad with my corpmates, and I'm very familiar with their different fighting styles. When I know my Galmando friend is about to step in front of 3+ dudes, I'm locking on before he loses shield to prevent him from getting insta-killed. That's how we survive as a mobile unit against greater odds. Otherwise, I fight alongside him. [65.1m SP] Sazu's Trading
Sergeant Sazu Mantodea MC 704	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:41:00 - [50] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: So what I'm doing is flawed, but "tourist logis" get the pass of the century lol! About to go hold R1, and get these kills in my logi lol! What? I tried to comprehend what you're saying, and my brain was like... "What?" [65.1m SP] Sazu's Trading

MrShooter01 Ustio Mercenary Squadron 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:44:00 - [51] - Quote Sergeant Sazu wrote: Incorrect. The rate of triage WP gain is based on the amount of armor repaired, not the amount of time repairing. Another popular logi misconception, building on this: many think that stabbing someone with a ** 30% needle for 30wp and repping is worth the most points... except no ** that noise. Most suits when revived at 30% might give 2, maybe 3 hits of triage points, time a bad logi is probably wasting with a crap basic rep tool (for "more" points!). If the downed friendly is a scout, caldari, or militia, good luck even getting one triage reward. So for all that wrangling with different tools, the logi gets 30WP revive and +25-50WP repair. Meanwhile, a proto needle will give you a guaranteed +90WP every time, even if you revive a militia caldari light. You don't have to ** around with a repair tool, he's ready for action right away. Most suits will regenerate that last 20% before seeing another enemy, a sentinel picked up in the heat of combat with a proto needle is ready to ** up everything threatening you like an angry grizzly bear waking from hibernation. Surely something so awesome must cost 30k isk? Nope For only 7,050 isk, you too can be surrounded by cool people in proto suits who want you to plunge your thick black pro needle into their prone forms That's less than the price of an advanced gun! So, people. Please. Next time you complete a daily mission for an isk reward, buy a few dozen Wiyrkomi injectors, and replace the sharpened bit of PVC pipe you call a militia needle with them. Everyone will thank you. Or at least some KIN-012s ffs, they give 60wp, barely take any more fitting resources than militia, and I KNOW you have dozens sitting there in your inventory from strongbox drops, ones that don't even require skill level 3
Veg Hegirin DUST University Ivy League 102	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:49:00 - [52] - Quote MrShooter01 wrote: Only 7,050 isk, That's less than the price of an advanced gun! So, people. Please. Next time you complete a daily mission for an isk reward, buy a few dozen Wiyrkomi injectors, and replace the sharpened bit of PVC pipe you call a militia needle with them. Isk efficiency doesn't work that way That pushes the cost of suits well above what I'm comfortable losing Scrub-a-dub-dub
Sergeant Sazu Mantodea MC 706	Posted - 2015.07.18 01:50:00 - [53] - Quote MrShooter01 wrote: Another popular logi misconception, building on this: many think that stabbing someone with a ** 30% needle for 30wp and repping is worth the most points... except no ** that noise. Most suits when revived at 30% might give 2, maybe 3 hits of triage points, time a bad logi is probably wasting with a crap basic rep tool (for "more" points!). If the downed friendly is a scout, caldari, or militia, good luck even getting one triage reward. So for all that wrangling with different tools, the logi gets 30WP revive and +25-50WP repair. Meanwhile, a proto needle will give you a guaranteed +90WP every time, even if you revive a militia caldari light. You don't have to ** around with a repair tool, he's ready for action right away. Most suits will regenerate that last 20% before seeing another enemy, a sentinel picked up in the heat of combat with a proto needle is ready to ** up everything threatening you like an angry grizzly bear waking from hibernation. Surely something so awesome must cost 30k isk? Nope For only 7,050 isk, you too can be surrounded by cool people in proto suits who want you to plunge your thick black pro needle into their prone forms That's less than the price of an advanced gun! So, people. Please. Next time you complete a daily mission for an isk reward, buy a few dozen Wiyrkomi injectors, and replace the sharpened bit of PVC pipe you call a militia needle with them. Everyone will thank you. Or at least some KIN-012s ffs, they give 60wp, barely take any more fitting resources than militia, and I KNOW you have dozens sitting there in your inventory from strongbox drops, ones that don't even require skill level 3 I always run a proto needle. Having someone instantly battle ready while I tend to other thing (like shooting the reason my bro went down), is simply the best. Nice to see another enthusiast. Quote: ready to **** up everything threatening you like an angry grizzly bear waking from hibernation. I literally laughed out loud when I read this. [65.1m SP] Sazu's Trading
Larkson Crazy Eye WarRavens D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 97	Posted - 2015.07.18 02:34:00 - [54] - Quote MrShooter01 wrote: Only 7,050 isk, That's less than the price of an advanced gun! So, people. Please. Next time you complete a daily mission for an isk reward, buy a few dozen Wiyrkomi injectors, and replace the sharpened bit of PVC pipe you call a militia needle with them. For me it's usually not the isk, though it does had up. It's better now that they lowered the cost. Equipment used to have nearly the same cost as weapons. The big problem is the huge jump in CPU/PG cost of the proto gear. A basic rep tool and inj is about the lowest cost gear you can put on at 15 cpu and 2 PG. A proto however at something like 48 and 8 well gets dicey on some cheaper apex like fits even with the logi bonus to equipment cost. It's not as bad as proto nano hives but it's a factor more often than not. Most my mid range priced suits I run one piece of proto equipment with the rest advanced (or less if the CPU/PG becomes an issue). In the case of one item at proto level usually the rep tool wins out. A proto rep tool has more range and can work on two targets in addition to healing for more HP per second. An amazing tactical jump from the basic or even advanced model. The difference in time wasted and how many people die with being able to heal two people at once vs just one is huge. Never mind the extra distance to prevent losing your lock all the time. On the other hand I can often go entire matches without using my needle once. Some times in a curb stomp it's because no one really dies. Other times it's because they die from one shot deaths and explosions. Or just die in really lousy places that will only get us both killed if any one tries to pick them up. The thing about needles is their only really good if your team mates are running good equipment. It helps give them a safety net to want to risk those expensive suits. Tactically it's usually easier to just bleed out and spawn back in than get picked up in over all time wasted. Almost none of the matches I get into these days comes down to clones and generally the process of waiting for a person to call for help, picking them up and getting them on their way again w/o you both dying again is much longer than the 3-5 second spawns of most decent uplinks.
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 02:53:00 - [55] - Quote IceShifter Childhaspawn wrote: Maybe we rep because we don't have a gun game. Maybe we rep because we WANT our squad to have ammo, links that aren't 15 second timers, or a proto scanner to keep them aware. Maybe Im thankful I get that payout when I die 10 times in a suit carrying proto scan, hives, links and my favorite FW repper. Sprinting around in a scout suit sounds fun. Shooting the Jump fit Officer MD fits sounds fun too, I cannot. I die. I come back and still help my squad however I can and that huge payout SOMETIMES helps me break even. Ill work on that running away (not getting shot) thing, but I cant leave my squad behind. Have fun with your tanks. In a perfect world you could just not die so much? I rep, revive, link and resupply in a bpo logi suit with nearly no hp mods and still have above 1.0 kdr. I'm not a slayers slayer, but I'm not a punk either. Knowing who to rep, when to rep them as opposed to just letting them eat it and reviving them after you clean up, where to drop links that wont be farmed, etc etc are all a part of being a good logi, as much as having situational awareness, tactical I.Q and things that are combat related. Not knocking anyones playstyle, but being a logi doesn't in any way shape or form mean you have to rush headlong into death to get points. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
Sned TheDead Failures inc. 456	Posted - 2015.07.18 02:58:00 - [56] - Quote I want to respond to this in a constructive way. to agree with you on some points, and show you the error of your ways in others, but unfortunately for you, you seem to have a vendetta. Regardless, I am here to say a few simple things; First - All self-respecting logis mid game should have a needle on their suit. its how it is, needles are arguably the most important piece of equipment you can carry, so do so. Second - Rep Tool, love it, hate it, it has a purpose - to prepare your team for an assault, and to keep them alive through it. There is a reason it gives so much points - because it works. imagine that, something that helps the the team, and gives them the chance to survive against heavier fire power gives out a ton of points. hmm wonder why -_-. Third, and Final - So what are you complaining about exactly? Because all I read was a bunch of tears on the fact that you only got 400k isk, and a guy you were running with got 700k. Are you jealous? Is that what this is about? virtual currency that has no effect on the real world? Really? Man grow a pair, and have fun once in a while, don't complain on how some one who used a piece of equipment rather than a gun got more WP than you. Sned T. Dead. Post Script - also a good logi knows when to shoot, and if you don't, its before your buddy dies. shoot first, rep after. It just makes sense. And if you do not carry a needle, for shame, for shame. Cleaning up the mess everyone leaves behind :)
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 02:58:00 - [57] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Half rep wp payment, buff other equipment payouts to encourage diversity. Done. Uhh...nah, uplink payout is more than fine right now. I do support all equipment having tiered rewards though. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 03:29:00 - [58] - Quote Sned TheDead wrote: I want to respond to this in a constructive way. to agree with you on some points, and show you the error of your ways in others, but unfortunately for you, you seem to have a vendetta. Regardless, I am here to say a few simple things; First - All self-respecting logis mid game should have a needle on their suit. its how it is, needles are arguably the most important piece of equipment you can carry, so do so. Second - Rep Tool, love it, hate it, it has a purpose - to prepare your team for an assault, and to keep them alive through it. There is a reason it gives so much points - because it works. imagine that, something that helps the the team, and gives them the chance to survive against heavier fire power gives out a ton of points. hmm wonder why -_-. Third, and Final - So what are you complaining about exactly? Because all I read was a bunch of tears on the fact that you only got 400k isk, and a guy you were running with got 700k. Are you jealous? Is that what this is about? virtual currency that has no effect on the real world? Really? Man grow a pair, and have fun once in a while, don't complain on how some one who used a piece of equipment rather than a gun got more WP than you. Sned T. Dead. Post Script - also a good logi knows when to shoot, and if you don't, its before your buddy dies. shoot first, rep after. It just makes sense. And if you do not carry a needle, for shame, for shame. Agree, and no there's no hate or jealously. I think my post was taken incorrectly. I wrote it right after a battle where I was very heated after the battle so I may have came off that way. I dislike the idea that all the work that goes into winning a battle isn't rewarded better, but if you repping it's practically insta-pay?! I see such poor tactics from so many repping logis it's a bit frustrating. Then they get paid tons for basically helping you lose?! "Anybody order chaos?"
Larkson Crazy Eye WarRavens D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 98	Posted - 2015.07.18 03:45:00 - [59] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: I dislike the idea that all the work that goes into winning a battle isn't rewarded better, but if you repping it's practically insta-pay?! I see such poor tactics from so many repping logis it's a bit frustrating. Then they get paid tons for basically helping you lose?! Well Logi's are the Vultures of the battlefield. We only do well when our team does badly ;) The more you get hurt, die, spawn in and expend ammo the more points we earn. About the only non negative way a logi can earn Wp (other than normal killing/hacking etc) is scanners. And a mere 15 wp per squad kill while they are light up is kind of weak. Though with 16 man squads in PC I suppose that would happen more often than previously. Pub matches though scanners are worthless for WP. Scanners are definitely one piece of equipment you should praise any logi for using, it's about the worst pay out in terms of points of any thing he could be using.
Alena Ventrallis Commando Perkone Caldari State 3	Posted - 2015.07.18 03:49:00 - [60] - Quote No-one-ganks like-Gaston wrote: I agreed with you at first about someone who was only going logi to make bank being detrimental to the team. But then you started whining and saying things should be done based entirely off your opinion. Like removing the rep tool. And you know very ******* well that, in the army, if they had some sort of tool that could heal their soldiers as they were getting shot they would use the fck* out of it, and there would be several dedicated healers in every troupe. Don't give us this bull **** about how in the army you guys do it differently than a futuristic sci-fi game does. Of course you f*cking do. You don't have nearly the same capabilities as this imaginary future army does. Go stick a needle up your ass if you want one so bad, and don't compare video game logistics priorities to actual people who actually get hurt and actually die. Give him one! Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind.

Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 04:04:00 - [61] - Quote Larkson Crazy Eye wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: I dislike the idea that all the work that goes into winning a battle isn't rewarded better, but if you repping it's practically insta-pay?! I see such poor tactics from so many repping logis it's a bit frustrating. Then they get paid tons for basically helping you lose?! Well Logi's are the Vultures of the battlefield. We only do well when our team does badly ;) The more you get hurt, die, spawn in and expend ammo the more points we earn. About the only non negative way a logi can earn Wp (other than normal killing/hacking etc) is scanners. And a mere 15 wp per squad kill while they are light up is kind of weak. Though with 16 man squads in PC I suppose that would happen more often than previously. Pub matches though scanners are worthless for WP. Scanners are definitely one piece of equipment you should praise any logi for using, it's about the worst pay out in terms of points of any thing he could be using. The main one I use :) "Anybody order chaos?"
Veg Hegirin DUST University Ivy League 103	Posted - 2015.07.18 04:51:00 - [62] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: I dislike the idea that all the work that goes into winning a battle isn't rewarded better, but if you repping it's practically insta-pay?! I see such poor tactics from so many repping logis it's a bit frustrating. Then they get paid tons for basically helping you lose?! Implying that a good assault is more important than a good logi Implying that a good assault does more work than a good logi Implying that a good assault has more impact on the outcome than a good logi implying that a good assault deserves better rewards than a good logi Implying that logi is not a force multiplier Implying that your K:D is more important than keeping your team effective Do you see why people might be taking issue with that fact that you think n+1 > 2n ? Is sticking your rep tool up the arse of a good heavy ludicrously easy? Sure Does it always help your team? Not necessarily Can it help your team a great deal, and do you get more WP when it does? You bet your Paridae Is just this enough reason to change the WP gain of reps? No. Stop whining. Scrub-a-dub-dub
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 1	Posted - 2015.07.18 05:05:00 - [63] - Quote Veg Hegirin wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: I dislike the idea that all the work that goes into winning a battle isn't rewarded better, but if you repping it's practically insta-pay?! I see such poor tactics from so many repping logis it's a bit frustrating. Then they get paid tons for basically helping you lose?! Implying that a good assault is more important than a good logi Implying that a good assault does more work than a good logi Implying that a good assault has more impact on the outcome than a good logi implying that a good assault deserves better rewards than a good logi Implying that logi is not a force multiplier Implying that your K:D is more important than keeping your team effective Do you see why people might be taking issue with that fact that you think n+1 > 2n ? Is sticking your rep tool up the arse of a good heavy ludicrously easy? Sure Does it always help your team? Not necessarily Can it help your team a great deal, and do you get more WP when it does? You bet your Paridae Is just this enough reason to change the WP gain of reps? No. Stop whining. The entire basis of your rebuttal is based on the fact that you assume he is talking about a good logi vs a rep hooker. Not. The. Same. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
Summa Militum Art.of.Death 521	Posted - 2015.07.18 05:55:00 - [64] - Quote Vitharr Foebane wrote: you wanna know why most logis dont pack needles anymore? KD whores(like yourself im sure) whined and whined and whined that logis were ruining their precious KD and made it so you cant pick someone up unless they ask for it. By the way next to noone requests a revive. Are you serious? You think KDR whores are the reason for the change in reviving people with needles? The reason the revive with needles was changed was because of a$$hole Logi's who whored after WPs by forcing one of their teammates into a constant cycle of death. A$$hole Logi's would revive a teammate knowing damn well their teammate was still in the line of fire of the enemy. After the teammate immediately dies the Logi would revive him again just to watch him immediately die again. I once died 9 times in a row because of that crap. A$$holes with needles brought about the change to the revive, not KDR whores.
DeadlyAztec11 Defenders of the Helghast Dream 8	Posted - 2015.07.18 06:45:00 - [65] - Quote The Combat Logistics of Chromosome are gone. Now nearly all Logis are incompetent minions who drew the short straws. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
Larkson Crazy Eye WarRavens D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 99	Posted - 2015.07.18 07:45:00 - [66] - Quote Reign Omega wrote: Veg Hegirin wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: I dislike the idea that all the work that goes into winning a battle isn't rewarded better, but if you repping it's practically insta-pay?! I see such poor tactics from so many repping logis it's a bit frustrating. Then they get paid tons for basically helping you lose?! Implying that a good assault is more important than a good logi Implying that a good assault does more work than a good logi Implying that a good assault has more impact on the outcome than a good logi implying that a good assault deserves better rewards than a good logi Implying that logi is not a force multiplier Implying that your K:D is more important than keeping your team effective Do you see why people might be taking issue with that fact that you think n+1 > 2n ? Is sticking your rep tool up the arse of a good heavy ludicrously easy? Sure Does it always help your team? Not necessarily Can it help your team a great deal, and do you get more WP when it does? You bet your Paridae Is just this enough reason to change the WP gain of reps? No. Stop whining. The entire basis of your rebuttal is based on the fact that you assume he is talking about a good logi vs a rep hooker. Not. The. Same. To be fair what I read of the original post, he was talking about a competent logi. The guy broke 6k WP. You can't do that just being an idiot with a rep tool. 2-3k sure, maybe 4k or so if your squad leader or got the defend order on you. But imo 6k takes some serious effort, naho hives, uplinks maybe a few revives and kill assist. Especially since it was a Skirm match I believe. Which would mean less enemies are funneling into a single point for the logi to rep a heavy or two on. Though WP isn't everything. If your doing your job some times and sticking with the squad and defending an objective that doesn't really see any action your not going to get any WP.
Veg Hegirin DUST University Ivy League 104	Posted - 2015.07.18 09:56:00 - [67] - Quote Reign Omega wrote: Veg Hegirin wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: I dislike the idea that all the work that goes into winning a battle isn't rewarded better, but if you repping it's practically insta-pay?! I see such poor tactics from so many repping logis it's a bit frustrating. Then they get paid tons for basically helping you lose?! Implying that a good assault is more important than a good logi Implying that a good assault does more work than a good logi Implying that a good assault has more impact on the outcome than a good logi implying that a good assault deserves better rewards than a good logi Implying that logi is not a force multiplier Implying that your K:D is more important than keeping your team effective Do you see why people might be taking issue with that fact that you think n+1 > 2n ? Is sticking your rep tool up the arse of a good heavy ludicrously easy? Sure Does it always help your team? Not necessarily Can it help your team a great deal, and do you get more WP when it does? You bet your Paridae Is just this enough reason to change the WP gain of reps? No. Stop whining. The entire basis of your rebuttal is based on the fact that you assume he is talking about a good logi vs a rep hooker. Not. The. Same. No, at most half my rebuttal is about rep-up-the-arse logi, which incidentally is what he is trying to reduce his friends logi efforts to: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Now I know a lot of logis will somehow justify how he was helping, but seriously in this battle everyone he was repping died tons! The first half of my argument is about good logi, and the fact that, frankly, they get more WP because they contribute more. He is literally saying that, being equally skilled and contributing, a slayer should get more WP than a logi which is whiny entitled bullshit. Scrub-a-dub-dub
Sned TheDead Failures inc. 459	Posted - 2015.07.18 11:08:00 - [68] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Sned TheDead wrote: I want to respond to this in a constructive way. to agree with you on some points, and show you the error of your ways in others, but unfortunately for you, you seem to have a vendetta. Regardless, I am here to say a few simple things; First - All self-respecting logis mid game should have a needle on their suit. its how it is, needles are arguably the most important piece of equipment you can carry, so do so. Second - Rep Tool, love it, hate it, it has a purpose - to prepare your team for an assault, and to keep them alive through it. There is a reason it gives so much points - because it works. imagine that, something that helps the the team, and gives them the chance to survive against heavier fire power gives out a ton of points. hmm wonder why -_-. Third, and Final - So what are you complaining about exactly? Because all I read was a bunch of tears on the fact that you only got 400k isk, and a guy you were running with got 700k. Are you jealous? Is that what this is about? virtual currency that has no effect on the real world? Really? Man grow a pair, and have fun once in a while, don't complain on how some one who used a piece of equipment rather than a gun got more WP than you. Sned T. Dead. Post Script - also a good logi knows when to shoot, and if you don't, its before your buddy dies. shoot first, rep after. It just makes sense. And if you do not carry a needle, for shame, for shame. Agree, and no there's no hate or jealously. I think my post was taken incorrectly. I wrote it right after a battle where I was very heated after the battle so I may have came off that way. I dislike the idea that all the work that goes into winning a battle isn't rewarded better, but if you repping it's practically insta-pay?! I see such poor tactics from so many repping logis it's a bit frustrating. Then they get paid tons for basically helping you lose?! How are they helping you lose? By repairing your armour? By resupplying your ammo? By scanning to show where the weak points are? By dropping links to allow you to get to the battlefield faster? By picking you up to ensure you are at full force when you push? These are the duty's of a logi. There are very few rewards to these duty's other than isk, which rarely allows us to break even in a good match. 700k would pay for one. let me repeat that. One. Of my proto suits. One. That is why there are so many Logis who wp *****. Remember that. While you may be able to break even in that match, isk wise, your buddy just lost an inane amount of isk if he was running proto. We don't come cheap, but we do our best. Next time consider this, I lose as much isk almost every battle as you do in a battle when the enemy team is all running proto AV against your tank, and you proceed to bring out four anyway. A rep tool has its time and place, it is not the most useful piece of equipment to have IMO, but does that stop me from running one? No. I am a min logi, I will play to my strengths. Which includes a rep bonus. Though the fact remains, you have to know when to shoot as a logi, you can NOT be caught with your tool in your hands(had to, I'm a child some times). Cleaning up the mess everyone leaves behind :)
gekko k Grundstein Automation Property of Negative-Impact 98	Posted - 2015.07.18 13:30:00 - [69] - Quote I said something similar in this post: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2545262#post2545262 The consensus is that logis need more incentive to do their job due to lack of interest in the role.


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