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Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 576	Posted - 2015.03.09 22:36:00 - [1] - Quote Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition SETUP: Both teams have 150 clones and an MCC each. There are a variable number of null cannon installations (1~5). All current maps for skirmish and domination remain viable for this game mode. CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. This includes: 1. The MCC itself (worth aprox. 75mil, guaranteed loss if MCC is destroyed) 2. Dropsuits 3. Vehicles CCP, please consider this and give it some thought. Thank you for reading. Know what cannot be known.
PLAYSTTION Corrosive Synergy RISE of LEGION 649	Posted - 2015.03.10 00:06:00 - [2] - Quote So, skirmish with a different type of clone count? I may not entirely understand this so it seems a little unnecessary, but like i said i don't understand it. I would like this with just the isk loss thing though, and maybe the more null cannons you have you generate x amount of isk to increase the amount of isk you can lose? Then lets say you have an objective and your max is now 30mil, your at 25mil. They enemy hacks the objective and you go back down to 20 mil and lose? Gassault Calogi and more. Respec Pending. `- Open Beta Vet - 38 mil sp - - Director of Corrosive Synergy -`
Gyn Wallace OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 281	Posted - 2015.03.10 00:12:00 - [3] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. .. Nice, so isk efficient players who slay with their basic and advanced suits might win the game against protostompers, even if they lost a few more clones in the process. I like it. My only question is: How are BPOs valued toward the victory condition? The same way as for match rewards or differently? The Dust/Eve Isk Exchange Thread
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5277	Posted - 2015.03.10 00:14:00 - [4] - Quote Gyn Wallace wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. .. Nice, so isk efficient players who slay with their basic and advanced suits might win the game against protostompers, even if they lost a few more clones in the process. I like it. My only question is: How are BPOs valued toward the victory condition? The same way as for match rewards or differently? I imagine you would just have to go with the ISK value of the BPO and pretend that it was actually expended? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 1676	Posted - 2015.03.10 05:38:00 - [5] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Gyn Wallace wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. .. Nice, so isk efficient players who slay with their basic and advanced suits might win the game against protostompers, even if they lost a few more clones in the process. I like it. My only question is: How are BPOs valued toward the victory condition? The same way as for match rewards or differently? I imagine you would just have to go with the ISK value of the BPO and pretend that it was actually expended? Kinda like how its supposed to behave now? BigBurns is exiled,and so with that, the forum's jimmies will no longer be rustled.
Starlight Burner ROGUE RELICS 159	Posted - 2015.03.10 05:47:00 - [6] - Quote I like this idea. x Starlight Burner Thank god for CCP Rattati!! Rogue Relics is my home away from home.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 18291	Posted - 2015.03.10 07:12:00 - [7] - Quote pretty cool actually, maximizes skill and efficiency. This is like hardcore mode :) "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Pagl1u M Dead Man's Game 1738	Posted - 2015.03.10 07:22:00 - [8] - Quote What about apex suits and bpos? I d say a suit should have a minimum cost for this mode, or that you shouldnt be allowed to play with a suit that costs less than x. Why? Say for example that the average cost of suits used by a team in this mode is 10k isk. 20kk/10k=2000 kills. This is way too much kills needed, the match would be too long, like 2 hours and more. So in these cases the only way to win would be to destroy enemy MCC, this brings us back to a normal skirmish. In my opinion if you want to add this mode you should Limit it to PRO, ADV and officer (apex not allowed.) One of the few assaults you'll find in a PC match!
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5286	Posted - 2015.03.10 07:43:00 - [9] - Quote I don't really see why you can' just say that when a BPO 'dies' it adds its equivalent MLT/STD cost the overall 'ISK Counter'. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 913	Posted - 2015.03.10 10:15:00 - [10] - Quote Pagl1u M wrote: What about apex suits and bpos? I d say a suit should have a minimum cost for this mode, or that you shouldnt be allowed to play with a suit that costs less than x. Why? Say for example that the average cost of suits used by a team in this mode is 10k isk. 20kk/10k=2000 kills. This is way too much kills needed, the match would be too long, like 2 hours and more. So in these cases the only way to win would be to destroy enemy MCC, this brings us back to a normal skirmish. In my opinion if you want to add this mode you should Limit it to PRO, ADV and officer (apex not allowed.) Run cheaper more effecient STD suits should be an option. End of the day, odds are this kind of match will primarily lead to the MCC going down before x amount of isk is lost. Running expensive suits wont cost too much, but losing those suits will hurt the team as well as your wallet. If you think of it as Mercs pulling a ,job for an employer, the employer has only a finite amount of funds he/she is willing to put to the Mercs use before its costs too much to continue, and the contract is terminated. Doesn't stop me from bringin out a tank, but man, losing that thing will cost the team dearly enough that I can't go on a bring out two or three. The players who are the most isk and result effcicient, win. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.

DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS 919	Posted - 2015.03.10 11:20:00 - [11] - Quote i love this idea +1
Archduke Ferd1nand Nos Nothi 163	Posted - 2015.03.10 13:25:00 - [12] - Quote YES ADD THIS NAOW BRB, looking for socks Asslut Rifles OP, anal now I shit shotgun shells and piss Remote Explosives
Gyn Wallace OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 283	Posted - 2015.03.10 14:23:00 - [13] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: ... CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. This includes: ... 2. Dropsuits 3. Vehicles Thinking about this more, what do the last moments of the match look like when loss of dropsuits and vehicles ends the match? Is it the last guy to spawn in with a suit over the limit that triggers the victory condition (like getting cloned) or does the match continue, with no more men and material available to that side, giving the other side an advantage towards taking the null cannons? If the latter, I'm trying to imagine edge cases, where both teams nearly "isk out" and you're left with the remaining few survivors on each team running around trying to kill each other for a total annihilation of the enemy's available clones, or hack the null cannons, until.. MCC distruction or one side is completely eliminated? This is potentially a long time for the downed, unable to respawn people to wait for the match to end. Should they be unable to respawn, have to wait, be able to exit to the end of match screen earlier than the current system, or be able to respawn in free suits? The Dust/Eve Isk Exchange Thread
Gyn Wallace OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 283	Posted - 2015.03.10 14:36:00 - [14] - Quote Gyn Wallace wrote: I'm trying to imagine edge cases, ... Let me flesh that out better, because Kaeru's idea is awesome. So imagine you've got a protosquad, team deployed to the attrition match. Their strategy is to revive their fallen, and keep their average respawns down to 4 or 5, so they can all run proto gear. The other side runs cheap suits and fails to hold the null cannons at all for the first half of the match. The cheap suits burn up the proto squad's isk pool as the cheap suit team's MCC goes to 1/4 armor. This is where my prior post's question comes into play. Does the match not end until the cheap suits have held the null cannons long enough to burn through the proto team's MCC shields and armor, or until they've tracked down and killed the last proto-team's cloaked scout? That's potentially a very long time for a bunch of people to be waiting and unable to respawn. It begs for the ability to leave the match early without losing all rewards for having participated. If we can still join matches late and earn rewards for only partial participation, being able to leave attrition mode matches early, earning partial rewards, would be reasonable. If that's not feasable, coming up with a faster way to end the match than my hypothetical would be beneficial for wait times, and getting people back into the pool of players available for the next game's queue. The Dust/Eve Isk Exchange Thread
Corbina Ninja ItalPetrolCemeTermoTessilFarmaMetalChimica 1243	Posted - 2015.03.10 14:46:00 - [15] - Quote New Game Mode skirmish with isk limit? is not a NEW game mode :/ CTF Rush (battlefield's Rush) survival (all against all) are "new" «Questa è l'Italia del futuro: un paese di musichette mentre fuori c'è la morte.»
Lorhak Gannarsein Nos Nothi 4422	Posted - 2015.03.10 16:15:00 - [16] - Quote You'd need to change some of the parameters; to burn out 20M in 150 deaths would take some reasonably expensive gear; certainly pricier than most of what I see in matches. 10M seems like a more sensible number, possibly lower. Cool idea, though. Guys, we need to stop calling MU a 'matchmaker' when it's actually a 'teambuilder'. And I want to play FE:A now. Damn.
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 590	Posted - 2015.03.10 17:48:00 - [17] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Gyn Wallace wrote: Nice, so isk efficient players who slay with their basic and advanced suits might win the game against protostompers, even if they lost a few more clones in the process. I like it. My only question is: How are BPOs valued toward the victory condition? The same way as for match rewards or differently? I imagine you would just have to go with the ISK value of the BPO and pretend that it was actually expended? Exactly, every item, even BPO, ALREADY has a built in ISK value. That value is deducted from your team's total. Gyn Wallace wrote: Thinking about this more, what do the last moments of the match look like when loss of dropsuits and vehicles ends the match? Is it the last guy to spawn in with a suit over the limit that triggers the victory condition (like getting cloned) or does the match continue, with no more men and material available to that side, giving the other side an advantage towards taking the null cannons? If the latter, I'm trying to imagine edge cases, where both teams nearly "isk out" and you're left with the remaining few survivors on each team running around trying to kill each other for a total annihilation of the enemy's available clones, or hack the null cannons, until.. MCC distruction or one side is completely eliminated? This is potentially a long time for the downed, unable to respawn people to wait for the match to end. Should they be unable to respawn, have to wait, be able to exit to the end of match screen earlier than the current system, or be able to respawn in free suits? No, Look at it differently: When you spawn in something or call in a vehicle that your team cannot afford, you go into OVERCOST Overcost does not change anything because the assets need to be destroyed in order to trigger victory conditions for the other team. You team can continue to spawn in and call in more assets and go deeper into overcost mode. We do not want 2 or 3 people left on the field running around while everyone waits. A creative game designer/developper might come up with interesting game mechanics for overcast mode, however. :3 Know what cannot be known.
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 590	Posted - 2015.03.10 17:52:00 - [18] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: You'd need to change some of the parameters; to burn out 20M in 150 deaths would take some reasonably expensive gear; certainly pricier than most of what I see in matches. 10M seems like a more sensible number, possibly lower. Cool idea, though. the 20m is an arbitrary number. Ideally I envision different NPC corps with different budgets and variable isk amounts available on either side. Obviously out of scope, though. Still the point is that it doesnt have to be 20m, it can be 15, it can be 10. Just know that a single player can VERY EASILY lose 500k in a match with proto equipment. Think of logis and vehicle users. It's totall OK if their are people spawning in BPOs that are worth 10k for the system. Remember even BPOs have an isk value per unit attributed to them in game. I would also like to add that the clone counts can be removed entirely if only to simplify the number of conditions for victory. I didn't suggest it at first in order to keep it simple. It's up for debate. Know what cannot be known.
TheSneakyDolphin DROPSHIP ONE OPERATIONS 14	Posted - 2015.03.10 17:59:00 - [19] - Quote I don't know about this. Will the ISK cost be tracked in the HUD? I can see the game mode getting very boring. Everyone will rush the points to get a lead then hide/snipe in the red line so they don't lose the ISK while 2 or 3 cloaked scouts run around try to hold/hack the points with remotes & shotguns. Then there will be a blue dots spawning vehicles helping lose the game. Maybe a blue dot's HAV taking out another blue dot's HAV by accident in the spawn already costing the team 500,000 ISK in the first 30 seconds of the game. Maybe a PC game mode but for public match. It could get messy. It's almost like an ambush were a blue dot is fighting against his/her corp members, spawns in a free suit and kill his or her self over and over so the other team has a better chance of winning but amplified because of the ISK. ISK winning will also be limited because of the ISK put into the game. SQUEAK! SQUEAK!
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 9807	Posted - 2015.03.10 18:03:00 - [20] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition SETUP: Both teams have 150 clones and an MCC each. There are a variable number of null cannon installations (1~5). All current maps for skirmish and domination remain viable for this game mode. CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. This includes: 1. The MCC itself (worth aprox. 75mil or more, guaranteed loss if MCC is destroyed) 2. Dropsuits 3. Vehicles CCP, please consider this and give it some thought. Thank you for reading. The MCC is worth about 200 million judging from a past DUST Trailer. I'd welcome this wholeheartedly. It may put more emphasis on team play instead of just relying on gun game without brains to win a match. *As long as 4/5 (80%) of infantry AV weapons are Anti Armor based you're never going to achieve vehicle balance CCP*

DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS 924	Posted - 2015.03.10 18:12:00 - [21] - Quote Gyn Wallace wrote: Gyn Wallace wrote: I'm trying to imagine edge cases, ... Let me flesh that out better, because Kaeru's idea is awesome. So imagine you've got a protosquad, team deployed to the attrition match. Their strategy is to revive their fallen, and keep their average respawns down to 4 or 5, so they can all run proto gear. The other side runs cheap suits and fails to hold the null cannons at all for the first half of the match. The cheap suits burn up the proto squad's isk pool as the cheap suit team's MCC goes to 1/4 armor. Proto-team is down to three players, and the remainder hold respawn, because they're about to (or have) run out of isk. This is where my prior post's question comes into play. Does the match not end until the cheap suits have held the null cannons long enough to burn through the proto team's MCC shields and armor, or until they've tracked down and killed the last proto-team's cloaked scout? That's potentially a very long time for a bunch of people to be waiting and unable to respawn. It begs for the ability to leave the match early without losing all rewards for having participated. If we can still join matches late and earn rewards for only partial participation, being able to leave attrition mode matches early, earning partial rewards, would be reasonable. If that's not feasable, coming up with a faster way to end the match than my hypothetical would be beneficial for wait times, and getting people back into the pool of players available for the next game's queue. or what if you "renew confidence" from your employer by completing a randomly selected objective ( get x amount of kills, hold objective for x amount of time, capture an objective, kill the highest ranking player on enemy team) and if you succeed, the you receive additional funding and your team continues the fight. so basically the fiight goes on until the OPs conditions are met or the "employer" loses confidence in your team and cancel the contract. this would create for some potenitally long and intense battles where a losing team can rally and make a comeback. to that end, i'd also suggest the ability to spend WPs to aid your team by healing you MCC. you can use WPs to repair MCC damage. this means a player or squad can join a mtach late and turn the match around throught their additional efforts.
Pseudogenesis Nos Nothi 2081	Posted - 2015.03.10 18:19:00 - [22] - Quote People would grief the hell out of this mode, I guarantee it. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS 924	Posted - 2015.03.10 18:21:00 - [23] - Quote TheSneakyDolphin wrote: I don't know about this. Will the ISK cost be tracked in the HUD? I can see the game mode getting very boring. Everyone will rush the points to get a lead then hide/snipe in the red line so they don't lose the ISK while 2 or 3 cloaked scouts run around try to hold/hack the points with remotes & shotguns. Then there will be a blue dots spawning vehicles helping lose the game. Maybe a blue dot's HAV taking out another blue dot's HAV by accident in the spawn already costing the team 500,000 ISK in the first 30 seconds of the game. Maybe a PC game mode but for public match. It could get messy. It's almost like an ambush were a blue dot is fighting against his/her corp members, spawns in a free suit and kill his or her self over and over so the other team has a better chance of winning but amplified because of the ISK. ISK winning will also be limited because of the ISK put into the game. NOT if the payouts are adjusted like discussed else where on the forums. there's been talk of payouts equaling what the enemy team loses in terms of isk value and increased salvage drops, similar to FW or PC
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 590	Posted - 2015.03.10 18:27:00 - [24] - Quote I really wouldn't worry too much about griefing in this game mode. People will have to lose substantial amounts of isk in order to accomplish this which results in only one thing: The match ends sooner than it should have. It sucks if people were actually trying to win, however it doesn't directly irritate anyone or steal anything from anyone other than the "employer". Trying to make the team lose with BPO gear would be mind numbingly slow. It would be faster to run the 150 clone count up with suicides, which is already possible in every game mode currently available. Know what cannot be known.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 3195	Posted - 2015.03.10 19:16:00 - [25] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: pretty cool actually, maximizes skill and efficiency. This is like hardcore mode :) Rattati, do you guys have the ability to see / show us how much isk has been destroyed at the end of a battle? I think that would be an awesome stat to see in the end of match screen, even more so if the figure is given per team! Vitantur Nothus wrote: Why hide a solution under frothy pile of derpa? MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 590	Posted - 2015.03.10 20:13:00 - [26] - Quote Both teams have an ISK counter displayed in the same light blue as the rest of the HUD. This ISK counter displays the amount of isk left for both teams. The ISK counter is only affected by assets destroyed. Similar to a clone that needs to be permanently bled out in Ambush in order to count, simply spawning in a suit does not affect the counter. Losing that suit or vehicle however subtracts the value of what was lost from your team's ISK pool. When your team has enough gear on the field that could make them POTENTIALLY lose the match, that team enters OVERCOST. That team's ISK color changes to red. This is simply a warning that if all current assets are lost, it would be enough to lose the match. It does not prevent more gear from being called in, it is simply a warning. Using more gear simply pushes the team deeper into overcost. Payouts could depend on overcost. Winning without even reaching overcost earns bonus pay. Perhaps driving enemy overcost could also earn a certain bonus. Clever game designers might come up with interesting mechanics for overcost, it could make a nice discussion. Important thing is that it does not affect a player's ability to continue to battle. Know what cannot be known.
Balistyc Farshot The Exemplars RISE of LEGION 90	Posted - 2015.03.10 20:24:00 - [27] - Quote Brilliant! +1 for this. I would just want to make sure that the isk counter is displayed, and at the end, WP is actually isk spent to isk taken. Heavy with a massive bullet hose called Lola (Burst HMG).
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4073	Posted - 2015.03.10 21:16:00 - [28] - Quote Late to the party here but I like the idea +1 See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 1699	Posted - 2015.03.10 21:20:00 - [29] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Late to the party here but I like the idea +1 You live! Knows more, cares less, and doesn't sleep as much as he should.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4073	Posted - 2015.03.10 21:29:00 - [30] - Quote Soldner VonKuechle wrote: Cross Atu wrote: Late to the party here but I like the idea +1 You live! I do! (sorry Rue for the off topic post, I'll buy you a DS in compensation ) Work has been keeping me on call lately so I've had hardly any free time and it's been broken up into tiny bits not suitable for most things. CPM meetings and thread reading have both continued, as has some Dust playtime but my interactive presence has been sadly diminished by this state of affairs I am hoping things settle down a bit for me post fan fest and I can be more present once again. However, whether or not that happens I can still be reached via e-mail and invite anyone who has a link, an idea, or a concern to contact me there Cheers, Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)

Gyn Wallace OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 286	Posted - 2015.03.10 23:14:00 - [31] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: When your team has enough gear on the field that could make them POTENTIALLY lose the match, that team enters OVERCOST. That team's ISK color changes to red. This is simply a warning that if all current assets are lost, it would be enough to lose the match. It does not prevent more gear from being called in, it is simply a warning. Using more gear simply pushes the team deeper into overcost. That completely addresses my concern/answers my question. The Dust/Eve Isk Exchange Thread
JARREL THOMAS Dead Man's Game RUST415 494	Posted - 2015.03.10 23:20:00 - [32] - Quote I like it, give this man a job! Caldari Loyalist Why should infrantry that don't own vehicles, that can't balance their own mechanics, balance vehicles
WeapondigitX V7 The Exemplars RISE of LEGION 258	Posted - 2015.03.11 03:58:00 - [33] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Gyn Wallace wrote: Gyn Wallace wrote: I'm trying to imagine edge cases, ... Let me flesh that out better, because Kaeru's idea is awesome. So imagine you've got a protosquad, team deployed to the attrition match. Their strategy is to revive their fallen, and keep their average respawns down to 4 or 5, so they can all run proto gear. The other side runs cheap suits and fails to hold the null cannons at all for the first half of the match. The cheap suits burn up the proto squad's isk pool as the cheap suit team's MCC goes to 1/4 armor. Proto-team is down to three players, and the remainder hold respawn, because they're about to (or have) run out of isk. This is where my prior post's question comes into play. Does the match not end until the cheap suits have held the null cannons long enough to burn through the proto team's MCC shields and armor, or until they've tracked down and killed the last proto-team's cloaked scout? That's potentially a very long time for a bunch of people to be waiting and unable to respawn. It begs for the ability to leave the match early without losing all rewards for having participated. If we can still join matches late and earn rewards for only partial participation, being able to leave attrition mode matches early, earning partial rewards, would be reasonable. If that's not feasable, coming up with a faster way to end the match than my hypothetical would be beneficial for wait times, and getting people back into the pool of players available for the next game's queue. or what if you "renew confidence" from your employer by completing a randomly selected objective ( get x amount of kills, hold objective for x amount of time, capture an objective, kill the highest ranking player on enemy team) and if you succeed, the you receive additional funding and your team continues the fight. so basically the fiight goes on until the OPs conditions are met or the "employer" loses confidence in your team and cancel the contract. this would create for some potenitally long and intense battles where a losing team can rally and make a comeback. to that end, i'd also suggest the ability to spend WPs to aid your team by healing you MCC. you can use WPs to repair MCC damage. this means a player or squad can join a mtach late and turn the match around throught their additional efforts. I very much like this attrition game mode idea for public contracts. I also like the ideas of sub missions within the game mode such as kill the highest ranking team member or hold an objective for x amount of time. Hope they are implemented. There has been ideas of PORTALS being used in DUST514 as well. Within that thread I have supported ideas of creating a safe zone for each team that interacts with 'ally entry only' portals at each side of the maps. You could implement some of those ideas and attach a isk value to each portal, allowing vehicles to destroy the enemy teams portals and make the enemy lose more isk (but not have special events such as destroying all enemy portals creates an automatic win). Each portal could perhaps be worth 8% of the enemies ISK budget with roughly 5 portals being owned by each team. This would help give vehicles another purpose on the battlefield to help incentivize the use of vehicles (to help balance out the disincentive created by vehicles costing a lot of ISK where dropsuits are cheaper and can potential perform any role a vehicle can). This would also help incentivize the use of forge guns and plasma cannons and mass drivers which might be underused weapons at the moment.
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 734	Posted - 2015.03.11 04:46:00 - [34] - Quote That's a pretty cool new idea. I don't know if it would work or could be done or how numbers would have to be tweaked -- but I'd be excited about playing it if it were added to the game. Bump plus like from me.
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 5247	Posted - 2015.03.11 09:45:00 - [35] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: pretty cool actually, maximizes skill and efficiency. This is like hardcore mode :) No one will play it. Usually banned for being too awesome.
Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2562	Posted - 2015.03.11 10:06:00 - [36] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: I don't really see why you can' just say that when a BPO 'dies' it adds its equivalent MLT/STD cost the overall 'ISK Counter'. Yeah, that would have to be the case, or else BPOs would be quite literally P2W. Or we could do it with Meta Levels... Each team has 10000 Meta Level Points to use, or something. A full Proto suit would run the team 8-9x more points if it was lost compared to a Standard suit. Home at Last <3
Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2562	Posted - 2015.03.11 10:07:00 - [37] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: pretty cool actually, maximizes skill and efficiency. This is like hardcore mode :) No Protoscrubs will play it. FTFY Home at Last <3
duster 35000 Algintal Core Gallente Federation 376	Posted - 2015.03.11 10:10:00 - [38] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition SETUP: Both teams have 150 clones and an MCC each. There are a variable number of null cannon installations (1~5). All current maps for skirmish and domination remain viable for this game mode. CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. This includes: 1. The MCC itself (worth aprox. 75mil or more, guaranteed loss if MCC is destroyed) 2. Dropsuits 3. Vehicles CCP, please consider this and give it some thought. Thank you for reading. I forgot, what was attricion like in mag? Molestia approved
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 5249	Posted - 2015.03.11 10:14:00 - [39] - Quote Fizzer XCIV wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: pretty cool actually, maximizes skill and efficiency. This is like hardcore mode :) No Protoscrubs will play it. FTFY BPO's by proxy would have to be banned. That alone would make it the one mode that I WOULD want to play. But think about it. Advanced gear is a fraction of the cost of proto gear, and in many cases just as capable of killing proto. Running proto is, effectively, the fastest way to lose the match. If you ran tanks, which are pretty much filler all things considered, you lose it even faster. The mode would simply be broken. If you run proto, you lose. If you run advanced or lower (like most people do), the attrition never becomes a factor. So it would be a pointless game mode. Nobody could run anything good, and if they did, their team would immediately hate them. Just a bad game mode, period. I would be more interested in Skirmish being refined. Add alternate methods of damaging the MCC like we used to have in beta. Put in different null cannon types with different damage profiles. Maybe put in an optional objective that gives some kind of bonus akin to an anti-vehicle cruise missile strike on cooldown. There are cool things that can be done with skirmish. We don't need a new game mode to bring them out and further segregate the playerbase. Usually banned for being too awesome.
Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2562	Posted - 2015.03.11 10:15:00 - [40] - Quote duster 35000 wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition SETUP: Both teams have 150 clones and an MCC each. There are a variable number of null cannon installations (1~5). All current maps for skirmish and domination remain viable for this game mode. CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. This includes: 1. The MCC itself (worth aprox. 75mil or more, guaranteed loss if MCC is destroyed) 2. Dropsuits 3. Vehicles CCP, please consider this and give it some thought. Thank you for reading. I forgot, what was attricion like in mag? There wasn't an attrition game mode in mag. Maybe you are thinking of Interdiction, which was pretty much the Skirmish we have in Dust? Or maybe Acquisition, which was capture the flag with an attzcking and defending team, and the flay was a MAV. But the closest to what he described is Suppression, which is basically TDM with 32v32. Home at Last <3

Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2562	Posted - 2015.03.11 10:21:00 - [41] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Fizzer XCIV wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: pretty cool actually, maximizes skill and efficiency. This is like hardcore mode :) No Protoscrubs will play it. FTFY BPO's by proxy would have to be banned. That alone would make it the one mode that I WOULD want to play. But think about it. Advanced gear is a fraction of the cost of proto gear, and in many cases just as capable of killing proto. Running proto is, effectively, the fastest way to lose the match. If you ran tanks, which are pretty much filler all things considered, you lose it even faster. The mode would simply be broken. If you run proto, you lose. If you run advanced or lower (like most people do), the attrition never becomes a factor. So it would be a pointless game mode. Nobody could run anything good, and if they did, their team would immediately hate them. Just a bad game mode, period. I don't know. I'd love it, since it would place ISK efficiency above K/D, and it would provide a more level playing field and there for be a more accurate test of skill, since it would disincentivize Proto gear to the point that pretty much nobody would use it... And like others said, BPOs could just be worth their ISK price in this situation, which is something I'm fairly certain is already done when calculating payouts for each team... I'd play the **** out of it. It sounds like "Better Ambush" to me... Home at Last <3
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 5249	Posted - 2015.03.11 10:25:00 - [42] - Quote Keeping tally of Isk destruction doesn't have to be a game mode. It should simply be an in-your-face stat that belongs to every game mode. Again, it would be a pointless game mode. You wouldn't be allowed to use anything good without incurring the wrath of your team. If you ran proto, you would be hated. If you didn't run proto, you would constantly be blaming the people who did. It would be a poor, negative experience every time you went into a match. Usually banned for being too awesome.
Mejt0 Dead Man's Game RUST415 1001	Posted - 2015.03.11 13:09:00 - [43] - Quote It would still be the same gamemode : skirmish, just with changed rules. Why not make FFA mode? Or Vehicle only mode, where : two teams have to destroy each other // team A has to destroy X to win, while team B has to defend X to win. X - {instalations, neutral objects, etc.} Caldari Hero Loyal To The State Mejt0 Sale List
Gyn Wallace Ready to Play 290	Posted - 2015.03.11 13:45:00 - [44] - Quote Fizzer XCIV wrote: I don't know. I'd love it, since it would place ISK efficiency above K/D, and it would provide a more level playing field and there for be a more accurate test of skill, since it would [discourage] Proto gear to the point that pretty much nobody would use it.. Unless the limit were under 8M for each 16 man side, I suspect you'd see organized teams running a pattern of suits, including protosuits for first spawns, with very cheap back up suits. Another one of the consequences, would be organized limiting of the number of logis, since their equipment costs are disproportionately expensive. You'd almost never see a que-synced pair of squads with more than four needles, whereas now you're likely to see as many needles as logis. Hives would be spent less haphazardly. This game mode is in part a better solution to equipment spam than bandwidth. One of the beauties of this mode would be if hacked vehicles subtracted isk from the team that lost them and added to the team that hacked them.. (Although its more likely that CCP would handle this like FW, blowing up a vehicle after the enemy hacks it, would probably subtract from the enemy's isk limit.) Expect LAVs with remotes to be mysteriously undefended. The Dust/Eve Isk Exchange Thread
Moorian Flav 317	Posted - 2015.03.11 14:52:00 - [45] - Quote This would of been cool last year or any time before that but most battles are over in the first 5 minutes any more. In FW, battles are often times over in the warbarge by most deciding to leave or sit in the MCC by looking at the enemy player list. If any thing, we need either shorter game modes or smaller battle sizes to compensate for this horrible trend. There could be other solutions but I doubt anything else would make such players actually fight as most only want to fight if facing little opposition. I don't troll; I tell the truth. I'm also known as "The ANTI-Propaganda Machine".
Ku Shala UNITED MERCINARY AND PILOTS ALLIANCE 1299	Posted - 2015.03.11 16:13:00 - [46] - Quote sounds cool , does it need a clone count? maybe a vehicle mode with a higher isk cap. *-¦a+ó a+ú-Æa+äla+ä (CK-0 Specialist)* Caldari Loyalist Superior technology will privale.
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 600	Posted - 2015.03.11 16:38:00 - [47] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: [...] If you ran proto, you would be hated. [...] lol Know what cannot be known.
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 735	Posted - 2015.03.12 01:09:00 - [48] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Keeping tally of Isk destruction doesn't have to be a game mode. It should simply be an in-your-face stat that belongs to every game mode. Again, it would be a pointless game mode. You wouldn't be allowed to use anything good without incurring the wrath of your team. If you ran proto, you would be hated. If you didn't run proto, you would constantly be blaming the people who did. It would be a poor, negative experience every time you went into a match. Unless you ran proto and killed more than you lost with it. Then it would be cool. Instead of Kills/Deaths at the end we would have Isk Destroyed/Isk Lost. It's the EXACT same thing as KDR, which is what Ambush boils down to, only deeper, more complex and nuanced. Arguing AGAINST complexity, depth, and nuance in New Eden is akin to suicide in public areas. Don't be a statistic.
WeapondigitX V7 The Exemplars RISE of LEGION 261	Posted - 2015.03.12 04:39:00 - [49] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Keeping tally of Isk destruction doesn't have to be a game mode. It should simply be an in-your-face stat that belongs to every game mode. Again, it would be a pointless game mode. You wouldn't be allowed to use anything good without incurring the wrath of your team. If you ran proto, you would be hated. If you didn't run proto, you would constantly be blaming the people who did. It would be a poor, negative experience every time you went into a match. You are assuming that every player in the match would value different tactics of winning compared to you that is playing the match. They would not be unified completely, some would agree with you and some would disagree. You could also apply your argument to skirmish and ambush in a different way to make the point that the game mode idea 'attrition' can not be worse that our current game modes in terms of player attitudes. Here is the application of the argument to skirmish and ambush: 'I hate those proto stompers on the opposite team, they ruin my game experience, they have infinite isk, it makes it harder for me to feel my efforts are worth it, it makes the game feel like a losing battle.' That is how some players feel about our current game modes. That is probably to most negative attitude you will find. I doubt that is more negative than the attitude some players would have towards proto gear players in the 'attrition' game mode. I have tried to make the attrition game mode idea look like it is just as bad a idea as our current game modes. As a result It makes it hard to argue why we should not create the game mode 'attrition' because it is easier to believe that 'attrition' would not make the DUST514 experience any worse. It could only make DUST514 much better or just as bad/good as the game currently is. The is no losing scenario if you see our current game modes as good game modes.
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1843	Posted - 2015.03.12 10:33:00 - [50] - Quote Agreed, a very cool mode indeed. That would require players to fit an entirely new line of dropsuit fittings for that which is also nice (if they have room for new ones) Looking at both sides of the coin. Even Aurum one.

Jathniel Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 1497	Posted - 2015.03.12 17:54:00 - [51] - Quote I'm President Luvthis Idea. And I approve this message. Retired
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 881	Posted - 2015.04.01 20:01:00 - [52] - Quote @Rattati, Hoping that this idea won't have too many obstacles to overcome ! Know what cannot be known.
emm kay Direct Action Resources 294	Posted - 2015.04.01 20:10:00 - [53] - Quote Pagl1u M wrote: What about apex suits and bpos? APEX -> aurum components -> ISK variants. APEX suit -> racial variants -> ISK variant. There is a reason you never see me in battle. it's because I see you first.
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 975	Posted - 2015.04.01 23:28:00 - [54] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition SETUP: Both teams have 150 clones and an MCC each. There are a variable number of null cannon installations (1~5). All current maps for skirmish and domination remain viable for this game mode. CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. This includes: 1. The MCC itself (worth aprox. 75mil or more, guaranteed loss if MCC is destroyed) 2. Dropsuits 3. Vehicles CCP, please consider this and give it some thought. Thank you for reading. I'd like it as just an extra feature in battles, along with MCC/Clone war. Pretty sure something like this was mentioned before once. Puts staying alive higher on the list and gives people a reason not to spam expensive gear.
DR DEESE NUTS 28	Posted - 2015.04.02 03:20:00 - [55] - Quote Maybe have a 6v6 version of it also? The USS m`dick
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 721	Posted - 2015.04.02 17:40:00 - [56] - Quote +1 Where do I sign up? also would this be particularly complex to code? I have no idea... Ratt?... Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair.
Kierkegaard Soren Corrosive Synergy Rise Of Legion. 736	Posted - 2015.04.02 21:02:00 - [57] - Quote This is an awesome idea that adds a whole new dimension to a match. ISK is both a resource and a weapon within the wider EVE universe, might as well be the same in Dust. Clever players vs Proto warriors? Yes please. Dedicated Commando. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 901	Posted - 2015.04.03 21:15:00 - [58] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition SETUP: Both teams have 150 clones and an MCC each. There are a variable number of null cannon installations (1~5). All current maps for skirmish and domination remain viable for this game mode. CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. This includes: 1. The MCC itself (worth aprox. 75mil or more, guaranteed loss if MCC is destroyed) 2. Dropsuits 3. Vehicles CCP, please consider this and give it some thought. Thank you for reading. I'd like it as just an extra feature in battles, along with MCC/Clone war. Pretty sure something like this was mentioned before once. Puts staying alive higher on the list and gives people a reason not to spam expensive gear. I'm actually hoping that IF this gets implemented and IF it becomes popular, it can be added to all game modes. I think starting out as it's own thing is prudent though. Know what cannot be known.
Godin Thekiller Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 3018	Posted - 2015.04.03 22:34:00 - [59] - Quote I don't see the point in this, unless the gear we use doesn't cost anything. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 1045	Posted - 2015.04.28 20:00:00 - [60] - Quote Any hope for this in a distant future release :D ? Know what cannot be known.

Alena Ventrallis Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 3031	Posted - 2015.04.28 20:43:00 - [61] - Quote And all those assets (including 75m from MCC) go into the pot for payments. My APEX suits are ready... Whirly gun make much thunder! - Victor
Scheneighnay McBob And the ButtPirates 6271	Posted - 2015.04.29 01:14:00 - [62] - Quote I like. I like very much. Some details can be ignored
DDx77 OUTCAST MERCS General Tso's Alliance 228	Posted - 2015.04.29 03:32:00 - [63] - Quote I Effing Fraking love this game mode idea
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 1	Posted - 2015.06.26 20:23:00 - [64] - Quote Hoping to keep this idea alive until it's a possibility. A lot of people backing it up, after PC is setup, please give it some thought ! Know what cannot be known.
501st Headstrong 0uter.heaven 1	Posted - 2015.06.27 01:53:00 - [65] - Quote Oh yes please :) "There are no rights. The world owes no one a living."-Sumner *The Mascot of 0uter.Heaven * Internet down atm :(
Stupid Blueberry RED 0MEN. Evil Syndicate Alliance. 1	Posted - 2015.06.27 02:51:00 - [66] - Quote I love this, it provides a reason to use those standard bpo suits and mlt modules instead of apex. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Haajakin Kalen. Blueberry smokin' that crack y'all
Devadander Woodgrain Atari 311	Posted - 2015.06.27 17:37:00 - [67] - Quote After four complete reads, I can't like this enough. This is something for every mode. This is the mindset that brings us closer to new Eden. Players with too much money will actually have to think. New berries with 3-10k suits become an asset. Vehicle operators will take less chances. "The thinking man's shooter" Gêå You want a toe? I can get you a toe dude. Gêå Joined - 06-28-12 ~Deal with it~
Text Grant PIanet Express Smart Deploy 432	Posted - 2015.06.28 13:00:00 - [68] - Quote +1
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 1	Posted - 2015.06.30 18:01:00 - [69] - Quote Devadander wrote: After four complete reads, I can't like this enough. This is something for every mode. This is the mindset that brings us closer to new Eden. Players with too much money will actually have to think. New berries with 3-10k suits become an asset. Vehicle operators will take less chances. "The thinking man's shooter" Excellent points ! I'm particularly interested in seeing vehicles used a lot less as suicide transports. It really takes away from the role of a vehicle operator. Know what cannot be known.
Text Grant PIanet Express Smart Deploy 434	Posted - 2015.07.03 16:50:00 - [70] - Quote Bump

Sigourney Reever Hyasyoda Terrestrial Acquisitions Firm 119	Posted - 2015.07.03 17:07:00 - [71] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: pretty cool actually, maximizes skill and efficiency. This is like hardcore mode :) Obviously you'd want to introduce better EoM accounting for ISK Risked, and ISK lost, vs ISK risked destroyed. It would improve 'the keep what you win' features coming to PC as well. You could also scale Public matches with different total loss limits. You've got the all numbers already to make the current status quo and scale it up from there. You'd also be able to add ISK efficiency into the calculations for Loyalty Rankings (overall and FW) and matchmaking.
Jenni Welsh Reincarnation Incorporated 8	Posted - 2015.07.03 20:23:00 - [72] - Quote Gyn Wallace wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Accessible through Public Contracts: Attrition CONDITIONS FOR VICTORY: First side to lose 20 million isk LOSES THE MATCH. .. Nice, so isk efficient players who slay with their basic and advanced suits might win the game against protostompers, even if they lost a few more clones in the process. I like it. My only question is: How are BPOs valued toward the victory condition? The same way as for match rewards or differently? I like the point he made about it helping to create a more proto-free environment. :) Obviously there are many items that would need to be either prohibited or coded for this kinda play... Apex, Aurum, BPOs, Experimental items, Officer items... there are probably more I'm not thinking of (there in would lie the greatest difficulty in seeing this come to life). Something else that might be cool is a Tactical game mode to encourage proto, squad, and teamwork more where there are up to 15 players and the match starts at a low reserve level (making it so that if you die then that's it unless you get resurrected, maybe allowing for 1 additional spawn per player)... standard domination and skirmish maps applying... Welcome to the snipe hunt. lol :)
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 1	Posted - 2015.07.03 21:37:00 - [73] - Quote Jenni Welsh wrote: [...]Obviously there are many items that would need to be either prohibited or coded for this kinda play... Apex, Aurum, BPOs, Experimental items, Officer items... there are probably more I'm not thinking of (there in would lie the greatest difficulty in seeing this come to life). [...] As discussed, all those items actually have ISK values attached to them. There is no reason to prohibit them, as their built in ISK values can be used and deducted from the team they belong to when destroyed. Know what cannot be known.
Jenni Welsh Reincarnation Incorporated 10	Posted - 2015.07.04 07:50:00 - [74] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Jenni Welsh wrote: [...]Obviously there are many items that would need to be either prohibited or coded for this kinda play... Apex, Aurum, BPOs, Experimental items, Officer items... there are probably more I'm not thinking of (there in would lie the greatest difficulty in seeing this come to life). [...] As discussed, all those items actually have ISK values attached to them. There is no reason to prohibit them, as their built in ISK values can be used and deducted from the team they belong to when destroyed. Yeah, but stuff like the APEX suits cost 10MILLION ISK, so basically 3 or so APEX suits are killed and game over (that was my point).
VikingKong iBUN 0uter.Heaven 464	Posted - 2015.07.04 16:15:00 - [75] - Quote Not a bad idea, but I can see a lot of people raging because of that one blueberry dying 10 times in proto and losing the game for the entire team. I would like a Gallente SMG. TUNNEL SNAKES RULE
Text Grant PIanet Express Smart Deploy 434	Posted - 2015.07.04 18:57:00 - [76] - Quote Jenni Welsh wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Jenni Welsh wrote: [...]Obviously there are many items that would need to be either prohibited or coded for this kinda play... Apex, Aurum, BPOs, Experimental items, Officer items... there are probably more I'm not thinking of (there in would lie the greatest difficulty in seeing this come to life). [...] As discussed, all those items actually have ISK values attached to them. There is no reason to prohibit them, as their built in ISK values can be used and deducted from the team they belong to when destroyed. Yeah, but stuff like the APEX suits cost 10MILLION ISK, so basically 3 or so APEX suits are killed and game over (that was my point). Actually the BPO cost is 10 mil. The BPC cost might be 10k isk. It's nowhere near 10 mil. That is what he meant by a built in isk value.
Kaeru Nayiri OSG Planetary Operations 1	Posted - 2015.09.03 23:21:00 - [77] - Quote Jenni Welsh wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Jenni Welsh wrote: [...]Obviously there are many items that would need to be either prohibited or coded for this kinda play... Apex, Aurum, BPOs, Experimental items, Officer items... there are probably more I'm not thinking of (there in would lie the greatest difficulty in seeing this come to life). [...] As discussed, all those items actually have ISK values attached to them. There is no reason to prohibit them, as their built in ISK values can be used and deducted from the team they belong to when destroyed. Yeah, but stuff like the APEX suits cost 10MILLION ISK, so basically 3 or so APEX suits are killed and game over (that was my point). The data base isk value of an apex suit is not 10 million, it's something under 50k (probably much less). What you pay to aquire it and the database sale value are a little different in this case. Know what cannot be known.


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