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Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18740	Posted - 2015.03.02 19:53:00 - [1] - Quote This is not being actively worked on but I would like to gather enough cards on the table that if work does start we can give the pilot suit the healthy things it needs to grow as an idea into reality. However it seems there are some conundrums. 1 Being that if they effect vehicles to heavily they can ruin the planned meta. 2 Defanging the pilot suit however in this manner will make them inferior suits to pilot the vehicle. 3 Forcing pilot suits into pilot seats seems to take away from the freedom of the game Minding this so far most players I've initially spoken to agree to the: 1. Sidearm only 2. Light Frame base suit. Not saying you have to agree to it but every other frame has had 2 roles in it and the second scout suit model has strong resemblance to that of a pilot getup to begin with. So anyways drop suggestions on how shape and form a pilot suit up. So debate among yourselves and show me what you guys got on the creative juices. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. 4067	Posted - 2015.03.02 20:24:00 - [2] - Quote 1 - I think AV being better than a vehicle at killing vehicles is broken meta but it seems im in the minority 2 - If they make pilot suits a must have to make a vehicle better and a harder nut for AV to crack while HAV/ADS pilots get to have fun whacking each other i don't think pilots will mind that much, AV will cry but i doubt it would get that far. 3. Knackers up the LAV but the pilot suit has to affect all vehicles. Pilot suit - Light, sidearm, low HP, 1 equip, any modules slots would have to have some modules that help enhance the vehicle in someway such as EWAR/HP/module efficencies etc Skills wise they have to have an effect on all vehicles including LAVs so caldari for shield/gallente rep/armor armor/minmatar speed etc Possibly could make a doc up or something for all races
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18742	Posted - 2015.03.02 20:36:00 - [3] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: 1 - I think AV being better than a vehicle at killing vehicles is broken meta but it seems im in the minority 2 - If they make pilot suits a must have to make a vehicle better and a harder nut for AV to crack while HAV/ADS pilots get to have fun whacking each other i don't think pilots will mind that much, AV will cry but i doubt it would get that far. 3. Knackers up the LAV but the pilot suit has to affect all vehicles. Pilot suit - Light, sidearm, low HP, 1 equip, any modules slots would have to have some modules that help enhance the vehicle in someway such as EWAR/HP/module efficencies etc Skills wise they have to have an effect on all vehicles including LAVs so caldari for shield/gallente rep/armor armor/minmatar speed etc Possibly could make a doc up or something for all races Not here to discuss Vehicle and AV stay on topic please also knackers? I am not a world linguist on slang so... CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3017	Posted - 2015.03.02 20:39:00 - [4] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: 1 - I think AV being better than a vehicle at killing vehicles is broken meta but it seems im in the minority 2 - If they make pilot suits a must have to make a vehicle better and a harder nut for AV to crack while HAV/ADS pilots get to have fun whacking each other i don't think pilots will mind that much, AV will cry but i doubt it would get that far. 3. Knackers up the LAV but the pilot suit has to affect all vehicles. Pilot suit - Light, sidearm, low HP, 1 equip, any modules slots would have to have some modules that help enhance the vehicle in someway such as EWAR/HP/module efficencies etc Skills wise they have to have an effect on all vehicles including LAVs so caldari for shield/gallente rep/armor armor/minmatar speed etc Possibly could make a doc up or something for all races Not here to discuss Vehicle and AV stay on topic please also knackers? I am not a world linguist on slang so... It's entirely on topic. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 8165	Posted - 2015.03.02 20:43:00 - [5] - Quote I would be ok with them getting a bonus to cloak like scouts so long as they have 1 EQ slot. I think whatever vehicle meta there is, particularly with HP (maybe damage), they could drop it 10% and give Pilots a 2% per level bonus to HP (and/or damage). I think they shouldn't have too many slots, something like Commandos currently have. Create Vehicle Use mods and give racial bonuses to efficacy, and perhaps have a rather high fitting cost with all Pilots getting a percentage off per level of the basic Pilot skill. Since they are light suits, they could theoretically move faster in light vehicles than say heavies. Those are just a few ideas that came to me, they don't all have to go together and you can adjust or amend them as you see fit. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17412	Posted - 2015.03.02 20:44:00 - [6] - Quote I'll throw it out there IWS I'd spend millions of SP to get a suit type that even adjusted small things that turret tracking, turret fitting, heat build up and even if the bonuses were only in the region of 1-2% per level. If it was had to be something I'd like the pilot suit to be a defining visual affirmation of the pilot role. Not wholly necessary but useful if you are interested in furthering your capabilities as a pilot. "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
Avallo Kantor 465	Posted - 2015.03.02 20:47:00 - [7] - Quote The main points that need to be addressed as well for pilot suits is: -How do you make an advantage on the suits that make them better than running other suits for vehicles? I agree with IWS on the matter of not making pilots a "forced" choice to drive a vehicle, but that means that pilot suits need someway to be more attractive than other suits in driving a vehicle, such that it becomes the "sensible" option. -How do you make a pilot wish to run a pilot suit other than militia. For this one, we have to acknowledge for Pilot suits to be viable they have to have some benefit other than the naked suit itself, and that benefit has to be vehicle directed. People are not going to be willing to take on pilot suits if they are not in vehicles, and if a proto pilot suit can't give benefits to a vehicle over a militia suit, then nobody will run anything higher. -They have to be balanced in cost WITH the cost of a tank or dropship in mind. The pricing structure on these suits has to be something that can not add significant costs to vehicle users per life over what they have now. Already some vehicle users find themselves running hard on being ISK-neutral, let alone ISK-positive. Adding potentially the cost of a fully kitted out Proto Suit in cost is not something most pilots would be able to tolerate, except for the hyper wealthy. (Note this could also be balanced by dropping the cost of vehicles, and modules) -They cannot have PG / CPU Bonuses to Vehicles A vehicle fitting must be able to stand independent of a pilot suit, or else you will have the situation of having to allow vehicles to fit illegal fittings, and potentially sit useless on the battle field. A Pilot should not have to take into account fitting considerations that nobody else in EVE or DUST has to. -They should not have the "dead on exit" issue. This issue originates in EVE where it was once possible to destroy a ship upon leaving it, as pilot skills enhanced it's hp values. By leaving the ship, these additional hp values would be lost causing the ship to blow up simply by having the capsuleer leave their ship. This should not happen in DUST. -Considerations for Multi-person vehicles and Dedicated Gunners? Will pilot suits be able to affect any vehicle they enter, or would only the driver benefit the vehicle? Will there be any ways for "dedicated gunners" to affect their favored small turrets. (For example, a dedicated Dropship gunner may want to be able to improve their own gun, regardless of their pilot)
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. 4068	Posted - 2015.03.02 21:02:00 - [8] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: 1 - I think AV being better than a vehicle at killing vehicles is broken meta but it seems im in the minority 2 - If they make pilot suits a must have to make a vehicle better and a harder nut for AV to crack while HAV/ADS pilots get to have fun whacking each other i don't think pilots will mind that much, AV will cry but i doubt it would get that far. 3. Knackers up the LAV but the pilot suit has to affect all vehicles. Pilot suit - Light, sidearm, low HP, 1 equip, any modules slots would have to have some modules that help enhance the vehicle in someway such as EWAR/HP/module efficencies etc Skills wise they have to have an effect on all vehicles including LAVs so caldari for shield/gallente rep/armor armor/minmatar speed etc Possibly could make a doc up or something for all races Not here to discuss Vehicle and AV stay on topic please also knackers? I am not a world linguist on slang so... Doesn't matter if you are not here to discuss that but it is a form of meta which in my book is broken and is a part of the problem of pilot suits because with it broken how do you put in pilot suits and what effects will they have? It has to be considered. Knackered - Broken - The LAV is open top and a flimsy pilot suit could get shot out of it with ease so it is more risk unless we get a roof on it with bulletproof glass.
Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3074	Posted - 2015.03.02 21:22:00 - [9] - Quote The most important thing: The color must be orange. Dust is there! I was real! Dear diary, Rattati senpai noticed me today~
Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3074	Posted - 2015.03.02 21:23:00 - [10] - Quote IWS, is there a technical possibility of introducing a "vehicle link module" system, similar to fleet boosters in Eve? Dust is there! I was real! Dear diary, Rattati senpai noticed me today~

el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 868	Posted - 2015.03.02 21:32:00 - [11] - Quote I have not piloted very often except in the most utilitarian manner and though I have been lately exploring the roles more my input is based on pretty limited experience. That being said, I definitley do not want to see pilot suits be required to pilot. If we need to add piloting skills (more than already exist insofar as unlocking vehicle use goes) thats fine, just not a requirement of pilot suit =vehicle use. LAV, HAV or DS. I also agree with those who are lobbying for Pilot Suits that add or enhance some aspect of vehicle use. Turret rotation speed bonuses sound good, and I would add module use/regen bonuses as well seem like obvious choices, what about actual handling bonuses like maybe a DS under fire "knockaround" reduction? Or how about automatic vehicle queue priority and faster recall? This sort of thing just make sense, to me. I'm not sure about it having to be a light frame, but if it is it should probably be one eq slot, bonused (if not outright pre-fitted) to a vehicle repper, higher db profile, and no grenades depending on whatever other bonuses are applied. Also not sure about it being sidearm only, I know any time I've crashed away from where I needed to be a light weapon has been my friend in getting to where I gotta go. Making the suit, again relative to w/e works out as the bonusing, single-weapon slot oriented makes sense tho. I read some of a previous Pilot Suit discussion and a major driver of the weapon situation is the possession of AV by a pilot. Being single-weapon in and of itself is a huge mitigator of that, IMO, since toting a swarm as your only weapon leaves you totally vulnerable to other infantry. Again, I don't neccessarily do a lot of piloting but for what it's worth that's where I'm at. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5120	Posted - 2015.03.02 22:08:00 - [12] - Quote I'll keep this concise even though the thread will undoubtedly derail before page 3. Suit must be weak outside of a vehicle, but not so weak that a pilot suit in an LAV is easily shot out. Requiring a pilot suit to pilot DOES restrict the freedom of the game, and should be avoided like the plague. Sidearm only is a given. No grenades. I'm against any sort of equipment. People will complain that they need a repair tool but native armor repair resolves this need. Others will claim they need uplinks, but anything that happens outside of a vehicle is not the role of the Pilot suit, dropping uplinks included. The act of dropping uplinks is is NOT part of the vehicle role, even if a vehicle is used to get to the drop location. Incidentally, mCRUs need to be easier fit/more accessible as well as have a distinct advantage over Uplinks. Note that the pilot doesn't HAVE to be a Light Frame, its an obvious choice since Light frames lack a secondary specialist frame, but it really doesn't HAVE to be one if balance causes issues. Suit must have Link Modules which are fit to the suit and boost either the vehicle or the modules on the vehicle. Benefit from links needs to be fairly small with no downside as to avoid excessive power creep, and avoid issue where non-pilot suit driven vehicles become non-viable. Benefit can be larger if an associated downside is attached to it, as the module still provides a positive benefit overall but a downgrade in another aspect of the vehicle. Somewhat like Rigs, or even Shield Rechargers vs Shield Energizers. Role Bonus for Pilot suit should be fitting reduction to Link Modules, as well as a generic benefit (without any sort of downside) which will be effective for any vehicle (Dropship, HAV, LAV) and racial bonuses should be useful for any vehicle within that race (In other words avoid bonuses which would only be useful to specific races/hull types) Consider tying Link Module skills to existing vehicle skills (For example Vehicle Armor Plate Modules and Armor Plate Link Modules unlocked via the same skill) as to avoid excessive SP cost in comparison to other non-Pilot roles. Cost of Suits/Modules needs to be carefully looked at, as the suit will likely die with the vehicle and excessively expensive suits on top of the vehicle cost may make them cost prohibitive in many situations. You can't balance with ISK, so don't go too crazy with the cost and make it too painful to die. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 868	Posted - 2015.03.02 22:16:00 - [13] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: I'll keep this concise even though the thread will undoubtedly derail before page 3. Suit must be weak outside of a vehicle, but not so weak that a pilot suit in an LAV is easily shot out. Requiring a pilot suit to pilot DOES restrict the freedom of the game, and should be avoided like the plague. Sidearm only is a given. No grenades. I'm against any sort of equipment. People will complain that they need a repair tool but native armor repair resolves this need. Others will claim they need uplinks, but anything that happens outside of a vehicle is not the role of the Pilot suit, dropping uplinks included. The act of dropping uplinks is is NOT part of the vehicle role, even if a vehicle is used to get to the drop location. Incidentally, mCRUs need to be easier fit/more accessible as well as have a distinct advantage over Uplinks. Note that the pilot doesn't HAVE to be a Light Frame, its an obvious choice since Light frames lack a secondary specialist frame, but it really doesn't HAVE to be one if balance causes issues. Suit must have Link Modules which are fit to the suit and boost either the vehicle or the modules on the vehicle. Benefit from links needs to be fairly small with no downside as to avoid excessive power creep, and avoid issue where non-pilot suit driven vehicles become non-viable. Benefit can be larger if an associated downside is attached to it, as the module still provides a positive benefit overall but a downgrade in another aspect of the vehicle. Somewhat like Rigs, or even Shield Rechargers vs Shield Energizers. Role Bonus for Pilot suit should be fitting reduction to Link Modules, as well as a generic benefit (without any sort of downside) which will be effective for any vehicle (Dropship, HAV, LAV) and racial bonuses should be useful for any vehicle within that race (In other words avoid bonuses which would only be useful to specific races/hull types) Consider tying Link Module skills to existing vehicle skills (For example Vehicle Armor Plate Modules and Armor Plate Link Modules unlocked via the same skill) as to avoid excessive SP cost in comparison to other non-Pilot roles. Cost of Suits/Modules needs to be carefully looked at, as the suit will likely die with the vehicle and excessively expensive suits on top of the vehicle cost may make them cost prohibitive in many situations. You can't balance with ISK, so don't go too crazy with the cost and make it too painful to die. Why, ooc, is "sidearm only" a given? If the frame is designed properly type/stat/bonus-wise is having an AR really being predicted as a being a problem? In my experience from playing as a Logi, being one weapon by itself has a huge impact on battlefield survivability. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Shamarskii Simon The Hundred Acre Hood RISE of LEGION 157	Posted - 2015.03.02 22:32:00 - [14] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194343&find=unread This thread by spkr is a nice starting place, check it out. It covers some of the basic things like just what it does, how it affects vehicles, and a few bonus ideas. Entering the void and becoming wind. Message for 1v1 air to air
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command 1009	Posted - 2015.03.02 22:33:00 - [15] - Quote - If I want to modify how the vehicle operates I want do that by fitting it accordingly. If I want higher resistances, I'd rather have a vehicle module to do that than a pilot suit. If I want better turret tracking (I mainly pilot NDS ), I'd rather have a vehicle module to do that than a pilot suit. If I want better vehicle handling, I'd rather have a vehicle module to do that than a pilot suit. ... In short: Don't have two systems that do the same thing. Pilot suit effects should not stack with skill bonuses and vehicle fittings. - I'd consider it a valuable experience to eject from a flaming dropship over hostile territory in a pilot suit and try to make it back with barely and hp and only a Scrambler Pistol as a weapon. ... Or just call in a new DS because that can be done anywhere on the map? - I used to use a Scout suit with a Sniper Rifle as a pilot suit. The Scout gave me ~80 m passive scans at a pretty good precision so I could always scan out the landing zone. The sniper rifle was only used to extend the draw distance on infantry so I'd have a better chance of spotting forgeguns and swarmers. It also had knives as a backup - just because it's cool to act out the 'stranded pilot' role by trying to cut open their throats rather than allowing them to take you prisoner. This suit isn't useful anymore, so these days I just run a Logi and farm WP by placing uplinks... - While it can be annoying to have the pilot of a LAV jump out and kill you with an HMG I don't mind it as a mechanic. If we want to fix that we should rather look at fixing the tanking ability of unfit LAV BPOs. I don't mind HMG tank drivers or HAV pilots with swarm launchers. Those strategies have advantages and disadvantages that depend on the situation. Neither of these is a "I win" button. Verdict: I don't mind the current situation. Pilot suits are a neat concept, but I'm not convinced they'd actually improve gameplay.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5121	Posted - 2015.03.02 22:39:00 - [16] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Why, ooc, is "sidearm only" a given? If the frame is designed properly type/stat/bonus-wise is having an AR really being predicted as a being a problem? In my experience from playing as a Logi, being one weapon by itself has a huge impact on battlefield survivability. Well as I stated, the pilot should be nearly useless outside of its vehicle. Anything that happens outside of the vehicle is not the role of the pilot, so I see no reason why they should have more than a sidearm. Additionally from my understanding, even modern tankers in the real world rarely carry what you would consider a "primary weapon" and tend to have PDWs, such as pistols and SMGs because they are small and compact and fit will inside the cramped quarters of a tank. As for the Logi example, I feel that Logis do have some limited combat role in the form of fire support, or indirect combat support (The Mass Driver is an awesome example of this). As such I feel that it makes sense they have a primary weapon. I do not feel that the Pilot shares this sort of role, as it is supposed to be in a vehicle and not running around on foot. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Haerr Nos Nothi 2410	Posted - 2015.03.02 22:50:00 - [17] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: This is not being actively worked on but I would like to gather enough cards on the table that if work does start we can give the pilot suit the healthy things it needs to grow as an idea into reality. However it seems there are some conundrums. 1 Being that if they effect vehicles to heavily they can ruin the planned meta. 2 Defanging the pilot suit however in this manner will make them inferior suits to pilot the vehicle. 3 Forcing pilot suits into pilot seats seems to take away from the freedom of the game Minding this so far most players I've initially spoken to agree to the: 1. Sidearm only 2. Light Frame base suit. Not saying you have to agree to it but every other frame has had 2 roles in it and the second scout suit model (minmatar) has strong resemblance to that of a pilot getup to begin with. So anyways drop suggestions on how shape and form a pilot suit up big or small well take them all for consideration. So debate among yourselves and show me what you guys got on the creative juices. Screw pilot suits. Make it so that you cannot call in Derps/Tanks while already deployed. You should only be able to get them into a match by spawning in them just like dropsuits. Edit: Also no getting in or out for pilots. Think of it as the Dust equivalent of Eve capsules (pods, eggs what ever you want to call them)
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2949	Posted - 2015.03.02 22:55:00 - [18] - Quote I see the Pilot suit as a mobile computer of sorts. It's not able to increase the mechanical abilities of the vehicle (at least not that much, maybe a little more juice out of them), but would be able to vastly increase the abilities of the electronics in the HAV. Sensors to see up close targets, more specific info given on the HUD about certain things, etc. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5121	Posted - 2015.03.02 22:57:00 - [19] - Quote Haerr wrote: Edit: Also no getting in or out for pilots. Think of it as the Dust equivalent of Eve capsules (pods, eggs what ever you want to call them) Actually its quite easy to get out of your ship, the capsules can be ejected with the click of a button. Typically there is rarely a reason to do this, as the capsule really can't do anything. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Derrith Erador Royal Uhlans 3375	Posted - 2015.03.02 23:03:00 - [20] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2651082#post2651082 My two cents. Which has remained roughly unchanged (reason being I can't think of anything better). 99% of what Derrith says is stupidity. -D3lta Blitzkrieg Oh yeah?! Well, I love redheads.

Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18742	Posted - 2015.03.02 23:09:00 - [21] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: IWS, is there a technical possibility of introducing a "vehicle link module" system, similar to fleet boosters in Eve? Technical evaluations from me are not helpful as I can only guess and ascertain capabilities of dust 514. Only CCP Rattati and his team know or can push the limits of the dust 514 engine. The larger question is that of wanting to do the technical work. Commandos for example and replacing their role into the assaults is almost out of the question. Not because it is not technically feasible but it is rather a technical headache to pull off involving all sorts of shenanigans. So yes it may be possible and maybe easy to do; then again it could be so obscurity hard that an attempt would not be desirable we won't know but dont be to afraid of suggesting. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 3457	Posted - 2015.03.02 23:13:00 - [22] - Quote Personally I'd like Pilot Suits to increase "quality of life" of vehicles, and not actual combat performance like EHP, this way we can actually see some point in using them without disrupting balance: First: Make it where you have to hold down the "enter/exit" button to enter vehicles, or make it where there is at least a delay. make it substantial, such as 1 second for LAVs, 2 for derpships, 3 for hippos, or whatever. You get the point. Next, for the pilot suits: Light Frame. Sidearm only. 2/2/2 equipment slots for basic/adv/proto (This will not shadow logis as they will be very fragile), ideally used for a cloak/repper. Bright Orange. Adds bonus to recalling and entering/exiting vehicles per level and bonus to rep tool on vehicles. Add interesting and useful bonuses for the racials, bonus to zoom levels, bonus to passive sensors etc. Even a bonus to total ammunition carried is great as it effects the long-term power of a vehicle but not the "in the middle of a firefight" power. If you have to, make the racial bonuses affect non EHP/Damage modules, make them promote the "utility" modules. Give the Gallente/Caldari a bonus to Vehicle Repper/Shield Transfer modules (yes, add those back), make those Amarrians have a bonus to the vehicle sensor modules to find their missing run-away-slaves easier, give those ingenious minnies a bonus against rust, things like that. shrugs Imagine a new piece of infantry equipment like a rep tool but with massive bonus against vehicles and worthless against infantry, that like the cloaks have a prohibitively high cost but Pilot suits have a great fitting reduction to use them. Make it a Rusty red-paint splattered Forge Gun Reskin that shoots black nanites. Imagine new vehicle "logi" modules like the old shield transfer modules, that a Caldari Pilot Suit would have bonuses on making them go from "good" to "great" with bonus to cooldowns, range and pulse value! Really, pilot suits would be better if we introduced some vehicle utility modules, and then make the pilot suits be the "vehicle logies" as well as better vehicle mechanics due to great vehicle repper rates and slightly better zoom. This would also let logi vehicles be logi vehicles again.... I miss that role. As a side note, you really should consider re-releasing logi vehicles with the huge resists but - the turret slots. "You see those red dots over there? Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 868	Posted - 2015.03.02 23:24:00 - [23] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Why, ooc, is "sidearm only" a given? If the frame is designed properly type/stat/bonus-wise is having an AR really being predicted as a being a problem? In my experience from playing as a Logi, being one weapon by itself has a huge impact on battlefield survivability. Well as I stated, the pilot should be nearly useless outside of its vehicle. Anything that happens outside of the vehicle is not the role of the pilot, so I see no reason why they should have more than a sidearm. Additionally from my understanding, even modern tankers in the real world rarely carry what you would consider a "primary weapon" and tend to have PDWs, such as pistols and SMGs because they are small and compact and fit will inside the cramped quarters of a tank. As for the Logi example, I feel that Logis do have some limited combat role in the form of fire support, or indirect combat support (The Mass Driver is an awesome example of this). As such I feel that it makes sense they have a primary weapon. I do not feel that the Pilot shares this sort of role, as it is supposed to be in a vehicle and not running around on foot. OK, I see where you're coming from with that. Thing about a Logi, we're usually able to have some control over where we are what we're doing there that a crashed pilot will not. I recognize the PDW parrallel but still don't see a problem with being able to tote a light weapon, especially if the suit is no equipment or limited to a vehicle reptool since there'll be no capability for self support/supply which is the actual lynchpin to AV. I was just curious, the pilots will figure out what works best for them and their role, balance providing. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 1556	Posted - 2015.03.02 23:26:00 - [24] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: 1 - I think AV being better than a vehicle at killing vehicles is broken meta but it seems im in the minority 2 - If they make pilot suits a must have to make a vehicle better and a harder nut for AV to crack while HAV/ADS pilots get to have fun whacking each other i don't think pilots will mind that much, AV will cry but i doubt it would get that far. 3. Knackers up the LAV but the pilot suit has to affect all vehicles. Pilot suit - Light, sidearm, low HP, 1 equip, any modules slots would have to have some modules that help enhance the vehicle in someway such as EWAR/HP/module efficencies etc Skills wise they have to have an effect on all vehicles including LAVs so caldari for shield/gallente rep/armor armor/minmatar speed etc Possibly could make a doc up or something for all races Not here to discuss Vehicle and AV stay on topic please also knackers? I am not a world linguist on slang so... You can't separate them and still have a discussion that is meaningful. Neither exists in a vacumn, a pilot suit won't exist in a vacumn. Because, that's why.
Kain Spero Negative-Feedback. 4629	Posted - 2015.03.02 23:36:00 - [25] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: This is not being actively worked on but I would like to gather enough cards on the table that if work does start we can give the pilot suit the healthy things it needs to grow as an idea into reality. However it seems there are some conundrums. 1 Being that if they effect vehicles to heavily they can ruin the planned meta. 2 Defanging the pilot suit however in this manner will make them inferior suits to pilot the vehicle. 3 Forcing pilot suits into pilot seats seems to take away from the freedom of the game Minding this so far most players I've initially spoken to agree to the: 1. Sidearm only 2. Light Frame base suit. Not saying you have to agree to it but every other frame has had 2 roles in it and the second scout suit model (minmatar) has strong resemblance to that of a pilot getup to begin with. So anyways drop suggestions on how shape and form a pilot suit up big or small well take them all for consideration. So debate among yourselves and show me what you guys got on the creative juices. This will be round 1; round 2 will have some more conversation sharpers. I would like to point out that this posthttps://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2654608#post2654608 is basically what the entire counter argument boils down to. So keep this fact in mind on what a pilot suit should be accomplishing because this notion here is not to be fought but worked around. One of the things that players have asked for a very long time is a way to lock out the driver seat in vehicles and I think requiring a pilot suit to fly a ADS or drive a HAV would be reasonable and a way to achieve this. I think the best thing that could be done with pilot suits is to allow them to add special abilities to vehicles rather than make them outright stronger (countermeasures to block/increase locking times, etc.). Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and Legion news
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2950	Posted - 2015.03.02 23:55:00 - [26] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Haerr wrote: Edit: Also no getting in or out for pilots. Think of it as the Dust equivalent of Eve capsules (pods, eggs what ever you want to call them) Actually its quite easy to get out of your ship, the capsules can be ejected with the click of a button. Typically there is rarely a reason to do this, as the capsule really can't do anything. Unless you're a scrublord that either has a giant ass bounty, or simply fails to update clones, in which reminds me that I need to update my own. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Logi Bro Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 3471	Posted - 2015.03.02 23:58:00 - [27] - Quote Whenever people mention pilot suits the same problem seems to come up. If the suit bonus is the only thing that effects vehicles, then it will totally invalidate the PRO tier, everyone will just max out the skill and use nothing but the STD, seeing as it would give the same bonus to their vehicle. The obvious solution to that is to make new modules that buff the vehicle that can be equipped on the pilot suit, but it seems to me that would be a lot of work for one suit. Personally I would say take the simplest route, make the pilot suit have two slots at every tier, from STD-PRO. Those two slots would be one sidearm and one module. Amarr and Gallente get a low module slot, Minmatar and Caldari get a high slot. They can equip vehicle modules in these slots. Essentially using a pilot suit gives their vehicle one extra module slot. Give the pilot suit a fitting reduction to sidearms so they aren't wasting too much fitting in order to defend themselves, then give each suit a fitting reduction to the modules that fit them racially. I am no lore master, but I imagine that would be extenders for the Cal, reppers for the Gal, plates and/or hardeners for the Am, and damage mods for the Min. Each tier of the suit has more CPU/PG for better modules. As far as I can tell, that wouldn't overpower vehicles too much, and it is useful for all vehicles, not just catering to HAVs, etc. SP Sinks? Fixed.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 868	Posted - 2015.03.03 00:03:00 - [28] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: This is not being actively worked on but I would like to gather enough cards on the table that if work does start we can give the pilot suit the healthy things it needs to grow as an idea into reality. However it seems there are some conundrums. 1 Being that if they effect vehicles to heavily they can ruin the planned meta. 2 Defanging the pilot suit however in this manner will make them inferior suits to pilot the vehicle. 3 Forcing pilot suits into pilot seats seems to take away from the freedom of the game Minding this so far most players I've initially spoken to agree to the: 1. Sidearm only 2. Light Frame base suit. Not saying you have to agree to it but every other frame has had 2 roles in it and the second scout suit model (minmatar) has strong resemblance to that of a pilot getup to begin with. So anyways drop suggestions on how shape and form a pilot suit up big or small well take them all for consideration. So debate among yourselves and show me what you guys got on the creative juices. This will be round 1; round 2 will have some more conversation sharpers. I would like to point out that this posthttps://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2654608#post2654608 is basically what the entire counter argument boils down to. So keep this fact in mind on what a pilot suit should be accomplishing because this notion here is not to be fought but worked around. One of the things that players have asked for a very long time is a way to lock out the driver seat in vehicles and I think requiring a pilot suit to fly a ADS or drive a HAV would be reasonable and a way to achieve this. I think the best thing that could be done with pilot suits is to allow them to add special abilities to vehicles rather than make them outright stronger (countermeasures to block/increase locking times, etc.). More reasonable would be just putting a damn owner lock on the pilots seat instead of a lock on half the gameplay. Countermeasure/early warning systems for Pilot Suits tho might work for folks. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5123	Posted - 2015.03.03 00:10:00 - [29] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Countermeasure/early warning systems for Pilot Suits tho might work for folks. Ehhhh a Pilot suit shouldnt be able to do anything that a Non-pilot can't. Do things better? Totally, but I wouldn't give features exclusively to the pilot. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2950	Posted - 2015.03.03 00:31:00 - [30] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Countermeasure/early warning systems for Pilot Suits tho might work for folks. Ehhhh a Pilot suit shouldnt be able to do anything that a Non-pilot can't. Do things better? Totally, but I wouldn't give features exclusively to the pilot. If modules exists for Pilot suits, they should be pilot suit exclusive. Otherwise, no point. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5125	Posted - 2015.03.03 00:49:00 - [31] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Countermeasure/early warning systems for Pilot Suits tho might work for folks. Ehhhh a Pilot suit shouldnt be able to do anything that a Non-pilot can't. Do things better? Totally, but I wouldn't give features exclusively to the pilot. If modules exists for Pilot suits, they should be pilot suit exclusive. Otherwise, no point. That's not what I mean. I mean I wouldn't make vehicle features exclusive to the Pilot suit, for example "You can only use a Flare Launcher if you're in a pilot suit" EDIT: To clarify. Link Modules should be unique to the pilot, but those link modules should not unlock features that you HAV to use a link modules to unlock. They should simply improve what the vehicle is already doing, Pilot or not. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 8183	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:00:00 - [32] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Countermeasure/early warning systems for Pilot Suits tho might work for folks. Ehhhh a Pilot suit shouldnt be able to do anything that a Non-pilot can't. Do things better? Totally, but I wouldn't give features exclusively to the pilot. If modules exists for Pilot suits, they should be pilot suit exclusive. Otherwise, no point. You can do what they did for cloaks and make them so obscenely costly for everyone else that it would be a major sacrifice, while giving Pilot Suits a fittings cost decrease. It would give a little variability and viability to other roles that want to use them, without them really being an issue. I mean, I have seen cloaked Commandos, but never really felt my role threatened by them. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
Reinhard Manderfelt Technically Legal 4	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:04:00 - [33] - Quote So, let me get this straight: We're against "Pilot suits to drive vehicles" because it removes some freedom? I don't agree. If I want to use an HMG, I am forced to spec into Heavy Suits. Whichever way you look at it, it's the same. Exact. Situation. Would it force existing pilots to spec into Pilot suits? Yes. That shouldn't be a problem, a single afternoon of playing nets you enough SP to spec into an entirely different Suit, even factional. I did it myself today. Spec'd into Minmatar Medium and made it to Assault. So that should hardly be a cause for concern. I personally believe that Pilot suits should be mandatory for HAV and DS (not LAV's for reasons stated before), because it just makes sense. Does a Tanker wear the same kit as a Footsoldier? Does a Jet/Helicopter pilot? No. For good reason. Cockpits and Tanks are cramped places. Now, I understand that forcing people to spec into a specific suit to pilot vehicles would limit freedom, but right now, one of the most unbalanced things I've seen is Heavy Dropsuits driving HAV's, who just drive through whichever AV -setup you've got, get out and blast you to tiny, sad bits. Basically, you can't beat them IN their Tank, and you can't beat them OUT of their tank. Where's the balance in this? So I vote for either A Pilot suit for DS/HAV, or Heavy's that can't Pilot anything including LAV (they can still get in the passenger seat/turret of any vehicle) . This should barely remove freedom, as it's easy to get a buddy/ squad member to drive. Heavy's are designed as Front-line suits, and that's where they should be, not behind the wheel of LAV's, HAV's or DS'. Also, as a side note, because AV-balance is, wether we want to or not, an intrinsic part of this discussion, I don't understand how many people complain AV is overpowered. Sure, I've taken out my fair share of tanks, but at least as many have cost me tons of ISK in AV fits. From ADS' avoiding SL in a straight line because of Afterburner gimmicks, or Gunnlogi's popping Shield Boosters & Hardeners (Also, 40% Damage resistance on a 4K+ shield is ridiculous!) ad infinitum, I can honestly say, that the weaker tanks are not a problem, and can be taken out solo by decent AV players, but the better tanks can outrun half a squad of AV-fits. In short, AV is both Over-and Underpowered. How would I do the Pilot suits? I don't know. But I do know there's some seriously unbalanced stuff out there already, and the Pilot suit could solve some of that. I hope the idea is at least considered. I love piloting Dropships, and the idea of having a Pilot suit sounds nice, even if only to distinguish between Pilots and the rest.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5126	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:09:00 - [34] - Quote Reinhard Manderfelt wrote: Now, I understand that forcing people to spec into a specific suit to pilot vehicles would limit freedom, but right now, one of the most unbalanced things I've seen is Heavy Dropsuits driving HAV's, who just drive through whichever AV -setup you've got, get out and blast you to tiny, sad bits. Basically, you can't beat them IN their Tank, and you can't beat them OUT of their tank. If your concern is related to the pilot bailing out and causing issues, should you not be more focused on the bailing out part and not so much the piloting part? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 8184	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:15:00 - [35] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Reinhard Manderfelt wrote: Now, I understand that forcing people to spec into a specific suit to pilot vehicles would limit freedom, but right now, one of the most unbalanced things I've seen is Heavy Dropsuits driving HAV's, who just drive through whichever AV -setup you've got, get out and blast you to tiny, sad bits. Basically, you can't beat them IN their Tank, and you can't beat them OUT of their tank. If your concern is related to the pilot bailing out and causing issues, should you not be more focused on the bailing out part and not so much the piloting part? I really hate heavies, and I really hate Heavy HAV/LAVs, but there are ways to incentivize using Pilot suits over other suits without completely eliminating their use. If vehicles are more effectively driven by a Pilot than a Heavy, you will naturally see non Pilot suit driven vehicles killed routinely by Pilot suit driven vehicles. What good is surviving once you get out of the vehicle if being in it will likely get you killed? If they create the right bonuses and incentives for wearing a Pilot suit while driving vehicles, then you will see a significant reduction of other suits piloting vehicles. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
Brush Master Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1463	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:16:00 - [36] - Quote I am one that believes that the pilot suit should be like a key that unlocks features on xx vehicles that other suits do not have access to in the form of a vehicle equipment slots. Possible types of vehicle equipment / features Countermeasures to break off any locked on swarms for xx seconds Stealth mode where you don't show up on the radar, no enemy/friendly display for anyone looking at ship for xx seconds Supply Drop aka like a large nanohive Spawn in with vehicle Vehicle Lock - Self / Squad / Anyone Lock on / targeting warning To name a few. Like others have said the cost of the suit is going to have to be worth the feature set or we will just keep using our free suits. Dust Veteran. June 2012 - ? True Logi. Flying DS from the start. @dustreports
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5128	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:45:00 - [37] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Reinhard Manderfelt wrote: Now, I understand that forcing people to spec into a specific suit to pilot vehicles would limit freedom, but right now, one of the most unbalanced things I've seen is Heavy Dropsuits driving HAV's, who just drive through whichever AV -setup you've got, get out and blast you to tiny, sad bits. Basically, you can't beat them IN their Tank, and you can't beat them OUT of their tank. If your concern is related to the pilot bailing out and causing issues, should you not be more focused on the bailing out part and not so much the piloting part? I really hate heavies, and I really hate Heavy HAV/LAVs, but there are ways to incentivize using Pilot suits over other suits without completely eliminating their use. If vehicles are more effectively driven by a Pilot than a Heavy, you will naturally see non Pilot suit driven vehicles killed routinely by Pilot suit driven vehicles. What good is surviving once you get out of the vehicle if being in it will likely get you killed? If they create the right bonuses and incentives for wearing a Pilot suit while driving vehicles, then you will see a significant reduction of other suits piloting vehicles. Pretty much. I think if you add a mandatory timer to climb in and out of a vehicle and scale that with suit type/vehicle type it solves a lot of the issues people are having issues with. Say you're a Heavy in an HAV and **** goes sideways. Assume a 10 second timer for heavies in an HAV. If that Heavy wants to bail out of his HAV, he has to sit there for 10 seconds doing nothing. Either he's going to get killed before he gets out, or he WILL get out in time, but now the enemy HAV has had a full 10 second to rep up and help modules cool down. So by the time that heavy drags his ass out of the HAV, he's going to be looking at an enemy that's much stronger than it was 10 seconds ago. End result? That heavy will probably stay in the HAV and fight to the end, because attempting to bail out will put him at an even greater disadvantage. If you want one of the pilots perks to be the ability to bypass that timer? shrugs fine by me, they wont be able to do much aside from attempt to run away in a paperthin suit anyways. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5128	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:48:00 - [38] - Quote Brush Master wrote: I am one that believes that the pilot suit should be like a key that unlocks features on xx vehicles that other suits do not have access to in the form of vehicle equipment slots. Possible types of vehicle equipment / features Countermeasures to break off any locked on swarms for xx seconds Stealth mode where you don't show up on the radar, no enemy/friendly display for anyone looking at ship for xx seconds Supply Drop aka like a large nanohive Spawn in with vehicle Vehicle Lock - Self / Squad / Anyone Lock on / targeting warning To name a few. Like others have said the cost of the suit is going to have to be worth the feature set or we will just keep using our free suits. Sorry but I think features like that should be general modules. We have so few modules as it is, I'm very much against locking them behind a specific suit type. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 868	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:56:00 - [39] - Quote Reinhard Manderfelt wrote: So, let me get this straight: We're against "Pilot suits to drive vehicles" because it removes some freedom? I don't agree. If I want to use an HMG, I am forced to spec into Heavy Suits. Whichever way you look at it, it's the same. Exact. Situation. Would it force existing pilots to spec into Pilot suits? Yes. That shouldn't be a problem, a single afternoon of playing nets you enough SP to spec into an entirely different Suit, even factional. I did it myself today. Spec'd into Minmatar Medium and made it to Assault. So that should hardly be a cause for concern. I personally believe that Pilot suits should be mandatory for HAV and DS (not LAV's for reasons stated before), because it just makes sense. Does a Tanker wear the same kit as a Footsoldier? Does a Jet/Helicopter pilot? No. For good reason. Cockpits and Tanks are cramped places. Now, I understand that forcing people to spec into a specific suit to pilot vehicles would limit freedom, but right now, one of the most unbalanced things I've seen is Heavy Dropsuits driving HAV's, who just drive through whichever AV -setup you've got, get out and blast you to tiny, sad bits. Basically, you can't beat them IN their Tank, and you can't beat them OUT of their tank. Where's the balance in this? So I vote for either A Pilot suit for DS/HAV, or Heavy's that can't Pilot anything including LAV (they can still get in the passenger seat/turret of any vehicle) . This should barely remove freedom, as it's easy to get a buddy/ squad member to drive. Heavy's are designed as Front-line suits, and that's where they should be, not behind the wheel of LAV's, HAV's or DS'. Also, as a side note, because AV-balance is, wether we want to or not, an intrinsic part of this discussion, I don't understand how many people complain AV is overpowered. Sure, I've taken out my fair share of tanks, but at least as many have cost me tons of ISK in AV fits. From ADS' avoiding SL in a straight line because of Afterburner gimmicks, or Gunnlogi's popping Shield Boosters & Hardeners (Also, 40% Damage resistance on a 4K+ shield is ridiculous!) ad infinitum, I can honestly say, that the weaker tanks are not a problem, and can be taken out solo by decent AV players, but the better tanks can outrun half a squad of AV-fits. In short, AV is both Over-and Underpowered. How would I do the Pilot suits? I don't know. But I do know there's some seriously unbalanced stuff out there already, and the Pilot suit could solve some of that. I hope the idea is at least considered. I love piloting Dropships, and the idea of having a Pilot suit sounds nice, even if only to distinguish between Pilots and the rest. I was also considering Pilots suits being required to drive anything as a synonymous situation with the HMG but while similiar there is a huge difference: The HMG is one type of weapon and not having a Heavy frame does not exclude an individual from access to the rest of the weapon class. Vehicles and their use is half the overall gameplay available to us and while it makes sense Pilot suits add a layer or two to vehicle effectiveness it doesn't make sense that not using a pilot suit excludes an individual from using vehicles at all. Just that a non-Pilot-Suited pilot isn't as effective. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 868	Posted - 2015.03.03 01:57:00 - [40] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Brush Master wrote: I am one that believes that the pilot suit should be like a key that unlocks features on xx vehicles that other suits do not have access to in the form of vehicle equipment slots. Possible types of vehicle equipment / features Countermeasures to break off any locked on swarms for xx seconds Stealth mode where you don't show up on the radar, no enemy/friendly display for anyone looking at ship for xx seconds Supply Drop aka like a large nanohive Spawn in with vehicle Vehicle Lock - Self / Squad / Anyone Lock on / targeting warning To name a few. Like others have said the cost of the suit is going to have to be worth the feature set or we will just keep using our free suits. Sorry but I think features like that should be general modules. We have so few modules as it is, I'm very much against locking them behind a specific suit type. So ask the pilots about making them genmods and PilotSuits have a major bonus to them, whether its fitting or use enhancement. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5132	Posted - 2015.03.03 02:04:00 - [41] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Brush Master wrote: I am one that believes that the pilot suit should be like a key that unlocks features on xx vehicles that other suits do not have access to in the form of vehicle equipment slots. Possible types of vehicle equipment / features Countermeasures to break off any locked on swarms for xx seconds Stealth mode where you don't show up on the radar, no enemy/friendly display for anyone looking at ship for xx seconds Supply Drop aka like a large nanohive Spawn in with vehicle Vehicle Lock - Self / Squad / Anyone Lock on / targeting warning To name a few. Like others have said the cost of the suit is going to have to be worth the feature set or we will just keep using our free suits. Sorry but I think features like that should be general modules. We have so few modules as it is, I'm very much against locking them behind a specific suit type. So ask the pilots about making them genmods and PilotSuits have a major bonus to them, whether its fitting or use enhancement. If the pilot suit has link modules which boost the effectiveness of these vehicle modules....working as intended. But a vehicle and all of the functions available to it should be accessible to any class...a pilot should just do it better. I mean the HMG/Forge is really the only content locked behind a suit class. I think of it more along the lines of "Anyone can use a Scrambler Rifle. But if you want it to REALLY kick ass, you use an Amarr Assault with that Scrambler Rifle" so similarly "Anyone can use a vehicle. But if you w want it to REALLY kick ass, you use a Pilot suit with that vehicle" "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Kain Spero Negative-Feedback. 4629	Posted - 2015.03.03 02:14:00 - [42] - Quote I don't know. I think making modules more effective on the vehicle because of the pilot suit is the exact wrong direction. Better modules means more HP or more Damage so just straight up more powerful. Special abilities make give you more tricks up your sleeve but it wouldn't increase raw power of the vehicles. Also, yes, the pilot suit should be required to drive a HAV or dropship. Alternatively go with the timer idea and also allow a pilot suit let you spawn already in a vehicle. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and Legion news
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5132	Posted - 2015.03.03 02:17:00 - [43] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: I don't know. I think making modules more effective on the vehicle because of the pilot suit is the exact wrong direction. Better modules means more HP or more Damage so just straight up more powerful. This was why I initially proposed downsides to link modules so it was still an upgrade but at a cost elsewhere. Additionally I prefer softer bonuses like faster cooldowns on hardeners rather than direct buffs to the damage reduction. I suppose think of it as making the functions of the vehicle more efficient, and less so directly buffing....but thats up for discussion of course "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 714	Posted - 2015.03.03 02:17:00 - [44] - Quote I believe that there should be vehicles entry exit timers (not including LAVs or passengers jumping out of dropships). It should take a few seconds to get into any and all vehicles for drivers, pilots, and gunners. (AGAIN let me stress -- NOT Lavs and NOT jumping out of a DS as a passenger -- DS gunners still apply) And I think pilot suits should reduce the amount of time this takes. -x% time at mlt, -y% time at Std, -z% time at adv, -c% time at proto. This would allow dedicated vehicle folks to still escape almost as fast as they do now from exploding vehicles at proto level. But still provide real risk to clone termination if they decide to run 'cheap.' Also solves a host of other problems with AV, wheelchair heavies, and prevents strait non isk/module related buffs to vehicles. In a game of economics -- non isk buffs is bad.
Kain Spero Negative-Feedback. 4629	Posted - 2015.03.03 02:20:00 - [45] - Quote Imp Smash wrote: I believe that there should be vehicles entry exit timers (not including LAVs or passengers jumping out of dropships). It should take a few seconds to get into any and all vehicles for drivers, pilots, and gunners. (AGAIN let me stress -- NOT Lavs and NOT jumping out of a DS as a passenger -- DS gunners still apply) And I think pilot suits should reduce the amount of time this takes. -x% time at mlt, -y% time at Std, -z% time at adv, -c% time at proto. This would allow dedicated vehicle folks to still escape almost as fast as they do now from exploding vehicles at proto level. But still provide real risk to clone termination if they decide to run 'cheap.' Also solves a host of other problems with AV, wheelchair heavies, and prevents strait non isk/module related buffs to vehicles. In a game of economics -- non isk buffs is bad. I think an exit timer would need to be modified based on suits so a heavy would take much longer to get out like Pokey was saying (even a LAV). I couldn't agree more strongly about the exit timer not affecting dropship passengers though. Pokey Dravon wrote: Additionally I prefer softer bonuses like faster cooldowns on hardeners rather than direct buffs to the damage reduction. I suppose think of it as making the functions of the vehicle more efficient, and less so directly buffing....but thats up for discussion of course I can get behind improving cool downs, but I think it could be a bit dangerous. I'm almost wondering if the pilot suit should just be a one tier suit with maybe getting a nice bonus per level. I just think it could potentially be easy to unbalance vehicles depending on how the suit bonus applies. I agree we don't want to see the pilot suit apply straight damage buffs or increased HP. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and Legion news
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2950	Posted - 2015.03.03 02:22:00 - [46] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Countermeasure/early warning systems for Pilot Suits tho might work for folks. Ehhhh a Pilot suit shouldnt be able to do anything that a Non-pilot can't. Do things better? Totally, but I wouldn't give features exclusively to the pilot. If modules exists for Pilot suits, they should be pilot suit exclusive. Otherwise, no point. You can do what they did for cloaks and make them so obscenely costly for everyone else that it would be a major sacrifice, while giving Pilot Suits a fittings cost decrease. It would give a little variability and viability to other roles that want to use them, without them really being an issue. I mean, I have seen cloaked Commandos, but never really felt my role threatened by them. If so, then 1: It would need to be comparatively easier to fit them, as fitting cloaks are a pain 2: To other suits would need to be like fitting very high requiring modules, higher than anything now. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 714	Posted - 2015.03.03 02:27:00 - [47] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: Imp Smash wrote: I believe that there should be vehicles entry exit timers (not including LAVs or passengers jumping out of dropships). It should take a few seconds to get into any and all vehicles for drivers, pilots, and gunners. (AGAIN let me stress -- NOT Lavs and NOT jumping out of a DS as a passenger -- DS gunners still apply) And I think pilot suits should reduce the amount of time this takes. -x% time at mlt, -y% time at Std, -z% time at adv, -c% time at proto. This would allow dedicated vehicle folks to still escape almost as fast as they do now from exploding vehicles at proto level. But still provide real risk to clone termination if they decide to run 'cheap.' Also solves a host of other problems with AV, wheelchair heavies, and prevents strait non isk/module related buffs to vehicles. In a game of economics -- non isk buffs is bad. I think an exit timer would need to be modified based on suits so a heavy would take much longer to get out like Pokey was saying (even a LAV). I couldn't agree more strongly about the exit timer not affecting dropship passengers though. Well, I don't think heavies should be able to drive anything at all. passenger only. I am a heavy myself and I think vehicles negate heavy weaknesses too easily. But that's a whole other topic tbh. But when I mean pilot suit modified, it would be based on the suit not the skill. The suit itself should provide the entry exit bonus. That way wearing a proto suit means something. I see it as system linking like in eve. Takes a few seconds for the vehicle or turret to link and sync up to the clone's brain. Pilot suits are designed to speed this process up and make linking more smooth. Which translates to faster entering and exiting of vehicles. Again, not LAvs (it's not a link vehicle, it is a car...) and not dropship passengers (they are not linked to anything.) No other desirable teamplay elements are changed or endangered with this mechanic, pilot suits matter for people who want to survive vehicle destruction, (or hop out of said vehicle to do stuff like hack, drop links, whatever at almost no risk), and vehicle users (especially casual users) face a more real risk of death (not just vehicle loss) outside of jihad jeeps. I had this idea having read (but never posting) the various vehicle threads and their debates that pop up.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 877	Posted - 2015.03.03 02:37:00 - [48] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Brush Master wrote: I am one that believes that the pilot suit should be like a key that unlocks features on xx vehicles that other suits do not have access to in the form of vehicle equipment slots. Possible types of vehicle equipment / features Countermeasures to break off any locked on swarms for xx seconds Stealth mode where you don't show up on the radar, no enemy/friendly display for anyone looking at ship for xx seconds Supply Drop aka like a large nanohive Spawn in with vehicle Vehicle Lock - Self / Squad / Anyone Lock on / targeting warning To name a few. Like others have said the cost of the suit is going to have to be worth the feature set or we will just keep using our free suits. Sorry but I think features like that should be general modules. We have so few modules as it is, I'm very much against locking them behind a specific suit type. So ask the pilots about making them genmods and PilotSuits have a major bonus to them, whether its fitting or use enhancement. If the pilot suit has link modules which boost the effectiveness of these vehicle modules....working as intended. But a vehicle and all of the functions available to it should be accessible to any class...a pilot should just do it better. I mean the HMG/Forge is really the only content locked behind a suit class. I think of it more along the lines of "Anyone can use a Scrambler Rifle. But if you want it to REALLY kick ass, you use an Amarr Assault with that Scrambler Rifle" so similarly "Anyone can use a vehicle. But if you w want it to REALLY kick ass, you use a Pilot suit with that vehicle" I agree with that overall perspective. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Shamarskii Simon The Hundred Acre Hood RISE of LEGION 159	Posted - 2015.03.03 03:00:00 - [49] - Quote Vehicle link modules ideas/suggestions Modifies EVERYTHING except PG/CPU. Small boosts have no downsides, large boosts do. Few exceptions E.G: a module which increases aHP/s by 5/6/7% (proto) <- cannot be large to offset non vehicle users. Or a large boost (10-13%) but takes away base aHP by X amount. Or increase turret rotation by 100% but reducing mag size by 50% same reload time. Or increase mag but reduce rotation Or a regulator, but a small reduction to sHP extends. And more of the ilk... Yu get the idea right? Entering the void and becoming wind. Message for 1v1 air to air
Soul Cairn Negative-Feedback 81	Posted - 2015.03.03 03:30:00 - [50] - Quote I strongly believe that pilot suits should have one eq slot. I believe that pilots should be placing uplinks in places difficult or impossible to reach for infantry. This is something I find beneficial to myself and my team. Don't be fooled, I'm Caldari Vehicular Specialist Grandmaster Bump

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5135	Posted - 2015.03.03 03:48:00 - [51] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: I'm almost wondering if the pilot suit should just be a one tier suit with maybe getting a nice bonus per level. I just think it could potentially be easy to unbalance vehicles depending on how the suit bonus applies. I agree we don't want to see the pilot suit apply straight damage buffs or increased HP. Bleh boring, and I hate breaking the existing suit progression we have in every other role. If Pilots are the only suit that you have to make an exception for by making a single tier, then there is something fundamentally wrong with how they're designed. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 886	Posted - 2015.03.03 04:36:00 - [52] - Quote Pilot suits should not be the only suits require to operate a vehicle. They should be advantageous enough to be the best choice in using a vehicle. There are lots of potential bonuses to think of that don't adresses the future meta. any combination of the following canbe used on the various racial suits. 3% to Turret tracking per level 3% to Module coodown per level 3% to Module duration 3% to Armor movement penalty 5% to magazine size 3% to dispersion 2% to afterburner/ Nitro accelleration 5% to PG/ CPU per level Pilots suits are pretty easy to cobble together. We have the light suits, takes no more than a hotfix to change the slot count. The only thing to prevent it's release is typing up the bonus, and whether it will or wont be on CCP's priority list. Since it aint, its just a pipe dream. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
anaboop NECROM0NGERS 159	Posted - 2015.03.03 05:44:00 - [53] - Quote First of all pilot suits nomnom. Sidearm, small frame. Sounds good to me. as for integrating them with vehicles, you can use the suit bonus like with all other suits but with bonuses for vehicles. Amarr, Caldari, Gallente, Minmatar Pilot suits (skill) Level 1 basic frame- (Shield based pilot suit) passive shield resistance +#% per level, (Armor based pilot suit) passive armor resistance +#% per level. Level 2 basic frame - same as above Level 3 adv frame - large turret rotation speed +#% per level Level 4 adv frame - same as above Level 5 proto frame - (shield based pilot suit) shield module effectiveness +#% per lvl (armor based pilot suit) armor module effectiveness +#%per lvl Mix and match or change what the bonuses are, but that concept would set the normal frame from a pilot frame apart. (pilot suits should come out side by side with the vehicles) expect problems but its better then doing it twice right? All in all cant wait for vehicle changes , tanking has gotten dull, as whoever gets the jump on the other usually comes out victorious. Fully sick Anaboop trading card
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5138	Posted - 2015.03.03 06:24:00 - [54] - Quote anaboop wrote: First of all pilot suits nomnom. Sidearm, small frame. Sounds good to me. as for integrating them with vehicles, you can use the suit bonus like with all other suits but with bonuses for vehicles. Amarr, Caldari, Gallente, Minmatar Pilot suits (skill) Level 1 basic frame- (Shield based pilot suit) passive shield resistance +#% per level, (Armor based pilot suit) passive armor resistance +#% per level. Level 2 basic frame - same as above Level 3 adv frame - large turret rotation speed +#% per level Level 4 adv frame - same as above Level 5 proto frame - (shield based pilot suit) shield module effectiveness +#% per lvl (armor based pilot suit) armor module effectiveness +#%per lvl Mix and match or change what the bonuses are, but that concept would set the normal frame from a pilot frame apart. (pilot suits should come out side by side with the vehicles) expect problems but its better then doing it twice right? All in all cant wait for vehicle changes , tanking has gotten dull, as whoever gets the jump on the other usually comes out victorious. So you want different levels of the same skill to offer different benefits? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
anaboop NECROM0NGERS 159	Posted - 2015.03.03 07:47:00 - [55] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: So you want different levels of the same skill to offer different benefits? Nono, just new bonuses at adv and proto. Fully sick Anaboop trading card
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5139	Posted - 2015.03.03 07:52:00 - [56] - Quote anaboop wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: So you want different levels of the same skill to offer different benefits? Nono, just new bonuses at adv and proto. Why would you deviate from the existing system that every single other suit in the game already uses? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
anaboop NECROM0NGERS 159	Posted - 2015.03.03 09:33:00 - [57] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: anaboop wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: So you want different levels of the same skill to offer different benefits? Nono, just new bonuses at adv and proto. Why would you deviate from the existing system that every single other suit in the game already uses? Its a good way to differentiate between basic adv and proto, given we havent got modules or anything. Fully sick Anaboop trading card
Mad Syringe ReDust Inc. 496	Posted - 2015.03.03 10:10:00 - [58] - Quote I would like to see pilot suits having bonuses to module duration and/or cooldown. Vehicle damage mods should be on the pilot suits. Pilot suits should have no EQ, since that's the job of the logis. If you want to be effective against vehicles (damage, module efficiency) you need to bring a pilot suit. If you want to spam links all over the place, bring a Amarr logi. Vehicle exit entry timers correspoinding to suit size. Heavies need 3 secs to get in and 10 seconds to get out... sorry, but it's pretty cramped in there... (This does only relate to closed seats i.e. all tank seats and the driver seat of a derpship). Mediums, 2 secs in and 6 out. Lights, 1 in and 3 out. Pilot suits would be able to get in and out as of now. This would reflect the fact of the suit sizes but it would not alter the transport capability for infantry suits with lavs and derpships. Tanks should be manned with pilot suits anyway, bonuses would stack but with a considerable penalty (more than the usual module stacking penalty). This would make it desireable for vehicle exclusive guys to wear a pilot suit, just to get that extra ooomph in Vehicle fights, and would still give infantry the possibility to use vehicles, but with less efficiency and the big disadvantage, to not be able to leave the vehicle in time in case of destruction...
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18745	Posted - 2015.03.03 11:32:00 - [59] - Quote I'm thinking the following: Vehicle Links Emergency Shunt and Coolant Tank Weapon Upgrades Transversal Manifold and Flushed Exhaust systems Afterburners and Nitros Surrogate Radiator and Heat Capacitor Sensor modules Nanite Pumps and Cermenting Array Armor Modules Resonance Emmitter and Cascade Chamber Shield Modules Progression of modules may be that Fitting saved for the first line (specialist variant) Effectiveness at the cost of more fitting for the second line (means giving up something on an already tight suit) Suits get role bonus for 2 of them can fit up to three if bonused or 2 unbonused Overall effect shouldn't equal 2 module replacements (that by installing 2 modules you can cover gaps in cycles with these) Non pilots can on average fit 1 (logis can probably push two) but fitting each one is like fitting a cloak its going to hurt on the fitting severely. Using links in equipment slots also solves the issue of sentinels being pilots or at least being better suited pilot suit than the pilot suit itself. Suits will increase effectiveness of a module class (Gallente armor, Caldari shields, amarr weapons, minmatar navigation) Suits however will role fitting in two different classes (Gallente armor and navigation, Amarr armor and damage, caldari shields and sensors, minmatar navigation and damage) I'm am thinking about a 4 slot layout at proto; semi acceptable fitting after you fit the 'links' Base Pilot values will be low and cannot compete against a poorly fitted scout Side arm only; pg and cpu to be considerate enouhg for an smg fit. 0 Bandwidth will ensure the use of links instead of equipment. Scanners are okay as they're a survival tool as well as the cloak if you can manage to fit it. If possible have the suits pre-tiericideded having all slots equal to that of the prototype suit making fitting the only factor difference in item progression. The going after cooldowns may be a good way to justify the pilot suit as it will not screw with the upcomming meta to hard AND it will also justify a good use for the pilot suit over any other class. The cooldowns and durations only screws with the windows of fighting stretching them or lowering them. Against other vehicle equipped with pilots this can balance out as thier abilities will counter each ohter. Vs infantry well lets just say infantry can probably stand to have more active module uses in the game. However in the proper conditions the vehicle should still be dying to AV even with pilot suits just pilot suits leviate some of the quality of life issues a pilot may face on the field and be able to enjoy the field more. Links and suit should be cheap side however ot encourage use in a vehicle without increases its investment price too steeply. passive traits would also if ever put in; instant ejection from vehicle while all other suits get a delay. Pilot suits are naturally fast and naturally stealthy weakest on hp of all classes weakest on repair and recovery of all classes decent stamina but slow to re-gen it back to be used more fo rrunnign away to call a new vehicle in; not to rush into combat. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
Lorhak Gannarsein Nos Nothi 4363	Posted - 2015.03.03 11:37:00 - [60] - Quote I actually am a fan of the idea of being forced to use a pilot suit of an appropriate tier to use a given tier of (enclosed) vehicle (that distinction being made because it would otherwise dramatically cut the utility of LAVs). Guys, we need to stop calling MU a 'matchmaker' when it's actually a 'teambuilder'. And I want to play FE:A now. Damn.

MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 2267	Posted - 2015.03.03 12:01:00 - [61] - Quote My thoughts on pilot suits: They should not be 'mandatory', they should instead be incredibly desireable sidegrades. Now, if you start **ing around with movement / turret / cpu / pg they start to slide further and further towards the 'mandatory' area. So how do we get them to be highly desireable sidegrades for dedicated pilots? Relatively simply in a matter of a few phases. Step 1: Introduce vehicle 'equipment' slots (much like dropsuit equipment slots) and move certain modules over to this area, stuff like MCRU's, Scanners, Remote repair devices and whatever else CCP decides to cook up whether it be bubble shields, triage bubbles, nanohive bubbles, whatever. Maybe some mobility modules could go here, but ultimately I don't think they should, for balances sake. No tank or damage modules should ever be in these 'equipment/utility' slots. This creates more of a direct parallel between dropsuits and vehicles. Step 2: Introduce pilot suits that enhance the effect of these 'equipment' modules. Maybe have the amarr get a bonus to MCRU spawn speed, the gallente a bonus to active scanner precision, minmatar / caldari repair range / whathaveyou. In short I want these things to be an OPTION not a 'must'. People who dabble in vehicles shouldn't feel punished for not having them, and people who want to just fly a dropship around / drive a tank around should feel like these are okay modules that help enhance their gameplay. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.** I have a few alts.
Brush Master Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1465	Posted - 2015.03.03 13:35:00 - [62] - Quote The feedback that I like thus far for a pilot suit: Spawn with vehicle at base. This would at least get me to use the basic pilot suit if I can just hot drop with my dropship into battle aka saves me time and hassle of finding a place to call in an hav Entry/Exit timer, agree that this is needed and pilot suit gives you instant access but other suits have a time based on suit size Pilot suit modify durations and cooldowns. More passive things that lower the time between recovery and going back into battle. Caution with hardners but things like afterburners are less risky to give a nice buff to active time/cool down. Dust Veteran. June 2012 - ? True Logi. Flying DS from the start. @dustreports
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. 4073	Posted - 2015.03.03 13:46:00 - [63] - Quote The pilot suit a sidegrade? If i want to go logi i go logi, if i want to assault i go assault, if i want to go scout i go scout. They are straight upgrades for a role that it is designed to do. If the pilot suit is a sidegrade and really doesn't offer much over say a heavy suit then why would i use it? I do believe that for DS/HAV the pilot suit has to be the go to suit for piloting because if it isn't then why add the pilot suit to begin with? Also it has to follow the current meta so basic/advanced/prototype with increasing CPU/PG and slots. As for skills i am not spending 2.7mil SP to get the ability to hop in and out of it and anyways the pilot suit has next to no tank and has a sidearm so me jumping out is pointless.
Sole Fenychs Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 627	Posted - 2015.03.03 16:46:00 - [64] - Quote How about giving pilots better attributes in terms of handling? Let them add more grip/acceleration/top speed/turret rotation/etc., depending on racial flavor. Then add in the idea of having one or two vehicle module slots on the suit, to make ADV and PRO suits worthwhile, and you have something that would actually be decently desirable without crippling vehicles. It would also play directly into the idea of pilots having a direct interface for the vehicle, which grants them a higher degree of fine control. Hell, this even works in a meta sense - If you use a pilot suit, you literally have more control over your vehicle. A class bonus could be something like 1% module countdowns per level or something.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5152	Posted - 2015.03.03 17:41:00 - [65] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Pilot suits are naturally fast and naturally stealthy weakest on hp of all classes weakest on repair and recovery of all classes decent stamina but slow to re-gen it back to be used more for running away to call a new vehicle in; not to rush into combat. Id much rather have a slower, higher HP option so I don't get screwed as an LAV driver. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Avallo Kantor 466	Posted - 2015.03.03 17:47:00 - [66] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Pilot suits are naturally fast and naturally stealthy weakest on hp of all classes weakest on repair and recovery of all classes decent stamina but slow to re-gen it back to be used more for running away to call a new vehicle in; not to rush into combat. Id much rather have a slower, higher HP option so I don't get screwed as an LAV driver. LAVs should be 'everyman' vehicles that don't require pilot suits. As such pilot suits will generally be in a vehicle, and not need to worry about how much hp they need to buffer.
Brush Master Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1466	Posted - 2015.03.03 18:03:00 - [67] - Quote Avallo Kantor wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Pilot suits are naturally fast and naturally stealthy weakest on hp of all classes weakest on repair and recovery of all classes decent stamina but slow to re-gen it back to be used more for running away to call a new vehicle in; not to rush into combat. Id much rather have a slower, higher HP option so I don't get screwed as an LAV driver. LAVs should be 'everyman' vehicles that don't require pilot suits. As such pilot suits will generally be in a vehicle, and not need to worry about how much hp they need to buffer. I agree that LAV is really an exception. There is no real reason for a pilot suit in an lav. Dust Veteran. June 2012 - ? True Logi. Flying DS from the start. @dustreports
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. 4086	Posted - 2015.03.03 18:13:00 - [68] - Quote Brush Master wrote: Avallo Kantor wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Pilot suits are naturally fast and naturally stealthy weakest on hp of all classes weakest on repair and recovery of all classes decent stamina but slow to re-gen it back to be used more for running away to call a new vehicle in; not to rush into combat. Id much rather have a slower, higher HP option so I don't get screwed as an LAV driver. LAVs should be 'everyman' vehicles that don't require pilot suits. As such pilot suits will generally be in a vehicle, and not need to worry about how much hp they need to buffer. I agree that LAV is really an exception. There is no real reason for a pilot suit in an lav. What about the logi LAV? When it wasn't creaming infantry it was repping vehicles and was good at it, if it stays open top then a pilot suit being light would be a waste in it since it could easily get shot out.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5152	Posted - 2015.03.03 18:20:00 - [69] - Quote Avallo Kantor wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Pilot suits are naturally fast and naturally stealthy weakest on hp of all classes weakest on repair and recovery of all classes decent stamina but slow to re-gen it back to be used more for running away to call a new vehicle in; not to rush into combat. Id much rather have a slower, higher HP option so I don't get screwed as an LAV driver. LAVs should be 'everyman' vehicles that don't require pilot suits. As such pilot suits will generally be in a vehicle, and not need to worry about how much hp they need to buffer. No vehicle should require a pilot suit. My point being that once we get our specialist LAVs back, I'll want to use a pilot suit to increase their capabilities, and if I'm so absurdly squishy that grazing shots will take my head off, that's going to be problematic. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Avallo Kantor 469	Posted - 2015.03.03 19:33:00 - [70] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Avallo Kantor wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Pilot suits are naturally fast and naturally stealthy weakest on hp of all classes weakest on repair and recovery of all classes decent stamina but slow to re-gen it back to be used more for running away to call a new vehicle in; not to rush into combat. Id much rather have a slower, higher HP option so I don't get screwed as an LAV driver. LAVs should be 'everyman' vehicles that don't require pilot suits. As such pilot suits will generally be in a vehicle, and not need to worry about how much hp they need to buffer. No vehicle should require a pilot suit. My point being that once we get our specialist LAVs back, I'll want to use a pilot suit to increase their capabilities, and if I'm so absurdly squishy that grazing shots will take my head off, that's going to be problematic. Role bonus: 90% damage reduction while in a vehicle? -Lore hoook: Pilot suits are unique configured to interface with a vehicle, and as such are able to access unique sub-routines to reroute ship shielding to protect their suits. This would also help address the -extremely- rare issue of a pilot being shot out of a Dropship. (Which is possible)

Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18749	Posted - 2015.03.03 19:37:00 - [71] - Quote Re: Handling This is a dangerous route because simple changes in handling can be considered a bad thing. Dust 514 is not robust enough to simulate better driving and poor driving also things that changes how a vehicle at its core is played even so marginally can actually make an option not desired. Whole reason why I see more standard drop-ships used for suicide landings than militia ones. Nobody likes militia drop-ship handling. Re: LAVs and low HP pilots Link modules are going to be usable by any class that can fit it; just anyone else will be less efficient at it. This was a conscious decision against the LAV as having 3 links on those can make an LAV very powerful. By weakening the operator link capabilities to around 1 link module if you want a survivable operator is the desired effect and check balance. You can have a survivable operator but you will have fewer links, If you want more links you are going to have a weaker operator. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2951	Posted - 2015.03.03 20:44:00 - [72] - Quote Soul Cairn wrote: I strongly believe that pilot suits should have one eq slot. I believe that pilots should be placing uplinks in places difficult or impossible to reach for infantry. This is something I find beneficial to myself and my team. My question is why is a Pilot placing uplinks instead of fitting a mCRU to his/her vehicle. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5155	Posted - 2015.03.03 21:00:00 - [73] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Re: LAVs and low HP pilots Link modules are going to be usable by any class that can fit it (if we make them equipment this will bar the sentinel) ; just anyone else will be less efficient at it. This was a conscious decision against the LAV as having 3 links on those can make an LAV very powerful. By weakening the operator link capabilities to around 1 link module if you want a survivable operator is the desired effect and check balance. You can have a survivable operator but you will have fewer links, If you want more links you are going to have a weaker operator. LAVs have strong mobility which is a very powerful survival tool in the current and likely future metas. High mobility unless you slow down to perform the function of the vehicle, such as Logistics repping. A dead pilot is a useless one, and if its SO easy to pop a pilot out of an LAV, it'll reach a point where using a pilot is pointless because you're dying too quickly from enemy fire that may not even be focused. Even a tanked medium suit can be dropped quickly out of the drivers seat, imagine how awful it'll be with a light frame with even less HP than a scout. There needs to be something to help protect pilots, either via some bonus to reduce incoming damage or some other metric. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17434	Posted - 2015.03.03 21:41:00 - [74] - Quote Avallo Kantor wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Avallo Kantor wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Pilot suits are naturally fast and naturally stealthy weakest on hp of all classes weakest on repair and recovery of all classes decent stamina but slow to re-gen it back to be used more for running away to call a new vehicle in; not to rush into combat. Id much rather have a slower, higher HP option so I don't get screwed as an LAV driver. LAVs should be 'everyman' vehicles that don't require pilot suits. As such pilot suits will generally be in a vehicle, and not need to worry about how much hp they need to buffer. No vehicle should require a pilot suit. My point being that once we get our specialist LAVs back, I'll want to use a pilot suit to increase their capabilities, and if I'm so absurdly squishy that grazing shots will take my head off, that's going to be problematic. Role bonus: 90% damage reduction while in a vehicle? -Lore hoook: Pilot suits are unique configured to interface with a vehicle, and as such are able to access unique sub-routines to reroute ship shielding to protect their suits. This would also help address the -extremely- rare issue of a pilot being shot out of a Dropship. (Which is possible) DON'T USE MY LORE HOOK! "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
Avallo Kantor 469	Posted - 2015.03.03 21:44:00 - [75] - Quote Why not have a vehicle link module that reduces damage taken while inside a vehicle? (In lieu of a pilot suit role bonus) This helps to solve both sides of the argument: -It allows Logi Lav drivers to protect themselves by choosing to fit a module that adds protection, but only inside a vehicle. (Such as a LAV) -It weakens the max fitting benefit of a pilot suit on a LAV, by taking up one of the modules to fit protection, so that the max links a pilot may put on their LAV is limited, unless they sacrifice their durability completely for it. -It still allows other suits to drive LAVs with no issue, and potentially allows for "gunner" fittings that focus on operating exposed gun turret seats. On a note of balance: what % damage reduction while in a vehicle should such a module offer at std / adv /pro?
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18750	Posted - 2015.03.03 21:56:00 - [76] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Re: LAVs and low HP pilots Link modules are going to be usable by any class that can fit it (if we make them equipment this will bar the sentinel) ; just anyone else will be less efficient at it. This was a conscious decision against the LAV as having 3 links on those can make an LAV very powerful. By weakening the operator link capabilities to around 1 link module if you want a survivable operator is the desired effect and check balance. You can have a survivable operator but you will have fewer links, If you want more links you are going to have a weaker operator. LAVs have strong mobility which is a very powerful survival tool in the current and likely future metas. High mobility unless you slow down to perform the function of the vehicle, such as Logistics repping. A dead pilot is a useless one, and if its SO easy to pop a pilot out of an LAV, it'll reach a point where using a pilot is pointless because you're dying too quickly from enemy fire that may not even be focused. Even a tanked medium suit can be dropped quickly out of the drivers seat, imagine how awful it'll be with a light frame with even less HP than a scout. There needs to be something to help protect pilots, either via some bonus to reduce incoming damage or some other metric. The idea is that LAVs would benefit from fewer links than a vehicle that cannot get away as easily; remember this is about cool-downs and likely cool-down links used for the LAV are navigation and sensors. Also there is no guarantee we may see the return of a logistics LAV or a scout lav. Those roles could easily get shifted to other hulls (the mavs for example) CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 892	Posted - 2015.03.03 22:22:00 - [77] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Soul Cairn wrote: I strongly believe that pilot suits should have one eq slot. I believe that pilots should be placing uplinks in places difficult or impossible to reach for infantry. This is something I find beneficial to myself and my team. My question is why is a Pilot placing uplinks instead of fitting a mCRU to his/her vehicle. I can only answer this from the perspective of Infantry versus of Pilot, but it's basically this: mCRU's are the absolute last spawning option because it's mobile, and 99% of the time when you try to spawn on one the 10 second delay time it takes to actually spawn in is 10seconds of movement for that vehicle so once you actually spawn in you're waaaay far away from where you actually wanted or needed to be. It's literally better to spawn back in the redline and just run or call your own vehicle. Maybe one of the Pilot Suit bennies could be mCRU spawntimes are shortened, say to 6 or 7 seconds. Seriously, the spreadsheets may not show why but actual gameplay is crystal clear on why mCRU spawning is turrible. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 8210	Posted - 2015.03.04 01:35:00 - [78] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: Soul Cairn wrote: I strongly believe that pilot suits should have one eq slot. I believe that pilots should be placing uplinks in places difficult or impossible to reach for infantry. This is something I find beneficial to myself and my team. My question is why is a Pilot placing uplinks instead of fitting a mCRU to his/her vehicle. I can only answer this from the perspective of Infantry versus of Pilot, but it's basically this: mCRU's are the absolute last spawning option because it's mobile, and 99% of the time when you try to spawn on one the 10 second delay time it takes to actually spawn in is 10seconds of movement for that vehicle so once you actually spawn in you're waaaay far away from where you actually wanted or needed to be. It's literally better to spawn back in the redline and just run or call your own vehicle. Maybe one of the Pilot Suit bennies could be mCRU spawntimes are shortened, say to 6 or 7 seconds. Seriously, the spreadsheets may not show why but actual gameplay is crystal clear on why mCRU spawning is turrible. As opposed to uplinks which can be camped or popped before you even spawn in? I don't mind if Pilots have a little wiggle room with Uplinks, but they shouldn't have the BW to place more than 2 at pro. Lets face it, much of the Uplink spam came from ADS users placing them on high towers. We don't need a repeat of that. If you really want to place Uplinks, use a Logi to drive the vehicle or pick one up as a passenger. Othrewise mCRU should be a good spot. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5160	Posted - 2015.03.04 01:53:00 - [79] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Re: LAVs and low HP pilots Link modules are going to be usable by any class that can fit it (if we make them equipment this will bar the sentinel) ; just anyone else will be less efficient at it. This was a conscious decision against the LAV as having 3 links on those can make an LAV very powerful. By weakening the operator link capabilities to around 1 link module if you want a survivable operator is the desired effect and check balance. You can have a survivable operator but you will have fewer links, If you want more links you are going to have a weaker operator. LAVs have strong mobility which is a very powerful survival tool in the current and likely future metas. High mobility unless you slow down to perform the function of the vehicle, such as Logistics repping. A dead pilot is a useless one, and if its SO easy to pop a pilot out of an LAV, it'll reach a point where using a pilot is pointless because you're dying too quickly from enemy fire that may not even be focused. Even a tanked medium suit can be dropped quickly out of the drivers seat, imagine how awful it'll be with a light frame with even less HP than a scout. There needs to be something to help protect pilots, either via some bonus to reduce incoming damage or some other metric. The idea is that LAVs would benefit from fewer links than a vehicle that cannot get away as easily; remember this is about cool-downs and likely cool-down links used for the LAV are navigation and sensors. Also there is no guarantee we may see the return of a logistics LAV or a scout lav. Those roles could easily get shifted to other hulls (the mavs for example) Going under the assumption that you have to use a non-Pilot suit to use an LAV in an optimal matter is evident that something is severely wrong with the system. Not to mention going under the assumption that LAVs will never have a specialty variant is just....shortsighted. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18754	Posted - 2015.03.04 06:52:00 - [80] - Quote I am just saying there can be other variants of the LAV that are brought in that do not require it to be up and front with infantry. Case in point AA LAV Covert LAV CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5182	Posted - 2015.03.04 07:33:00 - [81] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I am just saying there can be other variants of the LAV that are brought in that do not require it to be up and front with infantry. Case in point AA LAV Covert LAV Well for one, I think the LLAV should still be a thing, and secondly I still think you're going to run into issues with an excessively squishy pilot. I mean will all open air vehicles simply be unsuitable for the Pilot suit because they'll get blowing away easily? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Chit Hoppened The Exemplars RISE of LEGION 419	Posted - 2015.03.04 22:56:00 - [82] - Quote I've always pictured Pilot suits having LESS (yes LESS) slots than any other Role, but the unique twist is that they can actually plug Vehicle Modules into their slots. The CalPilot (or any Pilot) would have AT MOST 3 total slots at Pro but they are Vehicle Mods so they can fit an extra Shield Booster/Extender/etc into those slots and they transfer DIRECTLY to their Vehicle. Now Lockout of all Vehicles except for Pilots may be extreme so possibly do a thing like anyone can use the Militia Vehicles (and BPO Vehicles) but only Pilots can use the Skilled Vehicles like Maddies, Gunnies and the ADSs. Also, haven't exactly read through all the pages. This is just what I first thought when I seen the Pilot Role. Bringing Heavy Metal to New Eden. Cannon Fever Representative


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