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CCP Logic, guys please look at yourselves.

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Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7699	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:28:00 - [1] - Quote This is not intended to be a complete rant but just to show us that you can't look at one problem and say one single thing is the factor for something. Please guys you have to stop this and actually look at the data, think about what factors into the data and then discuss it. I'm talking about a plethora of things CCP has screwed up with simply because they don't look at the whole picture but rather their precious infallible "data" I'm talking about: -Buffing the Bolt Pistol because it wasn't "used enough". Yes the Bolt Pistol needed a slight tune up but it wasn't a terrible weapon. The reason why people didn't use the Bolt Pistol right away is 1). You introduced the Weapon later in the game where people already skilled into Sidearms.2). The SMG was the god weapon so there was no need to switch. This actually goes for a lot of weapons in the past, Scrambler Rifle in it's early days, Burst HMG Nevertheless the Ion Pistol and Magsec did need a buff but they were legitimately bad weapons and were in different conditions as the Bolt Pistols, but with simply looking at numbers you would not be able to tell this difference, the folly of solely looking at "Data". - The whole Vehicle vs. AV imbalance I'm going to compact the history of this fiasco the best I can. In the early days, we had Standard, Advanced and PRO tanks. Then people would cry that they needed teamwork to kill the higher tier tanks (shocker right?) so to respond with CCPs need to attract more players they needed to dumb the game down a bit. So they Nerfed Vehicles while at the Same time...buffed AV. Now, this is the about the first time that they did this so it was acceptable but we ended up seeing that AV became too powerful against vehicles which made them kinda useless. A few months later they decide to take another swing at this. The solution was to Nerf AV while at the same time BUFFING Vehicles which somehow, *to their actual* surprise resulted in Vehicles becoming overpowered compared to Anti-Vehicle roles. This didn't happen once throughout DUST history, not twice, not even three times in this games lifetime but around 9 times of going in this clearly obvious cycle that they could have easily escaped from. Eventually the person that was in charge of vehicles...was no longer in charge of vehicles and they decided to completely strip down vehicle diversity and simplify it to start it from scratch so they could fix it.....which was a complete failure because the problems we had back then are literally the same exact problems we have now....minus the ADS issue. But I'll leave this for now because you could write a book on how they mishandled vehicle balance 101. - "Mu Data" That's apparently working as intended.** Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other. This game may have slowly reverted back into a lobby shooter with shorter time to kill like you guys said you didn't want to do a few months back...but teamwork is still one of the major, critical factors on if you lose or not. Trust me Rattai and friends, I do understand the limitations in what we are dealing with, not a large player base, and regional servers to further strain the matchmaking pool but asking for the game to be balanced around squads seems like a fairly simple construct to have. Would there still be pub stomps? Yes, it's going to happen, you can't escape total victories in any game but you can do a much better job with this, I know the system is new and it takes time but my optimism for this new matchmaking system has went from cheerfully optimistic to slightly worried to completely bitter; and it's only been about a week! -Assault Rifle nerfs in the old days This one is more towards the simpleton thinking of the DUST 514 community than CCP. A long time ago the Plasma Assault Rifle was the only General Purpose Rifle in the game and people complained that it was too good at a lot of things, even though the plasma rifle still had short range like now people complained that it was too good at what it did.....even though it was the only one that did what it did at the time so to fix this CCP decides to nerf the plasma Rifle, that's fine various variations did need a nerf but the general purpose rifle was fine. Cycles of Plasma Rifle Nerfs later and we see the Assault rifles in the pre-Delta form. Kinda useless overall and the best one [the standard assault rifle] was underperforming but there were no other general purpose rifles at the time so the community decides that the Assault Rifle is still too prominent on the field even though it was still the only assault rifle at the time and ask desperately to get the weapon nerfed. Thread after thread, the forums were filled with pleas to nerf the only general purpose rifle in the game because too many people used it. Later on the Scrambler Rifle is introduced and was pretty balanced besides some slight mechanic issues but CCP saw that "it wasn't being used as much as the Plasma Rifle" so they buffed it to what it was Pre-Delta. Even though this happened people still cried for plasma Rifle Nerfs and later on the Rail and Combat Rifle are introduced (at extremely OP levels) and everyone is completely fine with the OP rifles and completely forgets that they were just trying to nerf the now underperforming rifle. That says a lot! Something's wrong when you regret Things that haven't happened yet
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7699	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:28:00 - [2] - Quote -Academy Failures A long time ago CCP decided to listen to the community and improve the NPE by adding the Academy, while it was great on paper CCP managed to drop the ball on it by relying on their skewed "data" to make the Academy parameters. The Academy was designed to help new players and CCP decided that once you reach a certain WP level you could graduate from the Academy and get sent out into the glorious unforgiving world of ~~New Eden~~ DUST 514. They came up with the amount of WP needed to graduate by finding the Average of Players in this game and based it off of that. Which resulted in a failed experience where you only needed three battles to leave the academy. What went wrong? Here are just several factors 1). When dealing with the Averages you have to be careful because you can have the majority of players being on completely two completely different sides of the spectrum with only a few in the middle and the average will completely leave out the majority of players and focus only on the ones in the middle. I'll explain this with shapes and pigeons, lets say there are Pigeons sitting on a rectangle the majority of Pigeons are sitting on the far left and right side with only very little in the middle. If CCP were to look at this scenario they would say that the majority of Pigeons are in the middle simply because the numbers naturally even out between two extremes when you deal with Averages. Even though it's quite obvious that there are barely any pigeons in the middle, the data suggest that there are many. 2). Did not, at all take into account of AFK farming, which was a tremendous issue at the time. AFK farming is what happens in a game where you give little to no incentive to win, which is a problem DUST has always had but I digress. Going back to example 1 CCP made the Average WP based off of two (really more than two) extremes: People who played the Games WP ratio vs. New Player who just started the game vs. Alts that are just for SP/ISK farming vs. new players that completely dumped DUST 514 and left them idle. Take all that into account and you have the reason for Academy being a failed experiment for months and it's still too low if you ask me. They took the averages of the Community and based the Academy Criteria off of skewed data. I could go on but these are some of the examples that really bite at my knickers. I've been here since the beginning and I'm just tired of seeing CCP and the Community make similar mistakes and assumptions based off the same failed logic patterns time after time after time... You can't fix the Community, the majority of us are unsalvageable but CCP you aren't and you can and should learn to not look at things in a black and white light like you guys have done so disturbingly frequently. The point of this thread is just to say that when you're dealing with Statistics / data it is never black and white and there will never be one or two simple factors that act out a full equation. There are a multitude of factors to take into considerations but time after time CCP and the community have failed to realise this simple common knowledge. I feel like you guys do know this but something just looses contact along the way. With all that being said, CCP Rattati, you and your team are doing a thousand times better than the previous developers have and I can honestly say that had you been here in the beginning, DUST would have been a huge success because having a DEV that actually plays his own game and having some common gaming logic sense is so much more important than some guy who's some "highly trained", Ex-EA employee but is dealing with a product he has no clue about and is only concerned about the bottom line. Developers, GMs, thank you for your time if you managed to read through this, the purpose of this wasn't just a rant but a concern from a very loyal customer who believes greatly in your product. In the age of Lobby Shooters, low skill requirements and constant DLCs that have more content than the game itself, this FPS is a humongous breath of fresh air compared to the generic trash FPS shooters out there. I just don't want it to fail....well Legion to fail I guess because DUST is on it's way out but I digress! Thank you guys. Something's wrong when you regret Things that haven't happened yet
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 17970	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:40:00 - [3] - Quote 1. The bolt pistol: I agree. The bolt pistol was an unremarkable weapon pre-Delta, but it was by no means a bad one. Underused, yes - but not so much that it required such a large series of buffs. Moody has an excellent video extolling the virtues of the pre-Delta bolt pistol. It was an adequate weapon. A small buff might have been in order. A 70% damage buff and a much increased headshot multiplier, even if the clip size was reduced, does not count as a small buff. That's insane. There are very, very few weapons which have been buffed by that much, if any. I can't recall any others off the top of my head apart from perhaps the Chromosome TAR to the Uprising TAR. 2. Regarding Mu data and squads: Again, I completely agree. Squads make or break battles. They have a -huge- effect on the tide of battle. A squad of militiaberries who know what they're doing can quite happily take solo proto players on. I'm inclined to be tolerant of this system, though. I hope it'll be iterated on and Rattati has shown a heartening willingness to listen to players about this sort of thing. 3. Assault rifles: That episode was hilarious. I think they're okayish now, but it still amazes me that 'AR 514' became 'balanced' overnight because even more powerful rifles were introduced. 4. Academy and the NPE: The NPE... is a complex beast. It is, IMO, the single most important thing to DUST to be iterated on but one of the more difficult ones to get right. The Academy always seemed like a crude measure. It's something and that's great, but it's had its own series of problems and it's not sufficient on its own. The little steps like skillbooks being bought for new players are nice, but more really needs to be done. It's a shame there don't seem to be the resources to deal with it. DUST has a habit of overcomplicating itself for new players. Dropsuit command 5 is a farce of game design and whoever designed features like that in the skill tree is, frankly, an idiot. I'm probably going to start ranting about this if I spend too long on this post, though, so I'm going to cut it short there and go think of some little things that can be done for the poor newbies. 5. Regarding thinking about the reasoning behind statistics: So much yes. If there is one thing to take away from this post, it's that there is a reason for statistics. Rattati is doing a fine job finding where problems are with statistics, but there could be some... refinement of what's done about it. Give the man credit where it's due though - he's apparently smarter than the entire previous game design team put together and has done more for balance in a couple of months than they did in years. TL;DR: +1 The forums have ruined me.
Cheydinhal Guard Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 219	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:49:00 - [4] - Quote I agree with yu on the sidearms, but I still don't understand why the ScP (aside from the Breach variant) took such a huge damage nerf for no absolute reason. Prior to Delta, I seldom saw anyone with an ScP aside from MLT blueberries. The ScP had already received a RoF nerf a while back. It should've been kept that way. Now it's practically nothing but an Amarr Ion pistol. I can wait an entire hour in about 10 minutes. Impressive, i know.
Atiim 12672	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:50:00 - [5] - Quote Damn these Gallenteans and their giant walls of text. Someone needs to confiscate their keyboards. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 3893	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:53:00 - [6] - Quote I can't fathom reversing the awesome that is the new matchmaking. It's provided the most balanced matches in years. No longer does seeing a Fatal Absolution squad on the other team mean I might as well leave match, because it's going to be a stomp. If you are a really high Mu squad, and hence get matchmade with some newbies, and hence, have an actual "tough fight" instead of an easy stomp, that is a good thing. You should never go into a match assured of victory. If you want a game mode that is doing less to make for even matches, try FacWar. :D CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 17970	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:53:00 - [7] - Quote Atiim wrote: Damn these Gallenteans and their giant walls of text. Someone needs to confiscate their keyboards. It's funny that the Caldari should have a reputation for being 'industrious' when they post lazy comments like this. Soraya Xel wrote: I can't fathom reversing the awesome that is the new matchmaking. It's provided the most balanced matches in years. No longer does seeing a Fatal Absolution squad on the other team mean I might as well leave match, because it's going to be a stomp. If you are a really high Mu squad, and hence get matchmade with some newbies, and hence, have an actual "tough fight" instead of an easy stomp, that is a good thing. You should never go into a match assured of victory. If you want a game mode that is doing less to make for even matches, try FacWar. :D It's better than it was, but it's not perfect. There are still matches where you have ludicrously stacked odds. Even on my alts with low mu scores I sometimes end up against a double squad on the other team with only solo players on mine. We now have the basis of a solid matchmaker. There are still problems with it, though, but I suspect Rattati will build on that. The forums have ruined me.
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7703	Posted - 2014.10.02 21:00:00 - [8] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: I can't fathom reversing the awesome that is the new matchmaking. It's provided the most balanced matches in years. No longer does seeing a Fatal Absolution squad on the other team mean I might as well leave match, because it's going to be a stomp. If you are a really high Mu squad, and hence get matchmade with some newbies, and hence, have an actual "tough fight" instead of an easy stomp, that is a good thing. You should never go into a match assured of victory. If you want a game mode that is doing less to make for even matches, try FacWar. :D You're foolish if you wish to assume that I want a pubstomp simply because of my tag. And you're on the CPM? get out of here. My problem is that when squading with my teammates it results in our team being the only one to push objectives while everybody else runs and hides. You seriously find this acceptable? Or are your past biases getting in the way here since you wish to bring up my corp? I've only wanted good battles and balance in this game, I haven't ever even spec'd into Flavor of the Month sticking only to Gallente themed weaponry as my persona, even if that meant I had to use ***** weapons so how dare you even have the audacity to accuse me of wanting easy mode matches solely off my tag. Something's wrong when you regret Things that haven't happened yet
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7703	Posted - 2014.10.02 21:05:00 - [9] - Quote Atiim wrote: Damn these Gallenteans and their giant walls of text. Someone needs to confiscate their keyboards. They can take our Keyboards, but they will never take our FREEDOM! Something's wrong when you regret Things that haven't happened yet
Atiim 12674	Posted - 2014.10.02 21:13:00 - [10] - Quote @"V/AV Balance" When you think about it, Vehicles these days aren't as strong as they were back then, they only seem stronger to to AV weapons having a higher TTK Before Uprising 1.7, my Madrugar had approximately 7000 eHP, and had two 25% hardeners (which had very quick downtimes), along with an Efficient Repairer which had about 415HP/pulse. Now, my Madrugar has 5200 eHP, and 200HP/s, and only 1 25% hardener. I don't remember the DPS of the turrets, but in a 1v1 I think we all know which HAV build would win. Other than that, I completely agree. Many of the V/AV problems could have easily been avoided by assessing the changes thoroughly before implementing them. @"Mu" The main problem with players having friendlies on their team is the fact that the Academy lasts all of 20min for anyone with even the slightest bit of experience in FPS games (or games in general, really). Now that the starting ISK has been reduced, I think the duration that players are in the Academy should be increased. It won't completely fix the NPE, but it'd be a lot better than nothing. @"Assault Rifles" Despite being the "only general purpose riffle", it's TTK was to low compared to other weapons in the game (a problem which would be magnified even further with the introduction of Combat and Rail Rifles). The 1st Matari Commando -HAND

CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1858	Posted - 2014.10.02 21:14:00 - [11] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Developers, GMs, thank you for your time if you managed to read through this, the purpose of this wasn't just a rant but a concern from a very loyal customer who believes greatly in your product. In the age of Lobby Shooters, low skill requirements and constant DLCs that have more content than the game itself, this FPS is a humongous breath of fresh air compared to the generic trash FPS shooters out there. I just don't want it to fail....well Legion to fail I guess because DUST is on it's way out but I digress! Thank you guys. I can't express my agreement with this portion of your write up enough. DUST is still a breath of fresh air even years after the fact and on the ageing PS3 of all things. It is seeming to be like a distant memory now but there was a time when even the so called 'big developers' of the gaming world would truly come up with innovative, fun, challenging and fresh games. "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 3894	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:01:00 - [12] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: You're foolish if you wish to assume that I want a pubstomp simply because of my tag. And you're on the CPM? get out of here. My problem is that when squading with my teammates it results in our team being the only one to push objectives while everybody else runs and hides. You seriously find this acceptable? Or are your past biases getting in the way here since you wish to bring up my corp? My point isn't to insult your corp, if anything it's a complement. My point is, that if an FA squad is on one side, you can expect the other side to have more of the better players of the remaining 26 people in the room, because it's needed to compensate for your team's abilities. If you guys are the best in the room, you are going to have to carry your team. Because your Mu score says you can. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 17971	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:12:00 - [13] - Quote The thing about that, though, Soraya, is that if those players are on equal footing with the players composing the squad but are solo, the squadded players have a huge advantage. I understand the matchmaker tries to compensate for that to some extent - but I don't think its enough. The squad advantage is a little under-rated in terms of mu - I'm getting a lot of matches where it's squadstomps but players of similar ability. The forums have ruined me.
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 3894	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:22:00 - [14] - Quote So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher. Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1863	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:24:00 - [15] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: You're foolish if you wish to assume that I want a pubstomp simply because of my tag. And you're on the CPM? get out of here. My problem is that when squading with my teammates it results in our team being the only one to push objectives while everybody else runs and hides. You seriously find this acceptable? Or are your past biases getting in the way here since you wish to bring up my corp? My point isn't to insult your corp, if anything it's a complement. My point is, that if an FA squad is on one side, you can expect the other side to have more of the better players of the remaining 26 people in the room, because it's needed to compensate for your team's abilities. If you guys are the best in the room, you are going to have to carry your team. Because your Mu score says you can. Then why am I running into a squad of fatal absolution and a squad of molon labe on one side and not a single squad on the other? The Mu system is pitifully easy to fool, all I need do is afk to lower it then stomp face. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 3894	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:27:00 - [16] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Then why am I running into a squad of fatal absolution and a squad of molon labe on one side and not a single squad on the other? The Mu system is pitifully easy to fool, all I need do is afk to lower it then stomp face. Are you sending scoreboard screenshots of those to CCP Rattati? If the Mu system is failing, particularly in that way, definitely get him those. He'll see what's up with how the match was calculated. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
Vell0cet Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 2321	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:50:00 - [17] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: ...The Mu system is pitifully easy to fool, all I need do is afk to lower it then stomp face. We don't know how Mu is calculated. If Rattati followed some of our suggestions of using WP/Death (excluding suicides and teamkills) then it would be nearly impossible to manipulate short of intentionally running into enemy fire and dying over and over (sound like fun?). Even if he stuck with the original proposal of win/loss, he said this was over the aggregate of the character's life. This means you'd have to do a LOT of AFKing to lower your Mu on a high SP character. Best PvE idea ever!
Reign Omega Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 920	Posted - 2014.10.02 23:05:00 - [18] - Quote Side note, wtf is mu? Mark a$$ tricks, and bags of dicks....
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 17022	Posted - 2014.10.02 23:22:00 - [19] - Quote Thank you for a level headed analytics of pain points. CPM should strive to help resolve some of the issues but some issues are immensely daunting because of the lack of tools in the toolbox Ion Pistol should be very fixable and it is probably going to dominate the post delta scene to accompany what few or little changes being planned for Echo. I did fail my part because I didn't do a through enough simulation with the bolt pistol (and I suck with it) to see the potential overbuff to reign it back. Hopefully the community can help us adjust its knobs down to get it to that nice niche goal of a marksman's pistol you want to bring to a shooting target competition. MU changes are not perfect, they are however better than left as was. If you feel a match was badly placed please do not hesitate to snap of the end of match and send it into CCP Snorri's email. I do know squads break the calculations by a long shot and I know that players who understand how their own mu is calculated can do what is commonly known as smurfing even if it means wrecking their own wp/m stats. The plasma rifles are at the cusp of being just right, not enough, and op. So far there has been adjustments to it nearly every hotfix so far and its been an odd dance but I hope it continues until the plasma rifle feels 'just right' SCR is a similarly odd place right behind it (not the ACR) in terms of not doing enough and change one number and it becomes the murderer of teams. This is not like the bolt pistol where that is a culmination of buffs amounting to the what the fish bbq it does now. Either way continued adjustments should be going until fixed. NPE is by itself the worst beast to deal with as I said earlier. The community can continue to try to help us solve and alleviate that problem with the hotfixes but there is only so much we can do. Skill Garbage as I like to call it should be stomped out with a vengeance. Better clarity of every skill category's existence needs to be brought into the spot light and players need a stronger sense of agency over how to grow their character. Overall the task is daunting and tireless and will always be on our minds when it the chance to improve upon it comes. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Sniper Rifles =// Unlocked
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Kyoudai Furinkazan 1233	Posted - 2014.10.03 00:19:00 - [20] - Quote No knock to past CPM's but I like the crew that's in place right now and if you notice , they are not ghosts and they respond and communicate with the community as a whole . I appreciate that . I know that no one was knocking the CPM but I just felt that I had to say that . The OP has made some valid points though and I was wondering why the academy was changed to the point of taking unallocated points from the beginners . Yes they start one off in certain parts of the skill tree but they took ISK's and skill points and I was just wondering why ? Delta should come with a SP or infantry SP refund so that a campaign for one is not needed .

Leanna Boghin Paradox Pride 471	Posted - 2014.10.03 00:30:00 - [21] - Quote The nerfs and buffs in this game arent just about "balancing" even though thats the only reason CCP will give anyone for nerfing and buffing weapons the way they do. They actually have an agenda (which i cant really blame them) See they sell weapons and gear in the market for Aurum and when a certain weapon isnt getting much use but they want to make money off of it they buff the weapon in such a way as to make it more powerful sothat more and more people will want to use it. And since most people havent bothered to spec into that particular weapon thats been buffed at the time there is a good chance that people will buy aurum versions. I mean look what happened in the market after tank spamming began. They took advantage and started selling Aurum AV suits and tanks more so than they ever did. Its a typical money making ploy that most game companies will utilize. Another reason CCP does the nerfs and buffs is to gather data for legion. Of course CCP wont admit to it (simply because no one would spend money on a game they know is just a beta for another game) but all the evidence is there. Ever since the announcement of Legion they have taken a great interest in "improving" and "balancing" Dust when in fact its nothing more than a ploy to test variables for Legion. But like i said CCP is too much of a coward to admit anything i just stated. So in a year or two when they get tired of using Dust as a beta and searching the dust couches for change then and only then will they finally admit to it and then i can say i told you so. I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 3903	Posted - 2014.10.03 00:32:00 - [22] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: The nerfs and buffs in this game arent just about "balancing" even though thats the only reason CCP will give anyone for nerfing and buffing weapons the way they do. They actually have an agenda (which i cant really blame them) See they sell weapons and gear in the market for Aurum and when a certain weapon isnt getting much use but they want to make money off of it they buff the weapon in such a way as to make it more powerful sothat more and more people will want to use it. This is complete and utter bull. Period. Please pick up your complimentary tin foil hat from CEOPyrex. He has many. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 8378	Posted - 2014.10.03 00:36:00 - [23] - Quote Thank you for the feedback and since most of your points were non-ranty and written with good intentions, I can address most of them. That is not to say I agree with them, but I will explain why. 1) Statistics - You claim that we are just using usage data to warrant the change to the bolt pistol and I really don't like when people claim something without data to back it up. I have explained before that we use multiple methods, including Kills per Spawn per Weapon (per dropsuit), basically K/D per weapon. Where is your statement coming from, where are the facts? The CPM could tell you that we worked together on a detailed spreadsheet with all the sidearms, Zatara took lead on this one as the others had taken leads on different aspects of Delta. Together we collected community feedback, data and the CPM experience to rank all the sidearms into categories of needs buff/nerf, methods to do so and reasoning. 2) The final method of balancing the sidearms was also very clear, we established the weapon everyone knew, the SMG as the cornerstone of sidearms and created a range vs dps, and comparable dmg/clip and clips/ammo ratios nased completely around the DMG. We did not nerf it even though it was the most used weapon, but based the whole strategy around getting all the sidearms to a similar efficiency, meaning most got buffed (a lot) and a few got nerfed slightly. By changing these efficiencies, we may later see that the usage goes up, but usage is only an indicator of UP/OP. 3) Just the fact that we immediately tweaked Hotfix Delta with a balancing hotfix a week later, should speak for itself. Our data showed that the BP was OP, so we reduced ROF and if that isn't enough, we will keep working on it. 4) Please send me data on broken Teambuilding to [email protected]. I have yet to see a concrete example of unwarranted 2 stacked squads on one side and newberries on the other, and my inbox is full of screenshots from players. Yes, stomps happen, but they happen everywhere, even in the EPL, NBA and the NFL. When a 6 man squad from the best PC corp hits its stride, very few aside from a similar squad will stand a chance. Other than that, I don't get your point about Teambuilding, are you against having more even teams or? You can go play FW if you want to to try your luck, that feature doesn't use the new Teambuilder. 5) To whomever said it, good luck on manipulating the Mu and have lots of fun AFKing to do so. To me, even contemplating it is unfathomable. 6) New Player experience, in the four hotfixes we haven't ben able to change the "early mission system", but we have granted better starter fits, created tons of militia weapons," assisted" with skill selection (in fact gave 3 times more ISK than before through Skillbooks), and made the Academy a more "fun" place, so extending it (twice, from 2400 to 5000 in Delta) has been sown slowly and purposefully. Retention has never been higher than it is now. Consistently getting a 1000 WP per battle, means you completely get the game, fitting and progression. 7) Assault Rifles, again, are you referencing old ways, we can't change that, only how we work now. I think the 3 Tuning Rifles threads demonstrate that we are doing things differently. Again, the claim that we are using usage data or forum QQ to balance which is plainly not true. 8) V/AV, this is a longer standing issue. Let's just work together to make it fun for everyone. On your final assessment, I cannot agree with you more. DUST 514 is my favorite game and it keeps getting better. Thanks again for the feedback! "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

TH1EFOFSOuLS Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 39	Posted - 2014.10.03 00:46:00 - [24] - Quote Quote: 8) V/AV, this is a longer standing issue. Let's just work together to make it fun for everyone. ] You need to get people or at least motivate them to spec into their own vehicles as I always say nothing kills a tank better then a tank or a drop ship. One guy should not force me off a point immediately after I get their just because he is shooting down on me with a bunch of SP just so I can run away. No one tanks or even dropships anymore so if a respect to occur im sure allot of people would be happy to put their SP into proto stomping weapons like everyone else just letting you know.
Viktor Hadah Jr Negative-Impact Gentlemen's.Club 5266	Posted - 2014.10.03 00:49:00 - [25] - Quote TH1EFOFSOuLS wrote: Quote: 8) V/AV, this is a longer standing issue. Let's just work together to make it fun for everyone. ] You need to get people or at least motivate them to spec into their own vehicles as I always say nothing kills a tank better then a tank or a drop ship. One guy should not force me off a point immediately after I get their just because he is shooting down on me with a bunch of SP just so I can run away. No one tanks or even dropships anymore so if a respect to occur im sure allot of people would be happy to put their SP into proto stomping weapons like everyone else just letting you know. Are you taking about dropships in this sentence because thats how it was for many patches, and not just me one dropship can destroy entire squads by himself. EVE 21 Day Trial
Leanna Boghin Paradox Pride 472	Posted - 2014.10.03 01:01:00 - [26] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Thank you for the feedback and since most of your points were non-ranty and written with good intentions, I can address most of them. That is not to say I agree with them, but I will explain why. 1) Statistics - You claim that we are just using usage data to warrant the change to the bolt pistol and I really don't like when people claim something without data to back it up. I have explained before that we use multiple methods, including Kills per Spawn per Weapon (per dropsuit), basically K/D per weapon. Where is your statement coming from, where are the facts? The CPM could tell you that we worked together on a detailed spreadsheet with all the sidearms, Zatara took lead on this one as the others had taken leads on different aspects of Delta. Together we collected community feedback, data and the CPM experience to rank all the sidearms into categories of needs buff/nerf, methods to do so and reasoning. 2) The final method of balancing the sidearms was also very clear, we established the weapon everyone knew, the SMG as the cornerstone of sidearms and created a range vs dps, and comparable dmg/clip and clips/ammo ratios based completely around the SMG. We did not nerf it even though it was the most used weapon, but based the whole strategy around getting all the sidearms to a similar efficiency, meaning most got buffed (a lot) and a few got nerfed slightly. By changing these efficiencies, we may later see that the usage goes up, but usage is only an indicator of UP/OP. 3) Just the fact that we immediately tweaked Hotfix Delta with a balancing hotfix a week later, should speak for itself. Our data showed that the BP was OP, so we reduced ROF and if that isn't enough, we will keep working on it. 4) Please send me data on broken Teambuilding to [email protected]. I have yet to see a concrete example of unwarranted 2 stacked squads on one side and newberries on the other, and my inbox is full of screenshots from players. Yes, stomps happen, but they happen everywhere, even in the EPL, NBA and the NFL. When a 6 man squad from the best PC corp hits its stride, very few aside from a similar squad will stand a chance. Other than that, I don't get your point about Teambuilding, are you against having more even teams or? You can go play FW if you want to to try your luck, that feature doesn't use the new Teambuilder. 5) To whomever said it, good luck on manipulating the Mu and have lots of fun AFKing to do so. To me, even contemplating it is unfathomable. 6) New Player experience, in the four hotfixes we haven't ben able to change the "early mission system", but we have granted better starter fits, created tons of militia weapons," assisted" with skill selection (in fact gave 3 times more ISK than before through Skillbooks), and made the Academy a more "fun" place, so extending it (twice, from 2400 to 5000 in Delta) has been sown slowly and purposefully. Retention has never been higher than it is now. Consistently getting a 1000 WP per battle, means you completely get the game, fitting and progression. 7) Assault Rifles, again, are you referencing old ways, we can't change that, only how we work now. I think the 3 Tuning Rifles threads demonstrate that we are doing things differently. Again, the claim that we are using usage data or forum QQ to balance which is plainly not true. 8) V/AV, this is a longer standing issue. Let's just work together to make it fun for everyone. On your final assessment, I cannot agree with you more. DUST 514 is my favorite game and it keeps getting better. Thanks again for the feedback! 1) Show us your findings. You claim you do all this hard work yet you never show us anything but the end result. Which might i remind you usually ends up being a weapon too over powered or too nerfed. 2) The fact that you based your data on a smg was your failing right there. Never base your data gatherin g on a weapon or a piece of gear that is completely different from another that you are trying to "balance" because the end result will be very clear. A failure 3) If you want to stop the whining of the stomping then i suggest a respec. That way those that currently cant stomp will be able to (simply cause of misplaced skill points we all know that every noob puts all their skills every where instead of on just one thing) making things more balanced than they ever have been. Think about it for a minute and you will see that what i say is completely feasible. and 4) It figures you wouldnt comment about my statement i made about money problems which leads me to believe that i am more right on target than i have ever been. Its a same and i agree the game is great if not dying from failed mechanics and unnecessary nerfs and buffs to weapons that where clearly working very well. Hide it if you like but the CPMs talking to only a few people to get their data just isnt clearly enough to improve the game. I think its high time you direct them to each take a part and make a survey that you can then email to at least the people that are subscribed to your emails so that certain questions can be answered truthfully and discreetly. I believe that may be the only TRUE way to gather the data you need to "balance" this game. And if you dont want to do the survey idea then i bed the question as to why not? Sure your stretched thin but thats why i suggest you have the CPM draw up a survey with a little comment section below it to leave any comments they thought the CPMs might have left out. And plenty of sites will let you set up free surveys so its wouldnt be out of the realm of possibilities and certainly wont take any precious money from you. And until CCP and its developers is willing to do everything in their power to improve the game then i cant sit by and not think that you arent trying to run the game into the ground as nothing more than a beta for another game for PC. I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
Leanna Boghin Paradox Pride 472	Posted - 2014.10.03 01:08:00 - [27] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: The nerfs and buffs in this game arent just about "balancing" even though thats the only reason CCP will give anyone for nerfing and buffing weapons the way they do. They actually have an agenda (which i cant really blame them) See they sell weapons and gear in the market for Aurum and when a certain weapon isnt getting much use but they want to make money off of it they buff the weapon in such a way as to make it more powerful sothat more and more people will want to use it. This is complete and utter bull. Period. Please pick up your complimentary tin foil hat from CEOPyrex. He has many. Actually its not bull and it isnt a conspiracy its just simple business. And if i ran a game I would do the same thing they are doing. I dont blame them but it is sad to see thats how the gaming industry has moved since the days of mario and zelda. You can kiss the butts of every CCP employee all you want it wont change the fact that this is how gaming industry is in this day and age. And most people like yourself want to believe that the gaming companies actually want more than money but money is really the only thing that drives a game company anymore. Believe me if there wasnt money in gaming there would be no games. So yeah call it bullshit or a conspiracy all you want its simple business tactics and thats just how they do things. They also wont ever admit to it because of the bad PR they would gain. And CCP has enough bad PR circling the gaming community as it is to want to collect anymore. I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 3907	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:02:00 - [28] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: The nerfs and buffs in this game arent just about "balancing" even though thats the only reason CCP will give anyone for nerfing and buffing weapons the way they do. They actually have an agenda (which i cant really blame them) See they sell weapons and gear in the market for Aurum and when a certain weapon isnt getting much use but they want to make money off of it they buff the weapon in such a way as to make it more powerful sothat more and more people will want to use it. This is complete and utter bull. Period. Please pick up your complimentary tin foil hat from CEOPyrex. He has many. Actually its not bull and it isnt a conspiracy its just simple business. And if i ran a game I would do the same thing they are doing. I dont blame them but it is sad to see thats how the gaming industry has moved since the days of mario and zelda. You can kiss the butts of every CCP employee all you want it wont change the fact that this is how gaming industry is in this day and age. And most people like yourself want to believe that the gaming companies actually want more than money but money is really the only thing that drives a game company anymore. Believe me if there wasnt money in gaming there would be no games. So yeah call it bullshit or a conspiracy all you want its simple business tactics and thats just how they do things. They also wont ever admit to it because of the bad PR they would gain. And CCP has enough bad PR circling the gaming community as it is to want to collect anymore. Yeah, your level of tin foil is really up there. Money has nothing to do with the balance changes, except perhaps that a better game generally makes more money. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
Leanna Boghin Paradox Pride 473	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:09:00 - [29] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: The nerfs and buffs in this game arent just about "balancing" even though thats the only reason CCP will give anyone for nerfing and buffing weapons the way they do. They actually have an agenda (which i cant really blame them) See they sell weapons and gear in the market for Aurum and when a certain weapon isnt getting much use but they want to make money off of it they buff the weapon in such a way as to make it more powerful sothat more and more people will want to use it. This is complete and utter bull. Period. Please pick up your complimentary tin foil hat from CEOPyrex. He has many. Actually its not bull and it isnt a conspiracy its just simple business. And if i ran a game I would do the same thing they are doing. I dont blame them but it is sad to see thats how the gaming industry has moved since the days of mario and zelda. You can kiss the butts of every CCP employee all you want it wont change the fact that this is how gaming industry is in this day and age. And most people like yourself want to believe that the gaming companies actually want more than money but money is really the only thing that drives a game company anymore. Believe me if there wasnt money in gaming there would be no games. So yeah call it bullshit or a conspiracy all you want its simple business tactics and thats just how they do things. They also wont ever admit to it because of the bad PR they would gain. And CCP has enough bad PR circling the gaming community as it is to want to collect anymore. Yeah, your level of tin foil is really up there. Money has nothing to do with the balance changes, except perhaps that a better game generally makes more money. If you are going to comment and make wild accussations claiming that im some conspiracy theorist then how about you offer a reason as to why its bullshit of what im saying rather than being rude. Oh thats right because you dont have a reason -_- seriously until you can offer a reason as to why im sooo wrong your insults go on deaf ears (or eyes in this case) I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
Logical Logi Immortal Guides 13	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:10:00 - [30] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Thank you for the feedback and since most of your points were non-ranty and written with good intentions, I can address most of them. That is not to say I agree with them, but I will explain why. 1) Statistics - You claim that we are just using usage data to warrant the change to the bolt pistol and I really don't like when people claim something without data to back it up. I have explained before that we use multiple methods, including Kills per Spawn per Weapon (per dropsuit), basically K/D per weapon. Where is your statement coming from, where are the facts? The CPM could tell you that we worked together on a detailed spreadsheet with all the sidearms, Zatara took lead on this one as the others had taken leads on different aspects of Delta. Together we collected community feedback, data and the CPM experience to rank all the sidearms into categories of needs buff/nerf, methods to do so and reasoning. 2) The final method of balancing the sidearms was also very clear, we established the weapon everyone knew, the SMG as the cornerstone of sidearms and created a range vs dps, and comparable dmg/clip and clips/ammo ratios based completely around the SMG. We did not nerf it even though it was the most used weapon, but based the whole strategy around getting all the sidearms to a similar efficiency, meaning most got buffed (a lot) and a few got nerfed slightly. By changing these efficiencies, we may later see that the usage goes up, but usage is only an indicator of UP/OP. 3) Just the fact that we immediately tweaked Hotfix Delta with a balancing hotfix a week later, should speak for itself. Our data showed that the BP was OP, so we reduced ROF and if that isn't enough, we will keep working on it. 4) Please send me data on broken Teambuilding to [email protected]. I have yet to see a concrete example of unwarranted 2 stacked squads on one side and newberries on the other, and my inbox is full of screenshots from players. Yes, stomps happen, but they happen everywhere, even in the EPL, NBA and the NFL. When a 6 man squad from the best PC corp hits its stride, very few aside from a similar squad will stand a chance. Other than that, I don't get your point about Teambuilding, are you against having more even teams or? You can go play FW if you want to to try your luck, that feature doesn't use the new Teambuilder. 5) To whomever said it, good luck on manipulating the Mu and have lots of fun AFKing to do so. To me, even contemplating it is unfathomable. 6) New Player experience, in the four hotfixes we haven't ben able to change the "early mission system", but we have granted better starter fits, created tons of militia weapons," assisted" with skill selection (in fact gave 3 times more ISK than before through Skillbooks), and made the Academy a more "fun" place, so extending it (twice, from 2400 to 5000 in Delta) has been done slowly and purposefully. Retention has never been higher than it is now. Consistently getting a 1000 WP per battle, means you completely get the game, fitting and progression. 7) Assault Rifles, again, are you referencing old ways, we can't change that, only how we work now. I think the 3 Tuning Rifles threads demonstrate that we are doing things differently. Again, the claim that we are using usage data or forum QQ to balance which is plainly not true. 8) V/AV, this is a longer standing issue. Let's just work together to make it fun for everyone. On your final assessment, I cannot agree with you more. DUST 514 is my favorite game and it keeps getting better. Thanks again for the feedback! I may have cried once or twice when Delta dropped but then I looked in the eyes of the CPM and the AV community and said "You may have won Delta, but when Echo comes CCP will follow the normal pattern of making Vehicles so OP". Although maybe after a couple Hotfixes they will destroy the Incubus, Python, Madrugar, Gunnlogi, Methana, Saga, Saga \|\| and promise to remake them more balanced than ever. Then quit updating the game... Director of Planetary Operations and General recruitment for Immortal Guides.

Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 17028	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:10:00 - [31] - Quote Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Assault Rifles =// Unlocked
Leanna Boghin Paradox Pride 473	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:12:00 - [32] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
Leanna Boghin Paradox Pride 473	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:14:00 - [33] - Quote Logical Logi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Thank you for the feedback and since most of your points were non-ranty and written with good intentions, I can address most of them. That is not to say I agree with them, but I will explain why. 1) Statistics - You claim that we are just using usage data to warrant the change to the bolt pistol and I really don't like when people claim something without data to back it up. I have explained before that we use multiple methods, including Kills per Spawn per Weapon (per dropsuit), basically K/D per weapon. Where is your statement coming from, where are the facts? The CPM could tell you that we worked together on a detailed spreadsheet with all the sidearms, Zatara took lead on this one as the others had taken leads on different aspects of Delta. Together we collected community feedback, data and the CPM experience to rank all the sidearms into categories of needs buff/nerf, methods to do so and reasoning. 2) The final method of balancing the sidearms was also very clear, we established the weapon everyone knew, the SMG as the cornerstone of sidearms and created a range vs dps, and comparable dmg/clip and clips/ammo ratios based completely around the SMG. We did not nerf it even though it was the most used weapon, but based the whole strategy around getting all the sidearms to a similar efficiency, meaning most got buffed (a lot) and a few got nerfed slightly. By changing these efficiencies, we may later see that the usage goes up, but usage is only an indicator of UP/OP. 3) Just the fact that we immediately tweaked Hotfix Delta with a balancing hotfix a week later, should speak for itself. Our data showed that the BP was OP, so we reduced ROF and if that isn't enough, we will keep working on it. 4) Please send me data on broken Teambuilding to [email protected]. I have yet to see a concrete example of unwarranted 2 stacked squads on one side and newberries on the other, and my inbox is full of screenshots from players. Yes, stomps happen, but they happen everywhere, even in the EPL, NBA and the NFL. When a 6 man squad from the best PC corp hits its stride, very few aside from a similar squad will stand a chance. Other than that, I don't get your point about Teambuilding, are you against having more even teams or? You can go play FW if you want to to try your luck, that feature doesn't use the new Teambuilder. 5) To whomever said it, good luck on manipulating the Mu and have lots of fun AFKing to do so. To me, even contemplating it is unfathomable. 6) New Player experience, in the four hotfixes we haven't ben able to change the "early mission system", but we have granted better starter fits, created tons of militia weapons," assisted" with skill selection (in fact gave 3 times more ISK than before through Skillbooks), and made the Academy a more "fun" place, so extending it (twice, from 2400 to 5000 in Delta) has been done slowly and purposefully. Retention has never been higher than it is now. Consistently getting a 1000 WP per battle, means you completely get the game, fitting and progression. 7) Assault Rifles, again, are you referencing old ways, we can't change that, only how we work now. I think the 3 Tuning Rifles threads demonstrate that we are doing things differently. Again, the claim that we are using usage data or forum QQ to balance which is plainly not true. 8) V/AV, this is a longer standing issue. Let's just work together to make it fun for everyone. On your final assessment, I cannot agree with you more. DUST 514 is my favorite game and it keeps getting better. Thanks again for the feedback! I may have cried once or twice when Delta dropped but then I looked in the eyes of the CPM and the AV community and said "You may have won Delta, but when Echo comes CCP will follow the normal pattern of making Vehicles so OP". Although maybe after a couple Hotfixes they will destroy the Incubus, Python, Madrugar, Gunnlogi, Methana, Saga, Saga \|\| and promise to remake them more balanced than ever. Then quit updating the game... Lol they do so love that pattern dont they. I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 3907	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:19:00 - [34] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: The nerfs and buffs in this game arent just about "balancing" even though thats the only reason CCP will give anyone for nerfing and buffing weapons the way they do. They actually have an agenda (which i cant really blame them) See they sell weapons and gear in the market for Aurum and when a certain weapon isnt getting much use but they want to make money off of it they buff the weapon in such a way as to make it more powerful sothat more and more people will want to use it. This is complete and utter bull. Period. Please pick up your complimentary tin foil hat from CEOPyrex. He has many. Actually its not bull and it isnt a conspiracy its just simple business. And if i ran a game I would do the same thing they are doing. I dont blame them but it is sad to see thats how the gaming industry has moved since the days of mario and zelda. You can kiss the butts of every CCP employee all you want it wont change the fact that this is how gaming industry is in this day and age. And most people like yourself want to believe that the gaming companies actually want more than money but money is really the only thing that drives a game company anymore. Believe me if there wasnt money in gaming there would be no games. So yeah call it bullshit or a conspiracy all you want its simple business tactics and thats just how they do things. They also wont ever admit to it because of the bad PR they would gain. And CCP has enough bad PR circling the gaming community as it is to want to collect anymore. Yeah, your level of tin foil is really up there. Money has nothing to do with the balance changes, except perhaps that a better game generally makes more money. If you are going to comment and make wild accussations claiming that im some conspiracy theorist then how about you offer a reason as to why its bullshit of what im saying rather than being rude. Oh thats right because you dont have a reason -_- seriously until you can offer a reason as to why im sooo wrong your insults go on deaf ears (or eyes in this case) I'm the one making "wild accusations"? Read your own posts. o_O CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 17029	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:20:00 - [35] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Assault Rifles =// Unlocked
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 2494	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:24:00 - [36] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: ... FW ... doesn't use the new Teambuilder. How unfortunate, though I understand why... "You see those red dots over there? Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
Leanna Boghin Paradox Pride 474	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:33:00 - [37] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. No its simple logic and common sense something people like you these days seem to be lacking. Its simple business tactics nothing more yet you all have your head so far up CCP's butt that you cant see the truth behind my words. Its fine though keep smelling those "roses" eventually the truth will bite you in the butt later on and you will be wishing i hadnt been right. I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
Second Cerberus Tested In Production 145	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:43:00 - [38] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. IWS, didn't you read? Gaming = A business All businesses are about making money CCP is a business = CCP is about making money Therefore, CCP buffs weapons that you can buy with ISK to sell more AUR.... Um... never mind "I don't always test my code, but when I do, I do it in production." - *CCP*
Vell0cet Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 2324	Posted - 2014.10.03 02:56:00 - [39] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. No its simple logic and common sense something people like you these days seem to be lacking. Its simple business tactics nothing more yet you all have your head so far up CCP's butt that you cant see the truth behind my words. Its fine though keep smelling those "roses" eventually the truth will bite you in the butt later on and you will be wishing i hadnt been right. I completely agree that CCP is motivated by money. What you fail to grasp is that the amount of money they could generate by deliberately making things OP/UP is so insanely small than compared to building a balanced shooter that retains players and grows. The financial incentives are all aligned with making an awesome game that builds a huge following, not milking the tiny player base that currently exists for a little cash by deliberately messing with balance. Best PvE idea ever!
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 17031	Posted - 2014.10.03 03:02:00 - [40] - Quote Second Cerberus wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. IWS, didn't you read? Gaming = A business All businesses are about making money CCP is a business = CCP is about making money Therefore, CCP buffs weapons that you can buy with ISK to sell more AUR.... Um... never mind Still an Editorial. Negative Consumer Environment is a strategic plan that should be avoided at all costs. The long term effects implicitly impacts any future product or growth. The irrepressible offerings while seemingly good for sales those sales in the short run quickly dry up and ultimately drive away content providers. Target demographics are then out of disposable income while losing interest in other content providers or the lack there of because of the things the consumer bought drove them away. The volunteer content providers needs to have assurances their efforts are highly valued as any other customer by making sure their contributions are justly rewarded with a fair and varied stimulation. With content providers coming in all shapes forms and difficulties while the while potential target groups may be inclined to try to gain advantages. Disposable income is then metered in at an acceptable rates and is then seen and shown off in the field. This many even outside demographics to partake in the revenue streams as well resulting in a more positive consumer environment leading to more growth and loyalty of the product consumers and ultimately the product itself. See? An Editorial. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Assault Rifles =// Unlocked

Leanna Boghin Paradox Pride 475	Posted - 2014.10.03 03:02:00 - [41] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. No its simple logic and common sense something people like you these days seem to be lacking. Its simple business tactics nothing more yet you all have your head so far up CCP's butt that you cant see the truth behind my words. Its fine though keep smelling those "roses" eventually the truth will bite you in the butt later on and you will be wishing i hadnt been right. I completely agree that CCP is motivated by money. What you fail to grasp is that the amount of money they could generate by deliberately making things OP/UP is so insanely small than compared to building a balanced shooter that retains players and grows. The financial incentives are all aligned with making an awesome game that builds a huge following, not milking the tiny player base that currently exists for a little cash by deliberately messing with balance. I also stated the reason for the OP/UP issue that people seemed to overlook and that is beta testing for the Legion game they have been working on. And i will leave this discussion at that. No point in beating a dead horse people will either agree with me or they wont doesnt matter either way. At least when the truth comes out i wont be surprised or disappointed. Yeah i know im such a cynic but at least im honest about it. I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2436	Posted - 2014.10.03 03:18:00 - [42] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. So basically your "proof" is composed solely of vague, anecdotal statements? While I think we all know that CCP, like every other company in the world, has net profits as the huber one thing in mind, I don't believe that they are balancing the game to get aurum sales by people chasing the FoTM. Lets examine this from an unbiased, objective standpoint. The total number of active players in Dust is about 10-20k. Of those, I think its safe to say that 20% have actually spent money, so 2k-4k people. Of those 2k-4k people, about 30% (give or take) would have regularly invested money in this game before legion, giving us 600-1.2k. Legion affected players who would regularly spend money the most, and I think that its safe to say that >80% of them quit their regular spending following the announcement. This leaves us with, at most, 120-240 players left that would regularly pay money for the game. This seems a little high, but well work with it. The game gets hot fixed every month, which means these people will pay once per month. I will assume the average arum sale is 20$/person. So, this gives use 2400-4800$ per month generated by CCP trying to balance their game. For a corporation, that is pocket change. The real reason that CCP is balancing the game is so that they can get it right for Legion which will, in theory, provide exponentially more money for them than this game could. If you have a problem with my numbers, feel free to post your own math on this issue. "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ Give the Minja active dampening!--By Bor
Second Cerberus Tested In Production 146	Posted - 2014.10.03 03:59:00 - [43] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Second Cerberus wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. IWS, didn't you read? Gaming = A business All businesses are about making money CCP is a business = CCP is about making money Therefore, CCP buffs weapons that you can buy with ISK to sell more AUR.... Um... never mind Still an Editorial. Negative Consumer Environment is a strategic plan that should be avoided at all costs. The long term effects implicitly impacts any future product or growth. The irrepressible offerings while seemingly good for sales those sales in the short run quickly dry up and ultimately drive away content providers. Target demographics are then out of disposable income while losing interest in other content providers or the lack there of because of the things the consumer bought drove them away. The volunteer content providers needs to have assurances their efforts are highly valued as any other customer by making sure their contributions are justly rewarded with a fair and varied stimulation. With content providers coming in all shapes forms and difficulties while the while potential target groups may be inclined to try to gain advantages. Disposable income is then metered in at an acceptable rates and is then seen and shown off in the field. This many even outside demographics to partake in the revenue streams as well resulting in a more positive consumer environment leading to more growth and loyalty of the product consumers and ultimately the product itself. See? An Editorial. You do know I was agreeing with you, right? "I don't always test my code, but when I do, I do it in production." - *CCP*
CLONE ALPHA 001 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 36	Posted - 2014.10.03 04:29:00 - [44] - Quote im just gonna leave this here http://themittani.com/news/ccp-reveals-mediocre-2014-financials-layoffs
Avinash Decker Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 141	Posted - 2014.10.03 05:18:00 - [45] - Quote Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. So basically your "proof" is composed solely of vague, anecdotal statements? While I think we all know that CCP, like every other company in the world, has net profits as the huber one thing in mind, I don't believe that they are balancing the game to get aurum sales by people chasing the FoTM. Lets examine this from an unbiased, objective standpoint. The total number of active players in Dust is about 10-20k. Of those, I think its safe to say that 20% have actually spent money, so 2k-4k people. Of those 2k-4k people, about 30% (give or take) would have regularly invested money in this game before legion, giving us 600-1.2k. Legion affected players who would regularly spend money the most, and I think that its safe to say that >80% of them quit their regular spending following the announcement. This leaves us with, at most, 120-240 players left that would regularly pay money for the game. This seems a little high, but well work with it. The game gets hot fixed every month, which means these people will pay once per month. I will assume the average arum sale is 20$/person. So, this gives use 2400-4800$ per month generated by CCP trying to balance their game. For a corporation, that is pocket change. The real reason that CCP is balancing the game is so that they can get it right for Legion which will, in theory, provide exponentially more money for them than this game could. If you have a problem with my numbers, feel free to post your own math on this issue. There's less than 3k or 2,500-3k players playing last week and this week so the number that actually pay using your example is lower . Unless you meant unique players or was giving an example. To me they aren't doing this for legion mostly , they are doing it because they are trying to get some favor-ability back and keep the game running until further notice. Legion is an unknown product that will most likely play different from Dust all together. Lastly, we don't even know that the Dust devs and the Legion devs collaborate at all like that.
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7740	Posted - 2014.10.03 05:19:00 - [46] - Quote walks back into thread Leaves thread Something's wrong when you regret Things that haven't happened yet
Michael Arck 5839	Posted - 2014.10.03 05:34:00 - [47] - Quote Well that was some thorough answers. Let's not undo the thread people. Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah *Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 17981	Posted - 2014.10.03 06:03:00 - [48] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher. Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference. Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other. Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads. This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads. The forums have ruined me.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 8404	Posted - 2014.10.03 06:49:00 - [49] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher. Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference. Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other. Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads. This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads. FA squad Normal Squad Normal Squad Solo Veterans Solo New Players If this is the hand that is dealt to the Teambuilder, what else can we do but pit the FA squad against the other two? The FA squad will probably get the best solo player, and so on and so forth. What is a better solution in this situation? Certainly not FA squad plus second Normal Squad. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"


CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 8404	Posted - 2014.10.03 06:51:00 - [50] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: walks back into thread Leaves thread Not even a reply "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"


Michael Arck 5841	Posted - 2014.10.03 07:40:00 - [51] - Quote Such a pity. Are people really trying to find solutions or are they just arguing just to argue, because they have nothing else to offer? That's a damn shame, really. Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah *Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
Spankdamonke Dapper Gentlemen Corporation 13	Posted - 2014.10.03 07:55:00 - [52] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher. Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference. Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other. Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads. This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads. FA squad Normal Squad Normal Squad Solo Veterans Solo New Players If this is the hand that is dealt to the Teambuilder, what else can we do but pit the FA squad against the other two? The FA squad will probably get the best solo player, and so on and so forth. What is a better solution in this situation? Certainly not FA squad plus second Normal Squad. Are there no other preemptive measures which can be taken by the teambuilder to assess whether "balance" could reasonably be achieved with the queue of players it was dealt? For example, in the scenario you listed; If a FA squad was up against 2 other "normal squads" with nothing but lower end or (god forbid) academy fresh blueberries to fill in gaps, the imbalance is clear. Could the system reference a battle's current queue against other players that are waiting in line for a battle, to see if they would better suit the Mu balance? If imbalance is seen, Scotty can perform an additional check or 2 to help even things out. Wait times may be increased some, but it may go a good distance toward the goal of securing a true and even Tug-of-war for victory in any given fight. The force multiplication of a good squad (specifically how well they communicate) truly can not be totally accounted for, I understand that. But for a mostly Solo player like myself...I can assure you that I am being RAILED by matchmaking pretty regularly. Where should I send those Screenshots again?
Pseudogenesis Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 698	Posted - 2014.10.03 08:01:00 - [53] - Quote ITT: Conspiracy theorists who don't understand basic economics Stabby-stabber extraordinaire I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
Michael Arck 5841	Posted - 2014.10.03 08:05:00 - [54] - Quote I think its pretty simple, with the current playerbase. It's not grade A infallible, but its a system in a place designed to better the battles. Yet all I see is "that's not good enough". In fact, I've seen alot of that from forum members with whatever they implement according to what is desired by the community. The bottom line is this community often shorts itself. Here's the deal, you want better battles, then you need better players who are not selfish and work as a team. What else can they do? They are working with the best they have and some of you guys just say, "it's not good enough". And its not like this is last year where uneven teams were common occurrences. I love this game but sometimes this community makes it harder to appreciate Dust because some of you guys just can NEVER be satisfied. It's tiresome. Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah *Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1860	Posted - 2014.10.03 08:25:00 - [55] - Quote I really feel like saying, this is how it has been for us solo players since.... forever. We have learnt to adapt, use cheap stuff, accept that your team is pants and just enjoy the game and have what ever fun there is to be had. The thing is if good squads are being put up against more noobie squads, is this not the most balanced outcome? Short of a solo only mode I fail to see how we can get this any more balanced. And for the record, I have noticed a lot more balanced games recently but yes I still have been finding battles where my team of randoms gets put up against 2 or more proto squads. I need to start taking pics of the end of battle screen. "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3356	Posted - 2014.10.03 10:00:00 - [56] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: walks back into thread Leaves thread Not even a reply Probably the best response. The tinfoil is strong here because people seem to be under the delusion that "because I said so" constitutes evidence without a need for numbers or cited sources. There also seems to be vast swathes of ignorance about "trade secrets," NDAs, and the boss simply saying "no, don't share that up." Here's the thing nerds. If Rattati hands out his data metrics snd explains exactly how he reviews these metrics, you jerks will manipulate the data provided in game to get things you dislike nerfed, and things you use buffed. It's called information manipulation, and CCP has learned precisely NOT to do this because of EVE players. You haven't played until you have witnessed someone artificially inflating market values of useless mods to inflate LP payouts and make literal BILLIONS in minutes. There are also worse examples. Trying to force the devs to supply you their secrets is disingenuous and will allow you to manipulate the metagame to your own benefit at great cost to the other players. No I do not believe you wouldn't. If you say you would not I will automatically believe you to be lying. Human behavior makes me far too cynical to believe otherwise.
BL4CKST4R La Muerte Eterna Dark Taboo 3185	Posted - 2014.10.03 10:25:00 - [57] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher. Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference. Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other. Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads. This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads. FA squad Normal Squad Normal Squad Solo Veterans Solo New Players If this is the hand that is dealt to the Teambuilder, what else can we do but pit the FA squad against the other two? The FA squad will probably get the best solo player, and so on and so forth. What is a better solution in this situation? Certainly not FA squad plus second Normal Squad. Just gonna drop my 2 here. If Mu sorts out squad by an average of the "stats" of that squad why not add a multiplier to that number, for example if mu is blah, give it a 2.2x multiplier (0.2x increase per member). it is to my assumption Mu doesn't put extra weight on the size of a squad, because this I assume that Mu will probably also match the Mu of both teams regardless of squad. Another thing is that without putting heavier weight on being in a squad you can have one really good player, 5 mediocre to good players and be put in a lowberry match because of the relatively low score, stomping time. Or maybe it could be possible to create a tag that Mu will always match the amount of squads in a match, so squads will always be even on both sides by player number. supercalifragilisticexpialidocious
501st Headstrong G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 631	Posted - 2014.10.03 10:50:00 - [58] - Quote Fights are a lot harder now...I like that :) CEO of GODS AMONG MEN/ Code name: Kronos Friendships are forged by war, enemies by peace Stars Wars Fan4ever, BFront3
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1325	Posted - 2014.10.03 11:17:00 - [59] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: . . OP POSTS . . A very good description on what has happened and why those things went wrong. A few inaccuracies though, and one statement based on a guess. But, good stuff. People would enjoy Dust a lot more if they accepted the fact that EVERYTHING is subject to change
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game RUST415 1323	Posted - 2014.10.03 11:34:00 - [60] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: walks back into thread Leaves thread Not even a reply The points raised about having CCP play the game, would make a big difference.. I don't just mean joining in, deploying, finding a few squads and gaming for a while But get involved with in game corps/groups.. public events etc @ GM Archduke - We had some fun with Plasma Carnage .. but you guys took him back to work Whichever staff member was tasked with it gets an occasional DUST session during work hours Along with the crazed feedback you will hear and the feel of fighting with and against mixed levels of players And seeing varied performances of gear depending on how it's used and by who (new/skilled mercs) @ Rattati. The balance is better, but there is a large sense of carrying your team.. Not all bad.. But depending on teams. battles of 16v16 become 5/6v8/10 mercs that will take objectives Leaving an serious grind for one team, But at times there has been really good matches Replys would come more freely via ingame communication, for better and worse Innapropriate Irrelevence... Welcome to the Dust Forum, hang around to see why everyone else left :/

Zindorak G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1011	Posted - 2014.10.03 11:36:00 - [61] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Later on the Scrambler Rifle is introduced and was pretty balanced besides some slight mechanic issues but CCP saw that "it wasn't being used as much as the Plasma Rifle" so they buffed it to what it was Pre-Delta. Even though this happened people still cried for plasma Rifle Nerfs and later on the Rail and Combat Rifle are introduced (at extremely OP levels) and everyone is completely fine with the OP rifles and completely forgets that they were just trying to nerf the now underperforming rifle. That says a lot Thank you finally someone understands me. Nerfing the ScR was stupid because clearly the RR and CR were better at the time. The ScR was completely balanced and rarely used except on an Amarr Assault, Commando or Scouts. The CR now got a nerf because it lost it's wonderful 5 10 damage profile. RR has only got a damage nerf. Was it enough? Hell No! the damn thing kills things so quickly. If this thing doesn't get a nerf IDK what im gonna do. Sometimes i cant believe what the community wants nerfed and buffed Pokemon master! Death to all Swarm scrubs CCP please buff AScR and normal AR :(
Bright Steel Horizons' Edge Proficiency V. 132	Posted - 2014.10.03 13:03:00 - [62] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: You're foolish if you wish to assume that I want a pubstomp simply because of my tag. And you're on the CPM? get out of here. My problem is that when squading with my teammates it results in our team being the only one to push objectives while everybody else runs and hides. You seriously find this acceptable? Or are your past biases getting in the way here since you wish to bring up my corp? My point isn't to insult your corp, if anything it's a complement. My point is, that if an FA squad is on one side, you can expect the other side to have more of the better players of the remaining 26 people in the room, because it's needed to compensate for your team's abilities. If you guys are the best in the room, you are going to have to carry your team. Because your Mu score says you can. Then why am I running into a squad of fatal absolution and a squad of molon labe on one side and not a single squad on the other? The Mu system is pitifully easy to fool, all I need do is afk to lower it then stomp face. If they que synched into the same match then squaded while in the match it would remove the squad based multiplier The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Kyoudai Furinkazan 1235	Posted - 2014.10.03 13:06:00 - [63] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: 3) If you want to stop the whining of the stomping then i suggest a respec. That way those that currently cant stomp will be able to (simply cause of misplaced skill points we all know that every noob puts all their skills every where instead of on just one thing) making things more balanced than they ever have been. Until CCP and its developers is willing to do everything in their power to improve the game then i cant sit by and not think that you arent trying to run the game into the ground as nothing more than a beta for another game for PC. I totally agree with the first statement that I pointed out and is one of the main reasons that I talk about skill point refunds , not because I get tired of getting stomped but because SO MANY OTHERS talk about this same thing every day . A refund would help those balance out their respected characters , taking points from items and skills that they probably don't use at all if any and gives them the ability to place those necessary and vital points in areas that can become of greater use , so that these same players ... when placed a match with random players , could curb the stomping and also defend themselves better against such occurrences and allow them to HAVE SOME FRACKING FUN FOR A CHANGE . More interest means more money and if they are playing the game more it's helpful for all parties involved , what's so hard about that ???? The last statement could reflect this belief because it's " common " things that are missed but could be done to create a more exciting environment and experience but because you have some EVE players and some in the corporate brass with their heads up their @$$es , that's stopping this process from happening . So I can totally understand how Leanna feels because it is relevant and should be thought about and she's not the only one who feels this way and congrats to her for speaking her mind about how she feels because so many feel the same way and just don't say it . Keep being mislead by those whom you already have hooked CCP , they are giving you bad business advice and your missing out on so much but your killing yourself in the process while doing so , slowly . Most players are not asking for a refund to get out of FOTM and even if they were , why not allow it on a game that needs to generate money and numbers so that the tests and theories could be double checked and the data can be finalized . They are asking for a refund to re specialize their characters to the new environment that's current and to increase their playability and fun factor , they don't want to play other games more then they play Dust but missing out on these opportunities create such outcomes and you would have those in the community who would think lightly of such but if you have a business mind , you would know that this is damaging and something could be done to stave this is you would stop listening to all the wrong people and stop being so stiff necked and stuck in a certain way of conducting business . There is NO CLEAR CUT FOTM ANYMORE thanks to the efforts of rebalancing so this is not an excuse anymore and is a moot point in anyone's argument . More players with their hands in developing their character , creates a better environment with matchmaking and NPE because you would have better fights , those players who have done so .. would become more confident in their abilities and efforts , they would have more fun and there by play more and give the game a greater opportunity to create more money , I mean I can't understand why this is so strongly fought against when so many in the community asks for such and nothing but a positive outcome would come out of this being done ? Listening to the negative people in the community is hurting your business CCP , yes it might not seem like it now but if you just did the little things and stop listening to the nay says , then you might just see what so many are saying to you and it's not like they are trying to manipulate or damage what you have created , those who are nay saying are doing that .... the one's like Leanna are actually trying to help you to see what the voiceless say and feel . Delta should come with a SP or infantry SP refund so that a campaign for one is not needed .
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Kyoudai Furinkazan 1235	Posted - 2014.10.03 13:26:00 - [64] - Quote Another thing Rattati , If you don't read or even look at " rants " then your missing out on the whole point , some of the " ranters " are some of the MOST PASSIONATE players in the game and if you can't take constructive criticism then theirs no reason being in business where you deal with the public because everyone will not like what you do , in the substance of some of those rants ... might just be the message that the person was trying to make but because of their emotion , it was surrounded by that same emotion so it jumbled it up in a mixture of truth and passion . It's a part of being an adult when you can agree to not agree and being able to listen to all parties involved and understanding why a person is angry , might help you to solve their problems . They care and that's why they rant and are so passionate . Reading a post helps me to understand those who say things or create issues for goofing off or to get a response from the community , to see who's really seen something that needs to be brought to light because it can become a potential issue and those who are just frustrated with something in particular and just don't know how to handle what to do about it . Listen to the rants and you yourself could tell the difference but don't let a rant dictate what doesn't need to be done because it might be some truth in that rant . Delta should come with a SP or infantry SP refund so that a campaign for one is not needed .
Sylwester Dziewiecki Interregnum. 383	Posted - 2014.10.03 13:44:00 - [65] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: 6) (...)Consistently getting a 1000 WP per battle, means you completely get the game, fitting and progression. Sorry but no, it's mean that you have camped enemy CRU, and they were just keep spawning. How much you can get WP in battle is not a determinant of how much you 'know the game'. Academy should be focus on learning game as whole. CCP Rattati wrote: 4) Please send me data on broken Teambuilding to [email protected]. I have yet to see a concrete example of unwarranted 2 stacked squads on one side and newberries on the other, and my inbox is full of screenshots from players. Yes, stomps happen, but they happen everywhere, even in the EPL, NBA and the NFL. When a 6 man squad from the best PC corp hits its stride, very few aside from a similar squad will stand a chance. Other than that, I don't get your point about Teambuilding, are you against having more even teams or? You can go play FW if you want to to try your luck, that feature doesn't use the new Teambuilder. I do not know how Mu works, I did not read it. But when I end up in match where in my team is just one squad with just one player, beside that there's a band of individuals, and we are against two squads of players(and I can tell that because of corp names) I think that something is not 'ok'. I think that problem is in how squads works generally - they share scanner proximity, so squad need one pro-amarr fitted for max scanning and everyone ales in squad can focus on max tank; not to mention how talking with squad-mates is OP. Why do I have to fight again squads competently alone? Why Mu think I'm up for that kind of challenge. Can we just made small Ambush matches 6v6, 12v12 for players that want to fight with they squads and matches where players can not create squads? Gallente Speed Scout. EVE side of me: Nosum Hseebnrido
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5450	Posted - 2014.10.03 14:48:00 - [66] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: They care and that's why they rant and are so passionate . Indeed, we are passionate. But when we rant, we do so because (1) we lack sense or (2) we lack a solution. Take Kirk on the early Uprising Assault Rifle: Did the AR not dominate every killfeed of every battle, every day for 6+ months? Did the AR not outperform lasers (and everything else) at range? Did the AR not outperform HMGs (and everything else) up close? Does Kirk lack sense? Kirk maintains that everything was fine. That only real problem was with the Community, who failed to understand why one weapon should dominate gameplay on such extraordinary and prolonged scale. It was necessary and appropriate for the Gallente Fine Rifle to be the very best at all things. It was unnecessary and inappropriate for CCP to touch the Finest of Fine Rifles. Kirk's bias has overruled his sense. So Kirk rants. Or does Kirk lack a solution? Kirk maintains that while everything was fine with the Gallente Fine Rifle, there was a significant problem with comparative performance of every other weapon in the game. Kirk opposes any adjustment to the Finest of Fine Rifles, but at the same time recognizes that rebalancing all else against the AR would entail an extremely complex, error-prone and time-consuming effort. Something has to be done, but he can't think of what to do. Kirk lacks a solution. So Kirk rants. So in the case of AR-514, which bin do we put Kirk in? I honestly can't tell ... Sgt Kirk wrote: Assault Rifle nerfs in the old days This one is more towards the simpleton thinking of the DUST 514 community than CCP. A long time ago the Plasma Assault Rifle was the only General Purpose Rifle in the game and people complained that it was too good at a lot of things, even though the plasma rifle still had short range like now people complained that it was too good at what it did.....even though it was the only one that did what it did at the time so to fix this CCP decides to nerf the plasma Rifle, that's fine various variations did need a nerf but the general purpose rifle was fine. Cycles of Plasma Rifle Nerfs later and we see the Assault rifles in the pre-Delta form. Kinda useless overall and the best one [the standard assault rifle] was underperforming but there were no other general purpose rifles at the time so the community decides that the Assault Rifle is still too prominent on the field even though it was still the only assault rifle at the time and ask desperately to get the weapon nerfed. Thread after thread, the forums were filled with pleas to nerf the only general purpose rifle in the game because too many people used it. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3371	Posted - 2014.10.03 14:58:00 - [67] - Quote Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: 6) (...)Consistently getting a 1000 WP per battle, means you completely get the game, fitting and progression. Sorry but no, it's mean that you have camped enemy CRU, and they were just keep spawning. This is the crowning statement of bullsh*t I have seen in this thread so far. This is ceasing to be a discussion so much as an exercise in accusation and inciting argument over nitpicky crap. are you interested in a dialogue with the devs or is this your moment you have chosen as the best opportunity to berate them?
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7755	Posted - 2014.10.03 15:55:00 - [68] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: They care and that's why they rant and are so passionate . Indeed, we are passionate. But when we rant, we do so because (1) we lack sense or (2) we lack a solution. Take, for example, Kirk on the early Uprising Assault Rifle ... Fun Facts The AR dominated every killfeed of every battle, every day for 6+ months. The AR consistently outperformed laser rifles (and everything else) at range. The AR consistently outperformed the HMG (and everything else) up close. Does Kirk lack sense? Kirk maintains that everything was fine. The only real problem was with the Community, who failed to understand why one weapon should dominate gameplay on such extraordinary and prolonged scale. It was necessary and appropriate for the Gallente Fine Rifle to be the very best at all things, including but not limited to aiming itself. It was unnecessary and inappropriate for CCP to touch the Finest of Fine Rifles. Kirk's bias has overruled his sense. So Kirk rants. Or does Kirk lack a solution? Kirk maintains that while everything was fine with the Gallente Fine Rifle, there was a significant problem with comparative performance of every other weapon in the game. Kirk opposes any adjustment to the Finest of Fine Rifles, but at the same time recognizes that rebalancing all else against the AR would entail an extremely complex, error-prone and time-consuming effort. Something has to be done, but he can't think of what to do. Kirk lacks a solution. So Kirk rants. So which bin do we put Kirk in? Read the following rant, and decide for yourself: Sgt Kirk wrote: Assault Rifle nerfs in the old days This one is more towards the simpleton thinking of the DUST 514 community than CCP. A long time ago the Plasma Assault Rifle was the only General Purpose Rifle in the game and people complained that it was too good at a lot of things, even though the plasma rifle still had short range like now people complained that it was too good at what it did.....even though it was the only one that did what it did at the time so to fix this CCP decides to nerf the plasma Rifle, that's fine various variations did need a nerf but the general purpose rifle was fine. Cycles of Plasma Rifle Nerfs later and we see the Assault rifles in the pre-Delta form. Kinda useless overall and the best one [the standard assault rifle] was underperforming but there were no other general purpose rifles at the time so the community decides that the Assault Rifle is still too prominent on the field even though it was still the only assault rifle at the time and ask desperately to get the weapon nerfed. Thread after thread, the forums were filled with pleas to nerf the only general purpose rifle in the game because too many people used it. Or you could completely ignore where I said that they needed some tune downs at some points but that's okay, try to make yourself look smart little man. See you space cowboy...
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7755	Posted - 2014.10.03 16:07:00 - [69] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: walks back into thread Leaves thread Not even a reply Sorry, got sidetracked with life, I'm busier near the weekend than I am the week. I do appreciate the reply though and some points that I'd wish to bring up have already been addressed by other fellow DUSTers. See you space cowboy...
Cat Merc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 12491	Posted - 2014.10.03 16:43:00 - [70] - Quote I've said it back then and I'll say it now. The reason the AR was dominating the kill feed was because there was no other general purpose weapon. Shotguns are only as popular as they are because you have a cloak, negating a huge part of the range disadvantage. Laser Rifle was **** after it was nerfed too hard due to being god in chromosome. Sniper Rifles are, well, long range weapons. HMG's had their "too accurate" thing, and have about 30m less range. Scrambler Rifles never did take off until Delta, but even before that those few who used them knew how powerful they are. There's a reason it's one of TWO weapons I got to proficiency IV with. Mass Drivers are supposed to be suppression tools, punishing those who push too hard And I can go on, but basically, it's the same reason that rifles and carbines are the most common weapons that IRL infantry ground units carry. It's general purpose. Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC

Cat Merc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 12491	Posted - 2014.10.03 16:47:00 - [71] - Quote When more general purpose rifles were introduced, the HMG got fixed, the cloak got introduced (helping the shotty), the laser rifle got increased damage, you suddenly saw the AR being replaced on the kill feed. It was the least general purpose out of the general purpose rifles, since they all worked at all ranges, but the AR had the least range. Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
Bright Steel Horizons' Edge Proficiency V. 132	Posted - 2014.10.03 17:03:00 - [72] - Quote I have seen MU for individual players work great! Every match without corp squads has been very balanced. The only thing that needs work is balancing the strong vet or corp squads. But I have confidence that Rattati is already watching this and collecting data to fix it right rather than guessing and that makes me happy. The current mega squads, such as FA, NS, gods among men and the like, are in a league of their own. I have seen hem literally walk through other squads and especially noobs. The only way to avoid this is a handicap. How many solo B players does it take to match one of these PC worthy vet squads? I'm just an average Player but I have switched roles to support a few random blues and watched the match turn completely around. My point is that balancing sqaud MU multiplier is very delicate and one very small veritable can dramatically effect balance. The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
RayRay James Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 458	Posted - 2014.10.03 17:14:00 - [73] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. No its simple logic and common sense something people like you these days seem to be lacking. Its simple business tactics nothing more yet you all have your head so far up CCP's butt that you cant see the truth behind my words. Its fine though keep smelling those "roses" eventually the truth will bite you in the butt later on and you will be wishing i hadnt been right. IF CCP keeps nerfing/buffing weapons to make us switch and spend more money, then how have I maintained the same KDR with the same suits/weapons/fits since before the Combat Rifle came out? You're right, they want to make money. That's no evile or bad, it's business. As you said, without money, there'd be no games but to claim CCP is intentionally screwing with the weapons to milk us of more is paranoia at its finest. Especially when most people disagree with you. Call me a sheeple all you want, but you have provided no proof other than your opinions. I know a guy who tinfoils his windows to keep radio waves out of his house. You sound like him without any proof.
Z3dog BIG BAD W0LVES Canis Eliminatus Operatives 6	Posted - 2014.10.03 17:39:00 - [74] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: - "Mu Data" That's apparently working as intended. Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other. This game may have slowly reverted back into a lobby shooter with shorter time to kill like you guys said you didn't want to do a few months back...but teamwork is still one of the major, critical factors on if you lose or not. Trust me Rattai and friends, I do understand the limitations in what we are dealing with, not a large player base, and regional servers to further strain the matchmaking pool but asking for the game to be balanced around squads seems like a fairly simple construct to have. Would there still be pub stomps? Yes, it's going to happen, you can't escape total victories in any game but you can do a much better job with this, I know the system is new and it takes time but my optimism for this new matchmaking system has went from cheerfully optimistic to slightly worried to completely bitter; and it's only been about a week! CCP Rattati wrote: 4) Please send me data on broken Teambuilding to [email protected]. I have yet to see a concrete example of unwarranted 2 stacked squads on one side and newberries on the other, and my inbox is full of screenshots from players. Yes, stomps happen, but they happen everywhere, even in the EPL, NBA and the NFL. When a 6 man squad from the best PC corp hits its stride, very few aside from a similar squad will stand a chance. Other than that, I don't get your point about Teambuilding, are you against having more even teams or? You can go play FW if you want to to try your luck, that feature doesn't use the new Teambuilder. Just gonna leave this here. http://imgur.com/Qp3vGkN Maybe I'll make my own thread and just image dump for the sake of transparency. I will certainly be able to gather enough material. Dust 5/14
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5454	Posted - 2014.10.03 17:40:00 - [75] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: I've said it back then and I'll say it now. The reason the AR was dominating the kill feed was because... "Yes, the HAV is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Taki, Spkr "Yes, the AR is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Cat, Kirk, Aeon, Ydubbs Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 4864	Posted - 2014.10.03 17:49:00 - [76] - Quote Bright Steel wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: You're foolish if you wish to assume that I want a pubstomp simply because of my tag. And you're on the CPM? get out of here. My problem is that when squading with my teammates it results in our team being the only one to push objectives while everybody else runs and hides. You seriously find this acceptable? Or are your past biases getting in the way here since you wish to bring up my corp? My point isn't to insult your corp, if anything it's a complement. My point is, that if an FA squad is on one side, you can expect the other side to have more of the better players of the remaining 26 people in the room, because it's needed to compensate for your team's abilities. If you guys are the best in the room, you are going to have to carry your team. Because your Mu score says you can. Then why am I running into a squad of fatal absolution and a squad of molon labe on one side and not a single squad on the other? The Mu system is pitifully easy to fool, all I need do is afk to lower it then stomp face. If they que synched into the same match then squaded while in the match it would remove the squad based multiplier Lol, that doesn't happen Level 4 Forum Warrior PSN: wbrom42
Kensai Dragon DUST University Ivy League 7	Posted - 2014.10.03 17:59:00 - [77] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher. Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference. Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other. Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads. This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads. FA squad Normal Squad Normal Squad Solo Veterans Solo New Players If this is the hand that is dealt to the Teambuilder, what else can we do but pit the FA squad against the other two? The FA squad will probably get the best solo player, and so on and so forth. What is a better solution in this situation? Certainly not FA squad plus second Normal Squad. For Rattati: Not sure what FA means in this context, maybe 'Friendly Ally'? My question is how Mu Multiplier is applied to the 'less than full' squads; does a 1 man squad get the same multiplier as a full squad? Is it an aggregate multiplier that grows with the number of members? I've noticed some battles with multiple squads of 1 or 2 people, just wondering how this affects the overall balance. Otherwise, I like the change to team building. The losses tend to be from lack of organization rather than pub-stomps, which is to say that we're at least still on the battlefield. Let the minor leagues be separated from the major leagues.
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 3924	Posted - 2014.10.03 18:12:00 - [78] - Quote Kensai, Rattati was responding to Fatal Absolution players. "FA squad" refers to their squad. ;) And particularly the notion that it's probably a "pretty good" squad, because it's FA people, and they're pretty good. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 17987	Posted - 2014.10.03 18:37:00 - [79] - Quote Actually we're all terrible. The forums have ruined me.
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 17987	Posted - 2014.10.03 18:39:00 - [80] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Cat Merc wrote: I've said it back then and I'll say it now. The reason the AR was dominating the kill feed was because... "Yes, the HAV is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Taki, Spkr (Uprising 1.7) "Yes, the AR is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Cat, Aeon, Regnum, Ydubbs, etc (Uprising 1.1 - 1.6) "Yes, the scout is dominating the battlefield right now. But it's totally fine because _____ and _____." - Very long list of posters from the barbershop (Uprising 1.8 onwards) The forums have ruined me.

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5454	Posted - 2014.10.03 18:48:00 - [81] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: - snip - Or you could completely ignore where I said that they needed some tune downs at some points but that's okay, try to make yourself look smart little man. Did I miss that part? Are there solutions here, hidden somewhere in this Assault Rifle rant? Or was that "tune down" something you had proposed along the way, at some point between Uprising 1.1 and 1.6? Forgive me, but all I see here is another attempt to excuse AR-514, efforts to denigrate those who took issue with AR-514, and aimless whine in response to the actions taken which ended AR-514. Shall we have another look at that rant? Sgt Kirk wrote: 1: Assault Rifle nerfs in the old days This one is more towards the simpleton thinking of the DUST 514 community than CCP. 2: A long time ago the Plasma Assault Rifle was the only General Purpose Rifle in the game and people complained that it was too good at a lot of things, even though the plasma rifle still had short range like now people complained that it was too good at what it did.....even though it was the only one that did what it did at the time so to fix this CCP decides to nerf the plasma Rifle, that's fine various variations did need a nerf but the general purpose rifle was fine. 3: Cycles of Plasma Rifle Nerfs later and we see the Assault rifles in the pre-Delta form. Kinda useless overall and the best one [the standard assault rifle] was underperforming but there were no other general purpose rifles at the time so the community decides that the Assault Rifle is still too prominent on the field even though it was still the only assault rifle at the time and ask desperately to get the weapon nerfed. Thread after thread, the forums were filled with pleas to nerf the only general purpose rifle in the game because too many people used it. 1: Insults 2: Excuses and Moaning 3: Moaning and Excuses Show me substance and solutions, Kirk. Show me what I missed or ignored. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5454	Posted - 2014.10.03 19:02:00 - [82] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Cat Merc wrote: I've said it back then and I'll say it now. The reason the AR was dominating the kill feed was because... "Yes, the HAV is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Taki, Spkr (Uprising 1.7) "Yes, the AR is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Cat, Aeon, Regnum, Ydubbs, etc (Uprising 1.1 - 1.6) "Yes, the scout is dominating the battlefield right now. But it's totally fine because _____ and _____." - Very long list of posters from the barbershop (Uprising 1.8 onwards) Right alongside specific balance concerns and discussions, which are well documented and continue to this day (present concerns including fire-from-cloak and your very own brick tanked GalScout). By comparison, I don't recall many instances of give-and-take on the AR side of AR-514 discussions. I distinctly recall lots of "get good", "everything is fine", and a variety of excuses for the rampant and sustained imbalance. Seemed at the time more like players circling wagons than players interested in balance. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 17989	Posted - 2014.10.03 19:21:00 - [83] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Right alongside specific balance concerns and discussions, which are well documented and continue to this day (present concerns including fire-from-cloak and your very own, best-in-class bricked GalScout). By comparison, I don't recall many instances of give-and-take on the AR side of AR-514 discussions. I distinctly recall lots of "get good", "everything is fine", and a variety of excuses for the rampant and sustained imbalance. Seemed at the time more like players circling wagons than players interested in balance. I knew you'd immediately feel that was an unjust accusation. And yes, it was. But your lumping Cat Merc and Kirk in with the likes of Spkr is exactly the same - completely unjust. You accuse people of insults and then do that? Really? I know that they both have supported necessary changes because I've worked on threads with them. I used to write a frankly absurd number of balance threads and I have a hell of a lot of correspondence with both of them on many of them. You came into this thread, looked at a handful of complaints, and promptly misinterpreted them hugely. No, Kirk is not 'seeking a return to AR514'. Kirk was frustrated with some of the plasma rifle nerfs, and rightly so. Can you seriously claim that the 1.8 nerf to the breach rifle was necessary? Rattati has since given it serious attention, but it was in a poor way for a long time and Kirk competed against CRs and RRs in their prime with plasma weaponry. I'm sure he's certainly sentimentally attached to them just as you are to scouts - but comments on historical balance screwups hardly warrant accusing the guy of wanting it buffed beyond all reason. The forums have ruined me.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 368	Posted - 2014.10.03 19:37:00 - [84] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: I can't fathom reversing the awesome that is the new matchmaking. It's provided the most balanced matches in years. No longer does seeing a Fatal Absolution squad on the other team mean I might as well leave match, because it's going to be a stomp. If you are a really high Mu squad, and hence get matchmade with some newbies, and hence, have an actual "tough fight" instead of an easy stomp, that is a good thing. You should never go into a match assured of victory. If you want a game mode that is doing less to make for even matches, try FacWar. :D You're foolish if you wish to assume that I want a pubstomp simply because of my tag. And you're on the CPM? get out of here. My problem is that when squading with my teammates it results in our team being the only one to push objectives while everybody else runs and hides. You seriously find this acceptable? Or are your past biases getting in the way here since you wish to bring up my corp? I've only wanted good battles and balance in this game, I haven't ever even spec'd into Flavor of the Month sticking only to Gallente themed weaponry as my persona, even if that meant I had to use ***** weapons so how dare you even have the audacity to accuse me of wanting easy mode matches solely off my tag. He's right! All too often do we find ourselves outnumbered in battles?! It's more like 6 v 16 because we got 5 guys fresh out of the Academy who couldn't help us if they wanted to, and 5 more redline sniping(pre delta). Unless CCP makes the academy cap 2 mil SP nothing there will change, and squads of good players will continue to carry the team?! I love to see our squad of 4-6 and another squad of vertex, dystopian, vengeance, etc. Hell I'll take Los Leones over 10 solo players any day! Atleast I know they working together on a point, and not trying to troll some noob in the redline with a TAR?! "Anybody order chaos?"
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4118	Posted - 2014.10.03 20:03:00 - [85] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: FA squad Normal Squad Normal Squad Solo Veterans Solo New Players If this is the hand that is dealt to the Teambuilder, what else can we do but pit the FA squad against the other two? The FA squad will probably get the best solo player, and so on and so forth. What is a better solution in this situation? Certainly not FA squad plus second Normal Squad. Certainly not, but that's probably what they are used to, because god damn somehow the old matchmaking system did that Every. Single. Time! If the new Mu system (which I will admit I have not played much since it was implemented) consistently takes 3 squads, puts what is clearly the best one by itself with the superior blueberries against a team with the 2 lesser squads, then that is without question the greatest thing ever to happen to this game. Honestly, I just can't see how you can legitimately argue against that, Kirk. Everything else in this thread seems to have turned into an unfortunate straw man pissing contest (true story, none of you are innocent but also not remotely in the same class as spkr), but on the issue of matchmaking, there is really no other logical way for the algorithm to take the above situation and make a fair fight out of it. If you have a problem with that, then maybe what I always considered baseless accusations about elite corp pubstompers are actually true. Which would be sad. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5454	Posted - 2014.10.03 20:07:00 - [86] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Right alongside specific balance concerns and discussions, which are well documented and continue to this day (present concerns including fire-from-cloak and your very own, best-in-class bricked GalScout). By comparison, I don't recall many instances of give-and-take on the AR side of AR-514 discussions. I distinctly recall lots of "get good", "everything is fine", and a variety of excuses for the rampant and sustained imbalance. Seemed at the time more like players circling wagons than players interested in balance. I knew you'd immediately feel that was an unjust accusation. And yes, it was. But your lumping Cat Merc and Kirk in with the likes of Spkr is exactly the same - completely unjust. You accuse people of insults and then do that? Really? I know that they both have supported necessary changes because I've worked on threads with them. I used to write a frankly absurd number of balance threads and I have a hell of a lot of correspondence with both of them on many of them. You came into this thread, looked at a handful of complaints, and promptly misinterpreted them hugely. No, Kirk is not 'seeking a return to AR514'. Kirk was frustrated with some of the plasma rifle nerfs, and rightly so. Can you seriously claim that the 1.8 nerf to the breach rifle was necessary? Rattati has since given it serious attention, but it was in a poor way for a long time and Kirk competed against CRs and RRs in their prime with plasma weaponry. I'm sure he's certainly sentimentally attached to them just as you are to scouts - but comments on historical balance screwups hardly warrant accusing the guy of wanting it buffed beyond all reason. Absolutely fair, Arkena. I didn't suspect that Kirk was lobbying for another round of AR-514, but I did believe both Cat and Kirk to be quick-to-excuse AR-514's inexcusable imbalance. I was totally unaware that either of them made efforts to end the AR's reign. Apologies, Cat & Kirk. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Sylwester Dziewiecki Interregnum. 384	Posted - 2014.10.03 20:29:00 - [87] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: 6) (...)Consistently getting a 1000 WP per battle, means you completely get the game, fitting and progression. Sorry but no, it's mean that you have camped enemy CRU, and they were just keep spawning. How much you can get WP in battle is not a determinant of how much you 'know the game'. Academy should be focus on learning game as whole. This is the crowning statement of bullsh*t I have seen in this thread so far. This is ceasing to be a discussion so much as an exercise in accusation and inciting argument over nitpicky crap. are you interested in a dialogue with the devs or is this your moment you have chosen as the best opportunity to berate them? You sound as if you were directed by hormones in normal level to your age. Keeping anger out of forums is healthier for you, really - just try it. Gallente Speed Scout. EVE side of me: Nosum Hseebnrido
y678iop Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 31	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:19:00 - [88] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: I can't fathom reversing the awesome that is the new matchmaking. It's provided the most balanced matches in years. No longer does seeing a Fatal Absolution squad on the other team mean I might as well leave match, because it's going to be a stomp. If you are a really high Mu squad, and hence get matchmade with some newbies, and hence, have an actual "tough fight" instead of an easy stomp, that is a good thing. You should never go into a match assured of victory. If you want a game mode that is doing less to make for even matches, try FacWar. :D You're foolish if you wish to assume that I want a pubstomp simply because of my tag. And you're on the CPM? get out of here. My problem is that when squading with my teammates it results in our team being the only one to push objectives while everybody else runs and hides. You seriously find this acceptable? Or are your past biases getting in the way here since you wish to bring up my corp? I've only wanted good battles and balance in this game, I haven't ever even spec'd into Flavor of the Month sticking only to Gallente themed weaponry as my persona, even if that meant I had to use ***** weapons so how dare you even have the audacity to accuse me of wanting easy mode matches solely off my tag. Come on Kirk, FA pub stomps. Thats just the truth. They get 6 guys together, and they spam vehicles, and proto gear against any dot that walks on the field. If you wanted better fights couldnt you run G1s Assaults with a Dren rifle, rather than GK0 scouts with a creo dron shotty? Just saying. If you want better fights go squad with some newbs and teach em something. Then encourage independent corps to rival your own. This is an alt. It is here to be banned, so that I may be outrageous and speak the TRUTH.
y678iop Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 31	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:24:00 - [89] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Right alongside specific balance concerns and discussions, which are well documented and continue to this day (present concerns including fire-from-cloak and your very own, best-in-class bricked GalScout). By comparison, I don't recall many instances of give-and-take on the AR side of AR-514 discussions. I distinctly recall lots of "get good", "everything is fine", and a variety of excuses for the rampant and sustained imbalance. Seemed at the time more like players circling wagons than players interested in balance. I knew you'd immediately feel that was an unjust accusation. And yes, it was. But your lumping Cat Merc and Kirk in with the likes of Spkr is exactly the same - completely unjust. You accuse people of insults and then do that? Really? I know that they both have supported necessary changes because I've worked on threads with them. I used to write a frankly absurd number of balance threads and I have a hell of a lot of correspondence with both of them on many of them. You came into this thread, looked at a handful of complaints, and promptly misinterpreted them hugely. No, Kirk is not 'seeking a return to AR514'. Kirk was frustrated with some of the plasma rifle nerfs, and rightly so. Can you seriously claim that the 1.8 nerf to the breach rifle was necessary? Rattati has since given it serious attention, but it was in a poor way for a long time and Kirk competed against CRs and RRs in their prime with plasma weaponry. I'm sure he's certainly sentimentally attached to them just as you are to scouts - but comments on historical balance screwups hardly warrant accusing the guy of wanting it buffed beyond all reason. Absolutely fair, Arkena. I didn't suspect that Kirk was lobbying for another round of AR-514, but I did believe both Cat and Kirk to be quick-to-excuse AR-514's inexcusable imbalance. I was totally unaware that either of them made efforts to end the AR's supreme reign. Apologies, Cat & Kirk. I'd long believed you both to be AR-514 apologists; Arkena has set my thinking straight. This conversation reads like fan created fps soap drama.... This is an alt. It is here to be banned, so that I may be outrageous and speak the TRUTH.
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 17993	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:38:00 - [90] - Quote y678iop wrote: This conversation reads like fan created fps soap drama.... It probably is basically random forum drama. The forums have ruined me.

postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 116	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:39:00 - [91] - Quote Atiim wrote: Damn these Gallenteans and their giant walls of text. Someone needs to confiscate their keyboards. U know thats Gallentean thingie, they need everything opulent, needfull and big. Caldaries are like, oki this is needed and this. Amarrs ale like oh, we are this and we will have that like that. And with amari people its mostly like, oki we can try this together with that and maybe it possible. XD "The human being was not chosen to be a god..the god himself should become a human being."
CharacterNameWasTaken G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 110	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:51:00 - [92] - Quote Cheydinhal Guard wrote: I agree with you on the sidearms, but I still don't understand why the ScP (aside from the Breach variant) took such a huge damage nerf for no absolute reason. Prior to Delta, I seldom saw anyone with an ScP aside from MLT blueberries. The ScP had already received a RoF nerf a while back. It should've been kept that way. Now it's practically nothing but an Amarr Ion pistol. Edit: Well at least it still has its headshot bonus, but nonetheless the nerf wasn't warranted. i love using the "amarr ion pistol" its so fun running dual breaches on a galscout.
postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 116	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:52:00 - [93] - Quote CharacterNameWasTaken wrote: Cheydinhal Guard wrote: I agree with you on the sidearms, but I still don't understand why the ScP (aside from the Breach variant) took such a huge damage nerf for no absolute reason. Prior to Delta, I seldom saw anyone with an ScP aside from MLT blueberries. The ScP had already received a RoF nerf a while back. It should've been kept that way. Now it's practically nothing but an Amarr Ion pistol. Edit: Well at least it still has its headshot bonus, but nonetheless the nerf wasn't warranted. i love using the "amarr ion pistol" its so fun running dual breaches on a galscout. I thought ION is gallentean and scrable is amarrian "The human being was not chosen to be a god..the god himself should become a human being."
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2441	Posted - 2014.10.03 22:26:00 - [94] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Cat Merc wrote: I've said it back then and I'll say it now. The reason the AR was dominating the kill feed was because... "Yes, the HAV is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Taki, Spkr (Uprising 1.7) "Yes, the AR is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Cat, Aeon, Regnum, Ydubbs, etc (Uprising 1.1 - 1.6) "Yes, the scout is dominating the battlefield right now. But a good way to nerf it to appease the general populace while not completely breaking it is _____ and _____." - Very long list of posters from the barbershop (Uprising 1.8 onwards) Fixed. "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ Give the Minja active dampening!--By Bor
CharacterNameWasTaken G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 111	Posted - 2014.10.03 22:49:00 - [95] - Quote postapo wastelander wrote: CharacterNameWasTaken wrote: Cheydinhal Guard wrote: I agree with you on the sidearms, but I still don't understand why the ScP (aside from the Breach variant) took such a huge damage nerf for no absolute reason. Prior to Delta, I seldom saw anyone with an ScP aside from MLT blueberries. The ScP had already received a RoF nerf a while back. It should've been kept that way. Now it's practically nothing but an Amarr Ion pistol. Edit: Well at least it still has its headshot bonus, but nonetheless the nerf wasn't warranted. i love using the "amarr ion pistol" its so fun running dual breaches on a galscout. I thought ION is gallentean and scrable is amarrian so i guess you either A) didnt read the quote or B) didnt see i put quotations aroun amarr ion pistol
CharacterNameWasTaken G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 111	Posted - 2014.10.03 22:55:00 - [96] - Quote TH1EFOFSOuLS wrote: Quote: 8) V/AV, this is a longer standing issue. Let's just work together to make it fun for everyone. ] You need to get people or at least motivate them to spec into their own vehicles as I always say nothing kills a tank better then a tank or a drop ship. One guy should not force me off a point immediately after I get their just because he is shooting down on me with a bunch of SP just so I can run away. No one tanks or even dropships anymore so if a respect to occur im sure allot of people would be happy to put their SP into proto stomping weapons like everyone else just letting you know. then even if i pull a tank to kill a tank i get aved right away.
postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 117	Posted - 2014.10.03 23:02:00 - [97] - Quote CharacterNameWasTaken wrote: postapo wastelander wrote: CharacterNameWasTaken wrote: Cheydinhal Guard wrote: I agree with you on the sidearms, but I still don't understand why the ScP (aside from the Breach variant) took such a huge damage nerf for no absolute reason. Prior to Delta, I seldom saw anyone with an ScP aside from MLT blueberries. The ScP had already received a RoF nerf a while back. It should've been kept that way. Now it's practically nothing but an Amarr Ion pistol. Edit: Well at least it still has its headshot bonus, but nonetheless the nerf wasn't warranted. i love using the "amarr ion pistol" its so fun running dual breaches on a galscout. I thought ION is gallentean and scrable is amarrian so i guess you either A) didnt read the quote or B) didnt see i put quotations aroun amarr ion pistol Nope sorry i get it now i have issue with "long connection" sometimes (have AS) "The human being was not chosen to be a god..the god himself should become a human being."
Vyzion Eyri The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 2494	Posted - 2014.10.03 23:24:00 - [98] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: So they Nerfed Vehicles while at the Same time...buffed AV. Now, this is the about the first time that they did this so it was acceptable but we ended up seeing that AV became too powerful against vehicles which made them kinda useless. A few months later they decide to take another swing at this. The solution was to Nerf AV while at the same time BUFFING Vehicles which somehow, *to their actual* surprise resulted in Vehicles becoming overpowered compared to Anti-Vehicle roles. This didn't happen once throughout DUST history, not twice, not even three times in this games lifetime but around 9 times** of going in this clearly obvious cycle that they could have easily escaped from. What if there is no true balance though, and there is only cycling between metas? I will take the example of League of Legends. Love it or hate it, you've got to agree that for the game to survive, the champions players use cannot exhibit massive strengths over others. Yet, in each season, there ARE a few champions that are better than the rest. Watch the World championships, you will see these same champions banned and picked over and over again because the top teams know that in the current 'meta', they outshine the 100 or so other champions available to be picked. 100 unused champions in a global championship! Talk about redundancy, am I right? Or is it? Are these champions simply waiting for their time to shine? Indeed, Riot has never specified their goal is to seek balance: if you have a look at their design values they pursue Mastery, counterplay, teamplay, clarity, evolution. No balance. Because it's obvious when you involve real players, finding real balance is going to be difficult if not utterly impossible. So what does Riot do? They swap back and forth between metas, allowing champions whose kits are simply outmatched or power is simply outscaled by the current meta, to take the stage through a series of buffs and nerfs. This 'clearly obvious cycle that they could have easily escaped from' is clearly a cycle, but not easily escaped from. In fact, I would daresay it isn't something you want to escape from. > Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Cat Merc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 12499	Posted - 2014.10.04 00:29:00 - [99] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Cat Merc wrote: I've said it back then and I'll say it now. The reason the AR was dominating the kill feed was because... "Yes, the HAV is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Taki, Spkr (Uprising 1.7) "Yes, the AR is dominating the battlefield right now. But its totally fine because _____ and _____." - Cat, Aeon, Regnum, Ydubbs, etc (Uprising 1.1 - 1.6) Nice strawman you got there. People tend to gravitate to general purpose weapons, situational weapons are just that, situational. They're great where they work, but those moments when they don't tick people off. This was true with the AR, and it's still true (Combat Rifle, Rail Rifle, Scrambler Rifle, Plasma Rifle, HMG) I don't actually remember any shooter in recent memory where rifles or their analogue in said game aren't the most common weapons by far. Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
Cat Merc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 12499	Posted - 2014.10.04 00:34:00 - [100] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Right alongside specific balance concerns and discussions, which are well documented and continue to this day (present concerns including fire-from-cloak and your very own, best-in-class bricked GalScout). By comparison, I don't recall many instances of give-and-take on the AR side of AR-514 discussions. I distinctly recall lots of "get good", "everything is fine", and a variety of excuses for the rampant and sustained imbalance. Seemed at the time more like players circling wagons than players interested in balance. I knew you'd immediately feel that was an unjust accusation. And yes, it was. But your lumping Cat Merc and Kirk in with the likes of Spkr is exactly the same - completely unjust. You accuse people of insults and then do that? Really? I know that they both have supported necessary changes because I've worked on threads with them. I used to write a frankly absurd number of balance threads and I have a hell of a lot of correspondence with both of them on many of them. You came into this thread, looked at a handful of complaints, and promptly misinterpreted them hugely. No, Kirk is not 'seeking a return to AR514'. Kirk was frustrated with some of the plasma rifle nerfs, and rightly so. Can you seriously claim that the 1.8 nerf to the breach rifle was necessary? Rattati has since given it serious attention, but it was in a poor way for a long time and Kirk competed against CRs and RRs in their prime with plasma weaponry. I'm sure he's certainly sentimentally attached to them just as you are to scouts - but comments on historical balance screwups hardly warrant accusing the guy of wanting it buffed beyond all reason. Absolutely fair, Arkena. I didn't suspect that Kirk was lobbying for another round of AR-514, but I did believe both Cat and Kirk to be quick-to-excuse AR-514's inexcusable imbalance. I was totally unaware that either of them made efforts to end the AR's supreme reign. Apologies, Cat & Kirk. I'd long believed you both to be AR-514 apologists; Arkena has set my thinking straight. I like where the AR is right now, just so you'll understand my line of thinking. Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC

Ziiro Celeste Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 304	Posted - 2014.10.04 01:26:00 - [101] - Quote I say buff scrambler rifles! Go Amarr!!!1!!one! Aisha Ctarl if you didn't know
Zindorak G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1012	Posted - 2014.10.04 01:27:00 - [102] - Quote Ziiro Celeste wrote: I say buff scrambler rifles! Go Amarr!!!1!!one! Yas thank you caldari Pokemon master! Death to all Swarm scrubs CCP please buff AScR and normal AR :(
Atiim 12695	Posted - 2014.10.04 02:46:00 - [103] - Quote Ziiro Celeste wrote: I say buff scrambler rifles! Go Amarr!!!1!!one! And I say you'd have to be a mega-scrub to need a SCR buff. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
iKILLu osborne ripley's believe it or die 360	Posted - 2014.10.04 06:41:00 - [104] - Quote just an idea, i if you lowered squad count it would allow for more balanced teams cause scotty would have more room to place solo players of higher (or lower) mu to balance things out. my suggestion would help but i'm prepared for the shitstorm of hate so let it rain. lp cal scout i demand it
CUSE TOWN333 KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1645	Posted - 2014.10.04 10:35:00 - [105] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. come on every intelligent person that has played dust for a long time knows its true. how can with every patch cycle there is something so wildly more OP than everything else for two years now. just look at before delta with the burst HMG fireing 6000 RPM. or the bolt pistol doing 250 damage. by making something ridiculously better then its counterparts one can only assume its about the money. and if its not about the money then we have a big problem being that the Devs really have no clue how to balance. it takes most shooting games 3-5 months when they come out to reach good balance. KEQ diplomat/ intel /GC officer
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4127	Posted - 2014.10.04 23:25:00 - [106] - Quote iKILLu osborne wrote: just an idea, i if you lowered squad count it would allow for more balanced teams cause scotty would have more room to place solo players of higher (or lower) mu to balance things out. my suggestion would help but i'm prepared for the shitstorm of hate so let it rain. Not a bad idea. 6 person squads with teams of 16 never made sense anyway. Make them 4 man squads. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
iKILLu osborne ripley's believe it or die 363	Posted - 2014.10.05 07:01:00 - [107] - Quote Atiim wrote: Ziiro Celeste wrote: I say buff scrambler rifles! Go Amarr!!!1!!one! And I say you'd have to be a mega-scrub to need a SCR buff. not really with the recent changes to scr heat build up its very easy to overheat when faced with more then one opponent, i find my self using the acr and rr more often even though i'm prof.5 in scr, i even considered running a rr on my amarr assault but i don't want the neighborhood kids laughing at me. lp cal scout i demand it
Happy Violentime OMFGZOMBIESRUN 827	Posted - 2014.10.09 10:26:00 - [108] - Quote More FA QQ - nothing more, nothing less.


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